From rsavage@netcom.com Mon Oct 16 10:59:23 PDT 1995
Article: 4402 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
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From: rsavage@netcom.com (Rick Savage)
Subject: US Constitution- 4 "We the Bankers"
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The U.S. Constitution is for "them" and not "we the people."

--------------------
The CONSTITUTION Of The UNITED STATES
A Man Inspired Document!

by John Spencer


"NO HUMAN LAW IS OF ANY VALIDITY, IF
CONTRARY TO THE LAW OF GOD."
1 Blackstone Comm. 40


INTRODUCTION

	One of the great tactics of war is to use propaganda and fear to 
re-educate and alter the thinking of your enemies. Goliath used this 
tactic against the Israelites in the Old Testament. He caused so much 
fear in the camp of Israel by his words alone, that no one would go out 
to battle against him. 
	There is a large population in the United States who remember the words 
of Nakita Kruschev, "We will take over the United States without firing 
a shot. Your children will live under communism!" It is an old and time 
tested tactic. Many of us remember the "cold war" which allegedly ended 
with the breakup of the Soviet Union. But Kruschevwas right, the 
children of those living when he made his statement now live under 
communism in the United States. The take over of our nation however, 
began long ago. 
        One must respect an enemy who has the cunning to convince a nation 
that a new kind of law was being given to the American people; a law never 
before used in the history of the world. The basis of this new law was 
"WE THE PEOPLE". 
	It was not easy to convince the people in the 13 colonies that the 
Constitution of the United States was what was needed to make our nation 
successful. Many fought against it to the very end.  Benjamin Franklin 
when asked by a woman, "What kind of government have you given us?" 
Replied, "A Republic Madam, if you can keep it!" 
       When reading the definitions of this word Republic, confusion sets 
in to those who can still read. "Our Republic is not like those we read 
about in history, it is a Representative Republic", we are told. 
Imagine an enemy so cunning that it has been able to convince the 
American people they have been free, while at the same time enslaving us. 

       Our historians tell us the Constitution is "a God-inspired document." 
Our historians tell us that America was founded to be the "melting pot 
of the world." Modern language would define the United States as the 
"most cosmopolitan country in the world." It's true, we have more races 
of people living in this nation than perhaps any nation in the world. We 
have allowed, through the Constitution, every culture and religion on 
the face of the earth to come to America and flourish.

	Could it be that "the law of the land" is not what we have been told 
for all these years?  Were our founding fathers operating on biblical 
principles or were they led by "the love of money?" Is it possible that 
we have been sold a "bill of goods" by our enemies and been taken over 
by a cunning plan called the Constitution of the United States? Thinking 
we have been free for over 200 years, has our Constitution now made us 
slaves?

	You decide.


OUR FOUNDING FATHERS

      It is important to know the people behind any plan. During the 
last 20 years the media has attempted to slander the "good names" of 
many of our founding fathers. Quite an uproar resulted in the 
conservative community when Hollywood and television made some of these 
men look like perverts, rather than men of God who gave us our "law of 
the land." Their accounts of these men are mere speculation and it would 
be good to remember the words of Napoleon when reading and listening to 
any account of history. "History is nothing more than agreed upon lies."
      The word of God says, "The love of money, is the root of all evil" 
and "the borrower is slave to the lender." Our nation was founded upon the 
"love of money" and "debt". In 1716, the Mississippi River region of the 
United States was owned by France. John Law of Scotland established the 
General Bank in France. He issued through this bank, freshly printed 
paper called "banknotes". Yes, just like our Federal Reserve notes.The 
government of France made these banknotes legal tender and the bank 
flourished by lending these notes at interest. 
      In August 1717 , the General Bank absorbed the Louisiana Company. 
This new company was given the trading rights over the tremendous land 
area drained by the Mississippi, Ohio and Missouri Rivers and also 
trading rights in Canada. 
      In 1718 the General Bank changed its name to "Royal Bank" to give 
it a better image. The king of France guaranteed the bank notes issued 
by the Royal Bank. It was a true conglomerate.(1)
      Another  conglomerate was formed about this time called the 
"Western Company". This company was a rival to the Royal Bank and Louisiana 
Company. This new company absorbed the East India, Oriental and China 
Companies. The king of France gave this newly formed company the rights 
to "collect taxes" add a monopoly of the mint and coin issue under the 
condition they take over the national debt of France.(1) Sounds familiar 
doesn't it?
	The next thing to happen almost surpasses belief. The two companies 
merged! The price of the stock of the new company went out of sight. The 
merchants and farmers of France mortgaged their homes, farms and 
businesses to buy stock.(1)
	When John Law announced his plan to take the gold backing off the 
banknotes, long lines formed to exchange the banknotes for a meager 
supply of gold. When the gold ran out, the windows were closed and the 
homes, farms and businesses of the French people went to the usury 
bankers.(1) The bankers now had a toehold in America!
    	England assisted the 13 colonies of America in their war with the 
French and Indians. THEY LOANED THE COLONIES MONEY AT INTEREST TO FIGHT 
THIS WAR. In 1764 the Stamp Act was passed on the colonies to recoup 
some of this usury loaned money. The colonies revolted, they had no 
money to make repayment. In 1770 Virginia passed anti-slavery laws. The 
King of England gave instructions to His governor in Virginia that no 
such laws would be allowed. The King desperately needed his share of the 
slave trade profits to pay his own usury debts.(1)	
	By 1775, the balance of trade between the colonies of America and 
England was dramatic. The colonies owed English merchants L-4, 800, 000. 
The imposition of usury into this trade imbalance, made war with England 
inevitable. Unpayable debt was the cause. The colonies were enslaved. 
Virginia was in poverty.(1) Why? "The borrower is slave to the lender."
     The colonies were in a self inflicted and long planned bankers trap. In 
1776, the Declaration of Independence was written to seek independence 
>from  England. The colonies were heavily in debt and did not have the 
means to fight a war. What did they do? They borrowed money of course! 
>From whom did they borrow? Bankrupt France!
     The resulting "war" with England was "won" by the colonies, but while 
they won the war, the battle was lost, because "the borrower is slave to 
the lender." 
     Who were the men who led us to "victory" over England and forged a 
"new nation by writing the Constitution of the United States? A majority of 
them were ugh...lawyers. Forty of them held government bonds. Fourteen 
were land speculators. Twenty Four of them made their living lending 
money at interest. Eleven were involved in mercantile, manufacturing or 
shipping. Fifteen owned slaves. (2)
     Several of our founding fathers were in the back pockets of the usury 
bankers. In 1781, the private Bank of Pennsylvania was formed. It later 
became the Bank of North America. Among those who were able to get in on 
the original subscription of this bank were 1) Benjamin Franklin, 2) 
Thomas Jefferson, 3) Alexander Hamilton, 4) James Monroe, 5) John 
Jay, 6) John Paul Jones, 7) Commodore John Barry. In 1935, this bank 
took over the National Bank of the Danish W. Indies based in London."(1)
      In 1784, the Bank of New York was founded. This bank was a creation of 
Alexander Hamilton of New York whose backers were reputed to be the 
Rothchilds and the Bank of England.(1)
      In 1787, the Constitution was fittingly put together in Philadelphia, 
the home of the Bank of North America.(1) Hamilton and his backers wrote 
the original document for the Constitution to the dismay of most of the 
attendees of the meeting. Many were horrified that an entirely new kind 
of government was being formulated, when in fact they had been sent only 
to revise the Articles of Confederation. Patrick Henry, himself a 
lawyer, went home to fight against the Constitution. Like so many of our 
present day pieces of legislation, out of 62 delegates, only 39 signed 
the final document. Through the efforts of Hamilton, who wrote the 
majority of the Federalist Papers, the people were finally convinced 
that the Constitution would, if the people were "vigilant", safeguard 
their liberties. It was a great con job foisted upon a nation of 
people. The banks were in, the people and their properties were out!
	In 1789, Washington was elected President. He gave Hamilton the 
appointment as Secretary of the Treasury. The fox was now guarding the 
hen house. Two years later Hamilton created the First Bank of the United 
States. It was a private bank to which all of the new governments money 
was entrusted. The successor to this bank was the Second Bank of the 
United States. When it went bankrupt 50 years later, it was found that 
64% of the banks 25,000 shares were owned by foreigners.  Many were 
British!(1)
       In 1794, taxes forced Pennsylvania farmers to revolt. Washington 
did what all rulers do when a country is in debt to the bankers. He sent 
thousands of Federal troops to crush the rebellion. He did to his own 
people what he had led his people to revolt against in the war with 
England.(1) But then the bankers must be paid. (2) 
      The Erwin Rommel School of Law
 
WHAT DOES THE CONSTITUTION REALLY SAY?

	I remember watching a "MASH" television show years ago. An injured 
soldier was desperate to talk to someone about not being sent back into 
the war. One of the doctors said, "Would you like to speak to our 
priest?" The soldier replied, "No, I'm an athiest." The doctor 
responded, "I don't believe that." "It's true," said the soldier, "I 
swear to God!" One of the soldiers statements was not true and what we 
have been taught about the Constitution folks, is not true.
	Many people still harp that the Constitution is a God inspired 
document. Yet God is never mentioned in the Constitution. The people 
were so fearful of it that the 10 Amendments became mandatory, before 
their fears were quelled. But the die had already been cast. The 
flexible, easily changed Constitution was in place.
        Few people ever examine words for what they actually say. Most 
prefer to take the word of those they trust, rather than look for 
themselves.  It is a fatal mistake. The godless Constitution has become 
"our fearful taskmaster", as Washington  once  described government. 
        Have you ever wondered why the ability to alter the Constitution 
was important to us?  Article V allows both the Congress, whenever two 
thirds of both houses deem it necessary, or, on the Application of two 
thirds of the several states, to propose Amendments to the Constitution. 
The legal "experts" tell us it is important, because of social and 
economic changes that might take place. We can certainly understand how 
this may benefit power brokers, but how could it possibly benefit the 
people of this nation? It doesn't!
      The bankers were well taken care of with the Constitution. Article V1 
makes all previous debts as valid under the Constitution, as under the 
Confederation. This was for the bankers, not us. They even had a special 
International Debt Jurisdiction put into our original Constitution. It 
is found in Article 111, Section 2 and is called admiralty and maritime. 
This special international legal jurisdiction was for the bankers, not 
us. The bankers, mostly anti-christ, in Article V1, also made sure that 
none of their boys and girls in either house could be given any sort of 
religious test that might keep them out of office. Article 1, Section 
10, takes away the states ability to argue with the bankers and their 
contracts. This clause guaranteeing the obligation of Contracts was not 
put there for us, it was placed there for the bankers.
	There is a false notion in the Patriot community today, which is 
basically teaching that the Constitution of the United States has been 
suspended. There are some fine men and women teaching this concept. 
Consider this: The Constitution was put into place for international 
bankers. It allows the President, when two thirds of the Senate concurs, 
to make international treaties. The Senators were originally chosen by 
the individual state legislators and sent to Washington D.C. to 
represent states rights. [Article 1, Section 3] International treaties 
affect states rights and the people who live there. NAFTA IS A GOOD 
EXAMPLE! But in 1913, the  Constitution was amended to allow WE THE 
PEOPLE to elect the Senators! The 17th Amendment cleared the way for the 
removal of states rights and removed the only obstacle to easy 
ratification of treaties.    
	Since treaties become part of the Constitution and "the law of the 
land", do you think the enemies of freedom may have used this UNLIMITED 
AMENDMENT PROCESS to alter the course of our nation? Of course they did! 
Have you ever read the hundreds of treaties our Presidents and Senate 
have made with our nations? 
       Did you know that the United Nations is a Treaty Agreement and as 
a signatory nation the United States is bound by its dictates and that 
it is part of our Constitution? Yes, when any elected official takes 
his/her oath of office to uphold and defend the Constitution of the 
United States, that oath includes treaties!!! Let me quote it for you. 
       ARTICLE V1, paragraph 2, "THIS CONSTITUTION, AND THE LAWS OF THE 
UNITED STATES WHICH SHALL BE MADE IN PURSUANCE THEREOF; AND ALL TREATIES 
MADE, OR WHICH SHALL BE MADE, UNDER THE AUTHORITY OF THE UNITED STATES, 
SHALL BE THE SUPREME LAW OF THE LAND, AND THE JUDGES IN EVERY STATE 
SHALL BE BOUND THEREBY, ANYTHING IN THE CONSTITUTION OF LAWS OF ANY 
STATE TO THE CONTRARY NOTWITHSTANDING."
      There you are folks, treaties are the law of the land and every 
judge is bound by them! Someone has said, "Any law repugnant to the 
Constitution is invalid." Treaties are not repugnant to the 
Constitution. They may be repugnant to individual rights, but not the 
Constitution. All we have to do is go to their courts, in front of their 
judges and attempt to claim our rights! What a joke.
      Are treaties under Common Law, Equity or Admiralty and Maritime? 
Yes guessed right if you said Admiralty and Maritime. It is the same legal 
jurisdiction that our founding fathers discovered in their day. Remember 
the Declaration of Independence? "He [the King] has combined with others 
to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and 
unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended 
Legislation." Then our founding fathers placed this same foreign 
jurisdiction into our Constitution. Who for? The bankers. 
	
THE CONSTITUTION HAS NOT BEEN SUSPENDED!

       It is almost fruitless to discuss how the Constitution itself is 
the very source of tyranny that has beset our nation. It is an any "god" 
document and has been used by every religion in this nation and been 
successful. The Constitution is like water poured into a cavern. It 
levels itself with current religious thought, including atheism, 
homosexuality and the murder of the unborn. Yes, it also would protect 
Christianity, if Christians had the guts to defend their God as do the 
godless. 
       The final authority in this document is "WE THE PEOPLE" and We 
People worship every god under the sun of our Creator! This is SOP 
[Standard Operating Procedure] for God's people. When we "walk after our 
own thoughts", (Isaiah 65:2) God brings His wrath against us. 
      We truly deserve what God has brought against us for our sin against 
Him.  Our "law of the land" eliminated God and His laws, statues and 
judgements from the original colonies.  Yes, the laws of the thirteen 
colonies came straight out of the Word of God.  Verses were quoted in 
their entirety as the laws. It was obedience to these laws which brought 
about the great success of the colonies as a blessing from God. Henry 
was right! "What was the emergency that required such a radical change?" 
The colonies had just defeated the mightiest army on the face of the 
earth! Why did they need to change their laws?
      Some 80 years later, under the Constitution and as a curse from 
God, the grandchildren of our founding fathers killed each other by the 
hundreds of thousands in the ungodly Civil War.  Many Americans still  
brag about World War 1, 11, the Korean War, the Vietnam War, the 
invasion of Panama and the Gulf War, never knowing that had our founding 
fathers retained the law of God as "the law of the land", most, if not 
all of these wars would not have occurred.  
      We now live in a nation that has more murders, rapes, etc., than 
any nation on earth. What kind of prosperity would prevail in our nation 
today if God's law had been honored and obeyed for the last 200 years? 
Only God knows, but He is a forgiving God. He asks only that we repent 
[change our mind] and return to Him and His laws.

THE ROMAN EMPIRE

      Much history has been written about the mighty Roman Empire. What is 
not generally known about this empire is that the original "Roman Civil 
Law" was a codification of Bible laws and precepts! Like the original 13 
colonies of our nation,  Rome became very prosperous under these laws. 
Over the years, this law was altered and replaced. As a result, the 
people became debauched, the government  became corrupt and Rome  became 
the most  cosmopolitan [racially, religiously and culturally mixed] city 
in the world! It is no more an empire. Before it was over, the people of 
the empire had accepted homosexuality as an alternative lifestyle and 
indeed, like the United States today, many of its leaders were 
homosexuals. The likeness of the Roman Empire to the great empire of the 
United States is startling. Someone has written, "If there is one thing 
we learn from history, it is that we do not learn from history."       
      Charles Weisman, in his book "A Handbook of Bible Law", states on 
Page 11,  "A rather recent doctrine which theologians and preachers have 
been espousing is that the laws laid down in the Old Testament were only a 
temporary arrangement and that the advent of Jesus Christ made them all 
null and void. This false doctrine has a great appeal to the carnal 
nature of man, as it relieves him of responsibility allowing him to 
completely act according to his will rather than the will of God. Yet 
when men act according to their will or carnal nature, committing 
adultery, theft, drunkenness, etc., these same preachers in their 
hypocrisy start to preach against the "sin" they are committing. What is 
sin but "the transgression of the law" (1 John 3:4). If one says there 
is no law that we are under then they are saying there is no sin, and 
they "make God a liar" (1 John 1:10)." This same type of theology 
eventually won out in the Roman Empire. It was a prevailing theology in 
the time of Christ. It is a prevailing theology in the United States 
today and if not corrected, will result in the further destruction of 
our great country. 

GOD'S LAW FOR CIVIL LAW

	The balance of this study will focus on what God's word 
says about the establishment of civil government. Specifically, we 
will cover the selection and election of civil officers and judges. 
The success of this process is always based upon self government or 
individual obedience to God's law. The apostle Paul captured the 
essence of a Godly civil government in Romans 13:4. "For he (civil 
officer) is a minister of God to you for good...to execute wrath 
upon him that does evil." 

RULE NUMBER 1

	"Moreover thou shall provide out of all the people able 
men, such as fear God, men of truth, hating covetousness, and place 
such over them, to be rulers of thousands, rulers of hundreds, 
rulers of fifties...(Exodus 18:21). The qualifications are very 
simple. To hold public office or trust an individual must: (1) Be 
an able man. (2) Must fear God. (3) Must be a man of truth. (4) 
Must hate coveteousness. Notice the "outward appearance" of a man 
is not mentioned. Neither is his ability to sway the masses with 
his rhetoric. These men must desire truth and justice, rather than 
the prestige of office. They are to fear God, rather than other men 
or special interest groups. 
      Few, if any men with these qualifications run for public office today. 
The media would slaughter them and most non-thinking Christians would 
not vote for them anyway. Yet these are God's qualifications to hold 
public office. Think for a moment. Why would God have eliminated these 
qualifications, because of the advent of Jesus Christ? It doesn't make 
sense does it? Well, God did not eliminate these qualifications. Our 
public office holders are all of  the evidence we need to show us how 
wrong the preachers are today.
	Thinking about these qualifications would be a start to our return to 
God and His law. The Constitution will not save us, only our Holy God 
and our obedience to His law can bring this about.  "He is our King, He 
is our only lawgiver, only He will save us..."  

John Spencer 

-- 
 _____________________Rick Savage ______________________
|   For unique political commentary & Christian views        Rick Savage    | 
|     Anonymous FTP:  ftp.netcom.com  - pub/SF/SFA           PO Box 5251    |
|   To obtain files by e-mail write me for help file       Denver, CO 80217 |
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From rsavage@netcom.com Sun Oct 22 11:52:06 PDT 1995
Article: 11896 of alt.revisionism
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
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From: rsavage@netcom.com (Rick Savage)
Subject: The 9 Million Holocaust
Message-ID: 
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The Nine Million Holocaust
 
Toronto - 
   "Deliberate Allied policy killed at least 9 million Germans after 
World War II - most of them women and children, author James Bacque says 
in a book soon to be published.  ...  In the new book, called 'Crimes and 
Mercies,' Bacque maintains that between 1946 and 1950 'the four wartime 
Allies agreed on a policy that deliberately exterminated at least 9 
million Germans.'  ... The basis for this claim, he says, lies in 
previously secret Russian and US papers ... He believes the high 
mortality stemmed from three factors:  deaths of Germans in flight as 
they were expelled from their former homes in Eastern Europe, deaths of 
prisoners in POW camps and deaths in Germany due to Allied policies.  
'The Allies refused to allow the Germans to fish, to make fertilizer, to 
earn money to import food, to make oils for tractors and farm implements, 
to make steel for farm implements, to buy medicine such as penicillin.  
They refused to allow foreign countries to donate food to save the lives 
of children,'  he said.  Bacque said Allied authorities falsified 
statistics to hide death tolls."  
    - Toronto Globe and Mail, copied from The Christian News, p.3, 
July 31, 1995

-- 
 _____________________Rick Savage ____________________
|  For unique political commentary & Christian views     Rick Savage      | 
|   SFA on WWW:  http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/           P.O. Box 5251     |
|    SFA by FTP:  ftp.netcom.com/pub/SF/SFA       Denver, CO 80217 (u)SA  |


From rsavage@netcom.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:02 PDT 1995
Article: 4965 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.cyberstore.ca!math.ohio-state.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!rsavage
From: rsavage@netcom.com (Rick Savage)
Subject: The 9 Million Holocaust
Message-ID: 
Keywords: Holocaust,Bacque,Crimes and Mercies,Germans
Organization: SFA> http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/
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The Nine Million Holocaust
 
Toronto - 
   "Deliberate Allied policy killed at least 9 million Germans after 
World War II - most of them women and children, author James Bacque says 
in a book soon to be published.  ...  In the new book, called 'Crimes and 
Mercies,' Bacque maintains that between 1946 and 1950 'the four wartime 
Allies agreed on a policy that deliberately exterminated at least 9 
million Germans.'  ... The basis for this claim, he says, lies in 
previously secret Russian and US papers ... He believes the high 
mortality stemmed from three factors:  deaths of Germans in flight as 
they were expelled from their former homes in Eastern Europe, deaths of 
prisoners in POW camps and deaths in Germany due to Allied policies.  
'The Allies refused to allow the Germans to fish, to make fertilizer, to 
earn money to import food, to make oils for tractors and farm implements, 
to make steel for farm implements, to buy medicine such as penicillin.  
They refused to allow foreign countries to donate food to save the lives 
of children,'  he said.  Bacque said Allied authorities falsified 
statistics to hide death tolls."  
    - Toronto Globe and Mail, copied from The Christian News, p.3, 
July 31, 1995

-- 
 _____________________Rick Savage ____________________
|  For unique political commentary & Christian views     Rick Savage      | 
|   SFA on WWW:  http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/           P.O. Box 5251     |
|    SFA by FTP:  ftp.netcom.com/pub/SF/SFA       Denver, CO 80217 (u)SA  |


From rsavage@netcom.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:52 PDT 1995
Article: 7007 of alt.politics.white-power
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.reston.ans.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom.com!rsavage
From: rsavage@netcom.com (Rick Savage)
Subject: The 9 Million Holocaust
Message-ID: 
Organization: SFA> http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
Date: Sat, 21 Oct 1995 17:17:16 GMT
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Sender: rsavage@netcom5.netcom.com

The Nine Million Holocaust
 
Toronto - 
   "Deliberate Allied policy killed at least 9 million Germans after 
World War II - most of them women and children, author James Bacque says 
in a book soon to be published.  ...  In the new book, called 'Crimes and 
Mercies,' Bacque maintains that between 1946 and 1950 'the four wartime 
Allies agreed on a policy that deliberately exterminated at least 9 
million Germans.'  ... The basis for this claim, he says, lies in 
previously secret Russian and US papers ... He believes the high 
mortality stemmed from three factors:  deaths of Germans in flight as 
they were expelled from their former homes in Eastern Europe, deaths of 
prisoners in POW camps and deaths in Germany due to Allied policies.  
'The Allies refused to allow the Germans to fish, to make fertilizer, to 
earn money to import food, to make oils for tractors and farm implements, 
to make steel for farm implements, to buy medicine such as penicillin.  
They refused to allow foreign countries to donate food to save the lives 
of children,'  he said.  Bacque said Allied authorities falsified 
statistics to hide death tolls."  
    - Toronto Globe and Mail, copied from The Christian News, p.3, 
July 31, 1995

-- 
 _____________________Rick Savage ____________________
|  For unique political commentary & Christian views     Rick Savage      | 
|   SFA on WWW:  http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/           P.O. Box 5251     |
|    SFA by FTP:  ftp.netcom.com/pub/SF/SFA       Denver, CO 80217 (u)SA  |


From rsavage@netcom.com Sun Oct 22 12:24:14 PDT 1995
Article: 16626 of alt.conspiracy
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
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From: rsavage@netcom.com (Rick Savage)
Subject: Re: The 9 Million Holocaust
Message-ID: 
Organization: SFA> http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
References:  <46b6av$msr@homer.alpha.net>
Date: Sat, 21 Oct 1995 16:49:51 GMT
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Sender: rsavage@netcom5.netcom.com

: >   "Deliberate Allied policy killed at least 9 million Germans after 
: >World War II - most of them women and children, author James Bacque says 
: >in a book soon to be published.  


John Q. Public (capmicro@execpc.com) wrote:
: Hey, that's great news!
: I guess the Jews really didn't have it bad, after all.  I just don't
: know why folks are so down on those poor, misunderstood Nazis....

    Translation=  kill Jews, suffer, pay for and never live it down for 
centuries.  Kill Germans:  get a reward.  

    Fascism isn't dead!  It calls itself "politically correct" today.
-- 
 _____________________Rick Savage ____________________
|  For unique political commentary & Christian views     Rick Savage      | 
|   SFA on WWW:  http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/           P.O. Box 5251     |
|    SFA by FTP:  ftp.netcom.com/pub/SF/SFA       Denver, CO 80217 (u)SA  |


From rsavage@netcom.com Sun Oct 22 12:25:13 PDT 1995
Article: 5059 of alt.skinheads
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads
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From: rsavage@netcom.com (Rick Savage)
Subject: The 9 Million Holocaust
Message-ID: 
Organization: SFA> http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
Date: Sat, 21 Oct 1995 05:27:20 GMT
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Sender: rsavage@netcom9.netcom.com

The Nine Million Holocaust
 
Toronto - 
   "Deliberate Allied policy killed at least 9 million Germans after 
World War II - most of them women and children, author James Bacque says 
in a book soon to be published.  ...  In the new book, called 'Crimes and 
Mercies,' Bacque maintains that between 1946 and 1950 'the four wartime 
Allies agreed on a policy that deliberately exterminated at least 9 
million Germans.'  ... The basis for this claim, he says, lies in 
previously secret Russian and US papers ... He believes the high 
mortality stemmed from three factors:  deaths of Germans in flight as 
they were expelled from their former homes in Eastern Europe, deaths of 
prisoners in POW camps and deaths in Germany due to Allied policies.  
'The Allies refused to allow the Germans to fish, to make fertilizer, to 
earn money to import food, to make oils for tractors and farm implements, 
to make steel for farm implements, to buy medicine such as penicillin.  
They refused to allow foreign countries to donate food to save the lives 
of children,'  he said.  Bacque said Allied authorities falsified 
statistics to hide death tolls."  
    - Toronto Globe and Mail, copied from The Christian News, p.3, 
July 31, 1995

-- 
 _____________________Rick Savage ____________________
|  For unique political commentary & Christian views     Rick Savage      | 
|   SFA on WWW:  http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/           P.O. Box 5251     |
|    SFA by FTP:  ftp.netcom.com/pub/SF/SFA       Denver, CO 80217 (u)SA  |


From rsavage@netcom.com Sun Oct 22 12:29:23 PDT 1995
Article: 61527 of soc.culture.german
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german
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From: rsavage@netcom.com (Rick Savage)
Subject: The 9 Million Holocaust
Message-ID: 
Organization: SFA> http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1]
Date: Sat, 21 Oct 1995 17:30:21 GMT
Lines: 27
Sender: rsavage@netcom5.netcom.com

The Nine Million Holocaust
 
Toronto - 
   "Deliberate Allied policy killed at least 9 million Germans after 
World War II - most of them women and children, author James Bacque says 
in a book soon to be published.  ...  In the new book, called 'Crimes and 
Mercies,' Bacque maintains that between 1946 and 1950 'the four wartime 
Allies agreed on a policy that deliberately exterminated at least 9 
million Germans.'  ... The basis for this claim, he says, lies in 
previously secret Russian and US papers ... He believes the high 
mortality stemmed from three factors:  deaths of Germans in flight as 
they were expelled from their former homes in Eastern Europe, deaths of 
prisoners in POW camps and deaths in Germany due to Allied policies.  
'The Allies refused to allow the Germans to fish, to make fertilizer, to 
earn money to import food, to make oils for tractors and farm implements, 
to make steel for farm implements, to buy medicine such as penicillin.  
They refused to allow foreign countries to donate food to save the lives 
of children,'  he said.  Bacque said Allied authorities falsified 
statistics to hide death tolls."  
    - Toronto Globe and Mail, copied from The Christian News, p.3, 
July 31, 1995

-- 
 _____________________Rick Savage ____________________
|  For unique political commentary & Christian views     Rick Savage      | 
|   SFA on WWW:  http://www.nilenet.com/~tmw/           P.O. Box 5251     |
|    SFA by FTP:  ftp.netcom.com/pub/SF/SFA       Denver, CO 80217 (u)SA  |


From rs241@delphi.com Tue Oct 31 09:00:26 PST 1995
Article: 13263 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!elvis.delphi.com!news.delphi.com!usenet
From: rs241@delphi.com
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Burning Pits
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 19:25:43 -0500
Organization: Delphi (info@delphi.com email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 23
Message-ID: 
References: <438r23$b1k@news.dknet.dk>      <-C-VmOev18eL065yn@login.dknet 
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1f.delphi.com
X-To: Jamie McCarthy 

Jamie McCarthy  writes:
 
>>   Though John Ball does not specifically designate the "pit" behind KII as
>> a "mark"  drawn of aerial photos, he does believe the "pits" near KIII are
>> drawn there.  Since the pits in both locations look alike, I would hazard a
>> guess that the pit near KII is also a CIA enhancement of the original 
>> imagery.  In any case, there is no smoke eminating from these locations in
>> any of the air photographs.
 
 
>Does John Ball explain why or how someone would have forged a photo
>that sat in archives until the late 70s?  A photo that was filed
>under the military photographs of the Monowitz facility, and whose
>worth to Holocaust historians was only discovered by researchers
>more than thirty years after the war was over?
>
>No, I didn't think so.
>
 
No I do not believe that Mr. Ball explains who placed the marks on
Krema II & III.  I myself would not be surprised that the CIA
during the 1970's placed these marks after the publication of
Dr. Butz's book.


From rs241@delphi.com Tue Oct 31 09:00:27 PST 1995
Article: 13266 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!elvis.delphi.com!news.delphi.com!usenet
From: rs241@delphi.com
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 19:34:37 -0500
Organization: Delphi (info@delphi.com email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 12
Message-ID: 
References:  <45kteq$hp8@nimitz.fibr.net>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1f.delphi.com
X-To: Daniel Keren 

Daniel Keren  writes:
 
>
>As I posted sometime ago, my brother and I a few years ago found a
>rather ugly dead rodent in our parents' back yard. For some reason,
>we decided to burn it. We doused it with gasoline and set it on
>fire. It sure like hell didn't "explode".
>
 
How much did this rodent weigh?  How much gasoline did you use on this
rodent?  I do not believe that Mr. Legace claimed that human bodies
would explode in an outdoor cremation.


From rs241@delphi.com Tue Oct 31 09:00:29 PST 1995
Article: 13268 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!elvis.delphi.com!news.delphi.com!usenet
From: rs241@delphi.com
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 20:09:01 -0500
Organization: Delphi (info@delphi.com email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 58
Message-ID: 
References:  <45kteq$hp8@nimitz.fibr.net>  <4627e4$cge@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>  <46d6b3$119u@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1f.delphi.com
X-To: John Morris 

John Morris  writes:
 
>And as I have stated here many times, I am curious to know why Lagace
>was brought from Calgary-more than 3000 kilometers from
>Toronto--rather than a crematory operator from Toronto. It is possible
>that no one in Toronto wished to testify for the defense, but I
>suspect that Lagace may have been a pliable witness who would not
>volunteer information about how many bodies you could put in one
>retort if you didn't use a coffin, or if you weren't legally
>constrained not to mix the ashes, or if your weren't legally
>constrained to reduce the coffin completely.
 
 
 
 
On page 271
of Barbara Kulaszaka's Did Six Million Reallly Die?  Report of the Evidence in
the Canadian "False News" Trial of Ernst Zu"ndel-1988, he did state to the
prosecution that he did not have experience  in cremating bodies where
there was no legal restricitions.
 
 
 
On page 268, Mr. Legace claims that people with moderat amount
of fat are easier to cremate than thin ones.  He had also claimed
that fat is ignited during the early stages of the cremation
process.  If this is true then, Mr. Legace had helped bolster
some exterminationist claims regarding the cremation of human
bodies.  Since you and others continue to question his political motives,
then maybe I should not accept his claims that are considered
favorable to you.  WOULD YOU AGREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


From rs241@delphi.com Tue Oct 31 09:00:29 PST 1995
Article: 13281 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!elvis.delphi.com!news.delphi.com!usenet
From: rs241@delphi.com
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 21:10:57 -0500
Organization: Delphi (info@delphi.com email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 31
Message-ID: 
References:  <471g79$kui@dns.enter.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1g.delphi.com
X-To: Yale F. Edeiken 

Yale F. Edeiken  writes:
 
>   Be serious.  Do you know what a "flashpoint" is?  If a body were to reach a 
>flashpoint it would ignite whether or not there was a flame.  It happens with fat 
>all the time.  Ask any cook.
>
 
According to page 269 of Barbara Kulaszka's book: Did Six Million Really
Die?  Report of the Evidence in the Canadian "False News" Trial of Ernst
Zu"ndel-1988, Mr. Legace claimed that a body would ignite if the furnace
was not cooled down.  I did not come across any statements where Mr.
Legace claimed that the bodies would explode if introduced
into the oven before it had cooled down.  He may have said it since
the book I am using is an abridged version of Ernst Zundel's trial.
 
 
 
If Mr. Legace did make that claim, then it was edited out by Ms.
Kulaszka.  I don't know if the exploding body thesis has any basis,
but in certain circumstances it may occur.  For example, a body that
has been left in the open will begin to bloat with liquids and (or)
gases.  If this body is introduced into an extremely hot oven, it may
cause an explosion.  This is hypothetical on my part.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


From rs241@delphi.com Tue Oct 31 09:00:30 PST 1995
Article: 13284 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.cyberstore.ca!van-bc!io.org!chi-news.cic.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!elvis.delphi.com!news.delphi.com!usenet
From: rs241@delphi.com
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: VERGASSUNGSKELLER  =  Carburetion Cellar
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 21:25:01 -0500
Organization: Delphi (info@delphi.com email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 17
Message-ID: 
References: <812427584snz@abaron.demon.co.uk> <44nbqe$mgo@rover.ucs.ualberta.ca> <812705164snz@abaron.demon.co.uk> <455ppn$hro@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca> <816651696wnr@stumpy.demon.co.uk> <467fl8$vqq@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1g.delphi.com
X-To: John Morris 

John Morris  writes:
 
>Leuchter's description is not the most imaginative interpretation of
>"Vergasungskeller," by far. I understand that Robert Faurisson, and
>later Arthur Butz, took it to mean that they were using the morgue to
>extract gas from coke. Personally, I've never understood why a morgue
>should be used to "carburet" coke when the Buna plant was close by
>"gasifying" coal, nor have I understood HOW you would "gasify" coke,
>since coke is the one of the end products of extracting gases, oil,
>and tar from coal.
 
 
 
 
Please look up producer gas.  This is prepared from coke.
You may want to look up coke gas, sometimes it is located with
coal gas in certain references.


From rs241@delphi.com Tue Oct 31 09:00:31 PST 1995
Article: 13285 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.cyberstore.ca!math.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!chi-news.cic.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!elvis.delphi.com!news.delphi.com!usenet
From: rs241@delphi.com
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 95 21:16:21 -0500
Organization: Delphi (info@delphi.com email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 31
Message-ID: 
References:  <46v6tl$dkk@nimitz.fibr.net> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1g.delphi.com
X-To: MORRISON  KEITH MURRAY 

MORRISON  KEITH MURRAY  writes:
 
>There has, to my knowledge, never been a case of a body exploding by its own 
>devices in a fire.  There have been, as Mr. Mazel indicates, thusands of 
>people who die in fires all the time, none of whom have been found scattered 
>all over the room in little chunks because they exploded.  I have seen 
>reports of fires in conditions that would make a furnace seem like Club Med 
>but those reports, when fatalities have occurred, have never stated that 
>bodies have exploded, nor is there any evidence for this being the case.
 
 
 
 
 
 
I have found no evidence that Mr. Legace claimed that the bodies would
explode in a crematory oven if it is too hot.  You are mixing an
open cremation with a cremation inside of a furnace.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

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