Warning: this is a collection of articles from Matt Giwer in which each
contains only a single line of thought from him. Each of these is
simply a followup to an article, usually with the entire article quoted,
plus one line of commentary from him, and one of his “stock” files
appended. Usually, it is hard to figure what the appended file has to
do with the quoted text; in the cases where they do have marginal
relevance, it’s probably just random coincidence.
My criterion for “one-liner” has been literal: under 80 characters.
There have also been a number of two-liners and three-liners which have
been left out.
Articles which include a great deal of quoted text, a one-liner
response, and _no_ appended tagline have _not_ been included here. This
file is designed to show Giwer’s intentions to waste bandwidth and time
by means of irrelevant appended files. Anyone can waste bandwidth by
failing to trim quoted text; Giwer isn’t just anyone.
As for why Giwer would reply with nothing but a “tagline,” see his
bragging about the length and irrelevancy of those taglines in:
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/g/giwer.matt/net-abuse/the-longer-my-tagline (page does not exist)
See also:
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/g/giwer.matt/net-abuse/followups-empty (page does not exist)
– Jamie McCarthy ([email protected]), June 22nd, 1996
Note: I’ve given up on tracking the “one-liners.” I’ve resigned myself
to just tracking the “zero-liners” for now, which are (1) more egregious
violations of netiquette and (2) more numerous by far. I’ve seen at
least a dozen one-liners in the last week, some as small as three words
of content surrounded by 10K of spam, but I’m simply going to ignore
them all. Only if Giwer takes advantage of my lapse by starting to post
nothing but one-liners will I return to tracking them. So, refer to the
“followups-empty” URL directly above.
– Jamie, July 1st, 1996
From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Hoaxsters for the Holocaust
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 03:42:56 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 114
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
<[email protected]>
<[email protected]> <[email protected]>
<[email protected]> <[email protected]>
<[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl1-16.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Jun 19 10:44:42 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] (Matt
>Giwer) wrote:
>> [email protected] (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>>
>> >In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
>> >(Matt Giwer) wrote:
>>
>> >> [email protected] (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>>
>> >[snip]
>>
>> >> >And which pictures are these? The ones of the triple-muffle furnaces in
>> >> >Krema II? You say their “fireboxes” are in _front_? ROTFL! Oh, my, Giwer
>> >> >pulls a Moran! How droll.
>> >>
>> >> Use the powerful search engine at Nizkor and find the pictures.
>>
>> >I did. Giwer, as usual, is full of shit. The photos simply show the front
>> >of the furnaces and the corspe loading and ash removal doors. The front of
>> >the furnaces are also situated along the centerline of the furncace hall.
>> >One can’t see the backs of the furnaces in the photos. This is why it is
>> >important to reference the drawings to see their positions relative to the
>> >Krema shell.
>>
>> The also show the rear wall and the minimal space between them.
>Bullshit. The “rear wall” of the furnace hall (e.g. the wall behind the
>furnaces) cannot be seen in the photo.
>Why does the Giwer-Troll lie so stupidly? Why doesn’t the Giwer-Troll
>realize that all it takes to see his lies for what they are is a modicum
>of research? In this case simply _looking_ at the photo reveals that one
>cannot see a wall behind the furnaces. If one wwre to examine the
>construction drawing it is _clear_ that the furnaces do not touch the wall
>behind them. Amazing.
What is that thing I see behind them if it not a wall?
>> But of course you would rather deceive people on the matter.
>On the contrary, I am trying to expose the Giwer-Trolls lies and deceptions.
>> But of course you will provide a URL to the reference drawings some day,
>> will you not?
>When they become available on a website and I am made aware of it, yes.
>Until then, I will reference them from the books where I find them.
>> How about Hoaxster for the Holocaust?
>How about:
>The Giwer-Troll is, as far as I can determine, an anti-Semitic and racist
>troller whose only interest is in slandering Jews and causing fights.
>While he can sometimes sound superficially plausible, he has profusely and
>consistantly lied about what has been said in exchanges (while accusing
>others of lying), refused to document claims, pretended not to see posts
>which contain documented refutation of his claims (even when they have
>been emailed to him), engaged in actual libel, blatant and offensive
>anti-Semitism, Nazi apologia, sexism, and has generally conducted himself
>with such a complete lack of intellectual and factual integrity that there
>seems to be no point in taking the time to read and respond. For detailed
>and documented evidence of this, please refer to
>URL http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/g/giwer.matt (page does not exist)
>Mark
>——————————————————————————–
>”Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil passes
>not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties–but
>right through every human heart–and all human hearts.”
>– Alexander Solzhenitsyn, “The Gulag Archipelago”
>——————————————————————————–
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: With evidence like this …
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 22:18:10 GMT
Amazing what some of the heroes of the holohuggers will say when under
oath.
1/24/85
Holocaust heavyweight Rudolf Vrba, under cross-examination in a
Canadian courtroom,
states under oath that 150,000 French Jews were gassed at
Auschwitz, in spite of the fact
that the entire number of Jews deported from France were only
75,721. Vrba claims he
arrived at his count “scientifically” by having listened to the
language spoken by the inmates
at Auschwitz and examining their luggage (!). The author of “I
Cannot Forgive” next
confessed that his book was “an artistic picture … not a document
for a court,” in spite of
the fact that Vrba’s testimony was crucial to both the War Refugee
Board and the Auschwitz
Trials in West Germany. Vrba further admitted that his written and
pictorial descriptions of
Auschwitz crematoria were a result of guessing, based on “what I
heard it might look like.”
Oops!
From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Giwer the Hypocrite
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 19:30:24 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl7-04.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Jun 20 2:32:14 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (Harry Katz) wrote:
>In article <[email protected]>,
>[email protected] whines:
> When I was accused of it, it was sufficient justification to
> harrass my service provider until I was removed. It is still
> used as justification for that harrassment. It is also used to
> justify the harrassment of my family.
>To quote Mr. Giwer himself, “…mere rhetoric does not constitute
>harrassment!” — unless, of course, Mr. Giwer is the victim!
> But you know that is what holohuggers are like.
>Yes, we are like convenient whipping boys who allow Mr. Giwer to flog
>his various neuroses and psychoses in public.
>–
>Harry Katz
>To have no faithful friends is worse than death.
> — The Wit and Wisdom of the Talmud, Madison C. Peters, ed.
But we all know what holohuggers are like.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Ooooo, those nasty SS
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:53:37 GMT
” The SS forced [women] to wash the stairs leading from the seven
entrances to the four-story
house, with their tongues and lips. After those stairways were wased,
the same people were
forced to collect garbage in the courtyard with their lips. All garbage
had to be transferred to one
place in the courtyard. ”
IMT VII – p.491.
From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: A discrepency among exterminationists…
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 1996 22:27:37 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 100
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl1-10.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Jun 18 5:29:20 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (Daniel Keren) wrote:
>[Followup = alt.revisionism]
>
>[email protected] (Les Griswold) writes:
>
># Chuckles has yet to clarify for me: HE claims that there WERE
># extermination facilities in Germany, but Simon Wiesenthal claims
># there WEREN’T. So who’s right?
>
>The apparent contradiction you point to does not exist. It is
>true, on one hand, that the camps in the “Old Reich” (Germany
>proper) were not extermination camps in the sense of Treblinka,
>Auschwitz-Birkenau, etc. This is why they are usually called
>”concentration camps”. However, a very large number of people
>were murdered in them (although, it is true, less than in the
>massive extermination camps the SS built in Poland).
>
>Here are some photographs taken in Belsen camp (which was in
>Germany proper).
>
>All the following photos are in
>
>ftp://ftp.almanac.bc.ca/pub/miscellany/dkeren-incoming/ (page does not exist)
>
>They are scanned from “The Belsen Trial” – Edited by R. Phillips,
>William Hodge and Company, 1949.
>
>Belsen01.jpg: A Mass grave in Belsen camp.
>Belsen02.jpg: A bulldozer being used to bury corpses in Belsen.
>Belsen03.jpg: Emaciated corpses in Belsen.
>Belsen04.jpg: Plump, overweight SS-women bury skeletal corpses in Belsen.
>Belsen05.jpg: The corpse of a child is thrown into a mass grave in Belsen.
And for those interested, here is how it came about.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Evil Nazis
From: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 16 Jun 1996 09:39:51 GMT
Working together with both Commandant Kramer and chief inmate
representative Kuestermeier,
Colonel Hanns Schmidt responded by arranging for the local volunteer
fire department to provide
water. He also saw to it that food supplies were brought to the camp
from abandoned rail cars.
Schmidt later recalled that Kramer “did not at all impress one as a
criminal type. He acted like an
upright and rather honorable man. Neither did he strike me as someone
with a guilty conscience.
He worked with great dedication to improve conditions in the camp. For
example, he rounded up
horse drawn vehicles to bring food to the camp from rail cars that had
been shot up.” (note 17)
“I was swamped,” Kramer later explained to incredulous British military
interrogators: (note 18)
The camp was not really inefficient before you [British and
American forces] crossed
the Rhine. There was running water, regular meals of a kind — I
had to accept what
food I was given for the camp and distribute it the best way I
could. But then they
suddenly began to send me trainloads of new prisoners from all over
Germany. It was
impossible to cope with them. I appealed for more staff, more food.
I was told that this
was impossible. I had to carry on with what I had.
Then as a last straw the Allies bombed the electric plant that
pumped our water.
Loads of food were unable to reach the camp because of the Allied
fighters. Then
things really got out of hand. During the last six weeks I have
been helpless. I did not
even have sufficient staff to bury the dead, let alone segregate
the sick … I tried to get
medicines and food for the prisoners and I failed. I was swamped. I
may have been
hated, but I was doing my duty.
Kramer’s clear conscience is also suggested by the fact that he made no
effort to save his life by
fleeing, but instead calmly awaited the approaching British forces,
naively confident of decent
treatment. “When Belsen Camp was eventually taken over by the Allies,”
he later stated, “I was
quite satisfied that I had done all I possibly could under the
circumstances to remedy the
conditions in the camp.” (note 19)
From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: “Adolf Hitler was the greatest man who ever walked this earth”
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 1996 20:08:42 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl8-04.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Jun 17 3:10:12 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
@stud-mailer.uni-marburg.de wrote:
>[email protected] (M Huber) wrote:
>>I predict the day coming in my lifetime when the figure of 6,000,000
>>***WILL*** become a reality.
>>
>>Sandra
>Open incitement to genocide…
>Nele
Do you feel incited?
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: No fuel needed
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:49:31 GMT
“MORGEN: These places were faked cloakrooms, and the person was given a
check at each
one so that the people believed that they would get their things back
…. When the last one was in,
the doors were shut and the gas was let into the room. As soon as death
had set in, the
ventilators were started. When the air could be breathed again, the
doors were opened, and the
Jewish workers removed the bodies. By means of a special procedure…
they were burned in the
open air without the use of fuel. ”
IMT XX – p. 494.
More Nazi physics at work.
I am certain our favorite chemist can explain this one.
On the other hand, why did they ever need any crematoria if they could
do this?
From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Giwer, the Crazed Liar, Strikes Again (Re: Degesh 0)
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 18:40:20 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 157
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl7-24.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Jun 20 1:42:13 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (Daniel Keren) wrote:
>[email protected] writes:
># Keep believing that. I post enough in this conference to
># make start a healthy skepticism in any unbiased reader.
>Yep. Who can resist claims such as Giwer had made in support of
>”Holocaust revisionism”…
>1) That Belsen camp was really in Poland.
>2) That Zyklon-B would not release any HCN in a temperature of
> 20 degrees (this from a “163-IQ’ed retired engineer”).
>3) That Degesch never manufactured Zyklon with an “Erco” carrier,
> and that such a carrier could not be bluish in color.
>4) That the Krema I gas chamber was really a “delousing chamber”;
> Giwer also claimed it had cyanide residues on its outer wall.
> Naturally, he failed to document this claim.
>5) That the Nazis are not to blame for tens-of-thousands of deaths
> at Belsen (never mind that there were hundreds of tons of food
> nearby, which were nontheless not given to the inmates; they were
> not even given water).
>6) That the testimonies about gassing are “unsigned, un-notarized,
> type written statements provided by the Russians”. (An outright
> lie, of course; most of these testimonies were given before
> German courts).
>7) And, one of my favorites: quoting the old .sig
>In Message-ID: <[email protected]>, Matt Giwer
>suggested that documents about a “gas chamber” and “gassing cellar”
>in the Birkenau crematoriums didn’t count, as they were really due
>to “a morbid sense of humor” of the SS men who authored the documents.
>And we could go on and on.
>-Danny Keren.
As can I.
JAPANESE WAR CRIMES TRIALS
While Germans were being convicted of making human “soap” (taken
seriously in the seventh edition of Oppenheim and Lauterpacht’s
prestigious International Law, vol. II, p. 450) Japanese defendants were
being convicted of making human “soup” in repeated trials.
This is not a misprint; it was considered a “proven fact” in 1948 – a
“fact” proven in numerous “trials” – that the Japanese are a race of
habitual cannibals who were forbidden upon pain of death from devouring
the corpses of their own dead, but who were officially encouraged to eat
Americans. Americans were served fried, or as soup; people were eaten
when other food was available. Thus, the Japanese engage in cannibalism
out of choice rather than necessity. Favourite human body parts for
culinary purposes are liver, pancreas and gall bladder; Chinese are
swallowed in pill form!
Among the “trials” in which this was “proven” are U.S. Tachibana Yochio
and 13 others, Mariana Islands, 2nd-15th August, 1946; Commonwealth of
Australia vs. Tazaki Takehiko, Wewak, 30th November 1945; Commonwealth
of Australia v. Tomiyasu Tisato, Rabaul, 2nd April 1946; and the most
complex war crimes trial in history, the International Military Tribunal
for the Far East (IMTFE) personally supervised by Douglas McArthur,
which lasted from May 1946 until December 1948 (see The Tokyo Judgment,
vol. 1, pp. 409-410, University of Amsterdam Press 1977, pp. 49,674-5 of
mimeographed transcript.
The 25 defendants who survived trial were all convicted; 7 were hanged.
Their crimes included:
Planning, initiation and waging “aggressive war” against the Soviet
Union (the Soviet Union attacked Japan two days after Hiroshima in
violation of a Non-Agression Pact; on this same day the London Agreement
was signed, pursuant to which the Nuremberg Trial was held); planning,
initiation, and waging “aggressive war” against France (France is in
Europe); illegal sea blockade and indiscriminate population bombing
(case against Shimada), that is, the actions of the British in Europe
would have been illegal if committed by the Japanese; trial of war
criminals before a military tribunal (case against Hata and Tojo; see
also U.S. vs. Sawada, probably the most disgusting and hypocritical
accusation of all; the victims were 7 Americans guilty of participating
in the fire-bombing of Tokyo in which 80,000 women and children were
burned to death) and cannibalism. It was not alleged that the defendants
ate anyone personally.
The evidence included:
* Soviet War Crimes Reports * Chinese War Crimes Reports * Soviet
reports based on Japanese documents not attached to the reports *
Summaries of Japanese military aggression in China (written by the
Chinese) * 317 Judge Advocate General War Crimes Reports (total length:
14,618 pages) “quoting” “captured” Japanese documents, diaries,
cannibalism confessions, mass murder orders, orders to gas P.O.W.s on
remote South Sea islands, etc. (“captured documents” not attached to
reports; proof of authenticity not required) * affidavits of Japanese
soldiers imprisoned in Siberia * affidavits of Japanese referring to
Japs as the ‘enemy’ * affidavits of Red Army Officers * newspaper
clippings (admissable evidence for the prosecution, but not usually for
the defense; i.e., events in China were proven by quoting the Chicago
Daily Tribune, the New Orleans Times- Picayune, the Sacrimento Herald,
Oakland Tribune, New York Herald, New York Times, Christian Science
Monitor, etc. * the “affidavit” of Marquis Takugawa (written in English
and not read to him in Japanese) * the statements of Okawa (Okawa was
declared insane and confined to a lunatic asylum, but his statements
were used in evidence) * the testimony of Tanaka (a professional witness
paid by the Americans; Okawa, when drunk, has confessed everything to
Tanaka; Tanaka ‘The Monster’ Ryukichi was supposedly responsible for
millions of atrocities but was not tried, instead he moved freely about
Japan) * Kido’s diary (titbits of gossip about everybody Kido didn’t
like) * Harada’s Memoirs (Harada had suffered a stroke, so his dictation
was incomprehensible; how well he could remember and what he meant to
say were anybody’s guess; the translations were a guess; many different
“copies” had been “corrected” by a variety of people other than the
person to whom he had dictated; added to which he had a reputation for
telling lies).
The Prosecution’s Answer to Defense Arguments at the end of the trial
refutes all defensive evidence, stating that documents (translations of
excerpts “copies” without proof of issuance or signature) are the best
witnesses. If prosecution and defense both quote a document, defense
have quoted out of context, but never the prosecution. Hearsay has
probative value; testimony of defense witnesses has no probative value;
cross- examination is a waste of time.
Five of the 11 judges – William Webb of Australia, Delfin Jaranilla of
the Philippines, and Bert. A. Ršling of the Netherlands, Henri Bernhard
of France, and R.B. Pal of India – dissented. Pal wrote a famous 700
page dissentient opinion in which he called the prosecution atrocity
evidence “mostly worthless”, remarking sarcastically that he hoped one
of the documents was in Japanese.
A peculiarity of war crimes trials is that far from “proving” anything,
they all contradict each other. It was held at Tokyo that the Chinese
had a “right” to violate “unfair” treaties, and that Japanese efforts to
enforce such treaties – because they were “unfair” – constituted
“aggression”.
When the atomic bombs were dropped, Shigemitsu had been attempting to
negotiate a surrender for nearly 11 months, beginning on September 14,
1944. This of course became another “crime” – “prolonging the war
through negotiation”.
“Proof” of Japanese cannibal activity may be found in JAG Report 317,
pp. 12,467-8 of mimeographed transcript; Exhibits 1446 and 1447, pp.
12,576-7; Exhibit 1873, pp. 14, 129-30, and Exhibits 2056 and 2056A and
B, pp. 15,032- 42.
Path: news.voyager.net!aanews.merit.net!imci3!newsfeed.internetmci.com!hunter.premier.net!netnews.worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Giwer the Hypocrite
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 19:30:24 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl7-04.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Jun 20 2:32:14 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (Harry Katz) wrote:
>In article <[email protected]>,
>[email protected] whines:
> When I was accused of it, it was sufficient justification to
> harrass my service provider until I was removed. It is still
> used as justification for that harrassment. It is also used to
> justify the harrassment of my family.
>To quote Mr. Giwer himself, “…mere rhetoric does not constitute
>harrassment!” — unless, of course, Mr. Giwer is the victim!
> But you know that is what holohuggers are like.
>Yes, we are like convenient whipping boys who allow Mr. Giwer to flog
>his various neuroses and psychoses in public.
>–
>Harry Katz
>To have no faithful friends is worse than death.
> — The Wit and Wisdom of the Talmud, Madison C. Peters, ed.
But we all know what holohuggers are like.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Ooooo, those nasty SS
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:53:37 GMT
” The SS forced [women] to wash the stairs leading from the seven
entrances to the four-story
house, with their tongues and lips. After those stairways were wased,
the same people were
forced to collect garbage in the courtyard with their lips. All garbage
had to be transferred to one
place in the courtyard. ”
IMT VII – p.491.
Path: news.voyager.net!nntp.netrex.net!gatech!arclight.uoregon.edu!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!oleane!nntp.coast.net!netnews.worldnet.att.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Hoaxsters for the Holocaust
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 03:42:56 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 114
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl1-16.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Jun 19 10:44:42 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] (Matt
>Giwer) wrote:
>> [email protected] (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>>
>> >In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
>> >(Matt Giwer) wrote:
>>
>> >> [email protected] (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>>
>> >[snip]
>>
>> >> >And which pictures are these? The ones of the triple-muffle furnaces in
>> >> >Krema II? You say their “fireboxes” are in _front_? ROTFL! Oh, my, Giwer
>> >> >pulls a Moran! How droll.
>> >>
>> >> Use the powerful search engine at Nizkor and find the pictures.
>>
>> >I did. Giwer, as usual, is full of shit. The photos simply show the front
>> >of the furnaces and the corspe loading and ash removal doors. The front of
>> >the furnaces are also situated along the centerline of the furncace hall.
>> >One can’t see the backs of the furnaces in the photos. This is why it is
>> >important to reference the drawings to see their positions relative to the
>> >Krema shell.
>>
>> The also show the rear wall and the minimal space between them.
>Bullshit. The “rear wall” of the furnace hall (e.g. the wall behind the
>furnaces) cannot be seen in the photo.
>Why does the Giwer-Troll lie so stupidly? Why doesn’t the Giwer-Troll
>realize that all it takes to see his lies for what they are is a modicum
>of research? In this case simply _looking_ at the photo reveals that one
>cannot see a wall behind the furnaces. If one wwre to examine the
>construction drawing it is _clear_ that the furnaces do not touch the wall
>behind them. Amazing.
What is that thing I see behind them if it not a wall?
>> But of course you would rather deceive people on the matter.
>On the contrary, I am trying to expose the Giwer-Trolls lies and deceptions.
>> But of course you will provide a URL to the reference drawings some day,
>> will you not?
>When they become available on a website and I am made aware of it, yes.
>Until then, I will reference them from the books where I find them.
>> How about Hoaxster for the Holocaust?
>How about:
>The Giwer-Troll is, as far as I can determine, an anti-Semitic and racist
>troller whose only interest is in slandering Jews and causing fights.
>While he can sometimes sound superficially plausible, he has profusely and
>consistantly lied about what has been said in exchanges (while accusing
>others of lying), refused to document claims, pretended not to see posts
>which contain documented refutation of his claims (even when they have
>been emailed to him), engaged in actual libel, blatant and offensive
>anti-Semitism, Nazi apologia, sexism, and has generally conducted himself
>with such a complete lack of intellectual and factual integrity that there
>seems to be no point in taking the time to read and respond. For detailed
>and documented evidence of this, please refer to
>URL http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/g/giwer.matt (page does not exist)
>Mark
>——————————————————————————–
>”Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil passes
>not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties–but
>right through every human heart–and all human hearts.”
>– Alexander Solzhenitsyn, “The Gulag Archipelago”
>——————————————————————————–
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: With evidence like this …
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 22:18:10 GMT
Amazing what some of the heroes of the holohuggers will say when under
oath.
1/24/85
Holocaust heavyweight Rudolf Vrba, under cross-examination in a
Canadian courtroom,
states under oath that 150,000 French Jews were gassed at
Auschwitz, in spite of the fact
that the entire number of Jews deported from France were only
75,721. Vrba claims he
arrived at his count “scientifically” by having listened to the
language spoken by the inmates
at Auschwitz and examining their luggage (!). The author of “I
Cannot Forgive” next
confessed that his book was “an artistic picture … not a document
for a court,” in spite of
the fact that Vrba’s testimony was crucial to both the War Refugee
Board and the Auschwitz
Trials in West Germany. Vrba further admitted that his written and
pictorial descriptions of
Auschwitz crematoria were a result of guessing, based on “what I
heard it might look like.”
Oops!
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From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: No gas chamber in Germany
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 08:30:23 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 139
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl10-48.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Jun 20 3:32:16 AM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (John Morris) wrote:
>On 19 Jun 1996 00:45:21 GMT, [email protected] (Yale F. Edeiken) wrote:
>>> Alexander Baron <[email protected]> writes:
>
>>> Shame on you Mr Stein, you have read my documentation of the lies of
>>> Organised Jewry about the Dachau “gas chamber”.
>> Is it as funny as the results of your “research” about Al Capone?
>It is indeed. The funniest part was where he decided that the vacuum
>tank used for the high-altitude medical experiments was the gas
>chamber. It was, as usual, predicated on a misreading as is so much of
>Mr. Baron’s “information” on the Holocaust.
>–
> John Morris <[email protected]>
> at University of Alberta <Scripture veteris capiunt exempla futuri>
>————————————————————————
> The Nizkor Project: An Electronic Holocaust Resource
> File archives – ftp://ftp.almanac.bc.ca (page does not exist)
> Web page – http://nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (page does not exist)
Sorry, but the “he” here counts.
JAPANESE WAR CRIMES TRIALS
While Germans were being convicted of making human “soap” (taken
seriously in the seventh edition of Oppenheim and Lauterpacht’s
prestigious International Law, vol. II, p. 450) Japanese defendants were
being convicted of making human “soup” in repeated trials.
This is not a misprint; it was considered a “proven fact” in 1948 – a
“fact” proven in numerous “trials” – that the Japanese are a race of
habitual cannibals who were forbidden upon pain of death from devouring
the corpses of their own dead, but who were officially encouraged to eat
Americans. Americans were served fried, or as soup; people were eaten
when other food was available. Thus, the Japanese engage in cannibalism
out of choice rather than necessity. Favourite human body parts for
culinary purposes are liver, pancreas and gall bladder; Chinese are
swallowed in pill form!
Among the “trials” in which this was “proven” are U.S. Tachibana Yochio
and 13 others, Mariana Islands, 2nd-15th August, 1946; Commonwealth of
Australia vs. Tazaki Takehiko, Wewak, 30th November 1945; Commonwealth
of Australia v. Tomiyasu Tisato, Rabaul, 2nd April 1946; and the most
complex war crimes trial in history, the International Military Tribunal
for the Far East (IMTFE) personally supervised by Douglas McArthur,
which lasted from May 1946 until December 1948 (see The Tokyo Judgment,
vol. 1, pp. 409-410, University of Amsterdam Press 1977, pp. 49,674-5 of
mimeographed transcript.
The 25 defendants who survived trial were all convicted; 7 were hanged.
Their crimes included:
Planning, initiation and waging “aggressive war” against the Soviet
Union (the Soviet Union attacked Japan two days after Hiroshima in
violation of a Non-Agression Pact; on this same day the London Agreement
was signed, pursuant to which the Nuremberg Trial was held); planning,
initiation, and waging “aggressive war” against France (France is in
Europe); illegal sea blockade and indiscriminate population bombing
(case against Shimada), that is, the actions of the British in Europe
would have been illegal if committed by the Japanese; trial of war
criminals before a military tribunal (case against Hata and Tojo; see
also U.S. vs. Sawada, probably the most disgusting and hypocritical
accusation of all; the victims were 7 Americans guilty of participating
in the fire-bombing of Tokyo in which 80,000 women and children were
burned to death) and cannibalism. It was not alleged that the defendants
ate anyone personally.
The evidence included:
* Soviet War Crimes Reports * Chinese War Crimes Reports * Soviet
reports based on Japanese documents not attached to the reports *
Summaries of Japanese military aggression in China (written by the
Chinese) * 317 Judge Advocate General War Crimes Reports (total length:
14,618 pages) “quoting” “captured” Japanese documents, diaries,
cannibalism confessions, mass murder orders, orders to gas P.O.W.s on
remote South Sea islands, etc. (“captured documents” not attached to
reports; proof of authenticity not required) * affidavits of Japanese
soldiers imprisoned in Siberia * affidavits of Japanese referring to
Japs as the ‘enemy’ * affidavits of Red Army Officers * newspaper
clippings (admissable evidence for the prosecution, but not usually for
the defense; i.e., events in China were proven by quoting the Chicago
Daily Tribune, the New Orleans Times- Picayune, the Sacrimento Herald,
Oakland Tribune, New York Herald, New York Times, Christian Science
Monitor, etc. * the “affidavit” of Marquis Takugawa (written in English
and not read to him in Japanese) * the statements of Okawa (Okawa was
declared insane and confined to a lunatic asylum, but his statements
were used in evidence) * the testimony of Tanaka (a professional witness
paid by the Americans; Okawa, when drunk, has confessed everything to
Tanaka; Tanaka ‘The Monster’ Ryukichi was supposedly responsible for
millions of atrocities but was not tried, instead he moved freely about
Japan) * Kido’s diary (titbits of gossip about everybody Kido didn’t
like) * Harada’s Memoirs (Harada had suffered a stroke, so his dictation
was incomprehensible; how well he could remember and what he meant to
say were anybody’s guess; the translations were a guess; many different
“copies” had been “corrected” by a variety of people other than the
person to whom he had dictated; added to which he had a reputation for
telling lies).
The Prosecution’s Answer to Defense Arguments at the end of the trial
refutes all defensive evidence, stating that documents (translations of
excerpts “copies” without proof of issuance or signature) are the best
witnesses. If prosecution and defense both quote a document, defense
have quoted out of context, but never the prosecution. Hearsay has
probative value; testimony of defense witnesses has no probative value;
cross- examination is a waste of time.
Five of the 11 judges – William Webb of Australia, Delfin Jaranilla of
the Philippines, and Bert. A. Ršling of the Netherlands, Henri Bernhard
of France, and R.B. Pal of India – dissented. Pal wrote a famous 700
page dissentient opinion in which he called the prosecution atrocity
evidence “mostly worthless”, remarking sarcastically that he hoped one
of the documents was in Japanese.
A peculiarity of war crimes trials is that far from “proving” anything,
they all contradict each other. It was held at Tokyo that the Chinese
had a “right” to violate “unfair” treaties, and that Japanese efforts to
enforce such treaties – because they were “unfair” – constituted
“aggression”.
When the atomic bombs were dropped, Shigemitsu had been attempting to
negotiate a surrender for nearly 11 months, beginning on September 14,
1944. This of course became another “crime” – “prolonging the war
through negotiation”.
“Proof” of Japanese cannibal activity may be found in JAG Report 317,
pp. 12,467-8 of mimeographed transcript; Exhibits 1446 and 1447, pp.
12,576-7; Exhibit 1873, pp. 14, 129-30, and Exhibits 2056 and 2056A and
B, pp. 15,032- 42.
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From: [email protected]etcom.com (Matt Giwer)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.discrimination,alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Ken McVay: Not Addressing the Question
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 1996 05:08:35 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 38
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected] <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl1-16.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Jun 20 12:10:21 AM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Xref: news.voyager.net alt.politics.white-power:38584 alt.politics.nationalism.white:29722 alt.discrimination:30632 alt.revisionism:49229
Laura Finsten <[email protected]> wrote:
>Craig, Matt Giwer is a demented troller who does nothing much
>but try to provoke angry responses from people. This sort of
>nonsense is a good example.
You must be as fat as Ostrov.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: What a clever way to kill people
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:48:00 GMT
“PAUL WALDMANN: In this small room [at Sachsenhausen] there was a slot
in the wall,
approximately 50 centimeters in length. The prisoner of war stood with
the back of his head
against the slot and a sniper shot at him from behind the slot. In
practice this arrangement did not
prove satisfactory, since the sniper often missed the prisoner. After 8
days a new arrangement
was made. The prisoner, as before, was placed against the wall; an iron
plate was then slowly
lowered onto his head. The prisoner was under the impression that he was
being measured for
height. The iron plate contained a ramrod which shot out suddenly and
poleaxed the prisoner with
a blow on the back of the head. He dropped dead. The iron plate was
operated by a foot lever in
a corner of the room. ”
IMT VII – p. 377.
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From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Lets get this straight God I hope so!
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 00:56:31 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl7-04.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Thu Jun 20 7:58:25 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Chuck Ferree <[email protected]> wrote:
>Chuck Ferree writes:
>Oh Shit!!! He’s into the cheap wine again. It’ll kill him but that’s
>O.K. too…(I guess)
>[email protected] wrote:
>>
>> I reserve the right to respond to any post that in any manner mentions
>> me in any manner.
>Or that mentions anything in any manner, especially if it’s in any
>manner, that the manner is mentioned!
>>
>> I will continue to do so until this crap stops.
>Especially the in any manner, matter. It’s a matter of manner. Or a
>manner of matter.
>>
>> That is not a problem with me in the least. This can become a spam
>> conference as I control it (as has been publically acknowledged) or it
>> will get down to cases on my terms.
>Control is a matter of manner, as is terms, only terms is a manner of
>matter.
>>
>> There is nothing in between.
>Your ears, you mean! Right? Or is it your legs? Doesn’t really matter,
>since it’s always been a manner of matter.
>>
>> I hope you folks come to understand this.
>Of course, and it’s profoundly disturbing. But again it’s the manner.
>Didja ever try taking a flying f–k at a rollin’ doughnut?
>Chuckles ( the saviour of most of Europe) Then how come they took my
>Good Conduct Medal [email protected] wrote:
>>
Gee, Mr. War Hero, What didn’t you do during the war?
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Ooooo, those nasty SS
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:53:37 GMT
” The SS forced [women] to wash the stairs leading from the seven
entrances to the four-story
house, with their tongues and lips. After those stairways were wased,
the same people were
forced to collect garbage in the courtyard with their lips. All garbage
had to be transferred to one
place in the courtyard. ”
IMT VII – p.491.
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From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: 163 atoms of history: The Man and the Terms
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 00:23:20 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl10-07.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Fri Jun 21 7:25:25 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (Nele Abels) wrote:
>[email protected] wrote:
>>Your conclusions carry no weight save to you and to your fellow
>>holohuggers. But you know that.
>Save? From what? From the eternal abyss, because we are
>unbelievers?
That is another of your problems.
>** Mr. Giwer is in no way qualified to express himself in a rational way or to
>** support his inane claims with any historical evidence. If pressed to do so,
>** he will retreat to the point “I don’t need to proof anything because this is
>** my opinion”.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Ooooo, those nasty SS
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:53:37 GMT
” The SS forced [women] to wash the stairs leading from the seven
entrances to the four-story
house, with their tongues and lips. After those stairways were wased,
the same people were
forced to collect garbage in the courtyard with their lips. All garbage
had to be transferred to one
place in the courtyard. ”
IMT VII – p.491.
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From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: truer than true testimony
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 21:32:19 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl6-06.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Jun 22 4:34:33 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (Yale F. Edeiken) wrote:
>> [email protected] writes:
>>
>>
>> Are you really so uncritical a thinker that you can not see the problems
>> with either description?
> Now it takes a real critical thinker like Matty-poo to determine that a
>man could be repeated beaten with rifle butts, pistol butts and pistol barrels and
>not suffer any injuries.
>> ” The SS forced [women] to wash the stairs leading from the seven
>> entrances to the four-story
>> house, with their tongues and lips. After those stairways were wased,
>> the same people were
>> forced to collect garbage in the courtyard with their lips. All garbage
>> had to be transferred to one
>> place in the courtyard. ”
>> IMT VII – p.491.
> But matty-poo you told us that trial transcripts are only in Q&A format.
>This can’t be from the source that you cited. By your own statement you are
>relying on a paraphrase from a seconadary source.
I see. Different rules for thee and me.
> I know this will disappoint you because — with your abnormal
>pyschosexual hang-ups — get some perverted thrill out of repeating this, but, to
>paraphrase you:
> You ain’t got jack shit, asshole.
And you don’t have a holocaust.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: What a clever way to kill people
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:48:00 GMT
“PAUL WALDMANN: In this small room [at Sachsenhausen] there was a slot
in the wall,
approximately 50 centimeters in length. The prisoner of war stood with
the back of his head
against the slot and a sniper shot at him from behind the slot. In
practice this arrangement did not
prove satisfactory, since the sniper often missed the prisoner. After 8
days a new arrangement
was made. The prisoner, as before, was placed against the wall; an iron
plate was then slowly
lowered onto his head. The prisoner was under the impression that he was
being measured for
height. The iron plate contained a ramrod which shot out suddenly and
poleaxed the prisoner with
a blow on the back of the head. He dropped dead. The iron plate was
operated by a foot lever in
a corner of the room. ”
IMT VII – p. 377.
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From: [email protected]
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: The full story of the reconstruction
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 21:05:45 GMT
Organization: images incarnate
Lines: 61
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: tam-fl6-06.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Sat Jun 22 4:07:59 PM CDT 1996
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
[email protected] (Daniel Keren) wrote:
>[email protected] (Richard J. Green) writes:
># DvdThomas <[email protected]> wrote:
>[About the gas chamber in Krema I, Auschwitz main camp]
>## This is a given. There have even been discussions here about the
>## significance. No one questioned the existence of what is present in
>## pictures and reports. Why do you quibble about such an obvious
>## matter? Or is quibbling the aim?
># Where is Mr. Hunt’s evidence for such traces on the *outside* of
># homicidal gas chambers.
>I don’t suppose he has any. But don’t expect him to retract,
>or aplogize. He never does. He only makes jokes about Grabner.
>That’s how he gets his kicks. He probably finds mass murder to
>be amusing.
>-Danny Keren.
One tagline earns another.
>–
>In Message-ID: <[email protected]>, Matt Giwer
>suggested that documents about a “gas chamber” and “gassing cellar”
>in the Birkenau crematoriums didn’t count, as they were really due
>to “a morbid sense of humor” of the SS men who authored the documents.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: What a clever way to kill people
From: [email protected] (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:48:00 GMT
“PAUL WALDMANN: In this small room [at Sachsenhausen] there was a slot
in the wall,
approximately 50 centimeters in length. The prisoner of war stood with
the back of his head
against the slot and a sniper shot at him from behind the slot. In
practice this arrangement did not
prove satisfactory, since the sniper often missed the prisoner. After 8
days a new arrangement
was made. The prisoner, as before, was placed against the wall; an iron
plate was then slowly
lowered onto his head. The prisoner was under the impression that he was
being measured for
height. The iron plate contained a ramrod which shot out suddenly and
poleaxed the prisoner with
a blow on the back of the head. He dropped dead. The iron plate was
operated by a foot lever in
a corner of the room. ”
IMT VII – p. 377.
