From u58563@uic.edu Tue Oct  1 07:50:37 PDT 1996
Article: 70535 of alt.revisionism
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From: Tommy the Terrorist 
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,alt.politics,alt.conspiracy,alt.censorship
Subject: Re: Better dead than alive II
Date: 1 Oct 1996 03:18:55 GMT
Organization: Dis
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In article <324d7e21.25126539@199.0.216.204> tom moran, tm@pacificnet.net
writes:

>Who is "we"? You can't even use your own name. 

   It's not that I can't --- I just don't happen to want to.  My E-mail
address is information enough for whoever wants to get in contact with
me, and "Tommy the Terrorist" is much flashier.

   And, you see, unlike various 'Good Germans', I happen not to like the
notion of stopping at every street corner to show somebody identification
papers.

   As Linda Thompson says...

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DEATH TO THE NEW WORLD ORDER!<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<


From jmorris@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca Tue Oct  1 07:50:42 PDT 1996
Article: 70555 of alt.revisionism
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From: jmorris@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca (John Morris)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,alt.politics,alt.conspiracy,alt.censorship
Subject: Re: Better dead than alive II
Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 07:20:17 GMT
Organization: University of Alberta, Edmonton, Canada
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Tommy the Terrorist  wrote:

[snip]

>   As Linda Thompson says...
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DEATH TO THE NEW WORLD ORDER!<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Linda Thompson also says, "Hey, everybody, let's get our guns and
march on Washington!  Everybody? Hey? You don't want to march on
Washington? Fine! Be that way!"

--
 John Morris                               
 at University of Alberta     
-- 
The Nizkor Project     | http://www.nizkor.org/


From mvanalst@rbi.com Tue Oct  1 16:33:36 PDT 1996
Article: 70684 of alt.revisionism
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From: mvanalst@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,alt.politics,alt.conspiracy,alt.censorship
Subject: Re: Better dead than alive II
Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 08:11:22 -0800
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In article <3250c5bd.29402166@news.srv.ualberta.ca>,
jmorris@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca (John Morris) wrote:

> Tommy the Terrorist  wrote:
> 
> [snip]
> 
> >   As Linda Thompson says...
> >
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DEATH TO THE NEW WORLD
ORDER!<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
> 
> Linda Thompson also says, "Hey, everybody, let's get our guns and
> march on Washington!  Everybody? Hey? You don't want to march on
> Washington? Fine! Be that way!"

LOL! Poor Linda. All dressed up and nowhere to go.... What a boobette.

Mark

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil passes 
not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties--but
right through every human heart--and all human hearts." 

-- Alexander Solzhenitsyn, "The Gulag Archipelago"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


From morgoth@nome.net Tue Oct  1 19:08:02 PDT 1996
Article: 37115 of misc.activism.militia
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Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 96 1:33:03 GMT
Message-ID: <844133583$24806@atype.com>
Subject: UN and US Parks
Lines: 254



From=20boo.rody@backwood.com Mon Sep 30 17:28:54 1996
Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 08:41:00 GMT
From: Boo Rody 
Newsgroups: alt.culture.alaska
Subject: Dig the UN swallowing 48 US national parks!

This message was from lindat@iquest.net (Linda Thompson) to aen-news@a
originally in conference InternetE-MA on BACKWOOD {Back Woods)
and was forwarded to you by BOO RODY
                    ----------------------------------------
From: lindat@iquest.net (Linda Thompson)
To: aen-news@aen.org
Date: Sat, 28 Sep 96 09:12 EST
Subject: Dig the UN swallowing 48 US national parks!

>Date: Fri, 27 Sep 96 08:31:43 -0700
>From: 00000 
>Subject: Dig the UN swallowing 48 US national parks!


>Dig the UN swallowing 48 US national parks!
>From:  Jeff 
>Sent:  Friday, September 27, 1996 8:08 AM
>To:    MMCWU.recipients
>Subject:       Michigan Militia Corps Weekly Update (3-29)
>
>Please excuse any typos as this text is converted from a fax.
>
>
>Weekly Update - A publication of the Michigan Militia Corps
>Volume 3 Issue 29
>September 26, 1996
>
>The Taking of America
>by Karen Lee Bixman
>
>        "Welcome to Death Valley International Biosphere." This sign, post=
ed
>at the entrance of Death Valley National Park in the California desert=3D
> alerts
>visitors that Death Valley is no longer a national park. Along with 48 oth=
er
>national park sites throughout the country, Death Valley has come under th=
e
>guise and control of a United Nations advisory board that now supersedes t=
he
>authority of the United States Park Service.
>        If this scenario sounds like an Orwellian plot, too unbelievable t=
o
>be true, realize that while the American people have busied themselves in
>the essentials of raising their families and earning a living, our
>politicians in Washington have literally "given away the farm."
>        The Biosphere Reserve Program was the creation of the United Natio=
ns
>Educational Scientific Cultural Organization (UNESCO). Conceived in 1971,=
=3D
> the
>objective of the program was to designate world-wide sites for preservatio=
n
>and to protect the biodiversity of chosen sites on a global level.
>        As in the case of Death Valley, and other sites within the United
>States, each biosphere is divided into three different sections:
>(1) Wilderness zones (2) Buffer zones, and (3) Cooperation zones. The
>wilderness area is designed to be the habitat of plants and animals; human
>inhabitancy or human intrusion is forbidden. A buffer zone surrounds the
>wilderness area: limited access is permitted within this zone. The
>Cooperation zone will be allocated as the only site where humans will be
>allowed to live. The Sierra Club is but one of the 126 environmental
>organizations that work hand-in-hand with the United Nations to enact the
>environmental-global agenda. UNESCO passed resolution 1296 in 1968, which
>grants consultative status to organizations like the Sierra Club which=3D
> allows
>them to participate in UN environmental activities. In December 1972, UN
>Resolution 2997, which was adopted by the general assembly, created the
>United Nations Environmental Program (UNEP). This program has remapped the
>world into bioregions and is responsible for all of the environmental poli=
cy
>changes that have occurred globally in the last 20 years. Ideas spawned by
>the "chosen" 126 environmental groups are advanced by the UNEP.
>        It is the plan of the Sierra Club, the United Nations, and those
>followers of the "Green Agenda," to actually re-structure our society, as =
we
>now know it, and to relocate the human population of the United States=3D
> within
>these bioregions. The time estimate given for the re-structuring is 50 to=
=3D
> 100
>years. Therefore, when private citizens are robbed of their land, be it in
>the form of new legislation such as the Desert Wilderness Protection Act, =
or
>through land taking by the EPA, realize that the redistribution of the hum=
an
>population out of the "wilderness zones" has begun. [Ed. Note: It is not=
=3D
> only
>begun, but is well advanced. According to a map in National Geographic,=3D
> fully
>1/3 of the land in the United States belongs to the federal government.]
>        According to the plan, each of these 21 bioregions will be governe=
d
>by bioregional councils. Although in its infancy stage, the setting up of
>such a council is taking place in the U.S. South in conjunction with the
>Smoky Mountain National Park in Tennessee. In effect, when these councils
>come into play, local, state and national government will not be able to
>intervene with their enforcement. It will be under the strong arm of the U=
N
>that environmental organizations such as the Sierra Club, Natures'
>Conservancy and other green organizations will be given the green light an=
d
>will be the enforcement arm of these councils at the local level.
>
>        Another hoax perpetuated against the American people has been the
>implementation of the World Heritage Treaty signed by Richard Nixon on
>November 21, 1972, ratified by the Senate and entered into force on Decemb=
er
>17, 1975, this UN treaty was drafted during the general conference of UNES=
CO
>in 1972.
>        It addresses the cultural and natural heritage of lands throughout
(Continued to next message)

---
 =FE OLXWin 1.00b =FE MSI - Connecting The World (tm)

From=20boo.rody@backwood.com Mon Sep 30 17:29:02 1996
Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 08:41:00 GMT
From: Boo Rody 
Newsgroups: alt.culture.alaska
Subject: Dig the UN swallowi 02/04

(Continued from previous message)

>the world and contends that they're endangered and are being threatened by
>social and economic conditions. The treaty states, "Therefore, it is
>incumbent that the international community participate as a whole to use
>these heritage sites." Sites that qualify for protection under the title
>"Cultural Heritage" include any "monuments, archaeological works, building=
s,
>and landscapes which have universal value from a historical, aesthetic or
>ethnological point of view." Sites that qualify for protection under the
>description "National Heritage" include "aesthetic views, geographical
>formations and acres of threatened habitat of species of animal and plants=
=3D
> or
>natural areas of outstanding universal value from the point of science,
>conservation or natural beauty."
>        The treaty language is so vague that any property in the world can=
=3D
> be
>rendered a Heritage site if the governing committee so deems. The actual
>property does not need to be a historical site in the true sense of the=3D
> word,
>but, if for example, the site is of exceptional beauty, such as The Lake o=
f
>the Ozarks, in Missouri, or for that matter, Yosemite National Park in
>California, the site can be classified a Heritage site and removed from
>public use.
>        Recently, an example of the World Heritage Committee flexing its
>international arm of control, was felt when Yellowstone National Park was =
s
>elected as a World Heritage site.
>        For the past two years, the Crown Butte Company, owner of The New
>World Mine, had been undergoing an Environmental Impact Survey (EIS) in
>preparation of opening its gold mine outside the confines of Yellowstone
>National Park. According to Crown Butte owner, Joe Baylis, the mine was in
>compliance with all U.S. regulations. "In fact," stated Baylis, "new
>technology by the company actually serves to clean up the existing mine=3D
> waste
>in the area."
>        In July of 1995, however, a report by the Heritage Committee made
>reference to several threats to the park, such as deforestation by a
>religious group, tourism impacts and wildlife policies. Other concerns
>mentioned were "tourists overcrowding and threatening grizzly bears."
>        Bernard von Droste, Director of the World Heritage Committee state=
s=3D
>=3D20
>"Park managers in Yellowstone and elsewhere must also figure out ways to
>manage people who may otherwise love this park to death."
>        In light of statements made by von Droste, popular recreation area=
s
>and other national parks could soon find their way on the World Heritage
>Committee hit list. In September of 1995, fearing that the New World Mine
>would pass its EIS and be allowed to open, Secretary of the Interior Bruce
>Babbitt appealed to the Heritage Committee to declare Yellowstone a World
>Heritage site.
>        In December of 1995, the World Heritage Committee complied. Willia=
m
>Perry Pendly, an environmental attorney with the Mountain States Legal
>Foundation, stated in the February issue of The New American magazine that
>Yellowstone was threatened by the New World Mine.
>        "One of the misconceptions promoted by the mine's opponents is tha=
t
>it is right next to the park and that it would leave tailings and mine
>residue nearby, which would defile the park. But it is separated from
>Yellowstone by three mountain ridges. It is an area which has been mined
>since white men first went West and people have been smelting ore there=3D
> since
>about 1870."
>        As has been the norm with the establishment of International
>Biospheres, the World Heritage Treaty also calls for the taxing of private
>property as well. In the case of Yellowstone, this argument is now being=
=3D
> made
>by environmentalists that the ecosystem of Yellowstone extends tar beyond=
=3D
> the
>border of the 2.3 million acre park.
>        Tony Bemosky of the Mountain State Resources Center at Montana Sta=
te
>University stated that there is general agreement that the ecosystem
>encompasses parts of Utah, Idaho, Wyoming, and Montana, an area of between=
=3D
> 14
>to 18 million acres.
>        The UN environmental agenda has been avidly supported and advanced=
=3D
> by
>the Clinton administration. The Ecosystem Management Plan promoted by Vice
>President Al Gore, calls for 50 percent of the land within the United Stat=
es
>to be returned to wilderness. Twenty federal agencies are being used to
>implement this plan and the EPA is the enforcer.
>        Through executive order, Bruce Babbit and his Department of the
>Interior, in September of 1993, created the Office of National Biological
>Survey. This survey will attempt to record the location of each species of
>plants and animals located throughout the United States. The end result wi=
ll
>be a written record that will be used against the population whereby the E=
PA
>will then be justified in removing humans from areas where "endangered
>species" are located.
>        Through UN treaties and government proposals, the American people=
=3D
> are
>being robbed of their most precious freedom, the right to own land. One ca=
n
>only hope that the populous, once armed with the facts, will rise up and=
=3D
> eject
>these unconstitutional treaties, along with any governing body who would
>propose such a massive threat to the sovereignty of our country
>
>Am. Surv. Guide, September 1996
>
>
>UN "Reform" Not the Answer by John F. McManus
(Continued to next message)

---
 =FE OLXWin 1.00b =FE MSI - Connecting The World (tm)




From rcgraves@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  2 08:16:46 PDT 1996
Article: 70763 of alt.revisionism
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From: rcgraves@ix.netcom.com (Rich Graves)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,alt.politics,alt.conspiracy,alt.censorship
Subject: Re: Better dead than alive II
Date: 1 Oct 1996 23:57:00 -0700
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jmorris@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca (John Morris) writes:
>Tommy the Terrorist  wrote:
>
>[snip]
>
>>   As Linda Thompson says...
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DEATH TO THE NEW WORLD ORDER!<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
>
>Linda Thompson also says, "Hey, everybody, let's get our guns and
>march on Washington!  Everybody? Hey? You don't want to march on
>Washington? Fine! Be that way!"

John, you and Tommy have done it now. You're sure to be sued for
misappropriating Linda Th*mpson's name.

http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/t/thompson-linda/

-rich


From x@x.com Wed Oct  2 08:16:49 PDT 1996
Article: 70789 of alt.revisionism
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From: x@x.com (x)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,alt.politics,alt.conspiracy,alt.censorship
Subject: Re: Better dead than alive II
Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 21:26:23 GMT
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Upon Tue, 01 Oct 1996 07:20:17 GMT, jmorris@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca (John
Morris) You Said...:

->Tommy the Terrorist  wrote:
->
->[snip]
->
->>   As Linda Thompson says...
->>
->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DEATH TO THE NEW WORLD
ORDER!<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
->
->Linda Thompson also says, "Hey, everybody, let's get our guns and
->march on Washington!  Everybody? Hey? You don't want to march on
->Washington? Fine! Be that way!"
->
->--
-> John Morris

-> at University of Alberta     
->-- 
->The Nizkor Project     | http://www.nizkor.org/

Where is LINDA these days?
Don't see her post anymore?
Did *they* finally silence her?
I hope so, cause my $5K was paid in full...



From frice@stbbs.com Thu Oct  3 11:06:28 PDT 1996
Article: 95008 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!noc.van.hookup.net!nic.mtl.hookup.net!rcogate.rco.qc.ca!n3ott.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!n1van.istar!van-bc!uniserve!news.sol.net!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.sgi.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news-in2.uu.net!news3.agis.net!agis!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Government Cover-up
Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 19:09:48 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <52uf8h$mr2@newshub.atmnet.net>
References: <32500BB6.7384@uvsc.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.67.190.117
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

somebody  wrote:

>I am writing to tell you that there has been a government cover-up.  the 
>federal government planted the bomb in the federal building. they wanted 
>to 
>pass their anti-terrorism bill, so they drew upon public pity, to pass 
>the 
>bill with the support of the population. 

 Let me guess...  you ran into Linda Thompson and her fellow
brand of lunatics, right?  You forgot to mention that there were
buckets of mecury placed in the stairwells and that black helicopters
were stationed to videotape the event.

'Course there's no point in asking for evidence, huh?

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From lindat@iquest.net Fri Oct  4 07:42:55 PDT 1996
Article: 45695 of alt.politics.white-power
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From: lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson)
Subject: Re: Kill the lazy ass welfare loving dickhead NIGGERS!!!!! KKK will lynch you!!!
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Message-ID: 
Keywords: government Clinton CIA FBI ATF NSA DIA politics police militia military Waco Foster murder
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fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) wrote:

>ham@ix.netcom.com(William Mayers) writes about this spam:
>>This spam goes beyond the pale.  Complaints, accompanied by copies of
>>this post, to the server used by this cretin, are encouraged.

>He's posting from the very same machine (monet.icsi.net) and with the
>same ... er  ... language as the so-called "Travis
>" known for his postings in white-power
>groups.

>I posted the email addresses of people in charge of the server he uses,
>.monet.icsi.net, for this spam:

>   Administrative Contact:
>      Internet Connect Services, Inc.  (ICSI-NOC)  noc@icsi.net
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-8193
>   Technical Contact:
>      Suarez, Philip  (PS87)  philip@ICSI.NET
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-8193
>   Zone Contact:
>      Trew, Grady  (GT24)  grady@ICSI.NET
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-819
>   Support:
>      staff@icsi.ne
>      (800) 840-3694 (FAX) (512) 572-8193

>It's interesting how racists are either ashamed or afraid to express
>their views -- it's always posted under either fake names and email
>addresses or aliases.

>Maybe they don't have any identity.


CLUE UP.

These are virtually ALWAYS posted by government employees who are
trying to get the new FBI "controls" on Internet passed in Congress.

They need these posts to point to and say, "SEE!!!"

Get it?

Don't you find it AMAZING that whenever there is a gun-ban bill up in
Congress, there was a mass shooting?

Then, when the "anti-terrorism" bill is up for vote (twice -- once
during the World Trade Center bombing, now PROVEN to have been
financed by the FBI and Israel -- and the other time, right before the
Oklahoma building was blown up?

And, gee, funny thing, the FBI was in charge of BOTH operations and
benefit from BOTH bills, as does the US Military??!

Gee, who benefits from the new Internet legislation?  THE VERY SAME
GROUPS -- Southern Poverty Law Center and the ADL -- along with the
FBI -- who have been claiming there are
"terrorists/racists/nazis/porno" on the Internet.


This isn't rocket scientist material.


Kind regards,

************ V ***************
 Death to the New World Order
******************************

Dr. Linda Thompson
Attorney at Law
Chairman, American Justice Federation
lindat@iquest.net

******************************
      Remember Waco.
The murderers are still free.
******************************
   Have you seen this yet?
http://206.55.8.10/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum

If you have trouble accessing this site, contact
SkyWriter@Public-Action.com




From lindat@iquest.net Fri Oct  4 07:45:04 PDT 1996
Article: 95456 of alt.conspiracy
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.politics.datahighway,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.immigration,alt.skinheads,soc.penpals,alt.religion.christian,alt.conspiracy,sci.skeptic,alt.religion.islam,alt.alien.visitors,news.admin.net-abuse.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!news.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!news.thepoint.net!news1!news
From: lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson)
Subject: Re: Kill the lazy ass welfare loving dickhead NIGGERS!!!!! KKK will lynch you!!!
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: ind-000-236-59.iquest.net
Message-ID: 
Keywords: government Clinton CIA FBI ATF NSA DIA politics police militia military Waco Foster murder
Sender: lindat@iquest.net
Reply-To: lindat@iquest.net
Organization: AMERICAN JUSTICE FEDERATION
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
References: <52do36$2h1@monet.ICSI.Net> <52e52s$q45@dfw-ixnews12.ix.netcom.com> <52ebtv$i8s@luc.ircam.fr>
Date: Fri, 4 Oct 1996 06:27:09 GMT
Lines: 85
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca soc.culture.african.american:127488 alt.politics.datahighway:18703 alt.discrimination:54238 alt.politics.white-power:45695 alt.politics.nationalism.white:32116 alt.skinheads:38793 soc.penpals:86464 alt.religion.christian:133261 alt.conspiracy:95456 sci.skeptic:167687 alt.religion.islam:28502 alt.alien.visitors:104648 news.admin.net-abuse.misc:97447


fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) wrote:

>ham@ix.netcom.com(William Mayers) writes about this spam:
>>This spam goes beyond the pale.  Complaints, accompanied by copies of
>>this post, to the server used by this cretin, are encouraged.

>He's posting from the very same machine (monet.icsi.net) and with the
>same ... er  ... language as the so-called "Travis
>" known for his postings in white-power
>groups.

>I posted the email addresses of people in charge of the server he uses,
>.monet.icsi.net, for this spam:

>   Administrative Contact:
>      Internet Connect Services, Inc.  (ICSI-NOC)  noc@icsi.net
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-8193
>   Technical Contact:
>      Suarez, Philip  (PS87)  philip@ICSI.NET
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-8193
>   Zone Contact:
>      Trew, Grady  (GT24)  grady@ICSI.NET
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-819
>   Support:
>      staff@icsi.ne
>      (800) 840-3694 (FAX) (512) 572-8193

>It's interesting how racists are either ashamed or afraid to express
>their views -- it's always posted under either fake names and email
>addresses or aliases.

>Maybe they don't have any identity.


CLUE UP.

These are virtually ALWAYS posted by government employees who are
trying to get the new FBI "controls" on Internet passed in Congress.

They need these posts to point to and say, "SEE!!!"

Get it?

Don't you find it AMAZING that whenever there is a gun-ban bill up in
Congress, there was a mass shooting?

Then, when the "anti-terrorism" bill is up for vote (twice -- once
during the World Trade Center bombing, now PROVEN to have been
financed by the FBI and Israel -- and the other time, right before the
Oklahoma building was blown up?

And, gee, funny thing, the FBI was in charge of BOTH operations and
benefit from BOTH bills, as does the US Military??!

Gee, who benefits from the new Internet legislation?  THE VERY SAME
GROUPS -- Southern Poverty Law Center and the ADL -- along with the
FBI -- who have been claiming there are
"terrorists/racists/nazis/porno" on the Internet.


This isn't rocket scientist material.


Kind regards,

************ V ***************
 Death to the New World Order
******************************

Dr. Linda Thompson
Attorney at Law
Chairman, American Justice Federation
lindat@iquest.net

******************************
      Remember Waco.
The murderers are still free.
******************************
   Have you seen this yet?
http://206.55.8.10/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum

If you have trouble accessing this site, contact
SkyWriter@Public-Action.com




From lindat@iquest.net Fri Oct  4 07:45:05 PDT 1996
Article: 95457 of alt.conspiracy
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!portc01.blue.aol.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!news.thepoint.net!news1!news
From: lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson)
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: ind-000-236-59.iquest.net
Message-ID: 
Keywords: government Clinton CIA FBI ATF NSA DIA politics police militia military Waco Foster murder
Sender: lindat@iquest.net
Reply-To: lindat@iquest.net
Organization: AMERICAN JUSTICE FEDERATION
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
References:   <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net>  <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net>  <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net> 
Date: Fri, 4 Oct 1996 06:32:53 GMT
Lines: 253
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:95457 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:388648 rec.aviation.military:47384

jabowery@netcom.com (Jim Bowery) wrote:

CLUELESS:
>Drew Stowers (dstowers@wolfenet.com) wrote:
>: What do you mean 'no identifying markings'?  The only military
>: helicopters I know with identifying markings are non-tactical
>: transport helicopters (the ones that haul ranking officers or other
>: VIPs) and Coast Guard SAR helios.

>: The vast majority of military helios are painted in low reflective
>: (visual and IR) paint.  Any identifying marks (national ids and serial
>: numbers) are painted with the same stuff.  Otherwise the military
>: might as well paint bull's-eyes on them.

>Thanks for the information.  Do you have any authoritative references on 
>incidence of military aircraft being optically unmarked except for low 
>contrast markings?

>The reason this is important is that the population expects these aircraft
>to be visibly marked.  If they are visibly marked but it is low optical
>contrast, then even intelligent, but misinformed, observers are likely to
>add to the urban legend, as did my friend who saw these craft against a
>dark background and at reasonbly close range and therefore discounted the
>idea that markings were washed out due to lack of contrast.  One
>authoritative reference would do far more good than a thousand net-flames. 

>Are these markings of such low optical contrast that they are invisible in
>the optical range except upon close inspection?  Can we safely assume that
>ANY lighting conditions probable while observing one of these craft in
>flight will render these markings optically invisible? 
>-- 
>The promotion of politics exterminates apolitical genes in the population.
>  The promotion of frontiers gives apolitical genes a route to survival.
>                 Change the tools and you change the rules.


GO SEE THE MILITARY'S OWN DAMNED PICTURES AND LOOK AND SEE IF YOU SEE
ANY MARKINGS.

I GAVE YOU HOW MANY FRIGGIN' REFERENCES

TO **** MILITARY PICTURES OF THE DAMNED HELICOPTERS ****

AND THIS BONEHEAD COMES ALONG AND SAYS, "NO IT ISN'T."

Guess we just MUST believe him because he says so.

Some people are too stupid for words, just too stupid.

Here are the references, ONCE AGAIN:

                    BLACK HELICOPTERS EXIST
           THEY ARE BEING USED AGAINST U.S. CITIZENS
                             THEY ARE *NOT* U.N.

1.  Why do so many people react spastically at the mention of "Black
Helicopters" and immediately protest "THEY DON"T EXIST!"?

Years ago, the unit who flies the black helicopters was a "big secret"
and the public wasn't supposed to know.  It wasn't because the unit
was or is involved in something good, like space research, but rather,
because the unit received (and receives) "black budget" funds from
Congress, unaccountable to the public, and through the Organized Crime
Drug Enforcement Task Force (an illegal alliance of law enforcement
with the military), illegally served as the taxi-cab service for
private mafia squads of the FBI, DEA, and U.S. Customs.  They would
claim to be using task forces for "drug interdiction," but were in
fact, using them for private enterprises.

All the need for secrecy changed, however, when the military "Special
Operations Command" was formed, separate and apart from "Special
Forces," and when the 1995 Crime Bill officially (and
unConstitutionally) sanctioned the use of any federal agency in "crime
task forces."  Now the FBI, DEA, and military can form their mafia
squads out in the open and claim to be "fighting crime," and receive
their funds right out in the open.

2.  Well, if the black helicopters exist, where are they?

Ft. Campbell, Kentucky, is home of the U.S. Army's 101st Airborne
Division. 

Ft. Cambell's homepage is:  http://www.campbell.army.mil/campbell.htm

It is also the homebase for the 160th Special Operations Aviation
Regiment (the 160th SOAR), known as the "Nightstalkers," whose motto
is "Death Waits in the Dark."  Their logo is Death on horseback.

See their logo at:  http://www.nightstalkers.com/death.htm  

See photos of some of their BLACK HELICOPTERS at:

http://www.nightstalkers.com/museum.htm 
http://www.dtic.mil:80/airforcelink/pa/factsheets/pictures/mh_53j.gif


3.  What's the big deal about whether they are "BLACK" helicopters or
not anyway?

The color is significant because Special Operations Command gets this
particular type of paint, called "CARC" because it avoids infra-red
detection.  Some of the black paint is also radar absorbant.

The Special Operations units are often involved in clandestine (and
usually illegal) operations where they do not want to be detected and
if shot down, they do not want to be identified.  Their aircraft never
have any markings on them for this reason (unless they are temporarily
handpainted on in a homedone job when they are posing for TV).

The CARC paint appears flat black.  The radar-absorbant black paint 
looks somewhat crumbly.  Both are black, however.

Other Special Operations Units have black aircraft as well.  Other
black aircraft pictures can be seen at:

http://www.dtic.mil:80/airforcelink/pa/factsheets/pictures/ac_130h.gif

It is especially significant when a black helicopter is either a
"Little Bird" or an "Apache."  The 160th is the only unit that flies
the black "Little Bird" tactical chopper and black Apaches.  The Army
mentions that the 160th is the only unit to fly the Hughes 500 Little
Bird on their page at:  http://www.campbell.army.mil/copters.htm

The drawing shown on that page is of a green little bird, however, an
actual Little Bird, in flight, and, of course, black, is shown on the
160th page at:  http://www.nightstalkers.com/museum.htm 

Thus, the color black is useful for identifying the unit and purpose
of the particular aircraft.

For those who want to argue, "they're not really black, they're dark
GREEN," dark green can be seen on a C-130 at:

http://www.dtic.mil:80/airforcelink/pa/factsheets/pictures/c130.jpg

For those who want to argue "they're not really black, they're grey,
they just look black in the light," see the distinction between GREY
and BLACK on a GREY C-141 at:  

http://www.dtic.mil:80/airforcelink/pa/factsheets/pictures/c141.gif


When Special Operations military is used against American Citizens on
U.S. soil, that should be cause for alarm and outrage.

******************************************************

4.  HOW YOU CAN KNOW THAT ANYONE LOUDLY HOOTING DOWN ANYONE WHO SPEAKS
ABOUT EITHER WACO OR BLACK HELICOPTERS AS A "LOON" IS A NO-GOOD,
SCUM-BAG, MURDEROUS TRAITOR:

Black little birds, flown only by the 160th Special Operations
Aviation Regiment, were filmed by CNN, and by the FBI (we have a copy
of the FBI tape and have widely distributed it for two years) at Waco,
several times.

Remember the government's lies that no active duty military played
anything but a "support" role at Waco?

Remember Title 18, Section 1385 of the U.S. Code that makes such use
of the Army against American citizens COMPLETELY ILLEGAL?

Remember the women and children who came out of Waco saying that the
helicopters had fired into their house, into the roof?

Remember the BLACK LITTLE BIRD seen on TV in the first opening shots
of the "three helicopters" at Waco?

Remember Waco II, our video, that shows where the MEDIA cut out the
section of video with the sounds of the helicopters firing into the
roof, but made the mistake of leaving in the VIDEO that shows the
BULLETS SHOWN BEING FIRED INTO THE ROOF?

GUESS WHO THAT WAS.  Guess why they have spent SO MUCH MONEY
trying to convince the American public that there are "no black
helicopters" and there was "no illegal use of military at Waco."
(Though this lie should have been obvious to anyone who saw the tanks
in the front yard . . . .)

The 160th is a unit specially trained to do nothing but kill.  Their
own video, which shows their training, can be seen at the Pratt
Museum.

They are trained to do "urban insertion" -- parachuting from a
helicopter while a DOOR GUNNER fires into the URBAN TARGET below as a
"DIVERSION."  We filmed the 160th actually doing this training.

Remember ATF Agent Ted Royster, right after Waco, saying, "We had our
plan down, we had our **diversion** down, things just went wrong"?
(He's shown saying this in Waco, the Big Lie).

Remember the Treasury Report which says the "helicopers were supposed
to be a "diversion""?

Senator Dan Burton, who was spearheading the efforts to investigate
Waco and the murder of Vince Foster, suddenly found his son arrested
for dope charges -- twice in six months.

In the meantime, I found out it was DAN BURTON'S CHIEF OF STAFF who
was the head of the so-called "military experts" at Congress who
"examined" my tapes and found them to be "wholly wrong," and ran the
entire "investigation" into the ground.

DAN BURTON'S CHIEF OF STAFF WENT TO WORK FOR BURTON DIRECTLY FROM
DUTY WITH THE 160th SPECIAL OPERATIONS AVIATION REGIMENT.

And, guess who used the M67A FLAME THROWING TANKS and a technique
called "JITTERBUGGING" to COLLAPSE UNDERGROUND BUNKERS in Vietnam?
Why, gee, the same group who were the "consultants" for Waco:  5th
Group, Special Forces, Delta Force.  (Reference:  Treasury Department
Report on Waco, also shown in Waco II, the Big Lie Continues).

NOW YOU KNOW SOME OF WHY WE'VE BEEN TOLD SO MANY LIES ABOUT WACO,
ABOUT BLACK HELICOPTERS AND WHO THE LIARS ARE.

=========================================================

GO SEE THE REST OF THE STORY AT:

http://206.55.8.10/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum  <---- Best address
http://www.mnsinc.com/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum
http://www.Public-Action.com/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum


There you will also see the proof that the Branch Davidians did not
"commit suicide."  The autopsy pictures and Carol Valentine's
incredible and painstaking analysis of Waco, are the final blow.





Kind regards,

************ V ***************
 Death to the New World Order
******************************

Dr. Linda Thompson
Attorney at Law
Chairman, American Justice Federation
lindat@iquest.net

******************************
      Remember Waco.
The murderers are still free.
******************************
   Have you seen this yet?
http://206.55.8.10/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum

If you have trouble accessing this site, contact
SkyWriter@Public-Action.com




From finsten@mcmail.cis.mcmaster.ca Fri Oct  4 17:48:25 PDT 1996
Article: 45712 of alt.politics.white-power
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news1.wtn!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mathworks.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!news.drenet.dnd.ca!crc-news.doc.ca!nott!hone!informer1.cis.McMaster.CA!usenet
From: Laura Finsten 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.politics.datahighway,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.immigration,alt.skinheads,soc.penpals,alt.religion.christian,alt.conspiracy,sci.skeptic,alt.religion.islam,alt.al
Subject: Re: Kill the lazy ass welfare loving dickhead NIGGERS!!!!! KKK will lynch you!!!
Date: 4 Oct 1996 16:20:12 GMT
Organization: McMaster University, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada (NewServer)
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <533dfs$heq@informer1.cis.McMaster.CA>
References: <52do36$2h1@monet.ICSI.Net> <52e52s$q45@dfw-ixnews12.ix.netcom.com> <52ebtv$i8s@luc.ircam.fr> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: mac-finsten-l1.socsci.mcmaster.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; PPC)
X-URL: news:Dyqq06.Lys@iquest.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca soc.culture.african.american:127510 alt.politics.datahighway:18717 alt.discrimination:54252 alt.politics.white-power:45712 alt.politics.nationalism.white:32134 alt.skinheads:38805 soc.penpals:86469 alt.religion.christian:133376 alt.conspiracy:95563 sci.skeptic:167779 alt.religion.islam:28577

lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson) wrote:

>fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) wrote:

[...]

>>It's interesting how racists are either ashamed or afraid to express
>>their views -- it's always posted under either fake names and email
>>addresses or aliases.
[...]


>These are virtually ALWAYS posted by government employees who are
>trying to get the new FBI "controls" on Internet passed in Congress.

Gee, Dr. Thompson has just outed Kevin Strom, Bob Whitaker, p_stone,
Arthur LeBouthillier, Leslie Griswold and countless others as
employees of the US government!!!  Now isn't that exciting!

[...]

>Don't you find it AMAZING that whenever there is a gun-ban bill up in
>Congress, there was a mass shooting?

Statistically, I would guess that mass shootings are so common that
the alleged correlation is meaningless.  In other words, any time
would loosely "correlated with" a mass shooting.

>Then, when the "anti-terrorism" bill is up for vote (twice -- once
>during the World Trade Center bombing, now PROVEN to have been
>financed by the FBI and Israel[...]

I'm dying to hear your proof on that one.

>This isn't rocket scientist material.

You're not kidding.

"If I can't dance.....I don't want to be part of your revolution."
          Emma Goldman




From towry-rd-mg-ol@redstone.army.mil Fri Oct  4 17:49:06 PDT 1996
Article: 95507 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!news.nstn.ca!thor.atcon.com!eru.mt.luth.se!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!news.redstone.army.mil!news
From: "Elisa R. Towry" 
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 07:56:17 -0500
Organization: US Army Missile Command
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <32550971.EC2@redstone.army.mil>
References:   <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net>  <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net>  <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: 136.205.73.55
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b6Gold (Win95; I)
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:95507 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:388704 rec.aviation.military:47385

Dr. Linda Thompson wrote:
 
> 
> 3.  What's the big deal about whether they are "BLACK" helicopters or
> not anyway?
> 
> The color is significant because Special Operations Command gets this
> particular type of paint, called "CARC" because it avoids infra-red
> detection.  Some of the black paint is also radar absorbant.
> 
 >snip<

> The CARC paint appears flat black.  The radar-absorbant black paint
> looks somewhat crumbly.  Both are black, however.
> 
 
"CARC" means Chemical Agent Resistant Coating.  This only means that
the  CARC  paint has an additive to make it resistant to chemical
weapons.  Just because a paint is CARC does not mean that it is
automatically IR and/or radar absorbant and just because it is IR/radar
absorbant does not mean that it is CARC.


From rr04@gte.com Fri Oct  4 17:49:17 PDT 1996
Article: 95540 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news1.wtn.mci.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!news.gte.com!news
From: Rob Robertson 
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 12:00:24 -0400
Organization: GTE Laboratories Incorporated
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <32553498.18CA@gte.com>
References:   <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net>  <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net>  <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: h132-197-128-32.gte.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I)
To: lindat@iquest.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:95540 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:388783 rec.aviation.military:47386

Dr. Linda Thompson wrote:

> 4.  HOW YOU CAN KNOW THAT ANYONE LOUDLY HOOTING DOWN ANYONE WHO SPEAKS
> ABOUT EITHER WACO OR BLACK HELICOPTERS AS A "LOON" IS A NO-GOOD,
> SCUM-BAG, MURDEROUS TRAITOR:

*major snippage on my part*

I visited every site you included in your post, and not a single picture
does anything to convince me that there are UNMARKED military 
helicopters.

In the early 80's I worked on RF-4C's as they were switching over paint 
jobs to the matte black/matte olive drab paint scheme with flat black 
markings. Markings are visible in good light, but I could understand how 
a black helicopter with low-visibility markings could pass for 
'unmarked'.

Are night ops helos painted black? If they were MY birds, I'd paint 'em 
black, and if I had to fly in one at night with people shooting at me, 
I'd want it black. Are they unmarked? I've never seen one up close to say 
one way or another, but every picture I've seen has been inconclusive.

I don't have a problem with our military having black helicopters (it 
just seems to make sense to me), as long as they're identifiable, and 
I've yet to see any evidence that they are lacking ID markings.

-
Rob


From chute@bose.com Fri Oct  4 17:49:24 PDT 1996
Article: 95561 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.bc.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!uunet!news-in2.uu.net!news.ultranet.com!bose!usenet
From: Bruce Chute 
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 13:29:08 -0400
Organization: Bose Corporation
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <32554964.2407@bose.com>
References:   <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net>  <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net>  <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: gateway.bose.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (X11; I; HP-UX A.09.07 9000/777)
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:95561 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:388814 rec.aviation.military:47387

Dr. Linda Thompson wrote:



> 3.  What's the big deal about whether they are "BLACK" helicopters or
> not anyway?
> 
> The color is significant because Special Operations Command gets this
> particular type of paint, called "CARC" because it avoids infra-red
> detection.  Some of the black paint is also radar absorbant.
> 
> The Special Operations units are often involved in clandestine (and
> usually illegal) operations where they do not want to be detected and
> if shot down, they do not want to be identified.  Their aircraft never
> have any markings on them for this reason (unless they are temporarily
> handpainted on in a homedone job when they are posing for TV).
> 
> The CARC paint appears flat black.  The radar-absorbant black paint
> looks somewhat crumbly.  Both are black, however.
> 



How could the military be so intelligent as to be as close to taking
over as you say they are, and yet not realize that IR-resistant paint
(if there even is such a thing) won't do anything to hide that big ole
engine heat signature???  

Also, it wouldn't help for only some of the paint to be radar absorbant
'cause you'd have the rest of the non-radar-aborbant-painted (??)
aircraft.

Hmmmm.  Unless...oh no, it must be!   this is a troll, isn't it??!!??

Bruce

-------------------------------------------------------------------
Bruce Chute
Bose Corporation
My opinions. I don't get paid enough to represent my employers opinions.


From finsten@mcmail.cis.mcmaster.ca Fri Oct  4 17:49:26 PDT 1996
Article: 95563 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news1.wtn!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mathworks.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!news.drenet.dnd.ca!crc-news.doc.ca!nott!hone!informer1.cis.McMaster.CA!usenet
From: Laura Finsten 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.politics.datahighway,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.immigration,alt.skinheads,soc.penpals,alt.religion.christian,alt.conspiracy,sci.skeptic,alt.religion.islam,alt.al
Subject: Re: Kill the lazy ass welfare loving dickhead NIGGERS!!!!! KKK will lynch you!!!
Date: 4 Oct 1996 16:20:12 GMT
Organization: McMaster University, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada (NewServer)
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <533dfs$heq@informer1.cis.McMaster.CA>
References: <52do36$2h1@monet.ICSI.Net> <52e52s$q45@dfw-ixnews12.ix.netcom.com> <52ebtv$i8s@luc.ircam.fr> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: mac-finsten-l1.socsci.mcmaster.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; PPC)
X-URL: news:Dyqq06.Lys@iquest.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca soc.culture.african.american:127510 alt.politics.datahighway:18717 alt.discrimination:54252 alt.politics.white-power:45712 alt.politics.nationalism.white:32134 alt.skinheads:38805 soc.penpals:86469 alt.religion.christian:133376 alt.conspiracy:95563 sci.skeptic:167779 alt.religion.islam:28577

lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson) wrote:

>fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) wrote:

[...]

>>It's interesting how racists are either ashamed or afraid to express
>>their views -- it's always posted under either fake names and email
>>addresses or aliases.
[...]


>These are virtually ALWAYS posted by government employees who are
>trying to get the new FBI "controls" on Internet passed in Congress.

Gee, Dr. Thompson has just outed Kevin Strom, Bob Whitaker, p_stone,
Arthur LeBouthillier, Leslie Griswold and countless others as
employees of the US government!!!  Now isn't that exciting!

[...]

>Don't you find it AMAZING that whenever there is a gun-ban bill up in
>Congress, there was a mass shooting?

Statistically, I would guess that mass shootings are so common that
the alleged correlation is meaningless.  In other words, any time
would loosely "correlated with" a mass shooting.

>Then, when the "anti-terrorism" bill is up for vote (twice -- once
>during the World Trade Center bombing, now PROVEN to have been
>financed by the FBI and Israel[...]

I'm dying to hear your proof on that one.

>This isn't rocket scientist material.

You're not kidding.

"If I can't dance.....I don't want to be part of your revolution."
          Emma Goldman




From lindat@iquest.net Fri Oct  4 17:51:00 PDT 1996
Article: 38793 of alt.skinheads
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.politics.datahighway,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.immigration,alt.skinheads,soc.penpals,alt.religion.christian,alt.conspiracy,sci.skeptic,alt.religion.islam,alt.alien.visitors,news.admin.net-abuse.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!news.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!news.thepoint.net!news1!news
From: lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson)
Subject: Re: Kill the lazy ass welfare loving dickhead NIGGERS!!!!! KKK will lynch you!!!
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: ind-000-236-59.iquest.net
Message-ID: 
Keywords: government Clinton CIA FBI ATF NSA DIA politics police militia military Waco Foster murder
Sender: lindat@iquest.net
Reply-To: lindat@iquest.net
Organization: AMERICAN JUSTICE FEDERATION
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
References: <52do36$2h1@monet.ICSI.Net> <52e52s$q45@dfw-ixnews12.ix.netcom.com> <52ebtv$i8s@luc.ircam.fr>
Date: Fri, 4 Oct 1996 06:27:09 GMT
Lines: 85
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca soc.culture.african.american:127488 alt.politics.datahighway:18703 alt.discrimination:54238 alt.politics.white-power:45695 alt.politics.nationalism.white:32116 alt.skinheads:38793 soc.penpals:86464 alt.religion.christian:133261 alt.conspiracy:95456 sci.skeptic:167687 alt.religion.islam:28502 alt.alien.visitors:104648 news.admin.net-abuse.misc:97447


fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) wrote:

>ham@ix.netcom.com(William Mayers) writes about this spam:
>>This spam goes beyond the pale.  Complaints, accompanied by copies of
>>this post, to the server used by this cretin, are encouraged.

>He's posting from the very same machine (monet.icsi.net) and with the
>same ... er  ... language as the so-called "Travis
>" known for his postings in white-power
>groups.

>I posted the email addresses of people in charge of the server he uses,
>.monet.icsi.net, for this spam:

>   Administrative Contact:
>      Internet Connect Services, Inc.  (ICSI-NOC)  noc@icsi.net
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-8193
>   Technical Contact:
>      Suarez, Philip  (PS87)  philip@ICSI.NET
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-8193
>   Zone Contact:
>      Trew, Grady  (GT24)  grady@ICSI.NET
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-819
>   Support:
>      staff@icsi.ne
>      (800) 840-3694 (FAX) (512) 572-8193

>It's interesting how racists are either ashamed or afraid to express
>their views -- it's always posted under either fake names and email
>addresses or aliases.

>Maybe they don't have any identity.


CLUE UP.

These are virtually ALWAYS posted by government employees who are
trying to get the new FBI "controls" on Internet passed in Congress.

They need these posts to point to and say, "SEE!!!"

Get it?

Don't you find it AMAZING that whenever there is a gun-ban bill up in
Congress, there was a mass shooting?

Then, when the "anti-terrorism" bill is up for vote (twice -- once
during the World Trade Center bombing, now PROVEN to have been
financed by the FBI and Israel -- and the other time, right before the
Oklahoma building was blown up?

And, gee, funny thing, the FBI was in charge of BOTH operations and
benefit from BOTH bills, as does the US Military??!

Gee, who benefits from the new Internet legislation?  THE VERY SAME
GROUPS -- Southern Poverty Law Center and the ADL -- along with the
FBI -- who have been claiming there are
"terrorists/racists/nazis/porno" on the Internet.


This isn't rocket scientist material.


Kind regards,

************ V ***************
 Death to the New World Order
******************************

Dr. Linda Thompson
Attorney at Law
Chairman, American Justice Federation
lindat@iquest.net

******************************
      Remember Waco.
The murderers are still free.
******************************
   Have you seen this yet?
http://206.55.8.10/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum

If you have trouble accessing this site, contact
SkyWriter@Public-Action.com




From finsten@mcmail.cis.mcmaster.ca Fri Oct  4 17:51:04 PDT 1996
Article: 38805 of alt.skinheads
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news1.wtn!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mathworks.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!news.drenet.dnd.ca!crc-news.doc.ca!nott!hone!informer1.cis.McMaster.CA!usenet
From: Laura Finsten 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.politics.datahighway,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.immigration,alt.skinheads,soc.penpals,alt.religion.christian,alt.conspiracy,sci.skeptic,alt.religion.islam,alt.al
Subject: Re: Kill the lazy ass welfare loving dickhead NIGGERS!!!!! KKK will lynch you!!!
Date: 4 Oct 1996 16:20:12 GMT
Organization: McMaster University, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada (NewServer)
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <533dfs$heq@informer1.cis.McMaster.CA>
References: <52do36$2h1@monet.ICSI.Net> <52e52s$q45@dfw-ixnews12.ix.netcom.com> <52ebtv$i8s@luc.ircam.fr> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: mac-finsten-l1.socsci.mcmaster.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; PPC)
X-URL: news:Dyqq06.Lys@iquest.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca soc.culture.african.american:127510 alt.politics.datahighway:18717 alt.discrimination:54252 alt.politics.white-power:45712 alt.politics.nationalism.white:32134 alt.skinheads:38805 soc.penpals:86469 alt.religion.christian:133376 alt.conspiracy:95563 sci.skeptic:167779 alt.religion.islam:28577

lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson) wrote:

>fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) wrote:

[...]

>>It's interesting how racists are either ashamed or afraid to express
>>their views -- it's always posted under either fake names and email
>>addresses or aliases.
[...]


>These are virtually ALWAYS posted by government employees who are
>trying to get the new FBI "controls" on Internet passed in Congress.

Gee, Dr. Thompson has just outed Kevin Strom, Bob Whitaker, p_stone,
Arthur LeBouthillier, Leslie Griswold and countless others as
employees of the US government!!!  Now isn't that exciting!

[...]

>Don't you find it AMAZING that whenever there is a gun-ban bill up in
>Congress, there was a mass shooting?

Statistically, I would guess that mass shootings are so common that
the alleged correlation is meaningless.  In other words, any time
would loosely "correlated with" a mass shooting.

>Then, when the "anti-terrorism" bill is up for vote (twice -- once
>during the World Trade Center bombing, now PROVEN to have been
>financed by the FBI and Israel[...]

I'm dying to hear your proof on that one.

>This isn't rocket scientist material.

You're not kidding.

"If I can't dance.....I don't want to be part of your revolution."
          Emma Goldman




From lindat@iquest.net Fri Oct  4 18:24:48 PDT 1996
Article: 54238 of alt.discrimination
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.politics.datahighway,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.immigration,alt.skinheads,soc.penpals,alt.religion.christian,alt.conspiracy,sci.skeptic,alt.religion.islam,alt.alien.visitors,news.admin.net-abuse.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!news.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!news.thepoint.net!news1!news
From: lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson)
Subject: Re: Kill the lazy ass welfare loving dickhead NIGGERS!!!!! KKK will lynch you!!!
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: ind-000-236-59.iquest.net
Message-ID: 
Keywords: government Clinton CIA FBI ATF NSA DIA politics police militia military Waco Foster murder
Sender: lindat@iquest.net
Reply-To: lindat@iquest.net
Organization: AMERICAN JUSTICE FEDERATION
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
References: <52do36$2h1@monet.ICSI.Net> <52e52s$q45@dfw-ixnews12.ix.netcom.com> <52ebtv$i8s@luc.ircam.fr>
Date: Fri, 4 Oct 1996 06:27:09 GMT
Lines: 85
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca soc.culture.african.american:127488 alt.politics.datahighway:18703 alt.discrimination:54238 alt.politics.white-power:45695 alt.politics.nationalism.white:32116 alt.skinheads:38793 soc.penpals:86464 alt.religion.christian:133261 alt.conspiracy:95456 sci.skeptic:167687 alt.religion.islam:28502 alt.alien.visitors:104648 news.admin.net-abuse.misc:97447


fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) wrote:

>ham@ix.netcom.com(William Mayers) writes about this spam:
>>This spam goes beyond the pale.  Complaints, accompanied by copies of
>>this post, to the server used by this cretin, are encouraged.

>He's posting from the very same machine (monet.icsi.net) and with the
>same ... er  ... language as the so-called "Travis
>" known for his postings in white-power
>groups.

>I posted the email addresses of people in charge of the server he uses,
>.monet.icsi.net, for this spam:

>   Administrative Contact:
>      Internet Connect Services, Inc.  (ICSI-NOC)  noc@icsi.net
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-8193
>   Technical Contact:
>      Suarez, Philip  (PS87)  philip@ICSI.NET
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-8193
>   Zone Contact:
>      Trew, Grady  (GT24)  grady@ICSI.NET
>      (512) 572-9987 (FAX) (512) 572-819
>   Support:
>      staff@icsi.ne
>      (800) 840-3694 (FAX) (512) 572-8193

>It's interesting how racists are either ashamed or afraid to express
>their views -- it's always posted under either fake names and email
>addresses or aliases.

>Maybe they don't have any identity.


CLUE UP.

These are virtually ALWAYS posted by government employees who are
trying to get the new FBI "controls" on Internet passed in Congress.

They need these posts to point to and say, "SEE!!!"

Get it?

Don't you find it AMAZING that whenever there is a gun-ban bill up in
Congress, there was a mass shooting?

Then, when the "anti-terrorism" bill is up for vote (twice -- once
during the World Trade Center bombing, now PROVEN to have been
financed by the FBI and Israel -- and the other time, right before the
Oklahoma building was blown up?

And, gee, funny thing, the FBI was in charge of BOTH operations and
benefit from BOTH bills, as does the US Military??!

Gee, who benefits from the new Internet legislation?  THE VERY SAME
GROUPS -- Southern Poverty Law Center and the ADL -- along with the
FBI -- who have been claiming there are
"terrorists/racists/nazis/porno" on the Internet.


This isn't rocket scientist material.


Kind regards,

************ V ***************
 Death to the New World Order
******************************

Dr. Linda Thompson
Attorney at Law
Chairman, American Justice Federation
lindat@iquest.net

******************************
      Remember Waco.
The murderers are still free.
******************************
   Have you seen this yet?
http://206.55.8.10/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum

If you have trouble accessing this site, contact
SkyWriter@Public-Action.com




From finsten@mcmail.cis.mcmaster.ca Fri Oct  4 18:24:52 PDT 1996
Article: 54252 of alt.discrimination
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news1.wtn!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mathworks.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!news.drenet.dnd.ca!crc-news.doc.ca!nott!hone!informer1.cis.McMaster.CA!usenet
From: Laura Finsten 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.politics.datahighway,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.immigration,alt.skinheads,soc.penpals,alt.religion.christian,alt.conspiracy,sci.skeptic,alt.religion.islam,alt.al
Subject: Re: Kill the lazy ass welfare loving dickhead NIGGERS!!!!! KKK will lynch you!!!
Date: 4 Oct 1996 16:20:12 GMT
Organization: McMaster University, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada (NewServer)
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <533dfs$heq@informer1.cis.McMaster.CA>
References: <52do36$2h1@monet.ICSI.Net> <52e52s$q45@dfw-ixnews12.ix.netcom.com> <52ebtv$i8s@luc.ircam.fr> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: mac-finsten-l1.socsci.mcmaster.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; PPC)
X-URL: news:Dyqq06.Lys@iquest.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca soc.culture.african.american:127510 alt.politics.datahighway:18717 alt.discrimination:54252 alt.politics.white-power:45712 alt.politics.nationalism.white:32134 alt.skinheads:38805 soc.penpals:86469 alt.religion.christian:133376 alt.conspiracy:95563 sci.skeptic:167779 alt.religion.islam:28577

lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson) wrote:

>fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) wrote:

[...]

>>It's interesting how racists are either ashamed or afraid to express
>>their views -- it's always posted under either fake names and email
>>addresses or aliases.
[...]


>These are virtually ALWAYS posted by government employees who are
>trying to get the new FBI "controls" on Internet passed in Congress.

Gee, Dr. Thompson has just outed Kevin Strom, Bob Whitaker, p_stone,
Arthur LeBouthillier, Leslie Griswold and countless others as
employees of the US government!!!  Now isn't that exciting!

[...]

>Don't you find it AMAZING that whenever there is a gun-ban bill up in
>Congress, there was a mass shooting?

Statistically, I would guess that mass shootings are so common that
the alleged correlation is meaningless.  In other words, any time
would loosely "correlated with" a mass shooting.

>Then, when the "anti-terrorism" bill is up for vote (twice -- once
>during the World Trade Center bombing, now PROVEN to have been
>financed by the FBI and Israel[...]

I'm dying to hear your proof on that one.

>This isn't rocket scientist material.

You're not kidding.

"If I can't dance.....I don't want to be part of your revolution."
          Emma Goldman




From stallppp@corcom.com Sat Oct  5 10:28:00 PDT 1996
Article: 95662 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!nnrp.info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!super.zippo.com!zdc!szdc!news
From: kevin Stall 
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 14:12:24 -0800
Organization: Crown Communication, Inc
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <32558BC7.736F@corcom.com>
References:   <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net>  <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net>  <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net>   <32553498.18CA@gte.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:95662 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:389025 rec.aviation.military:47390

Rob Robertson wrote:
> 
> Dr. Linda Thompson wrote:
> 
> > 4.  HOW YOU CAN KNOW THAT ANYONE LOUDLY HOOTING DOWN ANYONE WHO SPEAKS
> > ABOUT EITHER WACO OR BLACK HELICOPTERS AS A "LOON" IS A NO-GOOD,
> > SCUM-BAG, MURDEROUS TRAITOR:
> 
> *major snippage on my part*
> 
> I visited every site you included in your post, and not a single picture
> does anything to convince me that there are UNMARKED military
> helicopters.
> 
> In the early 80's I worked on RF-4C's as they were switching over paint
> jobs to the matte black/matte olive drab paint scheme with flat black
> markings. Markings are visible in good light, but I could understand how
> a black helicopter with low-visibility markings could pass for
> 'unmarked'.
> 
> Are night ops helos painted black? If they were MY birds, I'd paint 'em
> black, and if I had to fly in one at night with people shooting at me,
> I'd want it black. Are they unmarked? I've never seen one up close to say
> one way or another, but every picture I've seen has been inconclusive.
> 
> I don't have a problem with our military having black helicopters (it
> just seems to make sense to me), as long as they're identifiable, and
> I've yet to see any evidence that they are lacking ID markings.

I agree, those pictures do not show anything.  But there is something
else people must realize, the military are not covered by FAA
regulations.  They are not required to follow FAA rules.  There is no
reason, if they want, to have unmarked.

Kevin


From finsten@mcmail.cis.mcmaster.ca Sat Oct  5 11:33:39 PDT 1996
Article: 127510 of soc.culture.african.american
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news1.wtn!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.mathworks.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!news.drenet.dnd.ca!crc-news.doc.ca!nott!hone!informer1.cis.McMaster.CA!usenet
From: Laura Finsten 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,alt.politics.datahighway,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.immigration,alt.skinheads,soc.penpals,alt.religion.christian,alt.conspiracy,sci.skeptic,alt.religion.islam,alt.al
Subject: Re: Kill the lazy ass welfare loving dickhead NIGGERS!!!!! KKK will lynch you!!!
Date: 4 Oct 1996 16:20:12 GMT
Organization: McMaster University, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada (NewServer)
Lines: 42
Message-ID: <533dfs$heq@informer1.cis.McMaster.CA>
References: <52do36$2h1@monet.ICSI.Net> <52e52s$q45@dfw-ixnews12.ix.netcom.com> <52ebtv$i8s@luc.ircam.fr> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: mac-finsten-l1.socsci.mcmaster.ca
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (Macintosh; I; PPC)
X-URL: news:Dyqq06.Lys@iquest.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca soc.culture.african.american:127510 alt.politics.datahighway:18717 alt.discrimination:54252 alt.politics.white-power:45712 alt.politics.nationalism.white:32134 alt.skinheads:38805 soc.penpals:86469 alt.religion.christian:133376 alt.conspiracy:95563 sci.skeptic:167779 alt.religion.islam:28577

lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson) wrote:

>fingerhu@ircam.fr (Michel Fingerhut) wrote:

[...]

>>It's interesting how racists are either ashamed or afraid to express
>>their views -- it's always posted under either fake names and email
>>addresses or aliases.
[...]


>These are virtually ALWAYS posted by government employees who are
>trying to get the new FBI "controls" on Internet passed in Congress.

Gee, Dr. Thompson has just outed Kevin Strom, Bob Whitaker, p_stone,
Arthur LeBouthillier, Leslie Griswold and countless others as
employees of the US government!!!  Now isn't that exciting!

[...]

>Don't you find it AMAZING that whenever there is a gun-ban bill up in
>Congress, there was a mass shooting?

Statistically, I would guess that mass shootings are so common that
the alleged correlation is meaningless.  In other words, any time
would loosely "correlated with" a mass shooting.

>Then, when the "anti-terrorism" bill is up for vote (twice -- once
>during the World Trade Center bombing, now PROVEN to have been
>financed by the FBI and Israel[...]

I'm dying to hear your proof on that one.

>This isn't rocket scientist material.

You're not kidding.

"If I can't dance.....I don't want to be part of your revolution."
          Emma Goldman




From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct  6 16:33:03 PDT 1996
Article: 96292 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!news.nstn.ca!newsflash.concordia.ca!newsfeed.pitt.edu!news.duq.edu!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.sprintlink.net!new-news.sprintlink.net!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.journalism
Subject: Re: 'Oklahoma City: Day One'
Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 21:54:42 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 21
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dsale@users.southeast.net (Dan Sale) wrote:

>media tells us that we must fear American patriots... and the Militia.

>NOTHING COULD BE FARTHER FROM THE TRUTH!

>The Harvest Trust
>P.O. Box 1970
>Eagar, Arizona 85925

Cool.  Another right-wing extremist cult.  Or is this another front
for Linda Thompson's cult?

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct  6 16:33:05 PDT 1996
Article: 96295 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.sprintlink.net!new-news.sprintlink.net!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 21:54:10 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <539ag1$d87@newshub.atmnet.net>
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lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson) wrote:

>1.  Why do so many people react spastically at the mention of "Black
>Helicopters" and immediately protest "THEY DON"T EXIST!"?

Could it be because you right-wing lunatics don't ever provide any
evidence for the existance of these "black helicopters?"

In your extremist tirade (which I thankfully deleted) all I see are
a lot of unfounded accusations and rumors simply mouthing-off the
traditional urban legend with a weak atempt to lend it credability
by having the names of a few military bases tossed in.

Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?
Or do you only have a lot of unfounded accusations and religious
claims?

Any evidnce you might have can be directed to:

	frice@stbbs.com

Thanks.  

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct  6 16:33:06 PDT 1996
Article: 96297 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.sprintlink.net!new-news.sprintlink.net!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 21:54:32 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 45
Message-ID: <539ago$d87@newshub.atmnet.net>
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Rob Robertson  wrote:

>Dr. Linda Thompson wrote:

  She's calling herself a doctor now, I see.   
She's so ___cute___!

>> 4.  HOW YOU CAN KNOW THAT ANYONE LOUDLY HOOTING DOWN ANYONE WHO SPEAKS
>> ABOUT EITHER WACO OR BLACK HELICOPTERS AS A "LOON" IS A NO-GOOD,
>> SCUM-BAG, MURDEROUS TRAITOR:

Notice the characterization of her pretend opposistion?  While these
lunatics _are_ lunatics, they are motivated by religiously-induced
insanity, in my opinion, and can't properly be considered "traitors."

'Except that they bring upon the rest of us the very destruction of
the Constitution they decry.  When these right-wing extremists like
Thompson blow up buildings and call for the armed march on Washington,
they bring upon the populace the very government actions they bemoan
in response to safeguard the populace against her and her friends.

Because her Christian religious ideologies make her believe the
United States government is controlled by Jews, she works to bring
about the slow destruction of the Constitution to self-fufill her
lunatic religious beliefs -- and never mind the fact that 260 million
Americans have to suffer for ___her___ ignorant religious occultism.

>Are night ops helos painted black? If they were MY birds, I'd paint 'em 
>black, and if I had to fly in one at night with people shooting at me, 
>I'd want it black.

A better color scheme for night operations would be a grey.  The
problem with grey is the fighter pilots who think black looks more
sinister.    (One of the "Firepower" series shows talked
about how fighter pilots knew grey is harder to see from the ground
against the night sky than black but "lobbied" for black anyway.)

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct  6 16:33:07 PDT 1996
Article: 96298 of alt.conspiracy
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From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 21:54:36 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <539agu$d87@newshub.atmnet.net>
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Bruce Chute  wrote:

>Dr. Linda Thompson wrote:

  She's ___so___ cute!

>

>> 3.  What's the big deal about whether they are "BLACK" helicopters or
>> not anyway?
>> 
>> The color is significant because Special Operations Command gets this
>> particular type of paint, called "CARC" because it avoids infra-red
>> detection.  Some of the black paint is also radar absorbant.

>How could the military be so intelligent as to be as close to taking
>over as you say they are, and yet not realize that IR-resistant paint
>(if there even is such a thing) won't do anything to hide that big ole
>engine heat signature???  

She's not interested in the physics and the facts; she only wants to
depict this sinister corruption as evil...  Never mind the fact that
the populace at large doesn't own equipment which could bounce IR off
of her pretend black helicopters; never mind the fact that the
populace at large couldn't manufacture such equipment with available
public/private-sector supplies if they had to.

>Also, it wouldn't help for only some of the paint to be radar absorbant
>'cause you'd have the rest of the non-radar-aborbant-painted (??)
>aircraft.

>Hmmmm.  Unless...oh no, it must be!   this is a troll, isn't it??!!??

She's no troll.  She's a religious lunatic, in my opinion.  I have
extensive archives on her and her rightwing extremist friends and I
make them available to the public.

She was on KFI AM 640 Talk Radio in Los Angeles one day and launched
her ignorant tirade.  I managed to get my notes together and make it
into the radio station by telephone but learned that she had delayed
her appearance an hour, causing me to be bumped whereafter I was
unable to get a line back into the station.

I would have ___loved___ to cover the truth about Linda Thompson on
the air and ask her some embarrassing questions about beliefs of hers
which she convieniently "forgot" to mention on the air.  Among them
was her cult's claim that mecury was stored in the Oklahoma building
which was blown up by American government agencies, and that mecury
was also spread around the ruins of the Branch Davidians' compound to
poison investigators in an effort to keep them out.

But like any religious crusader, the truth just doesn't matter when
it comes to their superstitions.  'And ___fuck___ the 260 million
rest of us who directly suffer the loss of personal freedoms due to 
the self-fufilling prophecies of these right-wing extremist lunatics.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From chaos@tccbbs.com Mon Oct  7 14:53:09 PDT 1996
Article: 96617 of alt.conspiracy
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From: chaos@tccbbs.com (Chaos)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: 7 Oct 1996 19:32:02 GMT
Organization: cannet.com
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In article <539agk$d87@newshub.atmnet.net>, frice@stbbs.com says...

>She wasn't branded as the "Queen of Hate" by (Ironically enough) the
>National Enquirer for nothing.  When I was participaing in Civ_Lib,
>when she and her lunatic friends showed up I left; I then dropped out
>of every other forum where she put in an appearance.
>
>Quite simply the woman is, in my opinion, mentally unstable and should
>be avoided.  Evidence of that is her willingness to wind-up other
>unstable lunatics and set them on their way to pretend "assaults" on
>Washington.
>
>___REAL___ human rights activists in the United States are content
>enough to expose the tyrannies inflicted upon the populace by the 
>various branches of the United States government.  They don't have to
>contrive elaborate lies and conspiracies to try to lend their lunatic
>religious agendas credability.

Agreed. Her paranoid rantings have gotten worse over the years. One of the more 
hilarious ones was when she made a post about how a UPS delivery person was 
really a government spy trying to bug her office. I guess the guy made a 
delivery and asked if there was a bathroom he could use. Ms. Thompson's 
paranoia kicked in and she blew the whole thing out of proportion on fidonet.



From kkoller@adnetsol.adnetsol.com Tue Oct  8 09:22:52 PDT 1996
Article: 96765 of alt.conspiracy
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From: Ken Koller 
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!-----> BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ <------!!
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 19:53:44 -0700
Organization: Advanced Network Solutions
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Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:96765 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:390641 rec.aviation.military:47405

On Sat, 5 Oct 1996, Fredric L. Rice wrote:

> lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson) wrote:
> 
> >1.  Why do so many people react spastically at the mention of "Black
> >Helicopters" and immediately protest "THEY DON"T EXIST!"?
> 
> Could it be because you right-wing lunatics don't ever provide any
> evidence for the existance of these "black helicopters?"
> 
> In your extremist tirade (which I thankfully deleted) all I see are
> a lot of unfounded accusations and rumors simply mouthing-off the
> traditional urban legend with a weak atempt to lend it credability
> by having the names of a few military bases tossed in.
> 
> Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
> have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?
> Or do you only have a lot of unfounded accusations and religious
> claims?
> 
> Any evidnce you might have can be directed to:
> 
> 	frice@stbbs.com

Heck, I'd like to see it posted to the entire list myself. I'm not 
holding my breath though.

 
Ken Koller 

  *************************************************************************
  *   Fireline Images: Fire/Rescue/EMS Photography                        *
  *   http://www.islandnet.com/~waynej/Ken_Koller/fireline.html           *
  *   kkoller@adnetsol.com                                                *
  *                                                                       *
  *   	       As the decibels of this disenchanting discourse 		  *
  *             	Continue to dampen the day			  *
  * 	      The coin flips again and again and again and again          *
  *  			 As our sanity walks away			  *
  *						-- Live			  *
  *************************************************************************




From pdgraham@comsys.net Tue Oct  8 11:08:29 PDT 1996
Article: 323170 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!n3ott.istar!imci2!newsfeed.internetmci.com!act.news.telstra.net!nsw.news.telstra.net!elausrv2.att.net.au!surya@mail.att.net.au
From: Patrick Graham 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns
Subject: Re: To Linda Thompson - how about giving us a list of what you consider your personal accomplishments to gun rights.
Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 20:47:47 -0400
Organization: Unknown Organisation
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Message-ID: <3255B033.5505@comsys.net>
References: <5263hq$j81@crl11.crl.com>
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
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Steve D. Fischer wrote:
> 
>        I just received a piece of hate mail from Linda Thompson, which
> I won't bore you with here.  Stripped of all its invectives, her main
> point appeared to be that my view of her "accomplishments" was purely
> based on what the media have said about her.  Rather than argue that
> point, and in an effort to be totally fair, I will simply ask Linda to
> give me, and hence you, a list of what *SHE* considers to be *POSITIVE*
> accomplishments in the battle to maintain our 2nd Amendment rights.
> Then we can all decide if she has been misrepresented by the media.
> 
> Steve


I think Linda’s biggest accomplishment was when she tried to get us 
Indiana
gun owners to bring our guns to Washington and arrest all the 
politicians.
I’m sure she actually got some of the stupid amongst us arrested.

This dumb bitch has to take some responsibility for the OKC bombing.
She seems to have a way with the 90 or less IQ crowd.

No one has made the American gun owner look dumber .

She has got to be a plant, salted into our midst by some anti-gun group.

Patrick Graham
pdgraham@holli.com
pdgraham@comsys.net


From frice@stbbs.com Thu Oct 10 09:53:39 PDT 1996
Article: 97516 of alt.conspiracy
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From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 05:27:40 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <53i261$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net>
References:   <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net>  <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net>  <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net>   <539ag1$d87@newshub.atmnet.net> 
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Ken Koller  wrote:

>> lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson) wrote:

"Doctor."  

>> Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
>> have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?
>> Or do you only have a lot of unfounded accusations and religious
>> claims?
>> 
>> Any evidnce you might have can be directed to:
>> 
>> 	frice@stbbs.com

>Heck, I'd like to see it posted to the entire 
>list myself. I'm not holding my breath though.

If breath holding would work, we could take turns and see if that
would get these guys and gals to fork it over.  This is the same 
bitch who demanded that federal officials used flamethrowers against
the Branch Davidians -- and her lunatic nuts took a satelite
downlink of a personal armored transport knocking holes in the
Davidian compound's walls, called it a tank, and then MANUFACTURED
a hoax by splicing and time-editing the video tape; a hoax which 
the voice-over claims shows a tank using a flame thrower.

The bitch sells it as "Waco: The Big Lie."

What the _rational_, _honest_ people over at Soldier of Fortune
Magazine found was the original satelite feed tapes which were
undoctored -- they either pulled in the feed themselves else just
got it from their regular news sources.

What the ___undoctored___ tape showed was the armored personnel
carrier pulling down a section of wall where a piece of ceiling
falls down.  The Thompson cult doctored their hoax to try to make
the gullible see flames and smoke.

Now long after Soldier of Fortune Magazine started selling their
own copies to prove that Thompson is a liar, her little band of
unsalted nuts are ___still___ selling their lie; they've even
manufactured _another_ hoax and have called it something like, "The
lie continues."

Well they got that right.

But then with these right-wing extremists it's anything for a buck.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Thu Oct 10 09:56:24 PDT 1996
Article: 97517 of alt.conspiracy
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From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 05:27:35 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
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Message-ID: <53i25t$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net>
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chaos@tccbbs.com (Chaos) wrote:

>>___REAL___ human rights activists in the United States are content
>>enough to expose the tyrannies inflicted upon the populace by the 
>>various branches of the United States government.  They don't have to
>>contrive elaborate lies and conspiracies to try to lend their lunatic
>>religious agendas credability.

>Agreed. Her paranoid rantings have gotten worse over the years. One of the more 
>hilarious ones was when she made a post about how a UPS delivery person was 
>really a government spy trying to bug her office. I guess the guy made a 
>delivery and asked if there was a bathroom he could use. Ms. Thompson's 
>paranoia kicked in and she blew the whole thing out of proportion on fidonet.

That's the bitch right there, yeps.  And don't forget the one about
the doughnut shop across the street where the feds were actually
running the place only to keep an eye on her and her fellow unsalted
nuts.

What's next?  The postal carriers will all be CIA operatives
eventually, no doubt.    Er, no, BATF agents carrying
buckets of mecury.  Yeah, that'll be the ticket.

Man, we have _real_ human rights violations in the United States.
We don't need right-wing lunatics _forcing_ the government to
tighten its fingers around American's freedoms to protect us all
>from  the likes of her and her unsalted nuts.  Real human rights
organizations strive to do good; she doesn't.  She knows it.

My guess is that if they manage to convince themselves they have big
and powerful enemies, they can play pretend they're important in the
scheme of things; their otherwise uncontrolable lives within which
circumstances grants them little control have an impact upon society 
-- in their own minds, of course.  It makes them think they're alive.

Someone told me that it would take three days to mop up these 
lunatics if they ever decide to wipe out the government.  Most of
those three days, he suggested, would be tracking the survivors down
and stomping them out one by one.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Thu Oct 10 09:58:09 PDT 1996
Article: 97516 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!nnrp.info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!uunet!news-in2.uu.net!news3.agis.net!agis!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 05:27:40 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <53i261$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net>
References:   <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net>  <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net>  <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net>   <539ag1$d87@newshub.atmnet.net> 
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Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:97516 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:391882 rec.aviation.military:47410

Ken Koller  wrote:

>> lindat@iquest.net (Dr. Linda Thompson) wrote:

"Doctor."  

>> Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
>> have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?
>> Or do you only have a lot of unfounded accusations and religious
>> claims?
>> 
>> Any evidnce you might have can be directed to:
>> 
>> 	frice@stbbs.com

>Heck, I'd like to see it posted to the entire 
>list myself. I'm not holding my breath though.

If breath holding would work, we could take turns and see if that
would get these guys and gals to fork it over.  This is the same 
bitch who demanded that federal officials used flamethrowers against
the Branch Davidians -- and her lunatic nuts took a satelite
downlink of a personal armored transport knocking holes in the
Davidian compound's walls, called it a tank, and then MANUFACTURED
a hoax by splicing and time-editing the video tape; a hoax which 
the voice-over claims shows a tank using a flame thrower.

The bitch sells it as "Waco: The Big Lie."

What the _rational_, _honest_ people over at Soldier of Fortune
Magazine found was the original satelite feed tapes which were
undoctored -- they either pulled in the feed themselves else just
got it from their regular news sources.

What the ___undoctored___ tape showed was the armored personnel
carrier pulling down a section of wall where a piece of ceiling
falls down.  The Thompson cult doctored their hoax to try to make
the gullible see flames and smoke.

Now long after Soldier of Fortune Magazine started selling their
own copies to prove that Thompson is a liar, her little band of
unsalted nuts are ___still___ selling their lie; they've even
manufactured _another_ hoax and have called it something like, "The
lie continues."

Well they got that right.

But then with these right-wing extremists it's anything for a buck.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From kmcvay@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca Thu Oct 10 13:33:08 PDT 1996
Article: 97623 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!not-for-mail
From: kmcvay@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: 10 Oct 1996 10:04:57 -0700
Organization: The Nizkor Project
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <53jabp$8f0@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>
References:  <539ag1$d87@newshub.atmnet.net>  <53i261$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: localhost.almanac.bc.ca
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:97623 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:392030 rec.aviation.military:47412

In article <53i261$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net>, 
frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice) wrote:

>The bitch sells it as "Waco: The Big Lie."

>Now long after Soldier of Fortune Magazine started selling their
>own copies to prove that Thompson is a liar, her little band of
>unsalted nuts are ___still___ selling their lie; they've even
>manufactured _another_ hoax and have called it something like, "The
>lie continues."

>Well they got that right.
>But then with these right-wing extremists it's anything for a buck.

Welcome to the real world :-)

If you have not yet sufficiently irritated Ms. Thompson, do
not despair... you can do so much more!

You can, for instance, post the ADL reports which mention her
name on the web - she doesn't like that. For instructions in
how to become a true member of the "Linda Doesn't Like Me
Club," see http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/t/thompson-linda/
- you'll be glad you did, and, in passing, you can learn that
Ms. Thompson seems to have difficulty grasping the concept of
time zones... and she's really very funny, once you get to
know her :-)

-- 
Nizkor Canada          | http://www.nizkor.org
-----------------------| Remember John Hron
                       |--------------------------------------
     http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/h/hron-john/


From keithw@bctv.com Fri Oct 11 09:43:53 PDT 1996
Article: 97890 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!nnrp.info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.kei.com!news.texas.net!news
From: keithw@bctv.com (Keith Wood)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 02:05:17 +0000
Organization: Brass Cannon Productions/TANSTAAFL
Lines: 26
Message-ID: 
References:  
 <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net> 
 <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net> 
 <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net> 
  <539ag1$d87@newshub.atmnet.net>
 
 <53i261$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net>
Reply-To: keithw@bctv.com
NNTP-Posting-Host: client90.sedona.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:97890 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:392426 rec.aviation.military:47415

In article <53i261$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net>,
frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice) wrote:

[If breath holding would work, we could take turns and see if that
[would get these guys and gals to fork it over.  This is the same 
[bitch who demanded that federal officials used flamethrowers against
[the Branch Davidians -- and her lunatic nuts took a satelite
[downlink of a personal armored transport knocking holes in the
[Davidian compound's walls, called it a tank, and then MANUFACTURED
[a hoax by splicing and time-editing the video tape; a hoax which 
[the voice-over claims shows a tank using a flame thrower.
[
[The bitch sells it as "Waco: The Big Lie."
[
[What the _rational_, _honest_ people over at Soldier of Fortune
[Magazine found was the original satelite feed tapes which were
[undoctored -- they either pulled in the feed themselves else just
[got it from their regular news sources.

Close, but no kewpie doll!

It wasn't SOF -- it was Mike McNulty of the Citizens' Organization 
for Public Safety who found the whole tape and did the initial 
analysis.  Jim Pate at SOF then made sure that the truth got out.




From dsale@users.southeast.net Fri Oct 11 13:04:41 PDT 1996
Article: 97990 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!hookup!lll-winken.llnl.gov!uwm.edu!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!in-news.erinet.com!bug.rahul.net!rahul.net!a2i!ns2.mainstreet.net!ns2.southeast.net!news
From: dsale@users.southeast.net (Dan Sale)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 03:15:10 GMT
Organization: CLASSIFIED
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <53lsav$bo9@ns2.southeast.net>
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>>> Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
>>> have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?

Washington Times, 6/6/96 reported that Black Helicopters performing
"Urban Warfare Training"  swept through Pittsburg in the middle of the
night and turned parts of the city into war zones. Reports from
witnesses said that the helicopters were lower than FAA regulations
would permit ; several  witnesses observed one demolishing a warehouse
; all in all, over 100 witnesses called in.




From frice@stbbs.com Sat Oct 12 12:13:55 PDT 1996
Article: 98210 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 04:45:48 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <53n8hl$41n@newshub.atmnet.net>
References:   <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net>  <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net>  <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net>   <539ag1$d87@newshub.atmnet.net>  <53i261$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net> 
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Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:98210 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:392896 rec.aviation.military:47418

keithw@bctv.com (Keith Wood) wrote:

>[What the _rational_, _honest_ people over at Soldier of Fortune
>[Magazine found was the original satelite feed tapes which were
>[undoctored -- they either pulled in the feed themselves else just
>[got it from their regular news sources.

>Close, but no kewpie doll!

Damn!  I really could have used that doll!   }:-}

>It wasn't SOF -- it was Mike McNulty of the Citizens' Organization 
>for Public Safety who found the whole tape and did the initial 
>analysis.  Jim Pate at SOF then made sure that the truth got out.

Thanks for the correction.  I'll make a note of it and update
my archives.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Sat Oct 12 12:13:56 PDT 1996
Article: 98214 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!news.inc.net!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 04:43:59 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 51
Message-ID: <53n8ec$40c@newshub.atmnet.net>
References:  <539ag1$d87@newshub.atmnet.net>  <53i261$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net> <53jabp$8f0@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.67.190.109
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kmcvay@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC) wrote:

>>Now long after Soldier of Fortune Magazine started selling their
>>own copies to prove that Thompson is a liar, her little band of
>>unsalted nuts are ___still___ selling their lie; they've even
>>manufactured _another_ hoax and have called it something like, "The
>>lie continues."

>> Well they got that right.  But then with these right-wing 
>> extremists it's anything for a buck.

>Welcome to the real world :-)

Thanks.  It's great to be back.   }:-}

>If you have not yet sufficiently irritated Ms. Thompson, do
>not despair... you can do so much more!

Well I'm sure I never intended to irritate the bitch; what's more
important is to expose these nuts for what they're realy about.

While governmental abuse is epidemic, her and people like her are
working to make it worse by forcing the government to defend both
themselves and _us_, the populace, from these unsalted nuts.

>You can, for instance, post the ADL reports which mention her
>name on the web - she doesn't like that. 

Oh?  I'll have to check to see if I have that report; I think I
would have remembered it if I had.  If not, I'll check for it
using DejaNews.  Thanks for the tip!

>For instructions in how to become a true member of the "Linda 
>Doesn't Like Me
>Club," see http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/t/thompson-linda/
>- you'll be glad you did, and, in passing, you can learn that
>Ms. Thompson seems to have difficulty grasping the concept of
>time zones... and she's really very funny, once you get to
>know her :-)

Will do!  Here...  I'll print your message and grab it when I
delink.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct 13 10:33:01 PDT 1996
Article: 98469 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!newsfeed.internetmci.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 22:00:54 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 26
Message-ID: <53p55h$se@newshub.atmnet.net>
References:   <52530j$i84_002@patriot.iquest.net>  <52eq3p$jol@ratty.wolfe.net>  <52i2cr$br2@ratty.wolfe.net>   <539ag1$d87@newshub.atmnet.net>  <53i261$g4e@newshub.atmnet.net> <53lsav$bo9@ns2.southeast.net>
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Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:98469 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:393173 rec.aviation.military:47420

dsale@users.southeast.net (Dan Sale) wrote:

>>>> Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
>>>> have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?

>Washington Times, 6/6/96 reported that Black Helicopters performing
>"Urban Warfare Training"  swept through Pittsburg in the middle of the
>night and turned parts of the city into war zones. Reports from
>witnesses said that the helicopters were lower than FAA regulations
>would permit ; several  witnesses observed one demolishing a warehouse
>; all in all, over 100 witnesses called in.

That's all very nice yet it didn't answer my question...  unless 
this warehouse had people in it at the time and that these alleged
"war zones" were acts against people, and not just training missions.

If anyone _does_ ever come up with any evidence, I would like a copy.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct 13 10:33:06 PDT 1996
Article: 98493 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news1.wtn.mci.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Linda "Militia March" Thompson  Was Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 22:02:03 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <53p57l$se@newshub.atmnet.net>
References:  <53ml0r$1cq@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.67.190.125
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rgates8254@aol.com (RGates8254) wrote:

>The same Linda "I am calling a militia march on DC where we are going to
>round up and execute all politicians who disagree with us" Thompson

>Why I just find all of this.......highly funny as usuall.  :)

It _is_ funny in a way; except that she and her unsalted nuts 
invite the government's restricting all of the population's personal
freedoms in direct response to her silly threats.

I wonder why she's not in jail.  She advocated the violent overthrow
of the government and solicited the murder of many of the populace.
That she was only pretending so she could wind-up some extremists to
start shooting and she could later deny complicity is besides the
point.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct 13 10:33:06 PDT 1996
Article: 98495 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news1.wtn.mci.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-pull.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-3.sprintlink.net!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: OKLAHOMA CITY and REALITY
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 22:01:59 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
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References: 
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lpease@netcom.com (Lisa Pease) wrote:

Why it's "Doctor" Linda Thompson, I suspect!

> INQUIRY: What about ATF / FBI foreknowledge of the bombing ?

What exactly are you accusing the BATF and FBI of, "Lisa?"  And do
you care to give us any names to match your unfounded allegations?

And why no mention of the buckets of mecury you and your fellow
unsalted nuts demanded were planted in the stair wells of the
building?

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From TZAC@foto.infi.net Sun Oct 13 10:33:26 PDT 1996
Article: 98589 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.infi.net!usenet
From: Leigh 
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 23:33:14 -0400
Organization: InfiNet
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Dr. Linda Thompson wrote:
> 


By the way, Dr. Thompson, who WAS on the grassy knoll?


From dkuehne@erols.com Sun Oct 13 13:35:56 PDT 1996
Article: 325614 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news
From: Dave Kuehne 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns
Subject: IN THEIR OWN WORDS AND DEEDS
Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 16:57:52 -0700
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Visit the Waco Holocaust Electronic Museum.

http://www.public-action.com/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum
http://206.55.8.10/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum

This is the be-all, end-all to any question whether the government
employees and mercenaries involved in Waco were just hapless
incompetents who were negligent, or just "messed up," or are liars and
murderers.

If murder indictments do not result from the evidence examined and put
forth to the public on these pages, then God have mercy on those whose
responsibility it is to do justice in this country.

                IN THEIR OWN WORDS AND DEEDS

The work and research done, largely by Carol Valentine, exposes what
was (until now) entirely ignored and vital aspects of the evidence
surrounding Waco.  Ms. Valentine has made her examination in
painstaking detail, from the government's own evidence.  It is
irrefutable.
                               
Most especially, Ms. Valentine's examination of the condition of the
bodies, analysis and cross-referencing of the autopsy reports is
absolutely devastating in its attention to detail and what is revealed
by those details.  Just a couple of the hundreds of the points of Ms.
Valentine's analysis of the government's reports reveal:

    -- Judy Schneider's body was completely missing its head, but
       Rodney Crowe performed a "dental exam."

    -- A "dental exam" was supposedly performed on a (toothless) fetus

    -- A "dental exam" was done on a lock of ponytail

FBI transcripts, testimony -- it's all there. See the photos of the
bodies and the autopsy reports, and a lot more.  See it for yourself.

PLEASE SPREAD THE WORD. REPLICATE THIS INFORMATION EVERYWHERE
BEFORE IT IS DESTROYED.   Please inundate your local news media with
this information and DARE them to look and tell the truth, for once.

Review:  I have not personally seen a better examination of the
evidence from Waco, anywhere, ever. -- Linda Thompson

*   AND  * From Parents Against Corruption and Coverup:

"Carol Valentine's Electronic Museum is a spellbinding collection of
fact and artifact documenting   mass murder and destruction of
evidence. This work underscores the depth of the human tragedy at WACO
and the absurdity of the U S  government's efforts to justify this
incident."
--Beth George (Parents Against Corruption and Coverup)

"The Waco Holocaust Electronic Museum is careful research carefully
preserved for other serious researchers. Carol Valentine has done us
all a favor by collecting this information and making it accessible in
a well-organized, logical format."
--Tom Burkett (Parents Against Corruption and Coverup) 
http://www.clark.net/pub/tburkett/pacc/PACC.html

Thank you for helping . . .



From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct 13 19:29:59 PDT 1996
Article: 46450 of alt.politics.white-power
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From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.white-power,alt.skinheads
Subject: Re: The Cowardly Tom Metzger
Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 01:38:53 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <53s6ba$ar8@newshub.atmnet.net>
References: <325A63E6.7611@rio.com> <53mvhb$pfn@crl3.crl.com> <53on04$a84@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>
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kmcvay@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC) wrote:

>In response to the 1992 Los Angeles riots, Metzger also used the
>telephone hotline to express a perverse solidarity with the looters:
>"The courts and the police along with our keepers in Washington are
>corrupt to the core...Any attack on that system that weakens Big
>Brother is fine with white separatists...Too bad they didn't take
>out City Hall and the Federal Building."

Interesting.  Since it was blacks burning down shops and businesses
owned by blacks, these racists don't mind whatsoever.

Actually I find myself in some agreement with some of the
sentiments expressed in this bigot's sentence.  I am damn glad
that the blacks who rioted only destroyed buildings in their
own community.  Had it gone further then there would have been
a great many excuses to escalate the fighting.

And I think it would have been an interesting turn of events had
the governmental buildings been taken and occupied.  Then, perhaps,
the civil authorities would have had a target to rally against
rather than having to set up security parimiters and trying to
hold them against several weak fronts.

>* The League was responsible for introducing another key item of
>evidence which demonstrated Metzger's advocacy of violence - a
>photograph of Metzger with an AK-47, instructing a group of racist
>skinheads in the desert.

And yet Linda Thompson is still out walking freely among us.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct 13 19:31:59 PDT 1996
Article: 98948 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!hookup!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!ddsw1!news.mcs.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in3.uu.net!news3.agis.net!agis!atmnet.net!usenet
From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Mcdonalds & the Satanic Church of California
Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 01:36:57 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 25
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leftcoast@pacificcoast.net (Mike Aukslong) wrote:

>   Little known fact that Mcdonalds is actually owned by the Satanic Church of 
>California. Those Employee of the month pictures you see in their temples are 
>actually photo's of the last people that they offed.

  You sound like "Doctor" Linda Thompson!  

Actually I think only about 85% of the owners/operators of 
McDonnalds could be considered Christian Satanists.

>Ronald is the anti christ sent to walk amongs us he was also the other shooter 
>on the grassy nole . Turn those golden arches up side down and you've got one 
>evil looking pitch fork,  think about it.         

I'm convinced.   How do we arm ourselves?

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Sun Oct 13 19:32:02 PDT 1996
Article: 98958 of alt.conspiracy
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From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Linda "Militia March" Thompson Was Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 01:38:22 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <53s6ab$ar8@newshub.atmnet.net>
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haji@u.washington.edu (H. McDaniel) wrote:

>>I wonder why she's not in jail.

>Because there are 2 million other Linda Thompsons out there.  To be
>sure not all believe exactly what she does.  But the point is that
>you cannot simply arrest people for disagreeing with the government
>or calling for certain action. 

I had thought that calling for the violent overthrow of the
Constitution or the government was not covered by freedom of
speech and that it constituted a crime of treason.

Perhaps that's changed and is an outdated interpretation of
the law.

>Per the constitution treason requires one to comit an overt 
>act.  Per precidint this includes inciting someone else to 
>do the overt act.

If that were the case then the Baptist preacher which taught
the Oklahoma City bomber how to blow up buildings should be
arrested as well. 

>Now if someone had actually gone to Washington and *done* 
>something because they followed her.  That would be a 
>different story.

I wonder if her mock "recall" of her order to start shooting
government officials would grant her enough plausable deniability
to enable her and her cult to escape prosecution.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From frice@stbbs.com Mon Oct 14 09:59:43 PDT 1996
Article: 98984 of alt.conspiracy
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From: frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: !!----->  BLACK HELICOPTER FAQ   <------!!
Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 01:38:19 GMT
Organization: The Skeptic Tank
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Leigh  wrote:

>Dr. Linda Thompson wrote:
>> 

>By the way, Dr. Thompson, who WAS on the grassy knoll?

It was O. J. Simpson.  Er, no, it was Rush Limbaugh.  No, wait
a minute, it was Drew Barrymore.

---------------------------------
"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
---------------------------------
The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)




From steven@csnsys.com Mon Oct 14 10:00:18 PDT 1996
Article: 99134 of alt.conspiracy
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From: steven@csnsys.com (Steven Casas)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Linda "Militia March" Thompson  Was Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Sun, 13 Oct 96 21:49:23 GMT
Organization: The Silent Majority
Lines: 32
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>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>-------------------------------------------------------
>Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of
>chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God!  I know not what course other
>may take but as for me; give me liberty or give me death!
>                 ------Patrick Henry
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>-------------------------------------------------------
>

Let's see.. Patrick Henry would rather Die than be enslaved. Linda Thompson 
would rather die than be enslaved. So you attack Linda then quote Henry!??!!!

Two-thirds of the colonists at the time of the Revolution did'nt want any shit 
getting stirred up because they thought everything wouuld just be OK, somehow. 
They were called" Tories". The Patriots, like Linda, are the ones who, in 
blatant disregard for their own lives in favor of the lives of their children, 
stood up and *DID* something about it!

So keep your tory-comments where they belong...in AOL

************************************************************
**  Steve Casas        Carpenter          Gun Owner       **
**                     Singer             Songwriter      **
**  No man gave us     Guitar Player      Catholic        **
**  our FREEDOM and    Deadhead           Conservative    **
**  *dammit*, no man   Ex-Serviceman      Avid Reader     **
**  is gonna take      Electronics Technician             **
**  it away!!!!!!!                                        **
**                         steven@csnsys.com              **
************************************************************


From eus.eusrogm@memousa.ericsson.se Mon Oct 14 10:00:34 PDT 1996
Article: 99208 of alt.conspiracy
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From: Survivor 
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Linda "Militia March" Thompson Was Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 08:37:28 -0700
Organization: Incorporeal
Lines: 25
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H. McDaniel wrote:
> 
> frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice) writes:
> 
> >rgates8254@aol.com (RGates8254) wrote:
> 
> >>The same Linda "I am calling a militia march on DC where we are going to
> >>round up and execute all politicians who disagree with us" Thompson
> 
> >>Why I just find all of this.......highly funny as usuall.  :)
> 
> >It _is_ funny in a way; except that she and her unsalted nuts
> >invite the government's restricting all of the population's personal
> >freedoms in direct response to her silly threats.
> 
> >I wonder why she's not in jail.
> 
> Because there are 2 million other Linda Thompsons out there.  To be
> sure not all believe exactly what she does.  But the point is that
> you cannot simply arrest people for disagreeing with the government
> or calling for certain action. 

Tell that to the lady in Chicago who shouted an oath at the president 
and was detained (arrested?). Or the other man in Chicago(?) some years 
ago who simply asked the president a question he did not want to answer.


From haji@u.washington.edu Tue Oct 15 08:53:29 PDT 1996
Article: 99676 of alt.conspiracy
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From: haji@u.washington.edu (H. McDaniel)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Linda "Militia March" Thompson Was Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: 13 Oct 1996 07:16:41 GMT
Organization: University of Washington
Lines: 26
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NNTP-Posting-User: haji

frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice) writes:

>rgates8254@aol.com (RGates8254) wrote:

>>The same Linda "I am calling a militia march on DC where we are going to
>>round up and execute all politicians who disagree with us" Thompson

>>Why I just find all of this.......highly funny as usuall.  :)

>It _is_ funny in a way; except that she and her unsalted nuts 
>invite the government's restricting all of the population's personal
>freedoms in direct response to her silly threats.

>I wonder why she's not in jail.

Because there are 2 million other Linda Thompsons out there.  To be
sure not all believe exactly what she does.  But the point is that
you cannot simply arrest people for disagreeing with the government
or calling for certain action.  Per the constitution treason requires
one to comit an overt act.  Per precidint this includes inciting someone
else to do the overt act.

Now if someone had actually gone to Washington and *done* something
because they followed her.  That would be a different story.

-McDaniel


From danielk@erols.com Tue Oct 15 10:46:23 PDT 1996
Article: 38722 of misc.activism.militia
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Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 96 20:18:05 GMT
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Subject: Patriot's Disease
Lines: 261


Many psychologists consider fear of government to be some sort of
mental illness.  The following is a piece of scientific
literature that I uncovered on this subject.
-----------------------------------------------------------------


          A CLINICAL ANALYSIS OF ANTI-GOVERNMENT PHOBIA
 
                      Ivor E. Tower, M.D.     
                 Journal of Clinical Psychiatry
                 Volume 11, series 3, pages 4-5
 

                            ABSTRACT

     This paper conclusively demonstrates that unfounded fear of
government is a recognizable mental illness, closely related to
paranoid schizophrenia.  Anti-Government Phobia (AGP) differs from
most mental illnesses, however, in that it is highly infectious and
has an acute onset.  Symptoms include extreme suspiciousness,
conspiracy-mongering, delusional thought patterns, staunch "us
against them" mentality, withdrawal from reality, and often
religious fanaticism.
     Having the patient committed to a qualified mental health
institution is the best option for family and loved ones.  For this
reason, all psychologists and family physicians need to be provided
with educational materials, to help them recognize the various
symptoms and warning signs accompanying onset.  Once the illness is
correctly diagnosed, they next should notify the patient's
immediate family members and discuss the various treament options
with them.  Since comparitively little is known about
Anti-Government Phobia at the present time, a government-funded
health commission should be set up to oversee, and help focus,
future research. 


                     INCIDENCE AND ETIOLOGY

     Anti-Government Phobia has a worldwide distribution,
but has a particularly high incidence in the United States. 
Infection rates are estimated by mental health officials to be
about 5% of the general population, and this rate is growing at
an alarming rate.  Rates are highest, but not limited to, those
who are disaffected in some fashion, especially those who have a
strong personal grudge against the federal government for one
reason or another.    
     Although certain varients of the illness have been around for
many years, it is only in the last decade or so that the more
virulent and infectious strains have appeared.  This is most likely
due to the rapid buildup of government, at all levels, during the
1980's.  Closely paralling this trend was an explosion in the
number of cases in which individuals were diagnosed as having
unfounded fears concerning such.


              CLINICAL MANIFESTATIONS AND DIAGNOSIS
 
     Anti-Government Phobia is marked by extreme suspiciousness
toward government.  Onset is acute.  Symptoms start almost
immediately after a run-in with some agency or institution of the
government, or when the patient is introduced to anti-government
propaganda, in one form or another, by a self-styled "patriot." 
Common ways in which this harmful, anti-government propaganda is
spread include: books, pamphlets, magazines, newspapers,
audiotapes, videotapes, shortwave and conventional radio
programs, computer bulletin boards, and various Internet sites. 
     Upon exposure to "patriotic" propaganda, the patient
mysteriously begins to imagine hidden links between unrelated
current events, weaving these gross distortions of reality into a
complex delusional web; a labyrinth of conspiracy theories with
all imagined clues leading straight to the federal government. 
With further exposure, the patient becomes increasingly paranoid,
and slowly withdrawals from reality.  However, mental
deterioration is usually so gradual that the patient is often
unaware of it.  
     The illness progresses until the patient eventually assumes
a staunch "us against them" mentality.  For instance, in the
patient's warped mind-set, each new piece of gun-control
legislation is rationalized to be one more step in an ultimate
plot by the federal government to confiscate guns altogether.  In
severe cases, the patient assumes a survivalist mentality,
stocking up on de-hydrated food, guns, ammunition, and other
"essentials." 
     As the illness continues to progress, the patient
experiences increased delusional thinking.  For instance, he may
start believing that the Federal Reserve is not part of the
federal government, but is instead controlled by wealthy
Zionists.  Other delusions may involve the United Nations, "black
helicopters," concentration camps, or the Council on Foreign
Relations (CFR).  Delusions involving "takeovers" by foreign
military troops, or federal government agents, are also common.   

-----------------------------------------------------------------


                       YOUR ADDITIONS HERE


-----------------------------------------------------------------

     Anti-Government Phobia is often associated with religious
fanaticism.  An excellent example of this is the infamous Branch
Davidian case, in which many cult members preferred a fiery
suicide over peaceful surrender to the forces of "Babylon." 
There have been other cases in which "patriots" have became
involved with terrorist activity, fallaciously thinking they
were doing the "will of God."  More commonly, "patriots" have
been involved in aggressive outbursts in courtrooms, and in other
public places such as town-hall meetings.
     Overall, the worldview eventually adopted by "patriots"
interprets modern-day events in terms of pieces of a large jig-saw
puzzle.  Oddly, they believe that it is their solemn duty to put
these unrelated pieces together in order to discover the underlying
"big picture."  The warped interpretive framework used by most
"patriots" in their missionary-like endeavor of saving the lost
"sheeple" (derogatory term comparing non-patriots to lost sheep) is
a hyper-literal interpretation of Old and New Testament prophecies,
particularly the book of Revelation.  The sad truth is that the
"patriots" are actually doing the scriptures a great disservice by
maintaining such a narrow-minded interpretation.  


                      SPREAD OF THE ILLNESS

     In the eyes of the so-called "patriots," the relentless
attempt to indoctrinate others with extremist beliefs is seen as
a righteous and compulsory act to save their "self-destructing"
nation.  Wildly fantasizing that America can somehow turn back
the clock to better times, which in reality never existed,
"patriots" often quote constantly from the Founding Fathers,
Declaration of Independence, United States Constitution, and Bill
of Rights.  Ironically (and tragically), when "patriots" expose
others to their anti-government propaganda, in the name of
liberty, they are actually infecting them with an extremely
contagious mental illness.
     A strong analogy can be drawn between "patriotic"
indoctrination and patterns of religious conversion.  In both
cases, ultra-idealistic individuals believe that it is their solemn
duty to make "conversions" to their particular faith.  This is
usually done on a person-to-person basis with a friend or
acquaintance.  To keep new converts from going astray or
"backsliding," they are eagerly provided with a steady stream of
propaganda.  In each case, the devotee imagines that there is an
evil, sinister force which must be opposed at all costs.  In the
case of various religions, the faithful are supposedly rewarded for
sparring with the "devil."  In the case of the "patriot," the so-
called "New World Order" is viewed as the demonic bogeyman, with
the reward for opposing it supposedly being an increased amount of
"personal freedom".  In both "patriotic" and religious circles,
there is an entire counter-culture of anthems, creeds, holy books,
preachers, prophets, and propagandists of all colors and strains.


                           PREVENTION

     Needless to say, prevention is the first line of defense
against any type of illness or disease.  Unfortunately, most mental
illnesses are genetic and can not prevented.  However, it is
fortunate indeed that Anti-Government Phobia is non-genetic, and
thus, wholly preventable.  On an individual basis, the most
effective prevention policy is obviously not to allow oneself to
become indoctrinated by a self-styled "patriot," preferably by
staying as far as possible away from their divisive propaganda.  As
an added precaution, one should rely exclusively on well-known and
reputable sources for news and other information.  Family members
and loved ones can help in this effort.
     However, it should be noted that prevention programs work best
only when the entire community is involved.  We all need to
practice constant vigilance in order to spot diviseness and hate in
our communities.  In this regard, networking is the key to success.

A successful community-based empowerment program would include the
following elements: citizen networks, parent-teacher networks,
police-citizen networks, pastor-parisoner networks, doctor-family
member networks, state-local authority networks, federal-state
authority networks.          


                     TREATMENT AND PROGNOSIS

     Although the prognosis is fairly good if the illness is
treated soon after symptoms first appear, studies have shown that
a disturbingly low percentage of patients allow themselves to be
treated.  Thus, having the patient committed to a qualified mental
health institution is the best option for family and loved ones. 
For this reason, all psychologists and family physicians need to be
provided with educational materials, to help them recognize the
various symptoms and warning signs (outlined above) which accompany
onset.  Once the illness is correctly diagnosed, they next should
notify the patient's immediate family members and discuss the
various treament options with them.  This effort should be
reinforced with extensive public ad campaigns promoting a 1-800
help line.  Since comparitively little is known about
Anti-Government Phobia at the present time, a government-funded
health commission should be set up to oversee, and help focus,
future research.
     It can not be over-emphasized that prevention is the key to
stopping the spread of Anti-Government Phobia.  Once a person is
infected, the illness is generally incurable.  The only proven
treatment is an extended, and often risky, "de-programming" session
conducted by qualified professionals, such as the Cult Awareness
Network (CAN).  Left untreated, chronic symptoms invariably persist
throughout the entire lifetime of the patient.  Sadly, even the
patients themselves realize this horrifying fact, and,
surprisingly, seem apathetic to it.  Oddly, they often confuse
their symptoms with being "awake."  For instance, they have been
known to garble gibberish such as "once your awake, you can't go
back to sleep."  Further research is presently being conducted on
the reasons why they rationalize their mental illness in this
highly unusual manner.



                         ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS

     The writer wishes to thank the following individuals and
organizations for contributing to this report: Morris Dees of the
Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC), Rick Ross of the Cult
Awareness Network (CAN), Bo Gritz of Mormons Against Wild
Conspiracies Theories (MAWCT), the U.S. Justice Department (USJD),
the Federal Bureau of Investigations (FBI), and the Bureau of
Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (BATF).  This study was funded by a
grant from the National Institutes of Health (NIH). 



                           REFERENCES

Dees, Morris.  1975.  A treatise on far-right extremism.  Journal
of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 5:12:7-24.  

Dees, Morris.  1977.  Disillusioned dissidents and paranoid
patriots.  Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 7:21:5-19. 

Dees, Morris.  1978.  Debunking the black helicopter myth. 
Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 8:16:21-37.  

Dees, Morris.  1982.  Citizen militias: the rise of neo-Nazism in
America.  Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 11:32:6-17. 

Dees, Morris.  1986.  In defense of Zionism.  Journal of the
Southern Poverty Law Center, 16:18:4-13.  

Dees, Morris.  1987.  The demise of Christianity in America. 
Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 17:26:16-27.  

Dees, Morris.  1993.  Waco the Big Lie: more patriotic propaganda
>from  the queen of hate.  Journal of the Southern Poverty Law
Center, 26:14:24-36.  

Dees, Morris.  1995.  AEN: an underground Mecca of anti-government
hate.  Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 28:13:19-37.  

Gritz, Bo.  1994.  Linda Thompson is an evil witch.  The Mormon
Times, June 18, p. 3A.

Ross, Rick.  1987.  De-programming made simple, easy, and fun. 
The Journal of the Anti-Defamation League, 8:17:45-49.  




From goryder@teleport.com Tue Oct 15 18:05:30 PDT 1996
Article: 485161 of talk.politics.misc
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From: goryder@teleport.com (1-800-Go-Ryder)
Newsgroups: or.politics,pdx.general,talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian
Subject: Anti-Gobbermint Disease:  Identified!
Date: Tue, 15 Oct 96 13:45:59 GMT
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|Many psychologists consider fear of government to be some sort of
|mental illness.  The following is a piece of scientific
|literature that I uncovered on this subject.
|-----------------------------------------------------------------
|
|
|          A CLINICAL ANALYSIS OF ANTI-GOVERNMENT PHOBIA
| 
|                      Ivor E. Tower, M.D.     
|                 Journal of Clinical Psychiatry
|                 Volume 11, series 3, pages 4-5
| 
|
|                            ABSTRACT
|
|     This paper conclusively demonstrates that unfounded fear of
|government is a recognizable mental illness, closely related to
|paranoid schizophrenia.  Anti-Government Phobia (AGP) differs from
|most mental illnesses, however, in that it is highly infectious and
|has an acute onset.  Symptoms include extreme suspiciousness,
|conspiracy-mongering, delusional thought patterns, staunch "us
|against them" mentality, withdrawal from reality, and often
|religious fanaticism.
|     Having the patient committed to a qualified mental health
|institution is the best option for family and loved ones.  For this
|reason, all psychologists and family physicians need to be provided
|with educational materials, to help them recognize the various
|symptoms and warning signs accompanying onset.  Once the illness is
|correctly diagnosed, they next should notify the patient's
|immediate family members and discuss the various treament options
|with them.  Since comparitively little is known about
|Anti-Government Phobia at the present time, a government-funded
|health commission should be set up to oversee, and help focus,
|future research. 
|
|
|                     INCIDENCE AND ETIOLOGY
|
|     Anti-Government Phobia has a worldwide distribution,
|but has a particularly high incidence in the United States. 
|Infection rates are estimated by mental health officials to be
|about 5% of the general population, and this rate is growing at
|an alarming rate.  Rates are highest, but not limited to, those
|who are disaffected in some fashion, especially those who have a
|strong personal grudge against the federal government for one
|reason or another.    
|     Although certain varients of the illness have been around for
|many years, it is only in the last decade or so that the more
|virulent and infectious strains have appeared.  This is most likely
|due to the rapid buildup of government, at all levels, during the
|1980's.  Closely paralling this trend was an explosion in the
|number of cases in which individuals were diagnosed as having
|unfounded fears concerning such.
|
|
|              CLINICAL MANIFESTATIONS AND DIAGNOSIS
| 
|     Anti-Government Phobia is marked by extreme suspiciousness
|toward government.  Onset is acute.  Symptoms start almost
|immediately after a run-in with some agency or institution of the
|government, or when the patient is introduced to anti-government
|propaganda, in one form or another, by a self-styled "patriot." 
|Common ways in which this harmful, anti-government propaganda is
|spread include: books, pamphlets, magazines, newspapers,
|audiotapes, videotapes, shortwave and conventional radio
|programs, computer bulletin boards, and various Internet sites. 
|     Upon exposure to "patriotic" propaganda, the patient
|mysteriously begins to imagine hidden links between unrelated
|current events, weaving these gross distortions of reality into a
|complex delusional web; a labyrinth of conspiracy theories with
|all imagined clues leading straight to the federal government. 
|With further exposure, the patient becomes increasingly paranoid,
|and slowly withdrawals from reality.  However, mental
|deterioration is usually so gradual that the patient is often
|unaware of it.  
|     The illness progresses until the patient eventually assumes
|a staunch "us against them" mentality.  For instance, in the
|patient's warped mind-set, each new piece of gun-control
|legislation is rationalized to be one more step in an ultimate
|plot by the federal government to confiscate guns altogether.  In
|severe cases, the patient assumes a survivalist mentality,
|stocking up on de-hydrated food, guns, ammunition, and other
|"essentials." 
|     As the illness continues to progress, the patient
|experiences increased delusional thinking.  For instance, he may
|start believing that the Federal Reserve is not part of the
|federal government, but is instead controlled by wealthy
|Zionists.  Other delusions may involve the United Nations, "black
|helicopters," concentration camps, or the Council on Foreign
|Relations (CFR).  Delusions involving "takeovers" by foreign
|military troops, or federal government agents, are also common.   
|
|-----------------------------------------------------------------
|
|
|                       YOUR ADDITIONS HERE
|
|
|-----------------------------------------------------------------
|
|     Anti-Government Phobia is often associated with religious
|fanaticism.  An excellent example of this is the infamous Branch
|Davidian case, in which many cult members preferred a fiery
|suicide over peaceful surrender to the forces of "Babylon." 
|There have been other cases in which "patriots" have became
|involved with terrorist activity, fallaciously thinking they
|were doing the "will of God."  More commonly, "patriots" have
|been involved in aggressive outbursts in courtrooms, and in other
|public places such as town-hall meetings.
|     Overall, the worldview eventually adopted by "patriots"
|interprets modern-day events in terms of pieces of a large jig-saw
|puzzle.  Oddly, they believe that it is their solemn duty to put
|these unrelated pieces together in order to discover the underlying
|"big picture."  The warped interpretive framework used by most
|"patriots" in their missionary-like endeavor of saving the lost
|"sheeple" (derogatory term comparing non-patriots to lost sheep) is
|a hyper-literal interpretation of Old and New Testament prophecies,
|particularly the book of Revelation.  The sad truth is that the
|"patriots" are actually doing the scriptures a great disservice by
|maintaining such a narrow-minded interpretation.  
|
|
|                      SPREAD OF THE ILLNESS
|
|     In the eyes of the so-called "patriots," the relentless
|attempt to indoctrinate others with extremist beliefs is seen as
|a righteous and compulsory act to save their "self-destructing"
|nation.  Wildly fantasizing that America can somehow turn back
|the clock to better times, which in reality never existed,
|"patriots" often quote constantly from the Founding Fathers,
|Declaration of Independence, United States Constitution, and Bill
|of Rights.  Ironically (and tragically), when "patriots" expose
|others to their anti-government propaganda, in the name of
|liberty, they are actually infecting them with an extremely
|contagious mental illness.
|     A strong analogy can be drawn between "patriotic"
|indoctrination and patterns of religious conversion.  In both
|cases, ultra-idealistic individuals believe that it is their solemn
|duty to make "conversions" to their particular faith.  This is
|usually done on a person-to-person basis with a friend or
|acquaintance.  To keep new converts from going astray or
|"backsliding," they are eagerly provided with a steady stream of
|propaganda.  In each case, the devotee imagines that there is an
|evil, sinister force which must be opposed at all costs.  In the
|case of various religions, the faithful are supposedly rewarded for
|sparring with the "devil."  In the case of the "patriot," the so-
|called "New World Order" is viewed as the demonic bogeyman, with
|the reward for opposing it supposedly being an increased amount of
|"personal freedom".  In both "patriotic" and religious circles,
|there is an entire counter-culture of anthems, creeds, holy books,
|preachers, prophets, and propagandists of all colors and strains.
|
|
|                           PREVENTION
|
|     Needless to say, prevention is the first line of defense
|against any type of illness or disease.  Unfortunately, most mental
|illnesses are genetic and can not prevented.  However, it is
|fortunate indeed that Anti-Government Phobia is non-genetic, and
|thus, wholly preventable.  On an individual basis, the most
|effective prevention policy is obviously not to allow oneself to
|become indoctrinated by a self-styled "patriot," preferably by
|staying as far as possible away from their divisive propaganda.  As
|an added precaution, one should rely exclusively on well-known and
|reputable sources for news and other information.  Family members
|and loved ones can help in this effort.
|     However, it should be noted that prevention programs work best
|only when the entire community is involved.  We all need to
|practice constant vigilance in order to spot diviseness and hate in
|our communities.  In this regard, networking is the key to success.
|
|A successful community-based empowerment program would include the
|following elements: citizen networks, parent-teacher networks,
|police-citizen networks, pastor-parisoner networks, doctor-family
|member networks, state-local authority networks, federal-state
|authority networks.          
|
|
|                     TREATMENT AND PROGNOSIS
|
|     Although the prognosis is fairly good if the illness is
|treated soon after symptoms first appear, studies have shown that
|a disturbingly low percentage of patients allow themselves to be
|treated.  Thus, having the patient committed to a qualified mental
|health institution is the best option for family and loved ones. 
|For this reason, all psychologists and family physicians need to be
|provided with educational materials, to help them recognize the
|various symptoms and warning signs (outlined above) which accompany
|onset.  Once the illness is correctly diagnosed, they next should
|notify the patient's immediate family members and discuss the
|various treament options with them.  This effort should be
|reinforced with extensive public ad campaigns promoting a 1-800
|help line.  Since comparitively little is known about
|Anti-Government Phobia at the present time, a government-funded
|health commission should be set up to oversee, and help focus,
|future research.
|     It can not be over-emphasized that prevention is the key to
|stopping the spread of Anti-Government Phobia.  Once a person is
|infected, the illness is generally incurable.  The only proven
|treatment is an extended, and often risky, "de-programming" session
|conducted by qualified professionals, such as the Cult Awareness
|Network (CAN).  Left untreated, chronic symptoms invariably persist
|throughout the entire lifetime of the patient.  Sadly, even the
|patients themselves realize this horrifying fact, and,
|surprisingly, seem apathetic to it.  Oddly, they often confuse
|their symptoms with being "awake."  For instance, they have been
|known to garble gibberish such as "once your awake, you can't go
|back to sleep."  Further research is presently being conducted on
|the reasons why they rationalize their mental illness in this
|highly unusual manner.
|
|
|
|                         ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS
|
|     The writer wishes to thank the following individuals and
|organizations for contributing to this report: Morris Dees of the
|Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC), Rick Ross of the Cult
|Awareness Network (CAN), Bo Gritz of Mormons Against Wild
|Conspiracies Theories (MAWCT), the U.S. Justice Department (USJD),
|the Federal Bureau of Investigations (FBI), and the Bureau of
|Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (BATF).  This study was funded by a
|grant from the National Institutes of Health (NIH). 
|
|
|
|                           REFERENCES
|
|Dees, Morris.  1975.  A treatise on far-right extremism.  Journal
|of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 5:12:7-24.  
|
|Dees, Morris.  1977.  Disillusioned dissidents and paranoid
|patriots.  Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 7:21:5-19. 
|
|Dees, Morris.  1978.  Debunking the black helicopter myth. 
|Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 8:16:21-37.  
|
|Dees, Morris.  1982.  Citizen militias: the rise of neo-Nazism in
|America.  Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 11:32:6-17. 
|
|Dees, Morris.  1986.  In defense of Zionism.  Journal of the
|Southern Poverty Law Center, 16:18:4-13.  
|
|Dees, Morris.  1987.  The demise of Christianity in America. 
|Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 17:26:16-27.  
|
|Dees, Morris.  1993.  Waco the Big Lie: more patriotic propaganda
|from the queen of hate.  Journal of the Southern Poverty Law
|Center, 26:14:24-36.  
|
|Dees, Morris.  1995.  AEN: an underground Mecca of anti-government
|hate.  Journal of the Southern Poverty Law Center, 28:13:19-37.  
|
|Gritz, Bo.  1994.  Linda Thompson is an evil witch.  The Mormon
|Times, June 18, p. 3A.
|
|Ross, Rick.  1987.  De-programming made simple, easy, and fun. 
|The Journal of the Anti-Defamation League, 8:17:45-49.  
|


Are you free?

Do you own your body?  Can you prostitute yourself, sell your organs, or medicate yourself?  Do you own your labor?  Can you work for any wage you want, whatever hours you want, and keep the fruits of your sweat?  Do you own your possessions?  Can the terms of your property ownership be changed at any time, or for any reason?  Can your property be taxed without limitation?  Can you travel freely?  Must you carry identification papers for you and your property, submit to search without warrant, cause, or
 recourse?

There is a spectrum upon which lie two endpoints.  One point is slavery, and at the other end:  FREEDOM.


From apeman@hhs.net Wed Oct 16 00:51:47 PDT 1996
Article: 99992 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!portc01.blue.aol.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!uunet!news-in2.uu.net!news-in.iadfw.net!usenet
From: Steve Berlinsky 
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 01:30:53 -0400
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Dan Sale wrote:
> 
> >>> Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
> >>> have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?
> 
> Washington Times, 6/6/96 reported that Black Helicopters performing
> "Urban Warfare Training"  swept through Pittsburg in the middle of the
> night and turned parts of the city into war zones. Reports from
> witnesses said that the helicopters were lower than FAA regulations
> would permit ; several  witnesses observed one demolishing a warehouse
> ; all in all, over 100 witnesses called in.

All very well. You seem to have left out the part about the EXCERCISE
being cancelled due to the citizens of Pittsburgh complaining to their
councilmen (who knew in advance of the excercise but were asked to keep
silent on the matter to keep crowds from gathering at excercise sites.)
The "demolished" warehouse was in fact a former brewery (that's been
closed for some years). With the owners prior permission, Delta Force
practiced entering a locked building (by blowing the locks - with
firefighters and police watching by the way). As for FAA regulations,
why didn't the dumbass Washington Times reporter go look them up...hell,
why don't you for that matter. Helicopters - even black ones - are
allowed to fly pretty close to the ground. I suggest you order back
copies of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette for the week in question to give
you grasp of the facts.

Steve


From mikel360@ols.net Wed Oct 16 00:59:53 PDT 1996
Article: 327123 of talk.politics.guns
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From: Mike Lamb 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,misc.legal,misc.survivalism
Subject: Re: FBI Looking to Militias--Please Read!
Date: 16 Oct 1996 04:23:32 GMT
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                                       PLEASE READ THIS

Subj:	USA! SWAT PAINTBALL TERROR
Date:	95-08-30 20:06:05 EDT

                       Paintball Terrorists

Being one of the so-called idiots who was on the bus which was
stopped for hijacking and trasporting automatic firearms I will now
set the record straight-- First off, My team from ABC PAINTBALL SUPPLY,
the guys from Carter Machine, and a few guys from Combat Simulations in
Hawaii set out on a two week tour of Canada in which we were to hit
stock-class tournaments in Saskatoon and Edmonton.  We left LA on
Wednesday afternoon en route to Las Vegas for a night of gambling.

1-1/2 hours later 3 tires on our bus were blown out by SWAT team members
using a chain with spikes which was tossed across the hiway.  Our bus
subsequently pulled over to the shoulder and was immediately surrounded
by SWAT team members with automatic MP-5's and snipers perched atop the
surrounding hills with .308 rifles.  We were taken off of the bus,
handcuffed, and forced to sit on the hot pavement (temperature at
the time was ~115 degrees) while agents and dogs searched the bus for over
6 hours!  Until the very end, no one would tell us why we were stopped.
Later we learned that they had received a tip that we were illegally
transporting 600 automatic weapons!  The papers reported that the police
had seen us waving guns around inside the bus and that they thought we
were hi-jackers!

BULLSH*T!!! The police found NOTHING!  NO guns were inside the bus!  All
paintball guns taken on the trip were stowed properly in the bus' storage
compartment and we had no access to such compartment from inside the bus!

Once they saw that nothing was to be found, the police hid their badges
and refused to give us any information.  The interior of the bus was badly
damaged by the idiots who disassembled it!  All occupants of the bus were
badly sunburned, and had burns from the hot pavement on their buttocks and
knees.  Paintguns and personal belongings of all occupants were damaged,
but no officer remained behind to file reports with.

One Federal Agent gave us her business card, but when Jessica Sparks tried
to contact her the address was wrong, the phone # disconnected, but the
name was right.  However no calls would be returned. We were given nothing
to drink for the duration of the event. Our lives were endangered when the
tires of the bus (which was travelling about 65 mph ) were blown out. In
fact one SWAT Team member stated that they made a big mistake by blowing
the tires.  The chain with spikes was to be set up 7 miles down the road
in case the bus did not pull over.  I could go on and on about this
incident, but this is the condensed version.

If you think this could never happen to you, YOU ARE DEAD WRONG!

I had a red dot on my chest and had the player decided to fire, no
paintcheck would have been necessary.  Needless to say, Lawsuits are being
filed as we speak.

JJ/ABC PAINTBALL SUPPLY/NEW JERSEY

Stufaust@acs.eku.edu

When is America going to wake up? When are YOU going to wake up?


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please people, pass this paper around and make known what is happening in this country! I also
give permission for anyone to pass along and copy any news from the Patriot News Service.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 17 Aug 1995 11:21:09 -0400
From: Mayor Loz 
To: lindat@iquest.com
Subject: Pittsburgh Cops Mimic KGB

Pittsburgh Gun Owner/Collector Falsely Arrested as Psycho For
"Having Too Many Guns" and put into a Nut Ward To Silence Him!

I recently got an EMAIL originating From Linda Thompson about
the misuse of Psychiatry to brand patriots, government dissenters,
and gun owners as "nuts". This struck me as far out... then it
happened in my circle of friends.. I was so outraged I had this
fellows attorney go on the air of the Jim Quinn show, WRRK FM, 96.9
Pittsburgh, Daily 6-10 AM to tell the world about this happening
in my town of Pittsburgh, PA.. The story follows after my original
post and Linda's ALERT...

#: 862487 S8/LIBERTY ISSUES , Compuserve Go OUTFORUM, Section 8, Liberty Issues.
    15-Aug-95  13:21:06
Sb: Using Psych Wards in USA
Fm: "Mayor Loz" Schoenfelder 72162,1174
To: all

Interesting this could happen. My best friend in Pittsburgh is an
Attorney.  He just had a client who had THIS EXACT thing happen to him
... he was "jailed/committed  for having weapons....not illegal ones,
they then put him into a psych ward to STOP him when he called the media
about this illegal search and seizure of his guns, videos, cameras...etc.

Mayor Loz

 *** forwarded ****

FR: Linda Thompson, American Justice Federation

RE:  Police using 24-hour "Immediate Detention" as a "
dangerous/crazy person"to lock up political dissidents

Apparently, the police have gone to some school or convention
somewhere because they are, across the country, using a provision
in most state laws that allows a person who "presents a danger
to himself or others" to be picked up by the police, taken to a
local hospital and held involuntarily for up to 24 hours (there
is a provision where at anytime during that 24 hours, the hospital
can declare the person needs treatment for "mental illness" and
transfer them to a PRIVATE hospital for an additional 72-60 hours.
At that hospital, the person will be coerced into signing a statement
saying they VOLUNTARILY committed themselves at the threat of "If you
don't sign, you will be here until we can get a hearing in front of a
judge and we will be getting an order committing you for 90-180
days then. This causes most people to sign.)  The hospitals get state
money for this scam.  You do not have to be crazy or even doing
anything whatsoever to be picked up -- the cop's word is
good enough.  Afterwards, you have a record of being "involuntarily
committed," which can keep you from buying a gun, among other things.
Thus,the "24 hour mental detention" is being used as a scam to grab
patriots all over the country.  BE FOREWARNED.

-- Linda Thompson



Subj:	Interesting police action in CT....
Date:	95-09-02 08:49:29 EDT
From:	revcoal@pcnet.com (Donna J. Logan)

Well, yesterday we had an interesting development to a local
"domestic dispute"...seems some guy supposedly "made threats" against
his wife, she supposedly left the house, went to relatives, and
called the police, letting them know the teenaged son was still in
the house.

Well as it turns out, the husband has a "collection" of firearms to
which he has LEGAL permits....but it seems that this fact made the cops
decide they had an armed hostage situation...except by the time they
got there, the teenager was out sitting on the corner.  So then the
cops decided they had an "armed standoff" situation with a suicidal
madman, with what one news outlet claimed was "a drug problem"....

EXCEPT...this same news segment then interviewed the neighbors, who to
a person all said they knew the guy well and that he was very even
tempered and "a really nice guy" and had never evidenced behavior like
this in the past....not particularly the description of a "drug user"
(the "drug" supposedly being used was never mentioned, btw).  It was
stated that the police had no record of any previous trouble with the
guy, who was described as being on a leave of absence from his job working
at the water treatment facility at UConn.

And every family member stated that the guy definitely was not suicidal,
and his nephew was shown on TV as being really pissed off with the cops
cuz he claimed the whole situation could be ended immediately if they
just let him talk to his uncle, that he'd be able to get his uncle to
leave the house within minutes of talking to him...but the cops wouldn't
let him talk to his uncle.

In the meantime, the cops forcibly evacuated the whole neighborhood, and
not only cut electricity to the house, but CABLE ACCESS also!  Now seems
to me, once the electricity is off, that effectively cut the use of cable
TV...so why go to that extreme?  It was stated on the news that the cops
wanted to eliminate his access to media reports...but what about battery
operated radio and TV...and what's the logic behind eliminating the guy's
"access to media reports" of the event?

BTW, thru out this "seige", this guy never once fired a shot.  He was
described as "in an agitated state"...heck, if my house was surrounded
by SWAT, my neighbors forcibly evicted, and my electricity and cable cut
off...I'd be damned "agitated" too!

Anyways, about 20 hours after this all started, it was reported that the
guy finally "surrendered", and has been taken to a local hospital "for
psychiatric evaluation".....




O.K. people, repeat after me 1000 times. 
There is no conspiracy.
There is no conspiracy.



From wilson@softdisk.com.NOSPAMRIGHT? Wed Oct 16 08:14:15 PDT 1996
Article: 100058 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!n3ott.istar!imci2!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.softdisk.com!usenet
From: wilson@softdisk.com.NOSPAMRIGHT? ("Iron Parrot" Jiim)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Mcdonalds & the Satanic Church of California
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 10:26:35 GMT
Organization: ZATHOSTH ZONE
Lines: 34
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NNTP-Posting-Host: tty006.softdisk.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

frice@stbbs.com (Fredric L. Rice) did say:

>leftcoast@pacificcoast.net (Mike Aukslong) wrote:

>>   Little known fact that Mcdonalds is actually owned by the Satanic Church of 
>>California. Those Employee of the month pictures you see in their temples are 
>>actually photo's of the last people that they offed.

>  You sound like "Doctor" Linda Thompson!  

>Actually I think only about 85% of the owners/operators of 
>McDonnalds could be considered Christian Satanists.

>>Ronald is the anti christ sent to walk amongs us he was also the other shooter 
>>on the grassy nole . Turn those golden arches up side down and you've got one 
>>evil looking pitch fork,  think about it.         

>I'm convinced.   How do we arm ourselves?

>---------------------------------
>"de omnibus dubitandum"          | That is not dead which can eternal lie,
>All is to be doubted - Descartes | And with strange eons even death may die
>---------------------------------
>The Skeptic Tank: http://www.stbbs.com/personal/frice/index.htm
>The Skeptic Tank direct:  (818) 335-9601  (FidoNet 1:218/890.0)


But what about Grimace?  The Hamburgler?  What sinister plans do they
and their corrupt progeny concoct deep in the dank bowels of the
loathsome hidden temple of  Arche Deluxe?  And just what IS in the
SECRET SAUCE??!?!?
AAIAIIIEIEIEIEEEEIEIEIEIIEIEIEEIIIII




From geoffh@abcs.com Wed Oct 16 17:57:50 PDT 1996
Article: 100182 of alt.conspiracy
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From: geoffh@abcs.com (Geoffrey L. Hardin)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Black 'copters DO exist. . .here's undeniable proof.
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 17:03:37 GMT
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Finally, unable to take any more, I just had to put in my 2 cent's
worth .


Steve Berlinsky  wrote:

>Dan Sale wrote:
>> 
>> >>> Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
>> >>> have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?
>> 
>> Washington Times, 6/6/96 reported that Black Helicopters performing
>> "Urban Warfare Training"  swept through Pittsburg in the middle of the
>> night and turned parts of the city into war zones. Reports from
>> witnesses said that the helicopters were lower than FAA regulations
>> would permit ; several  witnesses observed one demolishing a warehouse
>> ; all in all, over 100 witnesses called in.

>All very well. You seem to have left out the part about the EXCERCISE
>being cancelled due to the citizens of Pittsburgh complaining to their
>councilmen (who knew in advance of the excercise but were asked to keep
>silent on the matter to keep crowds from gathering at excercise sites.)
>The "demolished" warehouse was in fact a former brewery (that's been
>closed for some years). With the owners prior permission, Delta Force
>practiced entering a locked building (by blowing the locks - with
>firefighters and police watching by the way). As for FAA regulations,
>why didn't the dumbass Washington Times reporter go look them up...hell,
>why don't you for that matter. Helicopters - even black ones - are
>allowed to fly pretty close to the ground. I suggest you order back
>copies of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette for the week in question to give
>you grasp of the facts.



Sigh.  Ok, let me unequivocally state that BLACK HELICOPTERS DO EXIST.
Period.  Don't believe me?   Want me to prove it?  Ok, that's simple.

UH-60 Helicopters are Black (arguably), or at least they appear black
when viewed from a distance.  Since they appear black, we can call
them black helicopters.  I personally know of someone who has a Hughes
500 which is painted glossy black.  If I had a scanner, I'd scan the
picture in for you all.

Therefore, because I can prove that there is a helicopter that appears
black, I can factually state that a black helicopter exists.  Since I
have personally, seen more than one, I can make that plural and state
that black helicopters exist.

Moreover, I can state that, because the Army, Air Force, Marines and
Navy all have helicopters and some of them are black, that the
military is in control of black helicopters.

Since, supposedly, our government is in control of the military, I can
state that the government knows about these black helicopters,
provides funding and training for them and even puts special equipment
on them for reasons of preparing for war (the Army, Air Force, and
Navy are all parts of our military which exists to conduct a war).

Now here's the fun part :  Since there are many parts of war that must
remain secret (so the enemy can't counteract them).  We can say that
the Government  is "...planning and acting together secretly. . .for a
harmful purpose" (war isn't a game of tiddlywinks).  This means they
are part of a conspiracy!!!

Since war involves people.  I can positively state that The U.S.
Government is involved in an established conspiracy involving the
utilization/implementation of black helicopters against the people in
concerted acts of aggression.

Even Better!!!!  Since we belong to the United Nations (remember,
we're the one's who put them together) and since members of our armed
forces are overseas serving under the U.N. banner I can even add :

Black Helicopters being flown by U.N. conspirators against the people!
The U.S. Government is not only aware of these incidents, but actually
supports and provides troops and equipment for the actions!!!!!!!

Now what I CAN'T prove is the statements that they are being flown by
small grey aliens and that they're zapping Linda Thompson in the head
in an effort to murder her (like they did to 6 or 7 of her friends). 

What amazes me to no extent is that there are more pictures, more
videos more sworn testimonies attesting to the existence of UFO's than
there are of black helicopters "harassing" citizens.  This is one of
the biggest problems I have with this part of the NWO conspiracy.

These "people" who claim to have had close encounters of the 2nd kind
(in some cases, third and fourth kind - I remember reading about
someone who had their van shot up in a swamp by some really pissed off
black helicopter dudes) are unable to provide even the most minute
trace of proof.  If you doubt their word, you're branded a co- NWO
conpirator. . . one of "them".  Obviously, since you don't take them
for face value, you are one of the "sheep", brainwashed by the NWO
crowd.  How dare you demand proof?   But I bet when they get pulled
over for a speeding ticket, they demand proof in court. . .oh, sorry,
THAT's different.  

Why is it that  Jim-Bob Hillbilly can submit a VCR tape of the UFO he
saw while taking his roadkill casserole to the trashcan out back, but
these "upstanding" citizens can't even produce a polaroid of one of
these black helicopters hovering over their vehicle making threatening
gestures?   

I guess it must be due to the fact that they have a SEP field
protecting the helicopter.

For those of you who are unfamiliar with the SEP Field Theory, to
oversimplify, it is an electro-psychic field generated around an
object.  This electro-psychic field invades the mind of anyone within
sight of the object and affects the mind in such a way as to make the
person believe that the object is "somebody else's problem" and,
basically, ignore the object.  Because the mind automatically ignores
the object, it is never seen, heard and cannot be remembered at a
later time, even under hypnosis. The SEP Field can even be made to
exclude certain people (with our without chips in their butts) so that
they could fly over the most crowded mall and be only seen by one
person, thereby making a visible and obvious threat BUT ONLY TO THAT
ONE PERSON.  When that person points, and tries to draw attention to
the object, the SEP field protects the object from other people.  Even
those who are looking directly at it (devious bastards, aren't they),
since the SEP Field works on the unconscious part of the brain and
cannot be overriden by the conscious part.  Someone who is being
affected by a SEP field has the object "filled" in with what the mind
should see behind it (e.g., a cloudy sky or a city skyline).  

For example.  The UN/Bilderbergers/Alien/Tri-Lateral Commission/Rabid
Boy Scout crowd decides that Jane Doe (names have been changed to
protect the mentally challenged) needs to be taught a lesson.  At 0100
(a.m.)  they turn on their HAARP project and beam special anti-SEP
rays into her bedroom (they can shoot right through a window, you
know).  This restructures the psychoperceptual relays in her brain so
she will not be affected by an SEP field (the field can be varied,
harmonically, so that different objects have different "frequencies"
thereby allowing only one or two of, say, a dozen objects to be seen).
Being the nefarious organization they are, they also have implanted a
suggestion that Jane Doe go to the mall.  Once they know she's there
(they follow her everyday, of course) they stage an overflight of a
helicopter or two.  Jane Doe, having been prepared earlier for this
event by the HAARP transmission, proceeds to have a conniption fit,
screaming, pointing, jumping up and down when the mall is buzzed by
this huge, black helicopter.  

She is further enraged when, as she points out to her fellow
mall-travellers the buzzing, threatening helicopters, everyone just
looks at her, then up to where she's pointing, then back at her again,
with puzzled looks on their faces.

Everyone around her, having been properly affected by the SEP field
see absolutely nothing except an obviously "demented" person who is
stamping, screaming and pointing up at the sky like Chicken Little
having a seizure.

Jane Doe, oblivious to the knowledge of the effects of the SEP
field(s) on all the other people only gets further enraged by everyone
looking at her as if she were crazy.  

Eventually one of the crowd calls the police about the "ranting,
raving lunatic" and has her dragged off to jail/the funny farm.

The pilot of the black helicopter increases power and cyclic and goes
off to do his next evil deed, smiling with the satisfaction of yet
another job well done.

Eventually Jane Doe is released.  It's a perfect plan.  She tries to
get someone to listen, she tries to provide proof, but since the SEP
field denies her even that, she is written off as a kook, a nut.
Slowly her sanity begins to slide, she even begins to doubt herself,
finally doctoring some videotapes to lend herself some credibility.

Damn those little grey aliens and their super technology
Geoffrey L. Hardin,
(geoffh@abcs.com)



From gthaler@cs.com Wed Oct 16 18:03:34 PDT 1996
Article: 485752 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.bc.net!news.insinc.net!news.total.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!netnews.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: Gail Thaler 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: Re: Kennemur  apologists!
Date: 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 47
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laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
>"@worldnet.att.net?"
>

pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
said AT&T was communist. start there.

>Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
>
Den.

>David
>
>S. Emma Edmonds (herstory@worldnet.att.net) wrote:
>: On Sat, 12 Oct 1996 14:43:05 GMT, voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim
>: Kennemur) wrote:
>
>: >You bonehead gun loons are pretty much indistinguishable in your lack
>: >of knowledge and stupidity when it comes to Constitutional law.
>: >
>: >Care to show me that court case that guarantees you an absolute right
>: >to keep and bear arms under the 2nd amendment?
>
>: Jim I beg you don't temp these silly people.  You want to see gun
>: control?  Take the second to court.
>
>
>: Emma
>:  ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
>: "Women should decide for themselves whether they shall
>: become mothers, under what conditions, and when."
>: 		--Margaret Sanger
>
>
>
>--
>David LaRo                                              laro@texas.net         
>"Books are a delightful society.  If you go into a room filled with books,
>even without taking them down from their shelves, they seem to speak to you."
>						     ***WILLIAM E. GLADSTONE
>




From rgates8254@aol.com Thu Oct 17 00:06:30 PDT 1996
Article: 100244 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!noc.van.hookup.net!laslo.netnet.net!node2.frontiernet.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!newstf01.news.aol.com!newsbf02.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
From: rgates8254@aol.com (RGates8254)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Linda "Militia March" Thompson  Was Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: 16 Oct 1996 20:09:51 -0400
Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364)
Lines: 23
Sender: root@newsbf02.news.aol.com
Message-ID: <543tgf$pgv@newsbf02.news.aol.com>
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Reply-To: rgates8254@aol.com (RGates8254)
NNTP-Posting-Host: newsbf02.mail.aol.com

>So keep your tory-comments where they belong...in AOL
  Steve,

  Be careful Steve, you starting to sound just like the Bill Clinton
apologists sound like.  You know:.  "The facts of what Bill did or didn't
do, his probably moral lapses and ethical problems,  or what he might have
done mean nothing, he is just a great guy standing up for us victims of
crime/against the evil gun owners/against the evil republicans/ blah
blah."   Then of course the next comment the apologists make is "Well go
say that about Bill somewhere else, or better yet don't every say it
again."


RGates8254@AOL.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------
Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of
chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God!  I know not what course other
may take but as for me; give me liberty or give me death!
                 ------Patrick Henry
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------



From johnlf@europa.com Thu Oct 17 00:06:34 PDT 1996
Article: 100323 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.bc.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!howland.erols.net!newsxfer.itd.umich.edu!qiclab.scn.rain.com!europa.com!usenet
From: John Fisher 
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: CONSPIRACY NATION ARCHIVE 10/16/96
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 22:11:51 -0700
Organization: JLF Inc.
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CONSPIRACY NATION ARCHIVE


http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-75 Skolnick on BATF
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-76 Skolnick on OKC Bombing [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-77 CN in Time Magazine
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-78 Skolnick on OKC Bombing [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-79 OKC Bombing [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-80 Skolnick on OKC Bombing [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-81 Waco
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-82 Skolnick on Clinton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-83 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-84 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-85 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-86 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-87 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-88 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-89 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-7]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-90 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-91 Skolnick on Whitewater
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-92 Skolnick on NWO [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-93 Skolnick on NWO [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-94 Skolnick on NWO [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-95 Skolnick on Swiss Bank Accounts
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-96 Skolnick on Swiss Bank Accounts
[P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-97 Skolnick on Janet Reno
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-98 Skolnick on Skolnick
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-99 Washington Times: Whitewater
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-01 Skolnick on Starr, etc. [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-02 Skolnick on Starr, etc. [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-03 Project Censored [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-04 Project Censored [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-05 Skolnick on Chicago Corruption
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-06 Skolnick on Japanese Spying
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-07 Penthouse Mena Story
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-08 Report From Iron Mountain
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-09 Skolnick on Whitewater [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-10 Skolnick on Whitewater [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-11 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-12 Great American Fortunes [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-13 Great American Fortunes [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-14 Great American Fortunes [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-19 Skolnick Interviews Povlovich
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-20 RFA:OKC Bombing [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-21 RFA:OKC Bombing [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-22 RFA:OKC Bombing [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-23 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-24 Globalization of Capital
Production [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-25 Globalization of Capital
Production [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-26 Skolnick on Whitewater
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-27 Globalization of Capital
Production [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-28 Militia Testimony 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-29 Skolnick on Clinton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-30 Skolnick on rogue grand jury
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-31 Reed Irvine on Foster
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-32 Stephen Jones Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-33 Von Trapp Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-34 Von Trapp Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-35 Von Trapp Interview [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-36 Unabomber
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-37 Edye Smith
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-38 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-39 Skolnick on Foster Murder [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-40 Skolnick on Foster Murder [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-41 Skolnick on Andreuccetti-Grabbe
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-42 Grabbe [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-43 Skolnick on Foster Murder [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-44 Grabbe [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-45 Skolnick on Grabbe/Norman [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-46 Skolnick on Grabbe/Norman [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-47 Skolnick on Grabbe/Norman [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-48 Grabbe [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-49 Vince Foster Murder
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-50 Von Trapp Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-51 Von Trapp Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-52 Von Trapp Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-53 Grabbe [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-54 Skolnick on Pollard and Foster
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-55 Skolnick on Pollard and Foster
[P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-56 AEP Responds
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-57 Larry Nichols
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-58 Ebola
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-59 Foster Files
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-60 Skolnick on Chinese Secret
Police
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-61 Skolnick on BATF
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-62 Skolnick on Wallace Shooting
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-63 Troy Underhill Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-64 Troy Underhill Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-65 Ryder Truck Bomb
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-66 Troy Underhill Interview [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-67 Troy Underhill Interview [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-68 Troy Underhill Interview [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-69 Troy Underhill Interview [P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-70 Michael Aquino
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-71 Kiri Jewell Lies
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-72 James Norman Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-73 James Norman Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-74 Kennedy Debate
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-75 Skolnick on Mena
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-76 Jean Lewis
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-77 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-78 Skolnick on Bribes
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-79 Subliminal Cartoons
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-80 Skolnick on William Hogan [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-81 Edye Smith
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-82 Skolnick on Norman [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-83 Skolnick on Norman [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-84 Skolnick on Grabbe [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-85 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-86 Skolnick on Grabbe [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-87 Skolnick on William Hogan [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-88 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-89 Skolnick on Mel Reynolds
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-90 Skolnick on Sugarman
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-91 Mel Reynolds
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-92 Randy Weaver [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-93 Randy Weaver [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-94 Korean MIA's
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-95 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-96 Ostrovsky Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-97 Skolnick Index
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-98 McClendon Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-99 Terry Cook
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-01 Grabbe Index
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-02 Klunk Letter
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-03 The Money Trail [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-04 The Money Trail [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-05 Wiencek Affidavit
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-06 Rothstein Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-07 Rothstein Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-08 Skolnick on Powell
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-09 Unabomber
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-10 Rothstein Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-11 WWW Conspiracy Sites
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-12 Rothstein Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-13 Skolnick on OJ [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-14 Linda Thompson
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-15 Skolnick's Book List
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-16 C.N's Book List
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-17 Mrs. Herman
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-18 Rothstein Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-19 OJ Simpson
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-20 D.C. Dave
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-21 Skolnick on OJ [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-22 Rooney on OJ
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-23 Skolnick on OJ [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-24 Skolnick on OJ [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-25 Von Trapp Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-26 Skolnick on OJ [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-27 Skolnick on OJ [P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-28 McVeigh's Lawyer
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-29 Prairienet
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-30 Rothstein Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-31 Skolnick on OJ [P-7]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-32 Skolnick on OJ [P-8]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-33 Skolnick Sues A.D.R.C.
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-34 Civil Search Warrants
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-35 Forged Suicide Note
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-36 Skolnick on OJ [P-9]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-37 Drugs and Prisons
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-38 Skolnick on Drugs
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-39 Rep. Burton on 60 minutes
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-40 Rep. Horn on Bosnia
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-41 Federal Internet Surveillance
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-42 HR Expert Reginald Alton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-43 Witness Patrick Knowlton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-44 Skolnick on OJ [P-10]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-45 Skolnick on Rabin Assassination
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-46 Skolnick on Rabin Assassination
[P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-47 J. Edgar Hoover
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-48 Skolnick on Judge Ito
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-49 Government Shutdown
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-51 The Bribery List
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-52 Grabbe Index
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-53 The Davidian Massacre
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-54 Oil Crisis: Operation Interlink
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-55 Skolnick on OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-56 Travelgate
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-57 Skolnick on BCCI, Rabin
Assassination
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-58 Gold Crunch
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-59 Militia Testimony
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-60 Beatle's Backwards Masking
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-61 Skolnick on Chicago Corruption
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-62 October Surprise
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-63 Senate Retirement Epidemic
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-64 CN News
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-65 Vatican Money Laundering
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-66 Rep. Dornan on Bosnia
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-67 International Corruption
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-68 Skolnick on International
Corruption 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-69 Lockerbie cover-up [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-70 Lockerbie cover-up [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-71 Bosnian Civil War
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-72 CN's National Security Reading
List
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-73 St. Peter's Banker
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-74 Chicago Crime
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-75 The Empire of 'The City' [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-76 Skolnick on OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-77 Skolnick on Various Scandals
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-78 DC Dave on suicide
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-79 The Empire of 'The City' [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-80 The Empire of 'The City' [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-81 NAFTA and The Mexican Crisis
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-82 October Surprise: The Ladies'
Room Files
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-83 Skolnick on Rabin Assassination
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-84 Leah Rabin and The Pope
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-85 The Naked Man
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-86 Oliver Stone's "Nixon"
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-87 Skolnick Silences Skeptics
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-88 Grabbe [P-36]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-89 Where's The Nazi Gold?
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-90 Marilyn, Kennedy and The Mob
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-91 Skolnick on Clinton vs. Congress
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-92 Bloodshed in The Balkans
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-93 Haitian Rebels Massacred 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-94 1904 Headlines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-95 Hillary's Week 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-96 1904 Headlines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-97 The Buying of The President 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-98 RFA on OKC Bombing 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-99 1925 Headlines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-01 1925 Headlines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-02 The Norman Thesis [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-03 The Norman Thesis [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-04 The Norman Thesis [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-05 The Norman Thesis [P-4] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-06 House Panel Looks at Mena 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-07 Bovine Growth Hormone 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-08 Hoppy Heidelberg Interview 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-09 CN Editor Whines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-10 Von Trapp Faxes Starr 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-11 DC Dave's Poetry 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-12 CN Subscriber Info 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-13 BCCI List 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-14 Reporters Fear of Mena 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-15 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-16 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-17 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-18 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-4] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-19 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-5] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-20 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-6] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-21 Waco Justice 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-22 Tsar Nicholas II's Burial 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-23 Web Site on Banned AIDS Book 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-24 AIDS Inc. [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-25 AIDS Inc. [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-26 Operation Silver Shovel 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-27 Major Toxic Dumping Scandals 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-28 Hotel Workers' Union 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-29 Mafia Games 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-30 Mobsters Got Into The Unions
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-31 AIDS Inc. [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-32 Oklahoma Bombing And The Media 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-33 AIDS Inc. [P-4] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-34 AIDS Inc. [P-5] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-35 AIDS Inc. [P-6] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-36 AIDS Inc. [P-7] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-37 The Oklahoma Bombing/Story of a
Magazine 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-38 Radio Havana 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-39 Did CFR Approve Cuban Downing? 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-40 The Oklahoma
Bombings/Radioactive Cover-Up 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-41 Gulf War Syndrome [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-42 Gulf War Syndrome [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-43 Gulf War Syndrome [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-44 U.S. Complicity in the Oklahoma
Bombings 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-45 Corroboration of BCCI Bribe List 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-46 Recent OKC Bombing Speculation 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-47 Louis Farrakhan [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-48 Louis Farrakhan [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-49 Louis Farrakhan [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-50 Louis Farrakhan [P-4] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-51 News Round-Up -- 03/24/96 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-52 Ralph Nader [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-53 Ralph Nader [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-54 Skolnick on aspartame 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-56 Compromised 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-57 Ron Brown: They Can't Indict Him
Now 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-58 Sabotage? The Crash of Ron
Brown's Plane 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-59 Arkansas 101 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-60 Jury Tampering 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-61 Ron Brown: Entrepreneur 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-62 Barry, Vince and Ron- 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-63 Rumors Surrounding Ron Brown's
Crash 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-64 Morris Dees and the Militia 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-65 Waco Plus Three Years [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-66 Waco Plus Three Years [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-67 Harold May Interview about Waco 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-68 Grabbe on Ron Brown 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-69 Waco Victim List 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-70 OKC Bombing: One Year Later 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-71 Postmodernism 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-72 Project Censored Top 25 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-73 Skolnick on Blackmail 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-74 Spotlight Exclusive: Ron Brown 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-75 Blood Sport Duplicity 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-76 Skolnick on Paper Money 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-77 Innocent Simpson 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-78 The Lindberg kidnapping 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-79 Skolnick on William Colby 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-80 The Freemen Standoff 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-81 Privatization of The Internet 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-82 CIA Propaganda 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-83 Bugged Confession 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-84 Force and The Lie 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-85 Hightower on Halloween 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-86 Potpourri 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-87 Skolnick Interviews John DeCamp 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-88 The Franklin Coverup 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-89 The "Suicide" of Admiral Boorda 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-90 "Obstruction of Justice" 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-91 Liberals Protest NWO 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-92 Conspiracies in Book of Mormon 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-93 FBI Has No Charter 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-94 Van Gogh 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-95 Isis Unveiled 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-96 JFK Assassination Booklist 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-97 Charles Hayes' Computers 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-98 James Norman Interview [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-99 James Norman Interview [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-01 Skolnick on Einstein 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-02 Rabin assassination Book 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-03 CN on Noam Chomsky 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-04 Skolnick on Andreuccetti 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-05 John Cummings Interview 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-06 Reed v. Young 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-07 Noriega and The USA 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-08 DCIA 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-09 Freespeechnews 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-10 666 Searcher 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-11 666 Searcher 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-12 Tommy Burkett Saga 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-13 Operation Pegasus 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-14 Secret Combinations 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-15 Who is Noam Chomsky? 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-16 Presidents vs. Congress 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-17 Observations By Grabbe 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-18 Skolnick on The Chicago Octopus 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-19 Donna Rice Hughes 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-20 Crooked Carlos Salinas 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-21 Skolnick on The Criminal
Convention 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-22 June Bilderbergers meeting 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-23 Donna Rice 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-24 Skolnick on What is Really Going
on 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-26 Lyndon Larouche 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-27 Crooked Carlos, Crooked Bill 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-28 Grabbe's "Apology and Goodbye" ;
) 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-29 Grabbe on Wayward Woodward 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-30 Grabbe on White House Database 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-31 Marcus Antonius 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-32 Hightower on Big Oil Companies 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-33 Excerpts From'Dope Inc.' 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-34 Excerpts From'Dope Inc.' 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-35 Prohibition Conspiracies 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-36 "Journalists" 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-37 CN Alert 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-38 Hightower on Corrupt Pol Money 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-39 Atlanta Olympics 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-40 Guns And Gold 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-41 Satire vs. Waco 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-42 Skolnick on Bill C. And
Rockefellers 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-43 Alpha 66 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-44 Hightower on Phillip Knight 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-45 "Mr. Mercedes's" Predictions 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-46 Feminism And Conspiracy 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-47 The Truth Matters 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-48 Rumor Mill News Service #1 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-49 Orlin Grabbe's The Clinton Crash 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-50 Fostergate: Pro And Con 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-51 Skolnick on Rockefellers And
Rothschilds 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-52 Rumor Mill News Service #2 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-53 Rumor Mill News Service #3 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-54 Mark Koernke on TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-55 Rodney Stich on S.A.M.'s 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-56 Witnesses of TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-57 Skolnick on TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-58 Grabbe on TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-59 Freespeech Newspaper? 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-60 "Economy Good"?  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-61 Grabbe on TWA 800 [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-62 Gene Tatum Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-63 Gene Tatum Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-64 Gene Tatum Interview [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-65 CN Threatened
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-66 Skolnick on White House Enemies
List 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-67 Grabbe on TWA 800 [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-68 The Death of Amschel Rothschild
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-69 Inventing The AIDS Virus 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-70 Gene Tatum Warns Ross Perot 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-71 Orlin Grabbe on Operation
BOPTROT
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-72 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-73 Who is Orlin Grabbe?
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-74 Gene Tatum Interview [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-75 Gene Tatum Interview [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-76 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-2]  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-77 Gene Tatum on Reno, Clinton,
Terror
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-78 Spoofing The Militias
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-79 "Chain Reaction"
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-80 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-81 CN Sells Out    
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-82 Meyer's Cell 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-84 The New Federalist
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-85 Rumor Mill News Service #4
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-86 Rumor Mill News Service #4
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-87 Senator For Sale
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-88 Subliminal TV Messages 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-89 Ross Perot Speaks
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-90 Tommy Burkett Cover-Up
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-91 Inslaw Update
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-92 Uncle Sam's Heroin Habit  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-93 Casoloctopus
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-94 OKC: What Really Happened?
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-95 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-96 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-98 The Partin Report    
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-99 King Klinton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-01 Traffickers of Death 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-02 The Death of James Moody [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-03 The Death of James Moody [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-04 The Dick Morris Mess
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-05 Mexican Dissidents  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-06 Clinton's Cocaine Habit
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-07 Skolnick on Saddam Hussein  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-08 Focus on Carlos Cardoen
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-09 CN's Prairienet Problems 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-10 Prairienet's Response
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-11 Code Word For Class War 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-12 Gene Tatum on Pegasus
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-13 Turning To Mexico [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-14 Potpourri 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-15 Turning To Mexico [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-16 The Endless Bull Market
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-17 Warren Commission Secrets
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-18 Turning To Mexico [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-19 Turning To Mexico [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-20 Turning To Mexico [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-21 Remote Viewing of TWA 800
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-22 Turning To Mexico [P-6] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-23 Turning To Mexico [P-7] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-24 SOURCES eJOURNAL
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-25 Potpourri
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-26 Gene Tatum on Clinton And
Cocaine
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-27 Strange Lights And TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-28 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-29 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-30 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-31 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-32 Skolnick on October's Eve  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-33 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-34 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-35 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-7]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-36 News on Chip Tatum
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-37 Skolnick on The OJ Cover-up
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-38 Investigative Report's Whitewash
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-39 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-8]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-40 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-9]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-41 Turning To Mexico [P-8]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-42 Gloria Steinem And The CIA
[P-10] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-43 Gloria Steinem And The CIA
[P-11]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-44 Skolnick vs. Hillary
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-45 Interesting Web Sites
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-46 Gloria Steinem And The CIA
[P-12]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-47 Gloria Steinem And The CIA
[P-13]    
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-48 The Cover-up Quilt
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-49 Skolnick on Crazy Judge Duff
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-50 Skolnick on Al Gore vs. George
Bush  

------------CORRUPTION IN AMERICA------------
---------------------------------------------
-----------------FEATURES:-------------------
---------------------------------------------
----------CONSPIRACY NATION ARCHIVE----------
-----------SKOLNICK'S COMMENTARIES-----------
-------------THE POLITICAL DIGEST------------
--------------THE CLINTON CRASH--------------
-----------------ORLIN GRABBE----------------
       

        http://www.europa.com/~johnlf


From voltai29@worldnet.att.net Thu Oct 17 00:29:22 PDT 1996
Article: 485907 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!news.wildstar.net!cancer.vividnet.com!hunter.premier.net!netnews.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim Kennemur)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: Kennemur Now Has a CS.COM Account!
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 22:43:24 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
References: <542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net> <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net>
Reply-To: voltai29@worldnet.att.net
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Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:327408 talk.politics.misc:485907

On 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT, Gail Thaler  wrote:

>laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
>>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
>>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
>>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
>>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
>>"@worldnet.att.net?"
>>
>
>pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
>said AT&T was communist. Start there.

Lookie David. Now I have a CS.COM account as well!

>>Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
>>
>Den.

It is a Lying Socialist Weasel thing David. Much too complicated for
your pretty little head!

     Jim

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
"Nobody fully understands this, but if you think of
the 'Contract With America,' it was, in fact, a training
implementation document masquerading as a public relations
device which allowed us -- and it was designed for this
purpose -- it was designed, because we felt we were in
control. It was designed as a training implementation 
document so the freshmen when they arrived and the
brand new chairmen could not be normal."

                        Newt Gingrich -- Roll Call
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=


From txjohn47@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 17 00:29:44 PDT 1996
Article: 486160 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!xavier.cybersmith.com!news.kei.com!news.texas.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: txjohn47@ix.netcom.com(John Johnson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: Re: Kennemur Now Has a CS.COM Account!
Date: 17 Oct 1996 04:39:32 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 62
Message-ID: <544da4$p2r@dfw-ixnews8.ix.netcom.com>
References: <542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net> <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dfw-tx10-30.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Oct 16 11:39:32 PM CDT 1996
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:327545 talk.politics.misc:486160

In <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim Kennemur) writes: 
>
>On 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT, Gail Thaler  wrote:
>
>>laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
>>>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
>>>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
>>>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
>>>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
>>>"@worldnet.att.net?"
>>>
>>
>> pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
>> said AT&T was communist. Start there.
>
> Lookie David. Now I have a CS.COM account as well!

  Not really:

   "In <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> Gail Thaler
     writes:         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^-----------<<<
  >
  > laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:"

   Care to explain how a "CS.COM" account can come up with a "from"
 address like the above? (And don't write "forgery")

>>> Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
>>>
>> Den.
>
> It is a Lying Socialist Weasel thing David. Much too complicated for
> your pretty little head!
>
>     Jim

   The abusive, slanderous, libelous and profane postings of Jim
 "Voltaire" Kennemur continue.

 --John Johnson

 "Handgun Control Inc., the lobbying group that helped push through
 the  federal ban on semi-automatic weapons and the Brady law on gun
 purchases, is said to be worried that it is losing the public
 relations war to the National Rifle Association. . . . It is also
 considering a name change because, among other reasons, polls and
 focus groups show  that many Americans are uncomfortable with the
 word *control*."  US News and World Report, August 19, 1996

 ATTENTION citizens near the east coast! That rumbling sound you
 hear is NOT an earthquake! It's just the sounds of Washington,
 Hamilton, Jefferson, Allen, Witherspoon, et al; spinning in their
 graves!
-- 

>From  the main computer of:
John Johnson
TXJohn47@ix.netcom.com

The opinions expressed above represent those of the writer (me)
and not necessarily those of his employer (also me).


From gthaler@cs.com Thu Oct 17 07:53:52 PDT 1996
Article: 327331 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.bc.net!news.insinc.net!news.total.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!hunter.premier.net!netnews.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: Gail Thaler 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: Re: Kennemur  apologists!
Date: 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 47
Message-ID: <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net>
References: <542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 56.arlington-04.va.dial-access.att.net
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.12(Macintosh; I; PPC)
X-URL: news:542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:327331 talk.politics.misc:485752

laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
>"@worldnet.att.net?"
>

pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
said AT&T was communist. start there.

>Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
>
Den.

>David
>
>S. Emma Edmonds (herstory@worldnet.att.net) wrote:
>: On Sat, 12 Oct 1996 14:43:05 GMT, voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim
>: Kennemur) wrote:
>
>: >You bonehead gun loons are pretty much indistinguishable in your lack
>: >of knowledge and stupidity when it comes to Constitutional law.
>: >
>: >Care to show me that court case that guarantees you an absolute right
>: >to keep and bear arms under the 2nd amendment?
>
>: Jim I beg you don't temp these silly people.  You want to see gun
>: control?  Take the second to court.
>
>
>: Emma
>:  ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
>: "Women should decide for themselves whether they shall
>: become mothers, under what conditions, and when."
>: 		--Margaret Sanger
>
>
>
>--
>David LaRo                                              laro@texas.net         
>"Books are a delightful society.  If you go into a room filled with books,
>even without taking them down from their shelves, they seem to speak to you."
>						     ***WILLIAM E. GLADSTONE
>




From voltai29@worldnet.att.net Thu Oct 17 07:54:02 PDT 1996
Article: 327408 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!news.wildstar.net!cancer.vividnet.com!hunter.premier.net!netnews.worldnet.att.net!newsadm
From: voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim Kennemur)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: Kennemur Now Has a CS.COM Account!
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 22:43:24 GMT
Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
References: <542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net> <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net>
Reply-To: voltai29@worldnet.att.net
NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.houston-2.tx.dial-access.att.net
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Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:327408 talk.politics.misc:485907

On 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT, Gail Thaler  wrote:

>laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
>>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
>>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
>>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
>>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
>>"@worldnet.att.net?"
>>
>
>pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
>said AT&T was communist. Start there.

Lookie David. Now I have a CS.COM account as well!

>>Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
>>
>Den.

It is a Lying Socialist Weasel thing David. Much too complicated for
your pretty little head!

     Jim

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
"Nobody fully understands this, but if you think of
the 'Contract With America,' it was, in fact, a training
implementation document masquerading as a public relations
device which allowed us -- and it was designed for this
purpose -- it was designed, because we felt we were in
control. It was designed as a training implementation 
document so the freshmen when they arrived and the
brand new chairmen could not be normal."

                        Newt Gingrich -- Roll Call
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=


From txjohn47@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 17 07:54:21 PDT 1996
Article: 327545 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!xavier.cybersmith.com!news.kei.com!news.texas.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: txjohn47@ix.netcom.com(John Johnson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: Re: Kennemur Now Has a CS.COM Account!
Date: 17 Oct 1996 04:39:32 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 62
Message-ID: <544da4$p2r@dfw-ixnews8.ix.netcom.com>
References: <542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net> <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: dfw-tx10-30.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Oct 16 11:39:32 PM CDT 1996
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:327545 talk.politics.misc:486160

In <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim Kennemur) writes: 
>
>On 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT, Gail Thaler  wrote:
>
>>laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
>>>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
>>>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
>>>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
>>>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
>>>"@worldnet.att.net?"
>>>
>>
>> pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
>> said AT&T was communist. Start there.
>
> Lookie David. Now I have a CS.COM account as well!

  Not really:

   "In <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> Gail Thaler
     writes:         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^-----------<<<
  >
  > laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:"

   Care to explain how a "CS.COM" account can come up with a "from"
 address like the above? (And don't write "forgery")

>>> Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
>>>
>> Den.
>
> It is a Lying Socialist Weasel thing David. Much too complicated for
> your pretty little head!
>
>     Jim

   The abusive, slanderous, libelous and profane postings of Jim
 "Voltaire" Kennemur continue.

 --John Johnson

 "Handgun Control Inc., the lobbying group that helped push through
 the  federal ban on semi-automatic weapons and the Brady law on gun
 purchases, is said to be worried that it is losing the public
 relations war to the National Rifle Association. . . . It is also
 considering a name change because, among other reasons, polls and
 focus groups show  that many Americans are uncomfortable with the
 word *control*."  US News and World Report, August 19, 1996

 ATTENTION citizens near the east coast! That rumbling sound you
 hear is NOT an earthquake! It's just the sounds of Washington,
 Hamilton, Jefferson, Allen, Witherspoon, et al; spinning in their
 graves!
-- 

>From  the main computer of:
John Johnson
TXJohn47@ix.netcom.com

The opinions expressed above represent those of the writer (me)
and not necessarily those of his employer (also me).


From libnw@dmi.net Thu Oct 17 11:54:16 PDT 1996
Article: 52391 of alt.society.civil-liberty
Message-ID: <326544DB.6850@dmi.net>
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 12:26:03 -0800
From: LIB_NW 
Organization: Liberty Northwest
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; U)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: WARNING-Government Operative Loose on InterNet
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Lines: 59
Newsgroups: alt.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.libertarian,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.society.civil-liberties
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.dsource.com!206.153.241.79
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.politics.libertarian:221586 talk.politics.libertarian:132803 alt.society.civil-liberty:52391 alt.society.civil-liberties:9778

Subject: WARNING - Government Operative Loose on InterNet
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 96 10:31:00 EST
From: "Cravens, Roger D." 
To: LIB_NW 
From: Linda Thompson 
To: aen-news@aen.org

An extremely dangerous, well-known government operative, Gary Hunt, is 
now
on the internet, putting out a publication called "Beyond the Fringe,"
(BTF).

His ENTIRE purpose in life is to recruit people into criminal activity 
and
get them arrested or killed, or both, while using them to attack
*GOVERNMENT* targets of the FBI (which, of course, is then blamed on
"militia" and the FBI always puts out stories claiming he is "militia.")
His group is "Sons of Liberty" and includes several other well-known
operatives out of Texas.

He provided a PO Box in Mesa, Arizona and an e-mail address of 
opf@azi.com.

I do not have time to post the background on Hunt right this sec, but 
will
by this weekend for those who don't know who and what he is.

We also have pictures of him.

Kind regards,

Linda Thompson

********************  V  ***************************
       DEATH TO THE NEW WORLD ORDER.
***************************************************
Dr. Linda Thompson
Attorney at Law
Chairman, American Justice Federation
Internet:  lindat@iquest.net

****************************************************
       Remember Waco.
  The Murderers are still free.
****************************************************
Have you seen this yet?

    http://206.55.8.10/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum

-- 
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
LIBERTY NORTHWEST CONFERENCE * Fidonet 1:346/16 (208) 267-9851
Visit Liberty Northwest on the Web: http://www.saldivar.com/lib_nw/
E-Mail Subscriptions: Subscribe.lib_nw@lib_nw.circuit.com

...Liberty is never an option... only a condition to be lost
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++




From gclind01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu Fri Oct 18 10:03:45 PDT 1996
Article: 100501 of alt.conspiracy
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From: gclind01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (George C. Lindauer)
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Black 'copters DO exist. . .here's undeniable proof.
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Date: 17 Oct 1996 18:36:07 GMT
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Geoffrey L. Hardin (geoffh@abcs.com) wrote:
: Finally, unable to take any more, I just had to put in my 2 cent's
: worth .
: 
: 
: Steve Berlinsky  wrote:
: 
: >Dan Sale wrote:
: >> 
: >> >>> Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
: >> >>> have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?
: >> 
: >> Washington Times, 6/6/96 reported that Black Helicopters performing
: >> "Urban Warfare Training"  swept through Pittsburg in the middle of the
: >> night and turned parts of the city into war zones. Reports from
: >> witnesses said that the helicopters were lower than FAA regulations
: >> would permit ; several  witnesses observed one demolishing a warehouse
: >> ; all in all, over 100 witnesses called in.
: 
: >All very well. You seem to have left out the part about the EXCERCISE
: >being cancelled due to the citizens of Pittsburgh complaining to their
: >councilmen (who knew in advance of the excercise but were asked to keep
: >silent on the matter to keep crowds from gathering at excercise sites.)
: >The "demolished" warehouse was in fact a former brewery (that's been
: >closed for some years). With the owners prior permission, Delta Force
: >practiced entering a locked building (by blowing the locks - with
: >firefighters and police watching by the way). As for FAA regulations,
: >why didn't the dumbass Washington Times reporter go look them up...hell,
: >why don't you for that matter. Helicopters - even black ones - are
: >allowed to fly pretty close to the ground. I suggest you order back
: >copies of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette for the week in question to give
: >you grasp of the facts.
: 
: 
: 
: Sigh.  Ok, let me unequivocally state that BLACK HELICOPTERS DO EXIST.
: Period.  Don't believe me?   Want me to prove it?  Ok, that's simple.
: 
: UH-60 Helicopters are Black (arguably), or at least they appear black
: when viewed from a distance.  Since they appear black, we can call
: them black helicopters.  I personally know of someone who has a Hughes
: 500 which is painted glossy black.  If I had a scanner, I'd scan the
: picture in for you all.
: 
: Therefore, because I can prove that there is a helicopter that appears
: black, I can factually state that a black helicopter exists.  Since I
: have personally, seen more than one, I can make that plural and state
: that black helicopters exist.
: 
: Moreover, I can state that, because the Army, Air Force, Marines and
: Navy all have helicopters and some of them are black, that the
: military is in control of black helicopters.
: 
: Since, supposedly, our government is in control of the military, I can
: state that the government knows about these black helicopters,
: provides funding and training for them and even puts special equipment
: on them for reasons of preparing for war (the Army, Air Force, and
: Navy are all parts of our military which exists to conduct a war).
: 
: Now here's the fun part :  Since there are many parts of war that must
: remain secret (so the enemy can't counteract them).  We can say that
: the Government  is "...planning and acting together secretly. . .for a
: harmful purpose" (war isn't a game of tiddlywinks).  This means they
: are part of a conspiracy!!!
: 
: Since war involves people.  I can positively state that The U.S.
: Government is involved in an established conspiracy involving the
: utilization/implementation of black helicopters against the people in
: concerted acts of aggression.
: 
: Even Better!!!!  Since we belong to the United Nations (remember,
: we're the one's who put them together) and since members of our armed
: forces are overseas serving under the U.N. banner I can even add :
: 
: Black Helicopters being flown by U.N. conspirators against the people!
: The U.S. Government is not only aware of these incidents, but actually
: supports and provides troops and equipment for the actions!!!!!!!
: 
: Now what I CAN'T prove is the statements that they are being flown by
: small grey aliens and that they're zapping Linda Thompson in the head
: in an effort to murder her (like they did to 6 or 7 of her friends). 
: 
: What amazes me to no extent is that there are more pictures, more
: videos more sworn testimonies attesting to the existence of UFO's than
: there are of black helicopters "harassing" citizens.  This is one of
: the biggest problems I have with this part of the NWO conspiracy.
: 
: These "people" who claim to have had close encounters of the 2nd kind
: (in some cases, third and fourth kind - I remember reading about
: someone who had their van shot up in a swamp by some really pissed off
: black helicopter dudes) are unable to provide even the most minute
: trace of proof.  If you doubt their word, you're branded a co- NWO
: conpirator. . . one of "them".  Obviously, since you don't take them
: for face value, you are one of the "sheep", brainwashed by the NWO
: crowd.  How dare you demand proof?   But I bet when they get pulled
: over for a speeding ticket, they demand proof in court. . .oh, sorry,
: THAT's different.  
: 
: Why is it that  Jim-Bob Hillbilly can submit a VCR tape of the UFO he
: saw while taking his roadkill casserole to the trashcan out back, but
: these "upstanding" citizens can't even produce a polaroid of one of
: these black helicopters hovering over their vehicle making threatening
: gestures?   
: 
: I guess it must be due to the fact that they have a SEP field
: protecting the helicopter.
: 
: For those of you who are unfamiliar with the SEP Field Theory, to
: oversimplify, it is an electro-psychic field generated around an
: object.  This electro-psychic field invades the mind of anyone within
: sight of the object and affects the mind in such a way as to make the
: person believe that the object is "somebody else's problem" and,
: basically, ignore the object.  Because the mind automatically ignores
: the object, it is never seen, heard and cannot be remembered at a
: later time, even under hypnosis. The SEP Field can even be made to
: exclude certain people (with our without chips in their butts) so that
: they could fly over the most crowded mall and be only seen by one
: person, thereby making a visible and obvious threat BUT ONLY TO THAT
: ONE PERSON.  When that person points, and tries to draw attention to
: the object, the SEP field protects the object from other people.  Even
: those who are looking directly at it (devious bastards, aren't they),
: since the SEP Field works on the unconscious part of the brain and
: cannot be overriden by the conscious part.  Someone who is being
: affected by a SEP field has the object "filled" in with what the mind
: should see behind it (e.g., a cloudy sky or a city skyline).  
: 
: For example.  The UN/Bilderbergers/Alien/Tri-Lateral Commission/Rabid
: Boy Scout crowd decides that Jane Doe (names have been changed to
: protect the mentally challenged) needs to be taught a lesson.  At 0100
: (a.m.)  they turn on their HAARP project and beam special anti-SEP
: rays into her bedroom (they can shoot right through a window, you
: know).  This restructures the psychoperceptual relays in her brain so
: she will not be affected by an SEP field (the field can be varied,
: harmonically, so that different objects have different "frequencies"
: thereby allowing only one or two of, say, a dozen objects to be seen).
: Being the nefarious organization they are, they also have implanted a
: suggestion that Jane Doe go to the mall.  Once they know she's there
: (they follow her everyday, of course) they stage an overflight of a
: helicopter or two.  Jane Doe, having been prepared earlier for this
: event by the HAARP transmission, proceeds to have a conniption fit,
: screaming, pointing, jumping up and down when the mall is buzzed by
: this huge, black helicopter.  
: 
: She is further enraged when, as she points out to her fellow
: mall-travellers the buzzing, threatening helicopters, everyone just
: looks at her, then up to where she's pointing, then back at her again,
: with puzzled looks on their faces.
: 
: Everyone around her, having been properly affected by the SEP field
: see absolutely nothing except an obviously "demented" person who is
: stamping, screaming and pointing up at the sky like Chicken Little
: having a seizure.
: 
: Jane Doe, oblivious to the knowledge of the effects of the SEP
: field(s) on all the other people only gets further enraged by everyone
: looking at her as if she were crazy.  
: 
: Eventually one of the crowd calls the police about the "ranting,
: raving lunatic" and has her dragged off to jail/the funny farm.
: 
: The pilot of the black helicopter increases power and cyclic and goes
: off to do his next evil deed, smiling with the satisfaction of yet
: another job well done.
: 
: Eventually Jane Doe is released.  It's a perfect plan.  She tries to
: get someone to listen, she tries to provide proof, but since the SEP
: field denies her even that, she is written off as a kook, a nut.
: Slowly her sanity begins to slide, she even begins to doubt herself,
: finally doctoring some videotapes to lend herself some credibility.

Well, I HAVE seen little black helicopters buzzing around me.  I have also
seen a great many other things.  Early on I caught on to what the reaction
>from  others was going to be, and the reactions that were expected from
me, and I just decided to ignore the stupid things.  After all they never
try to hurt you directly (or at least they never did me) and since the only
thing that could hurt me was my reaction I just quit reacting.  Of course
it takes a lot of guts to know you see things when everyone tells you you
are wrong, it is very easy to go from there to slide into mindlessness.
Somehow I found a way to hang on.  They don't bother me so much
any more, I just kind of take them for granted when I see them... I haven't
seen a black helicopter in many many years.

David
: 
: Damn those little grey aliens and their super technology
: Geoffrey L. Hardin,
: (geoffh@abcs.com)
: 


From nanomius@netcom.com Fri Oct 18 10:03:47 PDT 1996
Article: 100509 of alt.conspiracy
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!noc.van.hookup.net!laslo.netnet.net!node2.frontiernet.net!news.texas.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!nanomius
From: nanomius@netcom.com (Albert Nanomius)
Subject: OK Bombing web page
Message-ID: 
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 19:11:10 GMT
Lines: 788
Sender: nanomius@netcom6.netcom.com


this page has been out of commission for some time but was
just reinstalled thanks to Tony Sgarlatti. please update
your links. thanks!!

==


                        OKLAHOMA BOMBING INVESTIGATION
                                       
   http://www.future.net/~thetruth/okbomb/okbomb-index.html
   first installed 7/4/95, last updated 4/9/96
   
   Many anomalies have been observed and noted by people tracking the
   Oklahoma bombing closely in cyberspace. Frustration and outrage at the
   mainstream media and the FBI abounds in online circles, because of a
   perception of shoddy investigation or actual active suppression of
   information, or even outright deception. Large discrepancies exist
   between witness accounts and expert opinion on one hand, and media
   coverage and FBI explanations on the other.
   
   Browsable indexes by hit statistics, archive date, file size, and
   archive name for this site are available.
   
   Special thanks to "The Truth (as I see it)" weekly cable program for
   providing the webspace.
     _________________________________________________________________
   
   
     * Trial Currents - judge, prosecution, grand jury
     * Miscellaneous Anomalies - blast effects, 2nd bomb?
     * Witness Discrepancies - John Doe #2, advance warning?
     * Heidelburg - dismissed grand juror
     * Partin - USAF General munitions expert
     * Gunderson - FBI munitions expert
     * Key - outraged state representative
     * Seismograms - geological measurements at T0
     * Skolnick - investigation of radiation etc.
     * Edye Smith - mother of children killed
     * von Trapp - supposed secret conspiracy information
     * Affadavits - another strange rumor
     * Outrage - outrage at FBI, BATF etc.
     * Offline Resources: Hall, Rappoport, Marrs - books and videotapes
     * Online Resources - web sites, mailing lists
     * How you can help - publicize site
       
   
     _________________________________________________________________
   
   
   Trial Currents
          
          The bombing trial will be another tremendous media event,
          probably ranking in public interest above the World Trade
          Center bombing but less than the OJ trial. The trial promises
          to be extremely complex and convoluted based on the huge
          numbers of witnesses, experts, and all the varying evidence.
          Many of the theories bouncing around on the Internet are very
          likely to be aired during the trial.
          
          + Nov 9: Attorney Patrick Ryan angrily denies reports that the
            government is hiding a videotape showing suspects getting out
            of the bomb truck. However it was apparently the first time
            the government revealed they had the videotape. Some data on
            how the prosecutors are restrained by "jurisdiction issues"
            related to the location of the Murrah building in including a
            full murder count.
            
          + Aug 14: Jon Roland insists that the federal government has no
            jurisdiction to prosecute McVeigh in a federal case.
            
          + Aug 14: Stephen Jones, McVeigh's defense lawyer, says that
            the government may have been warned up to 6 months prior to
            the bombing. Involvement by middle eastern and Arabic
            elements. 10 witnesses linking McVeigh with "Middle Eastern"
            persons, seen in the Ryder truck and elsewhere with McVeigh
            as reported by KFOR.
            
          + Aug 25: An Iraqi sues KFOR-TV claiming that they
            misimplicated him with OK bombing witness reports. The
            reporter stands by the story. Competing TV reporters called
            the story "unethical".
            
          + Aug 7: human leg clad in camouflage and wearing a boot found
            in rubble; but curious circumstances seem to surround its
            uncovery. McVeigh's lawyer suggested it was the leg of a
            bombing accomplice.
            
          + Aug 1: McVeigh's sister "cuts a deal" with the FBI to testify
            against her brother.
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Miscellaneous Anomalies
          
          Many miscellaneous anomalies and discrepancies arose in FBI
          reports vs. what people were hearing about first- and
          second-hand over the internet. These are some of the laundry
          lists. (Unfortunately many people interlace their
          anti-government conspiracy theories with the discrepancy lists,
          taking the supposed link between the two as self-evident.)
          These articles tend to focus on the USGS seismological data,
          the physical artifacts of the blast scene, conflicting aspects
          of the FBI scenario reported in the media, particularly the
          correlation of the actual size and configuration of the
          explosion with the FBI explanation.
          
          + Charles Zeps went back to the original transcripts after the
            bombing that referred to a FBI confirmation of a second bomb
            found in the east side within the Murray building. A KFOR
            female reporter said over CNN, "They're trying to get the
            bomb defused right now. ... They're telling people that this
            is something to take very seriously, and not to slip forward
            to get a look at this, because this thing could definitely go
            off."
            
          + A suspicious Voss comments on some OGS data mentioning Holzer
            ("apparently the principal investigator") and gives a
            commentary on the known data such as the lack of ammonium
            nitrate reside and witness accounts, the PDTN vs. PETN
            discrepancy, etc.
            
          + A debate between Roger Voss and Griff Palmer on some of the
            discrepancies such as the Gunderson theories, the ANFO
            "resultants" supposedly seen by at least one witness
            ("burning eyes, heavy dust, and choking lungs"), etc. Quotes
            the New American article. Palmer quotes Dr. Ray Brown as
            saying that he has a difference of opinion with the official
            USGS press release asserting only one bomb, which
            misrepresented the OGS as coming to the same conclusion.
            
          + A potpourri of Voss's posts generally asserting a cocktail
            bomb i.e. a mixture of two different explosives, consistent
            with the seismology findings. Also, the problems of the
            "booster explosive" trigger, the ANFO as a "cover bomb" for
            C4, the modifications of the bomb size by authorities, etc.
            
          + The Imanyuel report on the bombing (secretary, Alameda
            Country Free Militia). Actually theorizes 6 different bombs.
            Significance of dimmed lights before the bomb, suppression
            and coverups by the military, FBI , and BATF, retouching of
            photos by the government, "people were told that taking
            souvenirs would result in arrest", aerial flight photographs
            prohibited, etc.
            
          + An early conspirational overview of some of the anomalies
            observed by keen online followers, particularly on the
            McVeigh angles, by Bob Glantz.
            
          + Michael Rivero has some acoustical analysis on his site he
            says shows a dual-bomb blast is "obvious".
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Witness Discrepancies
          
          A tremendous amount of discrepancy in witness reports
          surrounded the bombing. Some of this is due to the way that
          anyone can post reports on the Internet. These conflicting
          views of the bombing were widely disseminated on the Internet
          during the immediate aftermath of the bombing. Based on these
          articles it seems clear that the FBI is deliberately ignoring
          many supposed witness accounts. Unfortunately anonymous witness
          accounts are difficult to verify and the greatest potential for
          a disinformation or obfuscation campaign could be made through
          them.
          
          KPOC-TV in Oklahoma mounted its own investigation because of
          dissatisfaction with FBI reports and is a source of a lot of
          Internet attention. Much of the KPOC investigations tended to
          focus on witness discrepancies with the official FBI scenario.
          
          Two themes that did seem to emerge in some of the witness
          accounts, not addressed by the FBI or the mainstream media,
          were reports of advance warning to some building employees,
          including a bomb squad visiting the building the morning of the
          blast at about 7:30, and a link to Middle-Eastern person(s)
          seen around McVeigh shortly prior and subsequent to the blast.
          There are multiple claims the FBI is "aware of" but not talking
          to various witnesses, particularly those implicating Middle
          Eastern elements. (Based on a press conference, McVeigh's
          lawyer is apparently going to pursue the "Middle Eastern
          persons were involved" thread.)
          
          + Dec 11: New American newspaper and reporter William Jasper
            did an outstanding and thorough job of summarizing all the
            best contradictory witness evidence. Information on prior
            warning to ATF agents, "lies and cover up", outright lie by
            ATF agent Martz on the "McCauley elevator story" reported on
            CNN by John Magaw, information on a bomb squad on the scene,
            advance warning to the OK fire department denied by Chief
            Gaines, Islamic informant, etc.
            
          + Aug 21: Brian Redmond of Conspiracy Nation gives an update
            based mostly on radio interview with independent investigator
            Pat Breilly. Arabs, FBI ignores sources, "something really
            wrong with the FBI's investigation", bomb squad, squad denies
            they were present, severed leg, "inside job", Gunderson
            placed under "gag order", Waco records removed from building,
            two distinct explosions, option BATF attendance, NBC news
            reporting the bomb as being "more serious and dangerous
            chemistry than orginally thought", possibly using Hydrazine
            instead of fuel oil, McVeigh as possible BATF informant or at
            least known to the BATF prior to the incident.
            
          + Miscellaneous data from Charles Zeps: witnesses say BATF
            agents told them they got a "serious" bomb threat and that
            attendance on April 19th was "optional" (see also the Edye
            Smith section). John Doe II/III, vehicles involved. McVeigh a
            BATF informant? Arab connections on which "the grand jury has
            seen no information". Norma Smith witnessed bomb squad in
            front of building at 7:45.
            
          + Conspiracy Nation reports on KPOC findings about an APB that
            was issued but supposedly later denied by "authorities".
            Witness reports of a brown Ford pickup, discrepancies in the
            arrest report and timings, the conflicting reports on ATF
            deaths, the seismograms, earlier bomb reports, Debra von
            Trapp, etc. Also a later report on the multitude of John Doe
            #2 reports, KPOC vs. KFOR, Art Bell show, the brown pickup
            truck, John Doe "cover story", etc.
            
          + Two reports on KPOC-TV findings, the television station
            mounting its own independent investigation with former FBI
            employees. Another arrest taken away by military chopper,
            John Doe #2 a "known party under surveillance", BATF agents
            in building discrepancy, and McVeigh needing directions from
            bystanders at 3AM prior to the bombing.
            
          + Supposed anonymous policeman reports that the surveillance
            video caught a UPS truck, not a Ryder truck, and that ATF had
            an infiltrator working with McVeigh, planned interception
            gone awry because of timing.
            
          + William Cooper, leader of a militia, puts his own spin on the
            whole story with this long essay first drawing parallels to
            the FBI involvement in the World Trade Center bombing.
            Finally in the middle he talks about the discrepancies: two
            columns of black smoke, witness references to two blasts,
            "undetonated plastic explosives and a rocket launcher found
            on the scene by the first rescue workers", reports of a
            second bomb on the radio, firemen referring to the second
            bomb as "several colored cans of fulminate of mercury" (much
            of all this later denied by the FBI), differences in the
            McVeigh arrest stories, the seismic records, the Clinton
            bodyguard death, etc.
            
          + A militia Intelligence Service report shortly following the
            bombing: black helicopter, two explosions, bright light,
            siesmograph evidence, fulminate of mercury cans, "mind
            control of victims", McVeigh's microchip implant, etc.
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Heidelburg
          
          A juror on the McVeigh grand jury named Hoppy Heidelberg
          offended the judge by talking to the New American how he felt
          that the prosecutors were intentionally avoiding prosecuting
          one individual identified by numerous witnesses (the infamous
          "John Doe No. 2"), and that they had prior knowledge of the
          bombing because the individual was an informant.
          
          + An excellent interview of Heidelberg by bombing investigator
            and author Rappoport on December 14th for Media Bypass
            magazine. Heidelberg insists the grand jury was hampered from
            a full investigation by the prosecutor and expands on his
            view that John Doe #2 might be a government agent or
            "handler" for McVeigh. Fortier testimony pressure. Videotapes
            not shown to jury. Witness intimidation by FBI. FBI
            prosecution as "dog and pony show". McVeigh as patsy.
            
          + Nov 27: The New American story by William Jasper gives the
            full story about Heidelberg's accusations including
            heavy-handed prosecutorial conduct such as confiscating his
            notes. Attempts to discredit Heidelburg as a "paranoid
            right-wing extremist". Snippets on Rep. Key, also Wilburn: "I
            have observed the most obvious and blatant attempt by the
            justice system, specifically the U.S. Attorney's office and
            the Federal Bureau of Investigation, to deceive not only the
            public but the grand jurors as to the truth of the events and
            perpetrators regarding the bombing." Prior knowledge angle,
            bomb squad involvement, etc.
            
          + Oct 19: AP story on a grand juror who leaked trial details to
            Media Bypass and offended the judge and was apparently later
            dismissed. The judge threatened contempt-of-court charges.
            The juror believed the prosecutors were withholding
            information about another suspect not charged.
            
          + Nov 1: Another AP story identifies the juror as Hoppy
            Heidelberg, who believes the suspect was "either a government
            agent or government informant" and that officials "had prior
            knowledge of the bombing and that's what they can't afford to
            have come out."
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Partin
          
          Partin is a retired Brigadier General from the USAF who has
          spent 25 years in research, design, development, test, and
          management of weapons development and winner of a Distinguished
          Service medal.
          
          + pointer to an Aug. 7 New American article on Partin's claims
            in detail, with color photos and another article dissecting
            the seismic data.
            
          + May 16 Conspiracy nation excerpts Spotlight article profiling
            Gunderson's case suggesting FBI is lying. Seismographic
            evidence, PETN vs. PDTN, insider supposeldy confirms report,
            "John Doe #2 vaporized by design". insider, inside "drop and
            shear" charge, lack of ammonium nitrate evidence, "Gunderson
            100% right".
            
            
          + May 21 Partin letter faxed to various senators, a technical
            analysis of the effects of the bomb on all the building
            columns. Compares the bombing effects with the World Trade
            Center bombing. Discrepancies in the column destructions
            (i.e. some columns farther from the bomb more damaged than
            those closer). Urged the building be examined closely before
            demolished.
            
          + June 26 New American article on Partin's credentials and
            analysis, largely based on the Partin fax. Agreement by other
            explosives experts Raubach and Gronning. Redyke disagreed. No
            references to lack of fertilizer residue.
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Gunderson
          
          Gunderson is an ex-FBI employee with other outstanding
          credentials who sent letters to senators and various online
          outlets shortly after the bombing stating that the bomb could
          not have been based on ammonium nitrate fertilizer. He offered
          alternative bomb scenarios. One of his major claims is that a
          bomb had to be placed inside the building to shear the concrete
          columns. Tending to support this is the claim in many places
          that no ammonium nitrate residue was found at the site and that
          it would be very difficult if not impossible for a fertilizer
          bomb to explode leaving no residue.
          
          + Gunderson report on seismogram interpretations, the
            electro-hydrodynamic gaseous fuel device claims by
            Riconosciuto, the supposed NSA/CIA connections to
            Riconosciuto, checklist disproof of all the "fertilizer bomb"
            claims.
            
          + Transcript of a May 8th Radio Free America interview with a
            Gunderson correspondent. Supposedly Gunderson reported an FBI
            agent told him a duplex charge was used in the bombing, not a
            fertilizer bomb. The PDTN vs. PETN discrepancy. An inside
            charge in the building.
            
          + Two-part Gunderson interview in Conspiracy Nation talking
            about how his theory fits in with the seismogram findings,
            the lack of "breisance" from the ammonium nitrate charge, the
            evidence for an "electro-hydrodynamic gaseous fuel device"
            i.e. a barometric bomb ("Daisy Cutter"), etc. Gunderson
            however seems to mix up the time difference in the seismogram
            readings, saying it was "ten milliseconds".
            
          + a baffled Internet reader remarks on the confusion in
            Gunderson posts, in which first name is given as Ken or Ted,
            the length of experience in the FBI, and the spelling of his
            name. Apparently "Gundersen" spelling was due to someone who
            mistranscribed a radio report and was working phonetically.
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Key
          
          Oklahoma state representative Charles Key has publicly,
          repeatedly questioned the official bombing investigation and
          findings.
          
          + Sept 15: Charles Key says that he has obtained a copy of a
            video tape showing "ordinance" being removed from the ATF
            ordinance room in the Murrah Building which supposedly
            contradicts a statement by the ATF. Information on "the pit"
            beneath the building.
            
          + Aug 11th: Charles Key believes the OK investigation entails
            an "obstruction of justice [by the government] so blatant
            that it's been shocking to me. There's some reason they're
            covering this up." Supposed media blackout, witness
            discrepancies, McVeigh's attorney, Key's upcoming video.
            
          + June 28th: Charles Key calls for an independent state
            investigation into the bombing: "I am convinced that the
            government is not being forthright about the kind of bomb(s),
            the number of explosions, the placement of the explosives and
            other crucial aspects of the April 19th bombing." "Those who
            are challenging the current bombing explanation are highly
            credible and have impeccable credentials regarding
            explosives, munitions and covert intelligence."
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Seismograms
          
          Enormous conspiracy speculation mileage was generated by the
          seismogram records associated with the bomb blasts. The
          Oklahoma Geographical Society records two distinct seismic
          blips separated by 10 seconds approximately 20 miles from the
          blast. Many have pointed to this as evidence of two blasts. The
          USGS. (apparently without close consultation with OGS) actually
          issued a press release stating the evidence suggested a single
          bomb, although various credible scientists are in disagreement.
          Many different scientists were commenting on the data at
          different times with opinions far from unanimous, leading to a
          confusing picture. Some scientists apparently felt beseiged by
          inquirers and conspiracy theorists.
          
          Some confusion arose in the timing of the bombs: Gunderson said
          his alternate bomb model involved a 10 millisecond explosion
          difference. It is not clear that separate blasts would have
          arrived at the seismogram separated by the same 10
          milliseconds. One speculator below suggested that different
          bomb type explosions (such as in the "cocktail" theory advanced
          by Voss et.al.) might travel at different rates to the
          destination seismogram. In any case the theory that the second
          wave was due to a building collapse seemed to be debunked when
          later seismograms taken at the demolition did not record
          similar readings. There does not seem to be a consensus on
          whether the OGS data supports the theory of one or two bombs,
          because it is possible one bomb could have resulted in two
          peaks due to differences in the differing velocities of
          "survace vs. p-waves".
          
          + New American paper reports that the seismic controversy
            continues after a scientific conference on the bombing. Brown
            suggests more than one bomb and Holzer suggests one. Brown
            indicates FBI confiscated seismograms and he suggests
            critical parts were redacted before their release.
            
          + Aug 17: David Deming, assistant professor of geology and
            geophysics at the University of Oklahoma at Norman, tries to
            clear up what is known vs. speculative about the OGS seismic
            data. "I have been distressed to see reports that the USGS
            and the OGS have dismissed ... the seismograms." Ray Brown's
            report concluding "two contiguous seismic episodes". USGS
            findings as "unsupported by data or analysis". Comparison of
            seismicity data of complete building collapse on May 23 vs.
            bomb detonation on April 19. "I don't see how a single truck
            bomb could lead to [the] seismic activity on April 19." "From
            what we understand at the present time it appears to be
            difficult to explain the seismic data with a single blast."
            
          + In American Reporter article by Bill Johnson, Mankin
            announces on Aug. 10 through a press report that "we feel
            very comfortable in saying that the second shock was from the
            same occurrence that caused the first", stating that all
            seismographic data seemed to indicate a single explosion, but
            that the energy of the latter 5 seconds of 10 seconds cannot
            yet be accounted for. Several other paragraphs devoted to the
            "conspiracy theories": Keating involvement, dual
            single-position photograph, the UPS truck photo, etc.
            
          + Here's one copy of the seismogram graphic circulating all
            over cyberspace.
            
          + Early post by Linda Thompson apparently quoting Gunderson who
            seized on the OGS readings as evidence for his theory: "one
            big cover up ... an incident to enact further restrictive
            legislation ... New World Order at its best". Also, a rumor
            that "the government contacted the lab and told them they
            didn't know what they were talking about, there were not two
            detonations".
            
          + A New American overview of the seismogram record and Brown's
            analysis with agreement by Aki. Inconsistent witness reports,
            Lt. Col. Wallace, who thought it sounded like a "succession
            of bombs", a short reference to Partin's conclusions. Also, a
            short summary of the article and the five Brown theories.
            
          + May 25 report by Brown of the OGS analyzing the seismogram
            implications, enumerating the principle hypothetical
            explanations, and concluding it supports the theory of "two
            events" although "the study of the signals requires more
            thought".
            
          + June 1995 Media Bypass story of a witness account (a VietNam
            explosives veteran) stating there were two blasts, the second
            blowing out the windows. Also a followup interview with Watt
            by G.Palmer of the Oklahoman on the timing (about a half
            second to a second and a half) and whether it was a
            fertilizer bomb ("he has no trouble believing it").
            
          + Examples of the independent investigation by online readers.
            Early April 28 query to Luza by an Internet reader Rik
            Pierce. A May 23 report by G.Palmer on Mankin of OGS, who
            talked about the results of a second seismology reading after
            the building was demolished that in his opinion "puts to rest
            the hypothesis that the second wave train on April 19 was the
            result of the impact of the falling structure." Christopher
            Dunn exhibits the prerequisite paranoia over what most would
            consider honest disagreement in opinion and insinuates Luza
            lied to him based on Lawson's opinion (although interestingly
            the anecdote implies that the scientists were aware of the
            militia spin on their data and may have felt strong pressure
            to reach certain "uncontroversial" conclusions).
            
          + June 3 press release by USGS quoting Holzer as concluding the
            dual seismogram waves were simply surface and ground waves
            (the former travelling slightly above the ground through the
            earth surface, the latter travelling through the ground
            itself) originating from a single blast, and quoting Mankin
            as endorsing the results, and some followup reaction by
            another scientist giving a second opinion.
            
          + David Deming a Ph.D geophysicist offers his own opinion on
            the seismogram, that the data definitely support multiple
            hypotheses. It is interesting however in that it suggests
            that different wave origination phenomena may lead to
            different wave rates through the ground. This could either
            support a single bomb creating two different wave trains or
            two explosions. In any case it does appear that there are
            some differences in wave velocities because seemingly no
            witnesse reported a blast differential of 10 seconds at the
            origination. The poster Nuri also makes the basic point,
            often unaddressed by the conspiracy theorists, that merely
            because the government is hiding or suppressing information,
            while highly suspicious, does not imply it was involved in
            the blast.
            
          + A report that the regular posting of OGS gopher data
            pertaining to the blast initially had initally been delayed.
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Skolnick
          
          Strange rumors of possible radioactivity near the blast site
          and a supposed coverup are being investigated by Sherman
          Skolnick. Some supposed evidence is sickness in dogs, rumors of
          geiger counter measurements the day of the blast, sickness or
          cancers in rescue workers, the quick demolition and encasement
          of the site in concrete, etc. Skolnick has also focused on
          Lawrence Myers as a possible intelligence agent infiltrating
          Media Bypass magazine.
          
          + Skolnick investigates claims that the government was
            surveilling McVeigh and that a double agent was involved in
            the bombing. BATF surveillance, German connection, Iraqi
            intelligence, copier paper package subterfuge, Myers "outing"
            a juror, McVeigh's supposed role, Von Trapp claims.
            
          + Skolnick claims that the lungs of a rescuer dog were found to
            be highly radioactive. Rescuers as sick or dying from
            possible "deadly dose of radiation". Geiger counter
            measurements, "tritium". No attribution of sources. Skolnick
            discusses his sources and some other speculation in a
            followup article.
            
          + In a mindboggling new angle, Sherman Skolnick in Conspiracy
            Nation suggests the bomb was radioactive based on information
            supplied by a remarkable character Riconosciuto who claims to
            have invented it. Supposed massive radioactivity measured,
            rescuers possibly sick from "strange diseases from
            radioactivity", demolition and encasement of the building to
            contain "long-lasting radioactivity".
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Edye Smith
          
          Edye Smith, and IRS employee, lost two young children in the
          blast. She was featured in a CNN interview in which she said
          that she had been told to keep her mouth shut when asked about
          the whereabouts of BATF agents after the blast, and that she
          had heard rumors some had been given a "choice" to go to work.
          
          + Jan 1: an Edye Smith interview was cancelled by CNN under
            seemingly suspicious circumstances.
            
          + Edye Smith said during a live CNN interview that all the BATF
            agents were missing. Conflicting accounts of how many BATF
            agents were in the building and that they were "debriefed"
            afterwards. Discrepancy in claims of underground area in the
            Murrah building. Diverted mail. Bomb squad visited the
            building at 730am?
            
          + Smith reports an ATF agent told her he was given a choice not
            to go to work (although no mention of advance warning of a
            bomb threat here). Similar reports by KWTV and a
            "investigator" Malisa Moore.
            
          + In a CNN interview, Edye Smith, one of the victims' parents,
            suggests that the ATF has asked her to "keep her mouth shut"
            about her questions, such as whether any ATF employees were
            killed. "They had an option to not go to work that day."
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Von Trapp
          
          Some of the most incredible claims come from Debra Von Trapp in
          Conspiracy Nation, who claims the bombing was a Japanese
          government retaliation for trade tensions, and that it was
          funded through MCA Universal.
          
          + von Trapp's first press release: claims she predicted a
            terrorist attack on the US government by Japanese, in
            retaliation for US government attack on the Japanese subway
            system. MCA/Universal and director Patti Jackson involvement,
            U.S. intelligence Goetzman, Thomas, and Cofield involved in
            double agent spying on Clinton for Japan, bugged computer
            equipment, trade tensions, "undeclared war" against Japan.
            
          + Skolnick via Conspiracy Nation on von Trapp's claims: secret
            service agent who helped Japanese infiltration into
            Whitehouse killed in blast. Goetzman supposedly involved in
            Vince Foster assassination. Part II: Xerox involved in
            selling disk drives to the KGB, Aldrich Ames connections,
            Lear Jet crash prior to the OK bombing, Special Ops team from
            Air Force base in Alabama.
            
            Von Trapp on her Nightline interview and how it was biased.
            Trapp claims that a Clinton bodyguard was killed in the
            building as symbolic revenge, and that the downing of a
            military plane was related. Refers to NBC misreporting of
            Edye Smith's objections via tape splicing, and the victims
            being "empaneled" and given subpoena power. How to buy her
            tape.
            
          + Linda Thompson joins the melee by stating that the FBI
            threatened her over some information she had that "an FBI
            employee was working for Japan and spying on the Whitehouse
            and the OK bombing was a retaliatory connection". This
            appears to be related to the von Trapp thesis, if not
            originating from von Trapp directly. But later she totally
            backpedalled from the Japanese angle, chalking even Gunderson
            up as an agent provocateur.
            
          + Story that two "top-ranking" Michigan milita leaders Olson
            and Southwell resigned over their claims that the Japanese
            government was involved, again apparently based on the Trapp
            information.
            
          + Supposed glitch with the Von Trapp story based on the
            identity of Wes Thomas.
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Affadavits
          
          Rumors abounded that the OK bombing was an "inside job".
          Fueling this are persistent reports that internal U.S.
          government participants in the bombing had been horrified at
          the results (not knowing that children would be killed), later
          balked in horror, and signed affadavits that they were part of
          the plot.
          
          + Two justice department officials supposedly signed affadavits
            stating that they were part of a "committee of 10" who
            planned the bombing at an earlier time, "as a scare tactic to
            procure sympathy, money and power for government agencies".
            They and their families supposedly went into hiding and may
            fax the affadavits to "200 million recipients" if a "high
            ranking government official does not launch a proper course
            of action". The report came via a Boswell radio show, quoting
            CIA veteran James black and assistant Ron Jackson as having
            the affadavits in their possession. Also in that article a
            reference to a secret service agent overheard a conversation
            about the bomb in the White house prior to the blast, and the
            angle that the Waco documents were destroyed in the blast,
            supposedly intentionally stymying Congressional
            investigations later in the summer. Another report by the
            "Phoenix Foundation" claimed to have the affadavits as well
            and reasserts the supposed unintentional detonation time.
            
          + This excerpt reported came from a fax circulating
            approximately May 18th, with all names whited out but
            supposedly from a Leutenant General claiming to have been
            involved in a group to analyze a terrorist threat made by
            Mossad originating from Syria or Italy. He is not clear but
            he seems to be implicating the government.
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Outrage
          
          Many aspects of the bombing incited enormous outrage. The most
          obvious was the fact that someone had targeted "innocent
          children". But outrage mounted over followup reports about how
          the bombing was being investigated. Reports abounded that the
          BATF and FBI were suppressing evidence and intimidating
          witnesses and using heavy security supposedly to prevent
          independent inquiries into the bombing. There is controversy
          over whether the BATF lost any employees (reports that no BATF
          employees were in the building aroused much suspicion). The
          quick destruction apparently without thorough investigation of
          the building was seen as suspicious by many. The seeming media
          disinterest and mishandling is a continual source of ranting.
          
          + July 24th: editorial by Clark Mathews of the Spotlight on
            questionable criminal investigation techniques of the FBI in
            tracing the bombing, such as a sophisticated search through
            telephone records.
            
          + On June 15, OK victims delivered a petition calling for a
            Senate investigation into the bombing. Several credible
            accounts pointing to the two-bomb theory. Partin and Cohen
            (inventor of the neutron bomb) deny the government accounts.
            
          + Red Cross and Salvation Army are accused of "looting" mail
            for the checks addressed to OK bomb victims, on the "For The
            People Organization"'s video tape.
            
          + Reports and rumors persisted that the BATF held up the
            survivor rescue as they scrambled to remove documents from
            the building.
            
          + Jun 29: America Online yanks the Oklahoma Bombing message
            boards and files for unknown reasons.
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Offline Resources: Hall, Rappoport, Marrs
          
          Various alternative explanations of the bombing are slowly
          emerging. David Hall is an independent investigator and the
          producer of a video called "The Bomb" and has pursued many of
          the leads generally not considered by the mainstream media or
          the FBI. Rappoport is an investigative journalist who has
          looked into AIDS and US Government mind control experiments.
          
          + On Radio Free America, Hall said that the FBI may have been
            given "administrative leave" for April 19th. Hall has
            interviewed a confidential government informant who may have
            given 6 months advance notice to the government of the
            bombing.
            
          + Rappoport has a book out called Oklahoma Bombing: the
            Suppressed Truth. "Federal police are being forced to
            invent a fantasy. The truck Bomb didn't cause the real damage
            to the Federal Building." This message was reprinted in
            Conspiracy Nation. Also, a bit more information on the book
            contents which seem largely coincident with coverage on this
            web page. Rappoport gave more information in a radio
            interview in which he says the truck bomb not being wholly
            responsible is an "unassailable fact". John Doe #2, sting
            operation, Hoppy Heidelberg, bombing foreknowledge, etc.
            
          + Texe Marrs offers a video that "presents compelling evidence
            that the FBI, BATF, CIA, and other law enforcement
            authorities had the motive, the capability, and the occult
            frame of mind necessary to orchestrate the slaughter."
            
   
            __________________________________________________________
          
   Online Resources
          
          + Yahoo Oklahoma bombing page
          + Andy Somer's Oklahoma bombing page
          + message introducing a video produced by Tony Sgarlatti,
            "Anguish in Oklahoma City"
          + McVeigh, Nichols, Fortier indictments and other information
            on the Oklahoma station KWTV's web site.
          + Oklahoma bombing mailing list maintained by Aaron Dickey
            .
          + Oklahoma bombing Mailing list archives maintained by "Justin
            L."
          + Unfortunately there is no particularly relevant newsgroup but
            articles and discussions sometimes appear in alt.conspiracy.
-- 

~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
/\. |\| /\ |\| () |\/| | |/ _/~                     nanomius@netcom.com
A l b e r t   N a n o m i u s            http://www.newciv.org/~albert/


From johnlf@europa.com Fri Oct 18 10:03:53 PDT 1996
Article: 100645 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!noc.van.hookup.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.bc.net!unixg.ubc.ca!nntp.cs.ubc.ca!psgrain!news.rain.net!europa207.europa.com
From: John Fisher 
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy
Subject: CONSPIRACY NATION ARCHIVE
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 22:13:14 -0700
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CONSPIRACY NATION ARCHIVE


http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-75 Skolnick on BATF
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-76 Skolnick on OKC Bombing [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-77 CN in Time Magazine
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-78 Skolnick on OKC Bombing [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-79 OKC Bombing [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-80 Skolnick on OKC Bombing [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-81 Waco
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-82 Skolnick on Clinton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-83 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-84 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-85 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-86 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-87 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-88 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-89 Skolnick Interviews Von Trapp
[P-7]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-90 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-91 Skolnick on Whitewater
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-92 Skolnick on NWO [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-93 Skolnick on NWO [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-94 Skolnick on NWO [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-95 Skolnick on Swiss Bank Accounts
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-96 Skolnick on Swiss Bank Accounts
[P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-97 Skolnick on Janet Reno
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-98 Skolnick on Skolnick
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn4-99 Washington Times: Whitewater
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-01 Skolnick on Starr, etc. [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-02 Skolnick on Starr, etc. [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-03 Project Censored [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-04 Project Censored [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-05 Skolnick on Chicago Corruption
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-06 Skolnick on Japanese Spying
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-07 Penthouse Mena Story
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-08 Report From Iron Mountain
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-09 Skolnick on Whitewater [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-10 Skolnick on Whitewater [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-11 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-12 Great American Fortunes [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-13 Great American Fortunes [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-14 Great American Fortunes [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-19 Skolnick Interviews Povlovich
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-20 RFA:OKC Bombing [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-21 RFA:OKC Bombing [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-22 RFA:OKC Bombing [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-23 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-24 Globalization of Capital
Production [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-25 Globalization of Capital
Production [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-26 Skolnick on Whitewater
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-27 Globalization of Capital
Production [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-28 Militia Testimony 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-29 Skolnick on Clinton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-30 Skolnick on rogue grand jury
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-31 Reed Irvine on Foster
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-32 Stephen Jones Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-33 Von Trapp Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-34 Von Trapp Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-35 Von Trapp Interview [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-36 Unabomber
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-37 Edye Smith
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-38 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-39 Skolnick on Foster Murder [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-40 Skolnick on Foster Murder [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-41 Skolnick on Andreuccetti-Grabbe
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-42 Grabbe [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-43 Skolnick on Foster Murder [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-44 Grabbe [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-45 Skolnick on Grabbe/Norman [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-46 Skolnick on Grabbe/Norman [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-47 Skolnick on Grabbe/Norman [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-48 Grabbe [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-49 Vince Foster Murder
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-50 Von Trapp Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-51 Von Trapp Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-52 Von Trapp Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-53 Grabbe [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-54 Skolnick on Pollard and Foster
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-55 Skolnick on Pollard and Foster
[P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-56 AEP Responds
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-57 Larry Nichols
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-58 Ebola
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-59 Foster Files
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-60 Skolnick on Chinese Secret
Police
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-61 Skolnick on BATF
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-62 Skolnick on Wallace Shooting
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-63 Troy Underhill Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-64 Troy Underhill Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-65 Ryder Truck Bomb
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-66 Troy Underhill Interview [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-67 Troy Underhill Interview [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-68 Troy Underhill Interview [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-69 Troy Underhill Interview [P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-70 Michael Aquino
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-71 Kiri Jewell Lies
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-72 James Norman Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-73 James Norman Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-74 Kennedy Debate
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-75 Skolnick on Mena
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-76 Jean Lewis
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-77 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-78 Skolnick on Bribes
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-79 Subliminal Cartoons
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-80 Skolnick on William Hogan [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-81 Edye Smith
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-82 Skolnick on Norman [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-83 Skolnick on Norman [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-84 Skolnick on Grabbe [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-85 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-86 Skolnick on Grabbe [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-87 Skolnick on William Hogan [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-88 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-89 Skolnick on Mel Reynolds
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-90 Skolnick on Sugarman
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-91 Mel Reynolds
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-92 Randy Weaver [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-93 Randy Weaver [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-94 Korean MIA's
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-95 OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-96 Ostrovsky Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-97 Skolnick Index
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-98 McClendon Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn5-99 Terry Cook
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-01 Grabbe Index
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-02 Klunk Letter
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-03 The Money Trail [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-04 The Money Trail [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-05 Wiencek Affidavit
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-06 Rothstein Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-07 Rothstein Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-08 Skolnick on Powell
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-09 Unabomber
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-10 Rothstein Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-11 WWW Conspiracy Sites
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-12 Rothstein Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-13 Skolnick on OJ [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-14 Linda Thompson
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-15 Skolnick's Book List
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-16 C.N's Book List
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-17 Mrs. Herman
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-18 Rothstein Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-19 OJ Simpson
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-20 D.C. Dave
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-21 Skolnick on OJ [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-22 Rooney on OJ
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-23 Skolnick on OJ [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-24 Skolnick on OJ [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-25 Von Trapp Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-26 Skolnick on OJ [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-27 Skolnick on OJ [P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-28 McVeigh's Lawyer
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-29 Prairienet
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-30 Rothstein Interview
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-31 Skolnick on OJ [P-7]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-32 Skolnick on OJ [P-8]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-33 Skolnick Sues A.D.R.C.
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-34 Civil Search Warrants
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-35 Forged Suicide Note
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-36 Skolnick on OJ [P-9]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-37 Drugs and Prisons
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-38 Skolnick on Drugs
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-39 Rep. Burton on 60 minutes
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-40 Rep. Horn on Bosnia
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-41 Federal Internet Surveillance
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-42 HR Expert Reginald Alton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-43 Witness Patrick Knowlton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-44 Skolnick on OJ [P-10]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-45 Skolnick on Rabin Assassination
[P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-46 Skolnick on Rabin Assassination
[P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-47 J. Edgar Hoover
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-48 Skolnick on Judge Ito
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-49 Government Shutdown
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-51 The Bribery List
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-52 Grabbe Index
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-53 The Davidian Massacre
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-54 Oil Crisis: Operation Interlink
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-55 Skolnick on OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-56 Travelgate
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-57 Skolnick on BCCI, Rabin
Assassination
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-58 Gold Crunch
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-59 Militia Testimony
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-60 Beatle's Backwards Masking
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-61 Skolnick on Chicago Corruption
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-62 October Surprise
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-63 Senate Retirement Epidemic
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-64 CN News
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-65 Vatican Money Laundering
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-66 Rep. Dornan on Bosnia
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-67 International Corruption
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-68 Skolnick on International
Corruption 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-69 Lockerbie cover-up [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-70 Lockerbie cover-up [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-71 Bosnian Civil War
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-72 CN's National Security Reading
List
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-73 St. Peter's Banker
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-74 Chicago Crime
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-75 The Empire of 'The City' [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-76 Skolnick on OKC Bombing
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-77 Skolnick on Various Scandals
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-78 DC Dave on suicide
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-79 The Empire of 'The City' [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-80 The Empire of 'The City' [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-81 NAFTA and The Mexican Crisis
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-82 October Surprise: The Ladies'
Room Files
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-83 Skolnick on Rabin Assassination
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-84 Leah Rabin and The Pope
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-85 The Naked Man
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-86 Oliver Stone's "Nixon"
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-87 Skolnick Silences Skeptics
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-88 Grabbe [P-36]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-89 Where's The Nazi Gold?
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-90 Marilyn, Kennedy and The Mob
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-91 Skolnick on Clinton vs. Congress
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-92 Bloodshed in The Balkans
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-93 Haitian Rebels Massacred 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-94 1904 Headlines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-95 Hillary's Week 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-96 1904 Headlines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-97 The Buying of The President 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-98 RFA on OKC Bombing 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn6-99 1925 Headlines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-01 1925 Headlines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-02 The Norman Thesis [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-03 The Norman Thesis [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-04 The Norman Thesis [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-05 The Norman Thesis [P-4] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-06 House Panel Looks at Mena 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-07 Bovine Growth Hormone 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-08 Hoppy Heidelberg Interview 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-09 CN Editor Whines 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-10 Von Trapp Faxes Starr 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-11 DC Dave's Poetry 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-12 CN Subscriber Info 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-13 BCCI List 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-14 Reporters Fear of Mena 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-15 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-16 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-17 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-18 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-4] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-19 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-5] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-20 Skolnick on Bosnia- [P-6] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-21 Waco Justice 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-22 Tsar Nicholas II's Burial 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-23 Web Site on Banned AIDS Book 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-24 AIDS Inc. [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-25 AIDS Inc. [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-26 Operation Silver Shovel 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-27 Major Toxic Dumping Scandals 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-28 Hotel Workers' Union 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-29 Mafia Games 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-30 Mobsters Got Into The Unions
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-31 AIDS Inc. [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-32 Oklahoma Bombing And The Media 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-33 AIDS Inc. [P-4] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-34 AIDS Inc. [P-5] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-35 AIDS Inc. [P-6] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-36 AIDS Inc. [P-7] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-37 The Oklahoma Bombing/Story of a
Magazine 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-38 Radio Havana 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-39 Did CFR Approve Cuban Downing? 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-40 The Oklahoma
Bombings/Radioactive Cover-Up 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-41 Gulf War Syndrome [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-42 Gulf War Syndrome [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-43 Gulf War Syndrome [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-44 U.S. Complicity in the Oklahoma
Bombings 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-45 Corroboration of BCCI Bribe List 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-46 Recent OKC Bombing Speculation 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-47 Louis Farrakhan [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-48 Louis Farrakhan [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-49 Louis Farrakhan [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-50 Louis Farrakhan [P-4] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-51 News Round-Up -- 03/24/96 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-52 Ralph Nader [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-53 Ralph Nader [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-54 Skolnick on aspartame 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-56 Compromised 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-57 Ron Brown: They Can't Indict Him
Now 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-58 Sabotage? The Crash of Ron
Brown's Plane 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-59 Arkansas 101 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-60 Jury Tampering 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-61 Ron Brown: Entrepreneur 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-62 Barry, Vince and Ron- 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-63 Rumors Surrounding Ron Brown's
Crash 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-64 Morris Dees and the Militia 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-65 Waco Plus Three Years [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-66 Waco Plus Three Years [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-67 Harold May Interview about Waco 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-68 Grabbe on Ron Brown 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-69 Waco Victim List 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-70 OKC Bombing: One Year Later 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-71 Postmodernism 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-72 Project Censored Top 25 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-73 Skolnick on Blackmail 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-74 Spotlight Exclusive: Ron Brown 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-75 Blood Sport Duplicity 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-76 Skolnick on Paper Money 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-77 Innocent Simpson 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-78 The Lindberg kidnapping 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-79 Skolnick on William Colby 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-80 The Freemen Standoff 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-81 Privatization of The Internet 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-82 CIA Propaganda 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-83 Bugged Confession 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-84 Force and The Lie 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-85 Hightower on Halloween 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-86 Potpourri 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-87 Skolnick Interviews John DeCamp 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-88 The Franklin Coverup 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-89 The "Suicide" of Admiral Boorda 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-90 "Obstruction of Justice" 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-91 Liberals Protest NWO 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-92 Conspiracies in Book of Mormon 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-93 FBI Has No Charter 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-94 Van Gogh 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-95 Isis Unveiled 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-96 JFK Assassination Booklist 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-97 Charles Hayes' Computers 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-98 James Norman Interview [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn7-99 James Norman Interview [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-01 Skolnick on Einstein 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-02 Rabin assassination Book 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-03 CN on Noam Chomsky 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-04 Skolnick on Andreuccetti 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-05 John Cummings Interview 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-06 Reed v. Young 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-07 Noriega and The USA 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-08 DCIA 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-09 Freespeechnews 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-10 666 Searcher 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-11 666 Searcher 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-12 Tommy Burkett Saga 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-13 Operation Pegasus 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-14 Secret Combinations 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-15 Who is Noam Chomsky? 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-16 Presidents vs. Congress 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-17 Observations By Grabbe 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-18 Skolnick on The Chicago Octopus 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-19 Donna Rice Hughes 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-20 Crooked Carlos Salinas 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-21 Skolnick on The Criminal
Convention 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-22 June Bilderbergers meeting 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-23 Donna Rice 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-24 Skolnick on What is Really Going
on 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-26 Lyndon Larouche 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-27 Crooked Carlos, Crooked Bill 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-28 Grabbe's "Apology and Goodbye" ;
) 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-29 Grabbe on Wayward Woodward 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-30 Grabbe on White House Database 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-31 Marcus Antonius 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-32 Hightower on Big Oil Companies 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-33 Excerpts From'Dope Inc.' 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-34 Excerpts From'Dope Inc.' 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-35 Prohibition Conspiracies 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-36 "Journalists" 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-37 CN Alert 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-38 Hightower on Corrupt Pol Money 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-39 Atlanta Olympics 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-40 Guns And Gold 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-41 Satire vs. Waco 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-42 Skolnick on Bill C. And
Rockefellers 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-43 Alpha 66 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-44 Hightower on Phillip Knight 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-45 "Mr. Mercedes's" Predictions 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-46 Feminism And Conspiracy 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-47 The Truth Matters 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-48 Rumor Mill News Service #1 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-49 Orlin Grabbe's The Clinton Crash 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-50 Fostergate: Pro And Con 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-51 Skolnick on Rockefellers And
Rothschilds 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-52 Rumor Mill News Service #2 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-53 Rumor Mill News Service #3 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-54 Mark Koernke on TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-55 Rodney Stich on S.A.M.'s 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-56 Witnesses of TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-57 Skolnick on TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-58 Grabbe on TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-59 Freespeech Newspaper? 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-60 "Economy Good"?  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-61 Grabbe on TWA 800 [P-2] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-62 Gene Tatum Interview [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-63 Gene Tatum Interview [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-64 Gene Tatum Interview [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-65 CN Threatened
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-66 Skolnick on White House Enemies
List 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-67 Grabbe on TWA 800 [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-68 The Death of Amschel Rothschild
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-69 Inventing The AIDS Virus 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-70 Gene Tatum Warns Ross Perot 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-71 Orlin Grabbe on Operation
BOPTROT
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-72 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-73 Who is Orlin Grabbe?
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-74 Gene Tatum Interview [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-75 Gene Tatum Interview [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-76 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-2]  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-77 Gene Tatum on Reno, Clinton,
Terror
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-78 Spoofing The Militias
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-79 "Chain Reaction"
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-80 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-3] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-81 CN Sells Out    
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-82 Meyer's Cell 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-84 The New Federalist
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-85 Rumor Mill News Service #4
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-86 Rumor Mill News Service #4
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-87 Senator For Sale
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-88 Subliminal TV Messages 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-89 Ross Perot Speaks
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-90 Tommy Burkett Cover-Up
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-91 Inslaw Update
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-92 Uncle Sam's Heroin Habit  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-93 Casoloctopus
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-94 OKC: What Really Happened?
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-95 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-96 Skolnick on Clinton's
Resignation [P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-98 The Partin Report    
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn8-99 King Klinton
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-01 Traffickers of Death 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-02 The Death of James Moody [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-03 The Death of James Moody [P-1] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-04 The Dick Morris Mess
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-05 Mexican Dissidents  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-06 Clinton's Cocaine Habit
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-07 Skolnick on Saddam Hussein  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-08 Focus on Carlos Cardoen
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-09 CN's Prairienet Problems 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-10 Prairienet's Response
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-11 Code Word For Class War 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-12 Gene Tatum on Pegasus
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-13 Turning To Mexico [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-14 Potpourri 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-15 Turning To Mexico [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-16 The Endless Bull Market
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-17 Warren Commission Secrets
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-18 Turning To Mexico [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-19 Turning To Mexico [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-20 Turning To Mexico [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-21 Remote Viewing of TWA 800
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-22 Turning To Mexico [P-6] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-23 Turning To Mexico [P-7] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-24 SOURCES eJOURNAL
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-25 Potpourri
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-26 Gene Tatum on Clinton And
Cocaine
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-27 Strange Lights And TWA 800 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-28 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-1]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-29 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-2]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-30 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-3]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-31 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-4]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-32 Skolnick on October's Eve  
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-33 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-5]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-34 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-6]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-35 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-7]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-36 News on Chip Tatum
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-37 Skolnick on The OJ Cover-up
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-38 Investigative Report's Whitewash
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-39 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-8]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-40 Gloria Steinem And The CIA [P-9]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-41 Turning To Mexico [P-8]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-42 Gloria Steinem And The CIA
[P-10] 
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-43 Gloria Steinem And The CIA
[P-11]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-44 Skolnick vs. Hillary
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-45 Interesting Web Sites
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-46 Gloria Steinem And The CIA
[P-12]
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-47 Gloria Steinem And The CIA
[P-13]    
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-48 The Cover-up Quilt
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-49 Skolnick on Crazy Judge Duff
http://www.europa.com/~johnlf/cn/cn9-50 Skolnick on Al Gore vs. George
Bush  


------------CORRUPTION IN AMERICA------------
---------------------------------------------
-----------------FEATURES:-------------------
---------------------------------------------
----------CONSPIRACY NATION ARCHIVE----------
-----------SKOLNICK'S COMMENTARIES-----------
-------------THE POLITICAL DIGEST------------
--------------THE CLINTON CRASH--------------
-----------------ORLIN GRABBE----------------
       

        http://www.europa.com/~johnlf


From mrb@airmail.net Fri Oct 18 10:41:42 PDT 1996
Article: 486413 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!news-in.iadfw.net!usenet
From: mrb@airmail.net (J. Bryan Kelsch)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: Re: Kennemur Now Has a CS.COM Account!
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 17:07:18 GMT
Organization: always
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <32666646.14922404@news.airmail.net>
References: <542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net> <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net> <544da4$p2r@dfw-ixnews8.ix.netcom.com>
Reply-To: mrb@airmail.net
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Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:327698 talk.politics.misc:486413

txjohn47@ix.netcom.com(John Johnson) wrote:

>In <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
>voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim Kennemur) writes: 
>>
>>On 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT, Gail Thaler  wrote:
>>
>>>laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
>>>>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
>>>>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
>>>>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
>>>>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
>>>>"@worldnet.att.net?"
>>>>
>>>
>>> pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
>>> said AT&T was communist. Start there.
>>
>> Lookie David. Now I have a CS.COM account as well!
>
>  Not really:
>
>   "In <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> Gail Thaler
>     writes:         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^-----------<<<
>  >
>  > laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:"
>
>   Care to explain how a "CS.COM" account can come up with a "from"
> address like the above? (And don't write "forgery")
>
>>>> Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
>>>>
>>> Den.
>>
>> It is a Lying Socialist Weasel thing David. Much too complicated for
>> your pretty little head!
>>
>>     Jim
>
>   The abusive, slanderous, libelous and profane postings of Jim
> "Voltaire" Kennemur continue.
>
> --John Johnson

I've done some checking:

There is a Jim Kenneumur in Houston with 4 phone numbers listed (one
belongs to someone else, I guess he still lives with daddy).

There is a S E Edmonds in Houston but at a different number and
different zip code.

I have my doubts that they are the same person, bacause each made a
postin within an hour or so apart and S E Edmonds posted from Dallas
in her last reply.

As of the 15th either S E Edmonds was in Dallas or att.net lost it's
local news servers and had to post wild.



J. Bryan Kelsch
-------------------------------------------------------------
I haven't had the sense to come in out of the rain for years. 
     -Bill Clinton
-------------------------------------------------------------


From jamesd@iamerica.net Fri Oct 18 10:41:47 PDT 1996
Article: 486455 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!n3ott.istar!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!news1.iamerica.net!news
From: "James D. Nicholson" 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: 9334 Sanford Rd - Ring a bell anybody?
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 12:51:55 -0500
Organization: Texas State Rifle Association
Lines: 72
Message-ID: <3266723B.717E@iamerica.net>
References: <542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net> <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net> <544da4$p2r@dfw-ixnews8.ix.netcom.com> <32666646.14922404@news.airmail.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.173.253.11
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-KIT  (Win95; U)
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:327717 talk.politics.misc:486455

J. Bryan Kelsch wrote:
> 
> txjohn47@ix.netcom.com(John Johnson) wrote:
> 
> >In <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
> >voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim Kennemur) writes:
> >>
> >>On 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT, Gail Thaler  wrote:
> >>
> >>>laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
> >>>>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
> >>>>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
> >>>>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
> >>>>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
> >>>>"@worldnet.att.net?"
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
> >>> said AT&T was communist. Start there.
> >>
> >> Lookie David. Now I have a CS.COM account as well!
> >
> >  Not really:
> >
> >   "In <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> Gail Thaler
> >     writes:         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^-----------<<<
> >  >
> >  > laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:"
> >
> >   Care to explain how a "CS.COM" account can come up with a "from"
> > address like the above? (And don't write "forgery")
> >
> >>>> Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
> >>>>
> >>> Den.
> >>
> >> It is a Lying Socialist Weasel thing David. Much too complicated for
> >> your pretty little head!
> >>
> >>     Jim
> >
> >   The abusive, slanderous, libelous and profane postings of Jim
> > "Voltaire" Kennemur continue.
> >
> > --John Johnson
> 
> I've done some checking:
> 
> There is a Jim Kenneumur in Houston with 4 phone numbers listed (one
> belongs to someone else, I guess he still lives with daddy).
> 
> There is a S E Edmonds in Houston but at a different number and
> different zip code.
> 
> I have my doubts that they are the same person, bacause each made a
> postin within an hour or so apart and S E Edmonds posted from Dallas
> in her last reply.
> 
> As of the 15th either S E Edmonds was in Dallas or att.net lost it's
> local news servers and had to post wild.
> 
> J. Bryan Kelsch
> -------------------------------------------------------------
> I haven't had the sense to come in out of the rain for years.
>      -Bill Clinton
> -------------------------------------------------------------

-- 
Jim Nicholson
http://www.tsra.com
Join Texas State Rifle Association. - $15/year 
1131 Rockingham, Suite 101, Richardson, TX 75080


From mrb@airmail.net Fri Oct 18 13:30:11 PDT 1996
Article: 327698 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!news-in.iadfw.net!usenet
From: mrb@airmail.net (J. Bryan Kelsch)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: Re: Kennemur Now Has a CS.COM Account!
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 17:07:18 GMT
Organization: always
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <32666646.14922404@news.airmail.net>
References: <542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net> <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net> <544da4$p2r@dfw-ixnews8.ix.netcom.com>
Reply-To: mrb@airmail.net
NNTP-Posting-Host: dal15-07.ppp.iadfw.net
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99e/32.227
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:327698 talk.politics.misc:486413

txjohn47@ix.netcom.com(John Johnson) wrote:

>In <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
>voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim Kennemur) writes: 
>>
>>On 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT, Gail Thaler  wrote:
>>
>>>laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
>>>>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
>>>>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
>>>>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
>>>>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
>>>>"@worldnet.att.net?"
>>>>
>>>
>>> pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
>>> said AT&T was communist. Start there.
>>
>> Lookie David. Now I have a CS.COM account as well!
>
>  Not really:
>
>   "In <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> Gail Thaler
>     writes:         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^-----------<<<
>  >
>  > laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:"
>
>   Care to explain how a "CS.COM" account can come up with a "from"
> address like the above? (And don't write "forgery")
>
>>>> Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
>>>>
>>> Den.
>>
>> It is a Lying Socialist Weasel thing David. Much too complicated for
>> your pretty little head!
>>
>>     Jim
>
>   The abusive, slanderous, libelous and profane postings of Jim
> "Voltaire" Kennemur continue.
>
> --John Johnson

I've done some checking:

There is a Jim Kenneumur in Houston with 4 phone numbers listed (one
belongs to someone else, I guess he still lives with daddy).

There is a S E Edmonds in Houston but at a different number and
different zip code.

I have my doubts that they are the same person, bacause each made a
postin within an hour or so apart and S E Edmonds posted from Dallas
in her last reply.

As of the 15th either S E Edmonds was in Dallas or att.net lost it's
local news servers and had to post wild.



J. Bryan Kelsch
-------------------------------------------------------------
I haven't had the sense to come in out of the rain for years. 
     -Bill Clinton
-------------------------------------------------------------


From jamesd@iamerica.net Fri Oct 18 13:30:15 PDT 1996
Article: 327717 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!n3ott.istar!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!news1.iamerica.net!news
From: "James D. Nicholson" 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,tx.guns
Subject: 9334 Sanford Rd - Ring a bell anybody?
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 12:51:55 -0500
Organization: Texas State Rifle Association
Lines: 72
Message-ID: <3266723B.717E@iamerica.net>
References: <542rt4$i6u@news2.texas.net> <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net> <544da4$p2r@dfw-ixnews8.ix.netcom.com> <32666646.14922404@news.airmail.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.173.253.11
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-KIT  (Win95; U)
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:327717 talk.politics.misc:486455

J. Bryan Kelsch wrote:
> 
> txjohn47@ix.netcom.com(John Johnson) wrote:
> 
> >In <3272648c.3658617@netnews.worldnet.att.net>
> >voltai29@worldnet.att.net (Jim Kennemur) writes:
> >>
> >>On 16 Oct 1996 18:02:42 GMT, Gail Thaler  wrote:
> >>
> >>>laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:
> >>>>And here we have MS? S. Emma Edmonds? taking a stab at the loyal
> >>>>forces.  Has anyone noticed a slacking in Kennemur postings of late?
> >>>>And has anyone noticed that the posters who support Kennemur and
> >>>>are critical of the regular net seem to originate from
> >>>>"@worldnet.att.net?"
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> pssst. I got E-mail from Linda Thompson, of militia fame, that
> >>> said AT&T was communist. Start there.
> >>
> >> Lookie David. Now I have a CS.COM account as well!
> >
> >  Not really:
> >
> >   "In <543802$a00@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> Gail Thaler
> >     writes:         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^-----------<<<
> >  >
> >  > laro@millenium.texas.net (David Laro) wrote:"
> >
> >   Care to explain how a "CS.COM" account can come up with a "from"
> > address like the above? (And don't write "forgery")
> >
> >>>> Kennemur Fan Club, perhaps?  Family?
> >>>>
> >>> Den.
> >>
> >> It is a Lying Socialist Weasel thing David. Much too complicated for
> >> your pretty little head!
> >>
> >>     Jim
> >
> >   The abusive, slanderous, libelous and profane postings of Jim
> > "Voltaire" Kennemur continue.
> >
> > --John Johnson
> 
> I've done some checking:
> 
> There is a Jim Kenneumur in Houston with 4 phone numbers listed (one
> belongs to someone else, I guess he still lives with daddy).
> 
> There is a S E Edmonds in Houston but at a different number and
> different zip code.
> 
> I have my doubts that they are the same person, bacause each made a
> postin within an hour or so apart and S E Edmonds posted from Dallas
> in her last reply.
> 
> As of the 15th either S E Edmonds was in Dallas or att.net lost it's
> local news servers and had to post wild.
> 
> J. Bryan Kelsch
> -------------------------------------------------------------
> I haven't had the sense to come in out of the rain for years.
>      -Bill Clinton
> -------------------------------------------------------------

-- 
Jim Nicholson
http://www.tsra.com
Join Texas State Rifle Association. - $15/year 
1131 Rockingham, Suite 101, Richardson, TX 75080


From mholt@freenet.vcu.edu Fri Oct 18 15:27:47 PDT 1996
Article: 100834 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!news.bc.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!news.sgi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!freenet.vcu.edu!freenet.vcu.edu!not-for-mail
From: mholt@freenet.vcu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.government.abuse,alt.conspiracy,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,rec.aviation.military
Subject: Re: Linda Thompson: That lying, unfuckable bitch
Date: 18 Oct 1996 10:32:57 -0400
Organization: Central Virginia's Free-Net
Lines: 35
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <5484ep$2jg@freenet.vcu.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: freenet.vcu.edu
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:100834 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:395733 rec.aviation.military:47429


>dsale@users.southeast.net (Dan Sale) wrote:
>
>>>>> Do you have any evidence that these invisible "black helicopters"
>>>>> have been used against the citizens of the United States in any way?
>
>>Washington Times, 6/6/96 reported that Black Helicopters performing
>>"Urban Warfare Training"  swept through Pittsburg in the middle of the
>>night and turned parts of the city into war zones. Reports from
>>witnesses said that the helicopters were lower than FAA regulations
>>would permit ; several  witnesses observed one demolishing a warehouse
>>; all in all, over 100 witnesses called in.
>
>That's all very nice yet it didn't answer my question...  unless
>this warehouse had people in it at the time and that these alleged
>"war zones" were acts against people, and not just training missions.

Good point, though I'd want to discuss with the FAA why the
copters were so low (perhaps they had a special dispensation).

I've seen lots of helicopters which were black and unmarked:
it's a matter of distance and lighting, more than color and
markings (or lack of them).  I'd be realy surprised to
encounter any helicopters which really were unmarked and black.

On the other hand, Airwolf was black and unmarked....

(Is it just me, or is this subject rattling lots of us more
than it seems to deserve?  As long as their are governments and
secrets, such tales will be passed among us.)
  
-- 
Michael B. Holt    | After November 1, 1996, my e-mail address is:
Richmond, Virginia |    mholt@freedomnet.com
U.S.A.             | Goodbye, Freenet in central Virginia......


From waffle@primenet.com Fri Oct 18 18:17:17 PDT 1996
Article: 39400 of misc.activism.militia
Approved: militia-request@atype.com (d78728c0ee0818353b57cbfb94150ad0)
From: waffle@primenet.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82
Organization: Primenet
Return-Path: root@nnrp1.news.primenet.com
X-Posted-By: @198.68.45.212 (waffle)
Reply-To: waffle@primenet.com
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!news.internetMCI.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!nntp-hub2.barrnet.net!olivea!grapevine.lcs.mit.edu!atype.com!militia-request
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: Fri, 18 Oct 96 19:03:03 GMT
Message-ID: <845665383$11325@atype.com>
Subject: the "natzification of Christians"???
Lines: 46


LET US SEE: "Pitcaveage dislikes Thompson? Hmmmmm. No attempts to call
"militias" "nazis?" Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
I guess waf is just too "common" to see the connect--heh?
Better show me. Tell me "it ain't so DADDY!"
%$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$MO-MUNY$$$$$$$$$

Introduction 
     Rallying Cries of the Ultra-Right: Weaver and Waco 

     Forerunners and Influences

          The Arizona Patriots 
          Aryan Nations 
          Committee of the States 
          The Covenant, the Sword, and the Arm of the Lord 
          Robert DePugh and The Minutemen 
          Elohim City 
          Colonel James "Bo" Gritz 
          Gordon Wendell Kahl 
          Mark Koernke 
          Liberty Lobby and The Spotlight 
          Col. "Jack" Mohr and the Christian Patriots Defense League 
          The Order 
          William L. Pierce and The Turner Diaries 
          The Posse Comitatus 
          Linda Thompson 

     Other Far-Right Activists

          Louis R. Beam 
          "Pastor" Pete Peters 
          Thom Robb and the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan 

     Credits 



The original plaintext version of this file is available via ftp. 

                                   [ Index ] 

The Nizkor Project 
webmaster@nizkor.org 




From dkuehne@erols.com Sat Oct 19 12:56:12 PDT 1996
Article: 39502 of misc.activism.militia
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Subject: Re: Marshall: a Mind-Control "Program"
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Daniel Kuehne wrote:
> 
> Recently I re-watched a videotaped copy of an episode of "The
> Marshall" (ABC, October 9, 1995, 8-9 PM).  It is the episode in
> which the marshall (a suave, Don Johnson-like character) has a
> run-in with the "militia" (oh nooooo, not that... horror of
> horrors!!!).  Recall that this date was during the Senate Ruby
> Ridge hearings.  To say the least, this program is a
> grossly-distorted [per]version of the Ruby Ridge tragedy, and is an
> excellent example of soviet-styled mind control psyops at work in
> America today.  Unlike the CBS Ruby Ridge propaganda special (and,
> of course, the BATF's Waco special several years ago), the psyops
> in this production are far more concealed (at least to the
> untrained eye).  This leads me to the conclusion that the program
> "The Marshall" is exactly that: a mind-control "program."  The
> psyops in this episode, in particular, are relatively
> sophisticated, possibly even too sophisticated for even the
> controlled media to conjure up (at least without some outside help
> from their "consultants" at the ADL and SPLC).  Is this just
> another "conspiracy theory," well, you be the judge...
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> 



> 
> 2) The marshall and his buddy were out on an innocent fishing trip
> when they were brutally attacked by the "militia."  After the buddy
> gets shot, he says to the marshall: "Full metal jacket, its got to
> be military," and "This is militia country, maybe its one of your
> tax protesters."

I guess he'd been shot so many times he knew it had to be "military" ammo.

Remember also, earlier in the episode, the marshall said he had been
"up here before *CHASING* a tax protestor." Since when do the U.S. Marshals
enforce the tax code? Isn't that why there's an I.R.S.? Oh that's right,
they're to busy enforcing gun laws.


 
> 7) The family friend wore a hat with [gasp!!!] "Militia" written on
> it [and something else which I couldn't make out] and worked at a
> place called [are you ready for this???] "Iron Mountain General
> Store."  Needless to say, he was portrayed as a paranoid militia
> nut.  For instance, at the store, he told the boy's father
> [referring to the marshall and his buddy]: "Two of 'em, definitely
> feds.  I sold 'em some maps... lures.  They said they were just
> fishin'.  I don't buy it for a second."

Propaganda has gotten so sophisticated that it goes right over
the heads of those they control. Who ever heard of "Iron Mountain."

I'd say that this was directed at those of us who *ARE* aware of the
"Report from Iron Mountain."

They are *RUBBING OUR NOSE IN IT* and we don't even know it.
This country's not only *ASLEEP* it's *SNORING*.

Baaaa, Baaaaaaaa, Baaaaaaaa

> 8) In addition, during the standoff, he yells out the following:
> "Oh my God, it started, we're going to die!"; "Black helicopters,
> minions of death!"; "They're going to draw us out, going to gun us
> down!"; "They're going to flush us out with gas!"; "This is it kid,
> it's happening!"

I still roll on the floor laughing when I read that.
"Black helicopters, minions of death!" Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
Think they had Linda Thompson in mind when they wrote the script?

Are people really *THAT* stupid? Do the masses accept this as fact?
If they do, we're done. Stick a fork in 'em, they're done.
*WELL* done. Toast even!

> 9) The uniform worn by the local police included a star of David
> (two superimposed triangles, one pointing up and the other pointing
> down) in the middle of their hats.  [Could this be sophisticated
> psyops trying to make the local police, as opposed to the feds,
> look like "ZOG"?  Recall that many skinheads were present at the
> Ruby Ridge protest... you be the judge of this.]

What kind of thinking is that peeking out from under the sheet?

SNARF!

> 10) The local police are portrayed as the bad guys, instead of the
> feds.  The local police officials are portrayed as gung-ho,
> shoot'em up, military types, whereas the feds (i.e. the marshall)
> show great restraint with regard to the use of force.  For
> instance, the local police are the ones who overreact with legions
> of officers, helicopters, etc..., whereas the marshall is portrayed
> as being kind-hearted, good-willed, and compassionate [to the
> extent that he even lets the boy's father and mother go free... if
> this was a REAL portrayal of the feds, the boy's parents would
> surely have been convicted on some sort of "conspiracy" charge!!!].

They have to make local law enforcement look bad, that way if a
local official does what he has sworn to do, stands up to the feds
and defends the Constitution, they can gun him down. The "news" will
report that a "local official" went beserk and had to be "subdued."

> I believe this (the idea that the feds are friendly, caring, and
> understanding) is the central theme of this "program," especially
> since it aired during a time when the credibility of federal law
> enforcement was at an all-time low (during the Senate Ruby Ridge
> hearings).  Thus, the main purpose of this program was to help
> rehabilitate the feds' fallen image by re-writing history in the
> conscience of the general public.  The following is some key
> dialogue which illustrates this:
> 
> 11) The sheriff and the marshall discuss strategy during the
> standoff:
> 
> SHERIFF: "All told, we got 30, 40 law enforcement officers ready to
> roll, marshall.  Just give me the word and I can have them here
> inside half an hour."
> 
> MARSHALL: "Well, we're [the marshall and the boy's mother] going in
> alone, sheriff."
> 
> SHERIFF: "Oh, bull!  I mean, if you go in alone, I don't..."
> [interrupted by the marshall]
> 
> MARSHALL: "I just want to avoid a bloodbath.  There's been enough
> mistakes made already, but thanks for your help."
> 
> 12) Later, after the marshall leaves with the mother to go to the
> cabin, the sheriff says the following over the radio in his patrol
> car:
> 
> SHERIFF: "No, no.  The marshall's insane.  No, let's get some
> firepower up here and recon 'copters, and let's see if we can't
> save his sorry butt, okay."

Good grief, how many sherrif's department's have recon 'copters?

> 13) During the standoff, the marshall yells out to the boy's father
> in the cabin:
> 
> MARSHALL: "That man your son shot is a friend of mine.  Your son
> made a mistake.  I can understand.  In the forest, it's easy to
> make mistakes.  A couple of guys with no names and badges.  Sir, I
> know your son was scared and I guess it's what we don't know, what
> we don't understand, that scares us.  What we imagine is out
> there."

Yep, we're all just paranoid.

> 14) After the standoff, the sheriff is upset that the marshall does
> not want to convict the boy's mother and father:
> 
> SHERIFF: "There are laws, marshall, we all got to live by them."
> 
> MARSHALL: "Got to live with them too, sheriff."
> 
>                            Conclusions
> 
>      Apart from placing a grossly distorted [per]version of the
> Ruby Ridge tragedy into the conscience of the general public, this
> episode serves to build up a good reputation for the federal
> government.  As I'm sure most of you already know, there are more
> and more TV series coming out about federal agencies such as the
> FBI, Customs, Border Patrol, etc...  Thus, the controlled media is
> taking an active advocacy stance on these agencies (and, by
> inference, the entire federal government), when, in fact, the
> American sheeple fallaciously still believe that they are "nuetral"
> on such issues.  One good thing is this: the establishment has
> dumbed down the American sheeple to such an extent that most of
> them are, in fact, too dumb to understand much the propaganda
> content contained in these types of psyop productions!!!  Get real
> controlled media: How many people know what "Iron Mountain" is???
> Hence, much of this type of psyop garbage should be considered
> merely as entertainment for those, who, like us, are "in the
> know"!!!
> 

Wake up America. Turn off the T.V. and turn on life!

-Dave



From paulej@tiac.net Mon Oct 21 09:43:41 PDT 1996
Article: 329255 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!hookup!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.be.innet.net!INbe.net!news.nl.innet.net!INnl.net!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news.sgi.com!wrdiss1.robins.af.mil!news.monroe.army.mil!info.usuhs.mil!cs.umd.edu!gun-control
From: Paul Johnson 
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns
Subject: FBI Looking to Militias--Please Read!
Date: 20 Oct 1996 21:54:09 -0400
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Mike Lamb wrote:
# 
#                                        PLEASE READ THIS
# 
# Subj:   USA! SWAT PAINTBALL TERROR
# Date:   95-08-30 20:06:05 EDT
# 
#                        Paintball Terrorists
# 
# Being one of the so-called idiots who was on the bus which was
# stopped for hijacking and trasporting automatic firearms I will now
# set the record straight-- First off, My team from ABC PAINTBALL SUPPLY,
# the guys from Carter Machine, and a few guys from Combat Simulations in
# Hawaii set out on a two week tour of Canada in which we were to hit
# stock-class tournaments in Saskatoon and Edmonton.  We left LA on
# Wednesday afternoon en route to Las Vegas for a night of gambling.
# 
# 1-1/2 hours later 3 tires on our bus were blown out by SWAT team members
# using a chain with spikes which was tossed across the hiway.  Our bus
# subsequently pulled over to the shoulder and was immediately surrounded
# by SWAT team members with automatic MP-5's and snipers perched atop the
# surrounding hills with .308 rifles.  We were taken off of the bus,
# handcuffed, and forced to sit on the hot pavement (temperature at
# the time was ~115 degrees) while agents and dogs searched the bus for over
# 6 hours!  Until the very end, no one would tell us why we were stopped.
# Later we learned that they had received a tip that we were illegally
# transporting 600 automatic weapons!  The papers reported that the police
# had seen us waving guns around inside the bus and that they thought we
# were hi-jackers!
# 
# BULLSH*T!!! The police found NOTHING!  NO guns were inside the bus!  All
# paintball guns taken on the trip were stowed properly in the bus' storage
# compartment and we had no access to such compartment from inside the bus!
# 
# Once they saw that nothing was to be found, the police hid their badges
# and refused to give us any information.  The interior of the bus was badly
# damaged by the idiots who disassembled it!  All occupants of the bus were
# badly sunburned, and had burns from the hot pavement on their buttocks and
# knees.  Paintguns and personal belongings of all occupants were damaged,
# but no officer remained behind to file reports with.
# 
# One Federal Agent gave us her business card, but when Jessica Sparks tried
# to contact her the address was wrong, the phone # disconnected, but the
# name was right.  However no calls would be returned. We were given nothing
# to drink for the duration of the event. Our lives were endangered when the
# tires of the bus (which was travelling about 65 mph ) were blown out. In
# fact one SWAT Team member stated that they made a big mistake by blowing
# the tires.  The chain with spikes was to be set up 7 miles down the road
# in case the bus did not pull over.  I could go on and on about this
# incident, but this is the condensed version.
# 
# If you think this could never happen to you, YOU ARE DEAD WRONG!
# 
# I had a red dot on my chest and had the player decided to fire, no
# paintcheck would have been necessary.  Needless to say, Lawsuits are being
# filed as we speak.
# 
# JJ/ABC PAINTBALL SUPPLY/NEW JERSEY
# 
# Stufaust@acs.eku.edu
# 
# When is America going to wake up? When are YOU going to wake up?
# 
# ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# Please people, pass this paper around and make known what is happening in this country! I also
# give permission for anyone to pass along and copy any news from the Patriot News Service.
# ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# 
# ---------- Forwarded message ----------
# Date: Thu, 17 Aug 1995 11:21:09 -0400
# From: Mayor Loz 
# To: lindat@iquest.com
# Subject: Pittsburgh Cops Mimic KGB
# 
# Pittsburgh Gun Owner/Collector Falsely Arrested as Psycho For
# "Having Too Many Guns" and put into a Nut Ward To Silence Him!
# 
# I recently got an EMAIL originating From Linda Thompson about
# the misuse of Psychiatry to brand patriots, government dissenters,
# and gun owners as "nuts". This struck me as far out... then it
# happened in my circle of friends.. I was so outraged I had this
# fellows attorney go on the air of the Jim Quinn show, WRRK FM, 96.9
# Pittsburgh, Daily 6-10 AM to tell the world about this happening
# in my town of Pittsburgh, PA.. The story follows after my original
# post and Linda's ALERT...
# 
# #: 862487 S8/LIBERTY ISSUES , Compuserve Go OUTFORUM, Section 8, Liberty Issues.
#     15-Aug-95  13:21:06
# Sb: Using Psych Wards in USA
# Fm: "Mayor Loz" Schoenfelder 72162,1174
# To: all
# 
# Interesting this could happen. My best friend in Pittsburgh is an
# Attorney.  He just had a client who had THIS EXACT thing happen to him
# ... he was "jailed/committed  for having weapons....not illegal ones,
# they then put him into a psych ward to STOP him when he called the media
# about this illegal search and seizure of his guns, videos, cameras...etc.
# 
# Mayor Loz
# 
#  *** forwarded ****
# 
# FR: Linda Thompson, American Justice Federation
# 
# RE:  Police using 24-hour "Immediate Detention" as a "
# dangerous/crazy person"to lock up political dissidents
# 
# Apparently, the police have gone to some school or convention
# somewhere because they are, across the country, using a provision
# in most state laws that allows a person who "presents a danger
# to himself or others" to be picked up by the police, taken to a
# local hospital and held involuntarily for up to 24 hours (there
# is a provision where at anytime during that 24 hours, the hospital
# can declare the person needs treatment for "mental illness" and
# transfer them to a PRIVATE hospital for an additional 72-60 hours.
# At that hospital, the person will be coerced into signing a statement
# saying they VOLUNTARILY committed themselves at the threat of "If you
# don't sign, you will be here until we can get a hearing in front of a
# judge and we will be getting an order committing you for 90-180
# days then. This causes most people to sign.)  The hospitals get state
# money for this scam.  You do not have to be crazy or even doing
# anything whatsoever to be picked up -- the cop's word is
# good enough.  Afterwards, you have a record of being "involuntarily
# committed," which can keep you from buying a gun, among other things.
# Thus,the "24 hour mental detention" is being used as a scam to grab
# patriots all over the country.  BE FOREWARNED.
# 
# -- Linda Thompson
# 
# Subj:   Interesting police action in CT....
# Date:   95-09-02 08:49:29 EDT
# From:   revcoal@pcnet.com (Donna J. Logan)
# 
# Well, yesterday we had an interesting development to a local
# "domestic dispute"...seems some guy supposedly "made threats" against
# his wife, she supposedly left the house, went to relatives, and
# called the police, letting them know the teenaged son was still in
# the house.
# 
# Well as it turns out, the husband has a "collection" of firearms to
# which he has LEGAL permits....but it seems that this fact made the cops
# decide they had an armed hostage situation...except by the time they
# got there, the teenager was out sitting on the corner.  So then the
# cops decided they had an "armed standoff" situation with a suicidal
# madman, with what one news outlet claimed was "a drug problem"....
# 
# EXCEPT...this same news segment then interviewed the neighbors, who to
# a person all said they knew the guy well and that he was very even
# tempered and "a really nice guy" and had never evidenced behavior like
# this in the past....not particularly the description of a "drug user"
# (the "drug" supposedly being used was never mentioned, btw).  It was
# stated that the police had no record of any previous trouble with the
# guy, who was described as being on a leave of absence from his job working
# at the water treatment facility at UConn.
# 
# And every family member stated that the guy definitely was not suicidal,
# and his nephew was shown on TV as being really pissed off with the cops
# cuz he claimed the whole situation could be ended immediately if they
# just let him talk to his uncle, that he'd be able to get his uncle to
# leave the house within minutes of talking to him...but the cops wouldn't
# let him talk to his uncle.
# 
# In the meantime, the cops forcibly evacuated the whole neighborhood, and
# not only cut electricity to the house, but CABLE ACCESS also!  Now seems
# to me, once the electricity is off, that effectively cut the use of cable
# TV...so why go to that extreme?  It was stated on the news that the cops
# wanted to eliminate his access to media reports...but what about battery
# operated radio and TV...and what's the logic behind eliminating the guy's
# "access to media reports" of the event?
# 
# BTW, thru out this "seige", this guy never once fired a shot.  He was
# described as "in an agitated state"...heck, if my house was surrounded
# by SWAT, my neighbors forcibly evicted, and my electricity and cable cut
# off...I'd be damned "agitated" too!
# 
# Anyways, about 20 hours after this all started, it was reported that the
# guy finally "surrendered", and has been taken to a local hospital "for
# psychiatric evaluation".....
# 
# O.K. people, repeat after me 1000 times.
# There is no conspiracy.
# There is no conspiracy.



From danielk@erols.com Mon Oct 21 18:00:09 PDT 1996
Article: 40143 of misc.activism.militia
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Date: Mon, 21 Oct 96 21:19:55 GMT
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Wow, the cancelbots (uhummm... I mean "moderation robots") must be working overtime 
recently: messages have been disappearing left and right.  Here's a response to my 
"Marshall: a Mind-Control Program" post (the original post is included at the end):
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Daniel Kuehne wrote:
>
> Recently I re-watched a videotaped copy of an episode of "The
> Marshall" (ABC, October 9, 1995, 8-9 PM).  It is the episode in
> which the marshall (a suave, Don Johnson-like character) has a
> run-in with the "militia" (oh nooooo, not that... horror of
> horrors!!!).  Recall that this date was during the Senate Ruby
> Ridge hearings.  To say the least, this program is a
> grossly-distorted [per]version of the Ruby Ridge tragedy, and is an
> excellent example of soviet-styled mind control psyops at work in
> America today.  Unlike the CBS Ruby Ridge propaganda special (and,
> of course, the BATF's Waco special several years ago), the psyops
> in this production are far more concealed (at least to the
> untrained eye).  This leads me to the conclusion that the program
> "The Marshall" is exactly that: a mind-control "program."  The
> psyops in this episode, in particular, are relatively
> sophisticated, possibly even too sophisticated for even the
> controlled media to conjure up (at least without some outside help
> from their "consultants" at the ADL and SPLC).  Is this just
> another "conspiracy theory," well, you be the judge...
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>



>
> 2) The marshall and his buddy were out on an innocent fishing trip
> when they were brutally attacked by the "militia."  After the buddy
> gets shot, he says to the marshall: "Full metal jacket, its got to
> be military," and "This is militia country, maybe its one of your
> tax protesters."

I guess he'd been shot so many times he knew it had to be "military" ammo.

Remember also, earlier in the episode, the marshall said he had been
"up here before *CHASING* a tax protestor." Since when do the U.S. Marshals
enforce the tax code? Isn't that why there's an I.R.S.? Oh that's right,
they're to busy enforcing gun laws.


 
> 7) The family friend wore a hat with [gasp!!!] "Militia" written on
> it [and something else which I couldn't make out] and worked at a
> place called [are you ready for this???] "Iron Mountain General
> Store."  Needless to say, he was portrayed as a paranoid militia
> nut.  For instance, at the store, he told the boy's father
> [referring to the marshall and his buddy]: "Two of 'em, definitely
> feds.  I sold 'em some maps... lures.  They said they were just
> fishin'.  I don't buy it for a second."

Propaganda has gotten so sophisticated that it goes right over
the heads of those they control. Who ever heard of "Iron Mountain."

I'd say that this was directed at those of us who *ARE* aware of the
"Report from Iron Mountain."

They are *RUBBING OUR NOSE IN IT* and we don't even know it.
This country's not only *ASLEEP* it's *SNORING*.

Baaaa, Baaaaaaaa, Baaaaaaaa

> 8) In addition, during the standoff, he yells out the following:
> "Oh my God, it started, we're going to die!"; "Black helicopters,
> minions of death!"; "They're going to draw us out, going to gun us
> down!"; "They're going to flush us out with gas!"; "This is it kid,
> it's happening!"

I still roll on the floor laughing when I read that.
"Black helicopters, minions of death!" Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
Think they had Linda Thompson in mind when they wrote the script?

Are people really *THAT* stupid? Do the masses accept this as fact?
If they do, we're done. Stick a fork in 'em, they're done.
*WELL* done. Toast even!

> 9) The uniform worn by the local police included a star of David
> (two superimposed triangles, one pointing up and the other pointing
> down) in the middle of their hats.  [Could this be sophisticated
> psyops trying to make the local police, as opposed to the feds,
> look like "ZOG"?  Recall that many skinheads were present at the
> Ruby Ridge protest... you be the judge of this.]

What kind of thinking is that peeking out from under the sheet?

SNARF!

> 10) The local police are portrayed as the bad guys, instead of the
> feds.  The local police officials are portrayed as gung-ho,
> shoot'em up, military types, whereas the feds (i.e. the marshall)
> show great restraint with regard to the use of force.  For
> instance, the local police are the ones who overreact with legions
> of officers, helicopters, etc..., whereas the marshall is portrayed
> as being kind-hearted, good-willed, and compassionate [to the
> extent that he even lets the boy's father and mother go free... if
> this was a REAL portrayal of the feds, the boy's parents would
> surely have been convicted on some sort of "conspiracy" charge!!!].

They have to make local law enforcement look bad, that way if a
local official does what he has sworn to do, stands up to the feds
and defends the Constitution, they can gun him down. The "news" will
report that a "local official" went beserk and had to be "subdued."

> I believe this (the idea that the feds are friendly, caring, and
> understanding) is the central theme of this "program," especially
> since it aired during a time when the credibility of federal law
> enforcement was at an all-time low (during the Senate Ruby Ridge
> hearings).  Thus, the main purpose of this program was to help
> rehabilitate the feds' fallen image by re-writing history in the
> conscience of the general public.  The following is some key
> dialogue which illustrates this:
>
> 11) The sheriff and the marshall discuss strategy during the
> standoff:
>
> SHERIFF: "All told, we got 30, 40 law enforcement officers ready to
> roll, marshall.  Just give me the word and I can have them here
> inside half an hour."
>
> MARSHALL: "Well, we're [the marshall and the boy's mother] going in
> alone, sheriff."
>
> SHERIFF: "Oh, bull!  I mean, if you go in alone, I don't..."
> [interrupted by the marshall]
>
> MARSHALL: "I just want to avoid a bloodbath.  There's been enough
> mistakes made already, but thanks for your help."
>
> 12) Later, after the marshall leaves with the mother to go to the
> cabin, the sheriff says the following over the radio in his patrol
> car:
>
> SHERIFF: "No, no.  The marshall's insane.  No, let's get some
> firepower up here and recon 'copters, and let's see if we can't
> save his sorry butt, okay."

Good grief, how many sherrif's department's have recon 'copters?

> 13) During the standoff, the marshall yells out to the boy's father
> in the cabin:
>
> MARSHALL: "That man your son shot is a friend of mine.  Your son
> made a mistake.  I can understand.  In the forest, it's easy to
> make mistakes.  A couple of guys with no names and badges.  Sir, I
> know your son was scared and I guess it's what we don't know, what
> we don't understand, that scares us.  What we imagine is out
> there."

Yep, we're all just paranoid.

> 14) After the standoff, the sheriff is upset that the marshall does
> not want to convict the boy's mother and father:
>
> SHERIFF: "There are laws, marshall, we all got to live by them."
>
> MARSHALL: "Got to live with them too, sheriff."
>
>                            Conclusions
>
>      Apart from placing a grossly distorted [per]version of the
> Ruby Ridge tragedy into the conscience of the general public, this
> episode serves to build up a good reputation for the federal
> government.  As I'm sure most of you already know, there are more
> and more TV series coming out about federal agencies such as the
> FBI, Customs, Border Patrol, etc...  Thus, the controlled media is
> taking an active advocacy stance on these agencies (and, by
> inference, the entire federal government), when, in fact, the
> American sheeple fallaciously still believe that they are "nuetral"
> on such issues.  One good thing is this: the establishment has
> dumbed down the American sheeple to such an extent that most of
> them are, in fact, too dumb to understand much the propaganda
> content contained in these types of psyop productions!!!  Get real
> controlled media: How many people know what "Iron Mountain" is???
> Hence, much of this type of psyop garbage should be considered
> merely as entertainment for those, who, like us, are "in the
> know"!!!
>

Wake up America. Turn off the T.V. and turn on life!

-Dave
-----------------------------------------------------

Here's the original post (-DK)

--------------628DA9C187F
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Recently I re-watched a videotaped copy of an episode of "The
Marshall" (ABC, October 9, 1995, 8-9 PM).  It is the episode in
which the marshall (a suave, Don Johnson-like character) has a
run-in with the "militia" (oh nooooo, not that... horror of
horrors!!!).  Recall that this date was during the Senate Ruby
Ridge hearings.  To say the least, this program is a
grossly-distorted [per]version of the Ruby Ridge tragedy, and is an
excellent example of soviet-styled mind control psyops at work in
America today.  Unlike the CBS Ruby Ridge propaganda special (and,
of course, the BATF's Waco special several years ago), the psyops
in this production are far more concealed (at least to the
untrained eye).  This leads me to the conclusion that the program
"The Marshall" is exactly that: a mind-control "program."  The
psyops in this episode, in particular, are relatively
sophisticated, possibly even too sophisticated for even the
controlled media to conjure up (at least without some outside help
>from  their "consultants" at the ADL and SPLC).  Is this just
another "conspiracy theory," well, you be the judge...
-------------------------------------------------------------------

                 First, here's a brief summary:

     The story opens when the marshall and a buddy take an innocent
fishing trip in, judging from the countryside, what appears to be
[you guessed it!] northern Idaho.  While fishing, the buddy is
shot in the leg.  A masked gunman pursues them through the woods,
but the marshall (portrayed as the hero of the story) eventually
ends up catching him.  Under the mask, the gunman turns out to be
a 14 year-old boy who looks very young for his age [I wonder who
that's supposed to be, duhhh!].  The marshall then escorts his
severely-injured buddy, and the boy (who is handcuffed at this
point), to a nearby parking area.  At this point, the boy's father,
who is hiding in the woods [serving to illustrate typical militia
cowardice, I suppose], starts firing near the marshall and his
buddy, as a diversion.  The boy, taking advantage of this, gets
away from his captors, runs over to his dad, and tells him that the
marshall fired at him first.  
     Hence, at this point, the marshall and his buddy are "pinned"
down by the boy's father [starting to sound familiar?].  When
darkness finally falls, the marshall leaves his buddy behind and
goes out looking for help.  Before going far, however, he stumbles
upon a rustic cabin out in the middle of the woods [I wonder who
lives there, duhhh].  Inside, he finds family photographs of the
boy he captured, and his family.  He also finds [horror of
horrors!!!] survival books.  The marshall grabs (i.e. steals) some
food and heads back to where his buddy is still "pinned" down. 
Later that night, the boy's mother and a family friend arrive in a
pickup truck to rescue the boy and his father from the feds [they
had heard gunshots and knew something was wrong].  However, the
marshall, upon bringing up the fact that her son would receive life
in prison if his buddy dies, persuades the mother to rescue him and
his buddy instead [I told you he was suave!].  Meanwhile, the
family friend runs over to where the father and son are hiding in
the woods. 
     After the boy's mother rescues them, by driving away after
they climb into the bed of the pickup, the father, son, and
family friend head for the family's rustic cabin in the woods,
where they promptly barricade themselves in, expecting some sort of
standoff.  The next day, the marshall and the boy's mother go to
the cabin to try to persuade them to surrender, but a local police
helicopter unexpectedly comes along at a critical moment, which
almost results in dire consequences.  Despite this mishap,
everything turns out just fine in the end: the marshall even lets
the boy's father and mother go free, despite protests from the
local sheriff. 


         Here's some observations regarding propaganda:

1) The setting was a conifer-forested, mountainous region, with a
bridge crossing over a stream, which was eerily reminiscent of the
bridge over Ruby Creek.  

2) The marshall and his buddy were out on an innocent fishing trip
when they were brutally attacked by the "militia."  After the buddy
gets shot, he says to the marshall: "Full metal jacket, its got to
be military," and "This is militia country, maybe its one of your
tax protesters." 

3) The boy, conspicuously modeled after Sammy Weaver, was wearing
a bandanna over his face when the marshall caught him.  Thus, in
this "program," the "militia" is portrayed as masked terrorists,
instead of the feds.  [Now, that's a switch!!!]

4) The mother asks: "How did they find us?" and "How did they know
we were here?"  Hence, she was portrayed as highly paranoid.

5) A large confederate flag was the backdrop for a scene in which
the marshall is talking with the mother, over a cup of coffee, in
the house belonging to the family friend.  Recall that several
confederate flags were prominantly displayed in the CBS Ruby Ridge
propaganda special.   

6) The family cabin is very rustic and contains survivalist
literature, just like the Weaver cabin.   

7) The family friend wore a hat with [gasp!!!] "Militia" written on
it [and something else which I couldn't make out] and worked at a
place called [are you ready for this???] "Iron Mountain General
Store."  Needless to say, he was portrayed as a paranoid militia
nut.  For instance, at the store, he told the boy's father
[referring to the marshall and his buddy]: "Two of 'em, definitely
feds.  I sold 'em some maps... lures.  They said they were just
fishin'.  I don't buy it for a second."  

8) In addition, during the standoff, he yells out the following:
"Oh my God, it started, we're going to die!"; "Black helicopters,
minions of death!"; "They're going to draw us out, going to gun us
down!"; "They're going to flush us out with gas!"; "This is it kid,
it's happening!" 

9) The uniform worn by the local police included a star of David
(two superimposed triangles, one pointing up and the other pointing
down) in the middle of their hats.  [Could this be sophisticated
psyops trying to make the local police, as opposed to the feds,
look like "ZOG"?  Recall that many skinheads were present at the
Ruby Ridge protest... you be the judge of this.]

10) The local police are portrayed as the bad guys, instead of the
feds.  The local police officials are portrayed as gung-ho,
shoot'em up, military types, whereas the feds (i.e. the marshall)
show great restraint with regard to the use of force.  For
instance, the local police are the ones who overreact with legions
of officers, helicopters, etc..., whereas the marshall is portrayed
as being kind-hearted, good-willed, and compassionate [to the
extent that he even lets the boy's father and mother go free... if
this was a REAL portrayal of the feds, the boy's parents would
surely have been convicted on some sort of "conspiracy" charge!!!]. 
I believe this (the idea that the feds are friendly, caring, and
understanding) is the central theme of this "program," especially
since it aired during a time when the credibility of federal law
enforcement was at an all-time low (during the Senate Ruby Ridge
hearings).  Thus, the main purpose of this program was to help
rehabilitate the feds' fallen image by re-writing history in the
conscience of the general public.  The following is some key
dialogue which illustrates this:  

11) The sheriff and the marshall discuss strategy during the
standoff:

SHERIFF: "All told, we got 30, 40 law enforcement officers ready to
roll, marshall.  Just give me the word and I can have them here
inside half an hour."

MARSHALL: "Well, we're [the marshall and the boy's mother] going in
alone, sheriff."

SHERIFF: "Oh, bull!  I mean, if you go in alone, I don't..."
[interrupted by the marshall]

MARSHALL: "I just want to avoid a bloodbath.  There's been enough
mistakes made already, but thanks for your help."     


12) Later, after the marshall leaves with the mother to go to the
cabin, the sheriff says the following over the radio in his patrol
car:

SHERIFF: "No, no.  The marshall's insane.  No, let's get some
firepower up here and recon 'copters, and let's see if we can't
save his sorry butt, okay."


13) During the standoff, the marshall yells out to the boy's father
in the cabin:

MARSHALL: "That man your son shot is a friend of mine.  Your son
made a mistake.  I can understand.  In the forest, it's easy to
make mistakes.  A couple of guys with no names and badges.  Sir, I
know your son was scared and I guess it's what we don't know, what
we don't understand, that scares us.  What we imagine is out
there." 


14) After the standoff, the sheriff is upset that the marshall does
not want to convict the boy's mother and father:

SHERIFF: "There are laws, marshall, we all got to live by them."

MARSHALL: "Got to live with them too, sheriff."  


                           Conclusions

     Apart from placing a grossly distorted [per]version of the
Ruby Ridge tragedy into the conscience of the general public, this
episode serves to build up a good reputation for the federal
government.  As I'm sure most of you already know, there are more
and more TV series coming out about federal agencies such as the
FBI, Customs, Border Patrol, etc...  Thus, the controlled media is
taking an active advocacy stance on these agencies (and, by
inference, the entire federal government), when, in fact, the
American sheeple fallaciously still believe that they are "nuetral"
on such issues.  One good thing is this: the establishment has
dumbed down the American sheeple to such an extent that most of
them are, in fact, too dumb to understand much the propaganda
content contained in these types of psyop productions!!!  Get real
controlled media: How many people know what "Iron Mountain" is??? 
Hence, much of this type of psyop garbage should be considered
merely as entertainment for those, who, like us, are "in the
know"!!!        

--------------628DA9C187F--



From bigred@shout.net Wed Oct 23 16:45:59 PDT 1996
Article: 102571 of alt.conspiracy
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From: bigred@shout.net (Brian Redman)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.activism
Subject: Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 9 Num. 53
Date: 23 Oct 1996 15:33:43 GMT
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              Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 9  Num. 53
             ======================================
                    ("Quid coniuratio est?")
 
 
-----------------------------------------------------------------
 
OCTOBER SURPRISE
================
(From the September 1996 Conspiracy Nation Newsletter)
 
In 1980, fifty-two  American  hostages  were  being held by Iran.
The President at that  time  was  Jimmy  Carter.   He  was  being
challenged in his bid for re-election by the Reagan-Bush ticket. 
 
Though  Reagan-Bush  led  in the polls, they secretly feared that
Carter would stage what  was  called  an "October Surprise."  The
Republicans feared that if Carter were to bring about the release
of the American hostages in  late  October,  subsequent  national
euphoria would boost Carter in the polls and get him re-elected. 
 
So,   according   to   numerous   and   disparate  witnesses  and
investigators,   the   Reagan-Bush   faction   initiated   secret
negotiations with the Iranians.  The  deal reportedly was that if
the Iranians would ignore Carter  administration  overtures,  the
Republicans  would  give  the  Iranians  an  especially good deal
later, when Reagan-Bush came to power. 
 
Some may say, "Well,  Congress  looked into these allegations and
found nothing there."  But that is like saying that  the  Columbo
crime  family  looked  into  the  Genovese  mafia  and concluded,
"They're not such a bad bunch of guys."  Congress has also looked
into the strange  death  of  White  House  deputy counsel Vincent
Foster -- twice -- and concluded that  Foster  committed  suicide
right  where  his  body  was  found  in  Fort  Marcy Park.  So if
Congress is  so  infallible,  why  is  Special Prosecutor Kenneth
Starr now also  investigating  the  Foster  death?   And  why  do
two-thirds  of  Americans  not  believe  what  the Congress keeps
telling them, vis-a-vis Foster? 
 
Gary Sick served  on  the  National  Security Council staff under
Presidents Ford, Carter, and  Reagan.   Sick  was  the  principal
White  House  aide for Iran during the hostage crisis of 1979-81.
He  was  skeptical  at  first,  regarding  the  October  Surprise
allegations, yet gradually found that 
 
  A reality that I thought I  knew  well  turned  out  to  be
  little more than  a  facade.   I  had to utterly reevaluate
  whole constellations of  events,  even  those  that  I  had
  experienced personally...
 
  [Sick  had  thought  that]  The  events  of  1980  could be
  explained adequately without resort to what I considered to
  be a conspiracy theory...
 
  [Yet]  As time went on, seemingly inexplicable fragments of
  information  began to appear.  My experience was not unlike
  that of a medieval scholar discovering traces of  a  hidden
  text beneath the script on an old parchment.
 
Sick  is  cautious when he writes, in his book, October Surprise,
that "there is not  enough  evidence  at  this  point to launch a
prosecution," yet he obviously feels that  the  October  Surprise
story  is  grounded  in fact:  "If the evidence presented in this
book means what it seems to mean, we must conclude that in 1980 a
deception was inflicted on the  hostages, the government, and the
American people that has few if any  parallels  in  our  history.
That evidence is not easily dismissed." 
 
Not  so cautious as Sick has been Ari Ben-Menashe, who worked for
the Israeli intelligence agency,  the  Mossad, before he surfaced
to write a tell-all book, Profits  of  War  (1991).   Ben-Menashe
says  he  was  part  of  a  team  which worked with the French to
arrange secret meetings between  George  Bush, William Casey, and
the Iranians.  At one particular meeting in Paris, on October 19,
1980, a final agreement allegedly was concluded:  In exchange for
a $40 million bribe  and  future  arms  shipments,  the  Iranians
agreed  not  to  release  the American hostages until the January
1981 Presidential inauguration.  This,  in  fact, did happen; the
52 hostages were released on January 20, 1981. 
 
Barbara Honegger worked for  the  Reagan  administration  in  the
White House Office of Policy Development.  She worked there for 3
years before she became "the first resignation of conscience from
the  Reagan-Bush  Administration."   She held off from publishing
her book, October Surprise, until 1989, due to a sense of loyalty
she felt toward Ronald Reagan. 
 
Honegger points out that George  Bush  had been a Director of CIA
and, as such, had plenty of covert connections and know-how  with
which  to  implement  secret dealings between the Republicans and
Iran.  Many in CIA hated  Jimmy  Carter for downsizing the Agency
and were  eager  for  revenge.   Honegger,  like  Gary  Sick,  is
cautious;  throughout her book she refers to the October Surprise
story as "allegations."  Yet her evidence leads overwhelmingly to
the reality of the October Surprise conspiracy. 
 
For example, Honegger points to  the many witnesses who have gone
public concerning the affair.  While some  might  consider  these
CIA  contract  agents  to  be  shady characters and therefore not
sterling witnesses, she asks:  Why  didn't this body of witnesses
ever get to tell their stories to the  American  people?   Writes
Honegger:  "As an independent journalist, I believe profoundly in
the  right  of  the  American public to hear from all parties who
claim to  have  information  on  charges  as  serious  as that an
arms-for-hostage-delay deal  was  made  between  the  Reagan-Bush
campaign and Iran." 
 
So  why  didn't  we hear all sides of the story?  After all, in a
democracy it is supposed  that  the  public can think for itself,
and do  not  need  to  be  shielded  from  witnesses  which  some
self-appointed  authority  decides  are  "not credible."  By what
right do the few have such control over what the many are allowed
to hear? 
 
Rodney Stich, in his  classic  and  definitive book on government
corruption, Defrauding America (1-800-247-7389), suggests part of
the reason information is withheld, diminished, or twisted -- The
CIA's Media Wurlitzer. 
 
  The CIA has many media personnel on its  payroll  to  plant
  stories or discredit charges against the CIA.  It pays  out
  large sums of money for articles and books to be written on
  the CIA's behalf.  Its  control  over  the  media is like a
  Wurlitzer, orchestrating and  manipulating  all segments of
  the written or broadcast media.  It must be remembered that
  the CIA has iron-clad control over the establishment  media
  in   the   United   States,  and  spends  money  supporting
  journalists and the media.
 
In light of the July 1996  issue of this newsletter ("The Smiling
Pope"),  it  is  noteworthy  that  Ms.  Honegger  goes  into  the
Propaganda Due, or P-2, connection.  You'll recall that P-2 is  a
secret,  illegal Masonic lodge founded in Italy by Licio Gelli in
1966.  Honegger points  to  Alexander  Haig,  later to become the
Secretary of State under Ronald Reagan, as having  been  made  an
"honorary"  (non-Italian)  member of P-2 prior to 1980.  Honegger
further states that Licio  Gelli, finance wizard Michele Sindona,
Alexander  Haig,  and  CIA  Director  William  Casey  "were  also
reportedly members of the Vatican's military order,  the  Knights
of  Malta, whose initiates must take an oath of allegiance to the
Pope."  Furthermore, P-2 is linked to the Mafia, which also seems
to have  played  a  part  in  the  October  Surprise plot; writes
Honegger:  "A number of press reports,  taken  together,  suggest
that  there  may  have been a P-2 and Gambino Mafia connection to
the release of  the  fifty-two  American  hostages  from the U.S.
embassy in Tehran." 
 
(By the way, in light of the July issue of this newsletter,  "The
Smiling Pope," I recommend the movie, "The Godfather, Part 3.") 
 
Abol  Hassan  Bani-Sadr  was president of Iran during the hostage
crisis.  As of 1991, he  was  living  in exile, in Paris.  In his
book, My  Turn  To  Speak,  Bani-Sadr  corroborates  the  October
Surprise allegations. 
 
While  some  may  wonder why Iran would have negotiated with "the
Great Satan," i.e., the United  States,  it now appears that this
rhetoric served mainly to help unite a fractious Iran  against  a
common  enemy.  (Such techniques are used here in the U.S., where
the government uses the Big  Enemy  technique to rally support --
for example, Big Enemies such  as  Russia,  narcotics,  and  now,
increasingly,    supposed    omnipresent   terrorists.)    Writes
Bani-Sadr:  "The takeover of the  U.S. embassy was wholly in line
with  [Ayatollah]  Khomeini's  strategy  of  focusing   hostility
abroad."  Remember too that the U.S. had frozen Iranian funds and
had military spare parts desperately needed by the Iranians. 
 
Former-president  Bani-Sadr says he has proof of contacts between
Iran and the Reagan-Bush forces  as  early as the spring of 1980.
He claims that "the sole  purpose  of  [these  contacts]  was  to
handicap  Carter's  re-election  bid  by preventing the hostages'
release before the American elections in November 1980." 
 
The  late  Paul  D.   Wilcher   was  a  Washington  attorney  who
investigated the October Surprise charges.  In a 100-page  letter
addressed  to Attorney General Janet Reno and dated May 21, 1993,
Wilcher  offered  her  a  comprehensive  look  at  American "deep
politics."  (The term "deep politics," comes from Professor Peter
Dale Scott's penetrating look at the  assassination  of  John  F.
Kennedy,   Deep   Politics  and  the  Death  of  JFK.   Berkeley:
University of California Press,  1993.)  One section of Wilcher's
letter to Reno is entitled, "The  'October  Surprise'  Treason  &
Coup  D'Etat."   (My  thanks  to a subscriber for sending me this
disturbing document.)  Writes Wilcher: 
 
  My client  here  is  Gunther  Karl  Russbacher, a life-long
  covert operative  for  the  CIA  and  the  Office  of Naval
  Intelligence ("ONI") who has operated at the highest levels
  of both of these super-secret organizations over  the  past
  30 and 25 years, respectively.
 
  Because of his extremely high intelligence, his exceptional
  physical skills, his extensive training, his fluency  in  8
  languages, his proficiency as  one  of the CIA's top pilots
  and  marksmen,  and the fact that his father was one of the
  original founders (along  with  William  Casey, "Wild Bill"
  Donovan, and others)  of  the  Central Intelligence Agency,
  back in 1947, Gunther has always operated  at  the  highest
  levels of these "intelligence" organizations, and has  been
  entrusted with carrying out  some  of their most difficult,
  sensitive, and top secret covert operations.
 
  [......]
 
  For the moment, however, I want to  focus  on  one  pivotal
  event in Gunther's career -- the fact that he was  the  CIA
  pilot who flew George Bush and others (listed below) to and
  from Paris on  this  "October  Surprise"  weekend, and then
  flew George Bush back  to  America  on the CIA's hypersonic
  spy  plane, the SR-71 -- to get him back home before anyone
  would notice that he was gone.
 
Russbacher says his passengers on the flight to Paris during  the
October  19,  1980  weekend, included George Bush, William Casey,
Donald Gregg (later to become  Ambassador to South Korea), Robert
Gates  (later  to  become  Director  of  CIA),  Robert  McFarlane
(President Reagan's  National  Security  Advisor),  Robert  Allen
(President  Reagan's first National Security advisor), Earl Brian
(of later INSLAW notoriety),  Jennifer Fitzgerald (reportedly one
of George Bush's  mistresses),  Congressman  Daniel  Rostenkowski
(a.k.a.   "Rosty,"  now in jail), Congressman Dan Burton, Senator
Robert Byrd, Senator John  Tower,  Senator  John Heinz, and other
prominent Members of Congress.
 
Wilcher's letter describes who got what:
 
  The gist of these negotiations (and deal) was that Bush and
  Casey delivered to  the  Iranians  $40  million in cash (it
  started  out  as  $62  million, but by the time many of the
  Americans had dipped their hands  into the till, only about
  $35 million was left to give to the Iranians), basically as
  bribe money, plus the promise of $5 billion more in illegal
  arms sales and spare parts... in exchange for the Iranians'
  agreement not to release  the 52 American hostages captured
  in Tehran on November 4th, 1979, until after  the  November
  4th, 1980,  U.S.  Presidential  election  --  in  order  to
  guarantee  the  humiliation  and  defeat  of then-President
  Jimmy  Carter,  and the victory of Ronald Reagan and George
  Bush.
 
  The important point to remember  about this flight, and all
  those who were  participating  in  it,  is  that the entire
  exercise  was  a  carefully  planned, and well executed CIA
  covert operation -- which  had  been ordered and sanctioned
  at  the  highest  levels  of  the  "Shadow  Government"  --
  specifically for the purpose of  taking back control of the
  federal  government from the Democrats, and returning it to
  the CIA and the "Shadow Government."
 
  In other words,  this  entire  operation  was  --  and  was
  specifically designed to be -- a treasonous coup d'etat, to
  take back  control  of  the  federal  government from Jimmy
  Carter and the Democrats...
 
Paul Wilcher,  by  the  way,  is  numbered  among  the  so-called
"Clinton  Body  Count"  --  persons connected to Bill Clinton who
have  died  mysteriously  and/or  violently.   The  story  of the
Clinton Body Count was first brought  to  light  by  Indianapolis
attorney  Linda  Thompson.  She described how the information was
first intimated to her, by a purported CIA agent, on the February
3rd, 1994 broadcast  of  Chuck  Harder's  "For  the People" radio
show: 
 
  CHUCK HARDER:  Now, Linda, you were talking [about]...  The
  Clinton Body Count.  You say 25 people that have surrounded
  Bill Clinton, with some type  of  a  personal  relationship
  with him.....
 
  LINDA THOMPSON: Uh-huh. [Affirmative]
 
  CHUCK    HARDER:    .....have   turned   up   dead   within
  approximately the last 12 months.
 
  LINDA THOMPSON: Right.
 
  CHUCK HARDER:  Can  you  name  them  "off  the  top of your
  head," to the best of your ability?
 
  LINDA THOMPSON: Sure.
 
  CHUCK HARDER:  And who were they, and how  come,  and  that
  sort of thing.
 
  LINDA  THOMPSON:   C.  Victor  Raiser  was  Bill  Clinton's
  campaign  finance  chairman, and his son, who was also very
  active  in the campaign, Victor Raiser, Jr., were killed in
  a plane crash,  enroute  to  Alaska,  in  July of '92.  Now
  that's where the body count begins.  And it begins there...
  I almost didn't include them because I was going to  divide
  it  up into post-Presidency and pre-Presidency.  The fellow
  that  had  called  me and suggested that I do this was CIA.
  And he said, you  know,  "Do  a body count around Clinton."
  And I said, "What?!"  [He answered,] "Just do one.  Do  one
  before he became President  and  do  one  after  he  became
  President."  Because I would not have thought of this on my
  own.  I really...  It  would  never  have occurred to me to
  even think of doing this.
 
Besides Wilcher and Raiser, other names amongst the still-growing
Clinton Body  Count  are:   Paul  Tully,  DNC political director,
heart attack; Paula Gober, worked as  Clinton's  interpreter  for
the  hearing-impaired,  car crash; Jim Wilhite, friends with Mack
McLarty and Bill Clinton,  skiing  accident; Vincent Foster, Jr.,
deputy White House  counsel,  "suicide";  Luther  "Jerry"  Parks,
owner  of  a  security  service which supplied guards for Clinton
during  his  1992  presidential  campaign,  murdered  by multiple
gunshots; Jon Parnell Walker, RTC Senior Investigation Specialist
looking into  wrongdoing  at  Madison  Guaranty  S&L,  supposedly
jumped to his death while apartment hunting; Kathy Ferguson, wife
of  Danny Ferguson who said he brought sex-accuser Paula Jones to
Bill Clinton's hotel room  at  which  time  Clinton is alleged to
have sexually  harassed  Jones,  "suicide"  by  pistol;  Herschel
Friday,  a  member  of  C.  Victor  Raiser's  (see above) finance
committee,  plane  crash;   Ed   Willey,   manager  of  Clinton's
presidential campaign finance committee, supposedly shot  himself
on  November  30,  1993;  John A. Wilson, a Washington, D.C. city
councilman about to go  public  with information on Bill Clinton,
"suicide" by hanging; Ron Brown,  the  late  Commerce  Secretary,
killed in a suspicious plane crash.
 
The  list contains many more names than the above.  I may write a
more detailed account in  the  future.  Readers familiar with the
many violent and/or  mysterious  deaths  of  potential  witnesses
connected  to  the  JFK  assassination  will be familiar with the
pattern suggested by the  Clinton  Body  Count.  For now, add one
more name to the list of  suspicious  deaths  connected  to  Bill
Clinton:   Susann  Coleman.   As  documented in the book, Clinton
Confidential  (by  George  Carpozi),  Ms.  Coleman,  said  to  be
pregnant by Bill Clinton, died by "suicide" on February 15, 1977.
Writes Carpozi, "Coleman is purported to have put the muzzle of a
shotgun into her mouth and pulled the trigger." 
 
But how does October  Surprise  lead  to  the Clinton Body Count?
The October Surprise coup d'etat led to the  12-year  Reagan-Bush
Administration.  During that time,  the  illegal  Contra  war  in
Nicaragua  was  funded in part by CIA gun- and drug-smuggling via
Arkansas, condoned by then-Governor  Bill Clinton.  Bill Clinton,
according to Roger Morris, author of  Partners  in  Power,  is  a
long-time  CIA agent.  The Arkansas smuggling operation was under
the command of George Bush, himself  a former Director of CIA and
long-time agent  of  that  roach  hotel.   So  how  does  October
Surprise  lead  to the Clinton Body Count?  Well, as we all know,
roaches multiply.
 
Robert Parry has worked  for Associated Press, Newsweek magazine,
and the PBS program, "Frontline."  He has been  an  investigative
reporter for over 20 years.  Parry has continued to look into the
October  Surprise  story, has had a book published on the subject
(Trick or Treason),  and  recently  came  up  with some startling
information which he published on Internet. 
 
Following a Congressional task force report  which  debunked  the
October Surprise allegations (a report which, writes Parry, rests
on "an elaborate set of alibis"), Parry sought access to the task
force's  files.   He  obtained permission to examine unclassified
papers, stored in a Rayburn building sub-basement, in a converted
Ladies' washroom now used for storage.  To Parry's surprise, "Not
only did I find unclassified  notes  and documents about the task
force's work, but also 'secret' and even 'top secret'  papers..."
Parry's  study of these documents led him to believe, more firmly
than ever, that the October Surprise plot had indeed occured. 
 
Among the confidential  documents  that  Parry  lucked onto was a
six-page Russian report, sent in response to a query by Rep.  Lee
Hamilton  (D-Ind.)   According  to  Parry,  the  "Russian  report
stated,  as  fact,  that Casey, George Bush and other Republicans
had met secretly with Iranian officials in Europe during the 1980
presidential  campaign.   The   Russians   depicted  the  hostage
negotiations that year  as  a  two-way  competition  between  the
Carter  White House and the Reagan campaign to outbid one another
for Iran's cooperation  on  the  hostages.  The Russians asserted
that the Reagan team had disrupted Carter's hostage  negotiations
after all, the exact opposite of the task force conclusion." 
 
Still  don't  believe  the October Surprise machinations occured?
Tell that to former  Israeli  Prime  Minister Yitzhak Shamir who,
when asked in May of 1993 if there had been an October  Surprise,
responded,   "of   course,   it   was."    Tell  that  to  senior
representatives of Iran's current  government, who, writes Parry,
are "amused at how wrong the House task force  had  been."   Tell
that  to  veteran White House correspondent Sarah McClendon, who,
when I stated to her in  late  August of 1995, "So you agree with
the story of the 'October Surprise,'" responded: 
 
  Oh  definitely.  There definitely was.  And Bush has denied
  it  all  along.   And  people have seen him in Paris at the
  time  he  claims  he  wasn't there.  They saw him there and
  they know he went to  the  meeting.  And I definitely think
  the agreement was made there.
 
An  "October  Surprise"  has also come to have a generic meaning.
According to William Safire, writing in  the New York Times on or
about August 20,  1996,  "An  'October  Surprise,'  in  political
parlance,  is  the  making  of  big  news  to  affect  a November
election."  Safire points to two  events  which, he says, are "in
the pipeline" -- a possible indictment  of  Hillary  Clinton  for
perjury  and  obstruction  of  justice,  and  a possible punitive
strike against Iran  in  retaliation  for allegedly masterminding
the recent bomb attack  against  a  military  barracks  in  Saudi
Arabia.
 
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ADL: MILITIAS TAKE AIM AT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT

Is there no end to this bilge?

---------------------- Forwarded Message Follows ----------------------

FACT-FINDING REPORT. ARMED & DANGEROUS: MILITIAS TAKE AIM AT THE
FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, Anti-Defamation League.

Introduction: Bands of armed right-wing militants, most calling
themselves "militias," are cropping up across America. They have
no centralized structure, but there are linkages among some of
them, consisting largely of the sharing of propaganda material
and speakers. A survey conducted by the Anti-Defamation League
has found evidence of their activity in no fewer than 13 states.

The aims of these militias, often bellicosely stated, involve
laying the groundwork for massive resistance to the Federal
government and its law enforcement agencies as well as opposition
to gun control laws. In the view of many such extremists,
numbering in the thousands, America's government is the enemy,
now widening its authoritarian control and planning warfare
against the citizenry.
  
To the militia ideologues, gun control legislation -- the Brady
Law, restrictions on assault weapons, etc -- are major stratagems
in a secret government conspiracy to disarm and control the
American people and abolish their Constitutional "right to bear
arms." They are also obsessed with the role of government in two
recent events -- the Branch Davidian confrontation in Waco and
the Randy Weaver siege in Idaho -- which they interpret as signs
of impending tyranny. The answer, say these extremists, is
ultimately, necessarily, paramilitary resistance. An armed and
aroused citizenry must be mobilized and ready for a call to war.
  
For most, if not all, of the militias, the fear of government
confiscation of their weapons is a paramount concern. Samuel
Sherwood, head of the U.S. Militia Association in Idaho, states:
"When they come around to collect weapons, we'll have the legal
and lawful structure to say 'no' to that." Randy Trochmann of the
Militia of Montana gets tougher: "If and when the Federal
government decides to confiscate weapons, people will band
together to stop them. They are not going to give up their guns."
And the "enemy" easily becomes nightmarish: Robert Plummer, a
leader of the Florida State Militia, says that his group is
"capable of defending ourselves against chemical and biological
agents."
  
Although thwarting gun control is the chief aim of the militias,
they seek to turn the clock back on Federal involvement in a host
of other issues as well, e.g., education, abortion, the
environment.

Case in point: Norman Olson, a regional militia commander in
northern Michigan, has envisioned violence erupting if present
government policies continue. Olson, a Baptist minister who owns
a gun shop, declared: "We're talking about a situation where
armed conflict may be inevitable if the country doesn't turn
around." (Emphasis added.) Most often the central issue of the
militants has been the legality of guns themselves. Clearly,
their deeper suspicions and terrors should be of concern: Is
their militant cause merely the alleged gun-toting "right" of
citizens? -- or is it the "turning around" of the U.S. itself
>from  what the militants see as the "treasonous" direction of the
Federal government's present policies? The question which no one
can answer just yet is what, exactly, the "militias" intend to do
with their guns.

Might they still, as many observers hope, limit themselves to the
time-honored means provided by the Constitution -- freedom of
expression, the ballot, the courts, the right of petition -- or
do they intend to resort to lawlessness?

A recent episode in Virginia offers some partial but troubling
evidence. Members of a militia group calling itself the Blue
Ridge Hunt Club were arrested for possession of illegal weapons.
The leader of the group, James Roy Mullins, and three others who
were taken into custody, were found to be stockpiling weapons in
their homes and storage facilities. Found on a computer disk in
Mullins's home was a draft of the group's newsletter stating that
it planned a series of terrorist actions in furtherance of its
aims. According to an ATF official, the group intended to further
arm itself by raiding the National Guard Armory in Pulaski,
Virginia.

A further and vexing problem uncovered by investigation of the
growing militias is the presence in some of them -- even in
leadership roles -- of persons with histories of racial and
religious bigotry and of political extremism. In the Northwest,
for example, we find militia leaders with backgrounds in the
Aryan Nations movement, and elsewhere other erstwhile neo-Nazis
and Ku Kluxers.

The militias are of concern and doubtless will remain so in the
coming months; the are driven by a combustible issue in American
life which remains unresolved -- that of gun control, an issue of
urgency and passion in a society beset by violent crime. Coming
head to head: a cry for weapons restrictions and a perceived
Constitutional right. Most of those siding with the latter are
law-abiding citizens who feel that guns are desirable for
personal defense or for sport. Many of them feel that the
National Rifle Association (NRA) adequately represents their
concerns; others who see the NRA as too moderate have sought out
more extreme advocates such as the American Pistol and Rifle
Association (APRA). Of late, however, still others are resorting
to the mustering of a far more desperate and dangerous
"resistance" --the militia movement that is the focus of this
report.


LAW REPORT. THE ADL ANTI-PARAMILITARY TRAINING STATUTE: A
RESPONSE TO DOMESTIC TERRORISM., Anti-Defamation League.


Introduction: The phenomenon of domestic terrorism, dramatically
and tragically seared on America's consciousness by the
destruction [in April 1995] of the Federal Building in Oklahoma
City, is sadly not new. The Anti-Defamation League has monitored
the activities of hate groups in America for over 80 years, and
has looked for ways to counteract the threat they pose. One ADL
strategy has been to encourage states to enact anti-paramilitary
training statutes, which prohibit systematic instruction in
exercises comparable to military training, including the use of
advanced weaponry, for the purpose of fostering civil disorder.

Twenty-four states have now enacted such legislation based on or
similar to a model ADL initially proposed more than a decade ago.
In light of the recent tragedy in Oklahoma, which has in
particular highlighted the threat posed by the militia movement,
ADL is publishing this new report on our anti-paramilitary
training legislation. We believe this legislation can play a
significant role in deterring future acts of domestic terrorism,
and encourage all those states which do not presently have such
laws to enact them expeditiously.

The hate groups that the ADL statute targets are characterized by
a propensity for lawlessness and violence. Recent events reveal
that the most extreme of them regard violence as necessary in the
face of what they perceive to be impending Federal tyranny.

Many of these groups admit that they are seeking to establish the
groundwork for militant resistance not only to gun control laws,
but more broadly to the Federal government and its law
enforcement agencies. Some groups have already gone so far as to
conduct paramilitary training with organized instruction in
weapons handling and combat tactics. According to the doctrine of
these extremists, the Federal government is the enemy, an enemy
engaged in expanding its authoritarian control and planning
warfare against its citizenry. The training is interspersed with
anti-government and conspiracy-laden propaganda stressing the
need to be armed and ready for an impending war perpetrated by
the Federal government.

In an October 1980 publication, ADL documented the proliferation
of paramilitary training camps then being operated by the Ku Klux
Klan and other racist groups in clandestine training centers
across the country, including the states of Alabama, California,
Connecticut, Illinois, North Carolina and Texas. The report
disclosed that training being provided at these camps was
sophisticated and rigorous. In Texas, for example, the training
included tactical maneuvers, military drills, map reading and
weapons proficiency. Louis Beam, then a Grand Dragon of the Texas
KKK, boasted that Klan paramilitary training in Texas was more
rigorous than that given to U.S. Army soldiers stationed at Fort
Hood.

Some of these activities were labeled by their sponsors as
"defense" or "survival" training courses. Regardless of the label
applied, it was clear that armed racists, pathological enemies of
blacks, Jews, immigrants, and other minority groups, were engaged
in paramilitary training for guerilla warfare against their
alleged adversaries.

It was the activities described in this report which inspired the
ADL Legal Affairs Department to draft model state legislation
which would make it illegal to operate such camps. In attempting
to provide a legislative solution to this problem, the League
drafted a model bill which imposes criminal penalties for weapons
instructors and participants in paramilitary training camps. (See
Appendix A) In the fall of 1986, ADL issued a report providing a
broad introduction to the model anti-paramilitary training
statute. At the time, the League cited 13 states that had adopted
the model statute or a close facsimile. To date, 24 states have
anti-paramilitary training statutes on the books.

While paramilitary training by extremist groups was less
prevalent in the late 1980s, more recently the proliferation of
armed militias has been alarming. Last fall, ADL published a
report entitled "Armed & Dangerous: Militias Take Aim At The
Federal Government" which documented the growth of such militias
throughout the country. The report identified militia activity in
the following states: Arizona, Colorado, Florida, Idaho, Indiana,
Michigan, Missouri, Montana, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North
Carolina, Ohio and Virginia.

In the intervening time period, the number of states with militia
activity has reached 27 and continues to grow. These militias are
characterized by vigilant resistance to gun control laws and
government "overreaching." Moreover, individuals with histories
of racial and religious bigotry are involved in some militias,
even in leadership positions. In the Northwest, for example,
militia leader John Trochmann has been a featured speaker at an
annual Aryan Nations gathering.

Investigations into the militias have uncovered stockpiling of
lethal weaponry. In addition, many of the militias include
paramilitary training as a component of their larger mission. In
Michigan, for instance, a brigade of the Northern Michigan
Regional Militia established in April 1994 has been conducting
training exercises twice a month, reportedly with Chinese SKS
semi-automatic assault rifles and other weapons.

In March 1995, a member of the "freemen" movement was sentenced
by a Roundup, Montana, judge to a ten-year prison term for
felonious acts of terrorism in connection with his movement-
related activities. Followers of this anti-tax movement argue
that they are being deprived of their rights by the Federal
government and prefer to live by their own common law court
system. John Trochmann, the aforementioned leader of the Militia
of Montana, allegedly traveled with five of his followers to
Roundup, armed with an arsenal of weapons. "I believe the men
were here to attempt to capture or kill us," Musselshell County
Attorney John Bohlman told a local reporter. John Trochmann and
his five cohorts were arrested, and a search of their vehicles
revealed a collection of handguns, rifles, communications
equipment, and thousands of rounds of ammunition.

Anti-paramilitary training statutes provide law enforcement with
another tool that could potentially be used effectively against
such groups. They have worked well in the past: a case in point
was the reaction of the Christian Patriots Defense League (CPDL),
an extremist survivalist group which, beginning in 1979, held
propaganda-filled "freedom festivals" where over 1,000 people
engaged in military-style field maneuvers and attended some 55
classes, receiving instruction in, among other subjects, "Guns
and Reloading," "Demolition and Camouflage," "Anti-Aircraft and
Anti-Tank," and "Knife Fighting." In response to Illinois's
passage of an anti-paramilitary training statute, the CPDL moved
the festival to Kicking, Missouri. Missouri then passed its anti-
paramilitary training law, prompting CPDL director John Harrell
to warn invitees about the new law and instructing them not to
bring their firearms to the camp. Many extremists apparently
stayed away from the meeting for this reason.

In Florida, shortly after the enactment of the statute, five
members of the United Klans of America were arrested by the St.
Petersburg Police Department and the Pinellas County Sheriff's
office and charged with planning and training for terrorist acts
against minorities. One year later, two pleaded guilty and two
were convicted by a jury for violating Florida's anti-
paramilitary training statute. The goal of the group, according
to a police informant, was to incite blacks to riot so that
whites would turn to the Klan for leadership. In addition to
training with guns intended to be used against minorities,
members of the group were instructed in the making of incendiary
devices. The statute helped prevent a dangerous situation from
escalating into the kind of violence which could easily have led
to the loss of innocent life.

In North Carolina, violating of a Federal court order not to
operate an illegal paramilitary organization led to the
conviction of the leader of the White Patriot Party (WPP), an
armed racist gang. The court order settling a class action civil
suit prohibited WPP leader Glenn Miller and his organization from
harassing blacks and from violating the state's anti-paramilitary
training statute, also based on the ADL model legislation.

During a jury trial held in Federal district court in Raleigh,
witnesses reported that Miller's group stockpiled weapons and
conducted maneuvers for an eventual attempt to overthrow the U.S.
government and to create a racist state. Miller was sentenced to
six months in prison and three years probation.

In light of recent events involving the "militia movement," the
usefulness of anti-paramilitary training statutes for law
enforcement agencies could not be more apparent.

Contents: Introduction, Legal Analysis, ADL Model Statute
(Appendix A), Civil Disobedience Act 18 U.S.C. 231 et. Seq.
(Appendix B), Individual State Anti-Paramilitary Training
Statutes (Appendix C).


SPECIAL REPORT. PARANOIA AS PATRIOTISM: FAR-RIGHT INFLUENCES ON
THE MILITIA MOVEMENT. Anti-Defamation League. 

Introduction: On April 19, 1995, a large truck bomb destroyed the
Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City, killing 167
people, including 19 children in the building's day care center.
The deadly blast -- the worst act of domestic terrorism in U.S.
history --came on the two-year anniversary of the fiery
culmination of the Federal government's confrontation with the
Branch Davidian sect at its compound in Waco, TX. At first, law
enforcement and the country at large believed the Oklahoma City
explosion to be the work of international terrorists. However,
within days of this tragedy, the evidence pointed to a domestic
origin, and prosecutors alleged that the first man indicted was
motivated by an intense hatred of the Federal government. It was
further reported that the two bombing suspects charged thus far
had some contact with one of the many right-wing paramilitary
"militias" that have emerged in this country over the past year.

In October 1994, the Anti-Defamation League issued a 28-page
fact-finding report entitled, Armed & Dangerous: Militias Take
Aim at the Federal Government, highlighting the proliferation of
militias in America. The ADL findings were based on a survey
which found evidence of militia activity in 13 states. ADL
surveys two weeks after the Oklahoma City bombing indicated
evidence of militia activity in at least 32 states, with signs
that the total number might continue to rise.

The aims of these militias involve laying the groundwork for
large-scale resistance to the Federal government and its law
enforcement agencies, as well as opposing gun control laws. In
the view of many such extremists, America's government is the
enemy, widening its authoritarian control, planning warfare
against the citizenry and utilizing the Bureau of Alcohol,
Tobacco and Firearms and the Federal Bureau of Investigation as
its main instruments.

An additional problem uncovered by investigation of the growing
militias is the presence in some of them -- even in leadership
roles -- of persons with histories of racial and religious
bigotry and experience in political extremism.

In order to provide greater public understanding of the militias'
ideology and historical context, ADL has prepared this report. It
includes a summary account of two events that have fueled the
growth of militias, followed by concise discussions of selected
far-right activists and organizations -- a number of which have
had a significant influence upon or relationship to, the militia
groups.

Contents: Introduction, Rallying Cries of the Ultra-Right: Weaver
and Waco, Forerunners and influences: The Arizona Patriots, Aryan
Nations, Committee of the States, The Covenant the Sword and the
Arm of the Lord, Robert DePugh and The Minutemen, Elohim City,
Colonel James "Bo" Gritz, Gordon Wendell Kahl, Mark Koernke,
Liberty Lobby and The Spotlight, Col. Gordon "Jack" Mohr and the
Christian Patriots Defense League, The Order, William L. Pierce
and The Turner Diaries, The Posse Comitatus, Linda Thompson,
Other Far-Right Activists: Louis R. Beam, "Pastor" Pete Peters,
Thom Robb and the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan.

RESEARCH REPORT. WILLIAM L. PIERCE: NOVELIST OF HATE. ,
Anti-Defamation League. 11 pages.

Introduction: Since the April 19, 1995, bombing in Oklahoma City
by right-wing extremists, attention has been focused on the
groups, individuals and materials that may have influenced the
terrorists who committed that heinous act. One path leads to
William L. Pierce, leader of the "Cosmotheist Community Church"
and long an advocate of a neo-Nazi takeover of America.

Pierce is the author (using the pseudonym Andrew Macdonald) of a
1978 book entitled "The Turner Diaries," a novel popular among
far-right activists, which calls for the violent overthrow of the
Federal government, and the systematic killing of Jews and non-
whites, in order to establish an "Aryan" world. Although there is
no firm evidence that the Oklahoma City bombers read this book,
the parallels are hard to miss.

The book contains this scenario, chillingly similar to that of
Oklahoma City:

"At 9:15 yesterday morning our bomb went off in the FBI's
national headquarters building...the damage is immense. We have
certainly disrupted a major portion of the FBI's headquarters
operations for at least the next several weeks...we gaped with a
mixture of horror and elation at the devastation...

"It is a heavy burden of responsibility for us to bear, since
most of the victims of our bomb were only pawns who were no more
committed to the sick philosophy or the racially destructive
goals of the System than we are.

"But there is no way we can destroy the System without hurting
many thousands of innocent people...And if we don't destroy the
System before it destroys us...our whole race will die." [from
"The Turner Diaries"]

Contents: Introduction, Inspiring "The Order," Long Career in
Bigotry, "Literary" Services, New Location, Anti-Semitism:
Pierce's Raison d'Etre, Conclusion.



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ADL: MILITIAS TAKE AIM AT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT

Is there no end to this bilge?

---------------------- Forwarded Message Follows ----------------------

FACT-FINDING REPORT. ARMED & DANGEROUS: MILITIAS TAKE AIM AT THE
FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, Anti-Defamation League.

Introduction: Bands of armed right-wing militants, most calling
themselves "militias," are cropping up across America. They have
no centralized structure, but there are linkages among some of
them, consisting largely of the sharing of propaganda material
and speakers. A survey conducted by the Anti-Defamation League
has found evidence of their activity in no fewer than 13 states.

The aims of these militias, often bellicosely stated, involve
laying the groundwork for massive resistance to the Federal
government and its law enforcement agencies as well as opposition
to gun control laws. In the view of many such extremists,
numbering in the thousands, America's government is the enemy,
now widening its authoritarian control and planning warfare
against the citizenry.
  
To the militia ideologues, gun control legislation -- the Brady
Law, restrictions on assault weapons, etc -- are major stratagems
in a secret government conspiracy to disarm and control the
American people and abolish their Constitutional "right to bear
arms." They are also obsessed with the role of government in two
recent events -- the Branch Davidian confrontation in Waco and
the Randy Weaver siege in Idaho -- which they interpret as signs
of impending tyranny. The answer, say these extremists, is
ultimately, necessarily, paramilitary resistance. An armed and
aroused citizenry must be mobilized and ready for a call to war.
  
For most, if not all, of the militias, the fear of government
confiscation of their weapons is a paramount concern. Samuel
Sherwood, head of the U.S. Militia Association in Idaho, states:
"When they come around to collect weapons, we'll have the legal
and lawful structure to say 'no' to that." Randy Trochmann of the
Militia of Montana gets tougher: "If and when the Federal
government decides to confiscate weapons, people will band
together to stop them. They are not going to give up their guns."
And the "enemy" easily becomes nightmarish: Robert Plummer, a
leader of the Florida State Militia, says that his group is
"capable of defending ourselves against chemical and biological
agents."
  
Although thwarting gun control is the chief aim of the militias,
they seek to turn the clock back on Federal involvement in a host
of other issues as well, e.g., education, abortion, the
environment.

Case in point: Norman Olson, a regional militia commander in
northern Michigan, has envisioned violence erupting if present
government policies continue. Olson, a Baptist minister who owns
a gun shop, declared: "We're talking about a situation where
armed conflict may be inevitable if the country doesn't turn
around." (Emphasis added.) Most often the central issue of the
militants has been the legality of guns themselves. Clearly,
their deeper suspicions and terrors should be of concern: Is
their militant cause merely the alleged gun-toting "right" of
citizens? -- or is it the "turning around" of the U.S. itself
>from  what the militants see as the "treasonous" direction of the
Federal government's present policies? The question which no one
can answer just yet is what, exactly, the "militias" intend to do
with their guns.

Might they still, as many observers hope, limit themselves to the
time-honored means provided by the Constitution -- freedom of
expression, the ballot, the courts, the right of petition -- or
do they intend to resort to lawlessness?

A recent episode in Virginia offers some partial but troubling
evidence. Members of a militia group calling itself the Blue
Ridge Hunt Club were arrested for possession of illegal weapons.
The leader of the group, James Roy Mullins, and three others who
were taken into custody, were found to be stockpiling weapons in
their homes and storage facilities. Found on a computer disk in
Mullins's home was a draft of the group's newsletter stating that
it planned a series of terrorist actions in furtherance of its
aims. According to an ATF official, the group intended to further
arm itself by raiding the National Guard Armory in Pulaski,
Virginia.

A further and vexing problem uncovered by investigation of the
growing militias is the presence in some of them -- even in
leadership roles -- of persons with histories of racial and
religious bigotry and of political extremism. In the Northwest,
for example, we find militia leaders with backgrounds in the
Aryan Nations movement, and elsewhere other erstwhile neo-Nazis
and Ku Kluxers.

The militias are of concern and doubtless will remain so in the
coming months; the are driven by a combustible issue in American
life which remains unresolved -- that of gun control, an issue of
urgency and passion in a society beset by violent crime. Coming
head to head: a cry for weapons restrictions and a perceived
Constitutional right. Most of those siding with the latter are
law-abiding citizens who feel that guns are desirable for
personal defense or for sport. Many of them feel that the
National Rifle Association (NRA) adequately represents their
concerns; others who see the NRA as too moderate have sought out
more extreme advocates such as the American Pistol and Rifle
Association (APRA). Of late, however, still others are resorting
to the mustering of a far more desperate and dangerous
"resistance" --the militia movement that is the focus of this
report.


LAW REPORT. THE ADL ANTI-PARAMILITARY TRAINING STATUTE: A
RESPONSE TO DOMESTIC TERRORISM., Anti-Defamation League.


Introduction: The phenomenon of domestic terrorism, dramatically
and tragically seared on America's consciousness by the
destruction [in April 1995] of the Federal Building in Oklahoma
City, is sadly not new. The Anti-Defamation League has monitored
the activities of hate groups in America for over 80 years, and
has looked for ways to counteract the threat they pose. One ADL
strategy has been to encourage states to enact anti-paramilitary
training statutes, which prohibit systematic instruction in
exercises comparable to military training, including the use of
advanced weaponry, for the purpose of fostering civil disorder.

Twenty-four states have now enacted such legislation based on or
similar to a model ADL initially proposed more than a decade ago.
In light of the recent tragedy in Oklahoma, which has in
particular highlighted the threat posed by the militia movement,
ADL is publishing this new report on our anti-paramilitary
training legislation. We believe this legislation can play a
significant role in deterring future acts of domestic terrorism,
and encourage all those states which do not presently have such
laws to enact them expeditiously.

The hate groups that the ADL statute targets are characterized by
a propensity for lawlessness and violence. Recent events reveal
that the most extreme of them regard violence as necessary in the
face of what they perceive to be impending Federal tyranny.

Many of these groups admit that they are seeking to establish the
groundwork for militant resistance not only to gun control laws,
but more broadly to the Federal government and its law
enforcement agencies. Some groups have already gone so far as to
conduct paramilitary training with organized instruction in
weapons handling and combat tactics. According to the doctrine of
these extremists, the Federal government is the enemy, an enemy
engaged in expanding its authoritarian control and planning
warfare against its citizenry. The training is interspersed with
anti-government and conspiracy-laden propaganda stressing the
need to be armed and ready for an impending war perpetrated by
the Federal government.

In an October 1980 publication, ADL documented the proliferation
of paramilitary training camps then being operated by the Ku Klux
Klan and other racist groups in clandestine training centers
across the country, including the states of Alabama, California,
Connecticut, Illinois, North Carolina and Texas. The report
disclosed that training being provided at these camps was
sophisticated and rigorous. In Texas, for example, the training
included tactical maneuvers, military drills, map reading and
weapons proficiency. Louis Beam, then a Grand Dragon of the Texas
KKK, boasted that Klan paramilitary training in Texas was more
rigorous than that given to U.S. Army soldiers stationed at Fort
Hood.

Some of these activities were labeled by their sponsors as
"defense" or "survival" training courses. Regardless of the label
applied, it was clear that armed racists, pathological enemies of
blacks, Jews, immigrants, and other minority groups, were engaged
in paramilitary training for guerilla warfare against their
alleged adversaries.

It was the activities described in this report which inspired the
ADL Legal Affairs Department to draft model state legislation
which would make it illegal to operate such camps. In attempting
to provide a legislative solution to this problem, the League
drafted a model bill which imposes criminal penalties for weapons
instructors and participants in paramilitary training camps. (See
Appendix A) In the fall of 1986, ADL issued a report providing a
broad introduction to the model anti-paramilitary training
statute. At the time, the League cited 13 states that had adopted
the model statute or a close facsimile. To date, 24 states have
anti-paramilitary training statutes on the books.

While paramilitary training by extremist groups was less
prevalent in the late 1980s, more recently the proliferation of
armed militias has been alarming. Last fall, ADL published a
report entitled "Armed & Dangerous: Militias Take Aim At The
Federal Government" which documented the growth of such militias
throughout the country. The report identified militia activity in
the following states: Arizona, Colorado, Florida, Idaho, Indiana,
Michigan, Missouri, Montana, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North
Carolina, Ohio and Virginia.

In the intervening time period, the number of states with militia
activity has reached 27 and continues to grow. These militias are
characterized by vigilant resistance to gun control laws and
government "overreaching." Moreover, individuals with histories
of racial and religious bigotry are involved in some militias,
even in leadership positions. In the Northwest, for example,
militia leader John Trochmann has been a featured speaker at an
annual Aryan Nations gathering.

Investigations into the militias have uncovered stockpiling of
lethal weaponry. In addition, many of the militias include
paramilitary training as a component of their larger mission. In
Michigan, for instance, a brigade of the Northern Michigan
Regional Militia established in April 1994 has been conducting
training exercises twice a month, reportedly with Chinese SKS
semi-automatic assault rifles and other weapons.

In March 1995, a member of the "freemen" movement was sentenced
by a Roundup, Montana, judge to a ten-year prison term for
felonious acts of terrorism in connection with his movement-
related activities. Followers of this anti-tax movement argue
that they are being deprived of their rights by the Federal
government and prefer to live by their own common law court
system. John Trochmann, the aforementioned leader of the Militia
of Montana, allegedly traveled with five of his followers to
Roundup, armed with an arsenal of weapons. "I believe the men
were here to attempt to capture or kill us," Musselshell County
Attorney John Bohlman told a local reporter. John Trochmann and
his five cohorts were arrested, and a search of their vehicles
revealed a collection of handguns, rifles, communications
equipment, and thousands of rounds of ammunition.

Anti-paramilitary training statutes provide law enforcement with
another tool that could potentially be used effectively against
such groups. They have worked well in the past: a case in point
was the reaction of the Christian Patriots Defense League (CPDL),
an extremist survivalist group which, beginning in 1979, held
propaganda-filled "freedom festivals" where over 1,000 people
engaged in military-style field maneuvers and attended some 55
classes, receiving instruction in, among other subjects, "Guns
and Reloading," "Demolition and Camouflage," "Anti-Aircraft and
Anti-Tank," and "Knife Fighting." In response to Illinois's
passage of an anti-paramilitary training statute, the CPDL moved
the festival to Kicking, Missouri. Missouri then passed its anti-
paramilitary training law, prompting CPDL director John Harrell
to warn invitees about the new law and instructing them not to
bring their firearms to the camp. Many extremists apparently
stayed away from the meeting for this reason.

In Florida, shortly after the enactment of the statute, five
members of the United Klans of America were arrested by the St.
Petersburg Police Department and the Pinellas County Sheriff's
office and charged with planning and training for terrorist acts
against minorities. One year later, two pleaded guilty and two
were convicted by a jury for violating Florida's anti-
paramilitary training statute. The goal of the group, according
to a police informant, was to incite blacks to riot so that
whites would turn to the Klan for leadership. In addition to
training with guns intended to be used against minorities,
members of the group were instructed in the making of incendiary
devices. The statute helped prevent a dangerous situation from
escalating into the kind of violence which could easily have led
to the loss of innocent life.

In North Carolina, violating of a Federal court order not to
operate an illegal paramilitary organization led to the
conviction of the leader of the White Patriot Party (WPP), an
armed racist gang. The court order settling a class action civil
suit prohibited WPP leader Glenn Miller and his organization from
harassing blacks and from violating the state's anti-paramilitary
training statute, also based on the ADL model legislation.

During a jury trial held in Federal district court in Raleigh,
witnesses reported that Miller's group stockpiled weapons and
conducted maneuvers for an eventual attempt to overthrow the U.S.
government and to create a racist state. Miller was sentenced to
six months in prison and three years probation.

In light of recent events involving the "militia movement," the
usefulness of anti-paramilitary training statutes for law
enforcement agencies could not be more apparent.

Contents: Introduction, Legal Analysis, ADL Model Statute
(Appendix A), Civil Disobedience Act 18 U.S.C. 231 et. Seq.
(Appendix B), Individual State Anti-Paramilitary Training
Statutes (Appendix C).


SPECIAL REPORT. PARANOIA AS PATRIOTISM: FAR-RIGHT INFLUENCES ON
THE MILITIA MOVEMENT. Anti-Defamation League. 

Introduction: On April 19, 1995, a large truck bomb destroyed the
Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City, killing 167
people, including 19 children in the building's day care center.
The deadly blast -- the worst act of domestic terrorism in U.S.
history --came on the two-year anniversary of the fiery
culmination of the Federal government's confrontation with the
Branch Davidian sect at its compound in Waco, TX. At first, law
enforcement and the country at large believed the Oklahoma City
explosion to be the work of international terrorists. However,
within days of this tragedy, the evidence pointed to a domestic
origin, and prosecutors alleged that the first man indicted was
motivated by an intense hatred of the Federal government. It was
further reported that the two bombing suspects charged thus far
had some contact with one of the many right-wing paramilitary
"militias" that have emerged in this country over the past year.

In October 1994, the Anti-Defamation League issued a 28-page
fact-finding report entitled, Armed & Dangerous: Militias Take
Aim at the Federal Government, highlighting the proliferation of
militias in America. The ADL findings were based on a survey
which found evidence of militia activity in 13 states. ADL
surveys two weeks after the Oklahoma City bombing indicated
evidence of militia activity in at least 32 states, with signs
that the total number might continue to rise.

The aims of these militias involve laying the groundwork for
large-scale resistance to the Federal government and its law
enforcement agencies, as well as opposing gun control laws. In
the view of many such extremists, America's government is the
enemy, widening its authoritarian control, planning warfare
against the citizenry and utilizing the Bureau of Alcohol,
Tobacco and Firearms and the Federal Bureau of Investigation as
its main instruments.

An additional problem uncovered by investigation of the growing
militias is the presence in some of them -- even in leadership
roles -- of persons with histories of racial and religious
bigotry and experience in political extremism.

In order to provide greater public understanding of the militias'
ideology and historical context, ADL has prepared this report. It
includes a summary account of two events that have fueled the
growth of militias, followed by concise discussions of selected
far-right activists and organizations -- a number of which have
had a significant influence upon or relationship to, the militia
groups.

Contents: Introduction, Rallying Cries of the Ultra-Right: Weaver
and Waco, Forerunners and influences: The Arizona Patriots, Aryan
Nations, Committee of the States, The Covenant the Sword and the
Arm of the Lord, Robert DePugh and The Minutemen, Elohim City,
Colonel James "Bo" Gritz, Gordon Wendell Kahl, Mark Koernke,
Liberty Lobby and The Spotlight, Col. Gordon "Jack" Mohr and the
Christian Patriots Defense League, The Order, William L. Pierce
and The Turner Diaries, The Posse Comitatus, Linda Thompson,
Other Far-Right Activists: Louis R. Beam, "Pastor" Pete Peters,
Thom Robb and the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan.

RESEARCH REPORT. WILLIAM L. PIERCE: NOVELIST OF HATE. ,
Anti-Defamation League. 11 pages.

Introduction: Since the April 19, 1995, bombing in Oklahoma City
by right-wing extremists, attention has been focused on the
groups, individuals and materials that may have influenced the
terrorists who committed that heinous act. One path leads to
William L. Pierce, leader of the "Cosmotheist Community Church"
and long an advocate of a neo-Nazi takeover of America.

Pierce is the author (using the pseudonym Andrew Macdonald) of a
1978 book entitled "The Turner Diaries," a novel popular among
far-right activists, which calls for the violent overthrow of the
Federal government, and the systematic killing of Jews and non-
whites, in order to establish an "Aryan" world. Although there is
no firm evidence that the Oklahoma City bombers read this book,
the parallels are hard to miss.

The book contains this scenario, chillingly similar to that of
Oklahoma City:

"At 9:15 yesterday morning our bomb went off in the FBI's
national headquarters building...the damage is immense. We have
certainly disrupted a major portion of the FBI's headquarters
operations for at least the next several weeks...we gaped with a
mixture of horror and elation at the devastation...

"It is a heavy burden of responsibility for us to bear, since
most of the victims of our bomb were only pawns who were no more
committed to the sick philosophy or the racially destructive
goals of the System than we are.

"But there is no way we can destroy the System without hurting
many thousands of innocent people...And if we don't destroy the
System before it destroys us...our whole race will die." [from
"The Turner Diaries"]

Contents: Introduction, Inspiring "The Order," Long Career in
Bigotry, "Literary" Services, New Location, Anti-Semitism:
Pierce's Raison d'Etre, Conclusion.




From lloyd@a-albionic.com Mon Oct 28 08:11:39 PST 1996
Article: 104235 of alt.conspiracy
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From: Lloyd Miller 
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.org.cia
Subject: Linda Thompson vs Gary Hunt
Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 06:32:35 -0400
Organization: Msen
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Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.conspiracy:104235 alt.politics.org.cia:14297

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 02:04:41 -0400
From: Ian Goddard 
To: "Mark A. Smith" 
Cc: prj@mail.msen.com, opf@azi.com
Subject: Re: WARNING (fwd)

 >> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
 >> Date: Wed, 16 Oct 96 04:14 EST
 >> From: Linda Thompson 

 >> An extremely dangerous, well-known government operative, Gary Hunt, is
 >> now on the internet, putting out a publication called "Beyond the
Fringe,"   >> (BTF).

IAN: Linda Thompson calls 90% of all moving objects govt agents.
Interestingly, 100% of those objects voice ideas contrary
to her conspiracy theories. Is there a pattern afoot ?

Her many claims as I've reviewed -- before I too got on her shit
list for asking too many questions -- seem to be consistently
unreliable in the * extreme.*  Her main input -- since her famous
Ultimatum calling for violence against the U.S. govt where she
says she gathered thousands of names of others who wanted to
join her Washington D.C. invasion before she said she decided
she was only joking -- seems to be spreading suspicion about
the majority of anti-govt activists and conspiracy researchers
with theories contrary to her error filled and usually baseless
theories.

So let's review this one on the face of it:

This "Bob Hunt" is a "well-known govt operative." Let's see
now, the govt is the agency that issues legal identity. They
are the masters of ID. But alas this "well-known govt op"
named "Bob Hunt" is just stuck this ID he just can't
shake. Gee, perhaps the govt should get into the ID
business so they could change their operatives
identity at will.

Right off the bat it looks like
run of the mill Thompsonian B.S.

 >> His ENTIRE purpose in life is to recruit people into criminal activity
 >> and get them arrested or killed, or both, while using them to attack
 >> *GOVERNMENT* targets of the FBI (which, of course, is then blamed on
 >> "militia" and the FBI always puts out stories claiming he is "militia.")
 >> His group is "Sons of Liberty" and includes several other well-known
 >> operatives out of Texas.

IAN: And with the endless list of attacks on the govt and all
with Bob Hunt's name written all over it, why it's just too obvious.

What's more, he's in a group of other operatives.
Well there ya go, what do ya know, they must all
be ops. . .why Linda says so.

And now look who's saying people are govt agents if they try to
invoke acts of violence against the govt. Gee, wow. I remember
Linda's first planned attack on the govt DURING the Waco siege
where she amassed some rag tag bunch was used by none other
than Janet Reno as one of the reasons why they had to attack
the Davidians on the 19th. Why'd Linda have to go and give
Janet that reason ??!!

Now Linda claims almost half of the Davidian survivors are govt
agents, they too say things contrary to Thompsonian conspiracy
theory. If even the burned victims don't toe the Thompsonian
line, they too must be govt agents, it's just so simple to see.

 >> He provided a PO Box in Mesa, Arizona and an e-mail address
 >> of opf@azi.com.

IAN: Oooh ah. Arizona, that well known govt agent hideout.
Can't trust any from there, much less anywhere else.

 >> I do not have time to post the background on Hunt right this sec, but
 >> will by this weekend for those who don't know who and what he is.

IAN: I'm sure, IF she can find the time. "Mr. X is a govt
agent. Facts? Uh, gotta go now, bye." By then most will
have forgotten, but alas, she's planted her evil seed
that will be manifest in the lingering thought "I've
heard that that BTF thing is some govt front. Gee,
I think I better listen only to Linda Thompson,
everyone else seems to be a govt agent."

 >> We also have pictures of him.

IAN: Wow, there ya go, pictures too oooh.
It sounds like the case is closed.

I've also got lots of pictures, I never
realized they must all be of govt agents.

************************************************************************
 IAN GODDARD    Q U E S T I O N   A U T H O R I T Y
------------------------------------------------------------------------
 VISIT Ian Goddard's Universe   ----->    http://www.erols.com/igoddard
________________________________________________________________________

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From bogart1@earthlink.net Tue Oct 29 00:48:53 PST 1996
Article: 42167 of misc.activism.militia
X-No-Archive: yes
Approved: militia-request@atype.com (9b8ccef72a14a6f20b1042d1c8cc2fea)
From: bogart1@earthlink.net (Tim Hill)
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Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: Tue, 29 Oct 96 5:34:05 GMT
Message-ID: <846567245$28111@atype.com>
Subject: Linda Thompson: Militia Intellectual
Lines: 19


I recieved the e-mail following e-mail from Dr. Linda Thompson. 
Appearantly, she doesn't like my scientology page. Funny thing is that I 
don't have a scientology page. Perhaps she meant my militia page. Oh 
well, Miltia, Scientology, I guess one is as valid as the other.

Date sent:        Mon, 28 Oct 1996 23:29:56 -0800
From:             "Dr. Linda Thompson" 
Organization:     American Justice Federation
To:               bogart1@earthlink.net
Copies to:        lindat@iquest.net
Subject:          Your scientology webpage

Lame.

Tim Hill

Art Bell and Militia Parody Pages:
http://home.earthlink.net/~bogart1/


From dkuehne@erols.com Tue Oct 29 00:48:55 PST 1996
Article: 42177 of misc.activism.militia
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Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: Tue, 29 Oct 96 6:05:44 GMT
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Subject: America Under Siege-more confirmation
Lines: 18


I just received the following comment from someone I had sent E-mail concerning
the CIA-cocaine connection. This particular comment was totally unexpected
considering that this was not the issue I was trying to raise. If this is true
(and I have high confidence for several reasons) then time is very short.
This is further confirmation (as if we need any more) that what Linda Thompson
warned us about in "America Under Siege" is *REALLY* happening. This is *NO* joke.

--------------------- Excerpt From Private E-mail ---------------------

That's right, I guess we need to pray.  I believe the time clock is
ticking.  I did the 8 months at a half way house for criminals that had
spent 5 to 10 years.  Every one of them told me that when they were doing
their time they were forced to go out and build concentration camps
across the United States.  Some were told it was for people who are
going to oppose the New World Order.  It is only a matter of time,
especially if Clinton gets re-elected.

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