The Nizkor Project: Remembering the Holocaust (Shoah)

Shofar FTP Archive File: people/k/kleim.milton/1993/self-description.1993

Archive/File: fascism/dossier kleim.milton
Last-Modified: 1994/01/10

Kleim, Milton John Jr.
Neo-Nazi posting to UseNet news groups alt.skinheads and alt.revisionism; a
self-described racist and anti-semite. Note Milton's avoidance of questions
related to his stated beliefs - although he has been repeatedly asked to
provide references supporting his assertion that the Holocaust is a "myth,"
Mr. Kleim refuses to do so.

Path: oneb!!destroyer!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads
Subject: Re: ANA relay
Message-ID: <>
Date: 5 Nov 93 16:38:57 -0600
References: <>
Lines: 96

From the NS Bulletin: Official Newsletter of the New Order, Second
Quarter 1993 --

"'Holocaust' ... Or Hitler?"

Represented here are polar opposites, a dichotomy which defines the
overriding issue of modern time.  For involved are two totally dif-
ferent perceptions, two opposed outlooks, two irreconcilable sets of
values -- one Jewish and one Aryan.

The destiny of the former is the Old Order.  The destiny of the 
other is a New Order.

On November 9, 1989, a remarkable event took place.  Right there in
full view of the Bunker site where our Fuehrer fulfilled his earthly
mission and gave his life, the Berlin Wall collapsed, and the Old
Order entered upon its final, downward phase!

Today that order stands completely bankrupt.  It is incapable of
solving any of the great problems of modern society -- political,
social, economic, ecological or racial.  Morally and spiritually
it is an utter failure.

The only moral principle it can offer is "The Holocaust" and an 
invitation to take a guilt trip and grovel eternally before those 
who have chosen themselves for world rule.  In other words, it has
nothing better to offer than a monstrous lie and an obscene swin-

The Jews are now trying to foist this lie off as the central event
of human history.  With their control of the mass media, the churches
and the educational curricula, they have sought to make it the focus
of contemporary myth, ideology and all political correctness.

The purpose, of course, is to exert moral blackmail by instilling
in the goy a sense of perpetual guilt and shame.  Without such moral
extortion, these parasites would never be able to procure their vic-
tim's carte blanche support for the State of Israel and the Jewish
agenda.  And without such support, they could never realize their
age-old megalomaniac dream of global domination.

As National Socialists, we reject such a perverse, Judeocentric
outlook.  We reject its moral swindle.  We reject its pathological
designs to dominate and enslave the non-Jewish world.

For us the central event of history is not the so-called "Holo-
caust", but the advent of Adolf Hitler.  For it was he who had a
better idea and who challenged us.  His challenge calls for Aryans
to become aware and to liberate themselves.  It calls for them to
stop wallowing in an alien sty of guilt and shame.  It calls for
them to become morally and spiritually renewed.  It calls for them
to pursue their high destiny.

And so the issue today is between an alien myth called the "Holo-
caust" and the reality of Adolf Hitler.  This issue has been de-
termined, not by us, but by the adversary -- that is to say, by
those who wield dominant power and influence in the modern world.

Make no mistake: On this issue no one will be allowed to remain
neutral.  No one will be let off the hook.  Whether one likes it
or not, everyone will be compelled to stand up and be counted.  In
Jewish eyes, either you recognize their "Holocaust," or you are an
"anti-Semite" and a "Nazi."  In other words, either you are against
Hitler, or you are for him.

And indeed, you should be for him!  For his name means an end to 
such vile, outrageous parasitism.  His name means an end to alien 
lies and corruption.  His name means liberation, hope and sanity.
It means a bright new day, a better future for this planet.

For Hitler or against him?  How will you be counted?  Are you 
going to grovel and bow down before the yoke of Zion and continue
to worship Jews?  Or are you going to stand tall and pursue your 
true destiny as an Aryan?

The hour of decision is here -- now, today.  "HOLOCAUST" OR HIT-
LER -- which is it going to be?  That is the question.

-- by the Honorable MATT KOEHL, Commander of the New Order

   For further information, write:  New Order
                                    P.O. Box 27486
                                    Milwaukee, WI  53227


The above editorial is provided as a public service by the Aryan News
Agency.  It does not necessarily reflect the views of the ANA or the

-- Milton John Kleim, Jr.
   First degree Thought Criminal
   ADL-registered anti-Semite

Article 3300 of alt.skinheads:
Path: oneb!!!!!!emory!gatech!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads
Subject: Slowly, We Grow Stronger
Message-ID: <>
Date: 7 Nov 93 18:48:02 -0600
Lines: 52

Hitler and the NSDAP would have had no chance of achieving their
righteous aims if the corrupt political system of Weimar, and the
evil economic system of the world, had not sunk into chaos.

So it is with our movement today.  The Jewish Occupational Govern-
ment that dictates orders to the Sabbath Goiim serving as admini-
strators for America and Canada will wield power proportionally to
the level of psychological enthrallment that can be maintained over
the Aryan race in North America.

Should JOG lose a substantial proportion, or perhaps even most of
of its manipulatory ability, the White self-determination movement
will be provided with an opportunity for great expansion.  JOG 
cannot prevent this eventuality.

The economic conditions of North America, and the World, continue
to degenerate, despite the lies spewed out by the ruling elite's
economists.  The working class knows this; deceit will not dispel
their knowledge.

What would an economic collapse mean to an inhabitant of America?
Obviously, great hardship.  Who would these people look to for
direction?  The same corrupt puppets who helped lead them to 
disaster?  Certainly not.  White people by the millions would soon
take seriously the message espoused by the National Socialist
movement.  Once their expected comforts of daily life evaporate,
the Jewish-inspired mythology embedded in American culture, cen-
tered on "Shoah business," will become irrelevant, as it should

The National Socialist movement will be able to provide the leader-
ship needed for severe distress.  Our detractors may laugh at our
present composition, our unpolished ideas, and our lack of train-
ing, but let them remember that defenders of the filth called the
Weimar Republik laughed at Hitler too.  We move forward; learning,
improving, moving -- however slowly -- towards expertise.  We will
be prepared to offer guidance and a sense of direction when Destiny
provides the moment.  We will answer the call, and fulfill every

National Socialism will be ready, standing by to represent and 
focus the will of the Aryan race in North America into great cre-
ative strength, when the time arrives.  We will offer our people
a new way, a way of life beyond the shortsighted materialistic/
hedonistic deathstyle promoted by the present order.

Determination is our greatest tool.

-- Milton John Kleim, Jr.
   First degree Thought Criminal
   ADL-registered anti-Semite

From oneb!!utcsri!utnut!torn!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Mon Dec 13 11:28:34 PST 1993
Article: 3586 of alt.skinheads
Path: oneb!!utcsri!utnut!torn!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads
Subject: Re: Increasing Intolerance
Message-ID: <>
Date: 10 Dec 93 11:09:26 -0500
References: ,
Distribution: alt.skinheads
Lines: 24

Now ... the problem here is quite simple.  You are blaming the wrong people.
It is not the White male, the Negro, the Mexican migrant, the Asian immigrant.
Rather, it is the Jew.

Can't get a decent job?  Have to work long hours for slave wages?  Why not 
blame the origin of the corrupt Capitalist system?

What you are doing is blaming the WRONG PEOPLE.  You are blaming others
who are working, who are oppressed, exploited, suffer from discrmination
and bigotry.  You are blaming them as they struggle to free themselves and 
their peoples, just as you wish to. 

You have every right to feel angry.  But direct this in such a way as to
change the fundamental situation!  Blame the system, and the creature who
developed the criminal system: the Jew.  Unite with oppressed members of 
your race, and encourage your race to unite against the common enemy with
other oppressed races. 



From oneb!!!!!swrinde!emory!gatech!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Mon Dec 13 14:17:50 PST 1993
Article: 5599 of alt.revisionism
Xref: oneb alt.revisionism:5599 alt.skinheads:3598
Path: oneb!!!!!swrinde!emory!gatech!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,alt.skinheads
Subject: Am I annoying you people?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 11 Dec 93 16:15:12 -0500
Lines: 13

It seems that my opponents are in a flaming frenzy.  I haven't been flamed
so harshly for some time.  

Well, I just have to sit back and laugh.  You people respond to my posts 
just like Pavlovian dogs.  You allow me to control your thoughts.  I post;
you react.

Keep flaming me -- PLEASE!  I need to be entertained.


-- No Guilt -- No Remorse --
-- White Pride -- White Power! --

From oneb!!!!!!uunet!olivea!!decwrl!concert!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Sun Dec 19 05:05:55 PST 1993
Article: 3686 of alt.skinheads
Path: oneb!!!!!!uunet!olivea!!decwrl!concert!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads
Subject: Re: Peace...or Utter Destruction
Message-ID: <>
Date: 17 Dec 93 09:02:18 -0500
References: <2es45i$qo1@cat.cis.Brown.EDU>
Lines: 117

Danny Keren battles with me:
>## Hitler was not only responsible for the killing of millions of 
>## "sub-humans" such as Jews, Poles, Gypsies, Soviets and others.
># Again, the false claim of the Holocaust Myth.  Or are you referring to the
># war casualties?

>I meant the extermination of millions in Auschwitz, Treblinka, Belzec and
>many other death camps, as well as in numerous mass executions in Nazi
>occupied USSR and elsewhere.  Documents, eyewitness accounts and summaries
>written by (Establishment - ed.) historians were presented here to support 
>these facts.  

You are referring to the Holocaust Myth, an unproven thesis that millions
of Jews were deliberately exterminated by the National Socialist German

I have demonstrated that the sources which you quote to "prove" your claims 
have a motive to lie about purported genocide.  An historian who depends 
upon the Establishment for his/her income and research grants has a personal
interest in pleasing that Establishment.

>So far, you have not made one valid claim to prove that any of the evidence 
>is not true. You simply claim it is not, but never give any facts/arguments 
>to support your point.

You're the one indicting the German government and people.  You have to prove
*your* claim.   

I have presented many arguments against your claims of genocide.  The facts
I present you dismiss as "lies" from "Nazi apologists."  Every witness for
my version you claim is a "neo-Nazi," an "anti-Semite," and/or mentally
unbalanced, and therefore not worthy to present evidence against you.  You
dismiss every piece of evidence presented by revisionists as half-truths or 
total deceit.  

>## I am talking...of the Euthanasia (mercy killing) program, run under the 
>## direct supervision of Hitler, in which about 120,000 mentally retarded 
>## and insane Germans were murdered by gassing, phenol injections, and other 
>## methods.
># Keren is the type of person who opposes Jack Kevorkian.  I have no objection
># to the concept of the Tiergartenstrasse 4 program.  You call it "murder;"
># I call it mercy death.

>I have actually said nothing about Kevorkian.  He is not the issue here.

He *is* the issue here, because what you are arguing against in National 
Socialist Germany is today happening in Michigan.  You are the type of 
person who would rather see a person suffer than euthanize them.  

The *exact* same arguments used against Dr. Kevorkian (who happens to be
non-Aryan) were used (and are used) against the Tiergartenstrasse 4

My definition of human life precludes that of an individual who possesses no 
ability to interact normally with his environment or those around him.  A 
"vegetable" is not a person in my eyes.

>The issue is mass murder of mentally retarded and insane people which
>the Nazis conducted.  These people (nor their families) weren't asked if 
>they want to die.  They were simply murdered.

"These people" were not even able to ask for dinner.  And the family's 
wishes were irrelevant, unless they wanted to take care of them and pay 
for it.

Again, Keren calls it "murder;" I call it mercy death.

>Do you suggest doing the same here in the US?  Round up insane people
>and mentally retarded people and kill them? 


>Also, if you agree that the Nazis did kill many *Germans* - their own
>people - than why do you find it difficult to accept that they killed
>numerous people who belonged to ethnic/religious groups they obviously
>hated very much?

As I said in "Peace...or Utter Destruction," the war for survival would have
justified the extermination of the Jews, but this did not happen.  The 
so-called "Endloesung" is simply a ridiculous tale, concoted as a weapon
to further a certain peoples' agenda.

>The extermination of the Jews was a key issue for the Nazi regime. Hitler,
>Goebbels, Himmler and the other leaders of that regime spoke about it
>at length; it was a very important goal for them.  The evidence it happened
>is overwhelming.  Why do you keep denying it?

If the extermination of the Jews was a program of National Socialism, why
were so many Jews allowed to escape before the war -- with government
assistance -- to the West and Palestine?

The "evidence" that the Earth was flat centuries ago was "overwhelming" 
too.  The "evidence" that 2+2=5 was "overwhelming" for Winston Smith.  

I deny the Holocaust is fact because it is not fact.

>The rest of "HERMANN"'s article consists of the usual dismissal of 
>well documented historical material - quoted, BTW, from a book written
>by a German - as "lies". 

If a Jew writes a book denying the Holocaust, that means it didn't happen,

>It is quite amazing to see how he rejects every document and every eye-
>witness account that contradicts his opinions as forgeries and lies, while 
>claiming that the statements he makes are true even if there are no facts 
>to back them up. 

Replace "he" and "his" with "Danny" and "Danny's" and the effect is the same.


-- No Guilt -- No Remorse --
-- White Pride -- White Power! --

From oneb!!!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Mon Jan  3 15:10:19 PST 1994
Article: 6023 of alt.revisionism
Xref: oneb alt.skinheads:3827 alt.revisionism:6023
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads,alt.revisionism
Subject: VVZ
Message-ID: <>
Date: 3 Jan 94 08:35:04 -0500
Lines: 88


   Vladimir Volfovich Zhirinovsky, 47-year old political powerhouse.  This new
dynamo in the Russian political arena has instilled great unease in the 
International Establishment after his incredible showing in this month's 
parliamentary elections, winning the largest share -- 24 percent -- of the
popular vote.

   Why is he feared?

   Zhirinovsky may represent an emerging new era for the largest White nation.
His Liberal Democractic Party declares its main aim the preservation of 
"White civilization."  Understanding well the present corrupt order, he states
that Russia has been deliberately impoverished and exploited by the "inter-
national center," his term for the World's power elite.  Publicly acknowledg-
ing that World Jewry were instrumental in the materialization of both World
Wars, Zhirinovsky also said that "our faithful ally should have been Germany.
We could have avoided the two world wars with them."  He expands on this 
with, "we must never again allow ourselves to be driven apart," and con-
templates an "eternal alliance" between the two nations.

   He vigorously opposes "Americanization," referring both to the disposses-
sion of the Majority in our nation, and to the widespread infusion of materi-
alistic pseudo-culture as "Western" capitalists infiltrate his country.  More
aware than most Americans about grim reality, his autobiography states "we
Russians will take no joy when your states start to break away, when your 
factories grind to a halt, when there is not enough food.  There will be no
joy when California joins Mexico, when a negro republic is founded in Miami..."
In an interview, he expounded, "...[the United States] has really gone to 
Hell.  Soon all of America will be black.  Then you'll be asking *us* for
aid."  Seeking to prevent similar eventualities in Eastern Europe, Zhirinov-
sky proposes measures against the "yellow peril" and the former Soviet
Union's burgeoning non-White Muslim population, especially swift action 
to curb crime by "slant-eyed, yellow-skinned" thugs and racketeers.

   Zhirinovsky denounces the Russian newsmedia as being riddled with Jews, 
and points out that the vilest misinformation about him comes from Jewish 
journalists.  Scoffing at criticism, he commented, "...believe what you hear 
coming from my lips, not what you read in newspapers."  He dismisses Slavic 
anti-Semitism as a "phenomenon...provoked only by Jews themselves."

   Pulling no punches in his foreign policy, it is reported Zhirinovsky told
the disagreeable Japanese, "So, you want another one."  As President, he
"will not hesitate to deploy atomic weapons" against powers that interfere
in Russian affairs, impeding his wish to "restore Russia's greatness," 
establishing "a new state: strong, powerful, wealthy, White..."  He explains,
"we simply won't tolerate the domination of some yellow-skinned people."  He
approves of a revision of the Oder-Neisse line in "a formula that satisfies
Germany completely."  His attentions also focus on South Africa, proposing 
that should a Mandela dictatorship come to power, the Afrikaners may emigrate
to Russia.  Zhirinovsky's 1993 autobiography's title, Last Thrust to the
South, alludes to a crusade to secure Russian access to the Indian Ocean
and the Mediterranean Sea.

   Born in Alma Ata, Zhirinovsky left for Moscow to study Law.  Married with
one son, he describes himself as a "self-made man," sexalingual in, besides
his native tongue, English, French, German, Spanish, and Turkish.  Even 
opponents respect him for his charm and sense of humor.  Although a charis-
matic orator and skilled in politics, he is a recent arrival to the Russian
political scene, founding his party in 1990, but being catapulted onto cen-
ter stage by capturing 6 million votes -- third place -- in the 1991 presi-
dential election.  Rightly claiming that "hungry people will vote for me,"
the budding statesman sees himself as "someone from outside the elite," a
"clean, fresh, young face" opposed to "all those coughing, wheezing, sick
types...with their heart attacks and strokes."  Shying away from comparisons
between he and Hitler, he prefers the likening of himself to Bismarck.

   One distubing charge levelled against Zhirinovsky involves his family back-
ground.  Several parties, including the New York Times, assert that his 
father was Jewish, an allegation repeatedly denied.  Rumors that he is 
homosexual also circulate.  Such accusations should be weighed in light of
similar slander against Adolf Hitler.

   If Zhirinovsky is indeed not a cleverly-constructed front-man for Jewry, he
is a long-awaited alternative, a personality who can gain self-determination
for the Russian people from alien opportunists and self-serving renegades.
Despite his obvious faults, the salvation of the White world may also be
bound to the success of this Muscovite, for if he be true to his words,
this visionary leader can guide the most exploited White nation to prosperity
free of foreign poisons, and provide a beacon of hope for Whites around the
world.  While a revitalized Russia cannot avert an inevitable worldwide
disaster, it could lay the foundations of a speedier, more universal recovery.

   Once again, a radiant glow penetrates overwhelming gloom.

-- Milton John Kleim, Jr.

From oneb!!!!!agate!!!emory!gatech!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Mon Jan  3 16:33:57 PST 1994
Article: 6029 of alt.revisionism
Xref: oneb alt.skinheads:3830 alt.revisionism:6029
Path: oneb!!!!!agate!!!emory!gatech!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads,alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: VVZ
Message-ID: <>
Date: 3 Jan 94 11:55:59 -0500
References: <>
Lines: 15

In response to Mark Ira Kaufman, I offer these quotes from my article:

"... Zhirinovsky also said that 'our faithful ally should have been Germany.
We could have avoided the two world wars with them.'  He expands on this 
with, 'we must never again allow ourselves to be driven apart,' and con-
templates an 'eternal alliance' between the two nations.

"He approves of a revision of the Oder-Neisse line in 'a formula that satisfies
Germany completely.'"  

Doesn't sound like the comments of someone who wants to destroy Germany.
Mr. Kaufman's "news" sources must be lying again.

-- Milton John Kleim, Jr. 

From oneb!!destroyer!!!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Fri Jan  7 16:42:05 PST 1994
Article: 6139 of alt.revisionism
Xref: oneb alt.skinheads:3878 alt.revisionism:6139
Path: oneb!!destroyer!!!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads,alt.revisionism
Subject: Is VVZ genuine?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 7 Jan 94 16:39:55 -0500
Lines: 183

His Liberal Democractic Party declares its main aim the preservation of 
"White civilization."  

                              -- [see The New Republic, 11/11/91]

...Zhirinovsky also said that "our faithful ally should have been Germany.
We could have avoided the two world wars with them."  

                              -- [see USA Today, 12/15/93]

He expands on this with, "we must never again allow ourselves to be driven 
apart," and contemplates an "eternal alliance" between the two nations.

                              -- [see The New York Times, 12/15/93]

More aware than most Americans about grim reality, his autobiography states 
"we Russians will take no joy when your states start to break away, when your 
factories grind to a halt, when there is not enough food.  There will be no
joy when California joins Mexico, when a negro republic is founded in Miami..."

                              -- [see USA Today, 12/15/93]     

He approves of a revision of the Oder-Neisse line in "a formula that satisfies
Germany completely."  

                              -- [see The New York Times, 12/15/93]


One of three things is occurring:

1) Zhirinovsky is lying.
2) The Jewsmedia is fabricating material about Zhirinovsky.
3) The Jewsmedia is consciously distorting statements Zhirinovsky actually
   made in order to paint him in a very bad light.

Zhirinovsky is the greatest threat to the corrupt order since Hitler, and the
Establishment must neutralize his appeal by smearing his character, just as
they did with Hitler.  Assassination is out of the question, for to kill
him would be to martyr him in Russian eyes.

The Jewsmedia is the opinion manipulation instrument of the Establishment,
and has no interest in reporting the whole truth.  It is a propaganda insti-
tution and must be expected to lie regularly, especially about a threat 
such as VVZ.

Omri Schwarz writes:

>I don't know.  Time magazine doesn't lie very often.  Neither does the Boston
>Globe, and both mentioned the nutcase considering nuking the krauts if they get
>too persistent with their claim to the area around Kaliningrad/Konigsburg.

Zhirinovsky has said that he wants to conclude a treaty that "satisfies 
Germany completely" (see above) in regards to the Oder-Neisse line, and the
territory stolen from the German people by the Americans and the Soviets.

Time magazine regularly distributes disinformation.  What is so unusual about
it lying to distort the words of the Establishment's worst enemy?

I find it amusing that you have admitted that the Jewsmedia lies.

Mark Ira Kaufman quotes:
>    Informed by a German diplomat in Bulgaria that Bonn was denying
>    him a visa, Zhirinovsky responded that the rebuff could lead to a
>    new world war and Germany's "complete destruction," the newspaper
>    Welt am Sonntag said.

>    The man dubbed "the Russian Hitler" by some German media also 
>    threatened to impoverish Germany by exacting more reparations for
>    World War II, the paper said, citing unidentified German security
>    sources. [A dependible source?!?!?!?! -- editor]

"'I am for close military cooperation with Germany,' he said, calling for an
'eternal alliance' between Germany and Russia.  'We must never again allow
ourselves to be driven apart'."

                              -- The New York Times, 12/15/93

The anti-German rag The World on Sunday (masquerading as a pro-German paper)
is engaging in its primary purpose by misreporting and misrepresenting VVZ's

The forces in favor of the Jew World Order are desperate.  They seek to drive
a wedge between the Germans and the Russians, knowing that an alliance be-
tween the two -- sought sincerely by Zhirinovsky -- means the end of their
criminal regimes in Europe, probably the world.

Short Straw and Little Mind writes:

>   Hermann, you're losing *major* points with these posts stating
>   that Zhirinovsky is palsey-walsey with the Germans.

>   There have been several *major and popular* news organizations that have
>   quoted Zhirinovsky threatening Germany with nuclear weapons and other 
>   injury (I've seen it in, among other places, Newsweek magazine, and
>   The Baltimore Sun newspaper). 

Prominent and popular do not mean accurate and honest.  I will report the
truth, regardless of which Jewsmedia agency contradicts what I cite.

Zhirinovsky is in intimate contact with most German National Socialist liber-
ation organizations, and several of his friends are SS members.  There is no
love between your type of "Germans" and the Russians, but National Socialist
Germans realize Germany and Russia should be allies, as Zhirinovsky has 
stated.  An alliance between Deutschland and Rossija would be an unstoppable
force for Aryan freedom.

Charles Power writes:

I've been following Zhirinovsky's stories in the press, and I've yet to 
see any denial of his Jewish parentage.  It's repeatedly pointed out that 
while he refers to his mother's nationality, he refers only to the 
profession of his father.  

Either you are not paying even the least attention, or you are lying.  Anyone
who has read the most general background article on VVZ knows he asserts his
parents were Russians.

Zhirinovsky has vehemently denied that he is a Jew, even physically attacking
an individual who claimed such at his victory celebration last month.  This
latter incident was reported in several Jewsmedia organs.

I do not deny the possiblity that VVZ worked for a pro-Jewish organization
called Shalom a few years back.  What I would question is -- if the claim
is true -- his motive for doing so.  I would propose that he was acting sub-

[About the charge of homosexuality]

You're not paying attention, Milton.  This isn't a slander anymore.  BTW, 
this is the first time I've seen any rumor to this effect.  

If the charge of homosexuality is not slander, then why is it propagated?
Certainly if being labelled a queer is now positive, the Establishment would
not want to make VVZ look better.

Even Time magazine called the charge "slander" (see the 12/27 edition).

Danny Keren defecates:

>In short - another vulgar and stupid fascist, just the type of guy
>that makes hermie drool!

Everyone that has the gall to contradict Mr. Keren's ideology, and believe
differently is "vulgar" and "stupid."

Armin writes:

  Funny, I always thought Russians were considered to be non-white by most
of the White Boy Bunch...

Well, you thought wrong.

To my comrades who have broken ranks with me on the Zhirinovsky Question:

Do you not recall history?  Do you not remember the propaganda campaign of
the '30s and '40s?

There is nearly a perfect parallel in each of the charges made to defame
Adolf Hitler over five decades ago, and Vladimir Zhirinovsky today.

Both were/are claimed to be Jews, homosexual, insane, morally corrupt and 
without humanity.  Both supposedly worked/work for world domination and 
lusted/lust for mass murder.  Both were/are alleged to be working for the 
Establishment.  Mein Kampf and Last Thrust to the South are declared evil 
twins.  WE ARE REPEATING HISTORY!  Is the correlation of the charges
just coincidence?

We all know the reputation of the Jewsmedia regarding truth.  Zhirinovsky
deserves the benefit of our doubts.

-- Milton John Kleim, Jr.

Article 6253 of alt.revisionism:
Path: oneb!!destroyer!!!!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Is VVZ genuine?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 10 Jan 94 13:40:29 -0500
References: <> 
 <> <>,<>
Lines: 9

Ken Mcvay writes:

>You have been far too busy establishing yourself as a Genuine BadGuy...

Oooh!  Oooh!  I'm a "Genuine BadGuy."  

The Forces of Hate have given me a label.


Article 6272 of alt.revisionism:
Xref: oneb alt.skinheads:3947 alt.revisionism:6272
Path: oneb!!!!!agate!!!emory!gatech!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads,alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Is VVZ genuine?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 10 Jan 94 20:06:04 -0500
References: <2gnidf$>,,
Lines: 24

Barry Shein writes:

>Is the depth of reasoning here merely that when the NY Times reports
>something Hermann finds agreeable about Zhirinovsky then they are
>telling the truth and he quotes it, but when it's something he finds
>disagreeable then they are lying kike bastards?

>And, I suppose, that he simply does not believe that Zhironovsky made
>contradictory statements so THEREFORE (hah) someone must be
>fabricating his quotes?

I simply state that either the reporting entity, or the subject, is lying.

Many other statements, particularly before Zhirinovsky was recognized as a
threat, are totally inconsistent with what he is claimed to be, in short,
an egomaniac opportunist.

Why do *you* quote a source when it is favorable to you, but disregard con-
tradictory citations, as you accuse me of doing?

BTW, the New York Times was only *one* of the several sources I could quote
from for the VVZ quotes I cited in my article.


Article 6278 of alt.revisionism:
Path: oneb!!utcsri!utnut!torn!!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Another Question "Hermann" Will Never Answer?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 10 Jan 94 21:09:41 -0500
References: <2gsifv$g0k@cat.cis.Brown.EDU>
Distribution: world
Lines: 7

Danny Keren asks:

>So, "Hermann", did Himmler make this speech or not?

No, I do not believe Heinrich Himmler made the speech.


Article 6299 of alt.revisionism:
Path: oneb!!destroyer!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: "Hermann" Accuses Me of Using His Disinformation Techniques
Message-ID: <>
Date: 11 Jan 94 11:09:35 -0500
References: <2gtrlj$gai@cat.cis.Brown.EDU>
Distribution: world
Lines: 11

Danny Keren writes:

>BTW, what about the Hitler 1939 speech, in which he explicitly
>said that in the event of a new war the Jews of Europe will be
>exterminated? You probably saw it on TV one time or another.
>Don't tell me you deny that one?

You can read into his words whatever you like.  It still doesn't validate
your extermination claims.


Article 3973 of alt.skinheads:
Path: oneb!!destroyer!!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads
Subject: Re: Question
Message-ID: <>
Date: 11 Jan 94 11:19:14 -0500
References:  <>,<2gt6ft$bbc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>
Distribution: world
Lines: 20

Omri Schwarz responds to me:

>>Of course a pro-White activist cannot reconcile Christianity (as you under-
>>stand it) with White pride and White Power.

>How she understands it?  You mean "the extent to which she remembers that line
>'Love thy neighbor'?"

>How do you understand it?

The National Socialist German government promoted a form of Christianity
called "Positive Christianity."  The "Christianity" the poster means is a
servile, self-destructive ideology, the kind promoted by the Churchians with
the complete support of the Jews.

National Socialism is largely based upon the principle "Love Thy Neighbor."
But we also recognize God's Natural Law requires our neighbor to be the same


Article 6305 of alt.revisionism:
Path: oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!!!decwrl!decwrl!concert!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Is VVZ genuine?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 11 Jan 94 13:04:59 -0500
References: <> <2gkqcq$p5r@cat.cis.Brown.EDU>,
Lines: 34

Barry Shein writes:

>Hermann, face it, all you will ever understand or respect is the
>bottom of a boot.

Don't project your brutal mentality into my head.  I am normally compassion-
ate and merciful towards others, but when the circumstances call for it, I
am cold and calculating.

>>They don't post because they are not willing to subject themselves to hateful
>>personal -- sometimes obscene -- attacks by elements of your camp.

>Yes, I am sure that's just what nazi thugs are worried about, the lack
>of polite conversation...

I would love to be able to have a reasonable, productive debate on the Net,
but in the beginning, it was your camp that attacked me without provocation,
and the assault has not let up since.  Your side demonstrated that any 
dissent on the Holocaust Myth would bring about no-holds-barred attacks,
usually of an ad hominem nature.

>Just who do you think you are kidding? 

>It's hard to imagine what must go thru your head...white-supremacist,
>jew-hating nazis with delicate sensibilities...yow.

I don't give a damn whether you and your fellow Jews, and the fools who
follow your gang, think I'm a decent person.  My family, my girlfriend,
my comrades, my friends and co-workers -- only their opinions count.

I will not falsify history, I will not subscribe to politically-correct 
views of race and the Jews to gain acceptance and approval.

-- Milton John Kleim, Jr.

Article 6306 of alt.revisionism:
Xref: oneb alt.skinheads:3975 alt.revisionism:6306
Path: oneb!!destroyer!!!!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.skinheads,alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Is VVZ genuine?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 11 Jan 94 13:28:50 -0500
References: <2gnidf$> <> 
Lines: 12


>For once, I can really spoof this guy!  Zhirinovsky said those same things
>in an interview to a RUSSIAN TV program, and I happened to watch it (I speak 
>the language).  So "Jew York Times" did not lie.  Miltie, come down, have 
>some vodka, remember Zhirinovsky, and go to bed.

Did you actually hear the words of VVZ, or someone "quoting" him?  Further,
why should we believe you?  You are a biased source.


Article 6307 of alt.revisionism:
Path: oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!swrinde!!usc!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Hermann's Invisible Army [was Re: Is VVZ genuine?]
Message-ID: <>
Date: 11 Jan 94 13:25:56 -0500
References: <> <2gkqcq$p5r@cat.cis.Brown.EDU> 
Lines: 114

Christopher J. Hoover responds to me:

>>So you're more numerous.  Does that mean you have more credibility?  Hell
>>no!  Might does not make right.

>This somehow proves you _right_?  Iiiiiii don't think so, Tim.

Jack ass, *your* side implied that your numerity gave credibility to your

>>Your side is more vocal.  Your obsessive whining and greater resources give
>>the false impression that your side is more important than it really is.

>Please.  The preponderance of the available evidence gives most thinking 
>people the _correct_ impression that the "side" that suggests that the 
>wholesale slaughter of millions _happened_ in the name of National 
>Socialism is important because what it says is true.  

Curious term.  "Correct," but not factual.  The phrase "correct impression" 
reminds me an awful lot of stuff I read in _1984_.

>Do you truly believe that National Socialism is a more significant force 
>than the truth, Hermann?

No, National Socialism adjusts itself to fit truth/reality.  It is your side
that places the Holocaust Myth above truth.

>>>>We are confident that good people who don't post find our material 

>>>I hate to point this out, but your "good" friends probably don't post
>>>because (a) they can't read and (b) they can't write.

>>They don't post because they are not willing to subject themselves to hateful
>>personal -- sometimes obscene -- attacks by elements of your camp.

>Hi, Hermann.  You don't know me.  I'm just an average net denizen who 
>posts the odd request for help to a couple of comp.* groups, trades 
>guitar tablatures, and contributes every once and a while to the Usenet 
>Oracle.  I've been reading alt.revisionism since Gannon came back onto 
>the net, for amusement, mostly.  I generally find the rantings of your 
>lot good for an ironic chuckle or two.  Mostly I lurk.  I don't have the 
>archives that McVay has, or the gift for discourse that others like 
>Keren, McFee, and others have.

>But it was your above claims that the silent majority who read 
>alt.revisionism are on your side that have prompted me to unlurk, to 
>stand up and be counted.  You have the gall to claim that you "are 
>confident that good people who don't post find our material valuable."

>I would beg to differ.

You are but *one* person.  A hundred will prove me wrong.

>And don't delude yourself.  While polls indicate that some people are
>susceptible to your propaganda, never forget that the overwhelming
>majority of the people in this country know better, and have no interest
>in National Socialism in the American agenda. 

Another LA riot or two will change opinion real fast.

>You think all us lurkers agree with you, and that "they don't post because
>they are not willing to subject themselves to hateful personal --
>sometimes obscene -- attacks by elements of your camp?"

>Think again.  I, for one, have lurked mostly because a) I don't have the
>time to respond as effectively as some of the folks I've listed above, and...

I never said all "lurkers" agree with me.  I'd estimate that 40-50% agree
with your side, 10-15% with my side, and the rest are reading this group
out of curiosity.  If I plant the *slightest* doubt in the "fence-sitters,"
my mission is accomplished.  Little doubt grows into big doubt, especially
when it concerns a religion.

>...b) I wasn't terribly thrilled at the notion of being mail-bombed by the
>net's Nazi contingent.

Don't give me this crap.  There is no evidence that anyone from our side has
used any sort of electronic terrorism against your side.

>The following, pulled from another of your posts, is just icing on the 
>cake, and shows your true colors:

>>The Jewish instigation of two World Wars, the Jewish inspired and directed
>>annihilation of millions of Russians and Ukrainians (a great deal more than
>>your alleged "6 million") on racial and ideological grounds, the deliberate
>>effort to corrupt and destroy White cultures with the intended end of bio-
>>logical genocide of the Aryan race...

>Such a bigoted, idiotic reading of history would be laughable were the
>spectres it summons not so chilling. 

You are afraid of the truth.

Want a clearer statement of my beliefs?  I'm not ashamed of my beliefs:
I am a National Socialist, an admirer of the greatest leader of the 20th
cenutry, Adolf Hitler, a pan-Aryanist racial separatist, a critic of the
criminal state of Israel, a denier of the mythical "6 million"...

> might _almost_ make me ashamed...of my German ancestry. 

You should be ashamed to apologize for the people who tried hard to totally
annihilate your racial cousins and their culture, whom you claim to have
proud links to.

>So tell me, Herr Kleim:  am I a Jewish tool, part of a grand conspiracy 
>against pure Aryans like you?  Am I a lackey of the "Forces of Hate?"  
>Or am I just a guy with a computer and a newsfeed in South Dakota who 
>happens to have had enough of your garbage, and has decided to lend one 
>more small voice to the telling of the truth?

You're just a fool who cannot see beyond the propaganda taught to you.


Article 6308 of alt.revisionism:
Path: oneb!!!!!!uunet!decwrl!decwrl!concert!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Is VVZ genuine?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 11 Jan 94 13:36:35 -0500
References: <> <2gpu1l$i2a@cat.cis.Brown.EDU> 
Lines: 12

Richie Schultz:

Where did I "contradict myself?"

He writes:

>Which is completely beside the point that Stalin was not only not Jewish, he
>was an anti-Semite. 

Yeah, right.  An "anti-Semite" with a proud Jew as a right hand man.


Article 6798 of alt.revisionism:
Path: oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!!caen!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: A Game, Perhaps?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 28 Jan 94 09:17:20 -0500
References: <2i8l1p$d3n@cat.cis.Brown.EDU>
Distribution: world
Lines: 57

Danny Keren, propagandist for the Jewish Occupation Forces-United States,
responds to me:

># This is idiocy of the first rate, the product of the mind of either
># a simpleton or a propagandist.  

>Oh boy, hermie is mad. 

I'm not mad, just contemptuous of your habitual lying. 

>After being exposed as a lying idiot re the Himmler speech...

You have "exposed" nothing, proven nothing, done nothing besides promote 
hatred and bigotry against the German, Ukrainian, Baltic and other peoples
with your Hoaxocaust tale.

>after miserably failing to answer *one* question posed to him...

Let the world see Danny Keren lie again.  I have answered many questions 
from Keren and his fellow liars.

>after ridiculing himself re the "T4" murders (he admits
>gas was used, but insists that there were no gas chambers; how about
>"gassing rooms"?)...

Keren here insists upon confusing the issue, the tactic of a liar who has
no foundation to stand upon.  I have said that gas masks, hoses, and gas
cylinders were used in the Tiergartenstrasse 4 euthanasia program.

>Anyway, hermie avoids the debate...

Keren makes it impossible to debate.  Any intelligent individual realizes
that it is impossible to debate liars who refuse to adhere to reasonable
forensic rules, and reject valid claims from their detractors.

>Stop being a coward: say that you know the Holocaust happened...

Since the "Holocaust" did *not* happen, I will not proclaim that it did.

>Hell, everybody knows very well that this is what you really think. [That I
 wish to see the Jews eliminated]

Typical smears again.  You *know* what I think?  Well, we of the revisionist 
side know what *you* think, and who you really are:  a propagandist for the
Anti-Defamation League, the infamous psycho-terror organization that 
regularly violates the civil rights of countless of its critics of the Jews
and the critics of the criminal state of Israel, as well as heretics the 
Holocaust RELIGION.

Danny Keren's postings are seen by any objective individual as what they
are: a campaign of hate and disinformation.


-- No Guilt for being White
-- No Remorse for crimes that did not occur or I did not commit

From oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Fri Feb  4 12:27:10 PST 1994
Article: 7099 of alt.revisionism
Path: oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: The Holocaust: A Balloon Without Gas
Message-ID: <>
Date: 3 Feb 94 08:29:31 -0500
References: <2ip45l$4o4@cat.cis.Brown.EDU>
Lines: 48

Danny Keren, propagandist for the Jewish Occupation Forces-United States,

>It is hardly a surprise that "Hermann", after being caught lying
>and contradicting himself so many times, retreated into reposting 
>Gannon's old rubbish. 

I repost material from Dan's BBS because it very relevant -- and utterly 
damaging to your side's arguments.

Anyone who reads this group, and does not have an inherent, irrational bias
against the truth, knows exactly who is lying: YOU.

>He doesn't even try to answer the questions posed to him any more...

I have answered many questions of yours.  Just because you "forgot" my answers,
or refuse to accept my arguments does not mean I didn't answer you. 

>As noted before, the attempt to claim that the SS - in 1943 - would
>have "difficulties" in using HCN gas to kill people is utterly stupid.
>Gas chambers using exactly the same gas for execution were built
>in the US as early as 1920.

Certainly.  But no one claims that the US chambers "gassed" six million indi-

>It is quite amusing to see how "revisionists" change their opinions
>about the "technical problems" gassing involves. 

It is quite amusing to see how the Mythologists continue to retreat on their
"Holocaust" claim: from four million to only one million "gassed" at Auschwitz.
What other "Holocaust truths" will your side abandon next?

>They used to claim, for years, that it would have been dangerous to use HCN 
>in the Auschwitz gas chambers. 

It would have been extremely dangerous to use Zyklon B for the extermination
of humans in the rooms your side claims are "gas chambers."

>...(utterly stupid, of course; HCN is far from being appropriate for this 
>task [of delousing clothing and equipment]

Then are you going to claim that Zyklon B was invented by the Germans solely
to "gas" Jews (and Gypsies, Slavs, etc., etc., etc., although these others
are mentioned only once for every 100 times the "extermination of the Jews" is
mentioned)?  Zyklon B was designed for the extermination of lice, not Jews.


From oneb!!destroyer!gumby!yale!!!!!uunet!decwrl!!!!harry Sat Feb  5 16:04:41 PST 1994
Article: 7157 of alt.revisionism
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Path: oneb!!destroyer!gumby!yale!!!!!uunet!decwrl!!!!harry
From: (Harry Katz)
Subject: Milton Kleim Caught in a Lie!
Message-ID: <>
Sender: (USENET News System)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL9]
References: <>
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 1994 23:22:47 GMT
Lines: 54

In article <2ip45l$4o4@cat.cis.Brown.EDU>,
Danny Keren wrote:

	It is quite amusing to see how "revisionists"
	change their opinions about the "technical problems"
	gassing involves. They used to claim, for years, that
	it would have been dangerous to use HCN in the Auschwitz
	gas chambers. They claimed to "prove" this beyond doubt.
	However, as they admit, there are still cyanide traces
	in the remains of the gas chambers.  So what do the
	crackpots claim now? That the HCN was indeed used in
	them, but for "disinfecting corpses" (utterly stupid,
	of course; HCN is far from being appropriate for this
	task). Naturally, all the "proofs" that HCN could not
	have been used in the chambers are quietly flushed
	down the toilet.

In article <>,
hermann@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU changes what Mr. Keren
wrote in order to attack it.

First he quotes Mr. Keren accurately:

	They used to claim, for years, that it would have been
	dangerous to use HCN in the Auschwitz gas chambers. 

But in his next "quote" of Mr. Keren's post, he leaves out the
actual text and adds his own in square brackets:

	...(utterly stupid, of course; HCN is far from being
	appropriate for this task [of delousing clothing and

Now let's take a look at what Mr. Keren actually wrote, the part
that Herr Hermann felt obligated to delete:

	So what do the crackpots claim now? That the HCN was
	indeed used in them, but for "disinfecting corpses"
	(utterly stupid, of course; HCN is far from being
	appropriate for this task).

Note how Herr Hermann has changed "disinfecting corpses" into
"delousing clothing and equipment."

And he has the chutzpah to call Mr. Keren and other defenders
of historical truth liars!

Harry Katz

From oneb!!!!!!!!olivea!decwrl!!!!harry Sat Feb  5 16:05:26 PST 1994
Article: 7153 of alt.revisionism
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Path: oneb!!!!!!!!olivea!decwrl!!!!harry
From: (Harry Katz)
Subject: Re: Cult of Death, Cult of Hatred
Message-ID: <>
Sender: (USENET News System)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL9]
References: <>
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 1994 22:18:01 GMT
Lines: 48

In article <>, (Chris Krolczyk) commented on Herr Hermann's
reposting of drivel originally posted by Dan Gannon:

	It's rather obvious that Miltie Kleim is taking reposting
	lessons from Dan Gannon.  Lesson #1 apparently states that
	"the more you repeat an utter load of bullshit, the less
	it should smell offensive due to repeated exposure".

In article <>,
hermann@TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU retorts:

	Sorry Chris.  We don't take lessons from Danny Keren and
	Ken McOyVey.

Herr Hermann displays his only argument against the truth --
making fun of other people's names.  Of course, his own name
could also be twisted around and made to sound funny, but that
would not be fair to all those people named Kleim who are
honest and decent human beings.

	Dan [Gannon] and I only post truth;...

If these posts are so full of "truth" then why do they have to
post and repost them time and time again as if they wanted to
ram it down our throats?

Implied in these last two statements is an assertion that Mr. Keren
and Mr. McVay do not post the truth.  Herr Hermann has never been
able to prove that what they post is not true, whereas they have
many times pointed out the lies and half-truths in their posts.
But what can you expect from someone whose best argument is to make
fun of his opponents' names?

	...we're sorry if its fresh, clean scent offends your 
	putrid mind.

According to the recent poll of innocent bystanders that Herr Hermann
instigated and supported, most people think that it's his and Dan
Gannon's posts that stink of garbage!  Then again, to a cockroach
garbage smells like a "fresh, clean scent" and soap smells "putrid!"

Harry Katz

From oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!decwrl!decwrl!concert!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Fri Feb 11 20:18:48 PST 1994
Article: 7504 of alt.revisionism
Path: oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!decwrl!decwrl!concert!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: My motives
Message-ID: <>
Date: 10 Feb 94 11:02:44 -0500
Lines: 142

Barry Shein writes:

>I believe (b), although a person can convince himself of something
>quite false over time as it is easier than admitting to themselves
>they are living a lie.

This goes for those who believe in the "Holocaust" tale and racial equality
as well.

>But I believe what motivates folks like Gannon and Hermann are one or
>more of the following:

>1. For whatever reason they are true-blue Nazis. They are involved
>in the organization. They believe (for some reason) that the Nazi
>party shall lead the USA and other countries.

I am a National Socialist because my philosophy represents the most viable
and sound system for White survival and prosperity.  I reject the Marxo-
Capitalist system, with its false democracy, cultural degeneracy, and social

>They also believe that there is this annoying little memory (The 

There is the blatant lie of the "Holocaust," and we will continue to declare
what it is to the world.

>So, they try to rehabilitate the Nazi image. 

We contradict the lies and false beliefs your side promotes about National
Socialism, the German people, and World War II history.

>Since they believe that lying to people "for their own good" is their 
>god-given right and something Goebbells himself would be proud of they 
>are trying to show their peers what good Nazis they are in promoting this 

Please offer us documentation for your claim that National Socialism advo-
cates lying and deception to the People.  

I would say that true National Socialists have never held as policy the use
of falsehood and deception.

>Their ultimate fantasy is that the war is not over, they have not lost, 
>they've just, um, regrouped.

Your side's fantasy is to be rid of all opposition to your political and
social dogmas, including to the Holocaust Myth.

In a way, National Socialists have "regrouped."  The German Armed Forces
lost the war, not National Socialism.  Any doubters I would suggest con-
tact the ADL about worldwide "neo-Naziism" immediately.

>2. They have a real personal grudge against Jews...

I have no personal grudge against Jews.  I will not tolerate quietly and
meekly, however, the detrimental influence Jewry exercises over the media
and government of the White world.  The Aryan race has the right to self-
determination, and Jewish influence impedes that, just as Aryan control
of Jewry would be intolerable to Jews.

>Notice how they hardly ever bother to address the genocide of the
>Gypsies (or others) by the Nazis. It's just jooos, jooos, jooos, (or
>the codeword: zionist.)

Hey!  Wait a minute.  We aren't the ones who ignore the suffering and deaths
of others, during World War II or at other times.  It is the Jewish-
controlled media.  For every single time we hear of the slaughter of the 
Armenians, or the Ukrainians, or the Cambodians, we see the "Holocaust" 
shoved in the world's face at least a hundred times.  How many films about 
the Ukrainian famine or the Cambodian genocide or the Stalinist and Maoist 
mass murders are there?  How many museums?  How many high school classes 
have "famine studies?"  How many people even *know* about these other real 
and alleged crimes?

Why are the Jews so special?  Why the spotlight on them? 

>The obsession comes through loud and clear.

Look who's obsessed with the "six million?"

>So why do they hate jews so much? 

I do not hate Jews as Jews, but rather as members of a corrupting influence
upon my people.  Although most Jews see me as a personification of evil, and 
while it is true that occasionally I will insult a Jew as a Jew, I am little 
different from any normal individual on your side.  Denying the humanity of 
a true National Socialist is nothing more than a propaganda tactic. 

If you and I met in person, Barry, and we did not know each other, I'm sure 
we would be on the friendliest of terms, even if I knew you were a Jew.  

>Could be any number of reasons, from honest-to-god deeply seated racial 
>hatred to maybe their ex-wife's divorce lawyer was jewish and reamed them, 
>or something like that maybe a jewish boss once fired them or similar. The 
>kinds of things people can hold a real, deep grudge over. Particularly when 
>they're trying desparately to deny that it's their own fault that whatever
>happened happened.

>I think this kind of thing may have been what got someone like Gannon
>and Hermann started.

Education got me started.  I learned about the lies and fables Americans are
taught while doing research in my junior college library in California.  I
was at first shocked and dumbfounded, but then angered, to discover that my
society -- and I -- had been deceived so completely about the most important
issues of racial survival and social health.  Initially I was confused about 
the motives for the deception, but after even more research, I came to 
understand why we have been deceived, and why any effort to educate others
is met with a vicious campaign of misinformation and hate.

>3. Hermann I think is just your standard angry young man out to shock

Sometimes the truth is incredibly shocking, but provoking emotion is not
my purpose.  I could deliver the truth about the Holocaust Myth, the Jews, 
and race much more smoothly -- for wider appeal -- but subterfuge is not part 
of my tactics.

>Waving around Nazi regalia and claiming something like the
>Holocaust didn't happen or whatever might shock today is a
>time-honored tradition. 

I don't have any uniforms, any flags, any regalia.  I am not a "Hollywood
Nazi."  I have knowledge.  It is a powerful tool, as is evidenced by the 
effect of what I write on my opponents, and by the many e-mail inquiries I 
have received in the past few months from individuals interested in 

>So Hermann is pleased whenever he shocks, whenever he exercises his
>manhood (which he is desparately trying to prove to himself...

If I wanted to "prove my manhood," I would join the military or an SCSU
athletic team or go hunting every weekend.  I have nothing to prove gender-

I realize it is very difficult for you to understad that Dan and I are
not playing a game here, but that's your problem.  We see a higher 
righteous purpose in our efforts, which is why we endure the crap we receive.  
In fact, the hate of my detractors has strengthened my resolve.

-- Milton John Kleim, Jr.

From oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!caen!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Sat Feb 19 19:12:59 PST 1994
Article: 7910 of alt.revisionism
Path: oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!caen!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: The Real Greens
Message-ID: <>
Date: 18 Feb 94 11:31:36 -0500
Lines: 139


   There is a conspicuous absence of any significant discussion of ecologically
oriented matters within the movement for White racial survival.  This lack of
focus on the environment must be remedied.


   Since the 1960's, when it first began to expand into a mass phenomenon,
environmentalism has been tinted with a distinct shade of crimson.  A dearth 
of racialist thinkers, from Nordicist anarchists to National Socialists, 
whose silence has given a heavy leftist tilt to the philosophical under-
pinnings and activities of the "Green" movement, has allowed it to be cap-
tured by a herd of neo-Marxists, "Eco-Buddhists," and other assorted baffoons.
The classic focus of ecology, the study of organisms' functioning within
their environments, has been fused with various interracist concerns,  
from advocacy of global government to agit-propism against "environmental 

   Because our ideological opponents control and guide present-day environ-
mentalism, they are able to exploit justifiable ecological concerns to further
their morbid agenda.  In so doing, they discredit environmentalism in the
eyes of those who would believe in sound preservation principles to protect 
the genetic diversity and other natural resources which guarantees the 
continuity of the elements we need to survive, yet cannot accept the devious
program of corrupt bureaucrats and other parasitical entities.

   Few seem to know that the modern enivironmentalist movement has roots 
intertwined with those of racialism.  As noted by British historian Dr.
Anna C. Bramwell in her _Ecology in the Twentieth Century: A History_ (Yale
University Press, 1989), early theorists of Nordicism came up with many ideas
identical to those espoused by today's environmentalists.  Her 1984 article,
"Is This Man 'Father of the Greens'?" (_History Today_, September 1984, pp.
7-13), and book, _Blood and Soil: Walther Darre and Hitler's "Green Party"_ 
(Kensal Press, 1985), demonstrates that much of Green thought was first 
created by the Third Reich's Minister of Agriculture.  Furthermore, Robert 
Proctor says in his _Racial Hygiene: Medicine Under the Nazis_ (Harvard 
University Press, 1988), "the Nazis provided support for areas that today 
would be considered alternative, organic, holistic, or otherwise heterodox 
-- areas such as ecology, toxiclogy, and environmental science."  This 
reality is inconsistent with the false notions held of National Socialism 
by most members of our society.

   Richard Walther Darre popularized the idea of "Blut und Boden," refer-
ring to the holistic interaction of inhabitants and habitat.  The blood and 
soil duality, based upon traditions as old as the Germanic peoples who 
possessed and nurtured them, has the potential to generate a prolonged 
spiritual awakening, which every member of our race so desperately needs, 
along with a healthier, sustainable way of life.

   Darre denounced capitalism, as well as the urbanization, mass mechaniza-
tion, and pseudo-culture which go along with it.  He advocated planned,
step-by-step deindustrialization and its replacement by an updated version
of a Jeffersonian agrarian society.  Organic farming methods, with occasional
applications of advanced technology on small hereditary land holdings was
his goal.  In view of today's urban demographics, Darre's proposal to 
organize rural dwellers into an army to blockade and strangle cosmopolitan
cities is not as impractical as it seems.


   Examining the racial and environmental trends of past civilizations,
the concerned White activist must conclude that this constantly expanding,
life-smothering civilization of ours will soon come crashing down.  While 
voluntary renunciation of the unnecessary but hedonistic products of con-
temporary Western civilization may be unpalatable to many, the only choice
we have to avoid the full brunt of the attrition and decay affecting today's 
social order could be to cut ourselves off from it as much as possible, and 
adapt ourselves to an alternative, organic way of life.

   Civilization breeds an arrogance that leads men and women to believe that
they can permanently circumvent Nature's immutable commands.  The more 
"civilized" humans become, the more arrogance they usually develop.  This
arrogance, attributable in part to the extreme domestication brought about
by a lack of regular interaction with un- or partially tamed Nature, often
causes people to avoid undertaking necessary life-sustaining measures until
it is too late.

   Nature must be viewed not as an "empire" to be conquered and manipulated,
but rather as a "friend."  All must seriously ponder what is more important
to us: the lust for an ever more complex and dominating technology or the 
concentration of our capabilities on racial survival.  Of course modern 
technology is helpful in warding off foes, but allowing technics to set the 
rules of our existence will sap what remains of Aryans' spiritual strength.  
The creator must wrest control back from the created.


   Our primary objective must be to develop a system for continuing the
evolution of the bio-cultural entity that is our race.  Our secondary
objectives should be the reduction of rabid consumptionism and other types
of ecological destruction.  Our foremost efforts must be on behalf of our 
people, as we have neither the human or financial capital, nor even the 
potential to reverse on a wide-scale the deleterious influence of the 
prevailing paradigm on this planet.

   Lindbergh was right to ask, "Is civilization progress?"  Let no one
attempt to evade confrontation with this question by denouncing the nay-
sayer as an un-Faustian Luddite.  The widely held world view which promotes
this illusory "progress" must be tossed into the Jewish junkheap, along with
Judeo-Christianity, capitalism, and their lethal spawn.

   Catastrophic population reduction and infrastructure disintegration is
inevitable, through either human or natural causes.  Building self-sustaining,
defensible islands in a chaotic, hostile sea is what survival requires.

   Everyone on our side, regardless of ability or education, must develop
a stronger knowledge about and comprehension of ecology, and demonstrate it.
Merely joining an environmentalist group obviously does not serve our
needs, as organizations of tradition and stature such as the Sierra
Club and the Wilderness Society function in the "multicultural" morass.
Only efforts to foster ecological understanding and awareness -- in all
matters -- will bear fruit.

   Visionary work that treads in the footsteps of the philosophical frontier
opened up by European Nordicists early this century should by the order
of the day.  True environmentalism holds vast potential for ourselves
individually and our people collectively -- biologically, culturally, and

   Our future is green.


The above is an adaptation of the original text of my article published in 
_Instauration_, September 1993, p. 6, signed because of editorial policy with 
my pseudonym "HERMANN."

-- Milton John Kleim, Jr.

Post Office Box 76
Cape Canaveral, FL  32920

Sample issue: $4

From oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!caen!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Sat Feb 19 19:13:13 PST 1994
Article: 7911 of alt.revisionism
Path: oneb!!utcsri!utnut!!!caen!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: A new Way
Message-ID: <>
Date: 18 Feb 94 11:32:04 -0500
Lines: 292

If we are to survive the coming apocalypse...


   "Civilization" in the narrow sense means a society based upon cities; in
the broader sense, a merging of the most productive elements of different
cultures without regard for holism or the organic environment necessary for
the creation and sustenation of such culture.

   "Western Civilization" is an artificial construct, linking sound values
with bankrupt traditions, serving ultimately to the detriment of our people.
Celebration of the this delusive inorganic body, the basis of both our 
racial and ecological crises, glorifies the largely forgotten destruction 
of the old Northern cultures, which were diametrically opposed in many 
instances to the historical and present-day ideas of civilization.

   Many Aryan racialists have a misguided predilection for worshiping the
"West" and all it stands for.  While remarkable similarities exist between
the Indo-European cultures, and a great deal has been contributed to our 
knowledge from the Greco-Roman world, this moribund "Western Civilization," 
despite the undeniable racial kinship of its founders with our ancestors,
should be considered as alien as cultures wholly from outside Europe.  
Alfred Rosenberg stated:  

      In sad imitation of the Greek spirit, admittedly related to 
   ours in many respects, we have shifted the emphasis of our lives
   outside ourselves; we have used the standards of another people
   to measure our own achievements, and we have forgotten in doing
   so that people, like personalities, can never be measured by
   the _same_ standard. [1]

We may admire -- even utilize, as we do -- many aspects of Mediterranean 
culture, but we should not weigh the legitimacy of *our* Celto-Germano-
Slavic cultures by playing along with an intellectual fallacy.

   The prevailing destructive spirit of Western Civilization is its arrogant
attitude towards the natural Order.  In an extraordinary article, "The
Unnatural Jew" [2], Steven Schwarzschild reveals with pride the origin of 
this spirit: 

      The main line of Jewish philosophy...has paradigmatically defined
   Jewishness as alienation and confrontation with nature...Jewish 
   philosophy and culture followed a more "unnatural" path.  God and 
   man are totally distinct from and superior to nature. [3]

Schwarzschild concludes:

      I began by calling myself an urban man for more than half a 
   millenium.  It turns out, surprisingly, that as a Jew I have been 
   an unnatural man much longer. [4]

   Opposed to this, one may look back to pre-Christian European traditions 
and discover a lifestyle in true harmony with Nature, devoid of an ego-
maniacal dominating will, yet still capable of producing an advanced culture 
and chivalrous beliefs.  Our ancestors were wiser than us when they possessed 
our original, race-inspired religion.  The Levantine invasion deprived us 
of much more than financial freedom.  That even an exponent of the radical 
environmentalist "Deep Ecology" movement, Paul Shepard, understands the 
conflict can be seen in his statement:

      The only alternative visible to me now is northern...The _desert 
   mind_, a Platonic, prophetic, self-centering, dualistic, schizoid, 
   eco-alienating way of being, could not have been less like the 
   Germanic, Celtic, and Scandinavian _way_ that it eventually 
   quashed. [5]

   Egomania is a train of thought embraced by individuals with infantile
ethics.  Judaic thought symbolizes such an egotism.  Throughout its history
its strivings have converted beauty into ugliness, order into chaos, art
into commodities, Nature into "civilization," and ultimately, life into death.
An intensely dynamic will is characteristic of the Aryan, but while creative
and virtuous, this strong will is tempered by self-control, leading to a 
respect for powers higher than itself, and remaining in harmony with 
the unknowable and beneficial forces of Nature.  The self-sufficient, 
dominating will, represented most perfectly by Jewish-inspired egomania,
disregards necessary links between it and the surrounding community of
life.  Essentially, it dejustifies its own existence by denying the reality
of the natural Order of which it is eternally part.

   One may contrast the Northern "will to power" against Oriental passivity.
When the Northern infection by Judaic traditions is taken into account, 
however, it is clear that Europeans and Orientals share a great many things.
Contrasted to them is the cosmopolitan man, the Jew -- standing alone.

   As with the emphasis upon a hyperactive will, the false non-biological 
dichotomy between male and female is also an adoption from Judaic traditions.
I challenge anyone to provide solid evidence, from pre- or anti-Christian
sources, that our Aryan ancestors possessed such a disruptive, dangerous
idea.  On the contrary, as Hilda R. Ellis Davidson demonstrates in her 
book, _Gods and Myths of Northern Europe_ [6], our ancestors held the
antithesis of this male-female divisiveness, cooperating as they did with
Nature and all members of the community for the survival of all, most 
importantly those of the female sex.  Contempt for women pervades "civil-
ized" thought, and is a carryover from the Talmud, with its infamous
designation of Gentile women as pieces of meat, or its tirades masquerading
as "prayers" thanking God for not "making me a woman."

   The Jewish paradigm has been part of European philosophy for well over two
millenia.  It has become most blatant in the past two centuries, as modern
technology, driven by pursuit of money, expands exponentially and adversely 
affects the lives of all within its grasp.  The linking of the manipulative 
spirit with the dynamic capabilities of the Aryan peoples has become a soul-
wrenching nightmare for every society on Earth.

   While the desire for knowledge and understanding has always been in our
genes, our healthy quest to understand the beautiful world around us is
corrupted by the Judeo-Christian philosophical monstrosity.  Our drive
to question Why? and How? is perverted into a tool for the advancement of
materialistic ends.  As if they had nothing better to do, the best of 
Northern minds are devoted to dominating Nature.

   It is natural for humans to create art.  The creation of personal tools --
technology -- is art, a manifestation of culture.  Most peoples throughout 
history have observed and discovered the wondrous processes of Nature, and 
have fashioned elements of these processes into life-promoting tools suited 
for the individual.  The Aryan of course has been most prolific at this.  
However, the Jews, and those infected with their noxious spirit, are 
notorious for developing only "tools" -- systems -- such as usury banking, 
that are suited only for the manipulation of a whole society and are not 
only useless, but detrimental to the productive work of the individual 
artisan.  Those who revere Nature tend to subscribe to "microapplications" 
of technology -- that which is personally usable.  Those who view Nature 
and all its parts, including human beings, as objects to be controlled, 
tend to subscribe to "macroapplications" of technology, which influence 
whole communities, regions, even the whole planet.

   Nobel laureate Phillip Lenard wrote:
      [T]he successes of technology have produced a particular form 
   of arrogant material craze.  The exploitation of practical possi-
   bilities provided by the understanding of nature gave rise to the 
   notion of the 'mastery' of nature: 'Man has slowly become master 
   of nature.'  Such expressions in the manner of spiritually impover-
   ished grand technicians have gained much influence through the 
   ostentation made possible by new techniques.  And the effect of the 
   all-undermining alien spirit that has penetrated physics and mathe-
   matics has been to strengthen that influence. [7]

By "alien spirit," Lenard was of course referring to the Jewish spirit.
After a people is infected by this spirit, their natural instincts are
suppressed; they become "domesticated."  Once this occurs, the intricate 
beauty of Nature, vastly more complex than any -- even all -- of mankind's
machinery, becomes an entity to be manipulated to one's grandiose concep-
tualizations.  Quoting Lenard once again:

      Respect for the great teacher and judge Nature will always 
   remain the first mark of true natural research. [8]
   Nature's wildness should be a model for humankind's ways.  Nature combines
the lack of a fixed matrix with the mathematical complexity of DNA.  Infinite
variety is Nature's greatest strength, and lack of it techno-slavery's 
weakness.  The machine, producer of mass-replicated pseudo-culture, disrupts 
this balance between order and chaos.  In his _Autobiography of Values_, 
Charles Lindbergh commented:
      Real freedom lies in wildness, not civilization...As we lose 
   our wild freedoms, we recognize their value in opposition to the 
   tyranny of intellect. [9]

   Anthropocentric philosophy has led to the interracial "ideal," with its
Nature-mocking humanistic altruism.  This philosophical application has not 
been restricted to human ecology, but has struck a blow against all living 
communities.  Humanism, and all other ideologies that deify human beings
and attempt to raise them above the natural Order that is the origin of 
that life, are _life-denying_ and contemptuous of other forms of life of
the plant and non-human animal kingdoms.

   Conquest usually has negative, sometimes deadly, consequences for the 
conquerors.  Careless and sardonic disregard for specific boundaries and
other delineations of the natural Order brings great suffering to later
generations.  Like children, we do not fully comprehend -- _and never 
will_ -- the natural Order, yet we violate the most sacrosanct processes of 
life with our new toys and ideas.  We are deluged with artificial chemicals,
particularly in our nourishment.  We are saturated with elecromagnetic 
radiation from often useless appliances.  Most ominous of all, the Pandora's
box of genetic engineering has been opened.

   Just as it is wrong for humans to interfere in the habitat and lifeways
of other races for unnecessary endeavors, it is equally wrong to interfere
with life processes of Nature in other ways, such as disturbing wildlife 
populations, clear-cutting forests, and polluting bodies of water in the 
pursuit of wealth.  Aryans should heed Heidegger, abandon their arrogance
in trying to "improve" Nature's perfection, and learn to _let things be_.

   Our race's survival is not possible unless we secure victory on the 
spiritual-ideological battlefield *first*.  The soul of our people is 
gravely ill; its regeneration is our primary task.

   It is naive to believe that we can make more than a small impact on the
present political order.  We cannot defeat the enemy on his territory, nor
should we allow ourselves to become his ideological twin by adopting his

   It is time to face reality.  Rather than strategizing about how to restore
America, the intrusive beast that dominates this malevolent civilization, we 
should hope for its quick downfall.  With the collapse of America and the
civilization shored up by its gargantuan military murder machine will come
hardship -- hardship so difficult as to bring countless visits of the Grim
Reaper to those Third World myriads dependent upon America's economic
solvency and agricultural products.  With this apocalyptic transition, 
however -- which many of _us_ will undoubtedly not survive -- will come
the freedom to "instaurate" our people and give them a new start, this time 
with the wisdom gained from twenty centuries of errors.

   The engulfing power of Western Civilization continues to foment our slow,
lingering death.  The sooner that power is abated, the greater the chance
we have for perpetual survival.  Only when America really _is_ dead, shall
we be free.

   "Our territory" includes the realm of religion.  While many are averse 
to the spiritual world, it is the naturalness and unmatchable energy which 
religion can provide that is of crucial importance.  We have an overabun-
dance of reason and intellect, on which Jews and their lackeys thrive.
While a false faith based upon the various Jewish "religions" or a "scientific
animism" is out of the question, a "theistic naturalism" is an appropriate
beginning.  Perhaps this is what the Northern beliefs would have become
had their cultural evolution not been so brutally halted.
   Whatever we do, the Jewish-inspired anthropocentric "ethical" systems
embraced by most of our cohorts must be discarded -- uprooted -- _as
thoroughly as possible_.

   Our "new way" should be founded upon an intensive examination of our
inner selves, upon the remnants of our native culture, and upon the new
experiences we encounter while we are imbued with our new philosophy.  The
North, not Greece and Rome, is our home, ancestrally _and_ philosophically.

   One can learn much from a short time in a place with little or no 
human influence.  The greatest classroom is under the blue or starry sky, 
among the trees, the flowers, the critters.  Those who cannot understand this
have succumbed to the delusions planted by those who wish us dead.

   Our ancestors understood Nature.  We will live through their wisdom.


[1]:  Alfred Rosenberg.  _Der Voelkische Staatsgedanke: Untergang
         und Neugeburt_.  (Muenchen: Franz Eher Nachfolger, 1924).
         Extensive excerpts translated and republished as "The
         Folkish Idea of State," in _Nazi Ideology Before 1933:
         A Documentation_, edited and translated by Barbara Miller
         Lane & Leila J. Rupp  (Austin: University of Texas Press,
         1978), p. 67.

[2]:  Steven S. Schwarzschild.  "The Unnatural Jew," in _Environmental 
         Ethics_, Volume 6, #4 (Winter 1984).

[3]:  _Ibid_, pp. 349, 354.

[4]:  _Ibid_, p. 362

[5]:  Paul Shepard.  "Homage to Heidegger," in _Deep Ecology_, edited 
         by Michael Tobias  (San Diego: Avant Books, 1985), p. 209.

[6]:  Hilda Roderick Ellis Davidson.  _Gods and Myths of Northern 
         Europe_  (New York: Penguin Books, 1990).

[7]:  Phillip Lenard.  _Deutsche Physik, Band 1: Einleitung und 
         Mechanik_  (Muenchen: J.F. Lehmann, 1936).  Translated 
         and cited in _Scientists Under Hitler: Politics and the
         Physics Community in the Third Reich, by Alan D. Beyer-
         chen  (New Haven: Yale University Press, 1977), p. 137.
         Substantial excerpts also translated and republished as
         "The Limits of Science," in _Nazi Culture: Intellectual,
         Cultural and Social Life in the Third Reich, edited by
         George L. Mosse  (New York: Grosset & Dunlap, 1966).

[8]:  Beyerchen, 137.

[9]:  Charles A. Lindbergh.  _Autobiography of Values_.  Edited 
         by William Jovanovich & Judith A. Schiff  (New York:
         Harcourt Brace Jovanovich, 1978), p. 39.


The above is an adaptation of the original text of my article published in 
_Instauration_, November 1993, pp. 10-11, signed because of editorial policy 
with my secondary pseudonym "RICHARD HENRY LEE."

-- Milton John Kleim, Jr. 

Post Office Box 76
Cape Canaveral, FL  32920

Sample issue: $4

From oneb!!!!!!!!!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Tue Feb 22 21:21:51 PST 1994
Article: 7994 of alt.revisionism
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Holocaust Almanac - One, by One, by One...(Conclusions)
Message-ID: <>
Date: 22 Feb 94 11:12:52 -0500
References: <>
Lines: 11

Ken Mcvay posts:

>Archive/File: holocaust/miller conclusion
>Last-Modified: 1994/02/04

In response, I say:



From oneb!!!!!wupost!decwrl!decwrl!concert!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Sun Feb 27 19:59:00 PST 1994
Article: 8224 of alt.revisionism
Path: oneb!!!!!wupost!decwrl!decwrl!concert!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: The Revisionist Game
Message-ID: <>
Date: 27 Feb 94 19:40:31 -0500
Lines: 73

Gordon McFee writes:

>So, I put it to the "deniers".  To the Dan Gannon's, the 
>Milton Kleim's, the Ricardo Joshua's.  Explain succinctly and 
>inteligently why you deny.  

As I have said before, the criminal actions of European and World Jewry
against Germany and other Aryan European states would have justified
unparalleled brutal measures against Jewry.  Had the "Holocaust" occurred,
I would still not apologize for it, and would have no guilt whatsoever
for my (non-existent) role as an Aryan in it.  

However, I do not believe in the so-called "Holocaust" (i.e. the deliberate 
and calculated extermination of Jewry in "gas chambers" as a policy of the 
legally and popularly elected National Socialist German government of Adolf 
Hitler).  I have come to this conclusion after reading numerous works -- 
including many by Holocaust Myth defenders -- on the plight of the Jews 
under World War II German hegemony, and other works on the Jewish question 
from many times and places and from a wide-array of perspectives, even Jewish.  
As a student of Jewry, I have learned from the works of many renowned 
individuals (no, not National Socialists) that they have an unique -- 
often sinister -- disposition, with an attitude towards survival that 
the end justifies any means.  The lie of the Holocaust is a manifestation 
of this adoption of the maxim "the ends justify the means."  While it is 
acceptable for Jews to use this tactic, National Socialist Germany is 
damned for countering it. 

That Jewry would create a cleverly constructed Myth demonstrates that the
measures taken by National Socialist Germany and her allies during the
war, as well as ALL anti-Jewish measures by nearly every European nation
throughout the past two millenia, *were and are justified*.

>Tell me why the individuals I met in Germany lied to me.  

The persons whom you met may or may not have consciously lied to you.
It is probable that the social coercion, displayed in subconscious 
conformity, of the overwhelming mythology of the Holocaust caused them
to actually *believe* that their people were slaughtered by the Germans 
in "gas chambers."

>Explain why the Nazis wrote all those documents.  

The genuine documents (like genuine photographs) presented as "proof" of 
the Holocaust prove nothing without annotation.  Most of the other 
"documents" presented as "proof" are total or partial forgeries.

>We are not "defenders", we are the decent people.  

Your side's actions prove otherwise.  And if Holocaust defenders are
the "decent people," why was someone like Mr. Hart, who showed utmost
politeness and requested that no one "throw knives" at him, attacked and
mocked for daring to have doubts about your "revealed truth" of the 
Holocaust?  Why are peaceful people like Faurisson and Zundel attacked 
physically by thugs promoting the Holocaust?

>We have nothing to "defend".

Show us that you have nothing to defend.  Stop posting your documents
and your commentary in support of the Holocaust Myth.  If we revisionists
are liars, let our falsehoods collapse under their own weight of deceit.
Or do you fear that the public will see the truth of our material...

>racism, in all its ugly incarnations, must be opposed to the 
>bitter end.  

How about starting with Israel, the "racist blight" in the Middle East.
Or Judaism, which spawns people like the maniacs who machine-gunned 
peaceful worshippers a couple days ago.  Let the Jews, who have caused
untold trouble to every host they have had (provoking "anti-Semitism"
in the process), "show the way" and end *their* racist ways.  If the
Jews can do this, then the World *will* live in peace.


From oneb!!!!!wupost!decwrl!decwrl!concert!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN Sun Feb 27 20:34:03 PST 1994
Article: 8226 of alt.revisionism
Path: oneb!!!!!wupost!decwrl!decwrl!concert!!!!!TIGGER.STCLOUD.MSUS.EDU!HERMANN
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: A new Way
Message-ID: <>
Date: 27 Feb 94 20:10:26 -0500
References: <> <2kgl5r$>,<>
Distribution: world
Lines: 21

Tony Q. writes:

>   Indeed.
>   Jewish law permitted money-lending, Christian law didn't. Given
>that Jews were not permitted to own land, they naturally turned to
>this field, and grew rich on it as trade increased in the tenth and
>eleventh centuries. 

So the usual story goes...   Ho hum...

>   (Source: _The Day The Universe Changed_, James Burke)

You quote James Burke; I draw on the works of Werner Sombart.  Burke
is proficient at producing superficial books and TV programs for 
the not-too-bright.

>   Milton, you're a fool.

Thank you for your meaningless opinion.


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