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Shofar FTP Archive File: people/m/mcvay.ken/2002/defamation-issue.0702

From: John Morris 
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Ken McVay:  Child Porn does *Not* Exist
Organization: at University of Alberta
Reply-To: John.Morris@UAlberta.CA
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References:  <20020718022705.28=>
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Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:11:34 GMT
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In <> in alt.revisionism,
on 18 Jul 2002 06:27:05 GMT, nationalfront88@aol.comNoHoaxes
(National Front) wrote:

> >From: John Morris John.Morris@UAlberta.CA=20
> >Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 20:20:22 GMT

> >(National Front) wrote:

> >> >From: "Patrick Keenan"
> >> >Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 12:11:27 -0400

> >> >"National Front"  wrote in
> >> >message
> >> >>

> >> >> Ken McVay:  "I am weary of seeing the issue of 'child porn'
> >> >> blown out of proportion (I've been on and around the Net
> >> >> since 1988, and have *yet* to come across anything I'd
> >> >> consider 'child porn.' I've seen photos of naked children,
> >> >> but then I've got some of those in my family photo album, and
> >> >> fail to see the harm, or any great moral danger to our
> >> >> society)." =20

> >> >>     Jesus H. Moses on a raft, please save our children from
> >> >> moral degenerates like Kenneth N. McVay and other mad dog
> >> >> sick bastards.  These are the type of people who support The
> >> >> Holocaust=AE=A9 Industry.  Does anyone know if Ken McVay is a
> >> >> registered sex offender? If so, is that why he abandoned
> >> >> America (aside from
> >> >> his excuse that he wanted to homestead land)?

> >> >>      Inquiring minds want to know.

> >> >Try going to another school that teaches reading comprehension.
> >> >  You're certainly not learning that where you've been going. =20

> >>      Even John Morris knew McVay was referring to child porn on
> >> the Internet.  =20

> >"I am weary of seeing the issue of 'child porn' blown out of
> >proportion."

> >Take a "duh" from petty cash.

> >> How do you interpret McVay's statement?

> >The way I read the quote, McVay says he has not viewed any child
> >pornography.

>      That's your interpretation, but it is not an accurate one.=20
> McVay clearly writes that he has yet to come across anything that
> he would consider child porn.  Then he contrasts the photos of
> naked children on the Internet to those commonly found in family
> photo albums, which I agree does not violate the norm. =20

Actually, you lying little smear artist, he *compares* the pictures
he's seen on the Internet to pictures in a family album:

  I've seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of
  those in my family photo album.

Now go away, and don't come back until you learn to tell the truth.
> >>  I'll be around decades after McVay is
> >> gone and will be able to point out that his "work" is tainted
> >> with his failure "to see the harm, or any great moral danger to
> >> our society."

> >In what?  Pictures of children like the Coppertone Kid?

>      No, photos of naked children uploaded to the Internet, which
> is what McVay was obviously talking about (you're the one who used
> the red herring of the Coppertone Kid -- and you still are).

The Coppertone Kid has been uploaded to the Internet.  Not just the
famous painting, but that actual naked kid.  So what do you mean red
herring?  How do you know what Ken McVay has seen or not seen?  You
don't.  You just like to pretend that you know so that you run with
your little smear.

>  Remember that statement about being "on
> and around the Net since 1988, and have *yet* to come across
> anything [McVay would] consider 'child porn.'"?  That's one reason
> why I question PK's reading comprehension skills    =20

Oh?  You've seen child porn on the Internet?  I've had access to the
Internet for nearly as long as McVay, and *I've* never seen child
pornography.  I don't know how you'd come across it unless you were
looking for it.  Maybe Detective Michael should be investgating you.

Isn't starting a witch hunt fun?

> >>  With all of these
> >> child abductions making the news and the FBI stating these baby
> >> rapers usually collect child porn, I *do* see the harm and great
> >> moral danger to society.   =20

> >Please demonstrate that Ken McVay collects child pornography.  If
> >you can't do that, then all you've got is a sexual smear.

> >And, I submit, that's all you've got: the lowest form of
> >filth-mongering.
>      I never said McVay collects child pornography and you know it.

Then why did you bring up child rapists as collectors of child porn?=20
Why did you call Ken McVay a moral degenerate?  Why do you wonder out
loud whether he left the United States because he was a registered
sex offender?  Were those just idle thoughts that escaped to your
keyboard before they died of loneliness?

You've been flinging around a lot of very serious allegations.  Maybe
you don't know how serious.  Maybe you should search the law websites
to get some idea about what constitutes criminal defamation.

> McVay
> wants a government hands-off policy regarding the Internet to the
> extreme that Web sites hosting photos of naked children uploaded to
> the Internet should not be censored.

Does he say that?  Or does his original quote suggest anti-hate
efforts may be responding to hysteria in the same way as anti-porn

Look at the original quote in context for a change:

  Perhaps one thing that I should note, because authors
  often sensationalize the hatemongering on the Net, is that,
  for all their vitriol, these people are only a tiny handful
  of the 30-40 million users on the Internet. I am weary of
  seeing their activities blown out of proportion, as I am
  weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
  proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and
  have yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn."=20

Anti-hate crusaders (such as myself) can overreact to the apparent
numbers of hate sites because we go looking for them.  But compared
to the total size of the web, hate sites are neglible.  Certainly
from my perspective as long-time user of the 'net child porn sites
are non-existent.  One hears about child porn on the Internet, but
one never sees it unless one seeks it out.

Of course the trade should be stopped, but the only reason one hears
about it is because of successful police investigations.

> I actually agree with McVay that the government should not
> regulate the Internet with the exception of those whom are too
> young to speak for themselves:  children.

Naturally.  But McVay doesn't say that the government should take a
hands-off attitude towards child porngraphy.  He talking specifically
about the people playing you for a sucker:
  We are dealing with a few dozen cynical activists, trolling
  the net for money and cannon fodder. Even if all of the
  estimated 20,000 or so facists on the continent became active
  on the Net, they still would represent no more than a small
  ripple in the internet pond. In spite of that, the press
  continues to sensationalize their presence, using it as an
  excuse for black headlines, and the Canadian and American
  governments dutifully blather about "controlling the
  Internet," presumably for "our own good."

  Speaking for myself, I wish to make it crystal clear that I
  don't want to be "protected" by government thought police.
  Everywhere we turn, governments are pushing and prodding
  our lives, and I'm far more concerned about them attacking
  the Net, and thus our freedom, than I am about watching the
  Nazis do it.

In other words, he is saying that people like you should be free to
mouth off about their politics all they want.  And what do you do,
you ingrate?  You try to smear him as a pederast.=20

> >>      McVay's legacy will forever be tarnished.

> >"Tarnishing" seems to be your forte.  Obviously, you can't answer
> >the work.

>      McVay is the one who told me to crank up my anti-child porn
> crusade again, remember?  Careful what you wish for.

And total fucktard that you are, you thought that meant you should
make up a story about Ken McVay.
>      By the by, I don't have to "tarnish" McVay because he
> tarnished himself by making those weird comments.  I am merely
> going to remind people what he said and the context he said it in
> -- without the red herring of the Coppertone Kid. =20

Okay.  Suit yourself.  But you just told me that you find it hard to
believe that someone couldn't be on the 'net for very long and not
come across child porngraphy.  Sounds like the voice of experience to

Should the police be looking closely at your hard drive?

>  I predict McVay will not be conducting any more Internet
> interviews in the near future.=20

I predict that you're not going to be airing out your empty head on
this subject too much more.

- --=20
 John Morris                                
 at University of Alberta  

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