The Nizkor Project: Remembering the Holocaust (Shoah)

Shofar FTP Archive File: people/g/graves.george/1995/graves.1095


From gmgraves@aimnet.com Tue Oct 17 08:11:36 PDT 1995
Article: 6360 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: attn: all racists...
Date: 17 Oct 1995 07:01:46 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 6
Message-ID: <45vkcq$5gd@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45nhnc$48j@nyx10.cs.du.edu> <45pubu$a2h@ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>  <45s6mk$8pe@spectator.cris.com> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.19
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: jeannek@darkwing.uoregon.edu
X-URL: news:jeannek-1510951933470001@lanrover2-line5.uoregon.edu

>There are many humorous things in the world: among them the white >man's notion that he is less savage than the other savages."
> Mark Twain

He might not be less savage, but he sure is a hell of a lot smarter!




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 10:40:12 PDT 1995
Article: 11710 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.black,alt.revisionism,alt.discrimination,soc.culture.african.american,alt.discrimination,alt.fan.oj-simpson
Subject: Re: Report from the Million Man March
Date: 19 Oct 1995 20:32:59 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <466clr$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4631fn$m8s@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4642dq$1he@pan.ghgcorp.com> <4647q4$8e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: student@indiana.edu
X-URL: news:4647q4$8e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4814 alt.politics.white-power:6786 alt.revisionism:11710 alt.discrimination:37582 soc.culture.african.american:106319 alt.fan.oj-simpson:45140


>You may dislike the fact that Farrakhan does not think that white people
>have the best interests of blacks at heart. You may not like
>the idea that he does not implore blacks to beg whites for integration.
>You may be hostile to his notion that blacks should work among 
>themselves without white help in order to be uplifted. But I think that
>any comparison to Fuhramn, Hitler, the KKK is unfounded, dangerous 
>and mal-intentioned.
>
>Civilized Man
>
>"Doing this forever and you ask 'since when?'"
>-X-Clan


The interesting thing here is that it is the liberal "black-apologists"
who don't like Farrakhan. We anti-blacks like him. He knows what
Jews are and he is finally someone that blacks will listen to on this
subject. He knows that the Jew uses blacks as a tool to destroy this
country. Now, thanks to Farrakhan, many blacks know it as well. He
also wants the U.S. government to supply the black population of this
country with a 'black homeland' either on this continent or on some 
other and to support it for 20 years. This may not be too practical, but it sure is a good idea. I and many millions of whites like me
would certainly feel that such an endeavor is a much better
expenditure of our tax dollars than is the welfare system. I would be
willing to actively support such a movement with a generous 
donation of both money and time. 
Long live Louis Farrakhan!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:11:01 PDT 1995
Article: 4792 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.reston.ans.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!uwm.edu!lll-winken.llnl.gov!enews.sgi.com!decwrl!pagesat.net!netserv.com!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Million man march?  Ha!
Date: 18 Oct 1995 20:56:50 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <463pmi$kdr@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <451bvr$p39@kaiwan.kaiwan.com> <459qvl$qg_012@com.mindspring.com> <460viq$qnc@news2.isp.net> <461kp6$h79@mozo.cc.purdue.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-4.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: cabdulbh@expert.cc.purdue.edu
X-URL: news:461kp6$h79@mozo.cc.purdue.edu
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.discrimination:37561 alt.politics.white-power:6760 alt.politics.nationalism.white:4792 soc.culture.african.american:106294


> 
>first of all, to imply that African-American's have not contributed 
>anything of significance to this United Snakes of America is ignorance at 
>it's finest.  We invented that streetlight you use everyday to make sure 
>your butt doesn't have too many accidents on your way home, we invented 
>refrigerated cars(on trains)so that you could lower your salt intake when 
>eating your steaks, we invented all those marvelous ways to use 
>peanuts--ask Tide how we've helped their business, the toilet system was 
>invented in Africa, that phone you like to talk on so much was via the 
>African-American, and the electricity you need to use this computer would 
>not exist if not for the descendants of Africa.  So don't tell me that we 
>have not contributed to this country, because even if you'd like to 
>disregard all of that information, you cannot disregard the fact that 
>this country would not exist today without the blood and sweat of the 
>AFRICAN slave.


It's the easiest thing in the world to produce a laundry list of 
"inventions" supposedly originated by blacks. Where is the 
provenance for these inventions? For instance, The streetlight
was invented (as far as we know) by an unknown citizen of Cordoba
Spain sometime before the turn of the last millenium. Now, he was 
probably a Moor and thus a Semite. Your average Arab would 
probably take grave offense at being considered a negro. The first
refrigerated rail cars were invented in Australia at the end of the
last century to transport beef and lamb to market. I don't really
remember the name of the man who actually invented the thing, but
I doubt that in 19th century Australia, he would be a black man. 
Edison invented the Dynamo, and Nicolai Tesla, a Czech, came up
with the idea of alternating current for electrical distribution. To
my recollection, neither Edison nor Tesla were black. 
I would like to see you post a list of these inventions again, this
time with the names of the blacks who invented them. This way,
those of us who are interested can look these people up and see
for ourselves what race they were. Is that not fair?

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:11:02 PDT 1995
Article: 4814 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.black,alt.revisionism,alt.discrimination,soc.culture.african.american,alt.discrimination,alt.fan.oj-simpson
Subject: Re: Report from the Million Man March
Date: 19 Oct 1995 20:32:59 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <466clr$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4631fn$m8s@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4642dq$1he@pan.ghgcorp.com> <4647q4$8e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: student@indiana.edu
X-URL: news:4647q4$8e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4814 alt.politics.white-power:6786 alt.revisionism:11710 alt.discrimination:37582 soc.culture.african.american:106319 alt.fan.oj-simpson:45140


>You may dislike the fact that Farrakhan does not think that white people
>have the best interests of blacks at heart. You may not like
>the idea that he does not implore blacks to beg whites for integration.
>You may be hostile to his notion that blacks should work among 
>themselves without white help in order to be uplifted. But I think that
>any comparison to Fuhramn, Hitler, the KKK is unfounded, dangerous 
>and mal-intentioned.
>
>Civilized Man
>
>"Doing this forever and you ask 'since when?'"
>-X-Clan


The interesting thing here is that it is the liberal "black-apologists"
who don't like Farrakhan. We anti-blacks like him. He knows what
Jews are and he is finally someone that blacks will listen to on this
subject. He knows that the Jew uses blacks as a tool to destroy this
country. Now, thanks to Farrakhan, many blacks know it as well. He
also wants the U.S. government to supply the black population of this
country with a 'black homeland' either on this continent or on some 
other and to support it for 20 years. This may not be too practical, but it sure is a good idea. I and many millions of whites like me
would certainly feel that such an endeavor is a much better
expenditure of our tax dollars than is the welfare system. I would be
willing to actively support such a movement with a generous 
donation of both money and time. 
Long live Louis Farrakhan!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:25 PDT 1995
Article: 6497 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!kryten.awinc.com!news.netnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Hey niggers! Want your own country?
Date: 17 Oct 1995 19:18:28 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <460vi4$aj7@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45ebmb$o25$2@mhade.production.compuserve.com> <45f3l2$1iu@daryl.scsn.net> <45p8t9$k95@thales.nmia.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.20
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: Darkjedi@nmia.com
X-URL: news:45p8t9$k95@thales.nmia.com

>Hey you lousy white bastard!
>
>How's it going?  I guess after a time you've heard everything.  Let me tell you something:
>
>Just as your white supremicists are well entrenched, so are the Black people in this country.  
>You have no one to blame but yourselves because you brought us here.  You "inflicted" Black
>People on yourselves so live with it.  I'd like to see any of your flunkeys try to remove
>us from the US.  Talk about a Civil War that your kind will lose again.  We'll annihilate 
>the lot of you.
>
>Black is Beautiful and Power to the People!

"We'll annihilate the lot of you". Words of wisdom from a monkey. You 
stupid nigger, your kind is only 12% of the population. How the hell 
are you going to win a war against the rest of us? We have the guns
we have the brains (you niggers with your average IQ of 85 couldn't
mount a cohesive campaign against whites if you tried) You've got
nothing because you've done nothing. Yeah, our ancestors brought 
you here; that's something we regret, but it's in the past. What we can do is fix it. First we'll put you animals under martial law, then
we'll round you up and kick you out. Ask your "Reverend" Farrakhan where you can go. We American whites don't care as long as its not here.

George Graves 





From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:26 PDT 1995
Article: 6499 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: TO YOU RACIST FUCKHEADS
Date: 17 Oct 1995 19:41:29 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <4610t9$arm@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4602ph$nfe@netside.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.6
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: Sid@netside.com
X-URL: news:4602ph$nfe@netside.com

You know Sid, if we upset you so much, you shouldn't be on this 
forum. It plainly says "white-power"; you know, cavaet emptor,
read the lables, etc.
I suspect you are Jewish (very few christians named Sid, although I 
have known a few. If I am wrong, I appologize. Just take this as an
open note to all the Sids out there who are Jewish). If you are, I well
understand your point of view. You and your people have worked hard
through your control of the media to destroy this country and your
avowed enemy, the goyim. You are the authors of the type of 
liberalism which has created generations of confused, misguided
Americans (called liberals or democrates). But that's all ending now.
You can stand by and watch as we slowly return this country to the 
way it used to be. It will take time, but it will be done. You Jews
have failed. All of your big media guns are being shown for what they
are - a propoganda machine for Jewish liberalism. We aren't listening
any more Sid, and there are more of us every day. In short, you lose!

George Graves  




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:27 PDT 1995
Article: 6500 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.fan.oj-simpson,soc.culture.african.american,talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: White America Thanks You Mr.Cochran
Date: 17 Oct 1995 19:44:09 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <461129$arm@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <454u1i$hff@spectator.cris.com> <459807$8aq@maureen.teleport.com> <45ag6j$8qo@ionews.io.org>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.6
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: getting@the.heart.of.it
X-URL: news:getting-1410951037050001@geoaxm.fiu.edu
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.fan.oj-simpson:44962 soc.culture.african.american:106127 talk.politics.misc:283421 alt.politics.clinton:180065 alt.politics.white-power:6500

getting@the.heart.of.it (Farkward P. Parkenfarker) wrote:
>Holy Moses!
>
>Is this thread dumber than linoleum, or what?
>
>-- 
>I used to think I was stupid, but then I found alt.fan.rush-limbaugh

Think again. You ARE stupid.




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:27 PDT 1995
Article: 6534 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.reston.ans.net!swrinde!sgigate.sgi.com!enews.sgi.com!decwrl!pagesat.net!netserv.com!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Half Million Mean Monkeys on the Mall
Date: 17 Oct 1995 06:59:12 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <45vk80$5gd@news2.aimnet.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.19
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:alt.politics.white-power

Well, The "Million Monkey (er, Man) March is over.
I don't know how many of the white people on
this forum managed to catch any of it on the tube
today or any of the pre-game festivities on C-Span
last night, but if any of you did, then you know that
the gauntlet for the race war has been thrown. I'm
sure that those of us who have known the black for 
what it truly is for many years have been joined in
our assesment by many newly initiated souls. The
nigger has made it very clear today and last night
that if we whites don't "give" him a better life, 
he's going to take it by force. The Negro is simply
a predator. In its natural habitat, the buck simply 
takes what it wants, and if the rightful owner gets
in it its way, it just kills. This is what we are up
against. A predator to which civilization is but a 
gossamer thin veneer, one to which killing, raping
and stealing are a way of life. This thing is an animal.
We have to do something about it before it kills all
of us.
By the way. I like Calypso Louie. He knows what jews are,
and wants niggers to get out of the USA and form their
own country (Ha!). He may hate me, but his ideas are sure good.
How about starting a fund to send niggers away? I'm sure
millions of white Americans would gladly contribute. We
could take all of those old WW2 liberty ships out of mothballs
and......

George Graves
A racist, and damned proud of it!




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:28 PDT 1995
Article: 6616 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!miwok!ultra.sonic.net!pagesat.net!netserv.com!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Half Million Mean Monkeys on the Mall
Date: 17 Oct 1995 18:44:43 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <460tir$aj7@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45vk80$5gd@news2.aimnet.com> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.20
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: loquismo@aimnet.com
X-URL: news:loquismo-1710950159340001@204.118.64.29


>
>Why don't we use some of the leftover money from the purchase of those
>uninhabited islands for the Aryan Republic to buy the black separitists
>their own islands?
>
>Oh, I think you're overreacting. What makes you think that they're all
>going to go home and start a bloody revolution? There's no real reason to
>believe that anything will immediately change. After all, Farrakhan's
>speech was so long 
>(2 1/2 hours) that many in the crowd drifted away long before he finished.

It wasn't Farrakhan who said that if we didn't give the niggers what they wan't, they'd use force against us, it was speakers like A=
lron (SP?) Maddox who said things like that. As far as over-reacting goes, maybe wishful thinking is a better description. We need t=
o galvanize John Q. Whitey against these animals. A race war would do it.
Regards
George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:29 PDT 1995
Article: 6617 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!miwok!ultra.sonic.net!pagesat.net!netserv.com!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: What so wrong about being White?
Date: 17 Oct 1995 19:06:00 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <460uqo$aj7@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <1995Oct11.151344.2187@wpg.ramp.net> <45paoo$ilt@limestone.kosone.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.20
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: Rick
X-URL: news:45paoo$ilt@limestone.kosone.com

Rick Jones wrote:
>>   Joe Lockhart  writes:
>>  What do white people want?
>>  
>>  What people want the same things that the jews want,
>>  a land for their people. Israel is a "Jewish" state, all we
>>  want is a White Christian state.
>
>So move to Sweden, or Norway.  There are hardly ANY
>minorities there.  Switzerland also has very few minorities.
>Or find some little country and start one up yourself.  
>But don't start it here;, 'cause that's a civil war you're 
>destined to lose big.

We don't want to move to Sweden or Norway or Switzerland. You seem
to forget (or maybe you never knew) white people built this nation. 
Not the nigger, not the amerind, not the chinaman - WHITE PEOPLE. So 
why must we leave our own country, and abandon it to non-whites? 
We want our country back. We want to be able to walk our city 
streets in safety, leave our homes unlocked when we go to the store, 
let our kids walk themselves to school without an armed escort.
Impossible you say? With all of these inferior races filling this
country up on a daily basis, you are right, it is impossible. But if we
send these people back to their country of color, we can have it all
again. A free, white America! like it used to be before we let the 
nigger run wild.
We will start it here, and we will ultimately win. More and more
white Americans are waking up to the bill of liberal goods they've
been sold over much of this century. All we need to do is to send
more and more real conservatives to our state and national
legislatures and the laws will be passed, the non-whites will be
rounded-up and deported. It is our destiny to have a white country
again!

George Graves 







From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:30 PDT 1995
Article: 6654 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les in the Kalahari...
Date: 18 Oct 1995 20:36:57 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <463oh9$k99@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <460j5f$trg@news.scott.net>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-4.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: syc225@nwu.edu
X-URL: news:syc225-1810950028200001@hin082039.res-hall.nwu.edu

syc225@nwu.edu (Sherwin) wrote:
>I
>> 
>> Yes, the White man can take credit for elevating those Stone Age savages
>> out of their perpetual backwardness, and introducing them to civilization.
>>  Get it straight, Foot-boy:  whatever is good in African nations (and
>> that's a rarity, but still...) was introduced by the White man.  Left to
>> their own, negroes would still be tribal nomads.
>> 
>
>Interesting.  The African nations elevated the once, barbaric European
>civilization ages ago.  They can very well do it again one of these days. 
>In fact, isn't it written in the Bible somewhere that Africans will reign
>supreme someday?
>
>
>Sherwin

Uh, Sherwin, that African nation you speak of was ancient Egypt, 
was it not? If so, then you are technically correct. We Euro's owe
much to ancient Egypt. But Egyptians weren't negroes, they were
ancestors of what we now call Semitic peoples. Perhaps I'm 
splitting hairs here, but I believe that the writer to whom you
were responding was refering to Black Africa, even though he/she
did not specifically say that. Nes pas?

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:31 PDT 1995
Article: 6655 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Jew World Order
Date: 18 Oct 1995 21:06:56 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 139
Message-ID: <463q9g$kdr@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <462c90$cb9@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-4.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: dleonik@aol.com
X-URL: news:462c90$cb9@newsbf02.news.aol.com

dleonik@aol.com (DLeonik) wrote:
>The following comments are mine and mine alone. I believe that I am
>protected
>in what I write by the First Amendment to the United States Constituition.
>
>                         The FBI and the ADL be damned!
>
>
>The Jew World Order is being exposed  more and more for what it really is.
>
>
>First lets see what it is not. It is not what it pretends to be. It is not
>the beginning of the "millenium" whereby all "men" are equal and all races
>share the bountiful fruits of the world; a one world with no divisions, no
>classes, no religions (save unbridled worship of everthing jewish), no
>genders, perhaps not even any discrimination against any living thing! A
>peaceful, happy world where lifespans expand to infinity and hate, anger
>and
>jealously are replaced with love, peace, and compassion. THAT is the
>version
>the jews give to the gullible boobs that swallow any and everything
>offered
>it, so long as it's done in an authoritative, professional manner as on
>mainstream TV.
>
>In the inner folds of their organizations, I suspect the leaders of the
>Jew
>World Order know exactly what they have in store for us:  Race conflict
>and
>strife, Ethnic conflict and strife, Class conflict and strife, Gender
>conflict and strife, Generation conflict and strife, Religious conflict
>and
>strife and on and on. How do they do it? By forcing people of radical
>differences in race to live, work, school, and "church" together. By
>endless
>"psycho-babble" amount men abusing women, glorifying materialism, women
>are
>men, old is young, etc. ad nauseum; with the power of a police state and
>abundant coffers of dollars to bribe, blackmail and weave us all together
>in
>this unholy, chaotic nightmare. 
>
>Look how they solve the problems of the world. Ethnic strife in Bosnia?
>Open
>the American and European pocketbooks to bribe key officials. Muslim
>fundamentalism? Once again flood the fakirs and PLO leaders with YOUR tax
>money! Civil strife in Mexico? $12 billion in loan grants to their ruling
>elites who preside over a mestizo population that will NEVER be elevated
>any
>further than they already are - which is one or two shades above a
>Congolise
>man-ape. The pattern is the same the world over. As long as the boobs of
>America and Europe continue this fools folly, the problems increase
>exponentially with time. The bastards in charge create the problem, then
>come
>in like gang busters or knights on white horses to solve the problem with
>the
>use of YOUR MONEY. Remember:  the true wealth in any Nation is in the
>productivity, inventiveness and CREATIVITY of its indigenous population.
>As
>the White nations of the world become more and more bastardized and
>mongrelized like an India or a Mexico, the wealth of the nation will
>plummet.
>They know it, WE know it and now YOU know it! They already have all the
>wealth they can possibly steal. They want power AND wealth and they
>already
>have that too. The only thing they fear is a populist uprising that will
>defeat their supremely EVIL plans:  hence the attacks on the only groups
>or
>organizations they haven't got their perfidious hooks into - the militias,
>the fundamentalists, and the "Nazis". Especially the "Nazis". They spoiled
>their plans 60-odd years ago and will be forever hated as the jews hate
>the
>Roman Empire even to this day. The resurgence of "Nazis" post WWII has
>them
>shrieking and wailing from Tel Aviv to YOUR hometown. They see "Nazis"
>behind
>every bush, every corner, every deserted railroad track and isolated
>aircraft
>control tower. And if they don't see them there, then they will have their
>hired DOGS -  the FBI and the BATF - plant whatever evidence is needed.
>They
>create the problem - then they solve it by using YOUR MONEY and taking
>away
>YOUR FREEDOMS. Whether its Drugs or Nazis, Hate Crimes or Ecological
>'Disasters'.
>
>What can we do about it? Well, the fact that the enemy is forced to use
>repressive laws and fake evidence just shows how internally corrupt and
>weak
>they really are. They are racked with self-guilt and distrustful of
>everybody. In a word they are CORRUPT. All we have to do is maintain our
>commitment to TRUTH, LOYALITY, and HONOR. Have the truely NOBLE virtues
>that
>the enemy so woefully lacks. The dollars they use to bribe, blackmail and
>blacklist will be worthless soon enough. Their corruption and degeneracy
>will
>feed on itself, if it isn't already doing so. Keep your mind and body
>PURE.
>TURN AWAY from their world of FILTH and RACE-MIXING, turn off the TV and
>rediscover the LOVE of your FOLK, your HERITAGE, and mostly your FAMILY.
>BOND
>together with like minded people as never before. SPEND your ever
>dwindling
>money and time WISELY. KEEP THE FAITH of our RACE and our NATIONS. THEY
>are
>the evil ones who kill their best people. THEY are the ones who are doomed
>and will be cursed in the history books forever - for if perchance they do
>win, (and they won't), then the results of the steep decline of humanity
>won't care about extraneous things such as history or aesthetics - they
>will
>be a crawling, grasping, horde of wretches and skraelings just trying to
>live
>day by day without White people's technology, science, generousity and
>CREATIVITY to save them. (By the way, I agree that it was because of our
>"help" that conditions worsened in the third world. We should never have
>interfered with their "way of life". Weaklings among us felt that they
>should
>do something, and they acted in a manner more to placate their own
>shortcomings than to genuinely help those wretches.)
>
>In summary, as long as we maintain our NOBILITY as WHITE PEOPLE we will
>survive, later expand, and still later advance to greater levels of
>existence. Let the muds and mud-lovers fall away and be culled by NATURE.
>It
>has happened many times before in EVOLUTION, and it's happening NOW.



All too true. But remember, in order to fully succeed, the Jew must
utterly destroy his hated enemy, the White Northern European 
(sometimes called the Aryan). This he is trying his damndest to do
by promoting race mixing with the black (the Jew believes that
he can control the negro, so if he mixes the white with the black
he will eliminate us and produce a mongrel race that he can control.

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:31 PDT 1995
Article: 6760 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.reston.ans.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!uwm.edu!lll-winken.llnl.gov!enews.sgi.com!decwrl!pagesat.net!netserv.com!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,soc.culture.african.american
Subject: Re: Million man march?  Ha!
Date: 18 Oct 1995 20:56:50 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <463pmi$kdr@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <451bvr$p39@kaiwan.kaiwan.com> <459qvl$qg_012@com.mindspring.com> <460viq$qnc@news2.isp.net> <461kp6$h79@mozo.cc.purdue.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-4.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: cabdulbh@expert.cc.purdue.edu
X-URL: news:461kp6$h79@mozo.cc.purdue.edu
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.discrimination:37561 alt.politics.white-power:6760 alt.politics.nationalism.white:4792 soc.culture.african.american:106294


> 
>first of all, to imply that African-American's have not contributed 
>anything of significance to this United Snakes of America is ignorance at 
>it's finest.  We invented that streetlight you use everyday to make sure 
>your butt doesn't have too many accidents on your way home, we invented 
>refrigerated cars(on trains)so that you could lower your salt intake when 
>eating your steaks, we invented all those marvelous ways to use 
>peanuts--ask Tide how we've helped their business, the toilet system was 
>invented in Africa, that phone you like to talk on so much was via the 
>African-American, and the electricity you need to use this computer would 
>not exist if not for the descendants of Africa.  So don't tell me that we 
>have not contributed to this country, because even if you'd like to 
>disregard all of that information, you cannot disregard the fact that 
>this country would not exist today without the blood and sweat of the 
>AFRICAN slave.


It's the easiest thing in the world to produce a laundry list of 
"inventions" supposedly originated by blacks. Where is the 
provenance for these inventions? For instance, The streetlight
was invented (as far as we know) by an unknown citizen of Cordoba
Spain sometime before the turn of the last millenium. Now, he was 
probably a Moor and thus a Semite. Your average Arab would 
probably take grave offense at being considered a negro. The first
refrigerated rail cars were invented in Australia at the end of the
last century to transport beef and lamb to market. I don't really
remember the name of the man who actually invented the thing, but
I doubt that in 19th century Australia, he would be a black man. 
Edison invented the Dynamo, and Nicolai Tesla, a Czech, came up
with the idea of alternating current for electrical distribution. To
my recollection, neither Edison nor Tesla were black. 
I would like to see you post a list of these inventions again, this
time with the names of the blacks who invented them. This way,
those of us who are interested can look these people up and see
for ourselves what race they were. Is that not fair?

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:32 PDT 1995
Article: 6775 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Half Million Mean Monkeys on the Mall
Date: 19 Oct 1995 19:28:23 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <4668sn$sjr@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45vk80$5gd@news2.aimnet.com> <461tlr$67p@news.scott.net> <463n19$k99@news2.aimnet.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.2
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:463n19$k99@news2.aimnet.com

From: stefan@scott.net
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 11:55:59 -0700
Subject: Re: Half Million Mean Monkeys on the Mall
To: George Graves 
X-Mailer: AIR Mail 3.X (SPRY, Inc.)


>>I'll tell you what I've told others. This forum is for and about white
>>supremists. If that concept bothers you, go away!
>>By stating that I lack education, you make assumptions not in
>>evidence. If, by that statement you mean that I lack Liberal Jewish
>>brainwashing, you are correct.  You also take too much upon 
>>yourself
>>when you make assumptions about one's intelligence. Fact is, Mr.
>>Evil Beavis, if you spent less time watching your namesake on MTV
>>and studying history, psychology or other useful sciences, you 
>>might find real arguments to contribute here instead of resorting
>>to personal rancor, which is all you ever do.

>>George Graves

>Oh, so calling people niggers does not constitute rancor?? I mean, do >you 
>really believe you have a monopoly on this country and its culture?? >As I 
>said, you morons are really stupid...

>eB
Beavis. I call blacks "niggers" because they have proven to me over
the last 30 or so years that this is exactly what they are. When in
college, I was a raving liberal, even got myself thrown out of my
aunt's house when I told here that blacks were just as good as she.
So I've been there. I just realized over time that these people were
never going to assimilate, and that theirs was a bankrupt culture with nothing to offer but ignorance, crime and dependency on the 
government of this country for sustinance. This hardly constitutes
rancor. 
On the other hand, In my debate with you, you will notice that I never
call you names. Name calling conveys no message, no information. All
that one can infer from someone who resorts to personal rancor in a
debate is that he or she HAS NOTHING OF SUBSTANCE TO SAY, and in
their impotent rage, have resorted to the lowest form of argument.

George Graves 
 








From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:33 PDT 1995
Article: 6783 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Please stay in N. America you WP morons!
Date: 19 Oct 1995 20:18:37 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <466bqt$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <463kpc$hfc@news.scott.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: stefan@scott.net
X-URL: news:463kpc$hfc@news.scott.net

evil Beavis  wrote:
>It is a joke to see these wp morons from America bitch and moan about Aryan 
>purity and Norse heritage etc. Most Europeans laugh at these inbred mutts. We 
>don't want you in Sweden, nor in Germany. Most of us Europeans, and yes - even 
>the once with a hint of "Aryan" still in us, despise what you stand for. So please 
>stay in the U.S. and Canada! 
>By the way, if you ever can afford to go visit your "beloved" German "Reich" I 
>think you'll be quite disappointed when you see how dark most Germans are... 
>Furthermore, I think you'd be terrified about the future of us Aryans up in 
>Scandinavia since black women are very popular amongst Swedes, Norwegian, 
>Danes, and Norther Germans etc.!! Screwin' up the "race" I guess... 
>
>eB

I understand now! You are writing from Scandanavia! I didn't realize
that. You speak so vehemetly in favor of American blacks, that I 
thought you were one of our confused liberals.
Well, no wonder you talk as you do. You have no real experience with
our "black" brother. You haven't lived where he is a constant source
of crime. You haven't seen how he lives. You don't know what his 
priorities are. Well, if the conditions in Northern Europe are as 
condusive to blacks as you say they are, then you will very soon find
out what we already know: i.e. blacks and whites cannot live together
in substantial numbers. Oh what a rude awakening you poor folkes
have in store for you! If you live long enough to experience the 
darkening of your country with millions of negroes, I, for one, will
be glad to welcome you over to this side of the argument. Believe me,
you will change your mind! Its too bad that rampant liberalism has
infected western man to such a degree. It is a bigger shame that in
order for Europeans to find out what the black really is, they have to
follow the same road as America. The real problem here is that when
you do find out that we racists are correct in our assesment of blacks, it will be too late. You'll have them then!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:34 PDT 1995
Article: 6786 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.black,alt.revisionism,alt.discrimination,soc.culture.african.american,alt.discrimination,alt.fan.oj-simpson
Subject: Re: Report from the Million Man March
Date: 19 Oct 1995 20:32:59 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <466clr$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4631fn$m8s@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4642dq$1he@pan.ghgcorp.com> <4647q4$8e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: student@indiana.edu
X-URL: news:4647q4$8e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4814 alt.politics.white-power:6786 alt.revisionism:11710 alt.discrimination:37582 soc.culture.african.american:106319 alt.fan.oj-simpson:45140


>You may dislike the fact that Farrakhan does not think that white people
>have the best interests of blacks at heart. You may not like
>the idea that he does not implore blacks to beg whites for integration.
>You may be hostile to his notion that blacks should work among 
>themselves without white help in order to be uplifted. But I think that
>any comparison to Fuhramn, Hitler, the KKK is unfounded, dangerous 
>and mal-intentioned.
>
>Civilized Man
>
>"Doing this forever and you ask 'since when?'"
>-X-Clan


The interesting thing here is that it is the liberal "black-apologists"
who don't like Farrakhan. We anti-blacks like him. He knows what
Jews are and he is finally someone that blacks will listen to on this
subject. He knows that the Jew uses blacks as a tool to destroy this
country. Now, thanks to Farrakhan, many blacks know it as well. He
also wants the U.S. government to supply the black population of this
country with a 'black homeland' either on this continent or on some 
other and to support it for 20 years. This may not be too practical, but it sure is a good idea. I and many millions of whites like me
would certainly feel that such an endeavor is a much better
expenditure of our tax dollars than is the welfare system. I would be
willing to actively support such a movement with a generous 
donation of both money and time. 
Long live Louis Farrakhan!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Fri Oct 20 11:12:35 PDT 1995
Article: 6791 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Blonde Negresses
Date: 19 Oct 1995 20:52:28 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <466dqc$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45t1uq$1cqc@news.gate.net> <45u8mh$b76@news.scott.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: stefan@scott.net
X-URL: news:45u8mh$b76@news.scott.net

evil Beavis  wrote:
>>   salty@gate.net writes:
>>  Why do female niggers dye their hair blonde and war blue contacts?
>>  
>>  So black men will date them!
>>  
>>                       Salty
>>  
>>>>>
>Uhh, why do white women tan and dye their hair dark?
>
>So that white men will date them!
>
>I guess black men like white women and white men black women huh?!!
>
>eB

Not in this country eB. Cross dating and mixed marriages are quite rare. Not living here you have a distorted view of how the black and
white cultures of this country interact. Even the most virulant pro-
black liberals usually don't date or marry blacks. Those who do, usually have some ax to grind. For instance: I know a white woman
who was married at one time to a black man. She freely admits that
she did it to spite her father, who was anti-black, and with whom
she did not get along. (her brainwashing by her '60's schooling
has made her a raving liberal). This is usually the case in this 
country. 
On the other hand, American black males DO like white females. 
especially blue-eyed, blonde ones. Who can blame them? Its what
they see in every TV commercial. The grew up watching beautiful
white women on TV and in magazines. When they are teens, they 
find that publications designed to cater to the prurient interests 
of adolescents feature white women as the ultimate in desireability.
It is only natural that black males should respond to this
conditioning in much the same way as do white males. The reverse
is, however, not true. White American males do not, generally lust
after black females (of course there are exceptions to every 
generalization).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 11:52:03 PDT 1995
Article: 11890 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!esol.intermedia.com!emi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.fan.oj-simpson,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power,soc.culture.african.american,alt.discrimination,alt.revisionism,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Polarization of the races...
Date: 19 Oct 1995 19:58:43 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <466alj$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References:   <451u36$jom@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: igor@adacel.com.au
X-URL: news:igor.240.000E99D2@adacel.com.au
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.fan.oj-simpson:45246 alt.politics.nationalism.white:4954 alt.politics.white-power:6960 soc.culture.african.american:106424 alt.discrimination:37673 alt.revisionism:11890 soc.culture.jewish:12265

igor@adacel.com.au (Igor Siemienowicz) wrote:
>In article  brian@hevanet.com (Brian) writes:
>
>>> >I'm not sure who committed these murders.  I'm not convinced it was O.J.
>>> >I have faith that whomever it was will pay the price.  I'm also certain
>>> >that the people who are upset with the verdict are upset because they 
>>> >believe O.J. is guilty.  I understand this.  I don't think people can 
>>> >control what they believe.  Even if it was O.J. I feel it was a just 
>>> >verdict.  After all our system is designed so that guilty people go
>>> >free because of our fear that any innocent person would be put in jail.
>
>>This is the BIG lie. OJ murdered the mother of his children and another
>>man and he smeared their blood all over your face.
>
>>Brian
>
>If you can prove that, take it to the LA DA. If you can't, and nobody else 
>can, then the verdict was absolutely spot-on. I think the prosecution did a 
>pathetic job on Simpson, and that the LA police department still needs a 
>shakedown. Nobody learnt a thing from the Rodney King cock-up did they?
>
>Justice is not served by convicting people on insufficent evidence, no matter 
>how many opinionated racist assholes there are in the world.
>
>Igor Siemienowicz
>igor@adacel.com.au

Insufficient evidence? You could throw out 90%  (any 90%) of the 
evidence against Simpson, and the remaining 10% would be more
than enough to convict him in any REAL court of law (as opposed to
that media circus we were witness to for the better part of a year).
Agreed that the LA DA's office screwed-up royally, but that jury
wouldn't have found Simpson guilty if the prosecution had shown them video tapes of the guy committing the crime!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:20:57 PDT 1995
Article: 4940 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:03 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tqj$bk4@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4940 alt.politics.white-power:6944

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:20:57 PDT 1995
Article: 4941 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:04 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tqk$bk3@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4941 alt.politics.white-power:6945

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:20:58 PDT 1995
Article: 4942 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:06 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tqm$bk5@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4942 alt.politics.white-power:6946

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:20:59 PDT 1995
Article: 4943 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:08 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tqo$bk2@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4943 alt.politics.white-power:6947

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:20:59 PDT 1995
Article: 4944 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:20 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tr4$bk6@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4944 alt.politics.white-power:6948

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:00 PDT 1995
Article: 4954 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!esol.intermedia.com!emi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.fan.oj-simpson,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power,soc.culture.african.american,alt.discrimination,alt.revisionism,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Polarization of the races...
Date: 19 Oct 1995 19:58:43 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <466alj$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References:   <451u36$jom@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: igor@adacel.com.au
X-URL: news:igor.240.000E99D2@adacel.com.au
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.fan.oj-simpson:45246 alt.politics.nationalism.white:4954 alt.politics.white-power:6960 soc.culture.african.american:106424 alt.discrimination:37673 alt.revisionism:11890 soc.culture.jewish:12265

igor@adacel.com.au (Igor Siemienowicz) wrote:
>In article  brian@hevanet.com (Brian) writes:
>
>>> >I'm not sure who committed these murders.  I'm not convinced it was O.J.
>>> >I have faith that whomever it was will pay the price.  I'm also certain
>>> >that the people who are upset with the verdict are upset because they 
>>> >believe O.J. is guilty.  I understand this.  I don't think people can 
>>> >control what they believe.  Even if it was O.J. I feel it was a just 
>>> >verdict.  After all our system is designed so that guilty people go
>>> >free because of our fear that any innocent person would be put in jail.
>
>>This is the BIG lie. OJ murdered the mother of his children and another
>>man and he smeared their blood all over your face.
>
>>Brian
>
>If you can prove that, take it to the LA DA. If you can't, and nobody else 
>can, then the verdict was absolutely spot-on. I think the prosecution did a 
>pathetic job on Simpson, and that the LA police department still needs a 
>shakedown. Nobody learnt a thing from the Rodney King cock-up did they?
>
>Justice is not served by convicting people on insufficent evidence, no matter 
>how many opinionated racist assholes there are in the world.
>
>Igor Siemienowicz
>igor@adacel.com.au

Insufficient evidence? You could throw out 90%  (any 90%) of the 
evidence against Simpson, and the remaining 10% would be more
than enough to convict him in any REAL court of law (as opposed to
that media circus we were witness to for the better part of a year).
Agreed that the LA DA's office screwed-up royally, but that jury
wouldn't have found Simpson guilty if the prosecution had shown them video tapes of the guy committing the crime!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:44 PDT 1995
Article: 6943 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Half Million Mean Monkeys on the Mall
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:33:01 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <469t5t$bgo@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45vk80$5gd@news2.aimnet.com> <461tlr$67p@news.scott.net> <463n19$k99@news2.aimnet.com> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.9
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: BHendrsn@kirk.microsys.net
X-URL: news:a147cb$113329.2e0@kirk.microsys.net

BHendrsn@kirk.microsys.net (Brian & Lori Henderson) wrote:
>George Graves  wrote:
>
>>I'll tell you what I've told others. This forum is for and about white
>>supremists. If that concept bothers you, go away!
>
>It is also about showing what a bunch if ignorant assholes that white
>supremists are.  If you don't like that, go away.


Now we hear from Mr. Brian Henderson. Another victim of liberal
brainwashing, who, apparently has nothing of substance to say, so
he resorts to that bastion of knee-jerk liberal rhetoric, the insult.
Hello, Mr. Henderson.

George Graves
>
>
>
>
>




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:45 PDT 1995
Article: 6944 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:03 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tqj$bk4@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4940 alt.politics.white-power:6944

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:46 PDT 1995
Article: 6945 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:04 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tqk$bk3@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4941 alt.politics.white-power:6945

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:46 PDT 1995
Article: 6946 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:06 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tqm$bk5@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4942 alt.politics.white-power:6946

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:47 PDT 1995
Article: 6947 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:08 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tqo$bk2@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4943 alt.politics.white-power:6947

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:48 PDT 1995
Article: 6948 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: A Question to whites by non white
Date: 21 Oct 1995 04:44:20 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <469tr4$bk6@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <4511mt$m6e@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu> <4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: roman11@aol.com
X-URL: news:4679mh$qov@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:4944 alt.politics.white-power:6948

roman11@aol.com (Roman 11) wrote:
>We don't hate people of colour. We just don,t believe in race mixing
>because it just doesn't work. Can't you see that? You can take the purest
>spring water and the purest mineral oil and they WILL NOT MIX! I think
>this is the real problem. So let's cease the name calling and the blaming
>each other for all ills done to all of us.

Now, here is a real man! He understands and was able to put it in 
clear, concise words. If we all look around for the source of the 
problem, we can drop it directly into the lap of Jewish Liberalism.
Their Machievalian "divide and conquer" tactics has both groups at
each other's throat over what should be a no-brainer. Well done
Roman 11!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:48 PDT 1995
Article: 6956 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!kryten.awinc.com!news.netnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Get lost Stefan! ( Was Re: Hey niggers! Want your own country?)
Date: 21 Oct 1995 05:04:14 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 65
Message-ID: <469v0e$bk6@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <461amq$1dv8@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: speedy5@ibm.net
X-URL: news:461amq$1dv8@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net

speedy5@ibm.net (KT) wrote:
>
>evil Beavis  says:
>
>(snip)
>
>> You stick to your "Moske"?! idiot... So you're saying that Africans have never
>> developen any civilization(s), and white people only one??!!
>
>> evil "I didn't read it inna de pro-Afro history book"Beavis
>
>
>Whites have probaly developed 3 in the past 50.000 years.
>
>But niggers do not and NEVER had the intelligence or motivation to develop
>a civilization. They are also to babaric and primitive minded.
>
>That's why the crime is so high in all the *nigger* neighborhoods. It's also
>why african countries such as Rwanda and Somalia are so unstable and out of
>control.
>
>But you Liberals (and niggers) claim it's us White's who are the cause.
>Ironicly *YOU* were the ones who - back in the 60's - gave Africa back to 
>the niggers. Because the negoes had the right to, and would be well able to
>run they're own countries - the Libs said. 
>As it turned out, they couldn't and CAN'T. So we get the blame!
>
>Same thing in Washington DC were those fucking niggers are *marching* for
>more power. 
>
>A couple of well-aimed napalm bombs would do the trick though. 
>
>We could also ice Farrakhan and drop his dirty rotten body by parashoot
>right into the ghetto he came from.
>
>
>KT
>
>"Do you ever want to lead a long trail of
>destruction and mow down any bullshit
>that confronts you?"
>  --Green Day

Actually the problems we see with black crime here, in the USA and the problems African Blacks have maintaining the countries that w=
hite colonialists "gave' back to them stem from the same condition.
It took whites millenia to go through the actual experience of building civilization. As a result of that process, Europeans arrived=

at a point in the 18th century, where the full understanding of what
it means to be a free independent people occured to a multitude of 
startled minds. Freedom, independence, self reliance. These concepts
can be had, but they exact a price. That price is the sense of responsibility and community that are part and parcel of these concep=
ts. Blacks want the freedom, they want the independence, but they have little or no concept of the responsibilities that accompany t=
hese precious gifts. They do not have this concept in mind because
they have not gone through the process of "civilization". Strong Blacks captured weak blacks in the jungle, sold them to Arabs who, =
in turn, sold them to Europeans (mostly Dutch and Portugese) who brought them to these shores as slaves. For three centuries, blacks=

did not participate in American life. Suddenly, in the 1960's they were 'given' their rights. They have no cultural background which=
 
would prepare them for this 'gift'. They did not live the process. This is why they are so frustrated and unable to cope. I can give=
 you a book 
on nuclear physics, but if you've never taken algebra or calculus.......

George Graves 




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:49 PDT 1995
Article: 6960 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!esol.intermedia.com!emi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.fan.oj-simpson,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power,soc.culture.african.american,alt.discrimination,alt.revisionism,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Polarization of the races...
Date: 19 Oct 1995 19:58:43 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <466alj$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References:   <451u36$jom@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: igor@adacel.com.au
X-URL: news:igor.240.000E99D2@adacel.com.au
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.fan.oj-simpson:45246 alt.politics.nationalism.white:4954 alt.politics.white-power:6960 soc.culture.african.american:106424 alt.discrimination:37673 alt.revisionism:11890 soc.culture.jewish:12265

igor@adacel.com.au (Igor Siemienowicz) wrote:
>In article  brian@hevanet.com (Brian) writes:
>
>>> >I'm not sure who committed these murders.  I'm not convinced it was O.J.
>>> >I have faith that whomever it was will pay the price.  I'm also certain
>>> >that the people who are upset with the verdict are upset because they 
>>> >believe O.J. is guilty.  I understand this.  I don't think people can 
>>> >control what they believe.  Even if it was O.J. I feel it was a just 
>>> >verdict.  After all our system is designed so that guilty people go
>>> >free because of our fear that any innocent person would be put in jail.
>
>>This is the BIG lie. OJ murdered the mother of his children and another
>>man and he smeared their blood all over your face.
>
>>Brian
>
>If you can prove that, take it to the LA DA. If you can't, and nobody else 
>can, then the verdict was absolutely spot-on. I think the prosecution did a 
>pathetic job on Simpson, and that the LA police department still needs a 
>shakedown. Nobody learnt a thing from the Rodney King cock-up did they?
>
>Justice is not served by convicting people on insufficent evidence, no matter 
>how many opinionated racist assholes there are in the world.
>
>Igor Siemienowicz
>igor@adacel.com.au

Insufficient evidence? You could throw out 90%  (any 90%) of the 
evidence against Simpson, and the remaining 10% would be more
than enough to convict him in any REAL court of law (as opposed to
that media circus we were witness to for the better part of a year).
Agreed that the LA DA's office screwed-up royally, but that jury
wouldn't have found Simpson guilty if the prosecution had shown them video tapes of the guy committing the crime!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:21:50 PDT 1995
Article: 6961 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!esol.intermedia.com!emi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les in the Kalahari...
Date: 19 Oct 1995 19:50:45 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 34
Message-ID: <466a6l$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <460j5f$trg@news.scott.net> <464qdi$o0@taurus.sgi.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: smokin19@orion.sgi.net
X-URL: news:464qdi$o0@taurus.sgi.net

smokin19@orion.sgi.net (Smokin') wrote:
>evil Beavis  sez:
>
>>Well, those "dumpster-nations" were conceived by white people, and that's the 
>>reason they are what they are today!
>
>Actually the reason they are like that is because they either broke
>away or were cut loose by them white people, and without those Euros
>over there running things, nation after nation degenerated into what
>they are today. 
>
>Keep an eye on South Africa and you'll see what I mean. 

You got that part right, brother. I recently spoke with a guy who
has spent much time in South Africa over the last 25 years. His
most recent trip, made earlier this last summer, shocked him. He 
said that the place was virtually unrecognizable as the South 
Africa he knew. He further said the crime rate in cities like 
Johannesburg was appalling. Before the 'Kafers' took over there was
very little black-on-white crime there (sort of like it was in this
country before the Civil Rights Movement), now he says, white people
are afraid to go out of their homes at night. He further states that
gangs of blacks roam the streets at night breaking shop windows and
stealing whatever they want. The black 'government' seems
powerless to do anything about it. The American press never reports
this, however, because it is counter to what they want Americans to
believe about the  "new" South Africa. After all, they spent the better
part of 20 years whipping Americans up to denounce Aparthied. Like
most liberals, the press doesn't want to tell anybody when the facts
show that they were wrong.

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Sun Oct 22 12:38:47 PDT 1995
Article: 12265 of soc.culture.jewish
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!esol.intermedia.com!emi.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.fan.oj-simpson,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power,soc.culture.african.american,alt.discrimination,alt.revisionism,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Polarization of the races...
Date: 19 Oct 1995 19:58:43 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <466alj$sok@news2.aimnet.com>
References:   <451u36$jom@usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.24
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: igor@adacel.com.au
X-URL: news:igor.240.000E99D2@adacel.com.au
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.fan.oj-simpson:45246 alt.politics.nationalism.white:4954 alt.politics.white-power:6960 soc.culture.african.american:106424 alt.discrimination:37673 alt.revisionism:11890 soc.culture.jewish:12265

igor@adacel.com.au (Igor Siemienowicz) wrote:
>In article  brian@hevanet.com (Brian) writes:
>
>>> >I'm not sure who committed these murders.  I'm not convinced it was O.J.
>>> >I have faith that whomever it was will pay the price.  I'm also certain
>>> >that the people who are upset with the verdict are upset because they 
>>> >believe O.J. is guilty.  I understand this.  I don't think people can 
>>> >control what they believe.  Even if it was O.J. I feel it was a just 
>>> >verdict.  After all our system is designed so that guilty people go
>>> >free because of our fear that any innocent person would be put in jail.
>
>>This is the BIG lie. OJ murdered the mother of his children and another
>>man and he smeared their blood all over your face.
>
>>Brian
>
>If you can prove that, take it to the LA DA. If you can't, and nobody else 
>can, then the verdict was absolutely spot-on. I think the prosecution did a 
>pathetic job on Simpson, and that the LA police department still needs a 
>shakedown. Nobody learnt a thing from the Rodney King cock-up did they?
>
>Justice is not served by convicting people on insufficent evidence, no matter 
>how many opinionated racist assholes there are in the world.
>
>Igor Siemienowicz
>igor@adacel.com.au

Insufficient evidence? You could throw out 90%  (any 90%) of the 
evidence against Simpson, and the remaining 10% would be more
than enough to convict him in any REAL court of law (as opposed to
that media circus we were witness to for the better part of a year).
Agreed that the LA DA's office screwed-up royally, but that jury
wouldn't have found Simpson guilty if the prosecution had shown them video tapes of the guy committing the crime!

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:37:58 PDT 1995
Article: 5136 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 23 Oct 1995 00:07:10 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.11
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: dckom@future.altcom.net
X-URL: news:46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5136 alt.politics.white-power:7184

dckom@future.altcom.net (David) wrote:
>In article <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, tonycapone@aol.com says...
>>
>
>>When I see the old film footage of the KKK March on Washington early this
>>century, I get goosebumps.
>
>You damn well should. the kluxxers back then hated immigrants, particularly Italians 
>and other Catholics. 
>
>>When are we to have a White Nationalist Male March?  
>>There were nigra and mulato congressmen at the Million Monkey March
>>speaking to the monkeys.  They did it because "black men needed atonement,
>>the meaning of the march was greater then Farrakhan".
>>Imagine a White Nationaist March with pro-white congressmen speaking.  The
>>will do it and speak "for the atonement of white males".
>>A march for white christian males, Jew Bloodsuckers not allowed, nigras,
>>wetbacks, chinks, dotheads, and pakis not allowes either. heh heh heh....
>	The only atonemnt us white boys need to make is atonement
>for several centuries of bullying everybody else on the planet.
>	However, if such a march as you describe were (God forbid)
>to occur, a large and vocal portion of the speakers whould be in favor of
> sending Italian-Americans back to Italy. (all a bunch of gangsters and 
>Pope worshippers don'tya know)
>
>	David Christian
>	Race Traitor
>>A SHOW OF WHITE MALE MASCULINITY WILL WAKE UP THE WHITE MALES OF 
>AMERICA!
>>KETS HAVE A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH!
>>P.S. I bet you money it will be a million men, and not 400,000


Can't happen!
1) Marion Berry D.C.s cocain lord...er mayor wouldn't give the white
marchers a permit. Too antagonistic, costs the city a lot of money,
you know.
2) The liberal press would come down on the concept of a white
march like a ton of bricks. Only non-whites are allowed to do that, don't you know?
3) Whites are too busy making a living, feeding their families and 
working in the community to attend such a thing. Only non-
productive types have the time to attend marches.
4) What would it accomplish?

George Graves   




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:37:59 PDT 1995
Article: 5364 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 24 Oct 1995 20:29:05 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-21.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: gmarquez@netcom.com
X-URL: news:gmarquezDGwr4D.I9F@netcom.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5364 alt.politics.white-power:7425

gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>George Graves (gmgraves@aimnet.com) wrote:
>: Can't happen!
>: 1) Marion Berry D.C.s cocain lord...er mayor wouldn't give the white
>: marchers a permit. Too antagonistic, costs the city a lot of money,
>: you know.
>
>Well why don't you guys at least try instead of whining about it.
>
>: 2) The liberal press would come down on the concept of a white
>: march like a ton of bricks. Only non-whites are allowed to do that,
>: don't you know?
>
>No, I don't.  Again, are you going to try, or just "bitch-and-moan" about it?
>
>: 3) Whites are too busy making a living, feeding their families and 
>: working in the community to attend such a thing. Only non-
>: productive types have the time to attend marches.
>
>Or people that are commited to thier cause...
>
>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>
>Then why whine about it?
>
>	- Grego


I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
to do so.

George Graves
>




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:39:11 PDT 1995
Article: 7181 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Hey niggers! Want your own country?
Date: 22 Oct 1995 23:22:28 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <46ejnk$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <460vi4$aj7@news2.aimnet.com> <461u8k$67p@news.scott.net> <463nn2$k99@news2.aimnet.com> <46bidn$1lt@thales.nmia.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.11
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: Darkjedi@nmia.com
X-URL: news:46bidn$1lt@thales.nmia.com

>You know George the only things that you and your kind have is idle time on your hands 
>and if it comes down to a battle between my kind and yours, no matter what percentage 
>we hold in the total worlds's population we will annihilate you because 
>we Blacks aren;t the only ones who oppose you.  Consider this:  With all of 
>the Whites who don't share your sick dream and all of the civilized people who
>live in this world, you and yours comprise a small amount of "people" on this Earth.
>With that said you stand a snowball's chance in Hell in standing against us and I would
>take great pleasure in "pushing the button" and erasing all of you.  You're pathetic 
>and your so called intelligence doesn't rate any higher than homo sapiens neanderthalensis
>If you have a brain capacity equvalent to a monkey then try to figure this out.  If you don't then shut 
>the fuck up you lousy white bastard!
>
>The Dark Jedi


We've all seen monkeys and chimps in an impotent rage throw their own feces at zoo visitors, have we not? This sort of reminds
me of that.

George Graves
>



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:39:12 PDT 1995
Article: 7183 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: George Graves and his ilk
Date: 22 Oct 1995 23:53:16 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 37
Message-ID: <46elhc$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <46bjrd$1lt@thales.nmia.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.11
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: Darkjedi@nmia.com
X-URL: news:46bjrd$1lt@thales.nmia.com

Darkjedi@nmia.com (Darkjedi) wrote:
>This statement is directed to George Graves and his ilk:
>
>George:
>
>After reading your posts and getting one hell of a good laugh when I read
>them, the only other thing I have left to say to you is "Thank you for
>the hillarious entertainment."  The garbage that you believe in and the 
>vomit that you spew is about as funny as reading about your ridiculous
>beliefs in grade school when you thought that the Slavery, discrimination,
>etc would work and survive forever.  Look around you and you'll see that you
>are deluding yourself.  Your kind of thinking (if you are indeed thinking)
>is outdated as you are and it will only be a matter of time before you and
>your ilk vanish from the Earth.  Just for your reference, you'll not be 
>missed and your passing will be celebrated as the most significant event in
>the history of mankind.  We have time on my hands.  Do you?  Think about that 
>the next time you walk down the street and one of us sees one of you 
>before you know that you're being watched.  Who knows?  Maybe you'll find your 
>throat cut by someone, be he (or she) Black or white or maybe you'll just wake up one day
>and wonder what became of your miserable existence.  When you use the word "Nigger"
>you only emphasize the fact that the only person who is a "Nigger" is you.  Isn't that
>a shock!  You're not offending me or any of my Black Brothers but you are demeaning 
>yourself, your ilk, and your race.  Think about that.  I truly pity you.
>
>The Dark Jedi


I actually wrote a long tirade against this guy, but I didn't post it. He's just expressing what the liberals call "black pride"
(whatever that is. Oxymoron?). So let him rave. 
Notice, however, his threat of throat-cutting. I'd say that pretty
much takes the rag off the bush here. Lots of rhetoric, nicely
worded. Strip away the thin venier of civilisation and education 
and what do you have? A savage primative. 'Nuf said.

George Graves 




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:39:13 PDT 1995
Article: 7184 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 23 Oct 1995 00:07:10 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.11
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: dckom@future.altcom.net
X-URL: news:46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5136 alt.politics.white-power:7184

dckom@future.altcom.net (David) wrote:
>In article <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, tonycapone@aol.com says...
>>
>
>>When I see the old film footage of the KKK March on Washington early this
>>century, I get goosebumps.
>
>You damn well should. the kluxxers back then hated immigrants, particularly Italians 
>and other Catholics. 
>
>>When are we to have a White Nationalist Male March?  
>>There were nigra and mulato congressmen at the Million Monkey March
>>speaking to the monkeys.  They did it because "black men needed atonement,
>>the meaning of the march was greater then Farrakhan".
>>Imagine a White Nationaist March with pro-white congressmen speaking.  The
>>will do it and speak "for the atonement of white males".
>>A march for white christian males, Jew Bloodsuckers not allowed, nigras,
>>wetbacks, chinks, dotheads, and pakis not allowes either. heh heh heh....
>	The only atonemnt us white boys need to make is atonement
>for several centuries of bullying everybody else on the planet.
>	However, if such a march as you describe were (God forbid)
>to occur, a large and vocal portion of the speakers whould be in favor of
> sending Italian-Americans back to Italy. (all a bunch of gangsters and 
>Pope worshippers don'tya know)
>
>	David Christian
>	Race Traitor
>>A SHOW OF WHITE MALE MASCULINITY WILL WAKE UP THE WHITE MALES OF 
>AMERICA!
>>KETS HAVE A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH!
>>P.S. I bet you money it will be a million men, and not 400,000


Can't happen!
1) Marion Berry D.C.s cocain lord...er mayor wouldn't give the white
marchers a permit. Too antagonistic, costs the city a lot of money,
you know.
2) The liberal press would come down on the concept of a white
march like a ton of bricks. Only non-whites are allowed to do that, don't you know?
3) Whites are too busy making a living, feeding their families and 
working in the community to attend such a thing. Only non-
productive types have the time to attend marches.
4) What would it accomplish?

George Graves   




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:39:14 PDT 1995
Article: 7307 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: George Graves and His ilk
Date: 23 Oct 1995 20:47:34 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 89
Message-ID: <46gv16$egr@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <46f2c2$c3v@thales.nmia.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-21.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: Darkjedi@nmia.com
X-URL: news:46f2c2$c3v@thales.nmia.com

Darkjedi@nmia.com (Darkjedi) wrote:
>George:
>
>Savage primitive, perhaps, but my little admonition of you certainly got
>your attention didn't it?  My style of writing doesn't normally include
>savagery but at least I admit it.  Your kind has done much worse than this in its past
>so don't condescend me.  Bigotry such as what I've seen you spew has done nothing but divide mankind and cause needless bloodshed.
>Also if you notice I did not threaten you directly but there are those
>out there both Black and White that would probably do this to you after
>hearing the "vomit that you spewed."  Is this necessary?  I think not so
>you'd best honor your First Amendment right to free speech but be aware
>that everything that you say can and does have serious consequences.
>
>I happen to be well educated and well positioned in the Computer Industry
>and I no more think that all Whites are Racist Assholes than I think that
>all Black are ruthless savages.  However some Whites and Blacks are Racist
>Assholes and some Whites and Blacks are ruthless savages.  It's how we
>view the entire race that is the issue here.  Lumping all of us together
>(Black or White)in either a positive or negative way is wrong and only
>leads to trouble.
>
>The Dark Jedi


As to your P.S. I don't blame you for vehemently defending your race.
Everyone has a right to racial pride. If every black had your 
background and intelligence (no, they wouldn't all have to be in the 
computer industry), there would probably be no alt.politics.white
-power. And if there were, I wouldn't be posting on it. I don't 'hate'
anyone per se (except maybe a boss I once had, but that's another story - he was white, BTW). What I do hate is the crime, violence and
non-productivity of a large segement of the black community. I also
hate the knee-jerk white liberal "fixes" to these problem that only
make things worse. 
You blacks need to understand that conservatives (even racist ones)
are NOT YOUR ENEMY. The liberal, who claims to be working in your
behalf, is your enemy. Look what he does:
First, out of one side of his mouth, the liberal tells you that you
are equal to whites. Then out of the other side of his mouth, he tells
you that you are an oppressed people and lables you blacks or
African-Americans. Then he says that being oppressed, you cannot
survive without his help. (if you are equal, why would your people 
need anybody's help?) He then tells you to keep voting him (the
liberal politician) into power and he will help you. He does this for
Blacks, Hispanics, Asians, Gays, Feminists, anybody that he thinks 
is disenfranchised; any group he thinks will respond to these tactics.
The help he gives you is a massive welfare system that destroys
hope and creates classes where none really need to exist. The 
liberal keeps these groups down to maintain his power, not to
help anyone (except himself). Pretty cynical huh? And your people
bought it! (and the rest too, of course). I firmly believe that if you
give these groups of people incentives to get a good education, and
to go out there and work for a living, the bonds of poverty and
privation will be broken. Self respect will eliminate drugs and crime
>from  the scenario as well. But you can't wait around for the 
government to do something (haven't they done enough damage
already?). These groups have to do it themselves, especially the
blacks. Clean up your act, and most racism will probably go away. 
Show the white man that he wrong in his assesment of blacks and
he will have to admit he was wrong (I know that I will, gladly). But
as long as blacks underachieve, live off the dole, count one of three
of their young men as being involved in the criminal justice system,
refuse to get an education (many young blacks actually look down 
on other blacks who try to achieve in school), whites like me will
continue to critisize you. These black-apologists I see on this 
forum aern't helping your race either. Their intentions might be 
good, but instead of comming up with all of this socialogical
nonsense as reasons for the black failure, The should come up
with some answers as to how to fix the problem. They don't.
This anti-education mindset that much of the black community
harbors is a cultural problem that your leaders MUST fix. If 
the majority of blacks can be educated (something I have yet to
be shown) then they must be. There will be even less room in 
the twenty-first century for an unedcated population than there 
is in this century. 
The way I see it darkJedi, your people have two choices. Clean
up your act and become useful members of society, or leave this
country. Whichever you choose is up to you. But if you stay, the 
status quo will probably not be tolerated. There is simply no 
place in a Republic like the United States for second-class
citizens. And I don't really think you or any of your people want
to be one.

George Graves

P.S. You must have a Netscape Browser like I do. You forgot to put in a
hard carriage return at the end of a line and it didn't wrap until 
after the word "bloodshed". I do the same thing all the time. I
sure hope Netscape fixes this with a word wrap preference in V2.0.



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:39:14 PDT 1995
Article: 7425 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 24 Oct 1995 20:29:05 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-21.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: gmarquez@netcom.com
X-URL: news:gmarquezDGwr4D.I9F@netcom.com
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5364 alt.politics.white-power:7425

gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>George Graves (gmgraves@aimnet.com) wrote:
>: Can't happen!
>: 1) Marion Berry D.C.s cocain lord...er mayor wouldn't give the white
>: marchers a permit. Too antagonistic, costs the city a lot of money,
>: you know.
>
>Well why don't you guys at least try instead of whining about it.
>
>: 2) The liberal press would come down on the concept of a white
>: march like a ton of bricks. Only non-whites are allowed to do that,
>: don't you know?
>
>No, I don't.  Again, are you going to try, or just "bitch-and-moan" about it?
>
>: 3) Whites are too busy making a living, feeding their families and 
>: working in the community to attend such a thing. Only non-
>: productive types have the time to attend marches.
>
>Or people that are commited to thier cause...
>
>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>
>Then why whine about it?
>
>	- Grego


I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
to do so.

George Graves
>




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:39:15 PDT 1995
Article: 7427 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: George Graves on the Rant
Date: 24 Oct 1995 20:34:47 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <46jil7$n9s@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45vk80$5gd@news2.aimnet.com> <461tlr$67p@news.scott.net> <463n19$k99@news2.aimnet.com> <46gp4q$dab@bell.maths.tcd.ie>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-21.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: dbell@maths.tcd.ie
X-URL: news:46gp4q$dab@bell.maths.tcd.ie

dbell@maths.tcd.ie (Derek Bell) wrote:
>George Graves  writes:
>>I'll tell you what I've told others. This forum is for and about white
>>supremists. If that concept bothers you, go away!
>
>	Actually that concept doesn't bother me; in fact it's snoozing in the
>corner as I type.
>
>	As the posts I post here are *about* white supremacists, they're quite
>relevant.
>
>	Oh, by the way, that concept has woken up and gone out the door - just
>in case you were interested.
>
>>By stating that I lack education, you make assumptions not in evidence. If,
>>by that statement you mean that I lack Liberal Jewish brainwashing, you are
>>correct.  You also take too much upon yourself when you make assumptions
>> about one's intelligence.
>
>	Of course, George *never* makes "assumptions not in evidence" - like
>what evil Beavis spends his time doing!
>
>>Fact is, Mr.Evil Beavis, if you spent less time watching your namesake on MTV
>>and studying history, psychology or other useful sciences, you 
>>might find real arguments to contribute here instead of resorting
>>to personal rancor, which is all you ever do.
>
>	Of course, George Graves *never* resorts to personal rancour!!!
>
>	Derek "Huh! Huh! Huh! He said `rancour'!Huh! Huh! Huh!" Bell
>-- 
>Derek Bell  dbell@maths.tcd.ie  WWW: http://www.maths.tcd.ie/~dbell/index.html
> Death confronts us not unlike the historical battle scene that hangs on the
>   wall of the classroom. It is our task to obscure or quite obliterate the
>        picture by our deeds while we are still in this world. - Kafka

Are you mad (as in crazy, not angry)? This had nothing to do with
you. I was taking someone to task for resorting to name calling as 
opposed to actually debating me on the issue with which he
disagreed. Do you think personal rancor helps sort out anything? Do
you think it is a meaningful way to debate? If you do, you need some
reality readjustment, my friend.

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:39:16 PDT 1995
Article: 7428 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: George Graves on the Rant
Date: 24 Oct 1995 20:35:14 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 46
Message-ID: <46jim2$n9s@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45vk80$5gd@news2.aimnet.com> <461tlr$67p@news.scott.net> <463n19$k99@news2.aimnet.com> <46gp4q$dab@bell.maths.tcd.ie>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-21.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: dbell@maths.tcd.ie
X-URL: news:46gp4q$dab@bell.maths.tcd.ie

dbell@maths.tcd.ie (Derek Bell) wrote:
>George Graves  writes:
>>I'll tell you what I've told others. This forum is for and about white
>>supremists. If that concept bothers you, go away!
>
>	Actually that concept doesn't bother me; in fact it's snoozing in the
>corner as I type.
>
>	As the posts I post here are *about* white supremacists, they're quite
>relevant.
>
>	Oh, by the way, that concept has woken up and gone out the door - just
>in case you were interested.
>
>>By stating that I lack education, you make assumptions not in evidence. If,
>>by that statement you mean that I lack Liberal Jewish brainwashing, you are
>>correct.  You also take too much upon yourself when you make assumptions
>> about one's intelligence.
>
>	Of course, George *never* makes "assumptions not in evidence" - like
>what evil Beavis spends his time doing!
>
>>Fact is, Mr.Evil Beavis, if you spent less time watching your namesake on MTV
>>and studying history, psychology or other useful sciences, you 
>>might find real arguments to contribute here instead of resorting
>>to personal rancor, which is all you ever do.
>
>	Of course, George Graves *never* resorts to personal rancour!!!
>
>	Derek "Huh! Huh! Huh! He said `rancour'!Huh! Huh! Huh!" Bell
>-- 
>Derek Bell  dbell@maths.tcd.ie  WWW: http://www.maths.tcd.ie/~dbell/index.html
> Death confronts us not unlike the historical battle scene that hangs on the
>   wall of the classroom. It is our task to obscure or quite obliterate the
>        picture by our deeds while we are still in this world. - Kafka

Are you mad (as in crazy, not angry)? This had nothing to do with
you. I was taking someone to task for resorting to name calling as 
opposed to actually debating me on the issue with which he
disagreed. Do you think personal rancor helps sort out anything? Do
you think it is a meaningful way to debate? If you do, you need some
reality readjustment, my friend.

George Graves




From gmgraves@aimnet.com Wed Oct 25 22:39:17 PDT 1995
Article: 7432 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!newsjunkie.ans.net!howland.reston.ans.net!swrinde!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: George Graves and His ilk
Date: 24 Oct 1995 20:52:55 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 135
Message-ID: <46jjn7$nfq@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <46f2c2$c3v@thales.nmia.com> <46gv16$egr@news2.aimnet.com> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.2
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: cmlewis@usc.edu
X-URL: news:cmlewis-2310951817340001@lvl-mac035.usc.edu

cmlewis@usc.edu (aria) wrote:
>You blacks need to understand that conservatives (even racist ones)
>are NOT YOUR ENEMY. The liberal, who claims to be working in your
>behalf, is your enemy. Look what he does:
>First, out of one side of his mouth, the liberal tells you that you
>are equal to whites. Then out of the other side of his mouth, he tells
>you that you are an oppressed people and lables you blacks or
>African-Americans. Then he says that being oppressed, you cannot
>survive without his help. (if you are equal, why would your people 
>need anybody's help?)
>
>> George Graves
>> 
>
>
>   bullshit.
>
>   i jumped onto this newsgroup over a month ago trying to reach a general
>concensus amongst "blacks" and "whites" (as well as all others) in a
>heartfelt attempt to bridge the racial gaps which plague not only our
>country, but all people in general.  instead, i was met by racist remarks
>[les griswold], unprovoked hostility [racial theorist], and even outright
>threats of violence [salty].  i soon learned how the game was played: it's
>not about the upliftment and educating of your fellow man, here; it's
>about tearing the enemy down (most specifically "blacks", and on a
>smaller, but equally important level, "jews").
>
>   if you think otherwise, you are in the wrong fucking newsgroup.
>
>   take a look at some of "Roman 11"'s posts and see if you don't think
>that many "blacks" have a right to be angry about the generally racist
>state of affairs in america.  many "blacks" may hold the same attitude
>(hate breeds hate), but whose aanger do you feel is more justified by
>American history?
>
>   WE ARE A FUCKING OPPRESSED MINORITY.  THIS IS NOT THE FAULT OF
>"LIBERALS", BUT OF WHITE, ASIAN, HISPANIC AND BLACK AMERICA AS A WHOLE. 
>CIVIL EQUALITY (AS IF WE HAVE EVEN THAT) IS NOT THE SAME AS ECONOMIC OR
>SOCIAL EQUALITY.
>
>   morever...
>
>   it was "white" people who created this mess of a nation, not "blacks"
>(DENY THAT ONE PLEASE!!!), and it is "white" people who are ultimately
>responsible for the violence and low levels of respect amongst the various
>minorities groups, by sweeping the problems that have plagued the American
>underclass under the rug for centuries.  don't try to push it all on
>liberals; the Reagan 80's (and the Bush 90's) was when most of this "crack
>and guns" shit really took off.  notice, however, that at least "liberal"
>Clinton is doing his best to address the problem responsibly, rather than
>simply building more "revolving-door" prisons.
>
>   we are only about 10% of your nation. and only about 1/6 of that (1/3
>of black males, wasn't it?) are even involved in (alleged) criminal
>activity--less than 2% of the nation.  moreover, the MAJORITY of that 2%
>are arrested for "black-on-black" crime, further lowering the threat to
>your any of the people of your "race", which leads me to question exactly
>upon what your heartfelt criticism of "blacks" is based.  i'm sure that 2%
>of a basically disempowered and socially restricted minority grouping is
>not causing the moral and cultural destruction of America (as so many
>conservatives like to decry)...
>
>--[unless you continue aggravate that particular 2% until it takes
>recourse, committing terrorist-like guerilla action against Amerikkka in
>general...but, of course "white" america wouldn't do that, now would
>it?]--
>
>   and PLEASE stop trying to patronize "blacks".  that shit pisses me off
>more than anything else that "white" people do--like we need to be
>lectured by the likes of someone who can't possibly know what it is really
>like growing up as a member of the "black" race in an inherently racist
>society (YOU DON'T, SO DON'T EVEN TRY IT--THIS ONE IS A "BLACK THING" BY
>IT'S VERY DEFINITION).  i go through little "racist" social traumas on a
>daily basis, even here in college--a "white man's land" if ever i saw
>one--the likes of which you would have to see to believe.  (the looks i
>get when i tell white people that i don't play sports...)  let me tell you
>from experience, friend: it's not as easy to assimilate into "white"
>america as you'd like to tell us it is--even WITH a 1290 (bonjour, sylvie)
>SAT.
>
>   in closing...
>
>   DON'T FUCKING LECTURE US--words from people like you are the last thing
>most of us want to hear.  the underprivileged will do what they fucking
>have to do to make it in this hypocritical excuse for a people's
>republic--sell drugs, rob homes, and take welfare as it comes, and i, for
>one, don't blame them anymore, because even i don't know what it's like to
>truly be at the end of my rope.  the  thing that is respected most in the
>inner-city is SURVIVAL; a little no-holds-barred wargame that is played
>out worlwide; America is no exception.  
>
>
>   and ALWAYS, ALWAYS remember: "The White Man" lied to (and afterwards,
>in some cases, butchered, tortured, and raped) the Mexicans, the Indians,
>the Africans, and the Asians in order to turn this great nation into what
>it is today [sarcasm intentional here], so now why don't "you whites"
>start proving yourselves to "us minorities" if you want to see our overall
>attitude towards "whitey" (and america in general) improve in the future.
>
>   we know your fucking game (i didn't a month ago, but i do now)...  
>
>   ...and many of us refuse to play by your rules, anymore, seeing how far
>it got us in the sixties (dogs, hoses, beatings, lynchings, tear gassings,
>incarcerations--all for PEACEFUL protests)...
>
>   fuck peace.  i tried to make peace with some of your "ilk" over a month ago.
>
>   they didn't reciprocate.
>
>   flame fucking off.
>
>
>                                                         aria
>   
>   
>
>p.s.  i have no desire to change your views in any way, mr. graves.  i
>simply dislike it when someone comes in with only half the story and
>assumes that he knows the whole truth.

Stop apologizing for underachieving. Stop blaming other people
and other races for your people's failure. Stop blaming whites
for bringing you here against your will. It happened. Its over.
Its history, your here now. DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!
There will be less tolerance for this kind in attitude, and the 
social problems that it engenders, in the next century than there
has been in this one. Yes, you are only 12% of the population. Get
with the program before others start making more decisions about
your future in which you have no say.

George Graves






From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:48:03 PST 1995
Article: 5794 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 28 Oct 1995 08:50:07 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <46sqrv$pd7@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>  <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com> <46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.18
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: lzaird@io.org
X-URL: news:46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5794 alt.politics.white-power:7903

lzaird@io.org (lzaird) wrote:
>George Graves  wrote:
>>gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>>>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>>>Then why whine about it?
>>I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
>>to do so.
>
>Do you know what Irony is?

Yeah, do you know what humor is? Most of you liberal types
are so uptight, I have to ask.

George Graves





From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:48:04 PST 1995
Article: 5795 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 28 Oct 1995 08:51:16 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <46squ4$pf1@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>  <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com> <46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.18
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5795 alt.politics.white-power:7904

lzaird@io.org (lzaird) wrote:
>George Graves  wrote:
>>gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>>>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>>>Then why whine about it?
>>I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
>>to do so.
>
>Do you know what Irony is?

Yeah, do you know what humor is? Most of you liberal types
are so uptight, I have to ask.

George Graves





From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:48:05 PST 1995
Article: 5796 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 28 Oct 1995 08:52:31 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <46sr0f$pf3@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>  <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com> <46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.18
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5796 alt.politics.white-power:7905

lzaird@io.org (lzaird) wrote:
>George Graves  wrote:
>>gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>>>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>>>Then why whine about it?
>>I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
>>to do so.
>
>Do you know what Irony is?

Yeah, do you know what humor is? Most of you liberal types
are so uptight, I have to ask.

George Graves





From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:48:07 PST 1995
Article: 5797 of alt.politics.nationalism.white
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 28 Oct 1995 08:53:49 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <46sr2t$pf5@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>  <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com> <46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5797 alt.politics.white-power:7906

lzaird@io.org (lzaird) wrote:
>George Graves  wrote:
>>gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>>>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>>>Then why whine about it?
>>I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
>>to do so.
>
>Do you know what Irony is?

Yeah, do you know what humor is? Most of you liberal types
are so uptight, I have to ask.

George Graves





From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:04 PST 1995
Article: 7903 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 28 Oct 1995 08:50:07 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <46sqrv$pd7@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>  <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com> <46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.18
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: lzaird@io.org
X-URL: news:46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5794 alt.politics.white-power:7903

lzaird@io.org (lzaird) wrote:
>George Graves  wrote:
>>gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>>>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>>>Then why whine about it?
>>I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
>>to do so.
>
>Do you know what Irony is?

Yeah, do you know what humor is? Most of you liberal types
are so uptight, I have to ask.

George Graves





From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:04 PST 1995
Article: 7904 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 28 Oct 1995 08:51:16 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <46squ4$pf1@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>  <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com> <46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.18
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5795 alt.politics.white-power:7904

lzaird@io.org (lzaird) wrote:
>George Graves  wrote:
>>gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>>>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>>>Then why whine about it?
>>I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
>>to do so.
>
>Do you know what Irony is?

Yeah, do you know what humor is? Most of you liberal types
are so uptight, I have to ask.

George Graves





From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:05 PST 1995
Article: 7905 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 28 Oct 1995 08:52:31 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <46sr0f$pf3@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>  <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com> <46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.18
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5796 alt.politics.white-power:7905

lzaird@io.org (lzaird) wrote:
>George Graves  wrote:
>>gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>>>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>>>Then why whine about it?
>>I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
>>to do so.
>
>Do you know what Irony is?

Yeah, do you know what humor is? Most of you liberal types
are so uptight, I have to ask.

George Graves





From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:06 PST 1995
Article: 7906 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: HOW ABOUT A MILLION WHITE MAN MARCH?
Date: 28 Oct 1995 08:53:49 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <46sr2t$pf5@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <45meqg$3mr2@news-s01.ny.us.ibm.net> <467f30$k6@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <46cfur$9m8@news.atlcom.net> <46embe$6q3@news2.aimnet.com>  <46jiah$n9s@news2.aimnet.com> <46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46pute$rl3@ionews.io.org
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.nationalism.white:5797 alt.politics.white-power:7906

lzaird@io.org (lzaird) wrote:
>George Graves  wrote:
>>gmarquez@netcom.com (Richard Marquez) wrote:
>>>: 4) What would it accomplish?
>>>Then why whine about it?
>>I'm not whinning, just making a point and using a little irony
>>to do so.
>
>Do you know what Irony is?

Yeah, do you know what humor is? Most of you liberal types
are so uptight, I have to ask.

George Graves





From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:07 PST 1995
Article: 7907 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:28:57 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46st4p$pkc@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:08 PST 1995
Article: 7908 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:16:44 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 49
Message-ID: <46ssds$pfb@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve.

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:09 PST 1995
Article: 7909 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:20:08 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46ssk8$pju@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:09 PST 1995
Article: 7910 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:20:25 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46sskp$pjv@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:10 PST 1995
Article: 7911 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:20:34 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46ssl2$pk0@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:11 PST 1995
Article: 7912 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:23:00 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46sspk$pk4@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:12 PST 1995
Article: 7913 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:23:45 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46ssr1$pk5@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:12 PST 1995
Article: 7914 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:23:52 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46ssr8$pk7@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:13 PST 1995
Article: 7915 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:24:00 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46ssrg$pk8@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
To: froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:14 PST 1995
Article: 7916 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:24:32 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46sssg$pk9@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:15 PST 1995
Article: 7917 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les doesn't understand the CIVIL War now.
Date: 28 Oct 1995 09:31:47 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 52
Message-ID: <46sta3$pm2@news2.aimnet.com>
References:  <46fee6$c6u@limestone.kosone.com> <46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.5
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46rt9b$cqb@uuneo.neosoft.com

froggy@praline.no.NeoSoft.com (Carlos May) wrote:
>RickJones wrote:
>: >   bn946@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Les Griswold) writes:
>
>: >  For YOUR information, Beer-Stein, the War Between the States wasn't about
>: >  race, or anything like that.  It was about the Southern states CEDING from
>: >  the United States, and the Federalists saying "No way!"  Also, it wasn't a
>: >  "civil" war, because the Confederate States and the Union were NOT the
>: >  same country during the conflict.  Get it?
>
>: You apparently know about as much about the Civil War as you do about
>: World War II, which is to say not much at all.
>
>Indeed.
>
>Those under the delusion that slavery and race issues were not a prime 
>factor in the Confederate secession should go to the local library and 
>have a look at the Confederate Declaration of Independance.
>
>                    -- F.

Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
emancipated the slaves in1863. (this has always struck me as
funny. It's like Roosevelt freeing the Jews from Nazi concentration
camps in 1942 by decree. I.e. it only works if the side making
the decree wins the war). 
Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
"Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case. The
government of the Confederacy was constituted and had a formal
leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
not.
Most Americans don't seem to understand (perhaps because they
are not taught this in school) that in 1861 seccession was not
illegal. The Constitution had no provision for keeping the individual
states from leaving the Union if they so desired. In fact, In a 
conversation with President Lincoln, Secretary of State Seward
mentioned to him that the U.S.A. had no LEGAL right to force the
South to rejoin the Union. To this, Lincoln replied that he knew
that his action against the Confederacy was illegal, but that he
could not stand by and let the Union dissolve (this is possibly the 
first case of the U.S. government ignoring the Constitution when
it got in the  way of what they wanted to do, as we know, its 
certainly not the last).

George Graves



From gmgraves@aimnet.com Mon Oct 30 17:55:16 PST 1995
Article: 8043 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!olivea!decwrl!pagesat.net!netserv.com!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Les's history lesson for the day
Date: 30 Oct 1995 03:30:58 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <471gti$c13@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <46gfe8$qvb@natasha.rmii.com> <46mdh5$ebo@limestone.kosone.com> <46v49e$h7c@fox.ksu.ksu.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.247.5.17
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:46v49e$h7c@fox.ksu.ksu.edu

Stacia wrote:
>Rick Jones writes:
>
>>>   mkelly@qadas.com (Michael Kelly) writes:
>>>
>[snip]
>>>  Slavery was an after thought in the whole process (the North being
>>>  Industrial based had little use for unskilled 
>>>  labor so could not utilize slaves.)  The slavery issue came about to
>>>  weaken the Souths hold on thier economy (create a battle on two
>>>  fronts) which was always mildly unstable and to recruit sympathizers
>>>  in the South.
>
>>Complete bullshit.  Slavery was THE major issue in the United States
>>for decades preceding the war.  Otherwise, why do you think North
>>and South fought over the admission of "slave" and "non-slave" 
>>States?  For nearly twenty years the slave states fought politically
>>to keep the non-slave states from achieving total domination in
>>Congress.  While the war itself began over the right of secession,
>>to suggest that slavery was a "side issue" is nonsense.  Slavery
>>was the #1 dividing issue in the United States at the time beyond
>>ANY reasonable doubt or question.
>
>  I think what people are missing here is that on a large scale, slavery 
>was an economic factor and not a social one to much of the South 
>preceding the Civil War.  The South could very easily have truthfully 
>said that they seceded for economic reasons, while the North might see it 
>as more of a civil rights (or what passed for it) reason.
>  I was under the distinct impression that the South pretty much held out
>for letting states be admitted as either free or slave based on what the
>state wanted.  The North was the one who decided that the states had to be
>equally free- or slave-states.  Please correct me on this if need be, it
>has been a few years since I studied this with any regularity. 
>  The South as a whole felt constrained by the North and its tight grip on
>the nation.  Also, the North was becoming industrialized, and the South
>remained largely agricultural; it is easy to see, even now, the distinctly
>separate cultures these two "halves" of the continental US possess. (A
>generalization that, to save space, I won't elaborate on.  I hope that
>people take what I said as a generalization, and not as some sort of
>blanket statement of fact.) 
>  It was not *just* slavery or *just* admission of certain states or
>*just* the trade and economic factors, it was all of these combined.  I
>highly suspect that, if you asked different people, be they citizen or
>soldier, they would all have a different answer to why the War of the
>States was fought. 
>
>Stacia
>

Mr, Stacia is correct here. The reasons for the southern states
wanting to leave the Union were manifold. Slavery being but
a minor one. The North, however, made it a cause celebre.
Even left-wing pro-black film maker Ken Burns makes this point
abundantly clear in his semi-revisionist, liberal-leaning PBS
film, "The Civil War".
If you still doubt what we say, Try the book "The Battle Cry of
Freedom" by James M. McPherson. This is about as even-handed
a look at the war, and what led to it as I have seen since the 
revisionists took over the history departments of our various
educational institution in the mid-1960s.

George Graves






From gmgraves@aimnet.com Tue Oct 31 09:09:27 PST 1995
Article: 8122 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!news.sprintlink.net!aimnet.com!news2.aimnet.com!usenet
From: George Graves 
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power
Subject: Re: Graves doesn't know much about the Civil War, either.
Date: 31 Oct 1995 07:34:50 GMT
Organization: Graves Associates
Lines: 123
Message-ID: <474jiq$2tg@news2.aimnet.com>
References: <46sv8r$jqe@newsbf02.news.aol.com> <470anl$hoo@limestone.kosone.com> <471g9a$bc1@champ.ksu.ksu.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-cup1-10.iway.aimnet.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; 68K)
X-URL: news:471g9a$bc1@champ.ksu.ksu.edu

Stacia wrote:
>Rick Jones writes:
>
>>>   gmgraves@aol.com (GMGraves) writes:
>
>>>  Actually, slavery was minor issue when the war started. It certainly
>>>  became one of the major issues of the war when Lincoln 
>>>  emancipated the slaves in1863.
>
>>I am afraid that this is completely false.  Slavery, more than ANYTHING 
>>ELSE, was the dividing issue between North and South.  They didn't just
>>grow apart for no reason at all, nor did they grow apart solely because
>>of economic differences.  
>
>  Look, Rick, I know you've been pretty emotional about this, and I know 
>I posted this before, but the South at (and before) the time of the Civil 
>War did not see this is a racism issue, but as an economic issue.  Slaves 
>were economically important.  You can say that slavery divided the North 
>and South, but you cannot say that it was a civil rights issue, because 
>to half of the US at the time, it wasn't.  To the South, discontinuing 
>slavery was a symptom of a much bigger problem of control.  It is easy to 
>see where someone would think that it was a minor issue, because in a 
>way, it was.
>
>[snip]
>> it was a question of which states would be slave,
>>and which would be non-slave.  Admitting states into the Union based
>>upon THAT criterion does not suggest to me that slavery was a "non-issue."
>
>  I think GMGraves said it was a minor issue, not a "non-issue".  I think 
>the major argument here is the degree to which slavery was an issue, not 
>whether it was or not.  It's not like Graves said anything blatantly 
>wrong.  It is entirely a matter of perspective.

Matter of perspective or no, the South's grievence against the North was entirely based upon the issue of States Rights. I.E what th=
e Constitution left to the individual states to jurisdict. The North won.
It was an Illegal war, but they won, forever settling the question of
States Rights. The settlement was in the form of the States have no 
rights except those that the federal government tosses to them
as scraps. Even these can be taken away at the Fed's descretion. Take
for example speed limit laws. The Constitution in Article 2, Section
3 states that the Individual States are free to make any laws not
specifically denied to them under the Costitution. Cars didn't 
come along until the Twentieth century, so the feds let the states
set speed limits and other motor vehicle laws to suit themselves.
Until, that is, The feds decided that we needed a "national speed limit". At that time, the right to set speed limits was taken from=

the states by blackmail. (You don't adhere to the 50 MPH national
speed limit, and you get your federal highway funds yanked). Try
to do something like that in YOUR day-to-day business and see how
fast you end up on the wrong end of a extortion charge. But the feds
do it all the time. The South didn't lose the war, the individual
states both North and South lost it, and every since that day the 
power in these United States has gravitated increasingly toward
Washinton D.C.
>
>>>  Les is correct on another front as well. Since the "Nawth" won. 
>>>  they can call the war anything they like, but technically, the term
>>>  "Civil War" is innacurate.  A civil war is a war in which certain
>>>  factions of a populace rebel against the state. Since the South
>>>  seceeded, and formed their own country, this is not the case.
>
>>This is also nonsense.  Saying that the Civil War wasn't a Civil War
>>because the South claimed to be a nation is irrational; by that
>>token, I can declare my apartment building a state, constitute it,
>>hold a vote among the tenants, and if I get a majority, call myself
>>a nation and claim the cops are "invading" us when they show
>>up.  
>
>  The South seceded.  They may not have been recognized as a nation, but 
>it is entirely a Northern expression to call the war the Civil War.  On 
>the A&E special, actually, they mentioned that the war was called The War 
>Between the States across the entire nation, not just the South, for a 
>few years afterwards.  Civil War, however, does not necessarily contain 
>anything in its wording to indicate a national war, while the War Between 
>the States (as opposed to Between the Nations or something) does.  Makes 
>this argument a little odd, unless there is another phrase for the war 
>the Graves has mentioned that I missed.
>
>>Had the CSA won, then they would have had a claim.  The
>>war was over whether or not they COULD secede; they failed.
>>Nobody except the CSA recognized them as a nation; that they
>>could not survive as a self-claimed nation does not speak 
>>wellfor their historical claim to nationhood.
>
>  Actually, didn't some European countries recognize them as a nation?
>  And what about certain black and Jewish nations that WP'ers don't 
>recognize, does that mean they don't exist?  Or is it a majority of the 
>world that you're looking for?  I'm honestly confused by this claim that 
>the South could not have been recognized as a nation, because they could 
>have...
>
>
>>>  leadership, raised armed forces and made foreign policy. 
>>>  Russia, 1917 was a civil war. The U.S. Revolutionary war was, 
>>>  strictly speaking, a civil war. The War of Southern Secession was
>>>  not.
>
>>I would love to hear an explanation as to why the Revolutionary
>>war was a civil war, but the Civil War wasn't.
>
>  I think Graves is saying that since he feels the term "civil war" 
>reflects a war between national entities (here, states), that the 
>Revolutionary war was a civil one, because America was still British at 
>the time.  Although, since they effectively cut themselves off from 
>Britain, it seems that they would be in the same position as the South 
>was from the North, and therefore (according to Graves) NOT in a civil 
>war.  Which goes against Graves' point, apparently.
>
>Stacia
>
No it does not go against my point. In the Revolution you had a mix
of individuals throughout the population who were for or against
seperation from Great Britain. Those who wished to remain a colony
were called Torries and there were no drawn demarcation lines. It
wasn't Torries on this side of the line and revolutionaries on the
the other as it was in the War Between The States. Your next-door
neighbor in those days might have been a Torry, and he was in 
colusion with the British troops sent here to quell the rebellion.
This makes for a Civil War; two factions in the same political/geographic body fighting for opposing ideologies.

George Graves   




Home ·  Site Map ·  What's New? ·  Search Nizkor

© The Nizkor Project, 1991-2012

This site is intended for educational purposes to teach about the Holocaust and to combat hatred. Any statements or excerpts found on this site are for educational purposes only.

As part of these educational purposes, Nizkor may include on this website materials, such as excerpts from the writings of racists and antisemites. Far from approving these writings, Nizkor condemns them and provides them so that its readers can learn the nature and extent of hate and antisemitic discourse. Nizkor urges the readers of these pages to condemn racist and hate speech in all of its forms and manifestations.