Patr 1, Borowska Polin

Good morning everyone,

Today I am getting a third request that I type Hillary’s family tree.
This request, taken against the background of still frequent references
of Judeo-Christian philo-Semitesto the Jewish family background as
“anecdotal” I will print it, although if might be found in the original
sources, the Jewish weekly Forward of NY and the conservative Jewish New
York Post (8/6/1999, pp 5, 6, &7), the oldest day newspaper in America
established by Hamilton.

Edwin Howell married Della Murray in 1918 in Chicago and divorced her in
1927;
married by Methodist minister, Della Murray originally from
Montreal. “Della” is maternal grandmother of Hillary. Data gleaned from
death and marriage certificates.

There are two children from this marriage Isabelle Howell and Dorothy
Howell

In 1933 Della Murray marries Max Rosenberg and they have a daughter
Adeline Rosenberg. Close to Hillary aunt died two years ago.

Comment:

1) Jewish press went as far to admit Jewishness of Max Rosenberg and
Adeline , but only that far.

2) Note the strange name Della. I am certain it was doctored on some of
hers birth certificates from typical Jewish name Bella like famous
Congresswomen Bella Abzug of the same age.

3) Della Howell nee Murray looks like twin sister of Bella Abzug, i.e.
has a typical appearance of the Ashkenazi woman. Her last name Murray
was most likely aquired in Canada when she immigrated from Przemysl,
Poland

4) Della’s first born child daughter was named Isabelle ergo Bella, a
favor of Edwin Howell who initially loved so much his wife Della that
the couple gave their first child the real name of “Della’s”

Mother of Hillary marries in 1942 Hugh Rodham

Three children issue from this marriage

Tony Rodham, Richard Rodham and Hillary Rodham.

After their mother, Tony and Richard look like typical Ashkenazi Jews.
On the other hand Hillary does not have at all Jewish looks (she took it
after her father) except for her typical unshapely Jewish legs.

In 1975 Hillary marries William Clinton. Only one child issues from
this marriage named Chelsey. Chelsey has a typical facial looks of an
Ashkenazi girl (yenta).

Undoubtedly, her phenotype was acquired (inherited) from her maternal
grandmother.

Clintons have plenty of money to raise more than one child. Clearly
Hillary is fertile because Chelsey is not adopted and looks like her
grandmother Dorothy.

Hillary surrounds herself with women mostly lesbians. Bill for decades
remains unfaithful including having a son with a Afro-American. The
only conclusion is that Hillary keeps Clinton out of their matrimonial
bed. Initially in the White House Clinton resorted to jogging.
Eventually he got into sexual perversions with another Jewish girl.

Greetings,

Polina borowska

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:26 EDT 1999
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukraian,soc.culture.german,
alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: American looters during WW II >>Today’s Washington Post.
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 19:38:50 -0400
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jerzy wk wrote:

> Well, well, I thought that nothing is going to surprise me…
>
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/inatl/daily/oct99/train15.htm
>
> Jerzy WK

Above article is about “discovery” that American military was stealing
Jewish gold paintigs carpets and silver.

For some reason humanity has propensity for theft, including Germans.

However, when German soldiers engaged in looting, Germans engaged in
prosecuting them DURING the WW II.

1) for example, in late 1941 Dr Lach the SS Fuhrer of the district of
Galicia and brother of wife of Dr Hans Frank the Governor of General
Governement and personal atty of A. Hitler was cought in appropriating
of carpets, paintings and antique furniture of deported Lemberg’s
(Lwow’s) Jews, he was immediately replaced by Dr Wachter, tried by the
SS Court in Breslau (Wroclaw) and imprisoned, while H. Frank was
handing in resignations because of family ties.

After 1945 Dr. Lach was again tried at Nuremberg and imprisoned again,
but none of stealing Americans (or British soldiers).

2)) In 1944 the Commendant of Majdanek and later Bergen Belsen camps, SS
major, Carl Koch was cought by the SS judiciary for embrezelment of
inmates property> Koch was arested in 1944 and executed on February 9,
1945 when the III Reich was about to collapse.

3) iN 1943, Some Jews at the camp in Poniatowa complained to camps SS
Administration that an Ukrainian and Polish Trawniki Guards stole from
them 150 marks an equivalent of about $7,000.00 today. About two years
ago at the Archives of the Main Commission for the Nazi Crimes at WArsaw
I read the file of the proceedings against these guards who were
punished with three weeks of solitary confinment and transfer to
Shtuthoff camp.

I invite any exterminationist to show me similar examples of prosecution
of American or British soldiers for similar transgressions.

Polina Borowska

> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ (Page doesn`t exist)
> Before you buy.

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:26 EDT 1999
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukraian,soc.culture.german,
alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: American looters during WW II >>Today’s Washington Post.
Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 01:33:54 -0400
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<[email protected]>
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Dear Mr Morris,

Most of the Holocaust revisionists are eager students, even when the well
documented knowledge comes from the Holocaustians or exterminationists.

Thanks for your posting.

I knew nothing about the works of prof J. Robert Lilly.

1) But while reading his article on the subject of executions of American
soldiers I was under the impression that they were NOT military secrets but
hardly any one except Lilly took interest in them. Please correct me if I
misread Lilly’s article

2) All of the 18 American soldiers were executed by the military for rape,
murder or murder following rape while these soldiers were stationed in
Britain and were not exposed to enemy alliens, such as those imprisoned in
concentration camps.

Germans executed their own for mistreating the Jews!

Did Americans or Allies executed or punished any of their soldiers for
mistreating Germans or Italians or Japaneese?

3) It is of interest but probably statistically insignificant that 79% of
executed American soldiers were Negro or Latinos. Or perhaps it is
sociologically and politically significant?

With revisionist thanks to an angry exterminationist

remains yours, Polina Borowska

John Morris wrote:

> In <[email protected]> in alt.revisionism, on Sat, 16 Oct
> 1999 19:38:50 -0400, Joseph Pawlikowski pretending to be a woman named
> polin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >jerzy wk wrote:
>
> >> Well, well, I thought that nothing is going to surprise me…
>
> >> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/inatl/daily/oct99/train15.htm (Page doesn`t exist)
>
> [snip]
>
> >However, when German soldiers engaged in looting, Germans engaged in
> >prosecuting them DURING the WW II.
>
> [snip]
>
> >I invite any exterminationist to show me similar examples of prosecution
> >of American or British soldiers for similar transgressions.
>
> The problem is one of sources. German military justice records were
> not classified as military secrets by the Allies. Yet it is standard
> procedure for American military trials, for instance, to be classified
> as military secrets. It is only now that studies are being conducted
> such as J. Robert Lilly’s study of 18 select cases of US military
> executions of American soldiers in Britain during World War II.
>
> But one doesn’t expect Padlikowski to look for the facts. He is too
> busy playing apologist for the Nazis.

> John Morris <[email protected]>
> at University of Alberta <Multi pertransibunt & augebitur scientia>
> —
> “Nizkooks are not members of homosapiens.
> They are members of Judeosapiens.” Joe Bellinger, May 17, 1999.

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:27 EDT 1999
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Szczerbiec i NOP najgwaltowniejsze pismo i organizacja w Europie ?!
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 00:18:52 -0400
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<!doctype html public “-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en”>
<html>
Dobrywieczor i NPJC
<p>Polecam lekture ponizej z ktorej wynika ze miesiecznik Szczerbiec wydawany
w Warszawie i prawicowa organizacja Narodowe Odrodzenie Polski to “najgwaltowniejsze”
organizacje w Polsce i Europie!
<p>Oczywiscie zadne dowody na ta gwaltownosc nie sa podane.&nbsp; Miedzy
wierszami mozna doczytac sie ze te organizacje opisuja fakty ktore przecza
zagladzie 6,000,000 Zydow.&nbsp; I to wlasnie nawiecej boli Unie “Jewropejska”.
<p>Ja sama jestem aktywnym czlonkiem tych organizacji, ktore pozatym sa
reprezentowane na Zachodzie przez Polski Instytut Historyczny z USA.
<p>Uprzejmie prosze mi wskazac nasza GWALTOWNOSC w naszych publikacjach,
akcjach i moich listach i zawiadomieniach na sputsieci lub w takowych p.
Jozefa Pawlikowskiego kiedy on byl aktywnym na internecie ( przestal byc
bo mial dosyc obelg ktore na niego rzucano glownie za haslo NO&nbsp; BONES&nbsp;
NO&nbsp; HOLOCAUST – Nie ma kosci nie bylo holokostu [kosci 4,000,000 Zydow
ktorych hitlerowcy rzekomo rozstrzelali i nie mieli czasu przepalic])
<p>NOP zapoczatkowal akcje z stawianiem krzyzy w Oswiecimiu, ktora przekazal
K. Switoniowi kiedy okazalo sie ze akcja ta zaczela przybierac ostre pociagniecia.
<p>Demonstracje NOP we Wroclawiu zmusily Zydow do wycofania sie ze swych
roszczen do Szpitala Kolejowego w tym miescie.
<p>Bojowki zydowskie kilkadziesiat razy podpalaly i atakowaly siedziby
NOPu w roznych miastach Polski, najbardziej wielokrotnie w Lodzi.&nbsp;
To jak raz schodzi sie z tym ze Lodz byla (i jest) najbardziej zazydzonym
miastem przed wojna (30.3% ludnosci) zaraz przed Lwowem (30.1% Zydow).&nbsp;
W Warszawie bylo tylko 29% Zydow a ile jest obecnie to trudno wiedziec,
bo archiwa sadow grodzkich, w ktorych przechowje sie akta zmian nazwisk
z lat 1944-48 sa ostatnia tajemnica panstwowa III RP razem z archeologicznym
badaniem Brzezinki tzw Raportem Hydrokopu z 1966 roku.
<p>Brawo dla Szczerbca, NOP-u i Instytutu Narodowo Radykalnego, organizacje
ktore maja za glowny cel wychowanie mlodziezy na religii, patriotyzmie
i prawdzie historycznej a nie martyrologicznych mitach.
<p>Polina Borowska
<p>PS ks Wlodzimierzu prosze wyslac to do Gmuirczyka.
<br>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;
<p>T&nbsp;&nbsp; Y&nbsp;&nbsp; G&nbsp;&nbsp; O&nbsp;&nbsp; D&nbsp;&nbsp;
N&nbsp;&nbsp; I&nbsp;&nbsp; K
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
N A S Z A&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; P O L S K A
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
ISSN 1425-1914&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Indeks 332453&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
NR 40 (210)&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 6 pazdziernika 1999
<br>&nbsp;
<p>&nbsp;
<p>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Polska to kraj szalejacego antysemityzmu,
z rasistowskim Radiem Maryja i Liga
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Republikanska – stwierdzili francuscy
parlamentarzysci w zalaczniku do raportu nt.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ruchow ekstremistycznych w Europie.
Po protestach delegacji polskiej zalacznik zostal
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; wycofany.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Skandal w Strasburgu
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Zgromadzenie Parlamentarne Rady Europy,
ktore obradowalo w Strasburgu pomiedzy 20 i 24 wrzesnia br.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zajmowalo sie m.in. raportem Komisji
Spraw Politycznych Zgromadzenia pt.: Zagrozenie dla demokracji ze
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; strony ekstremalnych partii i ruchow
w Europie. Autorem raportu jest socjalista Henning Gjellerod,
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; przedstawiciel Danii.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tzw. organizacje ekstremalne i skrajna
prawica to m.in. wymienieni w raporcie: neonazisci, satanisci,
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; skinheadzi. Ale wymowa raportu jest
jednoznaczna – chodzi o zablokowanie pod pozorem walki z
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; neonazizmem i ksenofobia wszystkich
ruchow, ktore glosza postulaty “antyunijne” i bronia tozsamosci
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; narodowej wlasnych panstw.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Rada Europy w roli zandarma
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Raport Gjelleroda ma charakter teoretyczny,
pisany jest z pozycji lewicowych i globalistycznych. Okreslajac
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zadania Rady Europy (w tym: Komisji
Europejskiej do Walki z Rasizmem i Nietolerancja – ECRI), stwierdza on
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; we wstepie m.in., iz rasizm i nietolerancja
narasta w wielu krajach czlonkowskich Rady Europy i stanowi
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zagrozenie dla podstawowych wartosci
demokratycznych bronionych przez te organizacje. Dlatego tez
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; autor postuluje walke z ekstremistami,
a wiec m.in. z tymi grupami, ktore sprzeciwiaja sie globalizmowi i
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; utracie przez panstwa europejskie tozsamosci
narodowej i suwerennosci panstwowej. Pierwszy srodek to
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; pozbawienie ekstremistow poparcia wyborczego,
zdobytego w wyniku ekonomicznych bolaczek,
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; bedacych rezultatem globalizacji, w
tym bezrobocia. Ponadto “partie demokratyczne” (jak nalezy sadzic autor
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ma na mysli organizacje centrowe i socjaldemokratyczne
podporzadkowane idei “zjednoczonej Europy”) musza
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; uzyskac nowe oblicze, gdyz ich niezdolnosc
do przystosowania sie do nowej sytuacji gospodarczej i politycznej
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; w Europie kieruje sympatie elektoratu
ku skrajnej prawicy. Nalezy rowniez odpowiednimi przepisami prawnymi
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zakazac werbalnej badz pisemnej formy
wyrazania rasizmu, antysemityzmu i ksenofobii, wlaczajac w to
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; przekaz za posrednictwem mediow elektronicznych.
W szczegolnosci musi zostac prawnie zakazane
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; publiczne kwestionowanie holocaustu,
co jest wspolna cecha charakterystyczna dla wielu ruchow
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [ekstremalnych – przyp. aut.], jak dotad
nie we wszystkich krajach takie przepisy zostaly wprowadzone (…)
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; – stwierdza raport. Trzecim srodkiem
zagwarantowania “europejskiej poprawnosci politycznej” ma byc
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; prowadzona na wieksza niz dotad skale
skoordynowana polityka sil policyjnych dla zapobiezenia
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; gwaltownym formom ekstremizmu (…).
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Francuzi poszli dalej…
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Francuzi uznali raport Gjelleroda za
malo konkretny i uscislili go. Sporzadzili zalacznik pod nazwa Analysis
of
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; extremist parties and movements in various
European States (Analiza ekstremalnych partii i ruchow w
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; roznych krajach europejskich).
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Zalacznik liczy dziewietnascie stron
i zawiera charakterystyke poszczegolnych panstw europejskich pod katem
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; znaczenia w nich partii okreslanych
jako skrajna prawica lub prawica ekstremalna.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; W czesci poswieconej Europie Srodowowschodniej
stwierdza sie m.in.: Nie ma zadnych watpliwosci, iz wraz
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; z zamierzonym rozszerzeniem Unii Europejskiej
ekstremistyczne partie z Europy Zachodniej nawiazaly
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; nowe kontakty ze swoimi odpowiednikami
w Europie Wschodniej. Odbywa sie to w szczegolnosci
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; poprzez Euro-Nat, grupe zalozona przez
francuski Front Narodowy (…).
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Polska – kraj szalejacego antysemityzmu
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Zalacznik autorstwa Jeana-Yvesa Camusa
omawia i Polske. Wynika z niego, iz najwiekszym zagrozeniem dla
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; stabilnosci europejskiej jest “polski
antysemityzm” oraz promujace go Radio Maryja oraz partie prawicowe.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Wymowny jest juz tytul rozdzialu dotyczacego
naszego kraju: Polska – antysemityzm bez Zydow.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; A oto ten fragment dokumentu, ktory nasza
redakcja otrzymala ze Strasburga dzieki uprzejmosci Zgromadzenia
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Parlamentarnego Rady Europy: Zaden z
ekstremistycznych polskich ruchow politycznych nie jest
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; reprezentowany w parlamencie, zas partie
skrajnej prawicy ciesza sie malym poparciem spolecznym.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Naleza do nich m.in. Polska Wspolnota
Narodowa, majaca poparcie 0,1 procenta, Stronnictwo
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Narodowe Macieja Giertycha (poparcie
mniejsze niz 1 proc.) lub Blok dla Polski (okolo 2 proc.),
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; skladajacy sie z bylych czlonkow Bezpartyjnego
Bloku Wspierania Reform, utworzonego pod patronatem
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Lecha Walesy.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Partie te maja swoje korzenie w konserwatywnym
katolicyzmie i czesto odwoluja sie do Narodowej
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Demokracji Romana Dmowskiego. Jedynie
liderowi Prawicy Narodowej, powiazanej z francuskim
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Frontem Narodowym, udalo dostac sie
do parlamentu z list Akcji Wyborczej “Solidarnosc”. Rowniez
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; lider antykomunistycznej Ligi Republikanskiej
dostal sie do parlamentu.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Chociaz skrajna prawica cieszy sie malym
poparciem wyborczym, ekstremistyczne idee i ksenofobia w
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; stosunku do Zydow i mniejszosci niemieckiej
sa powszechne w pewnej czesci Kosciola Katolickiego. Na
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; przyklad Radio Maryja, kierowane przez
Ojca Tadeusza Rydzyka, jawnie przekazuje tresci
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ksenofobiczne, wiadomosci o charakterze
antysemickim i posiada poparcie trzydziestu poslow Akcji
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Wyborczej Solidarnosc i Stowarzyszenia
Rodzin Katolickich.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tradycjonalisci, ktorzy postawili krzyze
w bylym obozie koncentracyjnym Auschwitz, rowniez glosza
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; hasla antysemickie, tak jak robi to
ksiadz Henryk Jankowski, byly wspolpracownik Lecha Walesy. Ten
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; antysemityzm w kraju, w ktorym mieszka
obecnie zaledwie kilka tysiecy Zydow w porownaniu z 3
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; milionami w roku 1939, jest mocno tepiony
przez hierarchie Kosciola Katolickiego. Najbardziej
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; gwaltowna grupa jest Narodowe Odrodzenie
Polski, wydajace rewizjonistyczne pismo “Szczerbiec”.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Camus jak Tel Aviv
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Jean-Yves Camus jest czlonkiem “The European
Centre for Research and Action on Racism and
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Anti-Semitism”, z siedziba w Paryzu.
I zapewne temu nalezy przypisac obrazliwa dla Polski i Kosciola
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; katolickiego tresc dokumentu. Zalacznik
ten jest powtorzeniem niektorych antypolskich sloganow
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; pochodzacych m.in. z (o wiele bardziej
szczegolowego) raportu Anti-Semitism Worldwide 1997/98,
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; opracowanego przez The Stephen Roth
Institute Uniwersytetu w Tel Avivie. W tym wlasnie dokumencie, w
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; czesci poswieconej naszemu krajowi,
znajduje sie np. nieprawdziwe stwierdzenie – powtorzone przez Camusa –
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; iz jeden z liderow Prawicy Narodowej
dostal sie do parlamentu. Raport izraelski rowniez pietnuje dzialalnosc
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ksiedza Jankowskiego oraz takich antysemickich
partii jak Ruch Odbudowy Polski, Polskie Stronnictwo
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Ludowe, jest rowniez mowa o kontaktach
pomiedzy ekstremistami a bardziej wywazonymi silami
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; prawicowymi, ktore stworzyly rzad Akcji
Wyborczej “Solidarnosc”.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Najwiekszym skandalem w zalaczniku do
raportu Gjelleroda jest zawoalowana sugestia Camusa, iz Polacy
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; odpowiadaja za wymordowanie ludnosci
zydowskiej podczas II wojny swiatowej, jakze zbiezna z motywacja
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; pozwu Zydow przeciwko Polsce, zlozonego
w sadzie w Nowym Jorku. Jak inaczej bowiem nalezy odczytywac
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zdanie o tym, iz w Polsce mieszka obecnie
zaledwie kilka tysiecy Zydow w porownaniu z 3 milionami w
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; roku 1939? Francuz – reprezentant panstwa
majacego chyba najwieksze “osiagniecia” w kolaboracji z
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Niemcami hitlerowskimi – nie wspomina
w dokumencie o przyczynach zmniejszenia sie liczby Zydow w Polsce:
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; wojnie, eksterminacji Zydow przez Niemcow.
Tego nie ma. Padaja tylko suche liczby – trzy miliony w 1939 r. i
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; kilka tysiecy obecnie. Co sie stalo
z pozostalymi? Zapewne zostali wymordowani przez “antysemickich”
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Polakow.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Protesty pomogly
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Kuluarowe protesty polskich deputowanych
w ZPRE doprowadzily do wycofania zalacznika z tekstu raportu.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Wedlug przekazanego nam ze Strasburga
dodatku do zalacznika, zawierajacego opinie poszczegolnych
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; delegatow o dokumencie – z polskiej
strony swoje zdanie wyrazil jedynie postkomunista Tadeusz Iwinski. Co
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; oczywiste, przedstawiciela SLD nie oburzyly
falszywe informacje dotyczace rzekomego antysemityzmu Radia
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Maryja czy partii prawicowych. Pominal
je milczeniem. Stwierdzil jedynie, iz nic mu nie wiadomo, by
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; jakikolwiek lider Prawicy Narodowej
dostal sie do parlamentu.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Posel ZChN Marcin Libicki wydal natomiast
specjalne oswiadczenie, w ktorym kategorycznie sprzeciwil sie
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; przypisywaniu Radiu Maryja cech rasistowskich,
uznajac je za skrajnie niesprawiedliwe i oszczercze: Radio
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; jest jednym z najwazniejszych elementow
ladu medialnego w Polsce, dajac duchowe wsparcie milionom
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; sluchaczy kazdego dnia. Posel Libicki
odrzucil rowniez zarzuty francuskiego deputowanego odnosnie Ligi
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Republikanskiej – mlodziezowej i akademickiej
organizacji polskiej antykomunistycznej prawicy.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Podkreslil takze, iz problem antysemityzmu
w Polsce jest problemem sztucznym, a opinie zawarte w
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zalaczniku sa podobnie plytkie i niesprawiedliwe
jak sam antysemityzm.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ***
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tym razem protesty polskich politykow
pomogly i dokument z klamliwymi antypolskimi kalumniami
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zostal wycofany. Raport Gjelleroda bez
dyskusji plenarnej zostal zwrocony Komisji Spraw Politycznych
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Zgromadzenia. Sprawa powroci na porzadek
obrad w styczniu przyszlego roku. I dopiero wtedy
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; przekonamy sie, czy protesty naszych
parlamentarzystow odniosly jakis trwaly skutek.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; A na marginesie – czy warto pchac sie
do struktury, w ktorej obraza sie Polske, jej wiare i narod, bez
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; szacunku dla prawdy politycznej i historycznej?
A moze wlasnie cena za przystapienie do Unii
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Europejskiej, aspirujacej poprzez swoje
instytucje polityczne do roli zandarma w Europie, dla ktorego
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; liczy sie tylko obrona holocaustu, a
nie fakty polityczne i historyczne, ma byc zrzeczenie sie przez
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; politykow znad Wisly wlasnego honoru
i poczucia bycia Polakiem? r
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Andrzej Echolette
<br>&nbsp;
<p>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;</html>

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:27 EDT 1999
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukraian,soc.culture.german,
alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: American looters during WW II >>Today’s Washington Post.
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 13:24:34 -0400
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Grazyna Lesniak wrote:

> polin
>
> (…)
> >Germans executed their own for mistreating the Jews!
> (…)
>
> Dear Polin ;
>
> I’m always ready to revision my knowledge and opinions.
> Let me follow your magnificent way of thinking:
>
> -isn’t exterminating the nation a “mistreating”
> -or did Germans execute all nazis ?
>
> just curious
>
> Grazyna

NPJC,

Dear Grazyna:

While it is obvious to revisionists that the Endlosung or Final Solution
was Nazi euphemism for total expropriation of European Jews in revenge
for boycotting of the German foreign trade since March 24, 1933
(resulting in its reduction to 61% according to The Jewish Chronicle of
London of February 5, 1939) –

the matter of industrial killing of Jews is hotly disputed and still
remains to be proven by archeology of the mass graves, forensic and
toxicological data on Zyclon B and Diesel exhaust and wartime and post
war high resolution aerial photography.

Your “Epoka Piecow” and “Epoka Zaglady” ( Era of Ovens and Era of
Annihilation in Polish) is willting in the same manner as the First
World War ‘holocaust’ of 6,000,000 Jews and 800,000 Jewish children
wilted into oblivion. This First WW ‘holocaust’ widely publicized then
by the politicians in the USA, allegedly took place in Poland and
Ukraine and took place due to the “lust for the Jewish blood.”

I hope I satisfied your curiosity.

Since you are fluent in English please translate it for your collegues
at the Silesian Institute of Technology.

Greetings from Polina and Szczesc Boze.
wkw please email it to Gmurczyk

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<!doctype html public “-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en”>
<html>
&nbsp;
<p>Grazyna Lesniak wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE>polin
<p>(…)
<br>>Germans executed their own for mistreating the Jews!
<br>(…)
<p>Dear Polin ;
<p>I’m always ready to revision my knowledge and opinions.
<br>Let me follow your magnificent way of thinking:
<p>-isn’t exterminating the nation a “mistreating”
<br>-or did Germans execute all nazis ?
<p>just curious
<p>Grazyna</blockquote>
NPJC,
<p>Dear Grazyna:
<p>While it is obvious to revisionists that the Endlosung or Final Solution
was Nazi euphemism for total expropriation of European Jews in revenge
for boycotting of the German foreign trade since March 24, 1933 (resulting
in its reduction to 61% according to <i>The Jewish Chronicle</i> of London
of February 5, 1939) –
<p>the matter of industrial killing of Jews is hotly disputed and still
remains to be proven by archeology of the mass graves, forensic and toxicological
data on Zyclon B and Diesel exhaust and wartime and post war high resolution
aerial photography.
<p>Your “Epoka Piecow” and&nbsp; “Epoka Zaglady” ( Era of Ovens and&nbsp;
Era of Annihilation in Polish)&nbsp; is willting in the same manner as
the First World War ‘holocaust’ of 6,000,000 Jews and 800,000 Jewish children
wilted into oblivion.&nbsp; This First WW ‘holocaust’ widely publicized
then by the politicians in the USA, allegedly took place in Poland and
Ukraine and took place due to the “lust for the Jewish blood.”
<p>I hope I satisfied your curiosity.
<p>Since you are fluent in English please translate it for your collegues
at the Silesian Institute of Technology.
<p>Greetings from Polina and Szczesc Boze.
<br>wkw please email it to Gmurczyk</html>

————–2ED8A7B36B4FD4FA7F589E1E–

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:27 EDT 1999
Article: 190863 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: Statystyka elity, a ilosc Zydow-marranow w Polsce
>>>My Zydzi, My komunisci czerwoni – to dopiero brzmi dumnie
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 19:51:04 -0400
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Xref: hub.org soc.culture.polish:190863

NPJC i dobrywieczor czytelnikom;

Pan Kochanski o ile sie nie myle “sztandarowy” Zyd i zagladowiec nieswiadomie
ugdzil sie w serce wymieniajac kilkunastu czy kilkudziesieciu Polakow
zydowskiego pochodzenia w rzadzie i elicie III RP.

Poniewaz nie jestem antysemitka (a tylko rewizjonistka holokostu i innych
historycznych mitow), mnie nie przeszkadza ze Zydzi z demokratycznym
nastawieniem sa w polskiej czolowce i rzadzie.

Szczesc im Boze!

Jest mi nawet przyjemnie slyszec ze w wiekszosci sa oni dziecmi uprzednie elity
i czolowki wyznajacej i praktykujacej terror i totalitaryzm. Jest mi to milo
slyszec bo to oznacza ze dzieci moga byc madrzejsi i moralnie lepsi od ich
potwornych rodzicow.

Glowna przeslanka holokostu DWS jest to ze zniszczyl on ponad 90 % polskich
Zydow i ze w Polsce obecnie mieszka tylko od 5,000 do 20,000 Zydow.

Pytanie dlaczego Pan Kochanski ugodzil w serce holokostu ze swoim zwierzeniem.

Pan Wieslaw i reszta sciepowiczow i sciepowerow ( z wyjatkiem p. Miecza)
zapewne zgodza sie ze Zydzi sa madrzejsi i obrotniejsi od Polakow ale chyba nie
na wiecej niz na sto procent.

Przecietnie jedna osoba z 60,000 do 30,000 ludnosci wybija sie do tego by stac
sie czlonkiem rzadu lub intelektualnej elity. Poniewaz zalozylismy ze Zydzi sa
100% madrzejsi i aktywniejsi od Polakow czy innych Slowian, w takim razie kazdy
Zyd w czolowce jak np minister spraw zagranicznych Gieremek czy nasz prezydent
Kwasniewski czy redaktor Wyborczej reprezentuja od 30,000-15,000 Zydow zyjacych
w Polsce.

Poniewaz lekko doliczyc sie 50 Zydow w czolowce Polski a wiec obecnie, w
naszym kraju pod zmienionymi nazwiskami musi zamieszkiwac okolo 1,500,000
zydowskich marranow.

Jesli popelnilam gdzies matematyczny lub logiczny blad w tym rewizjonistycznym
rozumowaniu, prosze mi go wskazac piszac na sciep lub nawet lepiej na moja
elepoczte.

Z pozdrowieniaaami

Polina Borowska

Ps Ksiadz W prosze wyslac to Gmurczykowi do Szczerbca.

Wieslaw Kochanski wrote:

> Z tego, ze tzw. okres stalinizmu (czyli lata 1944-1956) byl najbardziej
> antypolskim okresem w dziejach PRL-u, wiekszosc Polakow zdaje sobie sprawe.
> Sporo naszych rodakow slusznie kojarzy te lata z dominacja w aparacie
> wladzy komunistow pochodzenia zydowskiego. Niewielu jednak wie o tym, iz
> znaczna czesc elity politycznej i kulturalnej Trzeciej Rzeczypospolitej
> wywodzi sie z rodzin owczesnych wladcow Polski. Warto sobie uswiadomic
> skale tego zjawiska.
>
> Kontynuatorzy z SLD
>
> Wielu potomkow bierutowsko-bermanowskiego establishmentu zasila dzisiaj
> szeregi SLD. Najlepszym tego przykladem jest (formalnie do ubieglego
> piatku) premier Wlodzimierz Cimoszewicz, ktorego ojciec, Marian, byl
> oficerem Informacji Wojskowej. W 1951 roku na jego rozkaz aresztowano
> komendanta Wojskowej Akademii Technicznej oraz kilkunastu oficerow
> pracujacych na tej uczelni, ktorzy wczesniej byli w Armii Krajowej.
>
> Inny czolowy polityk lewicy, byly wicepremier i wicemarszalek Sejmu
> (ostatnio ponownie wybrany do Sejmu) Marek Borowski, jest synem Wiktora,
> przedwojennego dzialacza Komunistycznej Partii Polski. Ojciec Borowskiego,
> ktory naprawde nazywal sie Aron Berman, w roku 1944 byl zalozycielem i
> pierwszym redaktorem naczelnym “Zycia Warszawy”, a w latach 1951-1967 –
> zastepca redaktora naczelnego “Trybuny Ludu”.
>
> Zwiazkami rodzinnymi z prominentami tamtego okresu moga sie pochwalic takze
> inni dzialacze SLD, np. posel Longin Pastusiak, ktory jest zieciem I
> sekretarza KC PZPR z roku 1956, Edwarda Ochaba. Z kolei jeden z czytelnikow
> “Glosu” w liscie do redakcji opublikowanym w numerze z 21-23 marca br.
> napisal, ze ojciec innego polityka lewicy, posla SLD ostatniej kadencji –
> Janusza Zemke, byl od roku 1945 szefem UB w Wabrzeznie (wojewodztwo
> torunskie). Posel Zemke jak dotad nie zaprzeczyl tej informacji.
>
> Wszyscy ludzie prezydenta
>
> O dzialalnosc w Urzedzie Bezpieczenstwa niektore emigracyjne gazety
> oskarzaly takze ojca prezydenta Aleksandra Kwasniewskiego, twierdzac, ze
> nosil on wowczas nazwisko Stolzman. Ale nawet, gdyby nie bylo to prawda,
> faktem jest, ze w swojej Kancelarii Kwasniewski zatrudnil ludzi
> pochodzacych z komunistycznych rodzin.
>
> O bylej szefowej Kancelarii, poslance SLD, Danucie Waniek, wiemy, iz
> wychowala sie w lewicowym domu we Wloclawku. Ojciec kierowal zakladem
> produkcyjnym, matka zwiazana byla z handlem. Oboje byli w PZPR (L.
> Zalewska, Spiewaczka prezydenta, “Zycie” z 2-3 listopada 1996 r.).
>
> Inny bliski wspolpracownik Kwasniewskiego, szef Biura Bezpieczenstwa
> Narodowego Marek Siwiec, rowniez pochodzi z takiej rodziny: Jego ojciec byl
> wicedyrektorem tarnobrzeskiego kombinatu siarkowego “Siarkopol”, matka –
> prokuratorem (R. Szubstarski, Misjonarz prezydenta, “Zycie” z 26-27
> pazdziernika 1996 r.).
>
> W prezydenckiej Kancelarii zostal zatrudniony takze znany (m.in. z
> publikacji na lamach prasy prawicowej!) publicysta i poeta, Aleksander
> Rozenfeld, ktory w tekscie pt. Byc Zydem w Polsce pisal: Moi rodzice po to,
> by nie byc obcymi wymyslili, ze beda budowac komunizm, to byla wlasnie
> ideologia, ktora kazala wierzyc, ze ludzie sa sobie rowni, bez wzgledu na
> kolor skory, religie i status spoleczny. Uwierzyli jeszcze przed wojna,
> ocalili zycie w sowieckiej Rosji i wrocili do Polski, nie rozumiejac, ze
> slowo komunista bedzie sie wlasnie w Polsce kojarzyc z Zydami (“Najwyzszy
> Czas!” z 12 marca 1994 r.).
>
> Od UB do UW
>
> Ale nie tylko w poblizu SLD i prezydenta Kwasniewskiego znalezli sie
> potomkowie “zasluzonych” komunistycznych rodzin. Wielu z nich znalazlo
> swoje miejsce w Unii Wolnosci, gdzie prym wioda dzialacze, ktorzy partyjne
> legitymacje nosili jeszcze za zycia Bieruta – Bronislaw Geremek i Jacek
> Kuron.
>
> W takim towarzystwie bardzo dobrze czuje sie np. posel Jan Litynski,
> ktorego rodzice byli komunistami jeszcze przed wojna; ojciec zmarl w 1947
> roku. (…) Litynski najwczesniej wkroczyl do historii. Jako szesciolatek
> na manifestacji 22 lipca 1952 roku podbiegl do trybuny i wreczyl Bierutowi
> kwiaty (A. Bikont, Siedmiu sposrod wybranych, “Magazyn Gazety Wyborczej” z
> 5 listopada 1993 r.).
>
> Inni prominentni czlonkowie UW posiadaja podobne zwiazki rodzinne:
> prezydent Warszawy Marcin Swiecicki jest zieciem PRL-owskiego wicepremiera,
> czlonka KC PZPR w latach 1948-1981, Eugeniusza Szyra, zas czolowy udecki
> ekonomista Waldemar Kuczynski przyznal sie do tego, iz jego tesciem byl
> Stefan Staszewski, I sekretarz Komitetu Warszawskiego PZPR w roku 1956.
>
> Zatrudniona przez Swiecickiego na stanowisku sekretarza gminy
> Warszawa-Centrum, zona posla UW Henryka Wujca, Ludwika Wujec, jest corka
> przedwojennej dzialaczki KPP Reginy Okrent, ktora w latach 1946-1949
> pracowala w Urzedzie Bezpieczenstwa w Lodzi.
>
> Burmistrzem warszawskiego Srodmiescia w latach 1990-1994 byl Jan
> Rutkiewicz, syn Wincentego, dzialacza komunistycznego, ktory zginal w
> czasie wojny, i Marii, w latach 1948-1950 szefowej Kancelarii Sekretariatu
> KC PZPR. Matka Jana Rutkiewicza po wojnie wyszla za maz za Artura
> Starewicza, ktory w latach 1949-1953 byl kierownikiem Wydzialu Propagandy
> KC PZPR, a nastepnie sekretarzem CRZZ i sekretarzem KC PZPR.
>
> “Sami swoi” w MSZ
>
> Rowniez wsrod pracownikow sterowanego przez Geremka Ministerstwa Spraw
> Zagranicznych znajdziemy ludzi o podobnych rodowodach.
>
> W latach 1995-96 wiceministrem w tym resorcie byl Stefan Meller, ktorego
> ojciec, Adam, pracowal w Informacji Wojskowej, a nastepnie, do roku 1968, w
> dyplomacji. Meller jest obecnie ambasadorem Polski w Paryzu.
>
> Dyrektorem Departamentu Studiow i Planowania MSZ jest Henryk Szlajfer, syn
> Ignacego, oficera UB we Wroclawiu w latach 1947-1952, a nastepnie cenzora w
> Glownym Urzedzie Kontroli Prasy, Publikacji i Widowisk. Natomiast
> stanowisko dyrektora Departamentu Promocji i Informacji MSZ zajmowala do
> niedawna Malgorzata Lavergne, corka znanego dzialacza komunistycznego,
> pierwszego szefa Glownego Zarzadu Politycznego LWP, gen. Wiktora Grosza,
> ktory jeszcze przed wojna nosil nazwisko Izaak Medres.
>
> Stanowiaca finansowe zaplecze udecji Fundacja Stefana Batorego to rowniez
> strefa wplywow potomkow stalinowskiego aparatu. Jej prezesem jest
> Aleksander Smolar, czlonek wladz Unii Wolnosci, syn Grzegorza, ktory do
> roku 1968 byl redaktorem naczelnym “Folks-Sztyme”, organu popieranego przez
> wladze PRL Towarzystwa Spoleczno-Kulturalnego Zydow w Polsce. Matka Smolara
> pracowala w KC PZPR. Sekretarzem Fundacji byl do niedawna Jozef Chajn,
> ktorego ojciec, Leon, byl w latach 1945-1949 wiceministrem sprawiedliwosci,
> a do roku 1961 sprawowal kontrole nad “sojuszniczym” Stronnictwem
> Demokratycznym.
>
> Korzenie Ruchu Stu
>
> Ludzi o bierutowsko-bermanowskiej genealogii znajdziemy takze na prawicy.
> Posel z ramienia Akcji Wyborczej “Solidarnosc”, prezes liberalnego Ruchu
> Stu, Czeslaw Bielecki, tak mowil o swoich rodzicach: Wyrastalem w rodzinie
> zasymilowanej inteligencji zydowskiej. Ojciec, z wyksztalcenia matematyk,
> byl dyrektorem generalnym w Ministerstwie Oswiaty w latach piecdziesiatych.
> Wylecial z tego stanowiska razem z Wladyslawem Bienkowskim, gdy Gomulka
> “zwijal” Pazdziernik. Matka byla urzedniczka w Glownym Urzedzie
> Statystycznym, zajmowala sie demografia. Rodzice komunizowali jeszcze przed
> wojna (E. Boniecka, Blizej politykow, Torun 1996).
>
> Towarzystwo z “Wyborczej”
>
> Terenem, na ktorym szczegolnie mocno usadowilo sie drugie pokolenie
> stalinowskich rodzin, jest prasa. Szefem najwiekszej w Polsce gazety jest
> przeciez Adam Michnik, syn przedwojennego komunisty Ozjasza Szechtera i
> autorki zaklamanych podrecznikow do historii, Heleny Michnik, a takze brat
> ubeckiego “sedziego”, Stefana Michnika. Redaktora naczelnego “Gazety
> Wyborczej” wspiera jego zastepczyni, Helena Luczywo, corka innego KPP-owca,
> a po wojnie kierownika wydzialu w KC PZPR, Ferdynanda Chabera.
>
> Drugim zastepca Michnika byl do niedawna dzis prowadzacy “Rozmowy Dnia” w
> programie Warszawskiego Osrodka Telewizyjnego (WOT) Ernest Skalski, syn
> Jerzego Wilkera-Skalskiego i Zofii Nimen-Skalskiej, przedwojennych
> komunistow, ktorzy pozniej pracowali w Komendzie Wojewodzkiej MO w
> Krakowie. Jerzy Urban napisal o nim: Pochodzenie Skalskiego z
> rodzicow-aparatczykow – zgodnie z dominujaca regula – musialo go
> zaprowadzic w koncu do opozycji (J. Urban, Alfabet Urbana, Warszawa 1990).
>
> Czolowym publicysta “GW” jest Konstanty Gebert, podpisujacy swoje teksty
> jako Dawid Warszawski, a od niedawna takze redaktor naczelny zydowskiego
> miesiecznika “Midrasz”. Ojciec Geberta, Boleslaw, byl po wojnie ambasadorem
> PRL w Turcji, a matka, Krystyna Poznanska-Gebert, w latach 1944-1945
> organizowala Wojewodzki Urzad Bezpieczenstwa Publicznego w Rzeszowie.
>
> Dziennikarze czerwoni od pokolen
>
> Redaktorem naczelnym zlikwidowanego niedawno “Sztandaru” byl Michal Komar,
> ktory jest jednoczesnie prezesem Unii Wydawcow Prasy. Jest on synem Waclawa
> Komara, dowodcy walczacych w Hiszpanii “dabrowszczakow”, a nastepnie
> PRL-owskiego generala, i Marii Komar, ktora dzialalnosc komunistyczna
> rozpoczela rowniez przed wojna, jeszcze pod nazwiskiem Rywa Cukierman.
>
> Wydawca i szef tygodnika “Nie”, Jerzy Urban, rowniez moze sie pochwalic
> podobnym pochodzeniem. Jego ojciec, co prawda zaczynal kariere polityczna i
> dziennikarska w przedwojennej PPS, jednak zaraz po wojnie wlaczyl sie w
> dzialalnosc PKWN, byl rowniez czlonkiem, kierowanej przez Bieruta, Krajowej
> Rady Narodowej. Wieloletni kolega Urbana z “Polityki”, obecnie ambasador
> Polski w Chile, Daniel Passent, byl wychowywany przez wuja, przedwojennego
> komuniste, generala Jakuba Prawina, po wojnie wiceprezesa NBP i wojewode
> olsztynskiego.
>
> Z kolei dziennikarzem “Tygodnika Solidarnosc” jest Antoni Zambrowski, syn
> Romana, jednego z czolowych stalinowcow, czlonka Biura Politycznego KC PPR
> i PZPR w latach 1944-1963. Szefem polskiego oddzialu agencji Reutera jest
> natomiast Michal Broniatowski, ktorego ojciec, pulkownik Mieczyslaw
> Broniatowski, od roku 1945 byl dyrektorem Centralnej Szkoly Ministerstwa
> Bezpieczenstwa Publicznego w Lodzi, a nastepnie dyrektorem Departamentu
> Spoleczno-Administracyjnego MSW.
>
> W kulturze – jak za Bieruta
>
> Rowniez w dziedzinie kultury mozna zauwazyc silna pozycje dzieci dawnych
> rzadcow Polski. Bardzo modnym wsrod udeckiej inteligencji kwartalnikiem
> “Zeszyty Literackie” kieruje Barbara Torunczyk, corka Henryka, dzialacza
> komunistycznego jeszcze sprzed wojny, i Romany, do 1968 roku pracujacej w
> Zakladzie Historii Partii przy KC PZPR.
>
> Inny publicysta i poeta o tej samej orientacji ideowej, Tomasz Jastrun,
> jest synem Mieczyslawa, znanego poety, po wojnie redaktora marsistowskiego
> tygodnika “Kuznica”, ktory z partii wystapil w 1957 roku, a wiec zaraz po
> zakonczeniu okresu stalinowskiego.
>
> Mieszkajacy obecnie w Australii (ale publikujacy w “Gazecie Wyborczej”)
> poeta i piesniarz, niegdys “bard opozycji”, Jacek Kaczmarski, tak mowil o
> swojej rodzinie: Moj dziadek byl przed wojna zaangazowanym komunista, po
> wojnie zas komunistycznym dygnitarzem. (…) Wierzyl w dziejowa misje
> partii itd. Po wojnie znalazl sie wiec w kregach wladzy, byl ambasadorem w
> Kambodzy, pelnil jakies dyplomatyczne funkcje w Szwajcarii, potem pracowal
> w ministerstwie oswiaty. Z partii wystapil w 1981 roku. Jego zona, czyli
> moja babcia (…) pochodzila z rodziny zydowskiej, co jak przypuszczam, nie
> pozostalo bez wplywu na zeslanie mojego dziadka do ministerstwa oswiaty po
> 1968 roku (wywiad pt. Chce konfrontacji, “Tygodnik Solidarnosc” z 4 maja
> 1990 r.).
>
> Filmowe imperium
>
> Wsrod najglosniejszych rezyserow filmowych znajdziemy dzisiaj Janusza
> Zaorskiego, bylego prezesa Radiokomitetu i przewodniczacego Krajowej Rady
> Radiofonii i Telewizji, ktorego ojciec w pierwszym okresie PRL-u byl
> dyrektorem generalnym w Ministerstwie Finansow, a nastepnie wiceministrem
> kultury i sztuki odpowiedzialnym za film. Bratem Janusza Zaorskiego jest
> znany aktor, Andrzej Zaorski.
>
> Inne znane rodzenstwo filmowe to Agnieszka Holland i Magdalena
> Lazarkiewicz, dwie rezyserki, ktorych ojcem byl Henryk Holland,
> przedwojenny komunista, w czasie wojny ochotnik w Armii Czerwonej, pozniej
> redaktor naczelny “Walki Mlodych” i dziennikarz “Trybuny Ludu”. W tej
> ostatniej gazecie, organie KC PZPR, w okresie stalinowskim pracowala
> rowniez matka Marcela Lozinskiego, rezysera znanego z proudeckich sympatii.
> Inny rezyser, Andrzej Titkow, jest synem Walentego, bylego I sekretarza KW
> PZPR w Warszawie.
>
> Genealogie profesorow
>
> Podobne rodowody posiada wielu znanych ludzi nauki. Profesor historii
> sredniowiecznej, a zarazem byly senator OKP i dzialacz Unii Pracy, Karol
> Modzelewski, pochodzi z rodziny przedwojennych komunistow, zas jego
> ojczymem byl czolowy stalinowiec, minister spraw zagranicznych w latach
> 1947-1951, Zygmunt Modzelewski.
>
> Inny historyk, profesor Instytutu Historii PAN, Jerzy W. Borejsza, jest
> synem zmarlego w roku 1952 komunistycznego dyktatora w dziedzinie kultury,
> Jerzego Borejszy, ktory przed wojna nazywal sie Beniamin Goldberg.
> Profesorem politologii na filii Uniwersytetu Warszawskiego w Bialymstoku, a
> zarazem redaktorem naczelnym Wydawnictwa Naukowego PWN, jest Jan Kofman,
> syn Jozefa, sekretarza i czlonka Prezydium CRZZ do roku 1968.
>
> Celem tego, niepelnego przeciez, zestawienia nazwisk nie jest obciazanie
> wymienionych tu osob odpowiedzialnoscia za czyny ich rodzicow. Chcialem
> jedynie pokazac, w jakim stopniu obecne elity naszego kraju wywodza sie z
> elit, ktore kilkadziesiat lat temu, w najciemniejszym okresie stalinizmu,
> rzadzily Polska. Czy tak duza ilosc ludzi o podobnych rodowodach w polskiej
> polityce, prasie, kulturze i nauce to tylko zwykly przypadek, czy raczej
> planowe promowanie ludzi z “czerwonej arystokracji”? Na to pytanie niech
> odpowiedza sobie Czytelnicy.
>
> Pawel SIERGIEJCZYK

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:28 EDT 1999
Article: 191094 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: glosujcie na Papieza
Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 10:21:15 -0400
Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com
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NPJC,

W zadnym wypadku nie bede glosowala na tego naszego ‘mierzawca’ (po rosyjsku
podla, mala, niewdzieczna osoba) Papieza. Juz nie tylko ze wzgledu na jego
sluzalcze ‘body language’ (po angielsku pozy ciala wskazujace na wewnetrzne
nastawienie osobnika) w obecnosci Zydow (Madlaine Albright w Watykanie lub
wobec rabina Kozielewskiego machajacego mu palcem pod nosem w Warszawie).

Jednakze jako kobiete i matke, najbardziej co mnie odrzuca od ‘naszego papieza’
to fakt ze klamie na temat swojej Matki i wstydzi sie jej ukrainskiego
pochodzenia i albo o niej milczy albo klamie ze byla Litwinka.

Bez watpienia, w poprzezednich dekadach robil to dla kariery i ze strachu przed
Zydami ktorzy uwazaja Ukraincow za jeszcze wiekszych antysemitow od Polakow.
Bedac papiezem moglby sie zaczac przyznawac do Matki na ktorej czesc wypisywal
elegie jako kilkunastoletni chlopiec. Wszak nie stanie ‘pieredsiedatieljom’
przewodniczacym czy pierwszym sekretarzem Trojcy Swietej.

Jako mlodzieniec, w czasie wojny stawial opor najezdzcy wystepujac jako aktor
w prywatnym krakowskim teatrzyku i wstepujacdo seminarium duchownego.

Ja juz glosowalam na J. Flemminga, jednego z odkrywcow PENICYLINY.

Odnosnie Hitlera, przykro mi slyszec ze jest on na trzecim miejscu.

Moi rodzice ucierpieli wywlaszczenie we wrzesniu 1939 roku i to bez-zwrotne.
Stad i brak u mnie do niego milosci choc z drugiej strony, ja jako polskie
niemowle przezylam DWS tylko dzieki hitlerowskiej opiece lekarskiej. Choc
Polacy mieli gorsze kartki zywnosciowe i byli drugiej klasy obywatelami III
Reichu z ograniczonymi prawami obywatelskimi, sluzba medyczna byla dla nas taka
sama jak dla Niemcow. Polakow i mnie leczono ze smiertelnych w tych czasach
biegunkach letnich noworodkow w niemieckim szpitalu Swietej Anny dwa razy.

Jezeli jednak wybiora Hitlera, to chyba dlatego ze coraz mniej ludzi wierzy w
zaglade Zydow (brak masowych grobow 4,000,000 Zydow kotrych niemcy nie zdazyli
przepalic) i Polakow a coraz wiecej zdaje sobie sprawe ze Hitler byl pierwszym
przywodca narodu ktory

– wprowadzil 4 tygodniowe wakacje dla pracownikow

– darmowa kase chorych dla wszystkich robotnikow ( nie ma tego do dzis w USA)

– sam nie palil i walczyl z paleniem papierosow jako szkodliwych dla zdrowia w
czasach kiedy American Medical Association zalecalo w rekalmach dla Camel’i
palenie w wypadku chorego gardla

– byl pierwszym ktory wprowadzil zarzadzenia w celu ochronny czystosci powierza
i srodowiska

– wprowadzil zarzadzenia ochrony zwierzat i kary za znecanie sie nad nimi

– zasluzonych robotnikow wysylal na wakacje do Grecji i Wloch w tym celu
zbudowanymi okretami

– WPROWADZIL PRAWA ZABRANIAJACE SKROBANEK W TYM DLA POLEK. Nie jestem pewna
ale chyba i te same prawa odnosily sie do Zydowek karal obozem koncentracyjnym
za nielegalne przerywanie ciazy.

– jako osme panstwo w Europie wprowadzil prawo o eutanazji. Choc byly
wybieranym dyktatorem po kilku miesiacach to zarzadzenie odwolal w 1939 roku po
protestach wladz koscielnych.

– Hitler byl jedynym zachodnim przywodca narodu ktory placil duchownym
comiesieczna gaze w tym polskim ksiezom, tym ktorzy nie zajmowali sie
polityka. Podejrzanych w patriotyzmie >>> internowal setkami w Dachau.

– HITLER BYL CHYBA JEDYNYM, WYBIERANYM CO DWA LATA W PLEBISCYCIE DYKATOREM
W NOWOCZESNEJ HISTORII SWIATA .

– Hitler byl utalentowanym artysta malarzem (portrety, architektura), ktory od
reki w czasie wizyty do budujacej sie fabryki Volkswagenow od reki na
karteluszce machnal olowkiem (naszkicowal) zewnetrzyny wyglad Volkswagena auto
ktore jeszcze do dzis uzywaja tysiace mieszkancow ziemskiej kuli.

– Hitler byl przeciwko totalitarnej wojnie i zwyciestwu za wszelka cene!!!

– Posiadajac zasoby gazow paralizujacych nerwy, wolal popelnic samobojstwo niz
uratowac za taka straszna cene III Rzesze

– Hitler byl jedynym ktory sprzeciwial sie budowaniu bombowcow dalekiego
zasiegu, ktrorych glownych celem bylo (w tych czasach) bombardowanie ludnosci
cywilnej ze wzgledu na ich niecelnosc w czasie zrzutow bomb (stad naloty
dywanowe w tym holokost w Hamburgu Cologne i Dreznie.)

– Nota bene Churchill byl pierwszym ktory zaczal bombardowanie ludnosci
cywilnej i to juz 11 maja 1940 roku na drugi dzien jak go obrano Prime
Minister. Bombardowanie Gurenica w Hiszpanii (1937), Warszawy (1939) i
Roterdamu (1940) bylo uprawomocnione miedzynarodowymi konwencjami o prowadzeniu
wojny i bombardowaniu miast twierdz.

Z powazaniem
Polina Borowska

PS Hitler byl rowniez glupi: na dobro nam lub na zlo nigdy nie rozparcelowal
kolhospow i dlatego przegral wojne z Rosja.

[email protected] wrote:
> ————————————————————————
> Subject: [ProPatria] glosujcie na Papieza
> Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 22:24:24 (UTC)
> From: [email protected]
> Reply-To: Lista Pro Patria <[email protected]>
> To: [email protected]
>
> VOTE AGAINST HITLER FOR TIME MAGAZINE’S PERSON OF THE CENTURY
>
> > >>> >TIME magazine is having an election, via the Internet, in order to
> > >>> >find the “person of the century.” Amazingly, today (right now)
> > >>> >Hitler is number 3. I don’t know how you feel about it, but I don’t
> > >>> >want to see Hitler’s face on the cover of this year’s December
> > >>> >edition of TIME magazine. I don’t think that someone who is
> > >>> >directly responsible for the death of millions and someone who
> > >>> >taught hatred in such an unbelievable way should be called the
> > >>> >”person of the century.”
> > >>> >
> > >>> >For whatever influence Hitler may have had on the 20th century
> > >>> >it seems a shame to give what could be considered an honor to this
> > >>> >man. There are so many people to vote for that have evoked
> > >>> >positive change on the 20th century.
> > >>> >
> > >>> >Please take a moment to visit the web site listed below and vote for
> > >>> >just about anyone else. If you look up the top 100 on the web site,
> > >>> >(by clicking “submit,” before you actually vote), it will show
> > >>> >you the number of votes accumulated for each person (again,
> > >>> >Hitler is in 3rd place right now).
> > >>> >
> > >>> >Neo nazi groups from all over the world will call their members
> > >>> >to vote for Hitler via e-mail; I want to do the same, but the other
> > >>> >way around. It is up to you if you want to follow my call for
> > >>> >voting against Hitler and it is also up to you if you want to spread
> > >>> >this e-mail or not. It won’t cost you anything, and takes just a
> > >>> >little time to do.

> > >>> >Please vote against Hitler under:
> > >>> >
> > >>> > http://cgi.pathfinder.com/time/time100/poc/century.html (Page doesn`t exist)
> > >>> > Click here: Person of the Century Poll
> > >>> > and please forward this to everyone on your e-mailing list
>
> =======================================================
> ProPatria – lista dyskusyjna poswiecona antypolonizmowi
> Administrator: <[email protected]> (MJ Wiechowski)

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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian
Subject: Re: jewropejszczyzna w naszej mowie >>>[central-europe] No Subject
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 09:29:09 -0400
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Choc pan mieszka w Polsce powinien pan najpierw nauczyc sie mowic i
pisac po polsku a nie wciskac nam zargon Jewropejskiej Unii.

Po polsku jest WYPISAC SIE a nie “wylogowac” co mozna przetlumaczyc na
‘wyklodzic’. W kazdym badz razie po angielsku ‘log’ to jest bierwiono
przed rozklinowaniem go na klody. Poprawny polski zargon Unii wymaga
powiedziec lub napisac ‘wylogingowac”

Na internet uzywam slowa sputsiec dla upamietnienia ze PIERWSZY
sztuczny satelita ziemi mial proto-ukrainska, staroslowanska nazwe
sptunik.

Ja nie wysylam emaili a elepoczte

Nie moge wymyslec slowa na witryne, makaronizm jak rowniez na fax ktory
Ukraincy nazywaja telezapysuwacz.

Stapler Ukraincy nazwali skobnikiem kilkanascie lat temu co sie przyjelo
w Polsce od slow skoba ktorymi zbijano bierwiona na goralskich chatach-
sadybach i szalasach.

Kitchen counter Ukraincy nazywaja lawnikiem poniewaz (niskie) lawy staly
pod scianami. Poniewaz ukrainskie i polskie slowa sa odnosnie tych
przedmiotow identyczne uzywam je i ja. Ciekawe czy sie przyjma.

Microwave oven Ukraincy nazywaja chwylopiczka. Ciekawe dlaczego w tym
najstarszym slowianskim jezyku jest tak lekko tworzyc nowe slowa a
jezyku polskim jest tak trudno je wymyslac?! Nasz’ piec mikrofalowy” to
raczej zlozona trzywyrazowa makaronistyczno slowianska okrpopnosc
jezykowa.

Klimatyzator lub eirkondyszoner ERIN’a i jemu podobnych Ukraincy
nazywaja ‘cholodilnyk’ w odroznieniu od kuchenno zenskiego rodzaju
cholodilnia lub lidiwnyczka. A jak cholodilnyk nazwac po polsku?

“Polski” kalkulator po ukrainsku czyselnyk.

Jestem zazdrosna ze Ukraincy mowiac po ukrainsku uzywaja ukrainskich
slow ( mimo tego ze przez 350 lat probowano ich zrusyfikowac a nas
zaledwie 150) , a my czepiamy sie jak nie jewropejszczyzny to
makaronizmow.

Nasi jezykoznawcy powinni poskrobac sie troche po glowach i wymyslec
jaka slowianska nazwe na computer. Proponuje zeby popatrzyli w

KILKUNASTOTOMOWY SLOWNIK STAROZYTNOSCI SLOWIANSKICH, ktory mi
splonal, i wskrzesili jakis staroslowianski lub staroposki archaizm
jezykowy ktory by mial podobne znaczenie jak dzisiejszy kompjuter.

Zapene bacowie mieli jakes slowo na wierzbowy lub topolowy patyk na
ktorym karbowali ilosc owiec i baranow zabieranych gospodarzom na lato
na hale.

Ale nasi dzisiejsi jezykoznawcy i kompjuterszczycy nie wiele madrzejsi
od tych goralskich baranow i zachlystuja sie jewropejszczyzna

z pozdrowieniami \\Polina Borowska

Ksiadz W prosze to wyslac Gmurczykowi i Papurkowi i prosze jeszcze raz o
ich adres elepoczty ktory zgubilam.

ERIN wrote:

> Co mam zrobic zeby sie wylogowac?????????????
> ———————————————————————–
> eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/central-europe (Page doesn`t exist)
> www.egroups.com – Simplifying group communications

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Choc pan mieszka w Polsce powinien pan najpierw nauczyc sie mowic i pisac
po polsku a nie wciskac nam zargon Jewropejskiej Unii.
<p>Po polsku jest WYPISAC SIE a nie “wylogowac” co mozna przetlumaczyc
na ‘wyklodzic’.&nbsp; W kazdym badz razie po angielsku ‘log’ to jest bierwiono
przed rozklinowaniem go na klody.&nbsp; Poprawny polski zargon Unii wymaga
powiedziec lub napisac ‘wylogingowac”
<p>&nbsp;Na internet uzywam slowa sputsiec dla upamietnienia ze PIERWSZY
sztuczny satelita ziemi mial proto-ukrainska, staroslowanska nazwe sptunik.
<p>Ja nie wysylam emaili a elepoczte
<p>Nie moge wymyslec slowa na witryne, makaronizm&nbsp; jak rowniez na
fax ktory Ukraincy nazywaja telezapysuwacz.
<p>Stapler Ukraincy nazwali skobnikiem kilkanascie lat temu co sie przyjelo
w Polsce od slow skoba ktorymi zbijano bierwiona na goralskich chatach-
sadybach i szalasach.
<p>Kitchen counter Ukraincy nazywaja lawnikiem poniewaz (niskie) lawy staly
pod scianami.&nbsp; Poniewaz ukrainskie i polskie slowa sa odnosnie tych
przedmiotow identyczne uzywam je i ja.&nbsp; Ciekawe czy sie przyjma.
<p>Microwave oven&nbsp; Ukraincy nazywaja chwylopiczka.&nbsp; Ciekawe dlaczego
w tym najstarszym slowianskim jezyku jest tak lekko tworzyc nowe slowa
a jezyku polskim jest tak trudno je wymyslac?!&nbsp; Nasz’ piec mikrofalowy”
to raczej zlozona trzywyrazowa makaronistyczno slowianska&nbsp; okrpopnosc
jezykowa.
<p>Klimatyzator lub eirkondyszoner ERIN’a i jemu podobnych Ukraincy nazywaja
‘cholodilnyk’ w odroznieniu od kuchenno zenskiego rodzaju cholodilnia lub
lidiwnyczka.&nbsp;&nbsp; A jak cholodilnyk nazwac po polsku?
<p>”Polski” kalkulator po ukrainsku czyselnyk.
<p>Jestem zazdrosna ze Ukraincy mowiac po ukrainsku uzywaja ukrainskich
slow ( mimo tego ze przez 350 lat probowano ich zrusyfikowac a nas zaledwie
150) , a my czepiamy sie jak nie jewropejszczyzny to makaronizmow.
<p>Nasi jezykoznawcy powinni poskrobac sie troche po glowach&nbsp; i wymyslec
jaka slowianska nazwe na computer.&nbsp; Proponuje zeby popatrzyli w
<p>KILKUNASTOTOMOWY&nbsp; SLOWNIK&nbsp; STAROZYTNOSCI&nbsp; SLOWIANSKICH,&nbsp;
ktory mi splonal, i wskrzesili jakis staroslowianski lub staroposki archaizm
jezykowy ktory by mial podobne znaczenie jak dzisiejszy kompjuter.
<p>Zapene bacowie mieli jakes slowo na wierzbowy lub topolowy patyk na
ktorym karbowali ilosc owiec i baranow zabieranych gospodarzom na lato
na hale.
<p>Ale nasi dzisiejsi jezykoznawcy i kompjuterszczycy nie wiele madrzejsi
od tych goralskich baranow i zachlystuja sie jewropejszczyzna
<p>z pozdrowieniami \\Polina Borowska
<p>Ksiadz W prosze to wyslac Gmurczykowi i Papurkowi i prosze jeszcze raz
o ich adres elepoczty ktory zgubilam.
<br>&nbsp;
<p>ERIN wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE>&nbsp;<font color=”#000000″><font size=-1>Co mam
zrobic zeby sie wylogowac?????????????</font></font>
<hr>
<br>eGroups.com home: <a href=”http://www.egroups.com/group/central-europe”
>http://www.egroups.com/group/central-europe</a> (Page doesn`t exist)
<br><a href=”http://www.egroups.com”>www.egroups.com</a> – Simplifying
group communications</blockquote>

</body>
</html>

————–123FF7A2FB2051B55F49155F–

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:28 EDT 1999
Article: 191443 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: Pare slow w sprawie KARUZELI…..
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 21:07:09 -0400
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WP Drozdowski, polscy Zagladowcy i zydowscy Sciepowerzy,

Cala ta dyskusja na temat karuzeli wskazuje na mnostwo emocji dopisujacych a
malo sensu i rzetelnych wiadomosci na ten temat. Wrazenia ludzi ktorzy
pisza na ten temat przypominaja reakcje pacjentow u psychiatry gdy on w
celach diagnostycznych kaze im opisac co widza w kleksie z atramentu.

I tak jedni z pacjentow widza diabla, czesc motyla a inni aniola. Bardzo
niewielu nawet zdrowych ludzi powiedza psychiatrze ze w plamie z atramentu
widza kleks na papierze. Jedna z tych osob jestem ja i postaram sie wskazac
na Wasze bujne Zagladowe wyobrazenia.

1) Sa tylko trzy rzetelne rzetelne wiadomosci na temat karuzeli w poblizu
muru Getta:

a) dosc nieostre zdjecie tej karuzeli w zbiorach GKBZH. Zdjecie to nie ma
daty i jego prowniencja jest nieznana. Przewozna karuzela jest na zdjeciu
zlozona (skladowana) tzn nikt jej w chwili robienia zdjecia nie uzywal i ze
zdjecie nie wynika ze ona byla niedawno lub pozniej w tym miejscu uzywana.

b) choc w warszawskiej gadzinowce z kwietnia 1943 roku sa reklamy, zadna
karuzela ani wesole miasteczko w tym czasie sie nie reklamowaly.

c) nikt z tych co przezyli okupacje ani z Polakow ani z Zydow tej karuzeli
nie wspominal o ile ja sie orientuje. Sprawa karuzeli nabrala rozglosu gdy
poeta zydowskiego pochodzenia Milosz wspomnial o niej w jednym ze swych
wierszy.

Po publikacji poezji Milosza, Ci Co Przezyli Polacy i Zydzi natychmiast
sobie przypomnieli karuzele w najdrobniejszych detalach i to ze muzyka grala
(patefon ? radio? mechaniczne pianino? zywa orkiestra?) a takze to ze
karuzela sie krecila gdy Niemcy palili Getto a Polacy i Polki sie smiali ze
Niemcy z Zydow robia kotlety.

W zakonczeniu chce przypomniec ze to ze Niemcy palili Getto jest wynikiem
nie ze Ci Co Ocaleli pamietali ten fakt ale wynikiem tego ze w latach
piecdziesiatych ogladali, razem ze mna, film zrobiony po wojnie na ktorym
hitlerowcy podpalali dom za domem przy pomocy miotaczy ognia.

Dzis po czterdziestu latach nie jestem pewna czy pozary ktore widzialam w
studium Wytworni Filmow Fabularnych w Lodzi umiejscowione w Parku
Poniatowskiego widzialam potem na filmie czy to byl jakis inny film krecony.

Rzeczywistosc odnosnie palenia Getta przez Niemcow jest tak samo rozna jak
ta na temat karuzeli.

Nie Niemcy a Zydowscy bojowkarze palili Getto i to w nie tyle w celach
obronnych co finansowych.

Hitlerowcy, wrecz przeciwnie, GASILI pozary w Gettcie i to przy pomocy okolo
600 polskich strazakow. Jednym z takich strazakow byl najblizszy przyjaciel
sp mgr. Bednarczyka. Ale poniewaz jestem rewizjonistka wiec ani
Bendnarczykowi ani temu strazakowi na slowo nie wierzylam. (Mgr. Bednarczyk
byl sikorszczakiem, czlonkiem Korpusu Bezpieczenstwa [to takie UB Armii
KRajowej] autorem kilku ksiazek (np Walus kontra Wisenthal] i zalozycielem
muzeum Sikorskiego w Wawie).

Jednakze pisale o tym general SS Stroop (jako rewizjonistka temu
hitlerowcowi oczywiscie nie wierzylam na slowo) a co najwazniejsze jak
ogladac zdjecia z jego albumu przez lupe to na dalekim planie widzac
polskich strazakow jak gasza pozary w Gettcie.

Oczywiscie nie robi najmniejszego sensu twierdzenie ze Niemcy palili i
jednoczesnie gasili Getto.

A dlaczego podpalali je zydowscy bojowkarze z Anielewiczem i Edelmanem na
czele? Odpowiedz jest ze glownie po to by ulatwic im “eksy”. Mikroskopowe
podziemie Getta zylo z ekspropriacji tzn szli z rewolwerami do bogatych
Zydow i grozili: Szmul jak nie masz miekkich (papierowych dolarow) dawaj
twarde zlote 20 dolarowki lub 10ciorublowki) na organizacje. Jak Szmul nie
dawal to bili lub urzadzali niby to egzekucje opornego.

Haslem do “powstania” a naprawde ruchawki bylo Kein Geld, Kein Mensch. 10
kwietnia 1943 roku Niemcy zarzadali kolejnej natychmiastowej kontrybucji
$5,000 w zlocie i zagrozili kolejna deportacja 5,000 mezczyzn do obozu w
Trawnikach i Poniatowej jesli zlota natychmiast nie dostana.

99.5% ludnosci getta postanowilo nie oddac monet zachowanych na czarna
godzine i spokojnie poddac sie deportacji a 0.5% awanturnikow i komunistow
postanowili wywolac “powstanie” (Dr. Edelman twierdzi ze bralo udzial okolo
200 bojownikow inni Zydzi ze okolo 1,000).

“Powstancy” widzac ze ludzie spokojnie pojda na deportacje zdawali sobie ze
nie beda mieli z kogo wiecej zdzierac pieniedzy. Stad powstanie. Dlaczego
palili – w dwu celach:

a) obronnym i zwiekszenie zamieszania dla Niemcow i odwrocenie ich uwagi

b) w celu szybkiego wykurzenia wspolwyznawcow z mieszkan w celu ich
“spenetrowania” i mieszkan tzn ostatniej ekspropriacji (ostatniego eksa).

I rzeczywiscie, nienajgorzej na tym wyszli. Antek Zukierman natychmiast po
wojnie sie rozpil nigdzie nie pracowal i chodzil w butach z cholewami (widac
to na zdjeciach). Buty z cholewami wowczas to tak jak sportowe Ferrari lub
Cadillac dzis. Dr. Edelman 24 letni rzekomo bez rodziny i bez grosza
mlodzieniec stal sie wlascicielem willi w Lodzi na
ulicy Zelwerowicza ktora dzis jest warta okolo $250,000 a chyba dwa razy
wiecej po wojnie w Lodzi w ktorej panowal szalony glod mieszkaniowy.

Nie trudno sie domyslec ze ci mlodzie ludzie stali sie nagle bogatymi w 1945
roku nie z pracy wlasnych rak.

Tak wiec wracajac do Warszawskiej Karuzeli, mitologia Zagladowcow na jej
temat wytwozyla sie dopiero kilkadziesiat lat po wojnie a “twarde” fakty
wskazuja na zupelna prozaike. Karuzela stala w tym miejscu
najprawdopodobniej skladowana i od lat nie uzywana. Inaczej, natychmiast po
wojnie pamietali by ja warszawscy Zydzi i Polacy

Z Powazaniem

Polina borowska

Ksiadz W. prosze wyslac to Gmurczykowi i Danie Papurec.

[email protected] wrote:

> On 16 Oct 1999 23:40:44 GMT, [email protected] (RU8xx) wrote:
>
> >Sprawa “Karuzeli”….
> >
> >Kontrowersja pomiedzy pogladem p. Ponieckiej i p. Malca w sprawie
> karuzeli,
> >ktora w kwietniu 1943 roku dzialala przy murach getta warszawskiego,
> wynika –
> >jak sadze – z oczywistego faktu, ze p. Jerzy widzi w tej karuzeli
> przede
> >wszystkim _ symbol_ sytuacji historycznej, a p. Hania – patrzy na te
> karuzele
>
> J.Malec nie widzi nic poza tym co chce widziec i Panu, Panie Pawle,
> widze oczy bielmem zachodza, jak nie przykladajac u J.Malca.
>
> >przede wszystkim jako na _historyczny fakt i konkret_.
> >
> >Znam starszego pana, ktory mieszkal bardzo blisko tej karuzeli, majac
> wtedy lat
> >pietnascie.
> >Wspomina czasem, jak wchodzil z kolega na dach domu, aby obserwowac,
> jak plonie
> >getto.
> >Pamieta karuzele.
> >Byla karuzela i faktycznie ludzie siadali na karuzeli i jakas muzyka
> nawet
> >grala, a getto plonelo i ludzie tam gineli.
>
> Ja rowniez znam straszego Pana, ktory pamieta ze ludzie w czasie kiedy
> gineli ludzie w lasach, obozach, podczas morderczej pracy czy tez
> lapanki brali sluby, robili wesela, obchodzili imieniny.
>
> >
> >Jeszcze przed powstaniem – wspomina moj znajomy, ktorego ojciec mial
> sklep z
> >tzw. “produktami kolonialnymi” tuz obok getta – codziennie do sklepu
> >przychodzili mali chlopcy z getta, ktorym udawalo sie przeslizgnac
> przez dziure
> >w murze.
> >
> >Moj znajomy dwie rzeczy pamieta najbardziej: ze jego ojciec zawsze im
> cos dawal
> >do jedzenia i ze powszechnie mowilo sie o takim dziecku – “Zydlak”.
> >
> >A z karuzela to tak bylo: z karuzeli wiadomo, ze korzystali mieszkancy
> >Warszawy…jednoczesnie wiadomo, ze bylo to – by pozyczyc zwrotu z
> jednego z
> >artykulow p. Prussa – POSPOLSTWO.
> >Warszawskie pospolstwo.
> >
> >Ludzie, ktorzy – jak pisze p. Pruss – mieli tendencje do mordowania
> Zydow w
> >Wielki Tydzien w okresie sredniowiecza, nie widzieli niczego
> niewlasciwego w
> >korzystaniu z karuzeli, gdy inni ludzie za murem umierali.
> >
> >Powiedzmy o nich wlasnie w ten, nieco archaiczny sposob: POSPOLSTWO.
> >
> >Pospolstwo jest wszedzie i bylo wszedzie.
> >
> >Chyba wiec zamiast mowic o POLAKACH, lepiej mowic o pospolstwie, ktore
> akurat
> >_ zdarzylo sie_ byc polskie.
> >
> >Ci ludzie nie byli w stanie odczuwac zadnej solidarnosci z Zydami i nie
> >zdawali sobie wtedy sprawy z jednej waznej sprawy…
> >Z tego, co mowi mloda Zydowka z opowiadania Tadeusza Borowskiego
> “Pozegnanie z
> >Maria”:
> >
> >” – A ja mysle, ze po aryjskiej stronie tez bedzie getto – powiedziala
> patrzac
> >z ukosa na Marie. – Tylko nie bedzie z niego wyjscia.”
>
> Bardzo manipuluje Pan, Panie Pawle, bardzo. Innymi slowy dolewa Pan
> swiadomie oliwy do ognia. Zapewne stanie Pan ponownie na szczycie stosu
> i zawola gromkim glosem jaka to niesprawiedliwosc sie dzieje.
> Ostatnim razem spoznilem sie z zapalkami ale teraz trzymam je blisko
> siebie.
>
> J.Drozdowski
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ (Page doesn`t exist)
> Before you buy.

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:28 EDT 1999
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: M. Kopernik, najslawniejszy rewizjonista ludzkosci
>>glosujcie na Papieza
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 21:41:59 -0400
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jacob wrote:

> polin wrote in message <[email protected]>…
>
> Jaka szkoda, ze Polin/Pawlikowski nie zyl/a w czaie Hitlera. Bylaby lepszym
> ministrem propagandy od Goebbelsa.
> A Wy glupi Polacy wcale nie wiedzieliscie jak docenic Hitlera.
> Trzeba byc podlym do najwyzszego stopnia, zeby tak draznic Polakow na
> polskiej liscie.
> Mozemy sobie wyobrazic, jak szczesliwa/y byl/a/by, gdyby Hitler wygral
> wojne.
>
> jakub

Panie Baker,

Gdybym nie uciekla z Polski zostalabym napewno uwieziona jako jedna z Taternikow
(czek) po procesie Kultury w 1964 roku.

Wbrew Panskim przewidywaniom, jestem pewna ze z moim rewizjonistycznym
nastawieniem do narodowych mitow, wyladowalabym w jednym z hitlerowskich obozow
koncentracyjnych obozow gdy Niemcy wygrali DWS.

Kiedys moim role model byl Nasz Papiez. Obecnie sa nim Maria Curie-Sklodowska i
Mikolaj Kopernik, najslawniejszy rewizjonista ludzkosci.

Polina

> >NPJC,
> >
> >W zadnym wypadku nie bede glosowala na tego naszego ‘mierzawca’ (po
> rosyjsku
> >podla, mala, niewdzieczna osoba) Papieza. Juz nie tylko ze wzgledu na jego
> >sluzalcze ‘body language’ (po angielsku pozy ciala wskazujace na wewnetrzne
> >nastawienie osobnika) w obecnosci Zydow (Madlaine Albright w Watykanie lub
> >wobec rabina Kozielewskiego machajacego mu palcem pod nosem w Warszawie).
> >
> >Jednakze jako kobiete i matke, najbardziej co mnie odrzuca od ‘naszego
> papieza’
> >to fakt ze klamie na temat swojej Matki i wstydzi sie jej ukrainskiego
> >pochodzenia i albo o niej milczy albo klamie ze byla Litwinka.
> >
> >Bez watpienia, w poprzezednich dekadach robil to dla kariery i ze strachu
> przed
> >Zydami ktorzy uwazaja Ukraincow za jeszcze wiekszych antysemitow od
> Polakow.
> >Bedac papiezem moglby sie zaczac przyznawac do Matki na ktorej czesc
> wypisywal
> >elegie jako kilkunastoletni chlopiec. Wszak nie stanie
> ‘pieredsiedatieljom’
> >przewodniczacym czy pierwszym sekretarzem Trojcy Swietej.
> >
> >Jako mlodzieniec, w czasie wojny stawial opor najezdzcy wystepujac jako
> aktor
> >w prywatnym krakowskim teatrzyku i wstepujacdo seminarium duchownego.
> >
> > Ja juz glosowalam na J. Flemminga, jednego z odkrywcow PENICYLINY.
> >
> >Odnosnie Hitlera, przykro mi slyszec ze jest on na trzecim miejscu.
> >
> >Moi rodzice ucierpieli wywlaszczenie we wrzesniu 1939 roku i to
> bez-zwrotne.
> >Stad i brak u mnie do niego milosci choc z drugiej strony, ja jako polskie
> >niemowle przezylam DWS tylko dzieki hitlerowskiej opiece lekarskiej. Choc
> >Polacy mieli gorsze kartki zywnosciowe i byli drugiej klasy obywatelami III
> >Reichu z ograniczonymi prawami obywatelskimi, sluzba medyczna byla dla nas
> taka
> >sama jak dla Niemcow. Polakow i mnie leczono ze smiertelnych w tych
> czasach
> >biegunkach letnich noworodkow w niemieckim szpitalu Swietej Anny dwa razy.
> >
> >Jezeli jednak wybiora Hitlera, to chyba dlatego ze coraz mniej ludzi wierzy
> w
> >zaglade Zydow (brak masowych grobow 4,000,000 Zydow kotrych niemcy nie
> zdazyli
> >przepalic) i Polakow a coraz wiecej zdaje sobie sprawe ze Hitler byl
> pierwszym
> >przywodca narodu ktory
> >
> >- wprowadzil 4 tygodniowe wakacje dla pracownikow
> >
> >- darmowa kase chorych dla wszystkich robotnikow ( nie ma tego do dzis w
> USA)
> >
> >- sam nie palil i walczyl z paleniem papierosow jako szkodliwych dla
> zdrowia w
> >czasach kiedy American Medical Association zalecalo w rekalmach dla Camel’i
> >palenie w wypadku chorego gardla
> >
> >- byl pierwszym ktory wprowadzil zarzadzenia w celu ochronny czystosci
> powierza
> >i srodowiska
> >
> >- wprowadzil zarzadzenia ochrony zwierzat i kary za znecanie sie nad nimi
> >
> >- zasluzonych robotnikow wysylal na wakacje do Grecji i Wloch w tym celu
> >zbudowanymi okretami
> >
> >- WPROWADZIL PRAWA ZABRANIAJACE SKROBANEK W TYM DLA POLEK. Nie jestem
> pewna
> >ale chyba i te same prawa odnosily sie do Zydowek karal obozem
> koncentracyjnym
> >za nielegalne przerywanie ciazy.
> >
> >- jako osme panstwo w Europie wprowadzil prawo o eutanazji. Choc byly
> >wybieranym dyktatorem po kilku miesiacach to zarzadzenie odwolal w 1939
> roku po
> >protestach wladz koscielnych.
> >
> >- Hitler byl jedynym zachodnim przywodca narodu ktory placil duchownym
> >comiesieczna gaze w tym polskim ksiezom, tym ktorzy nie zajmowali sie
> >polityka. Podejrzanych w patriotyzmie >>> internowal setkami w Dachau.
> >
> >- HITLER BYL CHYBA JEDYNYM, WYBIERANYM CO DWA LATA W PLEBISCYCIE
> DYKATOREM
> >W NOWOCZESNEJ HISTORII SWIATA .
> >
> >- Hitler byl utalentowanym artysta malarzem (portrety, architektura), ktory
> od
> >reki w czasie wizyty do budujacej sie fabryki Volkswagenow od reki na
> >karteluszce machnal olowkiem (naszkicowal) zewnetrzyny wyglad Volkswagena
> auto
> >ktore jeszcze do dzis uzywaja tysiace mieszkancow ziemskiej kuli.
> >
> >- Hitler byl przeciwko totalitarnej wojnie i zwyciestwu za wszelka cene!!!
> >
> >- Posiadajac zasoby gazow paralizujacych nerwy, wolal popelnic samobojstwo
> niz
> >uratowac za taka straszna cene III Rzesze
> >
> >- Hitler byl jedynym ktory sprzeciwial sie budowaniu bombowcow dalekiego
> >zasiegu, ktrorych glownych celem bylo (w tych czasach) bombardowanie
> ludnosci
> >cywilnej ze wzgledu na ich niecelnosc w czasie zrzutow bomb (stad naloty
> >dywanowe w tym holokost w Hamburgu Cologne i Dreznie.)

> >- Nota bene Churchill byl pierwszym ktory zaczal bombardowanie ludnosci
> >cywilnej i to juz 11 maja 1940 roku na drugi dzien jak go obrano Prime
> >Minister. Bombardowanie Gurenica w Hiszpanii (1937), Warszawy (1939) i
> >Roterdamu (1940) bylo uprawomocnione miedzynarodowymi konwencjami o
> prowadzeniu
> >wojny i bombardowaniu miast twierdz.
> >
> >Z powazaniem
> >Polina Borowska
> >
> >PS Hitler byl rowniez glupi: na dobro nam lub na zlo nigdy nie
> rozparcelowal
> >kolhospow i dlatego przegral wojne z Rosja.

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:28 EDT 1999
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: Hitler – wybieralnym dyktatorem >>> glosujcie na Papieza
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Leszek Andrzej Kleczkowski wrote:

> polin <[email protected]> wrote:
> : – HITLER BYL CHYBA JEDYNYM, WYBIERANYM CO DWA LATA W
> : PLEBISCYCIE DYKATOREM W NOWOCZESNEJ HISTORII SWIATA .
>
> W jakich latach te “plebiscyty” sie odbyly i kto jeszcze
> kandydowal??

Panie Leszku,

W plebiscytach cze referendum nie ma wielu kandydatow jest tylko jeden
na ktorego sie glosuje lub przeciw.

Gdyby Hitlerowi co dwa lata nie przeglosowan praw Furhera – przywodcy –
dyktatora wznowiono by dzialalnosc Reichstagu -Sejmu

Ostatnie wybory/plebiscyt/referendum na Hitlera odbylo sie w 1943 roku o
ile sie nie myle.

Poniewaz Pan zadal to (rozsadne) pytanie na ten malo znany a niezmiernie
wazny fakt przjerze podrezniki na ten temat.

Pozdrawia,

Polina Borowska.

PS Jestem pewna ze te wszystkie obelgi ktorymi mnie obsypujecie
uzywacie ich dlatego ze myslicie ze jestem mezczyzna. W zwiazku z tym
nie biore ich do siebie lub na powaznie. Jestem rowniez pewna ze wy
Polacy i polscy Zydzi jestescie zbyt wielkimi dzentelmenami by w tak
okrutny sposob obrazac niewiaste.

PB
> Leszek
> —
> Smart questions to stupid answers
> Pisz z sensem – rob dwie spacje po kropce

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:29 EDT 1999
Article: 191458 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: Rozprawiania sie z dr. Ratajczakiem – c.d.
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 21:57:31 -0400
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<!doctype html public “-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en”>
<html>
Dziekuje Panie Mieczu za zamieszczenie wiadomosci o Dr. Ratajczaku.
<p>Jego sprawa jest mi bardzo powazna i kamieniem na sercu i w zwiazku
z tym napisze na ten temat obszernie za kilka dni po doglebnym zasiegnieciu
jezyka
<p>Polina
<p>PS Rowniez Sciepowicze i Sciepowerzy powinni wiedziec dlaczego w wieku
niemowlecym rozpadl sie Komitet Obrony dr, Ratajczaka
<p>”Miecz – S&sup3;awomir” wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
Dnia 19. pazdziernika 1999 ( w 15. rocznice zamordowania
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ks. Jerzego Popieluszki) w Sadzie Rejonowym
w Opolu odbyla
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; sie rozprawa w sprawie umorzenia warunkowego
postepowania
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; przeciwko Doktorowi Dariuszowi Ratajczakowi,
wykladowcy
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Uniwersytetu Opolskiego – zawieszonemu w kwietniu
br.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; w prawach nauczyciela akademickiego po wydaniu
ksiazki
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; “Tematy Niebezpieczne” pod zarzutem k&sup3;amstwa
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; oswiecimskiego.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Prokurator Lidia Sieradzka
nie zgodzila sie na umorzenie
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; warunkowe, postulujac aby rozprawa sie odbyla
i aby Ratajczak
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zostal skazany a wyrok podany do publicznej
wiadomosci.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Dr Dariusz Ratajczak&nbsp;
rowniez nie zgadza sie na umorzenie
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; warunkowe, wnioskuje o pelne uniewinnienie
od zarzutow.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Bronil sie osobiscie&nbsp; z braku srodkow
finansowych na
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zaplacenie adwokata (nie pracuje juz od kwietnia
br). Odczytal
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; swoje 4-minutowe oswiadczenie w obronie wolnosci
slowa,
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; gdzie zaatakowal glownie polityczna poprawnosc
(political
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; correctness). Powiedzial miedzy innymi: “Politycznie
poprawne
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; grupy, ktore nawet fizycznie molestuja rewizjonistow
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; holocaustu, zachowuja sie nie lepiej niz hitlerowskie
bojowki SA
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; w roku 1933 w Niemczech”
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Po wysluchaniu obu
stron, sedzia Turczynski stwierdzil, ze
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; nastepna rozprawa odbedzie sie 16 listopada
br.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Na sali obecni
byli glownie dziennikarze prasy i telewizji
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; lokalnej i ogolnopolskiej.
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Rozprawa trwala okolo 10 minut i juz bylo
po wszystkim.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Trzeba podkreslic fakt
niezaprzeczalny, ze Dr Ratajczak po
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; kilku miesiacach bezrobocia, bez srodkow do
zycia, bez zadnej
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; pomocy finansowej z zewnatrz, nie zalamal
sie, nie poddal sie,
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; nie prosil na kolanach o umorzenie sprawy,
ale stanowczo
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; wnioskowal o uniewinnienie od wszelkich zarzutow.
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; podal PK
<p>Wiadomosc przeslal,
<br>–
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
//
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp; O&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;M I E C Z>>>>>>>>>>>>
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
\\
<p>T.N.Roman
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; „Jestem Polakiem —
wi&ecirc;c mam
<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; obowi&plusmn;zki&nbsp; polskie…”
<p>Roman Dmowski,&nbsp; „MY&brvbar;LI NOWOCZESNEGO POLAKA”
<p><a href=”mailto:[email protected]”>mailto:[email protected]</a>
</blockquote>
</html>

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:29 EDT 1999
Article: 191461 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: Polina sie pomylila >>>>Hitler – wybieralnym dyktatorem
>>>glosujcie na Papieza
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 22:46:11 -0400
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NPJC,

dobrywieczor sicepowiczom i sciepowerom, antysemitom i filosemitomm
rewizjonistom i zagladowcom.

Jak sie duzo mowi i lub pisze jest wrecz niemozliwym nie popelnic bledu.

Zdazylo sie to i mnie w ponizszym liscie.

Otoz nawet w tytule uzylam niewlasciwego slowa odnosnie Hitlera. Nie
zauwazylambym tego gdyby nie krytyka naszych zagladowcow-sciepowerow!

Rzeczywiscie Hitler nie byl wybieranym dyktatorem.

A bylo to tak:

W 1933 roku po pozarz Reichstag dal mu, kanclerzowi (kanclerz mniej wiecej =
prezes rady ministrow) dyktatorskie prawa na piec lat tzn mogl ustanawiac
prawa bez udzialu w tym Reichstagu (sejmu)

W 1934 umarl Hindenburg i Hitler poloaczyl urzad prezydenta z kancleerzem

Rowniez w 1934 Hitler zdelegalizowal partie polityczne procz NSDAP.

Pomiedzy 1933-1938 bylo okolo piec referendums w ktorych pytano miedzy
innymi czy ufa sie Hitlerowi na co 90 % Niemcow odpowiedziala Tak.

Co by sie stalo gdyby Szwabi powiedzieli NIE trudno przewidziec.

Co roku w styczniu Hitler dawal sprawozdanie dla Reichstagu

Ostatni raz co Reichstag (Sejm) przedluzyl prawa dyktatorskie Hitlerowi bylo
w 1943 roku. W tym roku panstowo Deutsches Reich zmienil nazwe na Grosse
Deutsches Reich.

Konstytucja Republiki Weimarskiej nigdy nie zostala uniewazniona lecz w
czasie wladzy Hitlera byla martwa litera prawa poniewaz Reichstag dal prawa
dyktatorskie Hitlerowi.

W 1945 roku przed smiercia Hitler odnowil Republike Weimarska. Kanclerzem
nazanczyl Adm Doenitza. Rozlaczyl urzad prezydenta i kanclerza. Rzad
Deonitza ktory natychmiast rozwiazal SS istnial do konca maja kiedy zostal
zlikwidowany przez Aliantow.

To ze Hitler przed samobojstwem rozlaczyl urzedy prezydenta i kanclerza
oznaczalo lub moze oznaczac ze on nie uwazal ze 1000-letni Reich powinien
trwac w systemie totalitarnym.

Natomiast ZSSR uwazalo ze dyktatura proletariatu powinna byc nieomal na
wiecznosc i to na calym swiecie.

Godlem III Reichu byla niemiecka “gapa”. Godlem ZSSR byl sierp i mlot
namalowany ponad kula ziemska na ktorej widac bylo wszystkich piec
kontynentow.

Godlem Prawdy bylo Proletariusze WSZYSTKICH krajow laczcie sie.

Godlem Werhmachtu bylo Gott mit uns.

Wydaje sie ze dykatura hitlerowcow byla czasowym zjawiskiem Dyktatura
proletariatu miala byc az do ostatecznego zwyciestwa a moze i dluzej.

Errare humanum est

Uczymy sie na wlasnych bledach w nieskonczonosc

Dziekuje

Polina borowska

W

polin wrote:

> Leszek Andrzej Kleczkowski wrote:
>
> > polin <[email protected]> wrote:
> > : – HITLER BYL CHYBA JEDYNYM, WYBIERANYM CO DWA LATA W
> > : PLEBISCYCIE DYKATOREM W NOWOCZESNEJ HISTORII SWIATA .
> >
> > W jakich latach te “plebiscyty” sie odbyly i kto jeszcze
> > kandydowal??
>
> Panie Leszku,
>
> W plebiscytach cze referendum nie ma wielu kandydatow jest tylko jeden
> na ktorego sie glosuje lub przeciw.
>
> Gdyby Hitlerowi co dwa lata nie przeglosowan praw Furhera – przywodcy –
> dyktatora wznowiono by dzialalnosc Reichstagu -Sejmu
>
> Ostatnie wybory/plebiscyt/referendum na Hitlera odbylo sie w 1943 roku o
> ile sie nie myle.
>
> Poniewaz Pan zadal to (rozsadne) pytanie na ten malo znany a niezmiernie
> wazny fakt przjerze podrezniki na ten temat.
>
> Pozdrawia,
>
> Polina Borowska.
>
> PS Jestem pewna ze te wszystkie obelgi ktorymi mnie obsypujecie
> uzywacie ich dlatego ze myslicie ze jestem mezczyzna. W zwiazku z tym
> nie biore ich do siebie lub na powaznie. Jestem rowniez pewna ze wy
> Polacy i polscy Zydzi jestescie zbyt wielkimi dzentelmenami by w tak
> okrutny sposob obrazac niewiaste.
>
> PB
> > Leszek
> > —
> > Smart questions to stupid answers
> > Pisz z sensem – rob dwie spacje po kropce

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:29 EDT 1999
Article: 191463 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: Roznica miedzy 90% i 99,5% >>Hitler – wybieralnym dyktatorem >>> glosujcie na Papieza
Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 22:52:04 -0400
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<[email protected]> <[email protected]>
<[email protected]>
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Panie Zalek,

Tak jak pan pisze w demoludach “wybierano” wiekszocia 99,5% glosow co bylo
oczywista fikcja

Referenda ktore oglaszal Hitler dawaly mu slowo zaufania w zaledwie 90% co
oznacza ze wybory w III Reichu byly wolne lub nieomal wolne.

Niemcy naprawde kochali Hitlera jak zlikwidowal bezrobocie.

W zwiazku z tym Goldhagen ma racje na 50% ze przecietny Niemiec jest
odpowiedzialny za postepki rzadu Hitlera. Jednakze tych drugich 50% to jest
to ze hitlerowcy nie mordowali Zydow na przemyslowa skale

Z powazaniem Polina

[email protected]” wrote:

> On Thu, 21 Oct 1999 21:54:03 -0400, polin <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> >Leszek Andrzej Kleczkowski wrote:
> >
> >> polin <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> : – HITLER BYL CHYBA JEDYNYM, WYBIERANYM CO DWA LATA W
> >> : PLEBISCYCIE DYKATOREM W NOWOCZESNEJ HISTORII SWIATA .
> >>
> >> W jakich latach te “plebiscyty” sie odbyly i kto jeszcze
> >> kandydowal??
> >
> >Panie Leszku,
> >
> >W plebiscytach cze referendum nie ma wielu kandydatow jest tylko jeden
> >na ktorego sie glosuje lub przeciw.
> >
> >Gdyby Hitlerowi co dwa lata nie przeglosowan praw Furhera – przywodcy –
> >dyktatora wznowiono by dzialalnosc Reichstagu -Sejmu
> >
> >Ostatnie wybory/plebiscyt/referendum na Hitlera odbylo sie w 1943 roku o
> >ile sie nie myle.
> >
> >Poniewaz Pan zadal to (rozsadne) pytanie na ten malo znany a niezmiernie
> >wazny fakt przjerze podrezniki na ten temat.
> >
> >Pozdrawia,
> >
> >Polina Borowska.
>
> Tez mi osiagniecie. W PRLu tez wybierano PZPR co pare lat i 99.9%
> ludzi glosowalo na Partje. To sie nazwa osiagniecie!!!!
>
> Mam nadzieje ze tego waznego faktu tez sie nie zapomni, i w
> podrecznikach historycznych te fakty beda lezaly bardzo blizko siebie.
>
> Zalek Bloom

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:30 EDT 1999
Article: 191479 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian,
soc.culture.german,soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: Who cares about Nuremberg Tribunal
>>>Suppression of Christian churches by Nazis
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 00:44:03 -0400
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soc.culture.russian:159112

Dear Mr Mc Vay,

In the “[present] era of revisionism” (term in editorial in Martyrs and
Resistance Dec. 1996) who cares about [extorted] testimonies obtained
during Nuremberg trials? … I guess only naive ones or fanatical
holocaustians.

I will bet on January 27, 1939 The New York Times which explicitly
acknowledged that from among the western leaders Hitler was the only one
who paid salaries to clergymen of all denominations, while some of them the
politically active he interned or imprisoned at Dachau.

In 1940, he put behind barbed wires about 1,400 Polish Catholic priests
while the others, explicitly less patriotic drew the Nazi salaries, and
printed as usual their religous literature on cellulose, a rationed and
strategically important material ( used in production of nitrocellulose
[smokeless powder and bandages for wounded soldiers]).

While Hitler was supportive of apolitical religion and Polish and Ukrainian
priests, unimpeeded, printed their religeous literature, another dictator
the CPSU Comm Party of the USSR ) abolished virtually all religeous
printing in Poland until 1956 and abolished the church (Catholic) of
Western Ukraine and imprisoned all of its bishops.

Why do you drone and exaggerate about Adolf Hitler and remain silent about
Uncle Stalin. Do you have any love for the latter because he was
protective of the Communist Jews and played Hatikva on the Moscow Radio and
Solomon Lozovsky was his chief of Propaganda?

And, while even during the war Hitler was paying clergy’s salaries,
Roosevelt and Churchill have never done it in the peace time.

Greetings from Polina Borowska

Kenneth McVay OBC wrote:

> Perhaps Mr. Vangel would like to comment on the Nazi campaign to
> destroy Christianity within areas under their control, as outlined
> during the first Nuremberg Tribunal?
>
> (https://nizkor.org/hweb/imt/nca/nca-01/nca-01-07-means-30.html) Broken link
>
> Archive/File: imt/nca/nca-01/nca-01-07-means-02
> Last-Modified: 1996/06/06
>
> [Page 263]
> Chapter VII
>
> MEANS USED BY THE NAZI CONSPIRATORS IN GAINING
> CONTROL OF THE GERMAN STATE
>
> 6. SUPPRESSION OF THE CHRISTIAN CHURCHES
>
> A. The Nazi conspirators sought to subvert the influence of
> the churches over the people of Germany.
>
> (1) They sought to eliminate the Christian Churches in
> Germany.
>
> (a) Statements of this aim. Martin Bormann stated in a
> secret decree of the Party Chancellery signed by him and
> distributed to all Gauleiters 7 June 1941:
>
> “Our National Socialist ideology is far loftier than
> the con-
> [Page 264]
>
> cepts of Christianity, which in their essential points
> have been taken over from
> Jewry ***. A differentiation between the various
> Christian confessions is not to be made here *** the
> Evangelical Church is just as inimical to us as the
> Catholic Church. *** All influences which might
> impair or damage the leadership of the people exercised
> by the
> Fuehrer with the help of the NSDAP must be eliminated.
> More and more the people must be separated from the
> churches and their organs the pastors. *** Just as
> the deleterious influences of astrologers, seers and
> other fakers are eliminated and suppressed by the
> State, so must the possibility of church influence also
> be totally removed. *** Not until this has happened,
> does the state leadership have influence on
> the individual citizens. Not until then are the people
> and Reich secure in their existence for all time.” (D-
> 75)
>
> Hans Kerrl, Reich Minister for Church Affairs, in a letter
> dated 6 September 1939 to a Herr Stapel, which indicated
> that it would be brought to the attention of the
> Confidential Council and of the defendant Hess, made the
> following statements:
>
> “The Fuehrer considers his efforts to bring the
> Evangelical Church to reason, unsuccessful and the
> Evangelical Church with respect to its condition
> rightfully a useless pile of sects. As you emphasize
> the Party has previously carried on not only a fight
> against the political element of the Christianity of
> the Church, but also a fight against
> membership of Party Members in a Christian confession.
> ***
>
> “The Catholic Church will and must, according to the
> law under which it is set up, remain a thorn in the
> flesh of a Racial State ***.” (129-PS)
>
> Gauleiter Florian, in a letter dated 23 September 1940 to
> the defendant Hess, stated:
>
> “The churches with their Christianity are the danger
> against which to fight is absolutely necessary.” (064-
> PS)
>
> Regierungsrat Roth, in a lecture 22 September 1941, to a
> group of Security Police, in the Reich Main Security Office
> (RSHA) concluded his address on Security Police (Sipo)
> measures for combatting church politics and sects with the
> following remarks:
>
> “The immediate aim: the church must not regain one inch
> of the ground it has lost. The ultimate aim:
> Destruction of the Confessional Churches to be brought
> about by the collection of all material obtained
> through the intelligence service (Nachrihtendienst)
> activities which will at a given time be produced as
> evidence for the charge of treasonable activities
> during the German fight for existence.” (1815-PS)
>
> The Party Organization Book states:
>
> “Bravery is valued by the SS man as the highest virtue
> of men in a struggle for his ideology.
>
> [Page 265]
>
> “He openly and unrelentingly fights the most dangerous
> enemies of the State; Jews, Free Masons, Jesuits, and
> political clergymen.
>
> “However, he recruits and convinces the weak and
> inconstant by his example, who have not been able to
> bring themselves to the National Socialistic ideology.”
> (1855-PS)
>
> (b) The Nazi conspirators promoted beliefs and practices
> incompatible with Christian teachings. The 24th point of the
> Program of the NSDAP, unchanged since its adoption in 1920,
> is as follows:
>
> “We demand freedom of religion for all religious
> denominations within the state so long as they do not
> endanger its existence or oppose the moral senses of
> the germanic race. The Party as such advocates the
> standpoint of a positive Christianity without binding
> itself confessionally to any one denomination. It
> combats the Jewish materialistic spirit within and
> around us, and is convinced that a lasting recovery of
> our nation can only succeed from within on the
> framework: common utility precedes individual utility.”
> (1708-PS)
>
> In official correspondence with the defendant Rosenberg in
> 1040, Bormann stated:
>
> “Christian religion and National Socialist doctrines
> are not compatible. *** The churches cannot be
> subjugated through compromise, only through a new
> philosophy as prophesied in osenberg’s works.”
>
> He then proposed creation of a National Socialist Catechism
> to provide a “moral foundation” for a National Socialist
> religion which is gradually to supplant the Christian
> churches. He stated the matter was so important it should be
> discussed with members of the Reich Cabinet as soon as
> possible and requested Rosenberg’s opinion before the
> meeting. (098-PS)
>
> In a secret decree of the Party Chancellery, signed by
> Bormann and distributed to all Gauleiters on 7 June 1941,
> the following statements appeared:
>
> “When we National Socialists speak of a belief in God,
> we do not understand by God, like naive Christians and
> their spiritual opportunists, a human-type being, who
> sits around somewhere in the sphere ***. The force of
> natural law, with which all these
> innumerable planets move in the universe, we call the
> Almighty, or God. The claim that this world force ***
> can be influenced by so-called prayers or other
> astonishing things is based upon a proper dose of
> naivete or on a business shamelessness.
>
> [Page 265]
>
> “As opposed to that we National Socialists impose on
> ourselves the demand to live naturally as much as
> possible, i.e., biologically. The more accurately we
> recognize and observe the laws of nature and of life,
> the more we adhere to them, so much the more do we
> conform to the will of the Almighty. The more insight
> we have into the will of the
> Almighty, the greater will be our successes.” (D-75)
>
> Rosenberg in his book “The Myth of the 20th Century”
> advocated a new National Socialist faith or religion to
> replace the Christian confessions in Germany. He stated that
> the Catholic and Protestant churches represent “negative
> Christianity” and do not correspond to the soul of the
> “Nordic racially determined peoples”; that a German
> religious movement would have to declare that the idea of
> neighborly love is unconditionally subordinated to national
> honor; that national
> honor is the highest human value and does not admit of any
> equal valued force such as Christian love. He predicted:
>
> “A German religion will, bit by bit, present in the
> churches transferred to it, in place of the crucifixion
> the spirit of fire the heroicin the highest sense.”
> (2349-PS)
>
> The Reich Labor Service (Reichsarbeitsdienst), a National
> Socialist youth organization, was prohibited from
> participating in religious celebrations of any kind, and its
> members were instructed to attend only the parts of such
> ceremonies as weddings and funerals which took
> place before or after the church celebration. (107-PS)
>
> The Nazi conspirators considered religious literature
> undesirable for the Wehrmacht. National Socialist
> publications were prepared for the Wehrmacht for the
> expressed purpose of replacing and counteracting the
> influence of religious literature disseminated to the
> troops. (101-PS; 100-PS; 064-PS)
>
> The Nazi conspirators through Rosenberg’s Office for
> Supervision of the Ideological Training and Education of the
> NSDAP and the Office of the Deputy of the Fuehrer “induced”
> the substitution of National Socialist mottoes and services
> for religious prayers and services in the schools of
> Germany. (070-PS)
>
> On 14 July 1939, Bormann, as Deputy of the Fuehrer, issued a
> Party regulation excluding clergymen, persons closely
> connected with the church, and Theology students from
> membership in the Party. It was further decreed that in the
> future Party Members who entered the clergy
> or turned to the study of Theology must leave the Party.
> (840-PS)
>
> (c) The Nazi conspirators persecuted priests, clergy and
> members of monastic orders. The priests and clergy of
> Germany were
>
> [Page 267]
>
> subjected by the police to systematic espionage into their
> daily lives. The Nazi conspirators through the Chief of the
> Reich Main Security Office (RSHA) maintained a special
> branch of the Security Police and Security Service (Sipo/SD)
> whose duties were to investigate the churches and maintain
> constant surveillance upon the public and private lives of
> the clergy. (1815-PS)
>
> At a conference of these police “church specialists” called
> by Heydrich, who was then SS Gruppenfuehrer and Chief of the
> Reich Main Security Office (RSHA), in Berlin, 23 September 1941, SS
> Sturmbannfueherer Hartl, acting for Heydrich, stated that
> the greatest importance was to
> be attached to church political activity. The intelligence
> network in this field, he continued, was to be fostered with
> the greatest of care and enlarged with the recruitment of
> informants, particular value being attached to contacts with
> church circles. He closed his lecture with the following
> words:
>
> “Each of you must go to work with your whole heart and
> a true fanaticism. Should a mistake or two be made in
> the execution of this work, this should in no way
> discourage you, since mistakes are made everywhere. The
> main thing is that the enemy should be constantly
> tackled with determination, will, and effective
> initiative.” (1815-PS)
>
> In a letter of 22 October 1941, Heydrich, as Chief of the
> Reich Main Security Office (RSHA) issued detailed
> instructions to all State Police Offices outlining the
> organization of the Catholic Church and directing close
> surveillance of the activities, writings, and reports of the
> Catholic clergy in Germany. In this connection he directed:
>
> “Reports are also to be submitted on those Theological
> students destined for Papal Institutes, and Priests
> returning from such institutes to Germany. Should the
> opportunity arise of placing someone for intelligence
> (Nachrichtendienst) purposes in one of these
> Institutes, in the guise of a Theological student, we
> should receive immediate notification.” (1815-PS)
>
> Priests and other members of the clergy were arrested,
> fined, imprisoned, and otherwise punished by executive
> measures of the police without judicial process. In his
> lecture before a conference at the Reich Main Security
> Office (RSHA) in Berlin, for “church specialists,” of the
> Security Police, 22 November 1941, Regierungsrat Roth stated (1815-
> PS):
>
> “It has been demonstrated that it is impracticable to
> deal with political offenses (malicious) under normal
> legal procedure. Owing to the lack of political
> perception which still
>
> [Page 268]
>
> prevails among the legal authorities, suspension of
> this procedure must be reckoned with. The so-called
> “Agitator Priests” must therefore be dealt with in
> future by Stapo measures, and, if the occasion arises,
> be removed to a Concentration Camp, if agreed upon by
> the RSHA.
>
> “The necessary executive measures are to be decided
> upon according to local conditions, the status of the
> person accused, and the seriousness of the caseas
> follows:

> 1. Warning
> 2. Fine
> 3. Forbidden to preach
> 4. Forbidden to remain in parish
> 5. Forbidden all activity as a priest
> 6. Short-term arrest
> 7. Protective custody.”
>
> Members of monastic orders were forced by the seizure and
> confiscation of their properties to give up their
> established place of abode and seek homes elsewhere (R-101-
> A; R-101-D). A secret order of the SS Economic
> Administration Office to all Concentration Camp Commanders,
> dated 21 April 1942, concerning labor mobilization of
> clergy, reveals that clergymen were at that time, and had
> previously been, incarcerated in Concentration Camps. (1164-
> PS)
>
> On the death of von Hindenburg, the Reich Government ordered
> the ringing of all church bells on 2 August 1934, 3 August
> 1934 and 4 August 1934. In Bavaria, there were many
> instances of failure to comply with this order. The Bavarian
> police submitted a report outlining the above situation and
> stating that in three cases the taking into protective
> custody of recalcitrant clergy could not be avoided.
>
> “The Parish priest, Father Johann Quinger of
> Altenkunstadt BA., Lichtenfels. He was taken into
> protective custody on 3 August on the express order of
> the State Ministry of the Interior, because he
> assaulted SA leaders and SA men who were ringing the
> bells against his wishes. He was released from custody
> on 10 August 1934.
>
> “The Parish priest, Father Ludwig Obholzer of
> Kiefersfelden, BA Rosenheim. For his personal safety he
> was in police custody from 2400 hours on the 2 August
> 1934, till 1000 hours on 3 August 1934. On 5 August
> 1934, he said sarcastically in his sermon, referring to
> the SA men who had carried out the ringing of the
> funeral knell on their own account, ‘Lord forgive them,
> for they know not what they do’ ! “The Parish priest,
> Father Johann Nepomuk Kleber of Wie-
>
> [Page 269]
>
> felsdorf, BA Burglengenfeld, refused to ring the church
> bells on the 2nd and 3rd. He is badly tainted
> politically and had to be taken into protective custody
> from the 5th to the 8th of August 34 in the interests
> of his own safety.” (1521-PS)
>
> After Hitler’s rise to power, Bishop Sproll of Rottenburg
> delivered a series of sermons regarded by the Nazis as
> damaging, and on 10 April 1938 he refrained from voting in
> the plebiscite. For this, the Reich Governor of Wuertemberg
> declared he would no longer regard Bishop Sproll as head of
> the Diocese of Rottenburg; made an official request that he
> leave the Gau; and declared he would see to it that all
> personal and official intercourse between the Bishop and the
> State and
> Party offices as well as the Armed Forces would be denied
> (849-PS). For his alleged failure to vote in the plebiscite,
> of 10 April 1938, the Party caused three demonstrations to
> be staged against the Bishop and his household in
> Rottenburg. The third demonstration was described as
> follows in a teletype message from Gestapo Office Stuttgart
> to Gestapo Office Berlin:
>
> “The Party on 23 July 1938 from 2100 on carried out the
> third demonstration against Bishop Sproll. Participants
> about 2,500-3,000 were brought in from outside by bus,
> etc. The Rottenburg populace again did not participate
> in the demonstration. The town took rather a hostile
> attitude to the demonstrations. The action got
> completely out of hand of the Party Member responsible
> for it. The demonstrators stormed the palace, beat in
> the gates and doors. About 150 to 200 people forced
> their way into the palace, searched the rooms, threw
> files out of the windows and rummaged through the beds
> in the rooms of the palace. One bed was ignited. Before
> the fire got to the other objects of equipment in the –
> rooms and the palace, the flaming bed could be thrown
> from the window and the fire extinguished. The Bishop
> was with Archbishop Groeber of Freiburg and the ladies
> and gentlemen of his menage in the chapel at prayer.
> About 25 to 30 people pressed into this chapel and
> molested those present. Bishop Groeber was taken for
> Bishop Sproll. He was grabbed by the robe and dragged
> back and forth. Finally the intruders realized that
> Bishop Groeber is not the one they are seeking. They
> could then be persuaded to leave the building. After
> the evacuation of the palace by the demonstrators I had
> an interview with Archbishop Groeber, who left
> Rottenburg in the night. Groeber wants to turn to the
> Fuehrer and Reich Minister of the Interior Dr. Frick
> anew. On the course of the action, the damage done as
> well as the homage
>
> [Page 270]
>
> of the Rottenburg populace beginning today for the
> Bishop I shall immediately hand in a full report, after
> I am in the act of suppressing counter mass meetings.”
> (848-PS)
>
> Reich Minister for Church Affairs Kerrl and other Party
> officials alleged that these demonstrations were
> spontaneously staged by indignant citizens of Rottenburg and
> caused representations to be made to the Holy See in an
> effort to effect the Bishop’s removal from office. (89-PS)
>
> On or about 3 December 1941, a copy of a secret decree of
> the Party Chancellery on the subject of Relationship of
> National Socialism to Christianity was found by the Security
> Police in the possession of Protestant Priest Eichholz at
> Aix-la-Chapelle. For this he was arrested and held for
> questioning for an unknown period of time. (D-75)
>
> (d) The Nazi conspirators confiscated church property. On 20
> January 1938, the Gestapo District Office at Munich issued a
> decree dissolving the Guild of the Virgin Mary of the
> Bavarian Diocese, together with its branches and
> associations. The decree also stated:
>
> “The property belonging to the dissolved Guild is to be
> confiscated by the police. Not only is property in cash
> to be confiscated, but also any stock on hand and their
> objects of value. All further activity is forbidden the
> dissolved Guilds, particularly the foundation of any
> organization intended as a successor or as a cover.
> Incorporation as a body into other women’s societies is
> also to be looked on as a forbidden continuation of
> activity. Infringements against the above prohibition
> will be punished according to par. 4 of the order of 28
> February 1933.”
>
> The reasons for the dissolution and confiscation were that
> the Guild of the Virgin Mary had occupied itself for years
> “to a most far-reaching degree” with arrangements of a
> “worldly and popular sporting character” such as community
> games and “social evenings”; and further that the
> president of the society supplied the members with
> “seditious materials” which served for “seditious
> discussions”; and that the members of the Guild were trained
> and mobilized for “political and seditious tasks.” (1481-
> PS)
>
> In a lecture delivered to a conference of police
> investigators of Church Affairs assembled in the lecture
> hall of the Reich Main Security Office (RSHA) in Berlin, 22
> September 1941, Regiersrungsrat Roth stated that about 100
> monasteries in the Reich had been dissolved and pointed out
> that the proper procedure called for seizure of the churches
> at the same time the monasteries were dissolved. (1815-PS)
>
> [Page 271]
>
> In February 1940, SS Gruppenfuehrer Heydrich suggested to
> Himmler the seizure of monasteries for the accommodation of
> Racial Germans. He proposed that the authorities of the
> monastic orders be instructed to make the monasteries
> concerned available and move their own members to less
> populous monasteries. He pointed out that the final
> expropriation of properties thus placed at their disposal
> could be carried out step by step in the course of time.
> Himmler agreed to this proposal and ordered the measure to
> be carried out by the Security Police and
> Security Service (Sipo and SD) in collaboration with the
> Reich Commissioner for Consolidation of German Folkdom. (R-
> 101-A)
>
> These orders for confiscation were carried out, as revealed
> in a letter dated 30 March 1942 from the Reich Main Security
> Office (RSHA) Chief of Staff to Himmler mentioning claims
> for compensation pending in a number of confiscation cases.
> In this letter he stated that all rental
> payments to those monasteries and ecclesiastical
> institutions whose premises had been put to use as camps for
> resettlers had been stopped on receipt of Himmler’s order.
> Concerning current developments, he stated:
>
> “After further preparations in which-the Party
> Chancellery participated prominently, the Reich
> Minister of the Interior found a way which makes it
> possible to seize ecclesiastical premises practically
> without compensation and yet avoids the impression of
> being a measure directed against the Church. ***” (R-
> 101-D)
>
> In a letter of 19 April 1941, Bormann advised Rosenberg that
> libraries and art objects of the monasteries confiscated in
> the Reich were to remain for the time being in these
> monasteries and that the Fuehrer had repeatedly rejected the
> suggestion that centralization of all such libraries be
> undertaken. (072-PS)
>
> (e) The Nazi conspirators suppressed religious publications.
> On 6 November 1934, Frick, as Reich and Prussian Minister of
> the Interior, issued an order forbidding until further
> notice publication of all announcements in the daily press,
> in pamphlets and other publications,
> which dealt with the Evangelical Church; with the exception
> of official announcements of the Church Government of the
> Reich. (1498-PS)
>
> By order of the State Police for the District of Dusseldorf,
> the Police Regulation which is quoted in part below was
> promulgated 28 May 1934:
>
> “The distribution and sale of published items of any
> sort in connection with worship or religious
> instructions in public streets or squares near churches
> is forbidden. In the same sense the distribution and
> sale of published items on the oc-
>
> [Page 272]
>
> casions of processions, pilgrimages and similar church
> institutions in the streets or squares they pass
> through or in their vicinity is prohibited.” (R-145)
>
> In January 1940, Bormann informed Rosenberg that he had
> sought to restrict production of religious publications by
> means of having their rations of printing paper cut down
> through the control exercised by Reichsleiter Amann, but
> that the result of these efforts remained
> unsatisfactory. (101-PS)
>
> In March 1940, Bormann instructed Reichsleiter Amann,
> Director of the NSDAP Publications Office, that in any
> future redistribution of paper, confessional writings should
> receive still sharper restrictions in favor of literature
> politically and ideologically more valuable. He went on to
> point out:
>
> ” *** according to a report I have received, only 10
> of the over 3000 Protestant periodicals appearing in
> Germany, such as Sunday papers, etc. have ceased
> publication for reasons of paper saving.” (089-PS)
>
> In April 1940, Bormann informed the High Command of the Navy
> that use of the term “Divine Service” to refer exclusively
> to the services arranged by Christian Confessions was no
> longer to be used, even in National Socialist daily papers.
> In the alternative he suggested:
>
> “In the opinion of the Party the term ‘Church Service’
> cannot be objected to. I consider it fitting since it
> properly implies meetings arranged and organized by the
> Churches.” (068-PS)
>
> (f) The Nazi conspirators suppressed religious
> organizations. On 28 May 1934, the State Police Office for
> the District of Duesseldorf issued an order concerning
> denominational youth and professional organizations which
> stated in part as follows:
>
> “Denominational youth and professional organizations as
> well as those created for special occasions only are
> prohibited from every public activity outside the
> church and religious sphere.
>
> “Especially forbidden is: Any public appearance in
> groups, all sorts of political activity. Any public
> sport function including public hikes and establishment
> of holiday or outdoor camps. The public display or
> showing of flags, banners, pennants or the open wearing
> of uniforms or insignia.” (R-145)
>
> On 20 July 1935, Frick, as Reich and Prussian Minister of
> the Interior, issued secret instructions to the provincial
> governments and to the Prussian Gestapo that Confessional
> youth organizations were to be forbidden to wear uniforms,
> or uniform-
>
> [Page 273]
>
> like clothing, to assemble publicly with pennants and flags,
> to wear insignia as a substitute for uniforms, or to engage
> in any outdoor sport activity.
>
> On 20 January 1938 the Gestapo District Office at Munich,
> issued a decree which stated in part as follows:
>
> “The Guild of the Virgin Mary (de Marianisch
> Jungfrauenkongregation) of the Bavarian dioceses,
> including the diocese of Speyere, together with its
> branches and associations and the Societies of Our Lady
> (Jungfrauenverenen) attached to it, is by police order
> to be dissolved and forbidden with immediate effect.”
>
> Among the reasons cited for this action were the following:
>
> “The whole behavior of the Guild of the Virgin Mary had
> therefore to be objected to from various points of
> view. It could be repeatedly observed that the Guild
> engaged in purely worldly affairs, such as community
> games, and then in the holding of ‘Social Evenings’.
>
> “This proves incontestably that the Guild of the Virgin
> Mary was active to a very great degree in a manner
> unecclesiastical and therefore worldly. By so doing it
> has left the sphere of its proper religious task and
> entered a sphere of activity to which it has no
> statutory right. The organization has therefore to be
> dissolved and forbidden.” (1481-PS)
>
> According to the report of a Security Police “church
> specialist” attached to the State Police Office at Aachen,
> the following points were made by a lecturer at a conference
> of Security Police and Security Service church intelligence
> investigators in Berlin, on 22 September 1941:
>
> “Retreats, recreational organizations, etc., may now be
> forbidden on ground of industrial war-needs, whereas
> formerly only a worldly activity could be given as a
> basis.
>
> “Youth camps, recreational camps are to be forbidden on
> principle, church organizations in the evening may be
> pre vented on grounds of the blackout regulations.
>
> “Processions, pilgrimages abroad are to be forbidden by
> reason of the over-burdened transport conditions. For
> local events too technical traffic troubles and the
> danger of air attack may serve as grounds for their
> prohibition. (One Referent forbade a procession, on the
> grounds of it wearing out shoe leather).” (1815-PS)
>
> (g) The Nazi conspirators suppressed religious education. In
> a speech on 7 March 1937, Rosenberg stated:
>
> “The education of youth can only be carried out by
> those who have rescued Germany from disaster. It is
> therefore
>
> [Page 274]
>
> impossible to demand one Fuehrer, one Reich and one
> firmly united people as long as education is carried
> out by forces which are mutually exclusive to each
> other.” (2351-PS)
>
> In a speech at Fulda, 27 November 1937 Reich Minister for
> Church Affairs Hans Kerrl stated:
>
> “We cannot recognize that the Church has a right to
> insure that the individual should be educated in all
> respects in the way in which it holds to be right; but
> we must leave it to the National Socialist State to
> educate the child in the way it regards as right.” (252-
> PS)
>
> In January 1939, Bormann, acting as Deputy of the Fuehrer,
> informed the Minister of Education, that the Party was
> taking the position that theological inquiry was not as
> valuable as the general fields of knowledge in the
> universities and that suppression of Theological Faculties
> in the universities was to be undertaken at once. He pointed
> out that the Concordat with the Vatican placed certain
> limitations on such a program, but that in the light of the
> general change of
> circumstances, particularly the compulsory military service
> and the execution of the four-year plan, the question of
> manpower made certain reorganizations, economies and
> simplification necessary. Therefore, Theological Faculties
> were to be restricted insofar as they could not
> be wholly suppressed. He instructed that the churches were
> not to be informed of this development and no public
> announcement was to be made. Any complaints, if they were to
> be replied to at all, should be answered with a statement
> that these measures are being executed in a general plan of
> reorganization and that similar things are happening to
> other faculties. He concludes with the statement that the
> professorial chairs vacated by the above program are to be
> turned over to the newly created fields of inquiry, such as
> Racial Research. (116-PS)
>
> A plan for the reduction of Theological Faculties was
> submitted by the Reich Minister for Science, Education and
> Training in April 1939 to Bormann, who forwarded it to
> Rosenberg for consideration and action. The plan called for
> shifting, combining and eliminating Theological
> Faculties in various schools and universities throughout the
> Reich, with the following results:
>
> “To recapitulate this plan would include the complete
> closing of Theological Faculties at Innsbruck, Salzburg
> and Munich, the transfer of the faculty of Graz to
> Vienna and the vanishing of four Catholic faculties.
>
> “a. Closing of three Catholic Theological Faculties or
> Higher Schools and of four Evangelic Faculties in the
> winter semester 1939/40.
>
> [Page 275]
>
> “b. Closing of one further Catholic and of three-
> further Evangelic Faculties in the near future.” (122-
> PS)
>
> In a secret decree of the Party Chancellery, signed by
> Bormann, and distributed to all Gauleiters on 7 June 1941,
> the following statement concerning religious education was
> made:
>
> “No human being would know anything of Christianity if
> it had not been drilled into him in his childhood by
> pastors. The so-called dear God in no wise gives
> knowledge of his existence to young people in advance,
> but in an astonishing manner in spite of his
> omnipotence leaves this to the efforts of the pastors.
> If therefore in the future our youth learns nothing
> more of this Christianity, whose doctrines are far
> below ours, Christianity will disappear by itself.” (D-
> 75)
>
> (2) Supplementary evidence of acts of oppression within
> Germany. In laying the groundwork for their attempted
> subversion of the Church, the Nazi conspirators resorted to
> assurances of peaceful intentions. Thus Hitler, in his
> address to the Reichstag on 23 March 1933 declared:
>
> “While the government is determined to carry through
> the political and moral purging of our public life, it
> is creating and insuring prerequisites for a truly
> religious life. The government sees in both Christian
> confessions the factors most important for the
> maintenance of our Folkdom. It will respect agreements
> concluded between them and the states. However, it
> expects that its work will meet with a similar
> appreciation. The government will treat all other
> denominations with equal objective justice. However, it
> can never condone that belonging to a certain
> denomination or to a certain race might be regarded as
> a license to commit or tolerate crimes. The Government
> will devote its
> care to the sincere living together of Church and
> State.” (3387-PS)
>
> (a) Against the Evangelical Churches. The Nazi conspirators,
> upon their accession to power, passed a number of laws,
> under innocent-sounding titles, designed to reduce the
> Evangelical Churches to the status of an obedient instrument
> of Nazi policy. The following are illustrative:
>
> [Page 276]
>
> Document Number Date Reichsgesetzblatt Title and Gist of Law
> Page
> ————————————————————
>
> 3433-PS 14.7.33 I.471
>
> Gesetz ueher die
> Verfassun der Deutschen
> Evanelischen Kirche (Law
> concerning the
> Constitution of the
> German Evangelical
> Church), establishing
> among other things the
> new post of Reich Bishop.
> [Signed by] Hitler,
> Frick.
>
> 3434-PS 26.6.35 I.774
>
> Gesetz ueer das
> BesGhlussverfahren in
> Rechtsaneleenheite der
> Evanelisschen Kirche (Law
> concerning procedure for
> decisions in legal
> affairs of the
> Evangelical Church),
> giving the Reich Ministry
> of the Interior sole
> authority to determine
> the validity of measures
> taken in the Churches
> since 1 May 1933, when
> raised in a civil
> lawsuit. [Signed by]
> Hitler, Frick.
>
> 3435-PS 3.7.35 I.851
>
> Erste Verordnung zur
> Durchfuehrung des
> Gesetzes ueber das
> Reschluss-verfahren in
> Rechtsanelegenheiten der
> Evanelischen Kirche
> (First Ordinance for
> Execution of the Law
> concerning procedure for
> decisions in legal
> affairs of the
> Evangelical Church),
> setting up detailed
> organization and
> procedures under the law
> of 21 June 1935. [Signed
> by] Frick.
>
> 3466-PS 16.7.35 I.1029
>
> Erlass ueber die Zusammen
> fassung der
> Zustaendiykeiten des
> Reichs und Preussens in
> Kirchenaneleenheiten
> (Decree to unite the
> competences of Reich and
> Prussia in Church
> affairs) transferring to
> Kerrl, Minister without
> Portfolio, the church
> affairs previously
> handled by Reich and
> Prussian Ministers of the
> Interior and of Science,
> Education, and Training.
> [Signed by] Hitler, Rust,
> Koerner.
>
> [Page 277]
>
>
> 3436-PS 24.9.35 I.1178
>
> Gesetz zur Sicherun der
> Deutschen Evangelischen
> Kirche (Law for the
> Safeguarding of the
> German Evangelical
> Church) empowering the
> Reich Minister of Church
> Affairs (Kerrl) to issue
> Ordinances with binding
> legal force. [Signed by]
> Hitler, Frick.
>
> 3437-PS 2.12.35 I.1370
>
> Fuenfte Verordnung Zur
> Durchfuehrun des Gesetzes
> zur Siherun der Deutschen
> Evanelischen Kirche
> (Fifth decree for
> execution of the law for
> the Safeguarding of the
> German Evangelical
> Church) prohibiting the
> churches from filling
> their pastorates,
> ordaining ministers,
> visitation, publishing of
> banns, and collecting
> dues and assessments.
> [Signed by] Kerrl.
>
> 3439-PS 25.6.37 I.697
>
> Fuenfzehnte Verordnun zur
> Durchfuehrun des Gesetzes
> zur Sicherung der
> Deutschen Evanyelischen
> Kirche (Fifteenth decree
> for the Execution of the
> Law for Security of the
> German Evangelical
> Church) establishing in
> the Reich Ministry for
> Church Affairs a Finance
> Department, to supervise
> administration of the
> church property budget,
> tax assessment, and use
> of budget funds. [Signed
> by] Kerrl.
>
> With the help of their Reich Bishop, Bishop Mueller, they
> maneuvered the Evangelical Youth Association into the Hitler
> Jugend under Von Schirach in December 1933. (1458-PS)
>
> They arrested prominent Protestant leaders such as Pastor
>
> [Page 278]
>
> Niemoeller. By 1937, the result of all these measures was
> complete administrative control by the Nazi conspirators
> over the Evangelical churches.
>
> (b) Against the Catholic Church. Just as in their program
> against the Evangelical Churches, so in their attack on the
> Catholic Church, the Nazi conspirators concealed their real
> intentions under a cloak of apparent respect for its rights
> and protection of its activities. On 20 July 1933, a
> Concordat was concluded between the Holy See and the German
> Reich, signed for the Reich by Von Papen (280-A-PS). It was
> the Nazi Government, not the Church, which initiated the
> negotiations.
>
> “The German Government asked the Holy See to conclude a
> Concordat with the Reich.” (268-PS)
>
> By Article I of the Concordat,
>
> “The German Reich guarantees freedom of profession and
> public practice of the Catholic religion.
>
> “It acknowledges the right of the Catholic Church,
> within the limit of those laws which are applicable to
> all, to manage and regulate her own affairs
> independently, and, within the framework of her own
> competence, to publish laws and ordinances binding on
> her members.” (3280-A-PS)
>
> Other articles formulated agreements on basic principles
> such as free communication between Rome and the local
> ecclesiastical authorities, freedom of the Catholic press,
> of Catholic education and of Catholic action in charitable,
> professional, and youth organizations. In return,
> the Vatican pledged loyalty by the clergy to the Reich
> Government and emphasis in religious instruction on the
> patriotic duties of the Christian citizen. (3280-A-PS)
>
> In reliance upon assurances by the Nazi conspirators, the
> Catholic hierarchy had already revoked their previous
> prohibition against Catholics becoming members of the Nazi
> Party (389 PS). The Catholic Center Party, under a
> combination of Nazi pressure and assurances,
> published on 29 December 1933, an announcement of its
> dissolution (2403-PS). Thus the Catholics went a long way to
> disarm themselves and cooperate with the Nazis.
> Nevertheless, the Nazi conspirators continued to develop
> their policy of slow strangulation of religion, first in
> covert, and then in open, violation of their assurances and
> agreements.
>
> In the Encyclical “Mt Brenneder Sorge”, on 14 March 1937, Pope
> Pius XI described the program:
>
> “It discloses intrigues which from the beginning had no
> other aim than a war of extermination. In the furrows
> in which we had labored to sow the seeds of true peace,
> others like the enemy in Holy Scripture (Matt. xiii,
> 25) sowed
>
> [Page 279]
>
> the tares of suspicion, discord, hatred, calumny of
> secret and open fundamental hostility to Christ and His
> Church, fed from a thousand different sources and
> making use of every available means. On them and on
> them alone and on their silent and vocal protectors
> rests the responsibility that now on the horizon of
> Germany there is to be seen not the rainbow of peace
> but the threatening storm clouds of destructive
> religious wars. *** Anyone who has any sense of truth
> left in his mind and even a shadow of the feeling of
> justice left in his heart will have to admit that, in
> the difficult and eventful years which followed the
> Concordat, every word and every action of Ours was
> ruled by loyalty to the terms of the agreement; but
> also he will have to recognize with surprise and deep
> disgust that the unwritten law of the other party has
> been arbitrary misinterpretation of agreements, evasion
> of agreements, evacuation of the meaning of agreements,
> and
> finally more or less open violation of agreements.”
> (3280-PS)
>
> The Nazis suppressed the Catholic Youth League, beginning
> ten days after the concordat was signed. (See Section 8,
> infra.)
>
> On 18 January 1942, in declining to accede to a demand made
> by the German Government that no further appointment of
> Archbishops, Bishops, and other high administrative
> dignitaries be made in the new territories of the Reich, or
> of certain of them within the old Reich, without previous
> consultation with the German Government (3261-PS), the
> Secretary of State of Pope Pius XII pointed to measures
> taken by the German Government,
>
> “Contrary not only to the existing Concordats and to
> the principles of international law ratified by the
> Second Hague conference, but oftenand this is much more
> graveto the very fundamental principles of divine law,
> both natural and positive.”
>
> The Papal Secretary of State continued:
>
> “Let it suffice to recall in this connection, among
> other things, the changing of the Catholic State
> elementary schools into undenominational schools; the
> permanent or temporary closing of many minor
> seminaries, of not a few major seminaries and of some
> theological faculties; the suppression of almost all
> the private schools and of numerous Catholic boarding
> schools and colleges; the repudiation, decided
> unilaterally, of financial obligations which the State,
> Municipalities etc. had towards the Church; the
> increasing difficulties put in the way of the activity
> of the religious Orders and Congregations in the
> spiritual, cultural and social field
>
> [Page 280]
>
> and above all the suppression of Abbeys, monasteries,
> convents and religious houses in such great numbers
> that one is led to infer a deliberate intention of
> rendering impossible the very existence of the Orders
> and Congregations in Germany.
>
> “Similar and even graver acts must be deplored in the
> annexed and occupied territories, especially in the
> Polish territories and particularly in the Reichsgau
> Wartheland, for which the Reich Superintendent – has
> issued, under date of September 13th last, a
> ‘Decree concerning Religious Associations and Religious
> Societies’ (Verordnung uber eligioese Vereinigngen und
> Religion-gesellschaften) in clear opposition to the
> fundamental principles of the divine constitution of
> the Church.” (3261-PS)
>
> Illustrative of the numerous other cases and specific
> incidents which might be adduced as the program of
> suppression was carried into action within Germany proper,
> are the measures adopted beginning in 1936 to eliminate the
> priest Rupert Mayer of Munich. Because of his sermons, he
> was confined in various prisons, arrested and rearrested,
> interned in Oranienburg-Sachsenhausen concentration camp,
> and the Ettal Monastery, from which he was released by
> Allied troops in May 1945, and later died. ‘(372-PS)
>
> (c) Against other religious groups.
>
> Members of the sect known as “BibelJorscher”meaning “Members
> of a Biblical Society” or “Bible-Researchers”were as early
> as 1937 sent as a routine matter to concentration camps by
> the Gestapo, even after serving of a sentence imposed by a
> court or.after the cancellation of
> an arrest order (D-84). At one camp aloneDachauthere were
> over 150 “Bibelforscher” in protective custody in 1937.
> (2928-PS)
>
> B. Acts of suppression of the Christian Churches in Annexed
> an Occupied Territories.
>
> (1) In Austria. The methods of suppression of churches
> followed in Austria by the occupying power began with
> measures to exclude the Church from public activities, such
> as processions, printing of newspapers and Reviews which
> could spread Christian doctrines; from forming Youth
> organizations, such as Boy Scouts; from directing
> educational or charitable activities; and even from
> extending help in the form of food to foreigners. Unable in
> conscience to obey the public
> prescription, ministers of religions were arrested and sent
> to concentration camps, and some were executed. Churches
> were closed, convents and mon-
>
> [Page 281]
>
> asteries suppressed, and educational property confiscated.
> The total number of confiscations, suppressions, or
> alienations of religious institutions exceeded 100 cases in
> one diocese alone. (3278-PS)
>
> The Lutheran Church in Austria, though comprising a small
> minority of the population, was subjected to organized
> oppression. Its educational efforts were obstructed or
> banned. Believers were encouraged, and sometimes
> intimidated, to repudiate their faith. Lutheran pastors were
> given to understand that a government position would be
> awarded to each one who would renounce his ministry and if
> possible withdraw from the Lutheran Church. (3273-PS)
>
> Tn summation of the period of Nazi domination and in review
> of the attempted suppression of the Christian Church, the
> Archbishops and Bishops of Austria in their first joint
> Pastoral after liberation declared:
>
> “At an end also is an intellectual battle, the goal of
> which was the destruction of Christianity and the
> Church among our people; a campaign of lies and
> treachery against truth and love, against divine and
> human rights and against international law.” (3274-PS)
>
> (2) In Czechoslovakia. The Czechoslovak Official Report for
> the prosecution and trial of the German Major War Criminals
> by the International Military Tribunal established according
> to the Agreement of the Four Great Powers of 8 August 1945
> describes in summary form the measures taken by the Nazi
> conspirators to suppress religious liberties and persecute
> the churches. The following excerpts are quoted from this
> report (998-PS):
>
> “(a) Catholic Church.
>
> “*** At the outbreak of war, 487 Catholic priests
> were among the thousands of Czech patriots arrested and
> sent to concentration camps as hostages. Venerable high
> ecclesiastical dignitaries were dragged to
> concentration camps in Germany. *** Religious orders
> were dissolved and liquidated, their charitable
> institutions closed down and their members expelled or
> else forced to compulsory labor in Germany. All
> religious instruction in Czech schools was suppressed.
> Most of the weeklies and monthlies which the Catholics
> had published in Czechoslovakia, had been suppressed
> from the very beginning of the occupation. The Catholic
> gymnastic organization “Orel” with 800,000
> members was dissolved and its Property was confiscated.
> To a
>
> [Page 282]
>
> great extent Catholic church property was seized for
> the benefit of the Reich.
>
> “(b) Czechoslovak National Church.
>
> “*** The Czechoslovak Church in Slovakia was entirely
> prohibited and its property confiscated under German
> compulsion in 1940. It has been allowed to exist in
> Bohemia and Moravia but in a crippled form under the
> name of the Czecho-Moravian Church.
>
> “(c) Protestant Churches.
>
> “The Protestant Churches were deprived of the freedom
> to preach the gospel. German secret state police
> watched closely whether the clergy observed the
> restrictions imposed on it. *** Some passages from
> the Bible were not allowed to be read in public at all.
> ***
>
> “* * Church leaders were especially persecuted, scores
> of ministers were imprisoned in concentration camps,
> among them the General Secretary of the Students’
> Christian Movement in Czechoslovakia. One of the Vice-
> Presidents was executed.
>
> “Protestant Institutions such as the YMCA and YWCA were
> suppressed throughout the country.
>
> “The leading Theological School for all Evangelical
> denominations, HUS Faculty in Prague and all other
> Protestant training schools for the ministry were
> closed down in November 1939, with the other Czech
> universities and colleges.
>
> “(d) Czech Orthodox Church.
>
> “The hardest blow was directed against the Czech
> Orthodox Church. The Orthodox churches in
> Czechoslovakia were ordered by the Berlin Ministry of
> Church Affairs to leave the Pontificate of Belgrade and
> Constantinople respectively and to become subordinate
> to the Berlin Bishop. The Czech Bishop Gorazd was
> executed together with two other priests of the
> Orthodox Church. By a special order of the Protector
> Daluege, issued in September 1942, the Orthodox Church
> of Serbian Constantinople jurisdiction was completely
> dissolved in the Czech lands, its religious activity
> forbidden and its property
>
> “All Evangelical education was handed over to the civil
> authorities and many Evangelical teachers lost their
> employment; moreover the State grant to salaries of
> many evangelical priests was taken away.” (998-PS)
>
> (3) In Poland. The repressive measures levelled against the
> Christian Church in Poland where Hans Frank was Governor-
>
> [Page 283]
>
> General from 1939 to 1945, were even more drastic and
> sweeping. In protest against the
> systematic strangulation of religion, the Vatican, on 8
> October 1942, addressed a memorandum to the German Embassy
> accredited to the Holy See in which the Secretariat of State
> emphasized the fact that despite previous protests to the
> Minister for Foreign Affairs of the Reich, von
> Ribbentrop, the religious condition of the Catholics in the
> Warthegau “has become even sadder and more tragic.” This
> memorandum states:
>
> “For quite a long time the religious situation in the
> Warthegau gives cause for very grave and ever
> increasing anxiety. There, in fact, the Episcopate has
> been little by little almost completely eliminated; the
> secular and regular clergy have been reduced to
> proportions that are absolutely inadequate, because
> they have been in large part deported and exiled; the
> education of clerics has been forbidden; the Catholic
> education of youth is meeting with the greatest
> opposition; the nuns have been dispersed;
> insurmountable obstacles have been put in the way of
> affording people the helps of religions; very many
> churches have been closed; Catholic intellectual and
> charitable institutions have been destroyed;
> ecclesiastical property has been seized.” (3263-PS)
>
> On 18 November 1942 the Papal Secretary of State requested
> the Archbishop of Breslau, Cardinal Bertram, to use every
> effort to assist Polish Catholic workers transferred to
> Germany, who were being deprived of the consolations of
> religion. In addition, he again appealed for help for the
> Polish priests detained in various concentration camps,
> whose death rate was “still on the increase.” (3265-PS). On
> 7 December 1942 the Cardinal Archbishop of Breslau replied
> that all possible efforts were being put forward by the
> German Bishops without success on behalf of the victims of
> concentration camps and labor battalions, and deplored “the
> intolerable decrees” against religious ministration to
> Poles. (3266-PS)
>
> On 2 March 1943, the Cardinal Secretary of State addressed a
> note to von Ribbentrop, Reichsminister for Foreign Affairs,
> in which the violations of religious rights and conscience
> among the civilian population of Poland were set out in
> detail, and the time, locality, and character of the
> persecutions were specified. Priests and Ecclesiastics were
> still being arrested, thrust into concentration camps, and
> treated with scorn and derision, while many had been
> summarily executed. Religious instruction was hampered;
> Catholic schools were closed; the use of the Polish lan-
>
> [Page 284]
>
> guage in sacred functions and even in the Sacrament of
> Penance was forbidden. Even the natural right of marriage
> was denied to men of Polish nationality under 28 years of
> age to women under 25. In the territory called “General
> Government” similar conditions existed and against these the
> Holy See vigorously protested. To save the harassed and
> persecuted leaders of the Catholic Church, the Vatican had
> petitioned that they be allowed to emigrate to neutral
> countries of Europe or America. The only concession made was
> that they would all be collected in one concentration camp
> Dachau. (3264-PS)
>
> The Nazi conspirators adopted a dilatory and obstructionist
> policy toward complaints as to religious affairs in the
> overrun territories, and a decision was “taken by those
> competent to do so. *** that no further consideration will
> be taken of proposals or requests concerning the territories
> which do not belong to the Old Reich.” (3262-PS)
>
> “Those competent” to make decisions on complaints as to
> religious affairs in the overrun territories — especially
> the Party Chancery, headed by Bormann — the methods they
> used, and the reasons for their attitude are outlined by the
> Cardinal Archbishop of Breslau, a German
> living in Germany, in a letter to the Papal Secretary of
> State on 7 December 1942 as follows:
>
> “Your Eminence knows very well the greatest difficulty
> in the way of opening negotiations comes from the
> overruling authority which the “National Socialist
> Party Chancery” (Kanzlei der Nazion-sozstschen Parez,
> known as the Partei-Kanzlei) exercises in relation to
> the Chancery of the Reich (Reichskanzlei) and to the
> single Reich Ministries. This ‘Parteikanzlei’ directs
> the course to be followed by the State, whereas the
> Ministries and the Chancery of the Reich are obliged
> and compelled to adjust their decrees to these
> directions. Besides, there is the fact that the
> “Supreme Office for the Security of the Reich” called
> the ‘Reichsscherheitshauptamt’ enjoys an authority
> which precludes all legal action and all appeals. Under
> it are the ‘Secret Offices for Public Security’ called
> ‘Geheime Staatspolizei’ (a title shortened usually to
> Gestapo) of which there is one for each Province.
> Against the decrees of this Central Office
> (Reichsscherheitshauptamt) and of the Secret Offices
> (Geheime Staatspolizei) there is no appeal through the
> Courts, and no complaint made to the Ministries has any
> effect. Not infrequently the Councillors of the
> Ministries suggest that they have not been able to do
> as they would wish to, because of the opposition of
> these Party offices. As far as the executive
>
> [Page 285]
>
> power is concerned, the organization called the SS,
> that is Schutzstaffeln der Partei, is in practice
> supreme.
>
> “This hastily sketched interrelation of authorities is
> the reason why many of the petitions and protests made
> by the Bishops to the Ministries have been foiled. Even
> if we present our complaints to the so-called Supreme
> Security Office, there is rarely any reply; and when
> there is, it is negative.
>
> “On a number of very grave and fundamental issues we
> have also presented our complaints to the Supreme
> Leader of the Reich (Fuehrer). Either no answer is
> given, or it is apparently edited by the above-
> mentioned Party Chancery, which does not consider
> itself bound by the Concordat made with the Holy See.”
> (3266-PS)
>
> The interchange of correspondence following the transmission
> of the above-described note of 2 March 1943 on the religious
> situation in the overrun Polish Provinces illustrates the
> same evasive tactics. (3269-PS)
>
> In his Allocution to the Sacred College, on 2 June 1945, His
> Holiness Pope Pius XII recalled, byway of example, “some
> details from the abundant accounts which have reached us
> from priests and laymen who were interned in the
> concentration camp at Dachau”:
>
> “In the forefront, for the number and harshness of the
> treatment meted out to them, are the Polish priests.
> From 1940 to 1945, 2,800 Polish ecclesiastics and
> religious were imprisoned in that camp; among them was
> the Auxiliary bishop of Wloclawek, who died there of
> typhus. In April last there were left only 816, all the
> others being dead except
> for two or three transferred to another camp. In the
> summer of 1942, 480 German-speaking ministers of
> religion were known to be gathered there; of these, 45
> were Protestants, all the others Catholic priests. In
> spite of the continuous inflow of new internees,
> especially from some dioceses of Bavaria, Rhenania and
> Westphalia, their number, as a result of the high rate
> of mortality, at the beginning of this year, did not
> surpass 350. Nor should we pass over in silence these
> belonging to occupied territories, Holland, Belgium,
> France (among whom the Bishop of Clermont), Luxembourg,
> Slovenia, Italy. Many of those priests and laymen
> endured indescribable sufferings for their faith and
> for their vocation. In one case the hatred of the
> impious against Christ
> reached the point of parodying on the person of an
>
> [Page 286]
>
> interned priest, with barbed wire, the scourging and
> the crowning with thorns of our
> Redeemer.” (3268-PS)
>
> Further revealing figure on the persecution of Polish
> priests are contained in the following extract from Charge
> No. 17 against Hans Frank, Governor-General of Poland,
> submitted by the Polish Government, entitled “Maltreatment
> and Persecution of the Catholic Clergy in the Western
> Provinces”:
>
> “IV. GENERAL CONDITIONS AND RESULTS OF THE PERSECUTION
>
> 11. The general situation of the clergy in the
> Archdiocese of Poznan in the beginning of April 1940 is
> summarized in the following words of Cardinal Hlond’s
> second report:
>
> 5 priests shot
>
> 27 priests confined in harsh concentration camps at
> Stutthof and in other camps
>
> 190 priests in prison or in concentration camps at
> Bruczkow, Chludowo, Goruszki, Kazimierz, Biskupi, Lad,
> Lubin and Puszczykowo,
>
> 35 priests expelled into the Government General,
>
> 11 priests seriously ill in consequence of ill-
> treatment,
>
> 122 parishes entirely left without priests.’
>
> 12. In the diocese of Chefmno,. where about 650 priests
> were installed before the war only 30 were allowed to
> stay, the 97% of them were imprisoned, executed or put
> into concentration camps.
>
> 13. By January 141 about 7000 priests were killed, 3000
> were in prison or concentration camps.” (3279-PS)
>
> The Allocution of Pope Pius XII on 2 June 1945 described
> National Socialism as “the arrogant apostasy from Jesus
> Christ, the denial of His doctrine and of His work of
> redemption, the cult of violence, the idolatry of race and
> blood, the overthrow of human liberty and dignity.” It
> summarized the attacks of “National Socialism” on the
> Catholic Church in these terms:
>
> “The struggle against the Church did, in fact, become
> even more bitter: there was the dissolution of Catholic
> organizations; the gradual suppression of the
> flourishing Catholic schools,-both public and private;
> the enforced weaning of youth from family and Church;
> the pressure brought to bear on the conscience of
> citizens, and especially of civil servants; the
> systematic defamation, by means of a clever, closely
> organized propaganda, of the Church, the clergy, the
> faithful, the Church’s institutions, teaching and
> history; the closing, dissolution, confiscation of
> religious houses and other ecclesiastical institutions;
> the complete suppression of the Catholic press and
> publishing houses.” (3268-PS)
> —
> The Nizkor Project: An Electronic Holocaust Educational Resource
> Search: https://nizkor.org/search.html Broken link
> Funding: https://nizkor.org/funding.html Broken link

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:30 EDT 1999
Article: 191481 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: Geysers of blood in Lemberg
>>Eichmann: “I Saw the Most Horrifying Thing I Have Ever Seen”
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 01:04:15 -0400
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Daniel Keren wrote:

> polin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> # Eichmann also testified about geysers of blood in Lemberg (presently Lviv
> # capital of Western Ukraine), a sheer absurd.
>
> This phenomena was described by others, including Albert Hartel,
> who testified about the gases, released from many thousands of
> buried corpses, causing “small columns of earth” to rise. It was
> soaked with blood, hence Eichmann’s description.
>
> # Daniel would you be able to prove anything Eichman said archeologically
> # or with air photos?
>
> Have you heard about the recent excavations in Belzec, “Polina”?

Even Ken Mc Vey could not obtain complete report just meaningless snippets.

Even the UNITED STATES HOLOCAUST MEMORIAL MUSEUM and RESEARCH INSTITUTE
do not have complete report just meaningless snippets.

How about you an holocaustian exterminationist and me the holocaust
revisionists in the background try to obtain the COMPLETE report???!

If it will show industrial murder of Jews I will instantly become one of you
again.

Did you hear about the 1966, 33 years old massive Hydrokop Report on Birkenau
and by the Dept of Archeology of Lodz University ?

With your help and unadultured holocaustian faith perhaps they will give it to
you with me in the background.

Are we going to try Mr Keren???

Polina Borowska

My fluency in Polish might be of advantage.

PS I am astonished that you might for a second believe in the geysers. Check
with any geologist or agronomist or a farmer who burried cattle dying en masse
of epidemics. There were no geysers of blood at Katyn, Palmiry, Miednoje,
Kharkiv, Vynnytsia where executed Slavs were burried.

But perhaps Jewish blood is different and it errupts in geysers or these are
just eruptions of the Jewish Group Fantasies of Martyrdom [and Omnipotence]>

> -Danny Keren.

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:30 EDT 1999
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: Why >>> Priests Murdered in Dachau??? >>> Concentration Camp
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Dear Mr. Karen,

Thank you for posting the table about the atrocious death rate of the
Polish priests at Dachau. It pains me especially, since I am Polish and
WW II holocaust revisionist.

I have studied in detail the massive 1200 pages source book on the fate
of the imprisoned clergymen at Dachau.

Your table shows that only Polish priests suffered such a tramendous
death rate at this camp while priests of other nationalities did NOT.

What your table does not show is the data which indicates that many if
not most of the priests were in the age group 35-45 years old. Such
young men should not die.

We revisionists blame death at concentration camps on epidemics. But at
Dachau the epidemics were quite well controlled. During some months
hardly any prisoners died. So why about 800 almost half of Polish
priests died???

By the age of 30 especially non-urban Poles were quite resistant to
typhus and dysentery.

Moreover about 300 professors frequently elderly of the Jagiellonian
University were interned at Dachau and hardly any of them died after
near six years of incarceration!

The source book on the deaths of the priests at Dachau seems to use
authenticated data.

I invite revisionists, especially prof Faurisson who studied Dachau
exhaustively, to explain this death rate of the Polish priests.

Until I hear from other revisionists I must agree with Mr. Keren that
these priests were essentially murdered if not by bullet then by
indirect methods.

Polina Borowska.

And if they were murdered I ask a knowledgable Holocaust believer to
explain to my why they were murdered. With courteous responses please
reply to my email address also.

Daniel Keren wrote:

> Priests in Dachau classified according to nationality
> and religion. Note very high number (and percentage) of
> Polish priests who were murdered in the camp.
>
> Source: SS records, quoted in “Concentration Camp Dachau”,
> ISBN 3-87490-528-4, p. 60.
>
> Nationality Total Released Transferred Liberated Deaths
> ——————————————————————–
> Albanian 2 – 2 – –
> Belgian 46 1 3 33 9
> Danish 5 5 – – –
> German 447 208 100 45 94
> English 2 – 1 1 –
> French 156 5 4 137 10
> Greek 2 – – 2 –
> Dutch 63 10 – 36 17
> Italian 28 – 1 26 1
> Lithuanian 3 – – 3 –
> Luxemburg 16 2 – 8 6
> Norwegian 1 1 – – –
> Polish 1780 78 4 830 868
> Rumanian 1 – – 1 –
> Jugoslavian 50 2 6 38 4
> Spanish 1 – – 1 –
> Swiss 2 1 – – 1
> Czechoslovakian 109 1 10 74 24
> Hungarian 3 – – 3 –
> Stateless 3 – 1 2 –
>
> Roman Catholic 2579
> Protestant 109
> Greek Orthodox 22
> Old Catholic and Maronite 8
> Mohammedan 2

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:30 EDT 1999
Article: 191580 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian,
soc.culture.german,soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: Who cares about Nuremberg Tribunal >>>Suppression of Christian churches by Nazis
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 13:45:55 -0400
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Mr Hubert is correct about the genesis of the salaried clergymen in Germany.
But he and other holocaustians forget that the Adolf, once given dictatorial
powers he could easily stop such payments by the fiat of his word, as he has
done it and away with political parties in 1934 in the III Reich.

He had not done it because while he was an apointed (rather then elected)
dictator, despite dictatorial powers on an important matters he ruled by the
will of the people i.e. referendums.

Moreover, one has to ponder and can never be sure if he would continue to rule
once the plain Germans did not gave him the about 90% vote of confidence.
Knowing his ego, I think he would probably resign.

Polina B.

RockyMtnCougar wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>, Juergen Hubert
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> > polin wrote:
>
> > > And, while even during the war Hitler was paying clergy’s
> > salaries,
> > > Roosevelt and Churchill have never done it in the peace time.
> > The fact that the German state continued to pay salaries to
> > clergymen
> > AFAIK wasn’t instituted by Hitler (and I doubt he would have done
> > that)
> > – that dates back to the German Empire, when the government
> > nationalized
> > all church lands, but agreed to reimburse the churches through
> > regular
> > payments.
> > – Juergen Hubert
>
> He also conveniently forgets that little slip of parchment called The
> Constitution, the First Ammendment of which makes clear that neither
> Roosevelt nor ANY other President of the United states will pay clergy
> (exceptions for military clerics who serve our soldiers being a notable
> exception).
>
> To fault Roosevelt for not paying Father Coughlin or any other civilian
> clergy person is ludicrous. Of course, most of what rolly-polly posts
> is.

> * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network *

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From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:31 EDT 1999
Article: 191583 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,alt,revisionism,soc.culture.jewish,
soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Why >>> Priests Murdered in Dachau???
>>> Concentration Camp
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 13:54:47 -0400
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Dear Mrs Poniecka,

You did not respond nor substantiated my questions:

1) Is the 50% death rate of Polish priests at Dachau authentic, considering
that out of 315 members of the generally elderly academia of the Jagiellonian
University about 285 survived near six years of imprisonment?

2) Did Nazis selectively murdered Polish priests at Dachau while did not
murder priests of other nationalities

3 ) Did Polish priests died due to privations or epidemics

4) Why Pius XII did not protest about the atrocious rate of the death of
Polish priests. In 1939 he was extremely supportive of conquered Poland.

5) why the record states that so many Polish priest and clergymen died (about
800)

Polina Borowska

PONIECKA wrote:

> >the atrocious death rate of the
> >Polish priests at Dachau
>
> The names of 108 Polish martyrs of WWII can be found at this site:
>
> http://www.ipipan.waw.pl/~klopotek/church/rcc_in_p.htm#Saints (Page doesn`t exist)
>
> Overwhelmingly, they are priests. But how to explain Christians killing
> Christians, and the barbaric measures taken against the clergy of the same
> religion, different nationality?
>
> PONIECKA

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:31 EDT 1999
Article: 191603 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian,
soc.culture.russian,soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Geysers of blood in Lemberg
>>Eichmann: “I Saw the Most Horrifying Thing I Have Ever Seen”
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 15:47:31 -0400
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Dear Daniel,

1) Please do not be more Catholic than the Pope! … Do not be more Holocaustian
than USMM and Ken Mc Vay who complained to me that he could not get complete Belzec
Report.

Snipetts available contradict the history of the Belzec camp of the last few
decades that all corpses were cremated and indicate that pedantic Germans were
careless at covering traces of their “crime” i.e. industrial murder of the Lemberg
(Lwow, Lviv) Jews. What you describe as huge seems to me as an usual cemetery
serving Nazi concentration camp.

There were about 50 mass graves for about 10,000 corpses at the Treblinka I for the
Poles. And we do not raise the roocous for that burial field or claim
extermination on such basis.

2) I am astonished that you are an exegetic of the WW II Holocaust but you do not
proseletise. I thought you will be happy that I would return to the Faith for any
hard evidence reason, like the Saint Thomas. It seems that both the Judaism and
Holocaustianism are two not proseltizing religions.

3) You claim that you saw Hydrokop Report. I am again astonished. Directors of
the Musemum Krystyna Oleksy and mrg. Wroblewski several times in writting refused
access of the Polish HIstorical Society of Stamford CT to this most important
document of the Holocaust.

Are you fluent in Polish or they showed you autheniticated translation in English.
Or they just showed you a few drawings and the Polish text??

If not translated I am ready to do it. Lets get togrether on that project, jointly
I former Holocaustian and you an active exegete.

5) I thought I will not succeed in prompting you into mentioning bloating, so last
evening posted about this phenomenon.

But belatedly you fell in my trap and mentioned the bloating today.

I agree that in warm temperature cadavers bloat … due to bacterial putrefaction.
But in order for Eli Wiesel in Kyiv or Adolf Eichman in Lviv to see geysers of
blood the gasses would have to be released simultaneously, I am sure you will
agree.

A malicious person might suggest that the dead bloated Jews had to burp in unison
in order to produce Eichmannesque geysers. And why Jewish corpses burp in unison
while Slavic do not???

Leaving gruesome jokes on the side the phenomenon of bloating of cxarcasses
observed every summer on American highways, is a prove that not only blood but even
the putrefaction gasses can not leave the corpse throught its intugemen.

I repeat: the human skin is so tight that after death will not release the internal
gasses ergo does not release fluids i.e. blood. Thus the geysers of blood even in
summer are total Holocaustian fiction and one of many martyrological
confabulations.

Thus exterminationist and revisionists agreed on little point of bloating and dealt
deadly blow to the blow-outs of geysers.

Polina

Daniel Keren wrote:

> [Followup-To: alt.revisionism]
>
> polin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> ## Have you heard about the recent excavations in Belzec, “Polina”?
>
> # Even Ken Mc Vey could not obtain complete report just meaningless snippets.
>
> He seems to have quite a lot of material posted on his site, which
> clearly indicates a huge amount of human remains in Belzec. The name
> is McVay, BTW.
>
> # If it will show industrial murder of Jews I will instantly become one of you
> # again.
>
> Oh, please don’t become one of us. Please.
>
> # Did you hear about the 1966, 33 years old massive Hydrokop Report on Birkenau
>
> Saw it, actually.
>
> # PS I am astonished that you might for a second believe in the geysers.
>
> Let’s start with a simple one. Do you agree, that when tens-of-thousands
> of corpses are buried in one place, this will cause a lot of gases to be
> released, due to the putrefication process?
>
> Have you heard, or read, descriptions about how corpses left on the
> battlefield bloat?
>
> -Danny Keren.

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:31 EDT 1999
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian,
soc.culture.german,soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: Why some Polish priests were dying at Dachau while
others were drawing salaries?? >>>Who cares about Nuremberg Tribunal
>>>Suppression of Christian churches by Nazis
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 20:20:51 -0400
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Goodevening,

Below, by inapproprietly accusing me of blaming Roosevelt, Rocky deflects the
dillemma of many Polish priests dying at Dachau others were drawing salaries
>from the Nazis.

Instead in a bigoted way zeroing on Roosevelt, [T]Rocky should zero in on
predominantly Jewish NKVD and the Communists who destroyed not only priests and
churches but faithful and religions (e.g. Judaism and Ukrainian Uniate Catholic
Church) while suppressing all others.

Polina

I did not bl

RockyMtnCougar wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>, Juergen Hubert
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> > polin wrote:
>
> > > And, while even during the war Hitler was paying clergy’s
> > salaries,
> > > Roosevelt and Churchill have never done it in the peace time.
> > The fact that the German state continued to pay salaries to
> > clergymen
> > AFAIK wasn’t instituted by Hitler (and I doubt he would have done
> > that)
> > – that dates back to the German Empire, when the government
> > nationalized
> > all church lands, but agreed to reimburse the churches through
> > regular
> > payments.
> > – Juergen Hubert
>
> He also conveniently forgets that little slip of parchment called The
> Constitution, the First Ammendment of which makes clear that neither
> Roosevelt nor ANY other President of the United states will pay clergy
> (exceptions for military clerics who serve our soldiers being a notable
> exception).
>
> To fault Roosevelt for not paying Father Coughlin or any other civilian
> clergy person is ludicrous. Of course, most of what rolly-polly posts
> is.
>
> * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network *

(Page doesn`t exist)

> The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:32 EDT 1999
Article: 191755 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,alt.revisionism,soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Why >>> Priests Murdered in Dachau??? >>> Concentration Camp
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 23:52:04 -0400
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PONIECKA wrote:

> “Polina Borowska” wrote:
>
> >You did not respond nor substantiated my questions
>
> It is not my intention to answer or substantiate your questions.
>
> The website of WWII Polish Catholic martyrs was brought up in another forum,
> and I posted it as more detailed information. In dealing with numbers, we
> forget the names of real people.
>
> Actually, I was more interested in tracing your post to the newsgroup
> alt.revisionism, where the thread originated as “Priests Murdered in Dachau
> Concentration Camp.”
>
> If you are truly interested in resolving your questions, why don’t you research
> the Internet yourself?

I wish I could. About Auschwitz alone, there were 9883 different titles of books
published by June 1996, (when I asked for the printout) and catalogued by about
23,000 libraries sharing information with the OCLC. Probably similar sea of
information is about Dachau and searching bibliography alone would take a few
weeks. Informational overkill is probably even greater on the Internet on these
subject. For this reason I asked for help and to repeat my questions

– Why Polish priests died more frequently than non-Polish priests at Dachau

– Why 80% of Polish priests were NOT imprisoned by the Nazis and safely drew
salaries and printed their religious materials on cellulose (paper), the strategic
and rationed war material.

– Why 50% of Polish priests survived for six years in the Nazi Death camps?

Did Hitler in 1942 run out of Zyclon B or carbon monoxide? Carbon monoxide could
be created by incomplete combustion of straw filled materaces on which the priests
slept in the camps.

Eventually, by early 1945 Hitler run out of insecticide Zyclon B when its factories
were randomly destroyed by American bombers, what resulted in an appalling death
rate at the concentration camps repetitiously shown by our media when the British
bulldozer plows into mass graves heaps of cahectic bodies (due to constant diarrhea
>from typhus and dysentery but not from starvation.

> For starters, there are several links to information
> about Dachau at this site:
>
> http://members.aol.com/AACTchrNet/page5.html#Dach (Page doesn`t exist)
>
> I also heartily recommend the book by Msgr. Stanislaw Grabowski, “Follow Me:
> The Memoirs of a Polish Priest.” An excerpt from the book summary:
>
> “Born to an impoverish peasant family in Russian-controlled Poland in 1911,
> Stanislaw Grabowski was ordained to the priesthood in 1938. At the outbreak of
> World War II he was serving a diocese in western Poland. In October 1939, he
> was arrested as part of an ethnic cleansing operation in the areas of Poland
> directly annexed by the Reich.
>
> For the next five and a half years Fr. Grabowski was a prisoner in Nazi camps.

SURVIVING FOR FIVE AND AN HALF YEARS AT THE DEATH CAMP???

> Most of that time was spent in the “priests’ barracks” in Dachau. After
> liberation, he came to the United States where he wrote one of the first
> accounts of the Holocaust in Polish outside of Poland. He served in parishes on
> the east coast, South Dakota, and Minnesota and passed away in 1993.

WORKED AND LIVED TO A SOUND 82 YEARS AFTER PRIVATIONS AND PERSECUTIONS OF THE DEATH
CAMP???

It seems that the Dachau perhaps gave him a sort of immuninty or at least lease on
longevity! One would expect that after the horrors of the camps liberated inmates
should pass away in a few months after their release, would you not agree?? My
relatives and acquaintances who survived Siberian camps usually returned toothless
and prematurely aged and died within years after their release in late 1950s.

And they were so ininated (worn out, nearly dead) that none of them was able to
create any writting. Did you noticed Mrs Poniecka that perhaps one of eight
Auschwitz survivors (there were about 60,000 of them) published a book or a
memoir. Did you also notice Mrs Poniecka that there is a virtual absence of
memoirs of Siberia survivors?

Not that I believe in survivors or refugees stories. I do not regardless they are
Jews, Poles Germans or Albanians. A huge, front page stories were created in our
press about 700 KOSOVARS massacred by Serbs and burried in an abandoned mineshaft.
About a week ago on back page of the NYT and other papers you could find that
invetigators of the Hague Tribunal for weeks excavated this mineshaft and found
nothing, NOT EVEN ONE CORPSE OR SKELETON! And the death of the 700 Kosovar martyrs
was established on the authority of testimonies of divergent Albanian refugees on
the premise that all of them were c o n s i s t e n t l y relating this
martyrological story.

Without reading Rev Grabowski memoir I classify it as such a confabulatory
martyrological story. I have red hundreds of them and cried many times reading it
until one time I started to reflect on their i n t e r n a l inconsitencies and
became a historical revisionist. From then on, I am looking for a hard, physical
evidence of martyrology and genesis of alleged facts.

Thus my question Why only 50% Polish priests died and Why some of them were
imprisoned while others not. Was Hitler bent of extermination of 50% of imprisoned
priests only???

> “Follow Me” tells the story of a remarkable and danger-filled life. It is one
> on the first books ever to tell the story of Polish priests imprisoned by the
> Nazis during World War II. Over a fifth of Poland’s Catholic clergy was killed
> during the war, and many religious were imprisoned or tortured.”
>
> PONIECKA

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:32 EDT 1999
Article: 191757 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian
Subject: Re: No Slovak, Ukrainian and Lithuanian priests at Dachau >>>Why
>>>Priests Murdered in Dachau??? >>> Concentration Camp
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 00:03:42 -0400
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Dear Mrs Poniecka,

The mortality of the Polish priests at Dachau and the longevity of its survivors
which you, inadvertently, brought to my attention with the example of Rev.
Grabowski creates prepexing incongruity in regard to alleged Nazis intention to
persecute Catholic Churc and Polish priests in particular.

I postulate that Hitler was NOT anti-Catholic per se. He paid salaries to Polish
priests whom he did not imprisoned and gave paper to continue to print their
literature, while the post-war, largely Jewish Polish government did not allow any
printing. The first New Testatment which appeared in my family was the one printed
in 1958. Before 1958 no New Testament was available for purchase in Poland!

My final argument that Nazia WERE anti-Polish but were NOT aniti-Catholic is that
there were no Ukrainian, Slovak and Lithuanian Catholic clergy imprisoned at
Dachau.

Is it possible that Hitler imprisoned 1,800 Polish priest for their Polish
patriotism and anti-Nazis stand???

Sincerely,

Polina Borowska

PONIECKA wrote:

> “Polina Borowska” wrote:
>
> >You did not respond nor substantiated my questions
>
> It is not my intention to answer or substantiate your questions.
>
> The website of WWII Polish Catholic martyrs was brought up in another forum,
> and I posted it as more detailed information. In dealing with numbers, we
> forget the names of real people.
>
> Actually, I was more interested in tracing your post to the newsgroup
> alt.revisionism, where the thread originated as “Priests Murdered in Dachau
> Concentration Camp.”
>
> If you are truly interested in resolving your questions, why don’t you research
> the Internet yourself? For starters, there are several links to information
> about Dachau at this site:
>
> http://members.aol.com/AACTchrNet/page5.html#Dach (Page doesn`t exist)
>
> I also heartily recommend the book by Msgr. Stanislaw Grabowski, “Follow Me:
> The Memoirs of a Polish Priest.” An excerpt from the book summary:
>
> “Born to an impoverish peasant family in Russian-controlled Poland in 1911,
> Stanislaw Grabowski was ordained to the priesthood in 1938. At the outbreak of
> World War II he was serving a diocese in western Poland. In October 1939, he
> was arrested as part of an ethnic cleansing operation in the areas of Poland
> directly annexed by the Reich.
>
> For the next five and a half years Fr. Grabowski was a prisoner in Nazi camps.
> Most of that time was spent in the “priests’ barracks” in Dachau. After
> liberation, he came to the United States where he wrote one of the first
> accounts of the Holocaust in Polish outside of Poland. He served in parishes on
> the east coast, South Dakota, and Minnesota and passed away in 1993.
>
> “Follow Me” tells the story of a remarkable and danger-filled life. It is one
> on the first books ever to tell the story of Polish priests imprisoned by the
> Nazis during World War II. Over a fifth of Poland’s Catholic clergy was killed
> during the war, and many religious were imprisoned or tortured.”
>
> PONIECKA

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:32 EDT 1999
Article: 191759 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian
Subject: Re: Niemcy zabijali Zydow ale …>>Roznica miedzy 90% i 99,5%
>>Hitler – wybieralnym dyktatorem >>> glosujcie na Papieza
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 01:13:43 -0400
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Drogi Panie Zalek:

[email protected]” wrote:

> On Thu, 21 Oct 1999 22:52:04 -0400, polin <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >Panie Zalek,
> >
> >Tak jak pan pisze w demoludach “wybierano” wiekszocia 99,5% glosow co bylo
> >oczywista fikcja
> >
> >Referenda ktore oglaszal Hitler dawaly mu slowo zaufania w zaledwie 90% co
> >oznacza ze wybory w III Reichu byly wolne lub nieomal wolne.
> >
> >Niemcy naprawde kochali Hitlera jak zlikwidowal bezrobocie.
> >
> >W zwiazku z tym Goldhagen ma racje na 50% ze przecietny Niemiec jest
> >odpowiedzialny za postepki rzadu Hitlera. Jednakze tych drugich 50% to jest
> >to ze hitlerowcy nie mordowali Zydow na przemyslowa skale
> >
> >Z powazaniem Polina
>
> Tak, tak Pani Mecenasowo(*)
>
> Niemcy nie mordowali Zydow

Powyzej pan mnie zle (i chyba z zamyslem) cytuje. Ja twierdze ze Niemcy
zabijali lub doprowadzali Zydow do smierci roznymi sposobami ale nie na
przemyslowa skale.

> a komunisci nie wygladzali Ukrainy.
> Nie znaleziono kosci wyglodzonych Ukraincow, wiec Ukraincy nie marli z
> glodu.

Kaganowich i Nikita Khruschev glodzili wiesniakow Ukrainy. Przyznaja sie do
tego glowni oficerowie Cheka w swych prosbach o promocje vide witryna Lubomyra
Prytulaka z Kanady cytujaca ksiazke Wiktora Szapochwala – zbior 300 takowych
aplikacji.

Pytanie ilu wiesniakow Ukrainy oni zaglodzili na smierc nie ma jasnej
odpowiedzi. Pan ma racje ze Ukraincy powinni zrobic wyrywkowe ekshumacje
przycerkiewnych cmentarzy na ukrainskich wioskach. Powinni znalezc tam masowe
groby.

Radzieckiej statystyce nie mozna wierzyc choc ona wskazuje na ubytek 2,000,000
Ukraincow pomiedzy spisami w 1929 i w 1939 roku. Tak jak ma sie sprawa z
Hitlerem tak samo ma sie sprawa ze Stalinem i Kaganowiczem. Ukrainskie wsie na
starych mapach poznikaly z map nowszych map Ukrainy. Ale trzeba rowniez
porownac czy w latach 1930-1933 nie wzrosla liczba wsi (kolchozow) na Zelenoj
Ukraini, klinie urodzajnej ziemi nad rzeka Amur na Zachod od Wladywostoku. O
ile ja wiem w chwili obecnej jest kilka milionow “Rosjan” (zrusyfikowanych
Ukraincow) ktorych nazwiska koncza sie na uk lub ko (Iwanejko lub Iwanczuk
zamiast Iwanov lub Ivaniv).

Jest mozliwosc ze czesc ktorych Ukraincy uwazaja za zaglodzonych na smierc
zostala deportowana na Daleki Wschod.

Bez watpienia Ukraincy “ustalili” liczbe ich ofiar glodu na 7,000,000 po to by
byla o wieksza od zydowskich 6,000,000 tak ze w koncu obie cyfry sa wyssane z
palca lub plodem mozgu propagandystow. Prosze zauwazyc ze w prasie II
Rzeczypospolitej Polskiej ktora byly szczegolnie anty-soviecka w opisach glodu
na Ukrainie nie znajduje sie wzmiankowanej liczby 7,000,000 a pisze sie o
2,000,000 lub wiecej milionach. 7,000,000 wyskoczylo dopiero po Norymberskim
procesie.

Sa zdjecia z 1945 roku Banderwoskich demonstracji w Nieczech w Monachium na
temat ofiar ukrainskiego glodu. Na plakatach nie ma liczby 7,000,000.
Wymyslono ja dopiero po 1946 roku po to by przelicytowac Zydow.

Ostatecznym dowodem ilu Ukraincow zginelo w czasie sztucznego glodu beda
archeologiczne wykopaliska najwczesniej w koncu nastepnego wieku. Pospiechu z
tym nie ma bo w zasadowych gruntach ukrainskiego czernozemu/lessu kosci zarowno
ludzkie jak i zwierzece (np mamutow i szablastych tygrysow) kamienieja i trwaja
w wiecznosc.

Gorzej jest z piaszczystymi (a wiec kwasnymi) gruntami w Polsce gdzie kosci
rozpuszczaja sie wrecz blyskawicznie w przeciagu 25 do 100 lat! Tak wiec
Panowie Zydzi jak chcecie sie przekonac czy was niemcy przemyslowo unicestwiali
trzeba sie spieszyc bo slady zagina.

Zrobiono co prawda w 1966 roku badania Brzezinki w celu udowodnienia
archeologicznego Zaglady Zydow ale w wiekszosci zydowska administracja Muzeum
uwaza Raport Hydrokopu za tajemnice panstwowa. Tak samo mysla nasi Zydzi jak
Prezydent Kwasnieski i Minister Geremek i Minister Oswiaty Hannah Sawicka.

> Jesli juz marli to na pewno z przejedzenia, gdyz ogladajac pod
> mikroskopem zdjecia tlustych Ukrainek z manifestacji 1 maja wyraznie
> widac ze cierpialy na nadtlusz miesni serca.

Pan ma racje ze “Ukrainki” na paradach 1 maja w Kijowie w latach 1930-33 byly
swietnie odzywione. Ciesze sie ze Pan Jozef i ja nauczylismy Pana zdawac sie
na physical evidence (materialne dowody).

Rowniez otluszczone sa dopiero co wyzwolone Zdowskie dzieci z Oswiecimia na
zdjeciach z polskimi zakonnicami pomiedzy drutami obozu

Rowniez otluszczone i usmiechniet sa matki Zdowki i ich niemowleta
sfotografowane w dniu wyzwolenia Obozu Smierci Dachau przez fotografow US
Signal Corps (fotografow amerykanskiej armii).

Rowniez otluszczone sa mlode Zydowki-placzki na manifestacyjnym pogrzebie
“ofiar” Kieleckiego pogromu w 1946 co raczej nieprzyjemnie sie oglada na Kronice
Filmowej nr 22/46 z lipca 1946 roku, dostepna z Polish Historical Society, POB
Stamford, CT 06905. Fotosy tych otluszczonych Zydowek czemus nigdy nie byly
drukowane w polskiej prasie, byc moze dlatego ze w lecie 1946 roku w Polsce
panowal na wsiach glod i ja sama bylam karmiona zupa z lebiody a moze raz na
tydzien dosawalam dwa lub trzy plasterki z jajka do kanapki z chleba jak szlam
do szkoly. O ile mnie pamiec nie myli to moze raz na miesiac byla frajda bo
babcia gdzies zdobyla kilka bulek kajzerek najwiekszy przysmak z mego
dziecinstwa. Dzieku amerykanskiemu obrzydliwemu tranowi nie dostalam krzywych
nog od krzywicy. A Zydowki w tym czasie byly otluszczone a Zydzi na cmentarzu w
skorzanych plaszczach i lub w butach z cholewami kiedy ja do kosciola jeszcze do
wczesnych lat piecdziesiatych biegalam piec kilometrow na boso ze wsi Bukowiec
kolo Lodzi do wsi Bedon kolo Andrespola. Po chleb jezdzilam rowerem 3 kilometry
do GS (Gminnej Spoldzielni) w Kustynowie… przez piaski rowerem nie mozna bylo
przejechac i trzeba go bylo pchac. Takie bylo zycie na wsi w powojennej
Ludowej Judeo-polonii.

Z zadroscia patrzylismy na spasione Zydowki co przyjezdzaly na letnisko do
pobliskiej Wisniowej Gory dwa km na zachod od Andrespola. Zydowskich dzieci nie
widywalam bo mamy trzymaly je zamkniete w willach.

Trudno je bylo zrozumiec bo chachlaly do siebie po zydowsku a ja jeszcze wowczas
nie mialam tyle rozumu zeby uczyc sie Yiddisz. Nauke zaczelam dopiero dwa lata
temu i choc nie mowie z trudnoscia czytam Does Noje Lebn z 1946 wydawane z Lodzi
a ktorego Zydowski Instytut Historyczny w Wa-wie nie zechcial mi/nam uzyczyc!.

> A Stalin nieslychanie lubial dzieci, dbal o zdrowie swoich obywateli i
> cierpiacych wysylal na dlugoletnie kuracje do sanatorji na Syberji.

Na temat kuracji Polakow i Ukraincow (najwiekszych wrogow ZSSR) pisalam przed
godzina we wczesniejszym dopisie na sciep lub alt.revisionism ale po angielsku.
Prosze mi nie docinac a poprosic kogos np pana Popiela lub Sharona aby panu
przetlumaczyli.

> Zalek
>
> (*) Panie wcale nie jest rewizjonistka – Pani jest obronca Hitlera,

Ja jestem obronca prawdy i nawet Stalinowi trzeba przyznac ze wykorzenil
analfabetyzm czego nie zrobil Pilsudski bozyszcze mojej rodziny, stad pan Miecz
mnie nienawidzi.

> Z szacunkiem,

Polina Boreowska.

PS,

Panie Zalek, prosze mi napisac dlaczego Panowie trzymaja sie sciepu i zmuszaja
nas do bezustannego zajmowania sie sprawami zydowskimi zamiast polskimi, i
dlaczego Pan i pana wspolwyznawcy WOGOLE nie udzielacie sie na
soc.culture.jewish. Czy zydowskie sprawy nie sa bardziej mile waszemu sercu?

> wiec zeby dodac wiecej szacunku do Pani pracy – nazwe Pania z lacinska
> – Pania Mecenasowa.

> >”[email protected]” wrote:
> >
> >> On Thu, 21 Oct 1999 21:54:03 -0400, polin <[email protected]>
> >> wrote:

> >> >Leszek Andrzej Kleczkowski wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> polin <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> >> : – HITLER BYL CHYBA JEDYNYM, WYBIERANYM CO DWA LATA W
> >> >> : PLEBISCYCIE DYKATOREM W NOWOCZESNEJ HISTORII SWIATA .
> >> >>
> >> >> W jakich latach te “plebiscyty” sie odbyly i kto jeszcze
> >> >> kandydowal??
> >> >
> >> >Panie Leszku,
> >> >
> >> >W plebiscytach cze referendum nie ma wielu kandydatow jest tylko jeden
> >> >na ktorego sie glosuje lub przeciw.
> >> >
> >> >Gdyby Hitlerowi co dwa lata nie przeglosowan praw Furhera – przywodcy –
> >> >dyktatora wznowiono by dzialalnosc Reichstagu -Sejmu
> >> >
> >> >Ostatnie wybory/plebiscyt/referendum na Hitlera odbylo sie w 1943 roku o
> >> >ile sie nie myle.
> >> >
> >> >Poniewaz Pan zadal to (rozsadne) pytanie na ten malo znany a niezmiernie
> >> >wazny fakt przjerze podrezniki na ten temat.
> >> >
> >> >Pozdrawia,
> >> >
> >> >Polina Borowska.
> >>
> >> Tez mi osiagniecie. W PRLu tez wybierano PZPR co pare lat i 99.9%
> >> ludzi glosowalo na Partje. To sie nazwa osiagniecie!!!!
> >>
> >> Mam nadzieje ze tego waznego faktu tez sie nie zapomni, i w
> >> podrecznikach historycznych te fakty beda lezaly bardzo blizko siebie.
> >>
> >> Zalek Bloom

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:32 EDT 1999
Article: 191760 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian,
soc.culture.german,soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: Who cares about Nuremberg Tribunal
>>>Suppression of Christian churches by Nazis
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 01:25:45 -0400
Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com
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<[email protected]>
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“Yale F.Edeiken” wrote:

> polin <[email protected]> wrote in article
> <[email protected]>…
> > Dear Mr Mc Vay,
>
> > In the “[present] era of revisionism” (term in editorial in Martyrs and
> > Resistance Dec. 1996)
>
> There is no such “era.” The deniers of the Holocaust are part of the
> lunatic fringe.

For the last 30 years, Martyrs and Resistance is the official periodical
publication sometimes monthly sometimes quarterly of the Holocaust Survivors in the
USA published in NYC. Blame the editoer Zborowski for using this term and not
revisionists.

> > who cares about [extorted] testimonies obtained
> > during Nuremberg trials?
>
> Anybody interested in the history of the period.
>
> But since you claim otherwise, please name a single prosecution witness
> whose testimony was “extorted”

The British hangman and the interrogator of R. Hoess claimed in his recent book
that he was tortured.

> or a signle document named in the analysis
> of the nazi war against Christianity which was not proved to be authentic.

The above is incomprehensible to me. Hitler imprisoned many (political?) priests
mostly Poles and about 200 German clergyman (out of tens of thousands) and to the
rest paid monthly salaries. It was political war but not religeous. In my city of
Lodz of 700,000 inhabitants, 40% Polish 30% Jewish and 30% German most Catholic
Churches were closed but none in cities without German populace. This again was
expression of ethnic but not religeous war.

Polina

thanks for refering me to Nizkor. As a historical revisionist I find the plethora
of documents listed there INVALUBLE to the revisionist cause e.g. about Treblinka
[II}latest document which indicates that the camp was a cadaveric smelly but not
secret or ‘exterminationist’ establishment

> –YFE
>
> The Holocaust History Project is at http://www.holocaust-history.org/
> The Nizkor Project is at https://nizkor.org/
> The Einsatzgruppen page is at http://www.pgonline.com/electriczen/ (Page doesn`t exist)
> The Cybrary of the Holocaust is at http://www.remember.org/
>
From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:33 EDT 1999
Article: 191761 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian,
soc.culture.german,soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: Treblinka was cadaveric and smelly but not exterminationist
>>> Who cares about Nuremberg Tribunal
>>>Suppression of Christian churches by Nazis
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 01:26:29 -0400
Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com
<[email protected]>
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“Yale F.Edeiken” wrote:

> polin <[email protected]> wrote in article
> <[email protected]>…
> > Dear Mr Mc Vay,
>
> > In the “[present] era of revisionism” (term in editorial in Martyrs and
> > Resistance Dec. 1996)
>
> There is no such “era.” The deniers of the Holocaust are part of the
> lunatic fringe.

For the last 30 years, Martyrs and Resistance is the official periodical
publication sometimes monthly sometimes quarterly of the Holocaust Survivors in the
USA published in NYC. Blame the editoer Zborowski for using this term and not
revisionists.

> > who cares about [extorted] testimonies obtained
> > during Nuremberg trials?
>
> Anybody interested in the history of the period.
>
> But since you claim otherwise, please name a single prosecution witness
> whose testimony was “extorted”

The British hangman and the interrogator of R. Hoess claimed in his recent book
that he was tortured.

> or a signle document named in the analysis
> of the nazi war against Christianity which was not proved to be authentic.

The above is incomprehensible to me. Hitler imprisoned many (political?) priests
mostly Poles and about 200 German clergyman (out of tens of thousands) and to the
rest paid monthly salaries. It was political war but not religeous. In my city of
Lodz of 700,000 inhabitants, 40% Polish 30% Jewish and 30% German most Catholic
Churches were closed but none in cities without German populace. This again was
expression of ethnic but not religeous war.

Polina

thanks for refering me to Nizkor. As a historical revisionist I find the plethora
of documents listed there INVALUBLE to the revisionist cause e.g. about Treblinka
[II}latest document which indicates that the camp was a cadaveric and smelly but
not secret or ‘exterminationist’ establishment

> –YFE
>
> The Holocaust History Project is at http://www.holocaust-history.org/
> The Nizkor Project is at https://nizkor.org/
> The Einsatzgruppen page is at http://www.pgonline.com/electriczen/ (Page doesn`t exist)
> The Cybrary of the Holocaust is at http://www.remember.org/

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:33 EDT 1999
Article: 191762 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: Pytanie? Rocznica smierci Ks. Popieluszki
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 01:46:44 -0400
Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com
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<[email protected]>
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<!doctype html public “-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en”>
<html>
Dlaczego Watykan na sile i z szybkoscia 100km na godzine wyswieca dziwnych
swietych jak miedzy innymi&nbsp; 108 ksiezy ktorych hitlerowcy wsadzili
do koncentrakow za polski patriotyzm a nie za religie a nie wyswieci blyskawicznie
mego ulubienca ks. Popieluszke lub
<p>2000 glownie Polskich (czesciowo Ukraincow) meczennikow ktorzy oddali
zycie za blizniego a moze i wroga bedac rozstrzelanymi Niemcami za przechowywanie
Zydow w czasie DWS
<p>Polish Historical Society zwrocilo sie z propozycja wyswiecenia 2,000
meczennikow do Watykanu cztery lata temu i do dzis nie otrzymalo na to
odpowiedzi.&nbsp; Moze dlatego ze czterotomowa Encyclopedia of the Holocasut
podaje liczbe ponad 900.&nbsp; To w takim razie dlaczego nie zrobic z nich
1,000 meczennikow?
<p>A ilu Zydow przyplacilo zyciem lub utrata posady w Polskim Urzedzie
Bezpieczenstwa za uratowanie lub przechowywanie Polakow?
<p>Polina
<p>PS od wiekow wysiwieconych Wojtylowski Watykan wyrzuca z kalendarza
a zastepuje ich naprawde podejrzanymi typami.
<p>Na beatyfikacje Edyty Stein przybylo 87 czlonkow jej zgladzonej rodziny.&nbsp;
Ciekawa Zaglada!
<p>Stepaniak Leszek wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE>In
<br>>
<br>>Urban byl wowczas rzecznikiem prasowym rzadu.
<br>>
<br>>W tym samym rzadzie Jaruzelskiego zasiadal Aleksader Kwasniewski,
dzisiejszy
<br>>prezydent RP. Ciekawe ze do niego Pan zadnych pretensji nie ma.
<br>>
<br>>Premierem, szefem PZPR i kim tam jeszcze byl niejaki Wojciech Jaruzelski.
Nic
<br>>sie w Polsce nie dzialo bez jego rozkazu. Pod adresem Jaruzelskiego
tez Pan
<br>>dziwnym trafem zadnych zarzutow nie wysuwa.
<br>>
<br>>Szefem bezpieki byl jeszcze inny minister – Kiszczak. Do niego tez
Pan jakos
<br>>pretensji nie ma.
<br>>
<br>>O mordercach ksiedza Popieluszki tez Pan nie wspomina.
<br>>
<br>>Tylko o Urbanie.
<br>Dzisiejszy rzecznik SLD, Kwasniewskiego czyn przyjaciel
<br>Urban z calym cynizmem przygotowywal duchowo do morderstwa Ksiedza
Popieluszki.
<br>Leszek Stepaniak</blockquote>
</html>

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:34 EDT 1999
Article: 191763 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian,
soc.culture.german,soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: Why some Polish priests were dying at Dachau while
others were drawing salaries?? >>>Who cares about Nuremberg Tribunal
>>>Suppression of Christian churches by Nazis
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 01:52:30 -0400
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<[email protected]>
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www.ukrachive of Lubomyr Prytulak reproduces recent book of Shapochwal
which provides verbatim handwritten applications for promotions of the
300 leading officers of the Cheka-NKVD in Ukraine for years 1920-40.

It shows that about 60% of them listed their ethnicity as Jewish.
Prytulak errs but not pointing to the fact that most of the rest were
like Madlaine Albrightr and General Clark of NATO of Hobrooke of UN i.e.
they did not know they were Jewish [actually they were able to hide
their Jewishness]

Book is available from the Polish Historical Society and in eight
libraries throughout USA and Canada

[email protected] wrote:

> Another lie from polin:
>
> > predominantly Jewish NKVD
>
> When will it end?

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:34 EDT 1999
Article: 191764 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.german,
soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: Revisionists, bloody-minded, reprehensible racists
>>Who cares about Nuremberg Tribunal
>>>Suppression of Christian churches by Nazis
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:06:08 -0400
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Dear Mr Kaspian,

If I am not mistaken Mr. Candide is NOT Holocaust revisionist. He simply
detests Jews. As you will notice I and true revisionists always capitalize
the word Jew or Jewess or Jewish. We respect Jews because for one reasons
among us are Jews such a David Cole videotaped and embarassed Dr. Piper of
the Auschwitz Museum and Efim Florisman who developed the true story of the
Babi Yar as a hoax by Solomon Lozowski of the Sovinform and Plitbureau and
wrote the Holocaust Chastushki for which he was severely chastized in Novoje
“Ruskoje” Slovo.

Moreover, we revisionists are inherently avoved pacifists. It is you
martyrologists who are bloody-minded and see baby brains splattered where it
there were no babies and do not see fat and smiling Jewish babies in
stills, photographed by the US Signal Corps at the day of the liberation of
Dachau or Jewish [?] babies in icubators depicted in the newsreals of the
just liberated Buchenwald.

You can see them in US National Archive only since no mainstream media will
publish them or the wartime air photos of Kyiv which show undisturbed
ground cover in Babi Yar and undisturbed tombstones at the nearby Jewish
cemetery.

You call us racists. There are Negro revisionist such as Dr. Block and Rev
Farrhakan and there are Semitic revisionists such as from the Radio Islam in
Sweden and some editors of the Egyptian newspapers. There are also Oriental
revisionists in Japan and in mainland China.

zzdrastvujte and Shalom from Polina

[email protected] wrote:

> A lie from Candide:
>
> > It is a well known fact that most (if not all) of
> > the documents presented at Nuremberg trials
> > were fabricated by the NKVD – the Soviet
> > political police, dominated almost entirely by
> > jews.
> >
> This is, of course, historically stupid. And Candide is only able
> to cite a single instance — the Katyn Forest massacre — in support of
> this idiotic assertion.
>
> Nobody is saying that the Soviets were not capable of terrible
> deeds, including the fabrication of history. Remember the Cold War? Do
> you need to be reminded of what *that* was about? But the fact that the
> NKVD were unpleasant people does not make the Nazis magically clean and
> pure.
>
> Again, we have a reiteration of the endless lie about the Soviet
> secret police being “dominated almost entirely by jews.” (I assume the
> refusal to capitalize the word “Jew” is yet another attempt to degrade
> these people.) When will it end?
>
> This poster has, astonishingly and yet revealingly, characterized
> the Nazi criminals hanged a Nuremberg as “innocent victims”! I’d say
> this remark, all by itself, places Holocaust denial in its proper
> perspective.
>
> Holocaust denial is a moral evil, and has absolutely nothing to do
> with history, except in the sense of being a chapter of
> history-in-the-making. Will these bloody-minded, reprehensible racists
> be allowed, once again, to triumph? For the sake of my children, I hope
> not.

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:34 EDT 1999
Article: 191765 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian,
soc.culture.russian,soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.german
Subject: Re: Geysers of blood in Lemberg
>>Eichmann: “I Saw the Most Horrifying Thing I Have Ever Seen”
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:35:22 -0400
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Dear Mr or Mrs Kaspian

For the benefit of American readers let me explain that your less then
perfect command of English and your name Kaspian indicate that you are a
Soviet Jew most likely of Ukrainian origin (less likely Armenian) and
perhaps a Soviet dissident.

Thus

1) If SS would truly engage in mass killing of Jews in todays English
lingua franca we would call them exterminators not exterminationists.

For centuries extermination ment in English banishment of deportations : in
Latin ex means out and terminus means border.

But because Nazis were deporting Jews to concentration camps and forced
labor, the media dominated by the Jews changed the original meaning of
extermination into industrial murder.

I am sure you red Dubnovs History of Jews of Russia . It was translated in
1918 by the Jewish Publications Society of Philadelphia. It states that in
1880s Tsars tried to exterminate Jews to Siberia and America and
annihilated Jewish youth by forcing them into military service.

Also on February 9 1939 The NYT reported that Czech authorities were forced
to liquidate Jews who got in after 1918 and those subject to liquidation
could for six months appeal the order of the Nazi run Czech administration.

Korbels, carpet baggers from Poland and owners of matches factory tried to
avoid this lquidation by Catholic baptism. When this ruse did not work
they liqudiated themself to England and became Methodists. Thus poor
little Madleine did not know that they were Jewish along with her husband
Albright. Meaning of words change. Liquidation of Jews today means
industrial murder

But when Hitler in his January 1939 speach to the Reichstag given at the
opulent Berlin Opera House threatened with extermination (Ausrottung) of
Jewish race from Europe which try to stir another war, the Jewish editors
printed these words verbatim and they did not ruffle in them a single
comment or emotion.

Instead they praised him for the peaceful intetions and his refutal of any
quest for the German colonies in Africa.

Perhaps, you will say, on the other side of the ocean, the
Schulzbergers the American Jews and the owners of the NYT misread Hitlers
words.

But the Jews on the receiving end in the nearby Poland exulted in their
WArsaw papers e.g. Nasz Przeglad (Our Review) with a titles “Hitler
Ureguluje Eksterminacje Zydow” (Hitler Will Streamline Deportation of
Jews) refering to streamlining removal of Jewish illegal alliens from III
Reich who were lingering for months in transit camps in no man land between
borders of Poland and GErmany.

3) Finally if you are or are not Soviet dissident I want to assure you that
we revisionists are later-day dissidents smeared jailed and persecuted
assuaulted and assasinated like Volodymyr Katylnyckyj in Kyiv in July 1997

With this ending you will perhaps see some commonality between you and me
between you soviet Jews and us revisionists.

Shalom,

Polina

You should be happy that we try to reduce you mourning for the relatives of
yours who were not industrially murdered

[email protected] wrote:

> More fabrications: the words “Holocaustian” and “exterminationist.”
>
> The intent of these words, invented by Holocaust deniers, is perfectly
> clear: they are another means of shrugging off the moral baggage of
> mass murder, in this case by shifting the very *words* to describe this
> unprecedented crime — words that might properly describe a member of
> Himmler’s killing squads — onto their (current) enemies, the defenders
> of the historical record.
>
> Not for nothing, it seems, did Polin spend his/her formative years in
> the former Soviet Bloc. The techniques of propaganda must come
> naturally after all that time.
>
> Let’s be clear. There is NO SUCH THING as a “Holocaustian” or an
> “exterminationist,” unless it be an elderly SS man with blood on his
> hands. Even Holocaust deniers — who prefer to call themselves by the
> sanitized term “revisionists” — ought to make enough pretence, at
> least, of human decency not to apply unwanted, derogatory terms to
> decent human beings who are guilty of nothing but moral integrity.
>
> When will the horror end?

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:34 EDT 1999
Article: 191766 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.german,
soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: Human fat soap was brought by Soviets to Nueremberg
>>>Who cares about Nuremberg Tribunal
>>>Suppression of Christian churches by Nazis
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:37:44 -0400
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My title is self explanatory

Polina

PS In addition they brough staged cremation pyres from Klooga camp as authentic

“Yale F.Edeiken” wrote:

> Candide <[email protected]> wrote in article
> <[email protected]>…

> > Yale F.Edeiken wrote:
> > >
> > > polin <[email protected]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > who cares about [extorted] testimonies obtained
> > > > during Nuremberg trials?
> > >
> > > Anybody interested in the history of the period.
> > >
> > > But since you claim otherwise, please name a single prosecution
> witness
> > > whose testimony was “extorted” or a signle document named in the
> analysis
> > > of the nazi war against Christianity which was not proved to be
> authentic.
> >
> > It is a well known fact that most (if not all) of
> > the documents presented at Nuremberg trials
> > were fabricated by the NKVD – the Soviet
> > political police, dominated almost entirely by
> > jews.
>
> It is not only not a “well known fact” but an utter fabrication.
>
> The Soviets supplied almost no documents whatsoever and the majority of
> those they used in evidence were supplied to them by the US army.
>
> > The most notorious examples of those false
> > documents are the witness testimonies, the
> > forensic report and other evidence produced at
> > the trial of ten German officers accused of
> > murdering thousands of Polish POWs at the
> > Katyn Forest.
>
> You are wrong again. The Soviets presented no doucmentary evidence of the
> Katyn massacre and what evidence they did present was easily proven
> fraudulent to the Tribunal which did not credit it.
>
> I find it strange that the deniers of the Holocaust continually use the
> fact that the Tribunal was savvy enough to expose frauds as evidence that
> the Tribunal was incapable of determining what was fraudlulent or not.
>
> > Now, I have hardly any sympathy for the
> > hanged Germans who had no business
> > invading Poland at the first place,
>
> But you will lie for them
>
> > but in the
> > eyes of law, they were innocent victims
> > murdered in cold blood
>
> In the eyes of the law, the trial at Nuremberg was fair and honest and
> those found guilty were given a fair trial. There was no finding by the
> Tribunal that the Germans committed the Katyn Massacre. In fact the
> evidence presented BY THE DEFENSE was ambiguous. No person was, therefore,
> sentenced to death for the crime.
>
> > This but one example of seemingly endless list
> > of false documents used as testimony at
> > Nuremberg trials.
>
> Since you haven’t named one your list is not, as you claim, without end
> but without beginning.
>
> The ignorant statements you make presents another good reason why the
> Nuremberg trials should be studied. The garbage you pass off as “well
> known facts” will then be instantly recognized as such.

> –YFE
>
> The Holocaust History Project is at http://www.holocaust-history.org/
> The Nizkor Project is at https://nizkor.org/
> The Einsatzgruppen page is at http://www.pgonline.com/electriczen/ (Page doesn`t exist)
> The Cybrary of the Holocaust is at http://www.remember.org/

From [email protected]ll.net Sun Oct 24 19:24:35 EDT 1999
Article: 191767 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.german,
soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: Human fat soap was brought by Soviets to Nueremberg
>>>Who cares about Nuremberg Tribunal
>>>Suppression of Christian churches by Nazis
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:38:04 -0400
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My title is self explanatory

Polina

PS In addition they brought staged photos cremation pyres from Klooga camp as
authentic

“Yale F.Edeiken” wrote:

> Candide <[email protected]> wrote in article
> <[email protected]>…
> >
> >
> > Yale F.Edeiken wrote:
> > >
> > > polin <[email protected]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > who cares about [extorted] testimonies obtained
> > > > during Nuremberg trials?
> > >
> > > Anybody interested in the history of the period.
> > >
> > > But since you claim otherwise, please name a single prosecution
> witness
> > > whose testimony was “extorted” or a signle document named in the
> analysis
> > > of the nazi war against Christianity which was not proved to be
> authentic.
> >
> > It is a well known fact that most (if not all) of
> > the documents presented at Nuremberg trials
> > were fabricated by the NKVD – the Soviet
> > political police, dominated almost entirely by
> > jews.
>
> It is not only not a “well known fact” but an utter fabrication.
>
> The Soviets supplied almost no documents whatsoever and the majority of
> those they used in evidence were supplied to them by the US army.
>
> > The most notorious examples of those false
> > documents are the witness testimonies, the
> > forensic report and other evidence produced at
> > the trial of ten German officers accused of
> > murdering thousands of Polish POWs at the
> > Katyn Forest.
>
> You are wrong again. The Soviets presented no doucmentary evidence of the
> Katyn massacre and what evidence they did present was easily proven
> fraudulent to the Tribunal which did not credit it.
>
> I find it strange that the deniers of the Holocaust continually use the
> fact that the Tribunal was savvy enough to expose frauds as evidence that
> the Tribunal was incapable of determining what was fraudlulent or not.
>
> > Now, I have hardly any sympathy for the
> > hanged Germans who had no business
> > invading Poland at the first place,
>
> But you will lie for them
>
> > but in the
> > eyes of law, they were innocent victims
> > murdered in cold blood
>
> In the eyes of the law, the trial at Nuremberg was fair and honest and
> those found guilty were given a fair trial. There was no finding by the
> Tribunal that the Germans committed the Katyn Massacre. In fact the
> evidence presented BY THE DEFENSE was ambiguous. No person was, therefore,
> sentenced to death for the crime.
>
> > This but one example of seemingly endless list
> > of false documents used as testimony at
> > Nuremberg trials.
>
> Since you haven’t named one your list is not, as you claim, without end
> but without beginning.
>
> The ignorant statements you make presents another good reason why the
> Nuremberg trials should be studied. The garbage you pass off as “well
> known facts” will then be instantly recognized as such.
>
> –YFE
>
> The Holocaust History Project is at http://www.holocaust-history.org/
> The Nizkor Project is at https://nizkor.org/
> The Einsatzgruppen page is at http://www.pgonline.com/electriczen/ (Page doesn`t exist)
> The Cybrary of the Holocaust is at http://www.remember.org/

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:35 EDT 1999
Article: 191768 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.jewish.,
soc.culture.german,soc.culture.ukrainian
Subject: Re: Apologies from Polina >>> Geysers of blood in Lemberg
>>Eichmann: “I Saw the Most Horrifying Thing I Have Ever Seen”
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:54:19 -0400
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Daniel Keren wrote:

> [Followup-To: alt.revisionism]
>
> polin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> # 1) Please do not be more Catholic than the Pope! … Do not be more Holocaustian
> # than USMM and Ken Mc Vay who complained to me that he could not get complete Belzec
> # Report.
>
> Didn’t Mr. McVay just post that he has the complete report?

About two weeks ago he did not have it. Do not obfuscate issue while you can ask him
directly and get authoritative answer

> # Snipetts available contradict the history of the Belzec camp of the last few
> # decades that all corpses were cremated and indicate that pedantic Germans were
> # careless at covering traces of their “crime” i.e. industrial murder of the Lemberg
> # (Lwow, Lviv) Jews. What you describe as huge seems to me as an usual cemetery
> # serving Nazi concentration camp.
>
> No, the remains indicate massive burning of corpses, and are up to 6.5 meters
> deep. This, and the area involved, indicate something rather different than
> a “usual cemetery”.

Experience shows that mass graves are dug only two meters deep in order to avoid building
retaining walls protecting diggers and preventing caving in before burial. If indeed
human remains were found at 6,5 meters (abouyt 20 feet) depth the upper layers were
undobutedly added during the last decade. In Treblinka II the mass grave was covered
with layer of concrete to prevent gold scavenging.

> # 2) I am astonished that you are an exegetic of the WW II Holocaust but you do not
> # proseletise. I thought you will be happy that I would return to the Faith for any
> # hard evidence reason, like the Saint Thomas. It seems that both the Judaism and
> # Holocaustianism are two not proseltizing religions.
>
> Whatever you’re injecting, it’s not doing you any good.
>
> # 3) You claim that you saw Hydrokop Report. I am again astonished. Directors of
> # the Musemum Krystyna Oleksy and mrg. Wroblewski several times in writting refused
> # access of the Polish HIstorical Society of Stamford CT to this most important
> # document of the Holocaust.
>
> What on earth is the “Polish HIstorical Society of Stamford CT”? A bunch of
> neo-Nazis, right?

Would you think that real Neo-Nazis would like to collaborate with you??? Of course they
would not because they hate the Jews. Revisionists do not because there are Jews among
us: Dr. Lilinethatl, Mr. Burg, David Cole, Efim Florisman (the Babi Yar man)

> # Are you fluent in Polish or they showed you autheniticated translation in English.
> # Or they just showed you a few drawings and the Polish text??
>
> The report is essentially a map, indicating the location of the holes, and what
> was found at each.

If you can provide me with the copy of this map I will pay up tro $100.00 although the
entire report consits of many pages.

Will you share with me the copy of this “map”???

> # I agree that in warm temperature cadavers bloat … due to bacterial putrefaction.
> # But in order for Eli Wiesel in Kyiv or Adolf Eichman in Lviv to see geysers of
> # blood the gasses would have to be released simultaneously, I am sure you will
> # agree.
>
> No.
>
> [Rest of rants from the twisted little neo-Nazi deleted]
>
> -Danny Keren.

PS: I sincerely appologize for rather tasteless humor. Seeing your justified
indignation on my “Haloween humor” I see that it was poor excuse and I appologize again.
Yes you were correct in deleating in and I thank you for you doing that. It was TOTALLY
inappropriate! Considering massive verbal abuse suffered by revisionists it was still
inappropriate

Polina

From [email protected] Sun Oct 24 19:24:35 EDT 1999
Article: 191770 of soc.culture.polish
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From: polin <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.ukrainian
Subject: Re: Sacrificed Inca children >>> Eichman was soaked with Thorazine not
blood from Jewish geysers …Geysers of blood in Lemberg
>>Eichmann: “I Saw the Most Horrifying Thing I Have Ever Seen”
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 03:31:00 -0400
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soc.culture.ukrainian:59598

Dear Philip,

Your citations support my contention.

Burial slows down decomposition

And low temperature you did not mentioned (on purpose???) stops decomposition. Look at
the recent National Gegraphic. Inca children sacrificed in the Ades 500 years ago look
“like new”.

Also waxy degeneration, as one found in Belzec, does not occur above the ground
especially in summer.

Also bloating does not occur under ground in mass graves due to slow production of gas
and heavy pressure.

In Poland and Ukraine and especially in Baltics the ground temperature steady year
around and measures at about 45-50F. The speed of cooling of bodies by the massive heat
(actually cold) capacity of the ground exeeds the rate of the exothermy of the anerobic
‘fermentation’ and slows it to near zero. In temperatures below 40 only fungi grow
slowly. Nothing grows in temperature below o Centigrade.

Mass killings by Einsatz gruppe were conducted in fall Babi Yar took place on September
29 -October 2, when the German and the Red Army were immobilized by heavy rain and early
snow in Kyiv area. These weather conditions are documented by daily weather reports in
German Kriegstagebuche and in Soviet notations thus are incontrovertible. In Moscow on
November 7 during the parade on the anniverssary of the October Revolution I am sure you
have seen on TV always snows.

Ceaca, do you know dring which month Eichmann said he visited Lviv??

Moreover, Nazis begun to form Ghetto and kill Jews on mass scale (600,000 in total
according to Nuremberg data) in Lemberg in December 1941.

The story of ground swelling and heaving over the mass graves like wave on the sea
described by survivors is pure martyrological fiction.

Polina

Philip Mathews wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>,
> polin <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Dear Philip,
> >
> > The geysers of blood are sheer hydrolic and medical impossibility.
> >
> > In mass grave blood is contained within the skin which can be described as a tight
> > leather sac and the bodies are gradually dehydrated by the ‘hydrostatic’ pressure
> > of the soil or corpses above. Think of cottage cheese being turned in a cheese
> > cloth between two boards into solid cheese.
> >
> > In the cool or cold and anerobic (oxygen deprived) millieu of the mass grave the
> > bacterial decomposition essentially ceases. Instead the slow growing fungi take
> > over. But fungi generally do not produce gases like the anerobic bacteria at body
> > temperature and above (85-105F) or yeast at 65-75F.
>
> This is not true. Buried bodies undergo the same five stages of decomposition
> (Fresh Stage, Bloated Stage, Decay Stage, Dry Stage and Remains Stage) as
> bodies left above ground .
>
> What does occur in buried corpses is a different rate of decomposition.
>
> (begin quote)
>
> Keh (1985) presented Casper’s rule, which states that decomposition in air
> for one week is approximately equal to decomposition in water for two weeks,
> which is approximately equal to decomposition underground for eight weeks.
> Others have also found that burial greatly slows down the rate of
> decomposition (Mann et al., 1990; Turner, 1987).
>
> (end quote)
>
> Using Insects to Determine the Post Mortem Interval
> Dr. Bob Randall
> University of Saskatchewan
>
> During this inevitable process of decomposition the corpse eventually reaches
> the Bloated Stage.
>
> (begin quote)
>
> The bloated stage of decomposition begins with the start of bloating and ends
> with the cessation of bloating (Early and Goff, 1986; Rodriguez et al., 1983;
> Turner, 1987). This stage of decomposition is characterized by putrefaction,
> during which the gases produced by anaerobic bacteria cause the abdomen to
> inflate. The internal temperature of the carcass starts to rise above
> ambient temperatures due to the activity of maggots and bacteria (Early and
> Goff, 1986; Greenberg, 1991). The stench also becomes strong. This stage is
> reported to last three days in the summer, and five to seven days in the
> spring and fall for fully exposed human corpses (Rodriguez and Bass, 1983).
> This stage ends when the gases escape and the bloated carcass collapses.
>
> (end quote)
>
> Ibid
>
> It is at this stage that large numbers of bodies, releasing gas mixed with
> bodily fluids, could produce the phenomenon reported by Eichmann and others.
>
> Philip Mathews
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ (Page doesn`t exist)
> Before you buy.