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From Fri Apr 19 18:44:39 PDT 1996
Article: 31972 of alt.revisionism
From: (Orest Slepokura)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.jewish,alt.flame,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.current-events,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.lebanon,alt.smokers,ba.israelis,
Subject: Re: Israeli attack on Civilans -- US Planes in Jordan
Date: 19 Apr 1996 11:55:32 GMT
Organization: CADVision
Lines: 45
References: <4krjsq$> <4ksu4o$> <4kt4bv$> <>
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In article <>, (<>) wrote:

> Yes sir! This is proven that Israel is a terrorist state. 
> They don't care if they kill children or fire at an ambulance.
> It is a nation sponsored terrorism.
> -- 
> My Turn



It only gets worse. Yesterday the Israelis lobbed missles at an apartment
block in a residential district in Lebanon, killing nine--mostly
children--of a family of 11. That was in the morning.

In the afternoon, the Israelis lobbed missles at a UN compound crammed
with hundreds of refugees, killing or maiming most of them.

They claim to be after Hizbollah fighters; yet few Hizbollah fighters have
to date been taken out. What's happened instead is that virtually
thousands of Lebanese civilians have been either killed or maimed; while
half a million have been turned into refugees by the Israeli invasion of

Is Israel going back to the future? 

Will Operation "Grapes of Wrath" turn into a rerun of its 1982 "Peace for
Galilee" operation?

I'm afraid so.



What sort of truth is it that needs protection?  - Auberon Waugh  *
The London Daily Telegraph, May 9, 1992                           *

From Sun Apr 28 10:09:44 PDT 1996
Article: 33365 of alt.revisionism
From: (Orest Slepokura)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Israeli atrocities in Lebanon [1]
Date: 28 Apr 1996 13:09:36 GMT
Organization: CADVision
Lines: 99
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.0b30


by Robert Fisk of THE INDEPENDENT [London]: 


By Robert Fisk
The Independent 4/19/96, page 1

Qana, southern Lebanon - It was a massacre. Not since Sabra and Chatila
had I seen the innocent slaughtered like this. The Lebanese refugee women
and children and men lay in heaps, their hands or arms or legs missing,
beheaded or disembowelled. There were well over a hundred of them. A baby
lay without a head. The Israeli shells had scythed through them as they
lay in the United Nations shelter, believing that they were safe under the
world's protection. Like the Muslims of Srebrenica, the Muslims of Qana
were wrong. 

In front of a burning building of the UN's Fijian battalion headquarters,
a girl held a corpse in her arms, the body of a grey- haired man whose
eyes were staring at her, and she rocked the corpse back and forth in her
arms, keening and weeping and crying the same words over and over: "My
father, my father." A Fijian UN soldier stood amid a sea of bodies and,
without saying a word, held aloft the body of a headless child.

"The Israelis have just told us they'll stop shelling the area," a UN
soldier said, shaking with anger. "Are we supposed to thank them?" In the
remains of a burning building - the conference room of the Fijian UN
headquarters - a pile of corpses was burning. The roof had crashed in
flames onto their bodies, cremating them in front of my eyes. When I
walked towards them, I slipped on a human hand... 

Israel's slaughter of civilians in this terrible 10-day offensive - 206 by
last night - has been so cavalier, so ferocious, that not a Lebanese will
forgive this massacre. There had been the ambulance attacked on Saturday,
the sisters killed in Yohmor the day before, the 2-year-old girl
decapitated by an Israeli missile four days ago. And earlier yesterday,
the Israelis had slaughtered a family of 12 - the youngest was a four-
day-old baby - when Israeli helicopter pilots fired missiles into their

Shortly afterwards, three Israeli jets dropped bombs only 250 metres from
a UN convoy on which I was travelling, blasting a house 30 feet into the
air in front of my eyes. Travelling back to Beirut to file my report on
the Qana massacre to the Independent last night, I found two Israeli
gunboats firing at the civilian cars on the river bridge north of Sidon.

Every foreign army comes to grief in Lebanon. The Sabra and Chatila
massacre of Palestinians by Israel's militia allies in 1982 doomed
Israel's 1982 invasion. Now the Israelis are stained again by the
bloodbath at Qana, the scruffy little Lebanese hill town where the
Lebanese believe Jesus turned water into wine. 

The Israeli Prime Minister Shimon Peres may now wish to end this war. But
the Hizbollah are not likely to let him. Israel is back in the Lebanese
quagmire. Nor will the Arab world forget yesterday'a terrible scenes.

The blood of all the refugees ran quite literally in streams from the
shell-smashed UN compound restaurant in which the Shiite Muslims from the
hill villages of southern Lebanon - who had heeded Israel's order to leave
their homes - had pathetically sought shelter. Fijian and French soldiers
heaved another group of dead - they lay with their arms tightly wrapped
around each other - into blankets.

A French UN trooper muttered oaths to himself as he opened a bag in which
he was dropping feet, fingers, pieces of people's arms. 

And as we walked through this obscenity, a swarm of people burst into the
compound. They had driven in wild convoys down from Tyre and began to pull
the blankets off the mutilated corpses of their mothers and sons and
daughters and to shriek "Allahu Akbar" (God is Great") and to threaten the
UN troops.

We had suddenly become not UN troops and journalists but Westerners,
Israel's allies, an object of hatred and venom. One bearded man with
fierce eyes stared at us, his face dark with fury. "You are Americans," he
screamed at us. "Americans are dogs. You did this. Americans are dogs."

President Bill Clinton has allied himself with Israel in its war against
"terrorism" and the Lebanese, in their grief, had not forgotten this.
Israel's official expression of sorrow was rubbing salt in their wounds.
"I would like to be made into a bomb and blow myself up amid the
Israelis," one old man said. 

As for the Hizbollah, which has repeatedly promised that Israelis will pay
for their killing of Lebanese civilians, its revenge cannot be long in
coming. Operation Grapes of Wrath may then turn out then to be all too
aptly named. 

[End of article]

What sort of truth is it that needs protection?  - Auberon Waugh  *
The London Daily Telegraph, May 9, 1992                           *

From Sun Apr 28 10:09:45 PDT 1996
Article: 33366 of alt.revisionism
From: (Orest Slepokura)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Israeli atrocities in Lebanon [2]
Date: 28 Apr 1996 13:10:05 GMT
Organization: CADVision
Lines: 102
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.0b30


By Robert Fisk
The Independent' - 4/22/96

Qana, Southern Lebanon

Herve de Charette's face was as white as death. The French Foreign
Minister, neatly clad in blue suit and tie, had gingerly walked through
the scene of last week's massacre at the UN's compound, nodding
diplomatically as the UN's Fijian commander described the 12 minutes in
which Israeli shells slaughtered up to 120 refugees, the sliced-up corpses
that his soldiers were forced to pick up, the difficulty in identifying
parts of the children who had been torn to pieces. Mr de Charette listened
with distaste. But then he was confronted by a survivor. 

Fawzaya Zrir, a small, frail woman in a scarf, simply walked up to the
French Foreign Minister and began talking to him with an odd mixture of
affection and anger. "For us, France is our mother and God is our father,"
she said in a flight of rhetoric that might have been written by the Quai
d'Orsay public relations men, who beamed happily at this fortunate

Then things began to go wrong. "We have lived through hell," Mrs Zrir
continued. "The people were chopped into pieces by the Israeli bombs. They
bleed, these people. You should have seen the heads." 

At the French foreign minister's right, a Lebanese softly translated the
woman's dreadful words. The PR men began to look uneasy. "We have lived
here 40 years and now we are treated like animals," the woman cried. "Do
you know what the dogs did at night after the killings? They were hungry
and I saw them in the ruins eating fingers and pieces of our people." 

Mr de Charette stared at her as if he had seen a ghost. This had clearly
not been part of the programme, a schedule that was supposed to have
whisked the foreign minister from a light lunch at UN headquarters in
Naqqoura to a photo-opportunity on the roof of the wrecked UN battalion
HQ, a three-minutes press conference to give the impression of openness
and a swift drive back to the coast and a helicopter to Beirut -
everything, in fact, that would enhance France's much-trumpeted love for
Lebanon. Reality had very definitely not been part of the programme. 

A UN soldier was quite blunt about it. "This place is going to be turned
into one of those awful pilgrimage sites for the great and the good," he
muttered. "Boutros-Ghali sent his emissaries today to express their
horror. But they'll do no more than they did after Srebrenica. They'll
tut-tut and shrug it off. and they won't even have the guts to condemn
Israel even now - for this wickedness."

And indeed, the UN Secretary-General did send General Frank Van Kappen of
the Netherlands army - not, perhaps, a happy choice after the Dutch army's
disgrace at Srebrenica and he duly marched round the site of the worst
carnage, asking how many rounds landed, where the Katyusha missiles were
fired from and whether he could be shown this site to discover if any
Israeli shells bad fallen there.

He would be meeting with General Amnon lipkin Shahak, the Israeli chief of
staff, he said.

Yes, he would be asking to meet the soldiers who fired the fatal artillery
rounds - "fat chance of that," another UN soldier said as he listened to
all this - and with that, Van Kappen, an immense figure in his steel flak
jacket and huge helmet clanked out of the compound with a colonel from the
Royal Engineers.

Mr de Charette was even more gentle of spirit. What had happened on
Thursday was 'unfortunate", an event for which France wished to show its
sympathy for the Lebanese. So how did it rank in the scale of civilian
atrocities? How did it rank, for example, beside the Sarajevo market

"Frankly," the Foreign Minister replied sharply, "I have not had an
opportunity to make categories of unhappiness we have to work to do is to
make it impossible for this to happen in the future in Lebanon." And so
say all of us. Did he believe Israel had given sufficient explanation of
the massacre? "I hear there is an inquiry we have to await the result." 

The problem, however is that neither America nor Europe are going to
condemn a country which pounded refugees of Qana with 155mm shells for 12
minutes; and such condemnation is about the only palliative that the
Lebanese might accept for the moment.

And you can see their point. On the coast road back to Beirut last night
there were burning cars, civilians deliberately targeted by Israeli
warships north of Sidon, three of whom had been badly wounded. Had this
being a Syrian warship shelling Israeli civilians on the Haifa-Tel Aviv
road, of course, Mr Clinton himself would have deplored--rightly--an act
of "international terrorism".

But not a word of criticism about this scandalous targeting of Lebanese
civilians was uttered by the foreign ministers of America, Russia, France
and Italy as they sought to bring an end to an apparently unstoppable

[End of article]

What sort of truth is it that needs protection?  - Auberon Waugh  *
The London Daily Telegraph, May 9, 1992                           *

From Mon Apr 29 09:31:03 PDT 1996
Article: 41285 of can.politics
From: (Orest Slepokura)
Newsgroups: bc.politics,ab.politics,bc.politics,can.politics,ont.general
Subject: Re: Sheila Copps Lies Again to Canadians
Date: 28 Apr 1996 23:58:27 GMT
Organization: CADVision
Lines: 56
References: <4lqiea$> <4lvn0p$>
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.0b30
Xref: bc.politics:276 can.politics:41285 ont.general:38475

In article <4lvn0p$>,
(Zeljko 'Zed' Zidaric) wrote:

> Georges Skorpios  wrote:
> >In refusing to do the honorable thing in resigning over 
> >the Liberal's failure to "scrap", "kill" and "abolish" (words used
> >by Chretien, Paul Martin, and Sheila Copps during the 1993 
> >federal election campaign) the GST,  Copps tried to defend 
> >her lack of integrity by
> >saying, "I think that making a fast-lip comment in the course
> >of an election campaign should not put me in a position of having
> >to resign".
> What was most disgusting was the flippant manner in which she laughed
> the whole thing off.  She has absolutely no resepect for the citizens
> of this country that she works for.


Sheila Copps is betting on Canadians having a short memory. 

Soon, she probably reckons, this whole flap over what she said she'd do
and didn't do relative to scrapping the GST (as the Liberals promised they
would in the lead up to the '93 election) will be yesterday's news; the
newspapers carrying editorials such as the Toronto Star and The Globe and
Mail demanding that Copps resign will be wrapping fish or used to line the
tray filled with kitty-litter.

That's what she's probably hoping will happen; that her promise to
quit--one she repeated more than once--should the GST NOT be scrapped will
either be forgotten or, if not forgotten, either forgiven or diminish in
importance over time.

Personally, I don't think that will happen.  But we'll see. Who knows? Her
best ally, at the end of the day, may be the supposed apathy of average,
rank and file Canadians.

Orest Slepokura

> Zeljko 'Zed' Zidaric
> "Sound argument will have more weight with me than popular opinion."
>         - Cicero, Paradoxa, I, 8.

What sort of truth is it that needs protection?  - Auberon Waugh  *
The London Daily Telegraph, May 9, 1992                           *

From Mon Apr 29 09:36:48 PDT 1996
Article: 45954 of soc.culture.jewish
From: (Orest Slepokura)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.mideast,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.arabic,soc.culture.palestine,soc.culture.african.american,soc.culture.african,,alt.rap,soc.culture.islam,alt.religion.islam,alt.religion.christian,soc.culture.maghreb,soc.culture.lebanon,,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Israeli war crimminals should be brought to Justice
Date: 26 Apr 1996 21:06:06 GMT
Organization: CADVision
Lines: 60
References: <> <4l69fh$> <4l75lk$> <4l7rmu$> <> <> <> <>
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.0b30
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In article <>, "Fr. John W. Morris +"

> George A. Rozes Jr. wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > Whether you saw it or not, I am increasingly convinced of your total
> > ignorance of the facts of this horrible history.
> > Your comparison of Zionism with National Socialism is an affront and a
> > ridiculous statement.


It's not ridiculous at all. In fact, intimate geopolitical ties between
Israel and the apartheid regime in South Africa, based on a natural
affinity of one for the other, are very well-documented. For example:

When the South African prime minister, John Vorster, paid an official
visit to Israel in April, 1976, it naturally included a tour of Yad
Vashem, the Holocaust memorial in Jerusalem, where the late Yitzhak Rabin
and other Jewish officials invited Vorster, a onetime Nazi collaborator
and an implacable white supremacist, to pay homage to victims of the

Vorster remained 4 days in Israel brokering deals between his racist
regime and a number of Israeli institutions. Leslie and Andrew Cockburn
write [Dangerous Liaisons, Stoddart: Toronto,  1991, pp. 299-300]: "The
old Nazi sympathizer came away with bilateral agreements for commercial,
military and nuclear cooperation that would become the basis for future
relations between the two countries."

Orest Slepokura


> > PEACE??????
> You should check the news. The Palestinian Council voted today (April 24, 
> 1996) to change its manifesto to remove those portions calling for the 
> destruction of Israel and to recognize the right of Israel to exist. 
> > George, a devoted Orthodox Christian who wishes that priests would preach
> > Christ, and not politics.
> Orthodox Christians should also be concerned with peace and justice. The 
> Israelis are killing Orthodox Christians in Lebanon. 
> Fr. John +

What sort of truth is it that needs protection?  - Auberon Waugh  *
The London Daily Telegraph, May 9, 1992                           *

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