The Nizkor Project: Remembering the Holocaust (Shoah)

Shofar FTP Archive File: people/k/kreiberg.ole/1995/kreiberg.1195


From olk@login.dknet.dk Thu Nov  2 06:08:59 PST 1995
Article: 13494 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: MY PROBLEMS WITH THE GERMAN GOVERNMENT
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 1995 20:45:44 -0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
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In article <46c56k$8jm@dns.enter.net>, Yale F. Edeiken wrote:
>
>   However unjustified the German laws are on a philosophical basis, they were 
>made, at bottom, to give the German government some basis upon which they 
>could move against neo-Nazi activity no matter the guise it appeared under.  The 
>people who made that law were victims of the Nazi regime just as were the the 
>people murdered in the concentration camps.  All of them had lost friends and 
>relatives because their country had been stolen by a group of irrational fanatics.  
>All of them had seen the devastation brought to their country by the ambitions of 
>those fanatics.  That they do not wish it to happen again is understandable.  That 
>they do not wish that madness to be justified -- in this case by denying a very 
>significant aspect of that madness -- is also understandable.  Whether or not you 
>disagree with the methods they chose then and now choose to continue is 
>irrelevant to their motives.  Certainly your characterization of their motives by 
>referring to them as tyranny was as misplaced and poorly considered as your 
>technical objections to the crematoria.
>
>    --YFE

  I still find it tyranical to sentence a man to 3½ years of prison for as 
little as denying the holocaust. To me this is simply madness and proves 
that the Germans have not changed so much the last 50 years as they pretend.

Ole Kreiberg
 
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Mon Nov  6 11:05:30 PST 1995
Article: 13777 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!kryten.awinc.com!news.netnet.net!news.inc.net!news.sol.net!daily-planet.execpc.com!spool.mu.edu!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!newsfeed.internetmci.com!EU.net!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Mein Kampf and Holocaust denial.
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 1995 09:58:58 +0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 40
Distribution: world
Message-ID: 
References: <81535147410267@inet.uni-c.dk>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article <81535147410267@inet.uni-c.dk>, Peter Herngaard wrote:
>Hello All
>
>Once I heard that Mein Kampf is forbidden in Germany and that a L!nder in
>Germany tries to prevent the publishing of this book.
>I have been told that possession of this book is punishable by a long prison sentence in Germany and Austria.
>Anyone who can tell me how the legislation is in USA and other western countries?
>Since this book is not forbidden in Denmark, where i live, I search
>for an electronically available copy of this book for reading only.
>Another question I find very  interesting is, how can Germany prosecute
>Garry Laugh for writing articles in the USA if the German goverment has no
>legal authority to judge what Americans do in their own country?
>If I said (this is NOT my opinion):"Holocaust did probably not take place" I would be subject to
>imprisonment in Germany and in Austria.
>But how is the legislation concerning Holocaust denial in other European and
>American countries?

In the USA there are even more freedom of speech than in Denmark. Holocaust-
denying is regarded a thought-crime in 4 crazy countries in Europe. It is
Germany, France, Austria and Switzerland.
                                         
>In Denmark where I live a right-winged group is being allowed to broadcast
>radio, but would it be allowable in the USA etc?

  The group you are referring to, is not just any "right-winged" group. It 
is DNSB, The Danish National Socialist Movement, that is the Danish Naziparty.
Do you remember "Radio Holger" which belonged to the Nationalpartiet Danmark
(The Danish National Party). I was lecturing there for more than 2 hours on
revisionism. 

  I had a leave for education in 1994 which I spent in the USA. Every 
saturday evening I was listening to the excellent radio program "American 
dissident voices" WRNO on 7355 MHZ shortvawe. This program is the mouth-piece
for the The National Alliance. 


Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Mon Nov  6 11:05:31 PST 1995
Article: 13795 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!kryten.awinc.com!news.netnet.net!news.inc.net!news.sol.net!daily-planet.execpc.com!spool.mu.edu!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news.uoregon.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!wave.news.pipex.net!pipex!dish.news.pipex.net!pipex!news00.sunet.se!sunic!news99.sunet.se!news.uni-c.dk!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 1995 21:57:38 +0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 25
Message-ID: 
References:  <471g79$kui@dns.enter.net>  <477fdk$924@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article <477fdk$924@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>, John Morris wrote:
>
>Mr. Kreiberg's desperate objection seems to be that the SS could not
>have cremated anybody. The fact the the body would ignite is not an
>argument against crematoria doing exactly what they were designed to
>do. Next Mr. Kreiberg will be arguing that there could have been no
>blitzkrieg because the Nazis' vehicles rolled across the ground
>instead of sinking into the earth.
>
  You are distorting what I have written. I have never claimed that the
SS was not able to cremate bodies. I have only questioned that they were
able to operate crematories in a way different from the one used outside 
the camps. Ivan Lagace suggested a maximum of 3 bodies per oven a
day. If you exclude the alleged explosion danger and omit to let the ovens
cool down after each cremation, you may be able to cremate perhaps 10 bodies 
in 24 hours. According to the established historiography there was supposed 
to be 46 ovens in Auschwitz. This will make a maximum of 460 cremations a 
day. The anti-revisionists are claiming that around 4000 a day would be the 
maximum.
  I am not doubting the possibility that some corpses could have been burnt 
on pyres, but I do not believe in the burning pits.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Mon Nov  6 11:05:32 PST 1995
Article: 13842 of alt.revisionism
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!kryten.awinc.com!news.netnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news00.sunet.se!sunic!news99.sunet.se!news.uni-c.dk!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 1995 21:53:21 -0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 25
Message-ID: 
References:  <46v6tl$dkk@nimitz.fibr.net>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article , Daniel Keren wrote:
>olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
>
># According to the testimony by Ivan Lagace as quoted by Ernst 
># Zundel a body may explode, if it exposed *too sudden* to enourmous
># heat (in this case app 760C). 
>
>1) Did this ever happen? Yes or no? Answer the question, it's
>   a simple question. Are there reports of corpses "exploding"
>   when exposed to such heat? Yes or no?

  Ivan Lagace mentioned that it would take a week to repair an oven that had
been damaged from such an explosion. Again the question should be addressed
to him and not to me. 

>2) What about the crematory operator John Morris spoke with? He
>   said the furnace is pre-heated to, if I recall, 850 degrees,
>   and he doesn't recall any "explosion" taking place. 
>
  I have explained the difference several times between the modern oven and
model in use in the forties.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Mon Nov  6 11:05:33 PST 1995
Article: 13843 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 1995 22:04:24 -0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 21
Message-ID: 
References:    <479v2h$pc8@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article <479v2h$pc8@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>, John Morris wrote:
>
>Sorry, but I seem to have lost track of exactly what it is that you
>are trying to prove. Are you now saying that cremation is impossible
>because bodies have a lot of water in them or that it is so difficult
>that no one is ever cremated?

 You know very well that from the beginning the discussion has been about,
how many bodies it was possible to burn a day. No revisionist has never 
denied that there in each concentration camp were one or more crematories, 
and that bodies were cremated there. It is only the capacity of those ovens
that has been the controversy. 

 Maybe we should finish this discussion now, as only real experts
in this field will be able to answer this question. 


Ole Kreiberg.

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.cyberstore.ca!van-bc!io.org!chi-news.cic.net!newsxfer.itd.umich.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.sprintlink.net!EU.net!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 1995 21:36:02 +0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 18
Message-ID: 
References:  
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article , Mark Van Alstine wrote:
>In article , olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole
>Kreiberg) wrote:
>
>> Where the working temperature of the modern gasfired oven is around 1000C, 
>> it was around 760C in the coke- and coalfired ovens from the forties. There 
>> were no flames to ignite the body in the older type.
>
>You _do_ realize how utterly silly this sounds? This is akin to saying
>that paper will not ignite at 451F or above without being exposed to a
>flame first. 
>
  Around 60 per cent of the human body consists of water. This means that 
human bodies do not burn easily, while the opposite is the case with paper.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.cyberstore.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!news.bc.net!news.uoregon.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.sprintlink.net!EU.net!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 1995 21:45:53 +0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 15
Message-ID: 
References:  <46v6tl$dkk@nimitz.fibr.net>   
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article , MORRISON  KEITH MUR wrote:
>
>Allow me to be more precise.  I have seen reports of fires in conditions 
>that could approximate the interior of a furnace (inside vehicles for 
>instance) and BODIES DO NOT EXPLODE.  And it is Kreiberg who is claiming 
>that bodies go bang, not Legace.
>
  As I have said before, it is not my allegation that bodies may explode, if  
exposed too suddenly to enourmous heat. I have just repeated, what Zundel has 
been quoting from Ivan Lagace testimony. 

Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!cdc2.cdc.net!news1.cris.com!news.sprintlink.net!EU.net!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: MY PROBLEMS WITH THE GERMAN GOVERNMENT
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 1995 20:45:44 -0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <8g-bmOev1WuQ065yn@login.dknet.dk>
References:  <46c56k$8jm@dns.enter.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT

In article <46c56k$8jm@dns.enter.net>, Yale F. Edeiken wrote:
>
>   However unjustified the German laws are on a philosophical basis, they were 
>made, at bottom, to give the German government some basis upon which they 
>could move against neo-Nazi activity no matter the guise it appeared under.  The 
>people who made that law were victims of the Nazi regime just as were the the 
>people murdered in the concentration camps.  All of them had lost friends and 
>relatives because their country had been stolen by a group of irrational fanatics.  
>All of them had seen the devastation brought to their country by the ambitions of 
>those fanatics.  That they do not wish it to happen again is understandable.  That 
>they do not wish that madness to be justified -- in this case by denying a very 
>significant aspect of that madness -- is also understandable.  Whether or not you 
>disagree with the methods they chose then and now choose to continue is 
>irrelevant to their motives.  Certainly your characterization of their motives by 
>referring to them as tyranny was as misplaced and poorly considered as your 
>technical objections to the crematoria.
>
>    --YFE

  I still find it tyranical to sentence a man to 3½ years of prison for as 
little as denying the holocaust. To me this is simply madness and proves 
that the Germans have not changed so much the last 50 years as they pretend.

Ole Kreiberg
 
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!kryten.awinc.com!news.netnet.net!news.inc.net!news.sol.net!daily-planet.execpc.com!spool.mu.edu!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!newsfeed.internetmci.com!EU.net!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Mein Kampf and Holocaust denial.
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 1995 09:58:58 +0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 40
Distribution: world
Message-ID: 
References: <81535147410267@inet.uni-c.dk>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article <81535147410267@inet.uni-c.dk>, Peter Herngaard wrote:
>Hello All
>
>Once I heard that Mein Kampf is forbidden in Germany and that a L!nder in
>Germany tries to prevent the publishing of this book.
>I have been told that possession of this book is punishable by a long prison sentence in Germany and Austria.
>Anyone who can tell me how the legislation is in USA and other western countries?
>Since this book is not forbidden in Denmark, where i live, I search
>for an electronically available copy of this book for reading only.
>Another question I find very  interesting is, how can Germany prosecute
>Garry Laugh for writing articles in the USA if the German goverment has no
>legal authority to judge what Americans do in their own country?
>If I said (this is NOT my opinion):"Holocaust did probably not take place" I would be subject to
>imprisonment in Germany and in Austria.
>But how is the legislation concerning Holocaust denial in other European and
>American countries?

In the USA there are even more freedom of speech than in Denmark. Holocaust-
denying is regarded a thought-crime in 4 crazy countries in Europe. It is
Germany, France, Austria and Switzerland.
                                         
>In Denmark where I live a right-winged group is being allowed to broadcast
>radio, but would it be allowable in the USA etc?

  The group you are referring to, is not just any "right-winged" group. It 
is DNSB, The Danish National Socialist Movement, that is the Danish Naziparty.
Do you remember "Radio Holger" which belonged to the Nationalpartiet Danmark
(The Danish National Party). I was lecturing there for more than 2 hours on
revisionism. 

  I had a leave for education in 1994 which I spent in the USA. Every 
saturday evening I was listening to the excellent radio program "American 
dissident voices" WRNO on 7355 MHZ shortvawe. This program is the mouth-piece
for the The National Alliance. 


Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!kryten.awinc.com!news.netnet.net!news.inc.net!news.sol.net!daily-planet.execpc.com!spool.mu.edu!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!news.uoregon.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!wave.news.pipex.net!pipex!dish.news.pipex.net!pipex!news00.sunet.se!sunic!news99.sunet.se!news.uni-c.dk!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 1995 21:57:38 +0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 25
Message-ID: 
References:  <471g79$kui@dns.enter.net>  <477fdk$924@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article <477fdk$924@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>, John Morris wrote:
>
>Mr. Kreiberg's desperate objection seems to be that the SS could not
>have cremated anybody. The fact the the body would ignite is not an
>argument against crematoria doing exactly what they were designed to
>do. Next Mr. Kreiberg will be arguing that there could have been no
>blitzkrieg because the Nazis' vehicles rolled across the ground
>instead of sinking into the earth.
>
  You are distorting what I have written. I have never claimed that the
SS was not able to cremate bodies. I have only questioned that they were
able to operate crematories in a way different from the one used outside 
the camps. Ivan Lagace suggested a maximum of 3 bodies per oven a
day. If you exclude the alleged explosion danger and omit to let the ovens
cool down after each cremation, you may be able to cremate perhaps 10 bodies 
in 24 hours. According to the established historiography there was supposed 
to be 46 ovens in Auschwitz. This will make a maximum of 460 cremations a 
day. The anti-revisionists are claiming that around 4000 a day would be the 
maximum.
  I am not doubting the possibility that some corpses could have been burnt 
on pyres, but I do not believe in the burning pits.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!kryten.awinc.com!news.netnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news00.sunet.se!sunic!news99.sunet.se!news.uni-c.dk!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 1995 21:53:21 -0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 25
Message-ID: 
References:  <46v6tl$dkk@nimitz.fibr.net>  
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article , Daniel Keren wrote:
>olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
>
># According to the testimony by Ivan Lagace as quoted by Ernst 
># Zundel a body may explode, if it exposed *too sudden* to enourmous
># heat (in this case app 760C). 
>
>1) Did this ever happen? Yes or no? Answer the question, it's
>   a simple question. Are there reports of corpses "exploding"
>   when exposed to such heat? Yes or no?

  Ivan Lagace mentioned that it would take a week to repair an oven that had
been damaged from such an explosion. Again the question should be addressed
to him and not to me. 

>2) What about the crematory operator John Morris spoke with? He
>   said the furnace is pre-heated to, if I recall, 850 degrees,
>   and he doesn't recall any "explosion" taking place. 
>
  I have explained the difference several times between the modern oven and
model in use in the forties.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!kryten.awinc.com!news.netnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news00.sunet.se!sunic!news99.sunet.se!news.uni-c.dk!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 1995 22:04:24 -0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 21
Message-ID: 
References:    <479v2h$pc8@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article <479v2h$pc8@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>, John Morris wrote:
>
>Sorry, but I seem to have lost track of exactly what it is that you
>are trying to prove. Are you now saying that cremation is impossible
>because bodies have a lot of water in them or that it is so difficult
>that no one is ever cremated?

 You know very well that from the beginning the discussion has been about,
how many bodies it was possible to burn a day. No revisionist has never 
denied that there in each concentration camp were one or more crematories, 
and that bodies were cremated there. It is only the capacity of those ovens
that has been the controversy. 

 Maybe we should finish this discussion now, as only real experts
in this field will be able to answer this question. 


Ole Kreiberg.

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.cyberstore.ca!van-bc!io.org!chi-news.cic.net!newsxfer.itd.umich.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.sprintlink.net!EU.net!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 1995 21:36:02 +0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 18
Message-ID: 
References:  
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article , Mark Van Alstine wrote:
>In article , olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole
>Kreiberg) wrote:
>
>> Where the working temperature of the modern gasfired oven is around 1000C, 
>> it was around 760C in the coke- and coalfired ovens from the forties. There 
>> were no flames to ignite the body in the older type.
>
>You _do_ realize how utterly silly this sounds? This is akin to saying
>that paper will not ignite at 451F or above without being exposed to a
>flame first. 
>
  Around 60 per cent of the human body consists of water. This means that 
human bodies do not burn easily, while the opposite is the case with paper.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.cyberstore.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!news.bc.net!news.uoregon.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!news.sprintlink.net!EU.net!dkuug!cph-1.news.DK.net!dknet!usenet
From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 1995 21:45:53 +0100
Organization: DKnet / EUnet Denmark - Login Tjenesten
Lines: 15
Message-ID: 
References:  <46v6tl$dkk@nimitz.fibr.net>   
NNTP-Posting-Host: login.dknet.dk

In article , MORRISON  KEITH MUR wrote:
>
>Allow me to be more precise.  I have seen reports of fires in conditions 
>that could approximate the interior of a furnace (inside vehicles for 
>instance) and BODIES DO NOT EXPLODE.  And it is Kreiberg who is claiming 
>that bodies go bang, not Legace.
>
  As I have said before, it is not my allegation that bodies may explode, if  
exposed too suddenly to enourmous heat. I have just repeated, what Zundel has 
been quoting from Ivan Lagace testimony. 

Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: MY PROBLEMS WITH THE GERMAN GOVERNMENT
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 1995 20:45:44 -0100
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In article <46c56k$8jm@dns.enter.net>, Yale F. Edeiken wrote:
>
>   However unjustified the German laws are on a philosophical basis, they were 
>made, at bottom, to give the German government some basis upon which they 
>could move against neo-Nazi activity no matter the guise it appeared under.  The 
>people who made that law were victims of the Nazi regime just as were the the 
>people murdered in the concentration camps.  All of them had lost friends and 
>relatives because their country had been stolen by a group of irrational fanatics.  
>All of them had seen the devastation brought to their country by the ambitions of 
>those fanatics.  That they do not wish it to happen again is understandable.  That 
>they do not wish that madness to be justified -- in this case by denying a very 
>significant aspect of that madness -- is also understandable.  Whether or not you 
>disagree with the methods they chose then and now choose to continue is 
>irrelevant to their motives.  Certainly your characterization of their motives by 
>referring to them as tyranny was as misplaced and poorly considered as your 
>technical objections to the crematoria.
>
>    --YFE

  I still find it tyranical to sentence a man to 3½ years of prison for as 
little as denying the holocaust. To me this is simply madness and proves 
that the Germans have not changed so much the last 50 years as they pretend.

Ole Kreiberg
 
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Mein Kampf and Holocaust denial.
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 1995 09:58:58 +0100
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In article <81535147410267@inet.uni-c.dk>, Peter Herngaard wrote:
>Hello All
>
>Once I heard that Mein Kampf is forbidden in Germany and that a L!nder in
>Germany tries to prevent the publishing of this book.
>I have been told that possession of this book is punishable by a long prison sentence in Germany and Austria.
>Anyone who can tell me how the legislation is in USA and other western countries?
>Since this book is not forbidden in Denmark, where i live, I search
>for an electronically available copy of this book for reading only.
>Another question I find very  interesting is, how can Germany prosecute
>Garry Laugh for writing articles in the USA if the German goverment has no
>legal authority to judge what Americans do in their own country?
>If I said (this is NOT my opinion):"Holocaust did probably not take place" I would be subject to
>imprisonment in Germany and in Austria.
>But how is the legislation concerning Holocaust denial in other European and
>American countries?

In the USA there are even more freedom of speech than in Denmark. Holocaust-
denying is regarded a thought-crime in 4 crazy countries in Europe. It is
Germany, France, Austria and Switzerland.
                                         
>In Denmark where I live a right-winged group is being allowed to broadcast
>radio, but would it be allowable in the USA etc?

  The group you are referring to, is not just any "right-winged" group. It 
is DNSB, The Danish National Socialist Movement, that is the Danish Naziparty.
Do you remember "Radio Holger" which belonged to the Nationalpartiet Danmark
(The Danish National Party). I was lecturing there for more than 2 hours on
revisionism. 

  I had a leave for education in 1994 which I spent in the USA. Every 
saturday evening I was listening to the excellent radio program "American 
dissident voices" WRNO on 7355 MHZ shortvawe. This program is the mouth-piece
for the The National Alliance. 


Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 1995 21:57:38 +0100
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In article <477fdk$924@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>, John Morris wrote:
>
>Mr. Kreiberg's desperate objection seems to be that the SS could not
>have cremated anybody. The fact the the body would ignite is not an
>argument against crematoria doing exactly what they were designed to
>do. Next Mr. Kreiberg will be arguing that there could have been no
>blitzkrieg because the Nazis' vehicles rolled across the ground
>instead of sinking into the earth.
>
  You are distorting what I have written. I have never claimed that the
SS was not able to cremate bodies. I have only questioned that they were
able to operate crematories in a way different from the one used outside 
the camps. Ivan Lagace suggested a maximum of 3 bodies per oven a
day. If you exclude the alleged explosion danger and omit to let the ovens
cool down after each cremation, you may be able to cremate perhaps 10 bodies 
in 24 hours. According to the established historiography there was supposed 
to be 46 ovens in Auschwitz. This will make a maximum of 460 cremations a 
day. The anti-revisionists are claiming that around 4000 a day would be the 
maximum.
  I am not doubting the possibility that some corpses could have been burnt 
on pyres, but I do not believe in the burning pits.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 1995 21:53:21 -0100
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In article , Daniel Keren wrote:
>olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
>
># According to the testimony by Ivan Lagace as quoted by Ernst 
># Zundel a body may explode, if it exposed *too sudden* to enourmous
># heat (in this case app 760C). 
>
>1) Did this ever happen? Yes or no? Answer the question, it's
>   a simple question. Are there reports of corpses "exploding"
>   when exposed to such heat? Yes or no?

  Ivan Lagace mentioned that it would take a week to repair an oven that had
been damaged from such an explosion. Again the question should be addressed
to him and not to me. 

>2) What about the crematory operator John Morris spoke with? He
>   said the furnace is pre-heated to, if I recall, 850 degrees,
>   and he doesn't recall any "explosion" taking place. 
>
  I have explained the difference several times between the modern oven and
model in use in the forties.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's 'Exploding Corpses'
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 1995 22:04:24 -0100
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In article <479v2h$pc8@pulp.ucs.ualberta.ca>, John Morris wrote:
>
>Sorry, but I seem to have lost track of exactly what it is that you
>are trying to prove. Are you now saying that cremation is impossible
>because bodies have a lot of water in them or that it is so difficult
>that no one is ever cremated?

 You know very well that from the beginning the discussion has been about,
how many bodies it was possible to burn a day. No revisionist has never 
denied that there in each concentration camp were one or more crematories, 
and that bodies were cremated there. It is only the capacity of those ovens
that has been the controversy. 

 Maybe we should finish this discussion now, as only real experts
in this field will be able to answer this question. 


Ole Kreiberg.

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 

From olk@login.dknet.dk Tue Nov 28 16:14:59 PST 1995
Article: 14138 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german,alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Comments and Questions to Ulrich Roessler
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:34:58 -0100
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In article , Martin Paegert wrote:
>Ole Kreiberg (olk@login.dknet.dk) wrote:
>> In article , Daniel Keren wrote:
>
>> >Would the corpses explode, Kreiberg? Yes? No? Don't know?
>>  
>> I choose the last option. I do not know.
>
>So let me try to help you a little. Human bodies consist of about 80 or 90 %
>of plain water. As a first thought experiment it would be sufficient to 
>imagine a bathtub of water being exposed to high temperatures - say by putting
>it into the furnace of a Krema. What would happen ?  Would the water 
>"explode" ?
>   It would not. It would simply boil away.

Have you ever heard about pressure cookers or steam engines explode?

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Tue Nov 28 17:56:59 PST 1995
Article: 14161 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german,alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: The STASIS are watching us
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 20:21:48 -0100
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In article , Martin Paegert wrote:
>Ole Kreiberg (olk@login.dknet.dk) wrote:
>
>> as I regard the holocaust a matter solely between 
>> the between the Germans and the Jews. If the German and the Jews would  
>> keep their holocaust-story to themselves and not bother other people with it, 
>> I would really care less whether or not the holocaust happened. 
>
>If you do so, why do you intervene and state again and again, that the 
>holocaust took not take place instead of following your line and keeping out ?

Because I am all the time reminded about the socalled holocaust in the 
massmedia. In some countries it is even illegal to express dissident views
about it. By questioning the holocaust I just feel that I am fighting back  
against this massive propaganda. If the holocaust was just forgotten I could
care less whether it happened or not.
>
>
>> In those days it pressured the Danish government to prohibit the communist
>> party - a violation of the Danish constitution. 
>
>Can you give me a clue or prove for that ?  I have never heard that the German
>Government did ask the Danish Government to forbid the comunist party.

  After the invasion of the Sovjet-union in 1941 the German government 
pressured the Danish government to sign the Anti-Commintern Treaty. The   
Danish foreign minister Eric Scavenius was in Berlin, where he met with 
Hitler and Rippentrop. This treaty meant that the communist party and all
communist propaganda was to be made illegal. A legislature much similiar
to the one you find in Germany of today concerning nazism was introduced.
This legislation was a violation of the Danish constitution. 

>
>
>> Some monthes ago in the Gerhard Lauck case Germany pressured Denmark to bend 
>> the law and thereby corrupting the courts. 
>
>The German prosecution did file out a petition for extradition as Lauck did
>violate German Laws while being in Germany the last time. As both countries
>did sign a mutual extradition treaty, a usual step. What exactly do you refer
>when talking about "pressure" ?

 What he did in the USA is not really illegal in Denmark. He had visited 
Denmark before without being arrested. I think that it was because 
the Americans refused to extradite him, that Germany tried to pressure 
Denmark. From sources within the Danish legal system I have heard that the 
German political police (der Verfassungsschutz) was behind much of this. I 
think that it is a scandal that Danish authorities cooperate with a deeply 
despicable institution as the "Verfassungsschutz", the BDR-STASI. I cannot
understand how it could be a matter for Denmark in 1941 that Germany had 
problems with comunism, as well as I cannot understand how it can be a 
matter for Denmark today that Germany thinks, it has problems with neo-nazism.

>   Another petition had been filed out to the US long before, but the US did
>state that it can not localize Lauck and therefor not arrest him as far as I
>know. And as far as I know this statement did meet the truth.

Why didn't the Danish authorities just send him back to USA? This problem was
solely a matter between the USA and Germany. A lot of people wondered. Many 
people who are normally left-winged and anti-racialist began to defend Lauck 
because of of this, and because they thought it was wrong to send him  
to a country, where he would end up as a political prisoner.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Tue Nov 28 17:57:01 PST 1995
Article: 14162 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german,alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: The STASIS are watching us
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:20:23 -0100
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In article , Martin Paegert wrote:
>Ole Kreiberg (olk@login.dknet.dk) wrote:
>
>> The whole of mankind is supposed to learn something from that 
>> [by map@zenon.ruhr.de: the holocaust], and I wonder what. Why are the 
>> atrocities of the Germans more important than the atrocities of other people? 
>
>
>The world did learn. A direct expression of what the world did learn is the 
>Universal Declaration of Human Rights by the UN (one of the founding 
>documents). What the world can and in my opinion should learn is to defend
>these rights by all means as long as the means do not violate the declared
>rights

Why can the world not learn something from what the communists did? More 
people died in communist camps than in nazi-camps. Why is it worse to kill 
people of racial reasons than of political reasons?

>
>
>You did mention Leuchter before. No petition would have been filed on him.
>Despite of his lack of expertise he just did doubt the holocaust could have
>been taken place and did present his "facts". They could not stand even the
>most simple tests, but as far as I know he never did state neo-nazistic
>views. As long as he does not, he will not violate German law. (Although it
>would violate German law to claim as engineer when being none as well as it
>would violate Germand law to declare to be a physician and never have approved
>as physician by any University.) 

How come that the Gunther Deckert, the leader of the NPD has been thrown into
prison? His party is not illegal and therefore not a nazi-party. 

>
>To spread out neo-nazstic ideas or views is not protected under the regulations
>of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights or by any other huaman rights
>document, as these views and ideas claim to violate the granted rights. 

  It is a grave flaw in the human rights, if the spread of neo-nazis is not
protected. If this is the case, I cannot take these human rigths seriously. 
The freedom of speech is for everyone even nazis, communists, Jews etc. 
The freedom of speech should be valid for either everyone or nobody, 
otherwise there would be no equality before the law. 

Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Thu Nov 30 00:42:22 PST 1995
Article: 14357 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.german,alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: The STASIS are watching us
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 21:11:11 +0100
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In article , Marty Kelley  wrote:
>On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Ole Kreiberg wrote:
>
>> In article , Martin Paegert wrote:
>> >Ole Kreiberg (olk@login.dknet.dk) wrote:
>> >
>> >> as I regard the holocaust a matter solely between 
>> >> the between the Germans and the Jews. If the German and the Jews would  
>> >> keep their holocaust-story to themselves and not bother other people with it, 
>> >> I would really care less whether or not the holocaust happened. 
>
>But the Holocaust _wasn't_ simply a matter between the Germans and the 
>Jews--it was the end result of a political philosophy that posited racial 
>superiority and eugenics.  Germany was out to "improve humanity" by 
>ridding Europe of "useless eaters"--not just Jews, but gypsies, gays, 
>communists, Slavs, etc.  

I think that the Germans were out only to improve Germany and not the whole
of humanity. The Germans passed laws to prevent miscegenation. In the USA
by the way there were in several states laws forbidding intermarriage 
e.g. between Whites and non-Whites until a few decades ago. Concerning 
eugenics and the USA, I think that e.g. the state of Virginia until a 
few years ago had laws, which made it possible to sterilize certain 
criminals. So the USA has had racial laws and eugenics but yet far from any 
holocaust. 
  

>And I don't understand why you feel the mass media engages in "massive 
>propaganda" about the Holocaust--certainly, it is a topic that is covered 
>from time to time, but no one's forcing you to read or view materials 
>about the Holocaust.  It's one of the pivotal events of the century, like 
>the Cold War or the end of European colonialism--so of course it will 
>continue to remain an important part of public discourse.
>
>> Because I am all the time reminded about the socalled holocaust in the 
>> massmedia. In some countries it is even illegal to express dissident views
>> about it. By questioning the holocaust I just feel that I am fighting back  
>> against this massive propaganda. If the holocaust was just forgotten I could
>> care less whether it happened or not.
>
>Perfectly chilling reasoning, Mr. Kreiberg.  How about trying this on for 
>size: if the Holocaust were forgotten, we'd learn nothing from it.  I see 
>the fact that war crimes tribunals are investigating the slaughters in 
>Bosnia and Rwanda as evidence that the world has attempted, however late 
>and insufficiently, to act against future genocides.
> 
  What can an American or a Dane learn from the so called holocaust? The USA 
has the largest Jewish population in the world. Have the Americans ever made 
any attempts or even thought about "exterminating" their Jews? If the 
holocaust did happen, the Danes had a perfect chance to have Denmark's Jewish 
population killed during WW2.
  Whatever happened to the Jews in the German occupied Europe during the 
second world war must be solely the responsibility of the Germans. If the 
Germans really did kill 6 millions Jews, I can still learn very little from 
that. Anyway I can not learn more, than I can from what Jack the Ripper, the 
Boston Strangler and a lot of similiar serial killers did to innocent women. 
If somebody says that I could learn something from the misdeeds of these 
killers, suggesting that I and all men had such inherent tendencies, I would 
regard it an insult. (By the way why is it not considered a crime against 
humanity to kill women the way Jack the Ripper or the Boston Strangler did?). 
I get similiar insulted when certain Jews suggest that I may go out and do 
similiar things to the Jews or somebody else, as the Germans are supposed 
to have done during WW2, if I do not remember the so-called holocaust.
  If (some) Jews have paranoid ideas that all non-Jews are potential  
Jew-killers and therefore constantly have to be "educated" by the Jews about
the holocaust in order to prevent them from performing their inherent evil 
and "anti-semitic" nature, I have problems with these Jews.  
  

Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Thu Nov 30 09:38:31 PST 1995
Article: 63016 of soc.culture.german
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.german,soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's Plan for Ethnic Cleansing
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:40:29 +0100
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  An excellent English translation of my proposal. No flaws and distortions.
However I must strongely emphasize that there would be absolutely no 
reductions in the level of social welfare for the Danish people, as well as 
there would be no changes in the system of government. The plan for the
repatriation of people, who ethnically and culturally are a part of the 
third world, will of course not be implemented without the political will of 
the majority of the ethnic Danish populution.

  Thank you very much for translating and posting this. I had thought of 
doing that myself, but unfortunatly I had not got the time.   

Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Thu Nov 30 10:11:56 PST 1995
Article: 14416 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.german,soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's Plan for Ethnic Cleansing
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:40:29 +0100
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  An excellent English translation of my proposal. No flaws and distortions.
However I must strongely emphasize that there would be absolutely no 
reductions in the level of social welfare for the Danish people, as well as 
there would be no changes in the system of government. The plan for the
repatriation of people, who ethnically and culturally are a part of the 
third world, will of course not be implemented without the political will of 
the majority of the ethnic Danish populution.

  Thank you very much for translating and posting this. I had thought of 
doing that myself, but unfortunatly I had not got the time.   

Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Thu Nov 30 10:11:57 PST 1995
Article: 14417 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: The STASIS are watching us
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:58:51 +0100
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In article <49gr8g$1j0@news.enter.net>, Yale F. Edeiken wrote:
>>   olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg) writes:
>>  Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 
>>  
>>>>>
>       If your tag line is correct why don't you tell the truth?  You are an 
>admitted sympathizer with a violent neo-nazi group -- the National Alliance in the 
>United States.

I have never heard the National Alliance advocate violence. Either have I 
heard them denounce the American constitution. To me they are simply 
Americans who love their country and race. I myself do not hate other races.
On the contrary I love the various races and ethnic groups to the extent
that I wish to have them protected against miscegenation. I think that the
first law of nature is self-preservation, and that this law is valid for
ethnic groups as well of nations. 

Ole Kreiberg



>
>       --YFE

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Thu Nov 30 19:11:42 PST 1995
Article: 14450 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.german,soc.culture.nordic
Subject: Re: Kreiberg's Plan for Ethnic Cleansing
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 20:29:07 +0100
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In article <49kft4$jt1@access5.digex.net>, Michael P. Stein wrote:
>In article ,
>Ole Kreiberg  wrote:
>>The plan for the
>>repatriation of people, who ethnically and culturally are a part of the 
>>third world, will of course not be implemented without the political will of 
>>the majority of the ethnic Danish populution.
>
>    I trust, then, that you would also see nothing wrong with, say, South
>Africa deporting all the white Afrikaaners back to the Netherlands?
>
>    I see one potential difficulty.  I note that you do not say anything
>about the political will of the majority of the population of the
>countries to which you plan to deport these people.  In the example of
>South Africa, don't you think the Netherlands would have something to say
>about the plan to dump hundreds of thousands of people on them suddenly? 
>I realize that Denmark is a small country, but other countries (such as 
>South Africa) which might want to try the same plan are not small 
>countries.  Therefore I think you still owe it to us to address this 
>point rather than using the excuse that it should not be a problem for 
>Denmark.

  I think that South Africa could either create an independent White 
Afrikaner homeland within the present South Africa or they could send them 
to the Netherlands, where most of them descent from, in exchange for the
many Blacks and other coloured people who live there. These coloured people
(a South African term for People of mixed race) from the Netherlands would 
blend in perfectly with all the millions of afrikaans speaking coloured 
people, who live in the Cape Province. 
				       
>    If other countries were not willing to accept all the people you don't
>want, what would you do about it?  To coin a phrase, what would your
>"final solution" be, Mr. Kreiberg?  Inquiring minds want to know. 

  My "final solution" would be patience over and over again. First
all foreign aid to the third world would be cancelled. This will make 2 
billion dollars per year available for the implementation of the "final  
solution". Some of this money could be spend on loans or even gifts to
countries willing to cooperate. Also lavish sums of money could be paid to
the Swiss banking accounts of cooperative rulers of those countries. In the 
case of Africa one could say that first the rulers of Africa earned a lot of 
money by selling some of their fellow African to European slavetraders a few
centuries ago, and now they earn a lot of money by taking them back. The 
introduction of the Negro slavery was one of worst and most loathsome 
mistakes in the history of European colonialism. These people were taken  
away from their natural homeland. Now time has come to make things good 
again. You appologize to them and put them back where you once took them 
from.

  In the last resort when everything else has failed, various military means 
could be used toward eventual recalcitrant countries. European countries
sharing the same problems could together create military beach heads in some
of these countries, then land the undesired persons and quickly retreat. If 
this was done to one or two countries I think the rest may be more easily 
persuaded by loans, gifts and money in the Swiss banking accounts of their 
rulers. Again invasions of foreign countries and even kidnapping their 
head of state seem to be a specialty of the USA such as it was done to Panama a 
few years ago. How many times has the USA invaded it's Latin-American 
neighbours in order to interfere political in the internal affairs of these
countries?  Are the above mentioned proposals to solve the problems of 
recalcitrant countries, which deny to take people of their own kind of people 
back, worse than the way the USA often is dealing with the internal affairs 
of it's neighbouring countries? I guess not. 

  However I hope that little by little ethnic cleansing would become an 
accepted and worldwide phenomenon, so that the countries could cooperate  
out of mutual interests in order to make the cleansing as efficient and
humane as possible. E.g. how about an independent and ethnic cleansed 
Curdistan and Tibet? Sounds great to me.

Ole Kreiberg
--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Sat Dec  2 07:51:04 PST 1995
Article: 14580 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.nordic,soc.culture.german
Subject: The Escape of the Danish Jews to Sweden during WW2
Date: Fri, 01 Dec 1995 14:34:23 +0100
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         The 50 anniversary of the of escape of the 7000 Danish Jews in
       October 1943 to Sweden were celebrated by the American Jews.
       According to the American Jews it was the whole Danish people and
       nation that out of some kind of "heroism" saved the Jews.
         As a Gentile Dane I find this embarrassing and nauseating.
       When this event is mentioned it is often forgotten how much money
       "heroic" Danes received for their effort. An example from the
       book, October 1943 by the former anti-German resistance leader
       Aage Berthelsen page 67-69 shows that a skipper received 100000
       DKR (app. US$ 16000) for sailing 230 Jews to Sweden the night
       between the 8th and 9th October 1943. Exactly how much this sum of
       money corresponds to today after 52 years of inflation I am not
       sure, but in 1943 a skilled worker in Denmark earned around 5000
       DKR (app. US$ 800) per year. The skipper had bought the boat for
       25000 DKR (app. US$ 4000). This means that he received 4 times the
       value of the boat for a single trip over the narrow sound between
       Denmark and Sweden. Because the engine of the boat was not able to
       start that night a "heroic" fishing boat skipper scored further
       17000 DKR (app. US$ 2600) for towing the boat to Sweden.
         Beside the Jew transportations many Danes also earned well on
       deliveries of war material, provisions etc to the Germans. In fact
       Denmark had the highest standard of living among all the countries
       in Europe involved in the war including Germany.
         Concerning Sweden that received the Jews it should be mentioned
       that Sweden gave the Germans permission to send their military in
       transit through Sweden to Norway. When the elephants are fighting
       the mice are in danger of being trampled down, and for small
       neutral countries like Sweden and Denmark it was wise to be nice
       to everyone and thereby hoping to get as unharmed as possible out
       of the war. In Denmark 2 per cent of the population voted on the
       Danish Naziparty in the elections of 1939 and 1943, and 2 percent
       were affiliated with the resistance movement against the German
       occupation towards the end of the war. The remaining 96 per cent
       supported more or less the pragmatic neutrality policy of the
       legal Danish government.
         If it really was so important for the Germans to exterminate the
       Jews how come that high-ranking German officials in Denmark like
       Duckwitz, Best and Renthe-Fink all tried to dissuade the German
       government from apprehending and deporting the Danish Jews to
       camps in Central Europe. How could it be tolerated that Duckwitz
       on his "own" initiative went to Sweden before the escape in order
       to get the Swedish acceptance of the reception of the Danish Jews.
       Why happened all German patrol boats to be in harbour when the
       escape was going on? Why did not these German officials receive as
       much as a reprimand from their superiors in Berlin, when it was
       discovered that almost all of the Danish Jews had escaped.
         I think that there are much in this story that proves that it
       was not basically the plans of Germans to exterminate the Jews but
       only to get rid of them through emigration or deportation.

       Most of the facts in this article are from a text-book in historical 
       critism by a Danish professor in history. The Title is:"Mordet på  
       Kennedy - og andre opgaver i historisk kildekritik" by Niels Skyum-
       Nielsen, Copenhagen 1973, ISBN 8750502492
       
       Ole Kreiberg


--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 


From olk@login.dknet.dk Sat Dec  2 07:51:05 PST 1995
Article: 14602 of alt.revisionism
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From: olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: The STASIS are watching us
Date: Sat, 02 Dec 1995 10:45:08 +0100
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In article <49n1si$p6m@news.enter.net>, Yale F. Edeiken wrote:
>>   olk@login.dknet.dk (Ole Kreiberg) writes:
>>
>>  
>>  I have never heard the National Alliance advocate violence. Either have I 
>>  heard them denounce the American constitution. To me they are simply 
>>  Americans who love their country and race.
>>  
>> 
>>>>>
>       I have heard members of the NA advocate violence and
>abrogation in writing ("The Turner Diaries"), 

The Turner Diaries was a fiction novel. Do you think that all authors of e.g.
crime novels are criminals themselves, just because they write fiction about
crimes. 

>here on the Web (killing
>Jews for "Crimes against the aryan race"), and in person.  The latter
>was on a videotaped confession where three NA members admitted to
>murdering their parents and torturing their 11 year old brother to death
>because the parents disagreed with the NA.  They also admitted, in other
>court papers, that thet decided to commit the murders because they
>believed they were following NA philosophy towars dissenters.  

There are crackpots etc. in all political parties. I think that in the 
republican party or the democratic party you will find many child molestors, 
drunken drivers etc., if you look long enough. However does this means that 
drunk driving and child molesting are the official policy of these two 
parties? What counts is what the official policy of the parties is and not 
the acts of some individual members. I have never heard the National 
Alliance advocate the use violence in their political struggle. 

>Good enough for you, Nazi boy, or do you want a list of the other violent crimes
>that have been credited to them in my county.
>
You are still the using the gutter invective: "Nazi-boy". Are you by the way 
one of those, who see "nazis" on every streetcorner?

I am only interested in evidence whether or not these acts may be the policy 
of the NA. I am not interested in the number og lunatics who might have 
sneaked into the NA. 

Ole Kreiberg

--
Truth alone triumphs. - Mundaka Upanisad 



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