The Nizkor Project: Remembering the Holocaust (Shoah)

Shofar FTP Archive File: people/g/grosvenor.william/2006/via-shaw.200607


From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:13 EDT 2007
Article: 539688 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Superstore Prefers Paying Maritimers $5,000 to Paying Locals!! Offers Only $1000 to Locals!
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On Sat, 11 Feb 2006 18:05:11 GMT, Carter  wrote:
>Tiberius Rex wrote:
>> The key question was:
>> Why should foreigners - i.e. non-Albertans be offered an extra
>> $5,000.00 not offered to locals?

>Probably because it wouldn't cost that much to get an Albertan to 
>relocate to Alberta.  You talk as if the $5000 dollars is a gift.  It 
>is not, it is relocation costs.

It IS a gift, since Superstore refuses to pay such largesse to
residents of Alberta, to relocate to Deadmonton or wherever their jobs
are!!

In fact, Stupidstore is NOW offering a $1,000 bonus to new employees,
to be paid AFTER working 1000 hours.

want to bet they will terminate workers just before 1000 hours, just
to avoid paying?

>BTW, Maritimers are not exactly foreigners, the happen to live in the 
>same country as Albertans.
>Carter

As far as residing in Alberta, they are foreigners.

>> On Fri, 10 Feb 2006 19:55:47 GMT, Carter  wrote:
>>> Tiberius Rex wrote:
>>>> Media this past week have been reporting that Westfair Foods,
>>>> operating as Superstore in Alberta have been trying to recruit people
>>>> from the Maritimes, to work in their stores in Alberta.
>>>>
>>>> They are offering Maritimers, besides wages:
>>>> free round-trip airfares
>>>> one month rent paid by Superstore
>>>> all moving/relocation costs
>>>>
>>>> These add up to around an extr5a $5,000 - which Superstore 
>>>> is NOT offering to workers in Alberta!!
>>> Why would Superstore make that offer to Albertans?  Albertans already 
>>> live in Alberta, Don't they?
>>>
>>> Carter
>> 



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:13 EDT 2007
Article: 539689 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.singapore:1315014 soc.culture.indonesia:409408 soc.culture.australian:393157 alt.activism.death-penalty:412631 soc.culture.canada:539689 soc.culture.europe:555431
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.singapore,soc.culture.indonesia,soc.culture.australian,alt.activism.death-penalty,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.europe
Subject: Re: 2 more Aussie Drug Traffickers to be Hanged - GOOD!
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At least the government of Indonesia know what to do with garbage
people, such as drug dealers.

They know, as do other sensible governments in the area, that an
executed criminal will never re-offend!!

Further, an executed waste of skin, will not cost the taxpayers for
the upkeep in some pampering prison system!!

If only the justice systems in North America would follow suit!!!


On 17 Feb 2006 18:43:24 -0800, "LifeManTalking" 
wrote:

>AUSTRALIA - Few Australians have much sympathy for Andrew Chan and
>Myuran Sukumaran, the two drug traffickers sentenced to death in Bali
>this week for their failed bid to smuggle more than 8kg of heroin on to
>the streets of Sydney.

>The lives of too many of their young people have been destroyed by
>drugs and, as innumerable letters to newspapers and callers to talkback
>radio have pointed out, Chan and Sukumaran could never have been in any
>doubt of the risk they took in running narcotics through Indonesia.

>But the prospect of the pair being taken from Kerobokan jail, tied to a
>tree in some lonely clearing, and shot by a paramilitary firing squad
>raises deep and disturbing moral, political and diplomatic dilemmas for
>a nation that last executed a criminal almost 40 years ago and now
>opposes the death penalty worldwide.

>Their own police provided the information that inevitably led to
>Tuesday's sentence. Their Government welcomed the death penalty given
>to the Bali bombers but opposes the same fate for Australian drug
>traffickers, and public opinion is repulsed by the prospect of
>executions at home but inconsistently accepts them abroad.

>It is a diplomatic minefield that Canberra traversed when
>Vietnamese-born Melburnian Van Tuong Nguyen was hanged in Singapore in
>December for taking heroin through Changi airport, despite Australian
>appeals for clemency.

>It is also a minefield that the nation will confront time and again:
>despite repeated warnings and the appalling reality of executions,
>there will always be people foolish enough to strap drugs to their
>bodies or conceal it in their luggage.

>Almost all will pass through Southeast Asia, the source of most of
>Australia's heroin (the Bali Nine consignment originated in Thailand)
>and where every country but Cambodia compulsorily hangs, shoots or
>lethally injects traffickers.

>Mike Phelan, the head of international operations for the Australian
>Federal Police and the man responsible for giving Indonesia the
>information it needed to arrest the Bali Nine, sees no end to the queue
>of couriers the trade calls "mules".

>"It continues to astound me that people attempt importations and move
>drugs through transit countries knowing that the death penalty exists,"
>he told ABC's Australian Story. "Many young lives get thrown away for
>the law of quick dollars."

>The AFP's role in the arrest of the Bali Nine is among the most
>sensitive of the issues facing Prime Minister John Howard, who has
>already weathered a barrage of criticism that has extended even into
>his own party room.

>The AFP caught the first whispers of a major heroin importing run in
>February last year and, in April, asked the Indonesian police to help
>uncover the members of the syndicate and the source of their supplies.

>Between them, the two forces discovered most of the names and built a
>remarkably accurate picture of their operation, including details of a
>previous successful run and another aborted attempt.

>This co-operation has become increasingly commonplace, spurred by the
>determination of all countries in the region to attack drug trafficking
>and terrorism. Intelligence swapping is required under a number of
>treaties.

>"We make no secret of the fact that the AFP has a policy of forward
>engagement where we want to stop the crimes at the source and (prevent
>them) from reaching Australian shores," Phelan said. "That's a practice
>we will continue to operate within."

>What worries many Australians is the fact that the AFP in effect turned
>over a group of young Australians to a country it knew was likely to
>execute them, rather than arresting them when they arrived home.

>The most emotional response centred on Scott Rush, 20, a drug mule who
>was jailed for life. His family, through lawyer Bob Myers, vainly asked
>the AFP to warn Rush of their interest before he left Australia.

>"No Australian public servant has the right to expose any Australian
>citizen to the death penalty," Myers told Australian Story.

>Rush and fellow mules Renae Lawrence, Martin Stephens and Michael
>Czugaj took the AFP to the Federal Court, claiming it had acted
>illegally by exposing them to the death penalty.

>While a large part of public opinion agreed, the court dismissed the
>action.

>The Government has also sidestepped criticism, pointing out that while
>the relevant treaty with Indonesia contains a clause allowing the
>Attorney-General to refuse to provide evidence if an Australian was
>charged with an offence carrying the death penalty, the AFP was free to
>do as it thought best until charges were laid.

>By the time the Bali Nine were formally charged, all the damaging
>evidence had been gathered.

>Phelan is unrepentant: "Basically all transit countries through which
>drugs come to Australia have the death penalty. The AFP cannot pick and
>choose who it chooses to cooperate with."

>International teamwork in the past few years has significantly reduced
>the flow of drugs into Australia. The most recent Australian Crime
>Commission figures, for 2003-04, show the lowest seizures of heroin for
>a decade.

>Refusal to co-operate abroad would outrage regional governments and
>threaten mutual action against other drug syndicates and terrorism.

>Public opinion in Southeast Asia also strongly favours the death
>penalty for traffickers, with polls in Singapore and Thailand showing
>support of up to 80 per cent.

>In Australia, opinion is more confused. A Morgan poll in November found
>that while only 27 per cent of Australians favoured the death penalty
>for murder, 57 per cent believed drug traffickers caught in Asia should
>die.

>Yet in the specific case of Van Nguyen, opinion was evenly divided.

>In The Australian, a newspoll found that more than 50 per cent of
>Australians favoured the death sentence for people convicted of major
>acts of terrorism.

>Howard now has to weigh all these conflicting factors in framing
>Canberra's approach to the executions of Chan and Sukumaran. He has
>said publicly he has no sympathy for the two men but will vigorously
>pursue Australia's long-standing opposition to the death penalty.

>How that is carried out will test Australian diplomacy.

>Apart from the risks to a fragile relationship, observers have pointed
>out that any blunt approach will almost certainly stiffen backs in
>Jakarta and end any chance of clemency.

>Hopes of saving Chan and Sukumaran now rest with Indonesia's
>inconsistent record in carrying out executions, the fact that in recent
>times only three of the more than 85 prisoners on death row have been
>shot, and the lengthy legal road still to be travelled.

>It may be years before their case moves through the Denpasar provincial
>High Court and the two reviews possible through the Supreme Court in
>Jakarta.

>And though President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono has said he will never
>grant clemency to drug traffickers, time and quiet diplomacy may change
>his mind.

>Death penalty Australia's double dilemma 
>
>18.02.06
>By Greg Ansley



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:14 EDT 2007
Article: 539690 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Another Crooked Edmonton Cops Expose!! - Repost
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The Edmonton Journal, in a banner headline story on page B1 of today's
paper, exposes yet another swindle involving Edmonton's crooked cops!!

They exposed a so-called CHARITY SCAM, for a so-called "benefit" game
run under the style of "Oldtimers Hockey Challenge".

This scam collected more than $250,000 through fraudulent telephone
solicitors, claiming the money was going to a charity.

In fact, only $20,000 actually goes to a local women's shelter safe
house.

Almost all the money goes to a scam business called Xentel DM Inc, out
of Calgary, not even a local business. In the USA, XENTEL has been the
subject of investigations alleging deceptive telemarketing, as well as
for breaching do-not-call laws.

In Iowa, in November 2004, Xentel was forced to stop abusive and
misleading calls in fundraising and solicitations, and was forced to
pay $30,000 in penalties.

Since almost all the money goes to a for-profit business, rather than
to a registered charity, why isn't the provincial government charging
the crooks and their sponsors with FRAUD?

This scam was being promoted by the Edmonton Police Faded Blues 
Hockey team.

Just one more scandal for the new chief to clean up!


From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:15 EDT 2007
Article: 539695 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.general,soc.culture.canada,edm.general,ab.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton cop suspended for Brutality-Local Gestapo  Thugs!!  AVOID Edmonton - MORE Crimes By Cops!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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In the Edmonton Journal for today 1st July 2006, on page B2, is yet
one more story about another crooked cop charged with criminal
assault!!

A cop with 24 years service, Jan Cichon 53, was charged with assault,
a criminal charge, in connection with yet another criminal assault on
a civilian.

he is still on the public payroll, with his first court appearance on
27 July, more than 6 months after the criminal act.

It seems there is no end to the number of criminal charges to get
filed against all the crooked cops in Edmonton.

Plus, do not forget the CRA charges against many cops for FRAUD, in
connection with fraudulently transferring overtime pay!!


On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 08:17:49 -0600, Frank Arthur 
wrote:

>The Edmonton Journal for today,Thursday 29 June 2006, has a full page of
>letters to the editor, denouncing the brutality of the Edmonton Police!!


>On 25 Jun 2006 12:18:00 -0700,  wrote:
>>http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/Alberta/2006/06/24/1650687-sun.html
>
>>Contact the Sun
>>Submit Photos
>>Reader Feedback
>>About the Sun
>>Buy SUN Photos
>
>>Sat, June 24, 2006
>
>>Edmonton officer suspended for alleged Whyte Ave. incident
>>UPDATED: 2006-06-24 02:07:43 MST
>
>>By AJAY BHARDWAJ, SUN MEDIA
>
>>EDMONTON -- An Edmonton cop has been suspended without pay after
>>allegations of misconduct while off-duty on Whyte Ave., during Edmonton
>>Oiler celebrations.
>
>>Staff Sgt. Greg Alcorn confirmed Const. Sebastien Berube was suspended
>>without pay June 15.
>>
>>Police Chief Mike Boyd has 30 days to report the suspension to the
>>Edmonton Police Commission, which will hold a hearing to decide whether
>>to reinstate his pay.
>
>>Alcorn wouldn't provide the reasons Berube was suspended.
>
>>But sources said, among other things, Berube violated the parking ban
>>on Whyte Ave. during Oilers' post-game celebration.
>
>>When cops working the avenue asked him to move his vehicle, he
>>allegedly struggled with officers before being subdued.
>
>>Suspending a cop without pay is rare. Two officers who face criminal
>>charges in connection with the awarding of a city photo radar contract
>>were suspended by Boyd, but continue to collect their paycheques.
>
>>Whyte Ave. was a simmering cauldron of trouble for cops as the Oilers
>>advanced to within a game of winning the Stanley Cup.
>
>>Costs of policing Whyte Ave. as the Oilers knocked off opponents on the
>>way to the Cup ballooned to $2.2 million, up from an estimated $1.2
>>million.
>
>>The price tag could rise even further when Camrose cops and the RCMP
>>submit their bill for helping out, but Boyd said the $2.2-million
>>estimate was close to the mark.
>
>>Police made more than 800 arrests during the Whyte Ave. celebrations
>>during the course of the playoffs.
>
>But, only a handful have actually been charged!!
>
>It seems the crooked cops just wanted media coverage, to pretend they were
>actually working!!
>
>
>The local media had a great day publicising the torture of a young woman by
>another rogue Edmonton cop!!
>
>This Gestapo-like thug was photographed by several reporters, while he beat
>the handcuffed young lady and threw her face onto the pavement, breaking open
>her face!
>
>In another incident the same night, a 66 year old lawyer , Brian Fish, was
>tasered illegally, for taking pictures of police brutality. He is now laying
>charges against the cops involved.
>
>And the police chief seems to be doing nothing about all his crooked cops!
>Is this why Mike Boyd was refused the Chief's position in Toronto?
>
>Guess Chief Boyd was too busy wasting $2,200,000 of taxpayers money 
>setting up his thugs to torture civilians?
>
>Mind you, the inept cops still have not caught the serial killer of more than
>100 prostitutes, or even the killers of another 2 people this week!!
>
>
>On 2006-06-19 11:53:03 -0400, Boadicea  said:
>
>> The Edmonton Journal for today - 19 June 2006 - carries 2 pages full
>> of photos showing the Edmonton Gestapo TORTURING a woman, who was not 
>> resisting!!
>
>> Guess the crooked cops forgot that there are people taking
>> photographs?
>
>> And the jew mayor sees nothing wrong with police brutality.
>> Guess he belongs to the kill-a palestinian school of torture?
>
>> And they wonder why tourists around the world are starting to avoid
>> visiting UNSAFE Canada!!
>
>
>_________________________________________
>Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>More than 140,000 groups
>Unlimited download
>http://www.usenetzone.com to open account



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:15 EDT 2007
Article: 539696 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.general,ab.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general,wpg.general
Subject: Re: Sears Illegally Distributing Your Personal Data
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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Jeff, dear fool, the story is completely true, and correct.

Whether  you work for Sears, or not, may all your personal ID be
obtained by an identity thief, so that you may understand the problem.


On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 21:04:37 GMT, "Jeff Stapleton"
 wrote:
>"Nemesis"  wrote in message 
>news:REM5A56038898.528287037@twistycreek.com...
>> It seems that Sears in Canada is illegally distributing personal data of 
>> its' customers.
>>
>> A charge has been filed with the Alberta Privacy Commissioner, proving 
>> that a major Sears store in Edmonton illegally provided personal confidential information of 
>> a customer, to someone who was most definitely NOT the customer. The Alberta government 
>> is prosecuting, to teach Sears that they are not above the law.
>>
>> This situation came to light when the victim received in the mail, from an 
>> anonymous source,  the actual store copy of the receipt involved.
>>
>> HIS personal info including 2 unlisted phone numbers were clearly printed 
>> on the invoice  receipt, together with ther actual customer's VISA card number.
>> Someone had even written on the bill, "wrong number", but the customer was 
>> still given all the details of the original Sears customer.
>>
>> In other words, one MUST NOT TRUST SEARS!


>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org

>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)


>yo spammer give it up already 




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:15 EDT 2007
Article: 539700 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.palestine,soc.culture.jewish
Subject: Re: Frankinstien Arthurhole is an arsehole!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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Frank Arthur dislikes the TRUTH!
He is only interested in zionazi propaganda, where he blames everyone
else for all the murders and atrocoities of his fellow ZHYDS!!


On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 17:52:10 -0400, "seven" 
wrote:

>Hey Frankfurt,
>Why does an asshole like you write all this anti-jew shit and then attack 
>anyone who says stuff against them that is real, you shit all over the 
>kitchen floor?You're stupiddddder than any jew! 

For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
JEW-WATCH:
http://www.jewwatch.com



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:16 EDT 2007
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.usa,alt.privacy,can.general,soc.culture.canada,edm.general,rec.travel.usa-canada
Subject: Re: MAN CHARGED AFTER VIDEOTAPING POLICE-In Edmonton Canada 66 Year Old Lawyer Tasered for Photographing Police Brutality!!
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In Edmonton Canada a week ago, a 66 year old lawyer was criminally
tasered by a rogue cop, for photographing police brutality on innocent
civilians!!

Sort of like what the cops did to Rodney King!!

No wonder the Edmonton Gestapo are getting such an unsavoury worldwide
reputation!!

On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 10:13:22 -0500, "harmony"  wrote:
>"RogerRabbit"  wrote in message 
>news:2j8pg.2663$5J6.2016@newsread1.mlpsca01.us.to.verio.net...
>> usenet@mantra.comnRi1f0l7M or www.mantra.com/jai (Dr. Jai Maharaj)
>> wrote:
>>> Man charged after videotaping police
>>>
>>> http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1658296/posts
>>>
>>> Jai Maharaj
>>> http://tinyurl.com/a5ljc
>>> http://www.mantra.com/jai
>>> Om Shanti
>>
>> Very shocking to read this. Is this true that owning such devices are 
>> against the law?

>blame it on 9/11, "which has changed everything" as bushistas never tire of 
>remind us. 




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:16 EDT 2007
Article: 539777 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.general,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa,tx.general,alt.privacy.ano
Subject: Re: WARNING - ISP Netidentity No Longer USA based, but in Canada!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <7s75a21dgghbn9gj28rae96n0s6tkhn2p6@4ax.com> 
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A very good point.
Guess we must then find and use servers not connected with
Germany,Austria, or Canada or UK?
Care to suggest a good server that will not be coerced?


On 29 Jun 2006 13:49:17 -0000, TwistyCreek 
wrote:
>NotMyName  wrote:
>
>> So, time to switch from Netidentity and TUCOWS, to a good US server,
>> such as 1&1.com, or Netzero.
>
>Fun Fact:
>1&1 US is controlled by its german mother 1&1. If german courts extend
>their reach as US courts tend to do, you better don't host any Nazi stuff
>on 1&1 servers.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:16 EDT 2007
Article: 539778 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.palestine,soc.culture.malaysia,soc.culture.canada,can.general,tor.general,soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: STUDY IN CANADA WITHOUT TOEFL/IELTS (SEPTEMBER 2006 INTAKE) - SCAM!! Avoid Getting Swindled!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <6mgea2pll5a79gcijq0t1v9ekittf86uaj@4ax.com>
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DEFINITELY A REAL SCAM!!

Canada Immigration is extremely apprehensive about letting people from
Poland or Palestine enter Canada, because of control of Canada by
ZYDS, who dislike the Polish and Palestinians because they blame
Poland for Oswiecim!!

More importantly, reputable universities and colleges NEVER USE
SO-CALLED RECRUITING FIRMS TO FIND STUDENTS!!

As for High School programs, such are available for less cost in
Singapore or Malaysia, or even Australia or New Zealand.

Save your money and avoid such scams!!

By the way, legitimate immigration consultants MUST BE REGTISTERED
WITH CANADA IMMIGRATION.
There is no knowledge of this business with the Government of Canada!!


On 27 Jun 2006 17:47:15 -0700, "Marwan Zaki" 
wrote:

>STUDY IN CANADA WITHOUT TOEFL/IELTS (SEPTEMBER 2006 INTAKE)

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>Email: mzaki@zeeinfotech.com
>www.zeeinfotech.com



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:16 EDT 2007
Article: 539779 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.new-zealand,uk.politics.misc,rec.travel.europe,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Re: Edmonton Canada Gestapo Getting Bad International Reputation  for Brutality - AVOID Edmonton
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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The Edmonton Journal for yesterday 29 June 2006 had a full page of
letters to the editor complaining about the police brutality!!

These comments are apart from concern by the taxpayers regarding the
supposed extra $2.2MILLION cost claimed by the new police chief.
Guess his undercover rioters did not come cheap?
Is this part of the reason Toronto refused repeatedly to give Mike
Boyd the position of Chief Cop?

Chief Boyd admits that there are at least 35 unresolved complaints
filed against his police in connection with police brutality over the
past week or so!


On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 08:17:52 -0600, Frank Arthur 
wrote:

>The local media had a great day publicising the torture of a young woman by
>another rogue Edmonton cop!!

>This Gestapo-like thug was photographed by several reporters, while he beat
>the handcuffed young lady and threw her face onto the pavement, breaking open
>her face!

>In another incident the same night, a 66 year old lawyer , Brian Fish, was
>tasered illegally, for taking pictures of police brutality. He is now laying
>charges against the cops involved.

>And the police chief seems to be doing nothing about all his crooked cops!
>Is this why Mike Boyd was refused the Chief's position in Toronto?

>Guess Chief Boyd was too busy wasting $2,200,000 of taxpayers money 
>setting up his thugs to torture civilians?

>Mind you, the inept cops still have not caught the serial killer of more than
>100 prostitutes, or even the killers of another 2 people this week!!


>On 2006-06-19 11:53:03 -0400, Boadicea  said:

>> The Edmonton Journal for today - 19 June 2006 - carries 2 pages full
>> of photos showing the Edmonton Gestapo TORTURING a woman, who was not 
>> resisting!!

>> Guess the crooked cops forgot that there are people taking
>> photographs?

>> And the jew mayor sees nothing wrong with police brutality.
>> Guess he belongs to the kill-a palestinian school of torture?

>> And they wonder why tourists around the world are starting to avoid
>> visiting UNSAFE Canada!!



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:17 EDT 2007
Article: 539847 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Canadian citizen facing execution in China
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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If you are guilty of breaking the laws in China, then you deserve
whatever pena;ty is usual in China.

In other words, if you do the crime, then you deserve the time, even
if it is short, until execution.

On 1 Jul 2006 22:14:59 -0700, "fyfpoon@gmail.com" 
wrote:
>Dennis G. wrote:
>> "fyfpoon@gmail.com"  wrote:
>> >Dennis G. wrote:
>> >> "fyfpoon@gmail.com"  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Is there a standardized definition of human right in the world?
>> >>
>> >> "Now, Therefore THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY proclaims THIS UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF
>> >> HUMAN RIGHTS as a common standard of achievement for all peoples and all
>> >> nations, to the end that every individual and every organ of society, keeping
>> >> this Declaration constantly in mind, shall strive by teaching and education to
>> >> promote respect for these rights and freedoms and by progressive measures,
>> >> national and international, to secure their universal and effective recognition
>> >> and observance, both among the peoples of Member States themselves and among the
>> >> peoples of territories under their jurisdiction."
>> >>
>> >> From: http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html
>> >>
>> >> Note that the Declaration makes no allowance for economic differences between
>> >> member states and note also that China is a signatore of the document.
>> >>
>> >> Jailing people who do not think like the rulers is the heart of despotism.
>> >>  If you wish to compare China to the Nazi's be sure you consider that Chinese
>> >> citizens are not free to elect their own leaders from a broad spectrum of
>> >> political platforms anymore then were the citizens of the Third Reich or the
>> >> people of Soviet dominated Eastern Europe.
>> >>
>> >> China needs to keep its promise to the UN.
>> >
>> >There is no thought police in China at the present time.
>>
>> Are all persons in China free to speak their opinions in Tiannemen Square now?
>
>If they  don't go out into the streets with a loud speaker, yes. But
>obviously the DEGREE of freedom of speech is nowhere near that of
>Canada.
>
>> If people are not free to speak their opinions(except those that advocate
>> harming the rights of others), how can they be siad to be free to think what
>> they will. They have no source for new ideas if none can ever be expressed
>> except by government.
>>
>>  >There used to
>> >be under Mao but it was the days of communism.  Now China is a
>> >capitalist country.  Hong Kong under the British for 150 years did not
>> >have democracy but HK was in every sense a capitalist country.  So did
>> >the British government in HK violate human rights?.  If it did, then it
>> >would suggest the government of Great Britain was also guilty of human
>> >right violation.  Since there is no thought police in China, your claim
>> >that "Jailing people who do not think like the rulers is the heart of
>> >despotism" is factually incorrect.  It is a meaningless slogan.
>> >
>> The slogan is not meaningless to those who are jailed for speaking their minds.
>>
>> IMo, the colonial powers did breach human rights.
>> But like China, Britain signed the Declaration in 1947 and so you must compare
>> the freedom in HK with the freedom in China after that signing.
>>
>The DEGREE of freedom in China is lower than that in Hong Kong...so?
>These two places have come through different socio-political
>orientations.
>
>> >There is election in China but the election does not take the form of
>> >multiparty democracy or universal or one vote for each person election.
>> > Does the observance of human rights have to be  predicated upon the
>> >existence of a multiparty political system?
>> >
>> The  number of parties is not important but the freedom to advocate change from
>> the status quo is. One party or no party and everything in between could
>> accomadate freedom of speech within the law.
>>
>Important to who????  Important to the people who want to run the show
>or the people living there.  Do you know how mixed the population in
>that part of the world is.  Have you been to XinXiang?  The non-muslim
>population there may even be more than the muslim people.  So should
>the muslims decide who can stay and who can go, and who kind of schools
>or language can be used, and religon organizations, etc..?  Sorry, the
>current development in China does not permit the advocation of certain
>changes such as independence of any region.  If the law over there does
>not permit something and you go ahead to challenge it, then you bear
>the consequences.  It is as simple as that.
>
>> >As China is progressive forward, more and more democratic reforms will
>> >surface.  But that does not mean it will necessarily tolerate
>> >individuals calling for and mobilizing independence of any province in
>> >order to comply with human right observation.  There is no stipulation
>> >in the UN charter
>> >of human rights that this has to be so.
>> >
>> The freedom to speak includes the advocay of independence for a particular
>> reason. The charter specifically names self-determination as protected.
>> China is arresting people because of what they advocate and what they believe
>> because it is different from the beliefs of the rulers.
>>
>The Chinese government not only arrests people who advocate
>independence, but also as in the case of Taiwan will resort to military
>solution to make sure no independence over there will materialize, and
>will even confront the US if the US comes to the help of Taiwan.  This
>is reality.  Go ahead to argue with it.  From the perspective of
>textbook political science students, it is OK to arrest drug smugglers
>while it is not OK to do the same thing to those who advocate
>independence, because drug is 'bad' and independence is 'good'.  In the
>real world, drugs hurt only a few while independence in that part of
>the world and at this time means bloodshed and millions being
>victimized.  Is every country in the world abiding 100% to the UN
>charter to which it is a signatory?  If China abides in some areas
>while in other areas the observance is less than textbook perfect, what
>can any other nation do about it? What can any other nation do about US
>invasion of Iraq?  Do you know that Great Britain even considered using
>nuclear weapon against China when the talk over HK failed to
>materialize in favor of the British side.  So you seem to be battling
>for justice in this unjust world and you place yourself on the side of
>the just.  Don't you?  It is might over right!  It was that way and it
>is that way and it will always been that way.  So go over it, sonni.
>
>> >Thus the observance of human rights is in principle applicable to all
>> >nations but that does not mean the ways by which this observance is
>> >practiced are standardized globally.  The differences are a function of
>> >many factors and one of them is the difference in the amount of
>> >economic freedom in each nation.
>> >
>> Please explain how economics reduces the human rights of some poor people as
>> compared to rights possessed by rich people?
>
>Economics is a study, and I have never mentioned this discipline of
>study "reduces the human rights of some poor people as compared to
>rights possessed by rich people".  You do NOT understand what I said
>and you just came out with a couple of sentences containing these
>words, pretending you understand.  I have been saying all along that
>political freedom and economic freedom go hand in hand; the more
>economic freedom a nation has, the more political freedom the people
>there enjoys.
>
>Whatever will happen to this Canadian will serve as an example to other
>Canadians that a law is a law, whether it is in Canada or China or in
>Indonesia, and as such has to be respected for what it is.  By the way,
>you have not answered my question how you are sure this Canadian who is
>about to get shot has not organized anything violent in that part of
>the world.  Some Chinese political dissidents also advocated the
>independence of Tibet or Taiwan, and got locked up in jail for years.
>Few I know have been shot.  On the other hand, those who did not
>advocate with their mouths but did so by planting bombs were shot as
>fast as they were nailed down; no color TV and hot water bath, and warm
>soup... sorry.   So please go ahead to convince me that this Canadian
>has not organized anything violent over there.  Did he simply go there
>and preach peace like Gan Day of India?  Or was he into something more
>exotic than that?
>
>FP
>
>==================
> reduces >
>> >If you know you will get locked up by smuggling mariguana into the US
>> >at this time, then you should refrain from doing it regardless how much
>> >you believe it is the right of the citizens to smoke pot.  The guy had
>> >known what the penalty for preaching independence is before he went
>> >there to set up a political party, but he still went to challenge the
>> >law of China.  There is NOTHING the government of Canada can do to
>> >change the law in China.  Also, we as outsiders don't really know
>> >whether his activities in China were confined to the scope of just
>> >preaching.  He himself or people under him might have done something
>> >rather sinister, such as planting bombs in hospitals and schools, and
>> >it is foolish for any outsider to think that he should be spared.  The
>> >bleeding hearts may pledge to have his death sentence changed to life
>> >imprisonment, depending on the situation, but to suggest China is in
>> >violation of human rights by punishing him is sheer groundless.
>> >Bleeding hearts like you used to be sympathetic to the 'freedom
>> >fighters' in Chechyna until you saw what they did in Moscow.
>> >
>> >FP
>>
>> Canada can request a resolution at the UN but it won't.
>>
>> He was charged with murder in Kyrgustan but was still able to get status from
>> the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees and became a Canadian citizen.
>>
>> Perhaps China should break up into its component parts as the Soviet Union did
>> and stop its colonization of foreign countries.
>> 
>> dennis



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:17 EDT 2007
Article: 539848 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: rec.travel.usa-canada,can.general,soc.culture.canada,rec.travel.europe
Subject: Re: Edmonton Canada  No one cares.
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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With newspapers publishing every few days ANOTHER STORY documenting
the criminality and brutality of the Edmonton police, no wonder
tourists are now avoiding Edmonton Canada, as though it was Baghdad
Iraq!!

There seem to be nothing but criminals on the Edmonton Police farce.


On Sun, 02 Jul 2006 04:26:06 GMT, gel  wrote:

>Unfortunaly.A song and dance that Edmonton is writing.
>    And you know a lot a people in Edmonton pretends to be happy like
>you Maxx. 
>  Edmonton is the example of everyman for themselves.
> You sure are.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:18 EDT 2007
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: rec.travel.usa-canada,can.general,soc.culture.canada,rec.travel.europe
Subject: Re: Edmonton; the only city in N.America where houses ...AVOID EDMONTON Canada
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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Local residents MUST be brain damaged, otherwise, why have they not
PROSECUTED their last 4 chiefs of police for their acts, instead of
giving them payoffs of up to HALF A MILLION DOLLARS?

On Sun, 02 Jul 2006 05:59:45 GMT, Brian K
 wrote:

>On 7/1/2006 8:32 PM  gel did the "monkey dance", then made these writings:
>> Edmonton ,Alberta is the only city in North America where houses only a
>> miles or two from three major refineries are sky rocketing in price.
>>    Three major refineries and a few chemicals plants are operating just
>> a few miles from downtown Edmonton.
>>   But the people overthere are considering themselves the happiest
>> people in Canada.
>>   Even if some house are only a mile away from the refineries people
>> live in it and see the value of their property increase.
>>   Basically no one in Edmonton realize that the refineries causes cancer
>> and other disease.
>>  Edmonton has been under the power of the same provincial government
>> aver 40 consecutives years.Only the communist country can claim such
>> timeline for a party in power.
>>   The oil refineries are operating just a mile away from the only river
>> in Edmonton.
>>  Asthma level are the highest in the country (Canada).It seems overthere
>> that the people are aphatics.Are they sold to the black gold?

>Houses near refineries are popular with Coneheads (see classic Saturday 
>Night Live).  They'll pay top dollar to "consume mass quantities" there 
>and do things with the Cone Ring. ;-)



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:18 EDT 2007
Article: 539850 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.canada:539850 can.general:352627 tor.general:324358 ab.general:110016 calgary.general:352038
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.general,tor.general,ab.general,calgary.general
Subject: Re: crossposting homosexual lynn
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <4kcaa2loqbfjjcioib3isumrn057lmp2up@4ax.com>   <44a74978$0$18474$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com> 
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Why don't you send a formal complaint to abuse@shaw.ca, and be sure to
include ALL lines from the headers.

Perhaps they will then cut him off, for abuse of TOS.


On Sun, 2 Jul 2006 07:27:07 +0300, "Markku Grönroos"
 wrote:


>perhaps you eskimo squaw get lost from rte.
>
>
>"lynn"  kirjoitti 
>viestissä:44a74978$0$18474$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com...
>> "Georges Fockstein"   wrote in message
>> news:5c44b1ttdve17c4obajrimvo75j3b6lo06@4ax.com...
>>
>> i am a old man looking for boy toys over the age of 18 (this is for 
>> dickheads who think i am looking for underage boys). does anyone know 
>> where i can get an boy toy over the age of 18? something nasty? this is 
>> the type i am looking for:
>> www.boytoyvideos.com
>> especially that guy on the right hand side with the moronic look on his
>> face. he looks nice and clueless. haha ha haahhahahaha ah h a!
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> "You gotta be smarter than your oponant."
>>
>> ---- Big Dumb Dave. (bigdumbdave29@yahoo.com)
>>
>> "Members of the 3rd right (Nazi/facist)?"
>>
>> ---- Scotty a.k.a. mr. third right. (cluelessscottyf44@canada.com)
>>
>>          .--------------------------------------.
>>         ( BAHHHH! KATO is an friend too  )
>>         ( my rear end BAHHHHH!               )
>>          `--------------------------------------'
>>     , ,/
>>     O@O
>> @   @@@
>>  @@@@@
>>  @@@@@
>>  || ||
>>
>> 
>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:18 EDT 2007
Article: 539852 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,calgary.general,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: New Rink For The Oilers - NO!! Not Another Triple5 Scam!! TAXES TOO HIGH ALREADY!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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If the stupid Oilers can pay Pronger $6 MILLION, and he still wants to
leave Deadmonton, then let the Oilers pay themselves for a new rink,
not taxpayers!!

If the Oilers can pay Roloson $11 MILLION, then they can afford to pay
for their own rink!!

After all, the Oilers is a BUSINESS, so let them survive, if at all,
by satisfying their actual customers.

If they don't, then let them go under, just like Woodwards, Eatons,
Debajis, and other businesses. With what they pay their thugs,
players, they are most definitely NOT A CHARITY, or even a city
service!!


On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 16:11:40 -0600, Harry Mazal 
wrote:

>With the taxpayers already being JEWED OUT OF $2.5 MILLION A YEAR TO SUBSIDIZE
>FOR THE NEXT 9 YEARS THESE OVERPAID HOCKEY THUGS, WHY SHOULD WE 
>GIVE THEM ONE BLOODY NICKEL MORE!!

>LET THEM GET THE MONEY NEEDED FROM THEIR SUCCKERS/SUPPORTERS, not taxpayers!

>On Mon, 3 Oct 2005 10:47:48 -0600, "TopPoster"  wrote:

>>> news:fle0k1l6hc3dsgh7lgkvilhdqf2st41637@4ax.com...

>>> > Saw the headline on the front page of today's Edmonton Journal.

>>> > Possibility that, ten years from now, the Oilers could be moving into a
>>> > new arena.

>>> > While they have nine years left to run in their lease on Rexall Place,
>>> > they could be looking for a bit of choice real estate to build a bigger
>>> > arena with seating for more Edmonton fans.  (I'm working on the
>>> > assumption here that the Edmonton Investors Group plans to keep the team
>>> > in Edmonton indefinietly.)

>>> > Assuming no unexpected downturn in the Alberta economy, it is reasonable
>>> > to expect that by that time Edmonton will be a much larger city than it
>>> > is today.

>>> > So where to put a new arena.  (I'm guessing sharx would prefer
>>> > Duggan--because then he'd be guaranteed a new LRT station close to sharx
>>> > manor.)

>>> Well, I have no objection to a new hockey arena AS LONG AS not one FUCKING
>>> cent of public funds goes into building it or maintaining it. The fucking
>>> owners group gets all the profit and the fucking owners group will get all
>>> the profit from the EVENTUAL sale of the team. Under the current
>>contracts,
>>> the owners group has no legal obligation to pay back one FUCKING cent of
>>> that TWO MILLION a year the city has been paying Northlands SO THAT THE
>>> FUCKING SPOILERS can use Rexall Place. Do I make myself abundantly FUCKING
>>> clear?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > --
>>> > John Fleming
>>> > Edmonton, Canada
>
>_________________________________________
>Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>More than 140,000 groups
>Unlimited download
>http://www.usenetzone.com to open account



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:18 EDT 2007
Article: 539854 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us can.politics:1339756 can.general:352630 soc.culture.canada:539854 tor.general:324359 ab.general:110020 calgary.general:352042
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics,can.general,soc.culture.canada,tor.general,ab.general,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton more murderous than Toronto
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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Deadmonton DOES NOT have a population of over 900,000!!
The city population is just over 500,000!!

The city is using the fictitious figure, to minimise the murder rate
in town!!

Don't forget, that the last 4 cop chiefs have all been canned in
disgrace!
Plus, the crooked cops still have not charged the serial killer of
over 100 women, which is making many think that perhaps it is 
one of the rogue cops doing all the extra murders!!

In fact the new chief this year is from Toronto. He was repeatedly
REFUSED the position of chief there. Mind you, as soon as he leaves
Toronto, Bill Blair the new chief, goes out and arrests 78 gang
members!!

Wonder why Mike Code did nothing about this while he was there as
deputy chief?

Apart from all the convictions against city cops for torture, with
more cops constantly being charged, and killing innocent victims like
last week!!

On Tue, 03 Jan 2006 22:27:54 GMT, "Chom Noamsky"  wrote:

>Edmonton records 37 homicides in 2005 while Toronto records 78.  Considering 
>the relative populations (est. 2004) of these two cities, the per 100,000 
>homicide rate works out to:

>  Edmonton - ( 37 / 947,311 ) * 10^5 = 3.9
>  Toronto - ( 78 / 2,518,772 ) * 10^5 = 3.1

>Oh what a shocker!  You're 25% more likely to become a victim of homicide in 
>Edmonton than Toronto.  What makes me laugh is the Alberta crackpot who 
>claims crime and homicide is somehow special to "Cherrana" and that the 
>problem is mysteriously attributable to "socialism."




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:19 EDT 2007
Article: 539855 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics,edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,calgary.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Two Edmonton cops epitomize "small town cheap"- Typical Edmonton Crooked Cops!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <0uqfa2trmnfu2ulj1c6j5n4ec143qh74t5@4ax.com>
References:  <6l4cv11lj13uguoj0i7m9m3nnigodtijkl@4ax.com>  
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On Fri, 17 Feb 2006 21:02:41 -0500, Bill Gannon
 wrote:
>Tiberius Rex  wrote:

>> Valid question, so far not answered - since the 2 cops charged DID NOT
>> HAVE THE AUTHORITY for the crooked photoradar contract, while the then
>> police chief WAS RESPONSIBLE, WHY HASN'T THE CHIEF ALSO BEEN ARRESTED?

>> The more is exposed about criminal cops in Edmonton, the more the
>> stink goes right to the top!!

>I suppose that you're happy that they gave the job of Chief to one of the 
>runners up for the job of Police Chief in Toronto?

>It takes time to clear up shit.   Michael J. Boyd was well regarded and a 
>favourite to replace Julian Fantino in Toronto, but politics screw the 
>best.   You didn't get a moron, that's for sure.


Perhaps Boyd will finally clean house, and not only FIRE, but also
PROSECUTE all those crooked senior cops that have been infesting EPS
for the last while under the last few disgraced and fired  chiefs of
police!!

This past week the Toronto Police announced massive raids against
gangs, with 78 arrests.

Why was this not done while Boyd was Deputy Chief in Toronto?

Why is nothing being done about skyrocketing crime in Deadmonton, now
that Boyd is chief there?

Hmmmm........

Only then will the public start to have any confidence in the local
cops. - when the crooked seargeants and inspectors and the like go to
jail!


From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:19 EDT 2007
Article: 539861 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,calgary.general,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: New Rink For The Oilers - NO!! OILERS PAY MILLIONS TO PRONGER,ROLOSON, So Don't Need Taxpayer Money!!  TAXES TOO HIGH ALREADY!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

If the stupid Oilers can pay Pronger $6 MILLION, and he still wants to
leave Deadmonton, then let the Oilers pay themselves for a new rink,
not taxpayers!!

If the Oilers can pay Roloson $11 MILLION, then they can afford to pay
for their own rink!!

After all, the Oilers is a BUSINESS, so let them survive, if at all,
by satisfying their actual customers.

If they don't, then let them go under, just like Woodwards, Eatons,
Debajis, and other businesses. With what they pay their thugs,
players, they are most definitely NOT A CHARITY, or even a city
service!!


On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 16:11:40 -0600, Harry Mazal 
wrote:

>With the taxpayers already being JEWED OUT OF $2.5 MILLION A YEAR TO SUBSIDIZE
>FOR THE NEXT 9 YEARS THESE OVERPAID HOCKEY THUGS, WHY SHOULD WE 
>GIVE THEM ONE BLOODY NICKEL MORE!!

>LET THEM GET THE MONEY NEEDED FROM THEIR SUCCKERS/SUPPORTERS, not taxpayers!

>On Mon, 3 Oct 2005 10:47:48 -0600, "TopPoster"  wrote:

>>> news:fle0k1l6hc3dsgh7lgkvilhdqf2st41637@4ax.com...

>>> > Saw the headline on the front page of today's Edmonton Journal.

>>> > Possibility that, ten years from now, the Oilers could be moving into a
>>> > new arena.

>>> > While they have nine years left to run in their lease on Rexall Place,
>>> > they could be looking for a bit of choice real estate to build a bigger
>>> > arena with seating for more Edmonton fans.  (I'm working on the
>>> > assumption here that the Edmonton Investors Group plans to keep the team
>>> > in Edmonton indefinietly.)

>>> > Assuming no unexpected downturn in the Alberta economy, it is reasonable
>>> > to expect that by that time Edmonton will be a much larger city than it
>>> > is today.

>>> > So where to put a new arena.  (I'm guessing sharx would prefer
>>> > Duggan--because then he'd be guaranteed a new LRT station close to sharx
>>> > manor.)

>>> Well, I have no objection to a new hockey arena AS LONG AS not one FUCKING
>>> cent of public funds goes into building it or maintaining it. The fucking
>>> owners group gets all the profit and the fucking owners group will get all
>>> the profit from the EVENTUAL sale of the team. Under the current
>>contracts,
>>> the owners group has no legal obligation to pay back one FUCKING cent of
>>> that TWO MILLION a year the city has been paying Northlands SO THAT THE
>>> FUCKING SPOILERS can use Rexall Place. Do I make myself abundantly FUCKING
>>> clear?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > --
>>> > John Fleming
>>> > Edmonton, Canada
>
>_________________________________________
>Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>More than 140,000 groups
>Unlimited download
>http://www.usenetzone.com to open account



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:19 EDT 2007
Article: 539867 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.usa,alt.privacy,can.general,soc.culture.canada,edm.general,rec.travel.usa-canada
Subject: Re: Edmonton, the best kept secret.
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <6i1ga2t65f4unh6cfdp9o3m45datldbv25@4ax.com>
References: <20060630XVbFnRi1f0l7Mxf194nd15I@G6Ld8> <2j8pg.2663$5J6.2016@newsread1.mlpsca01.us.to.verio.net>   
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Thanks to idiots such as you, reposting the articles on internet.
Plus, all the national and international TV news networks
rebroadcasting the shocking pictures of Kristin Wilson being pounded
into the pavement by one of Edmonton's finest thugs!!


On Sun, 02 Jul 2006 17:28:40 GMT, "Maxx" 
wrote:
>"NotMyName"  wrote in message 
>news:djgea2pp9bfk4bvf98o1vdc2o13abas4rm@4ax.com...
>
>> Sort of like what the cops did to Rodney King!!
>
>And THAT made world wide news!
>
> > No wonder the Edmonton Gestapo are getting such an unsavoury worldwide
>> reputation!!
>
>And just where would this, so called, "worldwide" news be found?  Oh - there 
>it is, NOWHERE!!
>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:19 EDT 2007
Article: 539915 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us edm.general:328143 edm.politics:12449 calgary.general:352062 ab.general:110036 can.general:352682 soc.culture.canada:539915
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,calgary.general,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: New Rink For The Oilers - NO!! OILERS PAY MILLIONS TO PRONGER,ROLOSON, So Don't Need Taxpayer Money!!  TAXES TOO HIGH ALREADY!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

If those replying want to financially support the overpaid
millionaires, then let them.

But NO TAXPAYER MONEY for these overpriced thugs!!

On Sun, 02 Jul 2006 17:23:27 GMT, NotMyName
 wrote:

>If the stupid Oilers can pay Pronger $6 MILLION, and he still wants to
>leave Deadmonton, then let the Oilers pay themselves for a new rink,
>not taxpayers!!
>
>If the Oilers can pay Roloson $11 MILLION, then they can afford to pay
>for their own rink!!
>
>After all, the Oilers is a BUSINESS, so let them survive, if at all,
>by satisfying their actual customers.
>
>If they don't, then let them go under, just like Woodwards, Eatons,
>Debajis, and other businesses. With what they pay their thugs,
>players, they are most definitely NOT A CHARITY, or even a city
>service!!


>On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 16:11:40 -0600, Harry Mazal 
>wrote:
>
>>With the taxpayers already being JEWED OUT OF $2.5 MILLION A YEAR TO SUBSIDIZE
>>FOR THE NEXT 9 YEARS THESE OVERPAID HOCKEY THUGS, WHY SHOULD WE 
>>GIVE THEM ONE BLOODY NICKEL MORE!!
>
>>LET THEM GET THE MONEY NEEDED FROM THEIR SUCCKERS/SUPPORTERS, not taxpayers!
>
>>On Mon, 3 Oct 2005 10:47:48 -0600, "TopPoster"  wrote:
>
>>>> news:fle0k1l6hc3dsgh7lgkvilhdqf2st41637@4ax.com...
>
>>>> > Saw the headline on the front page of today's Edmonton Journal.
>
>>>> > Possibility that, ten years from now, the Oilers could be moving into a
>>>> > new arena.
>
>>>> > While they have nine years left to run in their lease on Rexall Place,
>>>> > they could be looking for a bit of choice real estate to build a bigger
>>>> > arena with seating for more Edmonton fans.  (I'm working on the
>>>> > assumption here that the Edmonton Investors Group plans to keep the team
>>>> > in Edmonton indefinietly.)
>
>>>> > Assuming no unexpected downturn in the Alberta economy, it is reasonable
>>>> > to expect that by that time Edmonton will be a much larger city than it
>>>> > is today.
>
>>>> > So where to put a new arena.  (I'm guessing sharx would prefer
>>>> > Duggan--because then he'd be guaranteed a new LRT station close to sharx
>>>> > manor.)
>
>>>> Well, I have no objection to a new hockey arena AS LONG AS not one FUCKING
>>>> cent of public funds goes into building it or maintaining it. The fucking
>>>> owners group gets all the profit and the fucking owners group will get all
>>>> the profit from the EVENTUAL sale of the team. Under the current
>>>contracts,
>>>> the owners group has no legal obligation to pay back one FUCKING cent of
>>>> that TWO MILLION a year the city has been paying Northlands SO THAT THE
>>>> FUCKING SPOILERS can use Rexall Place. Do I make myself abundantly FUCKING
>>>> clear?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> > --
>>>> > John Fleming
>>>> > Edmonton, Canada
>>
>>_________________________________________
>>Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>>More than 140,000 groups
>>Unlimited download
>>http://www.usenetzone.com to open account



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:19 EDT 2007
Article: 539974 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us rec.travel.usa-canada:307584 can.general:352739 soc.culture.canada:539974 tor.general:324431
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: rec.travel.usa-canada,can.general,soc.culture.canada,tor.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton Canada  No one cares.
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There are now over 100 unsolved cases of murders of young women.
People are starting to wonder, whether the serial killer may even be
another crooked cop!!

Week after week, more unsolved murders, with the crooked cops begging
for citizen assistance.

It seems that all Edmonton cops are good for, is photo-radar tickets,
and beating up innocent civilians, just like the Gestapo, KGB, and the
Rodney King crooked cops!

On Sun, 02 Jul 2006 21:51:12 GMT, gel  wrote:

>The Edmonton police always seems to hit or even kill the weakest of
>people.
> They killed two drunks, brutalized a woman and it seems they always
>charge defenseless people with non-sens charges.Never do we ear they go
>after real criminals.
> And always they phisacally hurt the defenseless citizens .



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:20 EDT 2007
Article: 539975 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
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Subject: Re: Edmonton Canada  No one cares.
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It seems that Madd Maxx is just too plain stupid, to know how to use a
browser, and read the news articles for himself.


On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 00:01:46 GMT, "Maxx" 
wrote:
>"gel"  wrote in message 
>news:NJYpg.19$FO1.3984@news.uswest.net...
>> find it in The Edmonton Journal and The Edmonton Sun.
>
>If it were there, you could post a link.
>
>> Since you are one of those,then you do not care ,we know that already.
>>   Edmonton's mentality is everyman for themselves.
>> So Maxx you only care for yourself and you are ready to hurt for a
>> dollar.
>> You like it when Edmonton's cops hurts innocent people.
>>    Admit it Maxx.
>
>I don't like it, or dislike it.  How can I?  So far, these posts have been 
>just bullshit stories, with nothing backing them up. 
>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:20 EDT 2007
Article: 539980 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics.can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Costa Rican family deported on Canada Day
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On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 15:25:56 GMT, 10x@teluös.net wrote:
>On 2 Jul 2006 22:25:36 -0700, tyreenblaque@hotmail.com wrote:
>>spamhotmail@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> http://ca.news.yahoo.com/cbc/s/01072006/3/canada-costa-rican-family-deported-canada-day.html

>>> Costa Rican family deported on Canada Day

>>> A Toronto family has been deported to their native Costa Rica after
>>> exhausting all avenues to stay in Canada.

>>To be truthful the headline should have read "A Central American family
>>living illegally in Toronto has been deported to their native Costa
>>Rica after exhausting all avenues to stay in Canada".

>>What I can't figure out is why they deport these hardworking people and
>>leave behind all these low-down, no-good street trash foreign
>>criminals,who are out robbin',rapin',drug dealin',shootin' and a
>>killin'.

>It's the "Liberal Way"!
>take the ö out of 10x@teluös.net to email me

It seems the Costa Ricans were honest hard working people.
They were not ZYD criminals, dope dealers, AIDS spreaders, 
or any of the other criminal filth the Canadian government loves 
to import as so-called "refugees"



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:20 EDT 2007
Article: 539982 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.politics,edm.general,ab.general,calgary.general,can.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton Cop Posts "Racist" Material on U.S. Stormfront = CRIMINAL  ACTS by Crooked Edmonton Cops!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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On Mon, 3 Jul 2006 11:16:59 -0400, "Horgon"  wrote:
>"Dave Smith"  wrote in message
>news:44A93431.6F1D634B@sympatico.ca...
>> Frank Arthur wrote:
>>
>> > Will the police chief have the balls to charge his own people with CRIMINAL
>> > CHARGES, as his crooked cops did with Glenn Bahr?
>>
>> Frank, you poor pathetic loser. What exactly is it with you and your paranoia
>> about the Edmonton cops?
>>
>> No one cares.

>He's not the real Frank Arthur, he's mentally ill bigot William Grosvenor of
>Edmonton Alberta

And your proof for this claim is what?

By the way, why do you not comment on all the news stories,
documenting all the criminality of so many crooked Edmonton cops?

Surely you are not another one yourself?



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:20 EDT 2007
Article: 539983 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.australian:393281 soc.culture.new-zealand:209810 uk.politics.misc:1744565 rec.travel.europe:857240 soc.culture.canada:539983 soc.culture.usa:1882692
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.new-zealand,uk.politics.misc,rec.travel.europe,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Re: Edmonton Canada Gestapo Getting Bad International Reputation  for Brutality - AVOID Edmonton
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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The Edmonton Journal for yesterday 29 June 2006 had a full page of
letters to the editor complaining about the police brutality!!

These comments are apart from concern by the taxpayers regarding the
supposed extra $2.2MILLION cost claimed by the new police chief.
Guess his undercover rioters did not come cheap?
Is this part of the reason Toronto refused repeatedly to give Mike
Boyd the position of Chief Cop?

Chief Boyd admits that there are at least 35 unresolved complaints
filed against his police in connection with police brutality over the
past week or so!


On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 08:17:52 -0600, Frank Arthur 
wrote:

>The local media had a great day publicising the torture of a young woman by
>another rogue Edmonton cop!!

>This Gestapo-like thug was photographed by several reporters, while he beat
>the handcuffed young lady and threw her face onto the pavement, breaking open
>her face!

>In another incident the same night, a 66 year old lawyer , Brian Fish, was
>tasered illegally, for taking pictures of police brutality. He is now laying
>charges against the cops involved.

>And the police chief seems to be doing nothing about all his crooked cops!
>Is this why Mike Boyd was refused the Chief's position in Toronto?

>Guess Chief Boyd was too busy wasting $2,200,000 of taxpayers money 
>setting up his thugs to torture civilians?

>Mind you, the inept cops still have not caught the serial killer of more than
>100 prostitutes, or even the killers of another 2 people this week!!


>On 2006-06-19 11:53:03 -0400, Boadicea  said:

>> The Edmonton Journal for today - 19 June 2006 - carries 2 pages full
>> of photos showing the Edmonton Gestapo TORTURING a woman, who was not 
>> resisting!!

>> Guess the crooked cops forgot that there are people taking
>> photographs?

>> And the jew mayor sees nothing wrong with police brutality.
>> Guess he belongs to the kill-a palestinian school of torture?

>> And they wonder why tourists around the world are starting to avoid
>> visiting UNSAFE Canada!!



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:21 EDT 2007
Article: 539992 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics.can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Costa Rican family deported on Canada Day
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References: <1151860852.935347.31030@a14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> <1151904336.673189.200400@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com> <98aia2hr9ndl9nojf751dbl50n08n4cfb4@4ax.com>
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On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 15:25:56 GMT, 10x@teluös.net wrote:
>On 2 Jul 2006 22:25:36 -0700, tyreenblaque@hotmail.com wrote:
>>spamhotmail@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> http://ca.news.yahoo.com/cbc/s/01072006/3/canada-costa-rican-family-deported-canada-day.html

>>> Costa Rican family deported on Canada Day

>>> A Toronto family has been deported to their native Costa Rica after
>>> exhausting all avenues to stay in Canada.

>>To be truthful the headline should have read "A Central American family
>>living illegally in Toronto has been deported to their native Costa
>>Rica after exhausting all avenues to stay in Canada".

>>What I can't figure out is why they deport these hardworking people and
>>leave behind all these low-down, no-good street trash foreign
>>criminals,who are out robbin',rapin',drug dealin',shootin' and a
>>killin'.

>It's the "Liberal Way"!
>take the ö out of 10x@teluös.net to email me

It seems the Costa Ricans were honest hard working people.
They were not ZYD criminals, dope dealers, AIDS spreaders, 
or any of the other criminal filth the Canadian government loves 
to import as so-called "refugees"



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:21 EDT 2007
Article: 539993 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics,edm.general,ab.general,edm.politics,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Guardian Angels In Edmonton, Canada - Hooray
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The Guardian Angels group, headed by their leader, arrived yesterday
in Edmonton, Canada.

They had been invited by a local citizen, who had become disgusted
with the rising crime, compounded by all the scandals involving
crooked police.

Even the previous police chief was fired for just cause.
Now, the new chief cop is annoyed that an outside source has been
called in to do some of his functions.

The artsie-fartsie mayor is also annoyed, since it gives bad
international publicity to Deadmonton.


From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:21 EDT 2007
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.canada,can.general
Subject: Re: Want To See Ken McVay Tilt?
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On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 15:06:33 -0500, Tommy  wrote:

>The Numbers Decline, The Controversy Increases 
>Multiple Sources
>1-21-5

>It is past time for an international investigation conducted by truly
>impartial scientists, researchers and scholars into the reality of
>Auschwitz to properly and as accurately as possible bring history into
>accord with the facts. Peoples of all religions and persuasions have a
>right to such facts. So far, as the following data demonstrates, we are a
>long way from a consensus on the truth of what happened at Auschwitz in
>WWII. 
 
>9,000,000 
>  
>Source: Cited by the French documentary, Night and Fog, which has been shown
>to millions of school students worldwide. 
 
>8,000,000 
 
>Source: The French War Crime Research Office, Doc. 31, 1945. 
 
>7,000,000 
>  
>Source: Also cited by the French War Crime Research Office. 
>  
>6,000,000 
>  
>Source: Cited in the book Auschwitz Doctor by Miklos Nyiszli. It has since
>been proven that this book is a fraud and the "doctor" was never even at
>Auschwitz, even though the book is often cited by historians. 
>  
>5,000,000 to 5,500,000 
>  
>Source: Cited in 1945 at the trial of Auschwitz commander Rudolf Höss, based
>on his confession which was written in English, a language he never spoke. 
>  
>5,000,000 
>  
>Source: Cited on April 20, 1978 by the French daily, Le Monde. Also cited on
>January 23, 1995 by the German daily Die Welt. By September 1, 1989, Le
>Monde reduced the figure to 1,433,000. 
>  
>4,500,000 
>  
>Source: In 1945 this figure was cited by another witness at the
>aforementioned Höss trial. 
>  
>4,000,000 
>  
>Source: Cited by a Soviet document of May 6, 1945 and officially
>acknowledged by the Nuremberg War Crimes trial. This figure was also
>reported in The New York Times on April 18, 1945, although 50 years later
>on January 26, 1995, The New York Times and The Washington Post slashed the
>figure to 1,500,000 citing new findings by the Auschwitz Museum officials.
>In fact, the figure of 4,000,000 was later repudiated by the Auschwitz
>museum officials in 1990 but the figure of 1,500,000 victims was not
>formally announced by Polish President Lech Walesa until five years after
>the Auschwitz historians had first announced their discovery. 
>  
>3,500,000 
>  
>Source: Cited in the 1991 edition of the Dictionary of the French Language
>and by Claude Lanzmann in 1980 in his introduction to Filip Muller's book,
>Three Years in an Auschwitz Gas Chamber. 
>  
>3,000,000 
>  
>Source: Cited in a forced confession by Rudolf Höss, the Auschwitz commander
>who said this was the number of those who had died at Auschwitz prior to
>Dec. 1, 1943. Later cited in the June 7, 1993 issue of Heritage, the most
>widely read Jewish newspaper in California, even though three years
>previously the authorities at the Auschwitz museum had scaled down the
>figure to a minimum of 1,100,000 and a maximum of 1,500,000. (see below). 
>  
>2,500,000 
>  
>Source: Cited by Rudolf Vrba (an author of various fraudulent accounts of
>events he claims to have witnessed at Auschwitz) when he testified on July
>16, 1981 for the Israeli government's war crimes trial of former SS
>official Adolf Eichmann. 
>  
>2,000,000 
>  
>Source: Cited by Leon Poliakov (1951) writing in Harvest of Hate; Georges
>Wellers, writing in 1973 in The Yellow Star at the Time of Vichy; and Lucy
>Dawidowicz, writing in 1975 in The War Against the Jews. 
>  
>2,000,000 to 4,000,000 
>  
>Source: Cited by Yehuda Bauer in 1982 in his book, A History of the
>Holocaust. However, by 1989 Bauer revised his figure to 1,600,000. 
>  
>1,600,000 
>  
>Source: This is a 1989 revision by Yehuda Bauer of his earlier figure in
>1982 of 2,000,000 to 4,000,000, Bauer cited this new figure on September
>22, 1989 in The Jerusalem Post, at which time he wrote "The larger figures
>have been dismissed for years, except that it hasn't reached the public
>yet." 
>  
>1,500,000 
>  
>Source: In 1995 this was the number of Auschwitz deaths announced by Polish
>President Lech Walesa as determined by those at the Auschwitz museum. This
>number was inscribed on the monument at the Auschwitz camp at that time,
>thereby "replacing" the earlier 4,000,000 figure that had been formally
>repudiated (and withdrawn from the monument) five years earlier in 1990. At
>that time, on July 17, 1990 The Washington Times reprinted a brief article
>from The London Daily Telegraph citing the "new" figure of 1,500,000 that
>had been determined by the authorities at the Auschwitz museum. This new
>figure was reported two years later in a UPI report published in the New
>York Post on March 26, 1992. On January 26, 1995 both The Washington Post
>and The New York Times cited this 1,500,000 figure as the new "official"
>figure (citing the Auschwitz Museum authorities). 
>  
>1,471,595 
>  
>Source: This is a 1983 figure cited by Georges Wellers who (as noted
>previously) had determined, writing in 1973, that some 2,000,000 had died. 
>  
>1,433,000 
>  
>Source: This figure was cited on September 1, 1989 by the French daily, Le
>Monde, which earlier, on April 20, 1978, had cited the figure at 4,000,000. 
>  
>1,250,000 
>  
>Source: In the book, The Destruction of the European Jews, by Raul Hilberg
>(1985). 
>  
>1,100,000 to 1,500,000 
>  
>Source: Sources for this estimate are Yisrael Gutman and Michael Berenbaum
>in their 1984 book, Anatomy of the Auschwitz Death Camp. This estimate was
>later also cited by Walter Reich, former director of the U.S. Holocaust
>Memorial Museum, writing in The Washington Post on September 8, 1998. The
>upper figure of 1,500,000 is (the new) "official" figure as now inscribed
>at Auschwitz, with the earlier figure of 4,000,000 having been removed from
>the memorial at the site of the former concentration camp. 
>  
>1,000,000 
>  
>Source: Jean-Claude Pressac, writing in his 1989 book Auschwitz: Technique
>and Operation of the Gas Chambers. This is interesting since he wrote his
>book to repudiate so-called "Holocaust deniers" who were called that
>precisely because they had questioned the numbers of those who had died at
>Auschwitz. 
>  
>900,000 
>  
>Source: Reported on August 3, 1990 11, by Aufbau, a Jewish newspaper in New
>York. 
>  
>800,000 to 900,000 
>  
>Source: Reported by Gerald Reitlinger in his book, The Final Solution. 
>  
>775,000 to 800,000 
>  
>Source: Jean-Claude Pressac's revised figure, put forth in his 1993 book,
>The Crematoria of Auschwitz: The Mass Murder's Machinery, scaling down his
>earlier claim of 1,000,000 dead. 
>  
>630,000 to 710,000 
>  
>Source: In 1994 Pressac scaled his figure down somewhat further; this is the
>figure cited in the German language translation of Pressac's 1993 book
>originally published in French. Again, this is substantially less than
>Pressac's 1989 figure of 1,000,000. 
>  
>135,000 to 140,000 
>  
>Source: This is an estimate based on documents held by the International
>Tracing Service of the Red Cross. It is known that International Tracing
>Service has a complete set of registration documents. This is thought to
>include a complete set of roll-call data which includes twice daily tallies
>of those who died. Although the International Tracing Service of the Red
>Cross has such records, they have never officially published an accurate
>count of those who died, or even an accurate report as to exactly which
>documents they hold. However, totals from these records have been obtained
>by various interested parties. 
>  
>The estimate of 135,500 is roughly corroborated by the "Auschwitz death
>books." The death books themselves are wartime German camp records, which
>were captured by the Soviets towards the end of the war, and hidden in
>Soviet achieves, until released to the Red Cross in 1989. 
>  
>The death books consist of 46 volumes which document each death at Auschwitz
>(each death certificate consists of the deceased person's full name,
>profession and religion, date and place of birth, pre-Auschwitz residence,
>parents' names, time of death, and cause of death as determined by a camp
>physician). The records for the most important years, 1942 and 1943, are
>almost complete (there are also a few volumes for the year 1941, but none
>for the year 1944 or January 1945 (when Auschwitz was evacuated)). 
>  
>The Auschwitz death books contain the death certificates of some 69,000
>individuals, of whom about 30,000 were listed as Jews. You may view various
>entries in the Auschwitz Death Books by clicking on the following links to
>the Auschwitz museum: 
>  
>Using all available wartime records from the various camps it has been
>estimated that between 400,000 and 
>500,000 people died in the German concentration camp system (from all
>causes). 
>  
>The ever declining numbers of alleged dead at Auschwitz, are graphically
>illustrated by the plaques from the camp. 
>  
>The first is the plaque that was on display at the Auschwitz camp from 1948
>until 1989 and states "4 million" victims. 
>  
>The second plaque currently on display at Auschwitz has the dramatically
>reduced number of victims, now only 1.5 million. 
>  
>A casual reduction in the number of deaths by some 2.5 million. 
>  
>Deaths at Auschwitz drop by a stunning 2.5 million, but the legendary
>6,000,000 figure remains the same.
>http://www.rense.com/general62/auch.htm



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:22 EDT 2007
Article: 539995 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: bc.politics,can.politics,can.general,soc.culture.canada,ab.general,alt.politics.nationalism.white
Subject: Re: Former Vancouver police officer faces child pornography charges-ZYD Kiddie Porn Criminal Gets Off!
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On Tue, 20 Jun 2006 03:27:17 GMT, dangdangdoodle3
 wrote:
>In article ,
> "NDP Rogue"  Socilaists.6768447746865.gov> wrote:

>> Former Vancouver police officer faces child pornography charges

>> VANCOUVER (CP) - A former police officer who once ran the department's
>> school-liaison program faces child pornography charges. John Dragani has
>> been charged with one count of possession of child pornography and one count
>> of accessing child pornography. Dragani, who was a sergeant, was suspended
>> without pay last year until he retired. Vancouver Constable Tim Fanning says
>> Crown counsel approved the charges after an aggressive police investigation.
>> Fanning says the allegations were embarrassing, but it's also an opportunity
>> to show when criminal conduct is alleged against an officer they take it
>> seriously. Dragani was arrested Monday at his Vancouver home and will face
>> the charges in Surrey provincial court.

>It would take 5 or 6 minutes to charge anyone else, but for this cop, it 
>took over a year and apparently he was allowed to retire. Plus he 
>appears to be minimally charged, where as someone else would have the 
>book thrown at them.

>Any cop caught breaking the law on duty should have automatically 
>doubled sentencing because they've also broken the public's trust which 
>they have agreed to keep. I'm sure people like Harper, who believe in 
>longer sentences to protect the public would agree with me, if he's not 
>a being a bloody hypocrite again.

Typical of the crooked police forces in Canada!
Since they could not completely cover it up, they allowed the crooked
cop to resign, so he could collect his pension and other benefits!!

Subject: Re: ZYD Friedman-KIDDIE PORN DISTRIBUTOR , from Synagogue!!
He Did No Jail Time!! Edmonton Man,Not Jew, Gets 3 1/2 Years!

On 18 Mar 2006 20:14:27 -0000, Ariadne wrote:
And Robert Welldumb could find nothing wrong with the detailed report,
so he complains about the TRUTH:

Welldumb could not explain why the crooked ZYD got no jail, while the
white man in Edmonton got 3 1/2 years in jail - FOR AN EVEN LESSER
OFFENCE!!

One must wonder, is Welldumb another kiddie porn distributor?

>Notice that Ted had listed at least 2 different Friedman
>JEW CHILD MOLESTERS!!

>Are these Friedmans related to the pervert Stuart Friedman, former cantor of
>the synagogue in Halifax, Canada?

>He is the one caught as a major international distributor of KIDDIE PORN, from
>his synagogue. The Canadian cops allowed him to flee back to Boston, where the
>FBI picked him up!!

>But for a white man convicted of similar charges, the white guy in Edmonton gets 3 1/2 years in jail!!

One must question the preferential treatment given to the KIDDIE PORN
DISTRIBUTOR OPERATING FROM THE SYNAGOGUE!!

Why was he allowed to avoid jail, when a white man gets 3 1/2 years,
deservedly?

What did the crooked judge in that case receive for his generosity?

Looks like the Canadian public got JEWED, again!!
________________________________________
>On 31 Dec 2005 11:49:41 -0800, "Iamhere"  wrote:
>
>>If your piece is fact, what is the major deal about one Jewish pervert
>>vis a vis the thousands of priests who earned their prayer beads by
>>buggering little boys? I say you are a goyische hypocrite.
>>Iamhere
>>======================================================================================
>>Ted Dichtler wrote:
>>> On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 10:11:31 -0700, ariadne 
>>> wrote:
>
>>> Are these Friedmans related to the pervert Stuart Friedman, former
>>> cantor of the synagogue in Halifax, Canada?
>
>>> He is the one caught as a major international DISTRIBUTOR of KIDDIE
>>> PORN, from his synagogue. The Canadian cops allowed him to flee back
>>> to Boston, where the FBI picked him up!!
>
>>> Story as reported by newspaper follows:
>>> kenmcvay  Feb 14 1999, 1:00 am
>>> Newsgroups: soc.culture.polish, soc.culture.russian, soc.culture.ukrainian,
>>> soc.culture.palestine
>>> From: kenmc...@in.vino.veritas.lies
>>> Date: 1999/02/14
>>> Subject: Re: NIZKOR Supports ZHID Kiddie Porn Distributor from Synangogue
>>> On Thu, 25 Sep 1997 17:16:03 GMT, odess...@direct.ca wrote:
>>> >On Thu, 25 Sep 1997 01:55:53 -0500, jacob bekker 
>>> >wrote:
>
>>> >>If that was "A Polish school teacher at a Halifax church..." than it was O.K.
>>> >>J.B.
>>> >No, it would not be OK, no matter who is the pervert.
>
>>> >What is of concern, is whether the 3 NON-JEWS presently charged with
>>> >similar crimes, will now also be allowed to leave Canada, without
>>> >having to spend the normal 5 years in prison?
>
>>> >Or, is this generosity only available to damn JEW KIDDIE PORN
>>> >DISTRIBUTORS, especially if they are connected to a synagogue??
>
>>> >>> > wrote:
>
>>> ARREST SHOCKS SYNAGOGUE; TEACHER FLIES BACK TO U.S.
>>> By EVA HOARE and AMY PUGSLEY FRASER Staff Reporters
>
>>> A Hebrew school teacher and cantor at a Halifax synagogue, who downloaded
>>> hundreds of pornographic photographs of children from the Internet, was
>>> fined $2,200 in court Tuesday.
>
>>> The fine was paid and Suart David Friedman, a
>>> well-liked and respected member of the Beth Israel Synagogue, promptly left
>>> the country for his native United States.
>
>>> It's the first charge of its kind in Nova Scotia and justice officials
>>> hinted that Mr. Friedman's activities - downloading a personal fantasy
>>> collection of boys performing sexual and sadomasochistic acts - could be
>>> connected to an international child pornography ring.
>
>>> Mr. Friedman, 42, of South Park Street, Halifax, pleaded guilty to
>>> possessing child pornography from the Internet. When Canada Customs and
>>> police officers arrested him during a raid on his apartment Monday, the
>>> cantor was surfing the Net. Although his private cache contained photographs
>>> and videos - as well as gay and bondage magazines - the bulk of his
>>> collection was 223 computer-generated photos of child pornography stored on
>>> diskettes, on two computer hard drives, and on computer printouts.
>
>>> ``It's extremely disgusting,'' said Const. Gary Martin of the Halifax
>>> Regional Police Service, whose officers also conducted a search of Chebucto
>>> Freenet offices, Mr. Friedman's Internet provider. ``Ninety per cent of this
>>> material was obtained either directly or indirectly through the Internet.
>>> Some ... was directly downloaded from the Internet and some ... was obtained
>>> from different groups that are within the Internet,'' Const. Martin said.
>>> ``The pictures are very explicit. It covers just about every avenue of
>>> pornography that's out there.''
>
>>> Canada Customs' intelligence division started working the case last
>>> September and then brought in regional police, said Ed Osborne, customs'
>>> regional intelligence officer.
>
>>> Now officers - who'll spend hundreds of hours poring over the materials -
>>> want to know if any Nova Scotian children were depicted in the ``gruesome''
>>> photos and material seized. But they do not expect that will be the case.
>
>>> Parents of children who attended the Hebrew school, shocked by the arrest,
>>> planned to meet Tuesday night. ``As aware as people are that these things
>>> can and do happen, it's still a shock,'' said Cathy Fox, president of the
>>> Beth Israel Synagogue. Her three children - two sons and a daughter - were
>>> taught by Mr. Friedman at the synagogue's Hebrew school. ``It's a very
>>> difficult time.''
>
>>> The cantor - who leads the congregation in song - taught her 13- year-old
>>> son songs and chants that were part of his bar mitzvah ceremony last
>>> October, Mrs. Fox said.
>
>>> Some members will feel betrayed as a result of the charges. ``I think the
>>> elderly members of our congregation will be very hurt by this.'' Some are
>>> appalled while others expressed sympathy. ``I'm very saddened,'' said Robert
>>> Wolman, president of the synagogue's board of governors.
>
>>> Mr. Wolman said he and other board members heard about the case Monday night
>>> and Mr. Friedman was immediately dismissed.
>
>>> Wearing an olive-colored trenchcoat and a black yarmulke (skull cap) over
>>> his greying hair, a pale and visibly nervous Mr. Friedman was ushered into
>>> provincial court by two sheriff's deputies. Refusing even to look up at the
>>> judge, he stared resolutely at the floor while wringing his hands.
>
>>> ``This is the first (such) charge through our office,'' Crown attorney Frank
>>> Hoskins told Judge Hughes Randall. ``But it sends a message out to the
>>> public that if you're in possession of these images from your Internet and
>>> they're child pornography, you can be charged with a criminal offence and
>>> get a criminal record and a substantial fine,'' Mr. Hoskins said later.
>
>>> Article Segment 2 of 2
>>> (Ge
>>> (Get All
>
>>> Canada Customs received information about a child pornography ring in Canada
>>> and the United States operating via the Internet, surface mail and
>>> electronic (e-mail), the Crown attorney said.
>
>>> Officers said Mr. Friedman's apartment was ``ill-kept and unclean,'' and
>>> that they also found letters with explicit sexual content. A second search
>>> conducted at Chebucto Freenet yielded his e-mail records.
>
>>> Mr. Hoskins and defence lawyer Joel Pink said Mr. Friedman, who co-operated
>>> with police, was only using the material for his own sexual fantasies. ``His
>>> intent was possession, not distribution or selling,'' said the Crown.
>
>>> The former cantor - who is not married - has provided information that will
>>> help police bring more ``like-minded individuals'' to justice, Mr. Hoskins=
>>> said.
>
>>> Outside court, police Sgt. Bill Cowper, the department's Internet
>>> specialist, said this is just the beginning. ``We're pursuing every angle at
>>> this time. He's not the only person. ... The investigation does involve law
>>> enforcement officials in Canada and in the United States.''
>
>>> Police said Mr. Friedman is being investigated over the alleged distribution
>>> of photos to other Internet users. Police won't say which American agencies
>>> are involved and the U.S. Customs Service, reached late Tuesday, declined
>>> comment.
>
>>> Mr. Hoskins asked that Mr. Friedman surrender his computers, valued at
>>> $1,200 and $1,500 apiece, to the court in addition to the $2,200 fine
>>> ($2,000 plus a $200 victim surcharge). Two sets of handcuffs were also
>>> confiscated.
>
>>> After the court appearance, Mr. Friedman took the 4:45 p.m. flight to Boston
>>> to be with his family.
>
>>> Officials won't comment on the amount of the fine - the offence carries a
>>> maximum of five years in prison - saying that's up to the judge. But they
>>> did say there was a plea bargain.
>
>>> Mr. Friedman, holder of a music degree from an American university, arrived
>>> in Halifax in August 1994 and has worked at Beth Israel ever since. His last
>>> posting as a cantor was in the Detroit area. The man, whose job was to lead
>>> prayers, teach Hebrew school and help prepare boys for bar mitzvah, has no
>>> prior criminal record, Mr. Pink said.
>
>>> ``My eldest son has a great deal of respect for the cantor,'' said Mrs. Fox,
>>> who wanted to break the news to her children before they heard it through
>>> the media.
>>> ``We have to do this in a very nonalarmist fashion ... I'm still thinking
>>> about how we will handle this.''
>
>>> Mr. Wolman said the board of governors would review of the matter as soon as
>>> possible and plans to tighten the screening process for future cantors.
>
>>> Police also said they found a stash of adult pornography - 31 nude or
>>> partially-nude self-portraits - but the charges stem from the child-related
>>> material.
>
>>> With staff reporters Bruce Erskine and Barry Dorey
>>> The Halifax Herald Limited, 1997.
>
>>> Join NSWPP mailing-list, go to:
>>> http://www.nswpp.org/">http://www.nswpp.org
>
>
>>> >On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 17:54:44 +0100, "mkarwan"  wrote:
>
>>> >>http://judicial-inc.biz/freidman_pedophiles_from_hell.htm
>
>>> >One Of Jewry's Most Explosive Incidences
>
>>> >Every now and then, there is a crime so ghastly, that even the Jewish media
>>> >control can't prevent the world from knowing. The crimes of the Friedmans were
>>> >so atrocious, that no string pulling was going to stop this investigation.
>
>>> >They were running a day care in the morning, and teaching computers to 8, 9,
>>> >and 10 yr olds in the afternoon.
>
>>> >They were found to have molested  hundreds of children, and taken extensive
>>> >video and photographic files on their molestations.
>
>>> It seems that much of the pornography and especially KIDDIE PORN
>>> rackets worldwide are run by the JEWS!

If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
then visit  www.freedomsite.org

Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

"At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth 
is a revolutionary act." 
(George Orwell)

David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'

"All truth passes through three stages. 
First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, 
and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
(Arthur Schopenhauer)

"The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely, 
but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak 
falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if 
they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
against them -- except force." -- John Bryant  

"To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an 
acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer 
and impossible to ignore."
--John Bryant


Posted by: 
Patrick Lee Humphrey
7500 Bellerive #1807
Houston, Texas 77036-3040
1-713-266-7764

Steven Horn (KCOM)
1836 NW 11th St
Oklahoma City, OK 73106
(405) 524-0576

together with
Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive & 
Henry 
CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even 
VISIT me at:
55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132

We all like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
We are together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
We like young children, so that we can train them our way.


Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
office: VISIT at:
#5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
or call: 1-250-616-9431

As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is 
called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material 
should give an indication as to the why.

"I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]

Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like 
a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
even if he or she were not naked"?
http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg

For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David
Michael's
detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and
is
known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a
grosvenor!! 
It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases,
just 
to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.

Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: Flavia18@verizon.net, especially
late nights.

Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or  
send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
work:(780)492-0473

And also: George Firestone: "George" ,
and davejoll@ihug.co.nz.

Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!

For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
JEW-WATCH:
http://www.jewwatch.com

Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!

Or, other useful websites include:
ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
IHR - www.ihr.org
OSTARA - www.ostara.org
PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press, 
    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com

Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
They have lots of information, as well as books and records.

They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.

As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a 
victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:23 EDT 2007
Article: 539996 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us edm.general:328232 edm.politics:12455 ab.general:110047 can.general:352759 soc.culture.canada:539996 calgary.general:352074
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Anyone care to comment? Crooked Edmonton School Board Wasted Millions!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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Typical bureaucratic SCAM!!
The big shots KNEW they were OVERPAYING the teachers, but chose to do
nothing!
The principals KNEW they were OVER BUDGET, but chose to do nothing!
The teachers knew the Board could not afford them, but di not give a
damn.

And what about all the overpaid TRUSTEES? 
Why are they not being prosecuted, for NEGLIGENCE?

What is more alarming, the AUDITORS KNEW THERE WERE SERIOUS FINANCIAL
IRREGULARITIES, AND CHOSE TO COVER THEM UP FOR THOSE YEARS, 
INSTEAD OF EXPOSING THE PEOPLE WHO PAID THEM!! 
Or is it really pay-off to keep quiet?
Does CA still stand for CROOKED ACCOUNTANT?

It seems no one directly involved is being held responsible - why?


On Wed, 21 Jun 2006 23:35:57 GMT, Sew 
wrote:

>CARRIE McFADZEAN
>Examiner Staff 

>Edmonton Catholic School (ECS) trustees are changing the way they
>operate.
>
>Opening up lines of communication, taking back some of the
>superintendent’s power and playing a role on the budget committee are
>part of sweeping changes in the board’s governance policy.
>
>“For some time, the board has felt the governance model we’ve been
>using hasn’t been working that well,” says board chairperson Debbie
>Cavaliere.
>
>The changes, which were made during a board retreat in late May,
>follow a tumultuous time in the district.
>
>Earlier this year, a $10 million deficit, caused by accounting errors
>and overspending, was discovered. It will take the district five years
>to pay it back. At the end of February, superintendent Dale Ripley’s
>contract was terminated.
>
>While a new superintendent hasn’t been hired yet, Cavaliere says the
>timing was right to change the board’s governance policies.
>
>“It’s a dramatic shift in thinking and it’s time for the change,” she
>says.
>
>The board has been using the Carver model of governance since 1997.
>
>Under this model, used by many school boards in Alberta, trustees set
>policy direction, which is implemented by the superintendent who
>reports directly to the board.
>
>All district staff report only to the superintendent and have no
>contact with trustees.
>
>“Under that model, the board delegated a lot of responsibility,” says
>Cavaliere. 
>
>“It kept only those responsibilities that cannot be delegated like
>school closures, budget allocations and teacher transfers. Everything
>else was delegated to the superintendent.”
>
>Trustees were making important decisions based on information provided
>by the superintendent.
>
>Wanting a broader perspective and information base, trustees signaled
>a need for change.
>
>The new made-in-Edmonton-Catholic model gives more power to the
>trustees.
>
>For example, a trustee will now sit on the budget committee.
>
>Trustees will determine what responsibilities and authority district
>staff have.
>
>The superintendent will still have many of the same responsibilities,
>but trustees will now be able to ask senior staff questions directly.
>
>“It doesn’t put the onus on the superintendent to gather and relay the
>information,” says Cavaliere. “It’s much more effective and more
>efficient.”
>
>The new governance documents are being drafted and will come to a
>public meeting in the fall for a trustee vote.



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Post the news story to every appropriate newsgroup.
The hotel won't like the publicity, but if true, then you are
protected by the US Constitutuin!

Be sure to include the date of the news story, as well as page number
for reference.

Glad to see that some people are concerned about warning others.

Other warnings could include hotel names, where hotels infested with
bedbugs and cockroaches!

On 3 Jul 2006 10:00:27 -0700, "Takuro Ishii" 
wrote:

>I live in Virginia--near DC--and a hotel nearby has been suffered from
>a lot of crime lately, according to my local paper's crime report. It'd
>be nice to warn fellow travelers by posting the brief crime report but
>I have discovered this is banned at all major travel review sites
>(Yahoo, Expedia, TripAdvisor, etc). What's the reasoning behind this?
>
>Is there anywhere I can post this information in order to help fellow
>travelers, or would it be a bad idea for me to do so (in which case
>I'll just forget about it)?
>
>I think it's a shame that hundreds of readers/viewers to these travel
>sites will stay at this hotel based on the somewhat positive reviews
>out there, none of which address the crime issue.
>
>I wish there was a site that included this info--few things are more
>important than personal safety and property protection when choosing a
>hotel. Such a site could use a good tagline: "Get the real scoop on
>personal safety during your vacation. View the information that hotels,
>Yahoo, Expedia, and TripAdvisor DON'T want you to see!"



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:24 EDT 2007
Article: 540106 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.australian:393346 soc.culture.new-zealand:209812 uk.politics.misc:1745341 rec.travel.europe:857510 soc.culture.canada:540106 soc.culture.usa:1883117
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.new-zealand,uk.politics.misc,rec.travel.europe,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Re: Edmonton Canada Gestapo Getting Bad International Reputation for Brutality - AVOID Edmonton
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 14:02:35 -0700, "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)"
 wrote:

>NotMyName wrote:
>
>> The Edmonton Journal for yesterday 29 June 2006 had a full page of
>> letters to the editor complaining about the police brutality!!
>
>Isn't Edmonton in CANADA?  Police brutality is regrettable, 
>wherever it occurs, but is this example really relevant to 
>rec,travel.europe?

Of course it is.
After all, there are many people in Europe, who are considering travel
to Canada, and need to be warned, so that they are aware of the
criminals posing as cops in Edmonton Canada!!



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:24 EDT 2007
Article: 540114 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.general,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa,tx.general,alt.privacy.ano
Subject: Re: WARNING - ISP Netidentity No Longer USA based, but in Canada!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <7s75a21dgghbn9gj28rae96n0s6tkhn2p6@4ax.com> 
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A very good point.
Guess we must then find and use servers not connected with
Germany,Austria, or Canada or UK?
Care to suggest a good server that will not be coerced?


On 29 Jun 2006 13:49:17 -0000, TwistyCreek 
wrote:
>NotMyName  wrote:
>
>> So, time to switch from Netidentity and TUCOWS, to a good US server,
>> such as 1&1.com, or Netzero.
>
>Fun Fact:
>1&1 US is controlled by its german mother 1&1. If german courts extend
>their reach as US courts tend to do, you better don't host any Nazi stuff
>on 1&1 servers.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:24 EDT 2007
Article: 540115 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.general,ab.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general,wpg.general
Subject: Re: Sears Illegally Distributing Your Personal Data
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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References:  
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Jeff, dear fool, the story is completely true, and correct.

Whether  you work for Sears, or not, may all your personal ID be
obtained by an identity thief, so that you may understand the problem.


On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 21:04:37 GMT, "Jeff Stapleton"
 wrote:
>"Nemesis"  wrote in message 
>news:REM5A56038898.528287037@twistycreek.com...
>> It seems that Sears in Canada is illegally distributing personal data of 
>> its' customers.
>>
>> A charge has been filed with the Alberta Privacy Commissioner, proving 
>> that a major Sears store in Edmonton illegally provided personal confidential information of 
>> a customer, to someone who was most definitely NOT the customer. The Alberta government 
>> is prosecuting, to teach Sears that they are not above the law.
>>
>> This situation came to light when the victim received in the mail, from an 
>> anonymous source,  the actual store copy of the receipt involved.
>>
>> HIS personal info including 2 unlisted phone numbers were clearly printed 
>> on the invoice  receipt, together with ther actual customer's VISA card number.
>> Someone had even written on the bill, "wrong number", but the customer was 
>> still given all the details of the original Sears customer.
>>
>> In other words, one MUST NOT TRUST SEARS!


>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org

>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)


>yo spammer give it up already 




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:24 EDT 2007
Article: 540116 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Anyone care to comment? Crooked Edmonton School Board Wasted Millions!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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Typical bureaucratic SCAM!!
The big shots KNEW they were OVERPAYING the teachers, but chose to do
nothing!
The principals KNEW they were OVER BUDGET, but chose to do nothing!
The teachers knew the Board could not afford them, but di not give a
damn.

And what about all the overpaid TRUSTEES? 
Why are they not being prosecuted, for NEGLIGENCE?

What is more alarming, the AUDITORS KNEW THERE WERE SERIOUS FINANCIAL
IRREGULARITIES, AND CHOSE TO COVER THEM UP FOR THOSE YEARS, 
INSTEAD OF EXPOSING THE PEOPLE WHO PAID THEM!! 
Or is it really pay-off to keep quiet?
Does CA still stand for CROOKED ACCOUNTANT?

It seems no one directly involved is being held responsible - why?


On Wed, 21 Jun 2006 23:35:57 GMT, Sew 
wrote:

>CARRIE McFADZEAN
>Examiner Staff 

>Edmonton Catholic School (ECS) trustees are changing the way they
>operate.
>
>Opening up lines of communication, taking back some of the
>superintendent’s power and playing a role on the budget committee are
>part of sweeping changes in the board’s governance policy.
>
>“For some time, the board has felt the governance model we’ve been
>using hasn’t been working that well,” says board chairperson Debbie
>Cavaliere.
>
>The changes, which were made during a board retreat in late May,
>follow a tumultuous time in the district.
>
>Earlier this year, a $10 million deficit, caused by accounting errors
>and overspending, was discovered. It will take the district five years
>to pay it back. At the end of February, superintendent Dale Ripley’s
>contract was terminated.
>
>While a new superintendent hasn’t been hired yet, Cavaliere says the
>timing was right to change the board’s governance policies.
>
>“It’s a dramatic shift in thinking and it’s time for the change,” she
>says.
>
>The board has been using the Carver model of governance since 1997.
>
>Under this model, used by many school boards in Alberta, trustees set
>policy direction, which is implemented by the superintendent who
>reports directly to the board.
>
>All district staff report only to the superintendent and have no
>contact with trustees.
>
>“Under that model, the board delegated a lot of responsibility,” says
>Cavaliere. 
>
>“It kept only those responsibilities that cannot be delegated like
>school closures, budget allocations and teacher transfers. Everything
>else was delegated to the superintendent.”
>
>Trustees were making important decisions based on information provided
>by the superintendent.
>
>Wanting a broader perspective and information base, trustees signaled
>a need for change.
>
>The new made-in-Edmonton-Catholic model gives more power to the
>trustees.
>
>For example, a trustee will now sit on the budget committee.
>
>Trustees will determine what responsibilities and authority district
>staff have.
>
>The superintendent will still have many of the same responsibilities,
>but trustees will now be able to ask senior staff questions directly.
>
>“It doesn’t put the onus on the superintendent to gather and relay the
>information,” says Cavaliere. “It’s much more effective and more
>efficient.”
>
>The new governance documents are being drafted and will come to a
>public meeting in the fall for a trustee vote.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:25 EDT 2007
Article: 540125 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.taxes,can.general,can.politics,ab.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Canada Revenue Agency Meal Allowance Lawsuit Update
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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Alan, what is latest status of this matter?
Are snivel servants still ripping off taxpapyers, or will truckers now
be allowed same as crooked trough-feeders?


On 18 Mar 2005 12:16:44 -0800, alanbaggett1@canada.com (Alan Baggett)
wrote:

>Here's the latest from:

>http://pei.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/View?filename=pe-truck20050318

>Truckers fight for better meal deductions  
>Last Updated Mar 18 2005 11:24 AM AST
>CBC News 
>CHARLOTTETOWN – Some P.E.I. truckers have joined a class action
>lawsuit against the Canada Revenue Agency. They want to be able to
>claim more money for meals while they're on the road.

>Summerside's Chris Murphy spends two weeks at a time rolling across
>North America in his truck, paying for three meals a day in roadside
>restaurants.
>
>He said when government employees are traveling they are paid up to
>$75 a day as compensation for their meals and related expenses.
>
>However, truckers are allowed to claim a maximum of $23 a day as a
>business expense. Murphy believes the numbers should be the same.
>
>The court case was filed in British Columbia Supreme Court in 2002.
>
>Ernie Slump, the publisher of Trucker Magazine launched the suit.
>Since then, he has added the names of 3,000 truckers to the case.
>
>He believes the federal government is trying to delay the case.
>
>"We thought we might go to court in April or May, but we think now
>that the government may drag it out further until after the next
>election because this could very well become an election issue."
>
>Murphy said he just wants the same provisions as other people who have
>to leave home for work.
>
>The federal Department of Finance won't say if deductions for meals on
>the road might be raised.
>
>
>
>canadarevenueagency@hotmail.com (Alan Baggett) wrote in message news:<8b49ba6a.0503071010.32b5b558@posting.google.com>...
>> http://www.todaystrucking.com/displayarticle.cfm?ID=3824
>> 
>> Law firm files meal allowance suit 
>> 
>> SUMMERLAND, B.C. (Mar. 7, 2005) -- B.C. law firm Johnston, Johnson &
>> Co. has filed a class-action suit on behalf of 11 truck drivers
>> seeking to overturn the unfair meal allowance portion of the federal
>> tax policy.
>> The Summerland, B.C.-based lawyers are asking the Supreme Court of
>> British Columbia to strike down a section of the Income Tax Act
>> dealing with the deduction of their meals while they are on the road.
>> 
>> "Essentially, we looked at whether truckers, bus drivers, and other
>> workers that travel for a living could unite in one cause to get
>> parity with government workers," says Tom Johnston, lead counsel on
>> the case in a statement that appears on the firm's website.
>> "Government employees receive a meal allowance of $73.10 [an amount
>> that fluctuates on a quarterly basis according to the Consumer Price
>> Index] per day plus U.S. exchange (if they were traveling in the US),
>> without receipts."
>> 
>> In the Statement of Claim, it is asserted by the plaintiffs (the
>> truckers) that CCRA [formerly Revenue Canada] "through [its]
>> administrative policies, have ruled that some of the Plaintiffs and
>> some of the Class are not entitled to a meal allowance greater than
>> $16.50 before 2003, and, $22.50 after 2003, while other taxpayers
>> received more money for meals, including allowing some, the fair meal
>> allowance rate."
>> 
>> Further, the Plaintiffs claim that the decision to allow some
>> individuals to claim a greater amount than others is unfair and
>> discriminatory, and without adequate reason.
>> 
>> Johnston says he hopes for truckers to gain parity with federal civil
>> servants covered by the Treasury Board Secretariat Travel Directive.
>> "We're also seeking to strike down the 50 percent aspect of the rule,"
>> he says. "That applies to business meals, and in the case of our
>> clients, that's clearly not the case.
>> 
>> "In the civil servants' case, he or she is consuming meals for
>> sustenance, as are truck drivers. Allowing one group a more generous
>> allowance than others isn't fair. It's clearly a discriminatory
>> practice, and the Canadian Charter of Rights makes no room for
>> distinction between one class of citizens and another."
>> 
>> Drivers wishing to join the class action may still do so by contacting
>> Johnston & Johnson at their B.C. offices, or by visiting the website.
>> If the lawsuit is successful, only those registered and paid-up of the
>> class action may be able to claim retroactive meal allowances, the
>> firm says.
>> 
>> There is a $200 fee to join the class action. Those already in the
>> class action will need to pay an additional $100.00 to remain in the
>> lawsuit. For more information, see www.summerlandlawoffice.com or
>> call, 800-494-0442.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:25 EDT 2007
Article: 540126 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Another Crooked Edmonton Cops Expose!! - Repost
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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The Edmonton Journal, in a banner headline story on page B1 of today's
paper, exposes yet another swindle involving Edmonton's crooked cops!!

They exposed a so-called CHARITY SCAM, for a so-called "benefit" game
run under the style of "Oldtimers Hockey Challenge".

This scam collected more than $250,000 through fraudulent telephone
solicitors, claiming the money was going to a charity.

In fact, only $20,000 actually goes to a local women's shelter safe
house.

Almost all the money goes to a scam business called Xentel DM Inc, out
of Calgary, not even a local business. In the USA, XENTEL has been the
subject of investigations alleging deceptive telemarketing, as well as
for breaching do-not-call laws.

In Iowa, in November 2004, Xentel was forced to stop abusive and
misleading calls in fundraising and solicitations, and was forced to
pay $30,000 in penalties.

Since almost all the money goes to a for-profit business, rather than
to a registered charity, why isn't the provincial government charging
the crooks and their sponsors with FRAUD?

This scam was being promoted by the Edmonton Police Faded Blues 
Hockey team.

Just one more scandal for the new chief to clean up!


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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics,edm.general,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa,ab.general,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Guardian Angels In Edmonton, Canada - Hooray
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On 5 Jul 2006 04:42:08 -0700, tatpaul@gmail.com wrote:
>NotMyName wrote:
>> The Guardian Angels group, headed by their leader, arrived yesterday
>> in Edmonton, Canada.
>>
>> They had been invited by a local citizen, who had become disgusted
>> with the rising crime, compounded by all the scandals involving
>> crooked police.
>>
>> Even the previous police chief was fired for just cause.
>> Now, the new chief cop is annoyed that an outside source has been
>> called in to do some of his functions.
>>
>> The artsie-fartsie mayor is also annoyed, since it gives bad
>> international publicity to Deadmonton.
>
>I'm beginning to wonder why we need this biggest city budget item at
>all.  Private businesses, along with homeowners, have to rely on their
>own security measures and mostly insurance for recovery.Transit having
>to hire its own security force?  Come on. Be alot simplier to give all
>officers a bus pass for coming to and leaving work, counting time on
>the bus as part of a shift as they make sure there's courteous
>compliance by all passengers. I suspect flatfooters spend most of their
>time investigating traffic accidents, sometimes holding up traffic for
>hours.  Why should the property owner have to foot the bill for this,
>especially if out-of-towners are involved.  Let the insurance companies
>pay for accident investigation and they should be charged a thousand
>bucks for each hour traffic is held up.  There's a big RCMP detachment
>in the city; they can investigate the periodic murder, and often have
>been involved when a case involves areas outside the city. Buzzing
>around in the chopper at night is probably another waste of money  If
>city police had a prompt response program more thieves would be caught,
>fewer people hurt and murdered and police wouldn't need PR  departments
>to make excuses or publish throw-away newspapers. 
The Edmonton Police farce is wasting around $2 MILLION a year, wages
for 9 @ $95,000, plus benefits, computers, phones, rent, expenses,
support staff, etc.

>And a hate crimes
>unit, what a joke; if those subject to such "crimes" would clean up
>their act we'd end another money waster.  

For the 5 clowns under Sgt. Stevie Camp watching internet all day,
there goes another million wasted dollars, all costs included!

Bet you efficient Calgary Police doesn't waste the $3 MILLION that
Deadmonton is!! Apart from another million wasted on the
copper-chopper toy!!

>Tatarewicz



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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.new-zealand,uk.politics.misc,rec.travel.europe,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Re: Edmonton Canada Gestapo Getting Bad International Reputation for Brutality - AVOID Edmonton
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 14:02:35 -0700, "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)"
 wrote:

>NotMyName wrote:
>
>> The Edmonton Journal for yesterday 29 June 2006 had a full page of
>> letters to the editor complaining about the police brutality!!
>
>Isn't Edmonton in CANADA?  Police brutality is regrettable, 
>wherever it occurs, but is this example really relevant to 
>rec,travel.europe?

Of course it is.
After all, there are many people in Europe, who are considering travel
to Canada, and need to be warned, so that they are aware of the
criminals posing as cops in Edmonton Canada!!



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:26 EDT 2007
Article: 540268 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us can.general:352888 ab.general:110081 soc.culture.canada:540268 calgary.general:352108 wpg.general:246160 tor.general:324519
Path: sn-us!sn-feed-sjc-03!sn-xt-sjc-11!sn-xt-sjc-09!sn-xt-sjc-14!supernews.com!pd7cy1no!pd7cy2no!shaw.ca!pd7tw1no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail
X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.general,ab.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general,wpg.general,tor.general
Subject: Re: Sears Illegally Distributing Your Personal Data
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <9qqna2hdduqaas3kiflrkvd4levp0c7eb5@4ax.com>
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Jeff, dear fool, the story is completely true, and correct.

Whether  you work for Sears, or not, may all your personal ID be
obtained by an identity thief, so that you may understand the problem.


On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 21:04:37 GMT, "Jeff Stapleton"
 wrote:
>"Nemesis"  wrote in message 
>news:REM5A56038898.528287037@twistycreek.com...
>> It seems that Sears in Canada is illegally distributing personal data of 
>> its' customers.

>> A charge has been filed with the Alberta Privacy Commissioner, proving 
>> that a major Sears store in Edmonton illegally provided personal confidential 
>> information of  a customer, to someone who was most definitely NOT the customer. 
>> The Alberta government  is prosecuting, to teach Sears that they are not above the law.

>> This situation came to light when the victim received in the mail, from an 
>> anonymous source,  the actual store copy of the receipt involved.

>> HIS personal info including 2 unlisted phone numbers were clearly printed 
>> on the invoice  receipt, together with ther actual customer's VISA card number.
>> Someone had even written on the bill, "wrong number", but the customer was 
>> still given all the details of the original Sears customer.

>> In other words, one MUST NOT TRUST SEARS!


>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org

>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)


>yo spammer give it up already 




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:26 EDT 2007
Article: 540278 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.canada:540278 can.taxes:96949
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.taxes
Subject: Re: The poster using Frank Arthur is a fraud.
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <1102350836.102562.308210@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>  
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Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

Are you insane?
Since when can YOu patent or copyright a name?

For all we know, you are the poster of all the articles, since your
correct email address is indicated. And newsgroups do not show any
gray group.

On Wed, 5 Jul 2006 13:40:13 -0400, "Frank Arthur" 
wrote:

>The poster using Frank Arthur is a fraud.
>
>I am the legitimate Frank Arthur and I do not post to this newsgroup.
>The way to know if I am the legitimate Frank Arthur it will show on the gray 
>tab:
>
>Organization: BellSouth Internet Group
>
>All others are frauds!
>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:26 EDT 2007
Article: 540297 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.canada:540297 can.taxes:96952 soc.culture.usa:1883638
Path: sn-us!sn-feed-sjc-04!sn-xt-sjc-11!sn-xt-sjc-07!sn-xt-sjc-05!supernews.com!207.217.77.43.MISMATCH!elnk-pas-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!pd7cy1no!pd7cy2no!shaw.ca!pd7tw1no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail
X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.taxes,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Re: The poster using Frank Arthur is a fraud.
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2006 16:01:43 MDT
Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

On Wed, 5 Jul 2006 16:43:50 -0400, "Frank Arthur" 
wrote:

>I guess you are so proud of yourself as a human being that you proudly 
>present your name and your identifiable ISP so that your posts are unique in 
>all the world.
>Or are you some sniveling, cowardly worm who uses names like "NotMyName" or 
>some Anonymous remailer?


>"NotMyName"  wrote in message 
>news:tu0oa2l1ha7jls5ouummb6ckv7h2ugo3j8@4ax.com...
>> Are you insane?
>> Since when can YOU patent or copyright a name?

>> For all we know, you are the poster of all the articles, since your
>> correct email address is indicated. And newsgroups do not show any
>> gray group.

>> On Wed, 5 Jul 2006 13:40:13 -0400, "Frank Arthur" 
>> wrote:

>>>The poster using Frank Arthur is a fraud.

>>>I am the legitimate Frank Arthur and I do not post to this newsgroup.
>>>The way to know if I am the legitimate Frank Arthur it will show on the 
>>>gray tab:




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:26 EDT 2007
Article: 540417 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.canada:540417 soc.culture.china:784057 soc.culture.japan:404750 soc.culture.singapore:1315795 can.general:352979
Path: sn-us!sn-feed-sjc-04!sn-xt-sjc-12!sn-xt-sjc-08!sn-xt-sjc-14!supernews.com!pd7cy1no!pd7cy2no!shaw.ca!pd7tw2no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail
X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.china,soc.culture.japan,soc.culture.korea,soc.culture.singapore,can.general
Subject: Re: rogue elements in regina rcmp are behaving like nazi dictators
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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What is it that you have done to these rogue RCMP?
Have you photographed them brutalising some natives, again?
Did you get pictures of them soliciting young boys, or other
prostitutes?


On Thu, 6 Jul 2006 00:21:06 -0600, michael  wrote:

>what else do you call those who deliberately terrorize citizens with 
>aircraft and supersonic air force jets. They have a hi tech surveillance 
>device. They use it as an instrument of terror. With this device these 
>rogue elements in the regina rcmp have waged  a horrendous air campaign 
>against me and the residents of this south regina neighborhood. This is 
>state terrorism. I lived quietly in this city since 1983 until may of 
>2002 when all this started. The fact that I am writing this is a sign of 
>how badly they have mishandled this situation. These rednecks in the 
>regina rcmp have done everything possible to disturb me to antagonize me 
>to rob me of any peace to create the conditions for a disaster.
>
>
>This is what happens when small minded under educated rednecks get their 
>hands on sophisticated technology they abuse it. These rogue elements in 
>the regina rcmp think because they have this surveillance device that 
>they are masters of the universe. They are bullies with hi tech toys. 
>These rogue elements in the regina rcmp have exposed themselves for what 
>they are rednecks on power trips.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:27 EDT 2007
Article: 540449 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.canada:540449 can.taxes:96960 soc.culture.usa:1883976
Path: sn-us!sn-feed-sjc-04!sn-xt-sjc-12!sn-xt-sjc-01!sn-xt-sjc-14!supernews.com!green.octanews.net!news-out.octanews.net!news.glorb.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!pd7cy3no!pd7cy4no!shaw.ca!pd7tw3no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail
X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,can.taxes,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Re: The poster using Frank Arthur is a fraud.
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <1102350836.102562.308210@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>    
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NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2006 14:50:03 MDT
Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

You must be  insane?
Since when can YOU patent or copyright a name?

For all we know, you are the poster of all the articles, since your
correct email address is indicated. And newsgroups do not show 
any gray group.

On Wed, 5 Jul 2006 16:43:50 -0400, "Frank Arthur" 
wrote:

>I guess you are so proud of yourself as a human being that you proudly 
>present your name and your identifiable ISP so that your posts are unique in 
>all the world.
>Or are you some sniveling, cowardly worm who uses names like "NotMyName" or 
>some Anonymous remailer?

>> On Wed, 5 Jul 2006 13:40:13 -0400, "Frank Arthur" 
>> wrote:

>>>The poster using Frank Arthur is a fraud.

>>>I am the legitimate Frank Arthur and I do not post to this newsgroup.
>>>The way to know if I am the legitimate Frank Arthur it will show on the 
>>>gray tab:




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:27 EDT 2007
Article: 540554 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us edm.general:328568 edm.politics:12469 ab.general:110109 calgary.general:352121 can.general:353032 soc.culture.canada:540554
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,calgary.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: $Half MILLION UNDERASSESSED By City Tax Dept.Crooks!! Check YOUR Assessment This Month!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <1119921541.190198.158810@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> <1120083381.833747.102650@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>
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NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 10:30:07 MDT
Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

In May, the crooks in the city Tax Assessment Department will be
mailing out the fictitous assessments for taxation for this year.

If you feel that the assessment for your property is TOO HIGH, while
some neighbours are deliberately UNDER-ASSESSED, then file an appeal!!
If you are angry enough, let everyone know, and tell us on the
newsgroups.

Perhaps if there is enough publicity about these crooks, the city will
finally have to fire a few more, and hire some honest assessors!

All city home assessments are readily available on the internet, for
easy comparison.

Don't let yourself get JEWED by the crooks on the city payroll.
Expose them, as Grosvenor did about the lawyer's property, detailed
below.

The lawyer even had his property up for city tax sale, this year, for
unpaid taxes, April 27 2006!!

On 29 Jun 2005 15:16:21 -0700, "Brian Boulanger"
 wrote:

>One MUST wonder - was it bribery, graft, corruption or what, that this
>lawyer got a donation from the city tax department of a HALF MILLION
>DOLLARS each year deliberately UNDER-ASSESSED, while honest taxpayers
>got the shaft/got screwed!!

>Perhaps criminal charges should be considered against those city staff
>responsible, for the massive under-collection of proper tax revenues
>for 8 years? Particularly since it took a courageous taxpayer to force
>this scam into the courts and into the open!


>Newsgroups: edm.general, edm.politics, ab.general, calgary.general
>From: "Brian Boulanger"  - Find messages
>by this author
>Date: 27 Jun 2005 18:19:01 -0700
>Local: Mon,Jun 27 2005 8:19 pm
>Subject: $Half MILLION Underassessed By City Tax Dept.-Heads to Roll!!
>Reply | Reply to Author | Forward | Print | Individual Message | Show
>original | Remove | Report Abuse

>It seems that now that the City Auditor-General has his teeth into this
>notorious expose, more heads in the City Tax Assessment Department will
>be getting chopped, besides those staff already terminated.

>The notorious William Grosvenor took the city to tax court, and exposed
>the situation where a well-known lawyer's property was improperly
>UNDERASSESSED BY HALF A MILLION DOLLARS - at $149,500, when the
>lawyer's own documentation declared a value of $600,000!!

>Only now, after the courageous expose, is the property properly
>assessed at $651,000!!

>For 8 years the lawyer got off, while taxpayers who did pay their share
>had to make up the difference.

>Everyone involved in the cover-up, and scam, should not only be fired,
>but prosecuted for criminality as well!


>Newsgroups: edm.general, edm.politics
>From: Mike McWilliams  -
>Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 08:20:14 -0600
>Subject: APPEAL YOUR TAXES! Don't Get Jewed By Crooks In City Tax
>Dept.!

>If your city tax assessment has increased more than the 2.4% inflation
>certified by StatsCan, then perhaps you also are a victim of the crooks
>running Deadmonton?!!

>If you feel you are being overcharged, then do what you are entitled to
>do - FILE AN APPEAL!!

>The odds are in your favour, since more than 80% of appeals against the
>City,win!!

>Checking the website for this year's assessments, it seems that the
>city of Edmonton finally obeyed the ARB,regarding the dramatically
>UNDERASSESSED property owned by a city liar/lawyer!.
>The value now is $651,000, up from the ridiculous $149,500!!!

>If not CORRUPTION, then at least favouritism, when property
>UNDER-ASSESSED BY HALF MILLION DOLLARS!!

>Rumour has it that the city tax assessor responsible, is no longer
>employed by the city??
>Why should a private citizen have to take the City to Court, just to
>force the city to do a proper job, for which some slimeball is getting overpaid?


>From: heinrichhimmelf...@xmail.net (HeinrichHimmelfarb)
>Newsgroups:
>edm.general,edm.politics,ab.ge­­neral,ab.politics,can.general
>Subject: Re: Graft,Corruption Claimed in City Tax Appeal!! LAWYER TO
>GET TAXES QUADRUPLED!!
>Date: 2 Oct 2004 08:46:23 -0700

>It seems that even a lawyer will finally get his comeuppance.
>The ARB on Monday ordered the city tax assessment department to
>finally correct the improper assessment and bring the value up to what
>it should be.

>This means that in one year, the assessment had to jump from the
>massive under-assessment of $149,500 to at least $600,000 and probably
>$608,000!!!

>Even a damned lawyer can finally get what he deserves,when someone has
>the guts to force the issue into a court.

>How many other massive UNDER-ASSESSMENTS, FOR FRIENDS OF THE CITY
>MANAGERS ARE OUT THERE?

>heinrichhimmelf...@xmail.net (HeinrichHimmelfarb) wrote in message
>...

>> Regarding the article below,the City is now declining to appear before
>> the ARB, tomorrow at 3:30 in the afternoon!!
>> It seems that they do not want to name the city tax assessor
>> responsible for the more than $200,00 REDUCTION in the property tax
>> assessment of the city liar/lawyer!!

>> In their documents sent to the complainant, the City DOES CONFIRM THE
>> CORRECT VALUE AT MORE THAN $608,000!!
>> The tax appeal Court/ARB will be asked whether this constitutes
>> CORRUPTION, or/and CRIMINAL NEGLIGENCE!!!
>> Sharx, and others annoyed with city mismanagement, care to comment?

>> heinrichhimmelf...@xmail.net (HeinrichHimmelfarb) wrote in message ...
>> > City have in fact confirmed,and helped correct previous assessment
>> > value.
>> > It was actually $149,500, while the owners declared value,in writing,
>> > was $600,000!!

>> > No explanation from the cretins in the Tax Assessment section as to
>> > why they gave their buddy such a massive UNDER-ASSESSMENT!!
>> > This while they gouge small homeowners and apartment owners with
>> > massive tax hikes!!

>> > No wonder the number of appeals this year is allegedly double.
>> > Perhaps the citizens are finally getting mad enough for a tax revolt.
>> > > Apparently THIS scandal is but the tip of the iceberg, regarding
>> > > irregularities involving the city tax department.
>> > > Another case,coming up in court next week, relates to an out-of-court
>> > > settlement the city had to make un connection with the illegal closure
>> > > of the southbound access road for Calgary Trail at Ellerslie Road.
>> > > One of the property owners, incensed at his astronomical tax assessment hike
>> > > this year, is presenting to the tax appeal court, the evidence that
>> > > business plummeted, plus that the city had to pay one of the businesses!!
>> > > The right hand did not know what the left did.....

>> > > starwars  wrote in message ...
>> > > > Can someone explain how a well-known liar/lawyer is able to get a
>> > > > massive UNDER-ASSESSMENT on his palatial property,which is knowingly
>> > > > under-assessed by more than $200,000.00!!
>> > > > This property, which the lawyer and spouse have declared to be worth
>> > > > at least $600,000 (yes six hundred thousands because it is huge,has
>> > > > law offices on ground floor plus apartments on second floor was
>> > > > assessed last year for less than a quarter of value,for only
>> > > > $148,000!!
>> > > > After the city tax department documented in city tax appeal Court last
>> > > > year, evidence of the real value of $600,000. now this year it is
>> > > > assessed for $393,500 - still more than $200,000 UNDER-ASSESSED!!
>> > > > At the same time, neighbours are being OVER-ASSESSED by 20%!!
>> > > > Naturally, cynics wonder, who is on the take in the City?



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:28 EDT 2007
Article: 540555 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us alt.conspiracy:1161789 alt.revisionism:1129120 can.general:353033 soc.culture.canada:540555 soc.culture.usa:1884177 tx.general:56244
Path: sn-us!sn-feed-sjc-03!sn-xt-sjc-11!sn-xt-sjc-09!sn-xt-sjc-13!supernews.com!newshub.sdsu.edu!elnk-nf2-pas!elnk-pas-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!pd7cy1no!pd7cy2no!shaw.ca!pd7tw1no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail
X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.revisionism,can.general,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa,tx.general
Subject: Re: Evidence for RICO re McVay/Nizkor & Harry Mazal
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References:  <1134066915.228014.96670@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> <11ph5k5dfmb6led@corp.supernews.com> <1642514.PtBnYVMG7h@Xn1> <11ph7h9mknc6k94@corp.supernews.com> 
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X-Trace: pd7tw1no 1152289986 64.59.135.176 (Fri, 07 Jul 2006 10:33:06 MDT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 10:33:06 MDT
Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

On 8 Dec 2005 23:03:36 GMT, Wally Cleaver 
wrote:

>On Thu, 08 Dec 2005 20:57:13 -0000, <11ph7h9mknc6k94@corp.supernews.com>
>kmcvay@shell.vex.net (Kenneth McVay OBC) wrote:
>>In article <1642514.PtBnYVMG7h@Xn1>, 127.0.0.1 <127.0.0.1@127.0.0.1> wrote:
>>>Kenneth McVay OBC wrote:
>>>> In article <1134066915.228014.96670@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
>>>> Schorsch  wrote:
>>>>>Kenny McVay wrote:

>>>> [routine grosvomit]

>>>About the famous "gas chamber" in the Auschwitz I camp, Conan writes: 
>>
>>http://www.nizkor.org/faqs/auschwitz/auschwitz-faq-04.html
>>
>>As to Dr. Piper's response to David Cole, see his letter to the Daily Texan:
>>
>>Archive/File: people/p/piper.franciszek/press/daily.texan.1093
>>Last-Modified: 1994/11/12
>>
>>
>>                                                     ogwiqcim, October21,1993
>>                Dr Franciszek Piper
>>                Pa'nstwowe Muzeum
>>                32-603 Ogwiecim -Poland

>The above could be a forgery seeing how it is at your website which I have
>proven deals in forgeries!

>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.nationalism.white/msg/56a1a43fe4f9d61d?fwc=1
>Subject: The Nizkor Project Deals in Forged Documents and Smear Financed With
>Exempt Donations V3-2  T_0929
>Message-ID: 
>Date: 29 Sep 2005 15:34:29 GMT
>
>								Tavish
>
>     ~~Ken McVay Lying About His Financing Via S.A.A.F. Nizkor Fund~~
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.revisionism/msg/19272a44fd2c3cec?fwc=1
>From: kmcvay@veritas.nizkor.org (Kenneth McVay, OBC)
>Subject: STILL Waiting for Donnie..... (Or "Bradbury: Wrong Again")
>Date: 5 Jan 2001 00:32:08 GMT
>Organization: The Nizkor Project
>Message-ID: <9334m8$1nm1$1@news.tht.net>
>(Archived locally as: McVayEXHIBIT1)
>Mr. Bradbury, wishing to demonstrate how ill-equipped he is to deal with
>evidence of any sort... What Mr. Bradbury has failed to demonstrate is that The
>Nizkor Project, which I direct, has any association whatsoever with the "San
>Antonio Area Foundation - Nizkor Fund." That is because Mr. Bradbury is not very
>bright... Neither The Nizkor Project nor Ken McVay has ever received any money
>from the "San Antonio Area Foundation - Nizkor Fund" 
>
>
>As for Ken McVay's bold faced lie: "What Mr. Bradbury has failed to demonstrate
>is that The Nizkor Project, which I direct, has any association whatsoever with
>the San Antonio Area Foundation - Nizkor Fund." BUT I have "demonstrated" the
>association between the Nizkor Project and the San Antonio Area Foundation -
>Nizkor Fund and all with Ken McVay's very own words below!
>
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.revisionism/msg/7ed1cee6db046212
>(Archived locally as: SAAF_3)
>From: kmcvay@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC)
>Subject: American funding for the Nizkor Project
>Date: 1996/06/15
>Message-ID: <4pvl6g$ctm@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>
>organization: The Nizkor Project
>
>In the United States, checks in support of the work of The
>Nizkor Project should be made payable to:
>   SAN ANTONIO AREA FOUNDATION - Nizkor Fund
>and should be mailed to:
>	San Antonio Area Foundation
>	Nizkor Fund
>	P.O. Box 120366
>	San Antonio, TX 78212-9566
>
>
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.revisionism/msg/e6e8f845002483a1
>(Archived locally as: SAAF_1)
>From: kmcvay@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC)
>Subject: The Nizkor Project appreciates your support
>Date: 1996/09/05
>Message-ID: <50n608$9ds@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>
>x-network: http://www.nizkor.org/
>organization: The Nizkor Project
>
>..In the United States, checks should be made payable to:
>	"SAN ANTONIO AREA FOUNDATION - Nizkor Fund"
>and should be mailed to:
>	San Antonio Area Foundation
>	Nizkor Fund
>	P.O. Box 120366
>	San Antonio, TX 78212-9566
>We thank all of you who have sent your donations in support of the Nizkor
>Project. The funds you have provided have been used to provide substantial 
>improvements in service.
>
>
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.revisionism/msg/72d376fef3c983cf?fwc=1
>From: kmcvay@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC)
>Subject: Nizkor Project financing and Kleinsorg's slandering Germans
>Date: 1996/06/15
>Message-ID: <4pvbkg$auc@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>
>
>In article <31c2fa3a.16855786@news.annap.infi.net>, 
>hk@annap.infi.net (Horst Kleinsorg) wrote:
>
>>First tell us who is financing your Nizkor, then we perahps can
>>talk.
>
>Thank you for bringing that up, Mr. Kleinsorg. I am financed
>by thousands of "just plain folks" who wish to support my
>work... In the United States, they make their cheques payable to:
>	SAN ANTONIO AREA FOUNDATION - Nizkor Fund
>and mail them to:
>	San Antonio Area Foundation
>	Nizkor Fund
>	P.O. Box 120366
>	San Antonio, TX 78212-9566
>...By the way, Mr. Kleinsorg... now that I have responded openly
>and honestly to your question, perhaps you can tell us what
>difference it makes who finances my work... I fail to see
>how my financing changes that.
>
>
>"[W]hen you're living a lie, the lie has to get more complicated-they're always
>contradicting themselves...so that the lie itself becomes self-evident."
>-- Ken McVay, director of the Nizkor Project
>http://www.peacemagazine.org/fulltext/all-vol13no2.html
>(Link active November 20, 2003. Archived locally as: peacenik13_2)



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:28 EDT 2007
Article: 540688 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: calgary.general,edm.politics,edm.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Why appeal Property Assessment? Beause City Tax Assessors Are Either Corrupt, or Crooks!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <0a22b2to29l0nc7hqogqe8d7f42dmn74fv@4ax.com>
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Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

It seems that SOME of the crooks in city assessment got fired because
of the expose.
Unfortunately, those remaining are just as bad as those who got fired,
and also deserve to be prosecuted, then fired.

If you know of an HONEST city tax assessor, why not let all know
his/her name?


On Sun, 09 Jul 2006 02:41:26 GMT, "Jerry"
 wrote:

>Gotta love how people like you know nothing about whats goes on in City 
>Hall, and basically reams people who probably even agree with you in the 
>Assessment department. Those people who actually plans it won't even hear 
>your complaints.. its kinda like Tech Support for computers..
>
>Doc, I hope you will work in support of some capacity dealing with the 
>public and maybe you will understand.
>
>"Doc Holoiday"  wrote in message 
>news:3Q5OXU7N38906.5976736111@twistycreek.com...
>> Friday, 30th June is the deadline for filing an Appeal regarding 
>> fraudulently high Tax Assessments.
>>
>> For a $30 filing fee, one gets the opportunity to say nasty, but true, 
>> things about the crooks in the city tax assessment department.
>>
>> Plus, with a little work, one has a good chance to get the assessment, and 
>> city taxes,  lowered, plus a refund of the $30 fee!
>>
>>
>> On Fri, 26 May 2006 15:02:43 GMT, Asterix  
>> wrote:
>>>On Fri, 26 May 2006 07:56:39 GMT, "sharx35" 
>>>wrote:
>>
>>>>Well, SOME day, if you save up all your welfare payments, you, too, may
>>>>become a home owner and concerned about property taxes.
>>
>>>Well said, sharx.
>>
>> If it wasn't for Grosvenor exposing the HALF MILLION A YEAR
>> DELIBERATE UNDER-ASSESSMENT ON THE PROPERTY AT 13723 - 93 ST.,
>> which was deliberately under-assessed for 8 years, the public
>> would not have had the PROOF as to how crooked the city tax assessors 
>> are!!
>>
>>
>>>>> Socrates taught his students that the pursuit of truth can only begin  once
>>>>> they start to question and analyze every belief that they ever held  dear.
>>>>> If a certain belief passes the tests of evidence, deduction, and logic,  it
>>>>> should be kept. If it doesn't, the belief should not only be discarded, but
>>>>> the thinker must also then question why he was led to believe the erroneous
>>
>>>>> "sharx35"  wrote in message
>>>>> news:Feydg.35358$Qq.27711@clgrps12...
>>>>>> "John Fleming"  wrote in message
>>>>>> news:vcga7297ahfl0kb5o229s1lqq7gafok2v5@4ax.com...
>>>>>> > On Wed, 24 May 2006 20:58:07 GMT, while chained to a desk in the
>>>>>> > scriptorium, Lance Boyle  wrote:
>>>>>> >> $SamIAm wrote:
>>
>>>>>> >> $> There are many good reasons to appeal your property assessment.
>>>>> Here are some reasons:
>>
>>>>>> >> $> Tell them about the busy streets or the noisy development or
>>>>>> >> $> a problem with your roof or plumbing.
>>
>>>>>> >> $> 2)  Your property is below average for your community.
>>
>>>>>> >> $> So if most of the properties in your neighbourhood have
>>>>>> >> $> upgraded flooring, cabinets, plumbing, etc. and yours isn't then  you are
>>>>>> >> $> probably over assessed.
>>
>>>>>> >> $> 3)  You live in a neighbourhood where many of your neighbours  have built
>>>>>> >> $> garages or have completed basement development or have done  renovations
>>>>>> >> $> and you haven't.
>>
>>>>>> >> $In other words, you live in an overvalued shithole.
>>>>>> > LOL
>>
>>>>>> > Of course, his best option might be to just sell the house and buy
>>>>>> > something nicer in another neighbourhood.  (I was going to say, he  could
>>>>>> > do a kitchen upgrade, but if odne legally with all the necessary
>>>>>> > building permits, the city might just increase the assessed market
>>>>>> > value and bump up the taxes.)
>>
>>>>>> > John Fleming
>>>>>> > Edmonton, Canada
>>
>>>>>> Doing upgrades WITHOUT permits eventually pisses off the neighbours 
>>>>>> enough that at least ONE of them will file a complaint. I know, I've filed 
>>>>>> such complaints. Why should *I* pay more property taxes than some scofflaw 
>>>>>> who refuses to get the permits?



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:29 EDT 2007
Article: 540701 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.china,soc.culture.japan,soc.culture.korea,soc.culture.singapore,can.general
Subject: Re: rogue elements in regina rcmp are behaving like nazi dictators
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <6592b219hcq68fr9c7llsu9rr8mgvnvjed@4ax.com>
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What is it that you have done to these rogue RCMP?
Have you photographed them brutalising some natives, again?
Did you get pictures of them soliciting young boys, or other
prostitutes?


On Thu, 6 Jul 2006 00:21:06 -0600, michael  wrote:

>what else do you call those who deliberately terrorize citizens with 
>aircraft and supersonic air force jets. They have a hi tech surveillance 
>device. They use it as an instrument of terror. With this device these 
>rogue elements in the regina rcmp have waged  a horrendous air campaign 
>against me and the residents of this south regina neighborhood. This is 
>state terrorism. I lived quietly in this city since 1983 until may of 
>2002 when all this started. The fact that I am writing this is a sign of 
>how badly they have mishandled this situation. These rednecks in the 
>regina rcmp have done everything possible to disturb me to antagonize me 
>to rob me of any peace to create the conditions for a disaster.
>
>
>This is what happens when small minded under educated rednecks get their 
>hands on sophisticated technology they abuse it. These rogue elements in 
>the regina rcmp think because they have this surveillance device that 
>they are masters of the universe. They are bullies with hi tech toys. 
>These rogue elements in the regina rcmp have exposed themselves for what 
>they are rednecks on power trips.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:29 EDT 2007
Article: 540835 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: calgary.general,edm.politics,edm.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Why appeal Property Assessment? Beause City Tax Assessors Are Either Corrupt, or Crooks!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <3Q5OXU7N38906.5976736111@twistycreek.com> 
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Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

It seems that SOME of the crooks in city assessment got fired because
of the expose.
Unfortunately, those remaining are just as bad as those who got fired,
and also deserve to be prosecuted, then fired.

If you know of an HONEST city tax assessor, why not let all know
his/her name?


On Sun, 09 Jul 2006 02:41:26 GMT, "Jerry"
 wrote:

>Gotta love how people like you know nothing about whats goes on in City 
>Hall, and basically reams people who probably even agree with you in the 
>Assessment department. Those people who actually plans it won't even hear 
>your complaints.. its kinda like Tech Support for computers..
>
>Doc, I hope you will work in support of some capacity dealing with the 
>public and maybe you will understand.
>
>"Doc Holoiday"  wrote in message 
>news:3Q5OXU7N38906.5976736111@twistycreek.com...
>> Friday, 30th June is the deadline for filing an Appeal regarding 
>> fraudulently high Tax Assessments.
>>
>> For a $30 filing fee, one gets the opportunity to say nasty, but true, 
>> things about the crooks in the city tax assessment department.
>>
>> Plus, with a little work, one has a good chance to get the assessment, and 
>> city taxes,  lowered, plus a refund of the $30 fee!
>>
>>
>> On Fri, 26 May 2006 15:02:43 GMT, Asterix  
>> wrote:
>>>On Fri, 26 May 2006 07:56:39 GMT, "sharx35" 
>>>wrote:
>>
>>>>Well, SOME day, if you save up all your welfare payments, you, too, may
>>>>become a home owner and concerned about property taxes.
>>
>>>Well said, sharx.
>>
>> If it wasn't for Grosvenor exposing the HALF MILLION A YEAR
>> DELIBERATE UNDER-ASSESSMENT ON THE PROPERTY AT 13723 - 93 ST.,
>> which was deliberately under-assessed for 8 years, the public
>> would not have had the PROOF as to how crooked the city tax assessors 
>> are!!
>>
>>
>>>>> Socrates taught his students that the pursuit of truth can only begin  once
>>>>> they start to question and analyze every belief that they ever held  dear.
>>>>> If a certain belief passes the tests of evidence, deduction, and logic,  it
>>>>> should be kept. If it doesn't, the belief should not only be discarded, but
>>>>> the thinker must also then question why he was led to believe the erroneous
>>
>>>>> "sharx35"  wrote in message
>>>>> news:Feydg.35358$Qq.27711@clgrps12...
>>>>>> "John Fleming"  wrote in message
>>>>>> news:vcga7297ahfl0kb5o229s1lqq7gafok2v5@4ax.com...
>>>>>> > On Wed, 24 May 2006 20:58:07 GMT, while chained to a desk in the
>>>>>> > scriptorium, Lance Boyle  wrote:
>>>>>> >> $SamIAm wrote:
>>
>>>>>> >> $> There are many good reasons to appeal your property assessment.
>>>>> Here are some reasons:
>>
>>>>>> >> $> Tell them about the busy streets or the noisy development or
>>>>>> >> $> a problem with your roof or plumbing.
>>
>>>>>> >> $> 2)  Your property is below average for your community.
>>
>>>>>> >> $> So if most of the properties in your neighbourhood have
>>>>>> >> $> upgraded flooring, cabinets, plumbing, etc. and yours isn't then  you are
>>>>>> >> $> probably over assessed.
>>
>>>>>> >> $> 3)  You live in a neighbourhood where many of your neighbours  have built
>>>>>> >> $> garages or have completed basement development or have done  renovations
>>>>>> >> $> and you haven't.
>>
>>>>>> >> $In other words, you live in an overvalued shithole.
>>>>>> > LOL
>>
>>>>>> > Of course, his best option might be to just sell the house and buy
>>>>>> > something nicer in another neighbourhood.  (I was going to say, he  could
>>>>>> > do a kitchen upgrade, but if odne legally with all the necessary
>>>>>> > building permits, the city might just increase the assessed market
>>>>>> > value and bump up the taxes.)
>>
>>>>>> > John Fleming
>>>>>> > Edmonton, Canada
>>
>>>>>> Doing upgrades WITHOUT permits eventually pisses off the neighbours 
>>>>>> enough that at least ONE of them will file a complaint. I know, I've filed 
>>>>>> such complaints. Why should *I* pay more property taxes than some scofflaw 
>>>>>> who refuses to get the permits?



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:29 EDT 2007
Article: 541019 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,calgary.general,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: New Rink For The Oilers - NO!! OILERS PAY MILLIONS TO PRONGER,ROLOSON, So Don't Need Taxpayer Money!!  TAXES TOO HIGH ALREADY!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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If those replying want to financially support the overpaid
millionaires, then let them.

But NO TAXPAYER MONEY for these overpriced thugs!!

On Sun, 02 Jul 2006 17:23:27 GMT, NotMyName
 wrote:

>If the stupid Oilers can pay Pronger $6 MILLION, and he still wants to
>leave Deadmonton, then let the Oilers pay themselves for a new rink,
>not taxpayers!!
>
>If the Oilers can pay Roloson $11 MILLION, then they can afford to pay
>for their own rink!!
>
>After all, the Oilers is a BUSINESS, so let them survive, if at all,
>by satisfying their actual customers.
>
>If they don't, then let them go under, just like Woodwards, Eatons,
>Debajis, and other businesses. With what they pay their thugs,
>players, they are most definitely NOT A CHARITY, or even a city
>service!!


>On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 16:11:40 -0600, Harry Mazal 
>wrote:
>
>>With the taxpayers already being JEWED OUT OF $2.5 MILLION A YEAR TO SUBSIDIZE
>>FOR THE NEXT 9 YEARS THESE OVERPAID HOCKEY THUGS, WHY SHOULD WE 
>>GIVE THEM ONE BLOODY NICKEL MORE!!
>
>>LET THEM GET THE MONEY NEEDED FROM THEIR SUCCKERS/SUPPORTERS, not taxpayers!
>
>>On Mon, 3 Oct 2005 10:47:48 -0600, "TopPoster"  wrote:
>
>>>> news:fle0k1l6hc3dsgh7lgkvilhdqf2st41637@4ax.com...
>
>>>> > Saw the headline on the front page of today's Edmonton Journal.
>
>>>> > Possibility that, ten years from now, the Oilers could be moving into a
>>>> > new arena.
>
>>>> > While they have nine years left to run in their lease on Rexall Place,
>>>> > they could be looking for a bit of choice real estate to build a bigger
>>>> > arena with seating for more Edmonton fans.  (I'm working on the
>>>> > assumption here that the Edmonton Investors Group plans to keep the team
>>>> > in Edmonton indefinietly.)
>
>>>> > Assuming no unexpected downturn in the Alberta economy, it is reasonable
>>>> > to expect that by that time Edmonton will be a much larger city than it
>>>> > is today.
>
>>>> > So where to put a new arena.  (I'm guessing sharx would prefer
>>>> > Duggan--because then he'd be guaranteed a new LRT station close to sharx
>>>> > manor.)
>
>>>> Well, I have no objection to a new hockey arena AS LONG AS not one FUCKING
>>>> cent of public funds goes into building it or maintaining it. The fucking
>>>> owners group gets all the profit and the fucking owners group will get all
>>>> the profit from the EVENTUAL sale of the team. Under the current
>>>contracts,
>>>> the owners group has no legal obligation to pay back one FUCKING cent of
>>>> that TWO MILLION a year the city has been paying Northlands SO THAT THE
>>>> FUCKING SPOILERS can use Rexall Place. Do I make myself abundantly FUCKING
>>>> clear?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> > --
>>>> > John Fleming
>>>> > Edmonton, Canada
>>
>>_________________________________________
>>Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>>More than 140,000 groups
>>Unlimited download
>>http://www.usenetzone.com to open account



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:30 EDT 2007
Article: 541029 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.singapore:1317036 soc.culture.indonesia:410260 soc.culture.australian:394076 alt.activism.death-penalty:413375 soc.culture.canada:541029 soc.culture.europe:556276
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.singapore,soc.culture.indonesia,soc.culture.australian,alt.activism.death-penalty,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.europe
Subject: Re: 2 more Aussie Drug Traffickers to be Hanged - GOOD!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <8lcab2lr3tgulb2lmtuft4spvmcouf0q1n@4ax.com>
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At least the government of Indonesia know what to do with garbage
people, such as drug dealers.

They know, as do other sensible governments in the area, that an
executed criminal will never re-offend!!

Further, an executed waste of skin, will not cost the taxpayers for
the upkeep in some pampering prison system!!

If only the justice systems in North America would follow suit!!!


On 17 Feb 2006 18:43:24 -0800, "LifeManTalking" 
wrote:

>AUSTRALIA - Few Australians have much sympathy for Andrew Chan and
>Myuran Sukumaran, the two drug traffickers sentenced to death in Bali
>this week for their failed bid to smuggle more than 8kg of heroin on to
>the streets of Sydney.

>The lives of too many of their young people have been destroyed by
>drugs and, as innumerable letters to newspapers and callers to talkback
>radio have pointed out, Chan and Sukumaran could never have been in any
>doubt of the risk they took in running narcotics through Indonesia.

>But the prospect of the pair being taken from Kerobokan jail, tied to a
>tree in some lonely clearing, and shot by a paramilitary firing squad
>raises deep and disturbing moral, political and diplomatic dilemmas for
>a nation that last executed a criminal almost 40 years ago and now
>opposes the death penalty worldwide.

>Their own police provided the information that inevitably led to
>Tuesday's sentence. Their Government welcomed the death penalty given
>to the Bali bombers but opposes the same fate for Australian drug
>traffickers, and public opinion is repulsed by the prospect of
>executions at home but inconsistently accepts them abroad.

>It is a diplomatic minefield that Canberra traversed when
>Vietnamese-born Melburnian Van Tuong Nguyen was hanged in Singapore in
>December for taking heroin through Changi airport, despite Australian
>appeals for clemency.

>It is also a minefield that the nation will confront time and again:
>despite repeated warnings and the appalling reality of executions,
>there will always be people foolish enough to strap drugs to their
>bodies or conceal it in their luggage.

>Almost all will pass through Southeast Asia, the source of most of
>Australia's heroin (the Bali Nine consignment originated in Thailand)
>and where every country but Cambodia compulsorily hangs, shoots or
>lethally injects traffickers.

>Mike Phelan, the head of international operations for the Australian
>Federal Police and the man responsible for giving Indonesia the
>information it needed to arrest the Bali Nine, sees no end to the queue
>of couriers the trade calls "mules".

>"It continues to astound me that people attempt importations and move
>drugs through transit countries knowing that the death penalty exists,"
>he told ABC's Australian Story. "Many young lives get thrown away for
>the law of quick dollars."

>The AFP's role in the arrest of the Bali Nine is among the most
>sensitive of the issues facing Prime Minister John Howard, who has
>already weathered a barrage of criticism that has extended even into
>his own party room.

>The AFP caught the first whispers of a major heroin importing run in
>February last year and, in April, asked the Indonesian police to help
>uncover the members of the syndicate and the source of their supplies.

>Between them, the two forces discovered most of the names and built a
>remarkably accurate picture of their operation, including details of a
>previous successful run and another aborted attempt.

>This co-operation has become increasingly commonplace, spurred by the
>determination of all countries in the region to attack drug trafficking
>and terrorism. Intelligence swapping is required under a number of
>treaties.

>"We make no secret of the fact that the AFP has a policy of forward
>engagement where we want to stop the crimes at the source and (prevent
>them) from reaching Australian shores," Phelan said. "That's a practice
>we will continue to operate within."

>What worries many Australians is the fact that the AFP in effect turned
>over a group of young Australians to a country it knew was likely to
>execute them, rather than arresting them when they arrived home.

>The most emotional response centred on Scott Rush, 20, a drug mule who
>was jailed for life. His family, through lawyer Bob Myers, vainly asked
>the AFP to warn Rush of their interest before he left Australia.

>"No Australian public servant has the right to expose any Australian
>citizen to the death penalty," Myers told Australian Story.

>Rush and fellow mules Renae Lawrence, Martin Stephens and Michael
>Czugaj took the AFP to the Federal Court, claiming it had acted
>illegally by exposing them to the death penalty.

>While a large part of public opinion agreed, the court dismissed the
>action.

>The Government has also sidestepped criticism, pointing out that while
>the relevant treaty with Indonesia contains a clause allowing the
>Attorney-General to refuse to provide evidence if an Australian was
>charged with an offence carrying the death penalty, the AFP was free to
>do as it thought best until charges were laid.

>By the time the Bali Nine were formally charged, all the damaging
>evidence had been gathered.

>Phelan is unrepentant: "Basically all transit countries through which
>drugs come to Australia have the death penalty. The AFP cannot pick and
>choose who it chooses to cooperate with."

>International teamwork in the past few years has significantly reduced
>the flow of drugs into Australia. The most recent Australian Crime
>Commission figures, for 2003-04, show the lowest seizures of heroin for
>a decade.

>Refusal to co-operate abroad would outrage regional governments and
>threaten mutual action against other drug syndicates and terrorism.

>Public opinion in Southeast Asia also strongly favours the death
>penalty for traffickers, with polls in Singapore and Thailand showing
>support of up to 80 per cent.

>In Australia, opinion is more confused. A Morgan poll in November found
>that while only 27 per cent of Australians favoured the death penalty
>for murder, 57 per cent believed drug traffickers caught in Asia should
>die.

>Yet in the specific case of Van Nguyen, opinion was evenly divided.

>In The Australian, a newspoll found that more than 50 per cent of
>Australians favoured the death sentence for people convicted of major
>acts of terrorism.

>Howard now has to weigh all these conflicting factors in framing
>Canberra's approach to the executions of Chan and Sukumaran. He has
>said publicly he has no sympathy for the two men but will vigorously
>pursue Australia's long-standing opposition to the death penalty.

>How that is carried out will test Australian diplomacy.

>Apart from the risks to a fragile relationship, observers have pointed
>out that any blunt approach will almost certainly stiffen backs in
>Jakarta and end any chance of clemency.

>Hopes of saving Chan and Sukumaran now rest with Indonesia's
>inconsistent record in carrying out executions, the fact that in recent
>times only three of the more than 85 prisoners on death row have been
>shot, and the lengthy legal road still to be travelled.

>It may be years before their case moves through the Denpasar provincial
>High Court and the two reviews possible through the Supreme Court in
>Jakarta.

>And though President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono has said he will never
>grant clemency to drug traffickers, time and quiet diplomacy may change
>his mind.

>Death penalty Australia's double dilemma 
>
>18.02.06
>By Greg Ansley



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:30 EDT 2007
Article: 541255 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.europe,rec.travel.usa-canada,can.general,soc.culture.canada,ab.general,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton Canada Gestapo  Bad International Reputation - AVOID Edmonton - MORE!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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Regrettably, all the news reports are correct and TRUE.

Police brutality in Edmonton is so rampant, the Edmonton Journal
newspaper, as well as the TV stations hardly have a day pass, without
yet another expose of more police brutality!!

The media need not fabricate the stories, since the Courts carry the
charges!!

Your comments seem to be along the line of "shoot the messenger of bad
news!"

By the way, reference to Calgary merely confirms the truth, that
Calgary does not have the same problem with crooked cops!
In other words a great place to visit, unlike the cesspool of
Edmonton.


On Sat, 15 Jul 2006 05:01:38 GMT, "Alohacyberian"
 wrote:
>"Alan Pollock"  wrote in message 
>news:e99ivp$mvk$1@reader2.panix.com...
>> In rec.travel.usa-canada Alohacyberian  wrote:
>>
>>> The comments are so strident that I take them with a grain of salt.  If 
>>> they  were toned down serious people might take them more seriously.  KM
>>
>> It's easy to take some factual basis remote or not, fondle, spin and 
>> expand  into impressions designed to make the vulnerable believe a truth that just
>> doesn't exist.
>>
>> An example - albeit a touch more subtle but not by much - is Michael 
>> Moore's  "documentary" in effect a mockumentary called Farenheit 9-11.
>>
>> I must honestly add that I haven't researched Edmonton because quite 
>> frankly I  could care less. However the hate-posts here have had the opposite of 
>> their  intended effect on me.
>>
>> Edmonton's quite possibly a very good place to visit.
>>
>> Anybody who uses techniques like that of the posters is unworthy of my
>> respect, so in my book Edmonton's still a virgin, at the very least.
>>
>> The haters keep putting ketchup on the eggs of their own undoing. Nex
>>
>I have a friend who lives in Ontario and travels to Calgary, Alberta once a 
>year.  I asked him if he ever goes to Edmonton and he said that he'd been 
>there a few times and hadn't heard anything bad about it.  He was unaware of 
>the flap we've read here.  I, too will probably never go to Edmonton, 
>especially as long as Banff and Lake Louise are alternatives.  So yes, your 
>comparison of the shrill conjectures about Edmonton in this forum to Michael 
>Moore's schlockumentaries do seem apropos.  KM



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:31 EDT 2007
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.taxes,can.general,can.legal,soc.culture.canada,tor.general
Subject: Re: Alan Baggett to be discredited by the Canada Revenue Agency
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <70ksb2h092gj19egp2fure2c93hrckj27l@4ax.com>
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Do you have the address and phone for the disgusting pewrvert BOB
ALLISAT, so that people can visit this piece of feces?



On 19 Jul 2006 07:56:59 -0700, "Distant Early Warning"
 wrote:

>I never knew Alan but I saw him when he worked and I know more about
>what went on here with him then even he knows.
>
>I know all about Dino daguano and How Carl Balestri screwed up in
>Mississauga and I really wonder why he does not sue them all. And
>Laurie Wallass - she is huge assed and Michael Reganbogen and the whole
>thing.  even Jen steele too. I think I just about know it all.
>
>
>
>NotMyName wrote:
>> I would guess that some of the crooks in CRA have not been too happy
>> with the delightful exposes of their crimes by Alan Baggett.
>>
>> Alan, keep up the great work, and do not worry.
>> In fact, perhaps you should start naming some of the senior officials
>> engaged in criminality as well as juniors?
>>
>>
>> On 14 Jul 2006 09:45:10 -0700, "Distant Early Warning"
>>  wrote:
>>
>> >True. Just heard about it through the grapevione today. Apparently he's
>> >gonna be set up with something or framed somehow to stop him from
>> >selling his book and tattling on tax employees. Its about six or eight
>> >months away I was told but say your sayonaras now before it is too
>> >late. Adios Amigo and thanks for coming out.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:31 EDT 2007
Article: 541859 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.forsale,ab.forsale,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: WTB: Canadian Tax Collectors Bible - INFO
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: 
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It is readily available for $25 from Alan Baggett

The TCB is $25 Canadian. Supply a stamped and padded self addressed
envelope (large enough for a CD in a jewel case) and the Tax
Collector's Bible is only $20. And it's the best tax investment you
will ever make. Even lawyers and accountants don't have this
previously unpublished information. Payment by cash, cheque, money
order and credit card (via Paypal).

Orders to:

Alan Baggett,

1165 Carol St.,

Burlington, Ontario,

L7S 2A2

For further information, questions or comments query
taxbible@excite.com

 


On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 04:08:21 GMT, "petsormeat" 
wrote:

>After months of reading troll posts about this book, I would like to have a 
>copy.
>Does anyone have one for sale or know where I can purchase it. 
>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:31 EDT 2007
Article: 542027 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: ab.general,edm.general,calgary.general,soc.culture.canada,rec.travel.usa-canada
Subject: Statistics Canada Admits-Edmonton Is Crime Center of Canada!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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In a banner headline story across page B1 of the Edmonton Journal for
today 21 July 2006, Statistics Canada reports that Edmonton Canada is
now the crime capital of Canada!

The Edmonton region homicide/murder rate is documented at 4.3 per
100,000 people, compared to only 2.0 for crime-ridden Toronto!!

And, the Edmonton stats do not include bodies found outside the area,
>from the notorious Edmonton serial killer of female prostitiutes!

And the city wonders why it is getting such bad international
publicity, mainly caused by the crooked cops, who apparently can not
even catch a cold, let alone the serial murderer, who is suspected by
many, to be either a cop, judge or criminologist.


From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:31 EDT 2007
Article: 542028 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics,can.general,edm.general,tor.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton now ranks as Canada's most murderous metropolitan area
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <5va2c29uoceecgf211p98kt18h4ibb6rdu@4ax.com>
References: <0uSvg.120046$I61.47735@clgrps13>
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In a banner headline story across page B1 of the Edmonton Journal for
today 21 July 2006, Statistics Canada reports that Edmonton Canada is
now the crime capital of Canada!

The Edmonton region homicide/murder rate is documented at 4.3 per
100,000 people, compared to only 2.0 for crime-ridden Toronto!!

And, the Edmonton stats do not include bodies found outside the area,
>from the notorious Edmonton serial killer of female prostitiutes!

And the city wonders why it is getting such bad international
publicity, mainly caused by the crooked cops, who apparently can not
even catch a cold, let alone the serial murderer, who is suspected by
many, to be either a cop, judge or criminologist.


On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 21:22:04 GMT, Chom Noamsky  wrote:

>The per 100,000 murder rate in Edmonton now at 4.3.  Even more murderous
>than Regina, if you can believe it.  Toronto is 2.0.  In 2005, you were 2.3
>times as likely to become a victim of homicide in Edmonton than Toronto.  
>
>Someone told me once that conservative governments are tough on criminals.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:31 EDT 2007
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: ab.general,edm.general,calgary.general,soc.culture.canada,rec.travel.usa-canada
Subject: Re: Statistics Canada Admits-Edmonton Is Crime Center of Canada!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References:  <44C148B5.2287B5EC@sympatico.ca> <12c38f4t2r1d25a@corp.supernews.com>
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On Sat, 22 Jul 2006 03:56:20 -0000, kmcvay@shell.vex.net (Kenneth
McVay OBC) wrote:

>In article <44C148B5.2287B5EC@sympatico.ca>,
>Dave Smith   wrote:
>>
>>NotMyName wrote:
>>
>>> In a banner headline story across page B1 of the Edmonton Journal for
>>> today 21 July 2006, Statistics Canada reports that Edmonton Canada is
>>> now the crime capital of Canada!
>>>
>>> The Edmonton region homicide/murder rate is documented at 4.3 per
>>> 100,000 people, compared to only 2.0 for crime-ridden Toronto!!
>>>
>>> And, the Edmonton stats do not include bodies found outside the area,
>>> from the notorious Edmonton serial killer of female prostitiutes!


Notice that the disgusting AIDS-spreader pervert refused to discuss
the subject, preferring rather to post defamatory items instead.

It is because of such as it, that sensible people believe that faggots
are good only for incineration.


From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:32 EDT 2007
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: NO City Money for Racing/Business!! Taxpayers JEWED Again for WEM!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <1A1FD2XP38921.0376967593@twistycreek.com>
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>From all the vacant seats showing on the TV reports, it seems that
this year's races will be a financial disaster. Hooray!!

Gues there are not enough suckers in this area after all.


On 23 Jul 2006 04:54:17 -0000, MM2006  wrote:

>It seems that the retard city councillors, have again kissed butt for West Deadmonton Mall,
>and approved paying $650,000 of taxpayer money for the WEM car race!!
>
>Notice they DID NOT offer compensation to the many small restaurants and bars affected by
>the no-smoking bylaw, which will see many hundreds of jobs disappear, and small businesses
>go bankrupt!
>This is called GETTING JEWED, where some people get preferential treatment,at YOUR COST!!
>
>BOYCOTT THE RACE, and WEM, and everything connected!
>
>
>On Tue, 31 May 2005 14:50:16 -0600, George   wrote:
>
>>Whether sponsor or promoter, we still DO NOT WANT TO SUBSIDIZE THEM!! PERIOD!
>>We've been JEWED ENOUGH!! If they can.t pay their bills, then let them go
>>bankrupt!
>>And, yes, you are still a retard.
>
>>On Tue, 31 May 2005 16:41:25 GMT, "Fred Flinstone"  wrote:
>>>That makes them the title SPONSOR not the PROMOTER, So by your logic then
>>>Finning must own the raceway as it is known as the Finning International
>>>Raceway. retard
>
>>>"George"  wrote in message
>>>news:bp3p911l68pkvj9dum9qkhgp3tjh1odsg9@4ax.com...
>>>> Cretin, on TV the ads state loudly, that it is the West Edmonton Mall
>>>> Race!!
>
>>>> Taxpayers have already been JEWED out of more than a BILLION DOLLARS, so
>>>> NO MORE, for any reason!!
>
>>>> On Tue, 31 May 2005 16:06:27 GMT, "Fred Flinstone" 
>>>> wrote:
>
>>>>>West Edmonton Mall is not the promoter you fricken idiot
>
>>>>>"George"  wrote in message
>>>>>news:9tso91dv5uk31gqkbe0paub7s1o148jb5s@4ax.com...
>>>>>> Today's papers headline a story that the cons running the coming car
>>>>>> race  in Deadmonton, want stupid city taxpayers to give them $650,000 in city
>>>>>> paid services!!
>
>>>>>> The promoter of this race is the notorious West Edmonton Mall, already  the
>>>>>> recipient of $600 MILLION from city taxpayers, plus another $440 MILLION
>>>>>> from Alberta taxpayers through ATB!!
>
>>>>>> NOT ONE CENT MORE TO BE GIVEN!
>>>>>> If the racing business can not pay their bills, then let them go
>>>>>> bankrupt, as normal businesses do!!
>
>>>>>> Sharx, care to comment?
>
>
>If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>
>Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>
>"At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>is a revolutionary act."
>(George Orwell)
>
>David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>
>"All truth passes through three stages.
>First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>(Arthur Schopenhauer)
>
>"The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>
>"To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>and impossible to ignore."
>--John Bryant
>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:32 EDT 2007
Article: 542206 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: NO City Money for Racing/Business!! Taxpayers JEWED Again for WEM!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <1A1FD2XP38921.0376967593@twistycreek.com> 
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On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 14:34:07 -0500, "Mr Frederick"
 wrote:

>A- West Edmonton Mall is not the sponsor, it is the title holder.  For a 
>list of sponsors too long to list here go to 
>http://www.grandprixedmonton.com/v2/raceInfo_sponsors.php

>From all the ads on TV and in the newspapers, it is being called the
West Edmonton Mall Grand Prix!

>B - There was an absolutely huge crowd there, so a lot of money came into 
>the economy.  Last year there were 200,000 people, I'll bet this years's 
>total ends up similar.

>From all the TV footage, there are many thousands of vacvant seats
every day.

In fact all thew buses going to the races today did not have even one
passenger from north Edmonton!

Hopefully the promoters will go bankrupt!

>"MM2006"  wrote in message 
>news:1A1FD2XP38921.0376967593@twistycreek.com...
>> It seems that the retard city councillors, have again kissed butt for West 
>> Deadmonton Mall,
>> and approved paying $650,000 of taxpayer money for the WEM car race!!
>>
>> Notice they DID NOT offer compensation to the many small restaurants and 
>> bars affected by
>> the no-smoking bylaw, which will see many hundreds of jobs disappear, and 
>> small businesses
>> go bankrupt!
>> This is called GETTING JEWED, where some people get preferential 
>> treatment,at YOUR COST!!
>>
>> BOYCOTT THE RACE, and WEM, and everything connected!
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 31 May 2005 14:50:16 -0600, George   
>> wrote:
>>
>>>Whether sponsor or promoter, we still DO NOT WANT TO SUBSIDIZE THEM!! 
>>>PERIOD!
>>>We've been JEWED ENOUGH!! If they can.t pay their bills, then let them go
>>>bankrupt!
>>>And, yes, you are still a retard.
>>
>>>On Tue, 31 May 2005 16:41:25 GMT, "Fred Flinstone"  
>>>wrote:
>>>>That makes them the title SPONSOR not the PROMOTER, So by your logic then
>>>>Finning must own the raceway as it is known as the Finning International
>>>>Raceway. retard
>>
>>>>"George"  wrote in message
>>>>news:bp3p911l68pkvj9dum9qkhgp3tjh1odsg9@4ax.com...
>>>>> Cretin, on TV the ads state loudly, that it is the West Edmonton Mall
>>>>> Race!!
>>
>>>>> Taxpayers have already been JEWED out of more than a BILLION DOLLARS, 
>>>>> so
>>>>> NO MORE, for any reason!!
>>
>>>>> On Tue, 31 May 2005 16:06:27 GMT, "Fred Flinstone" 
>>>>> wrote:
>>
>>>>>>West Edmonton Mall is not the promoter you fricken idiot
>>
>>>>>>"George"  wrote in message
>>>>>>news:9tso91dv5uk31gqkbe0paub7s1o148jb5s@4ax.com...
>>>>>>> Today's papers headline a story that the cons running the coming car
>>>>>>> race  in Deadmonton, want stupid city taxpayers to give them $650,000 
>>>>>>> in city
>>>>>>> paid services!!
>>
>>>>>>> The promoter of this race is the notorious West Edmonton Mall, 
>>>>>>> already  the
>>>>>>> recipient of $600 MILLION from city taxpayers, plus another $440 
>>>>>>> MILLION
>>>>>>> from Alberta taxpayers through ATB!!
>>
>>>>>>> NOT ONE CENT MORE TO BE GIVEN!
>>>>>>> If the racing business can not pay their bills, then let them go
>>>>>>> bankrupt, as normal businesses do!!
>>
>>>>>>> Sharx, care to comment?
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>> 
>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:33 EDT 2007
Article: 542258 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: NO City Money for Racing/Business!! Taxpayers JEWED Again for WEM!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <60j9c2pv3hhj7q5ufo635gibmfd8v49t7v@4ax.com>
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Today's newspapers are reporting that the promoters continue to lose
on their $15 million so-called investment. due to a huge drop of more
than 27,000 less suckers attending the races this year!!

Hooray, and I hope for even less attendees next year, if there will be
a next year.


>On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 14:34:07 -0500, "Mr Frederick"
> wrote:
>
>>A- West Edmonton Mall is not the sponsor, it is the title holder.  For a 
>>list of sponsors too long to list here go to 
>>http://www.grandprixedmonton.com/v2/raceInfo_sponsors.php
>
>From all the ads on TV and in the newspapers, it is being called the
>West Edmonton Mall Grand Prix!
>
>>B - There was an absolutely huge crowd there, so a lot of money came into 
>>the economy.  Last year there were 200,000 people, I'll bet this years's 
>>total ends up similar.

>From all the TV footage, there are many thousands of vacvant seats
every day.

In fact all thew buses going to the races today did not have even one
passenger from north Edmonton!

Hopefully the promoters will go bankrupt!

>>"MM2006"  wrote in message 
>>news:1A1FD2XP38921.0376967593@twistycreek.com...
>>> It seems that the retard city councillors, have again kissed butt for West 
>>> Deadmonton Mall,
>>> and approved paying $650,000 of taxpayer money for the WEM car race!!
>>>
>>> Notice they DID NOT offer compensation to the many small restaurants and 
>>> bars affected by
>>> the no-smoking bylaw, which will see many hundreds of jobs disappear, and 
>>> small businesses
>>> go bankrupt!
>>> This is called GETTING JEWED, where some people get preferential 
>>> treatment,at YOUR COST!!
>>>
>>> BOYCOTT THE RACE, and WEM, and everything connected!
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, 31 May 2005 14:50:16 -0600, George   
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Whether sponsor or promoter, we still DO NOT WANT TO SUBSIDIZE THEM!! 
>>>>PERIOD!
>>>>We've been JEWED ENOUGH!! If they can.t pay their bills, then let them go
>>>>bankrupt!
>>>>And, yes, you are still a retard.
>>>
>>>>On Tue, 31 May 2005 16:41:25 GMT, "Fred Flinstone"  
>>>>wrote:
>>>>>That makes them the title SPONSOR not the PROMOTER, So by your logic then
>>>>>Finning must own the raceway as it is known as the Finning International
>>>>>Raceway. retard
>>>
>>>>>"George"  wrote in message
>>>>>news:bp3p911l68pkvj9dum9qkhgp3tjh1odsg9@4ax.com...
>>>>>> Cretin, on TV the ads state loudly, that it is the West Edmonton Mall
>>>>>> Race!!
>>>
>>>>>> Taxpayers have already been JEWED out of more than a BILLION DOLLARS, 
>>>>>> so
>>>>>> NO MORE, for any reason!!
>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, 31 May 2005 16:06:27 GMT, "Fred Flinstone" 
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>>West Edmonton Mall is not the promoter you fricken idiot
>>>
>>>>>>>"George"  wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:9tso91dv5uk31gqkbe0paub7s1o148jb5s@4ax.com...
>>>>>>>> Today's papers headline a story that the cons running the coming car
>>>>>>>> race  in Deadmonton, want stupid city taxpayers to give them $650,000 
>>>>>>>> in city
>>>>>>>> paid services!!
>>>
>>>>>>>> The promoter of this race is the notorious West Edmonton Mall, 
>>>>>>>> already  the
>>>>>>>> recipient of $600 MILLION from city taxpayers, plus another $440 
>>>>>>>> MILLION
>>>>>>>> from Alberta taxpayers through ATB!!
>>>
>>>>>>>> NOT ONE CENT MORE TO BE GIVEN!
>>>>>>>> If the racing business can not pay their bills, then let them go
>>>>>>>> bankrupt, as normal businesses do!!
>>>
>>>>>>>> Sharx, care to comment?
>>>
>>>
>>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>>
>>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>>
>>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>>> is a revolutionary act."
>>> (George Orwell)
>>>
>>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>>
>>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>>
>>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>>
>>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>>> and impossible to ignore."
>>> --John Bryant
>>>
>>> 
>>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:33 EDT 2007
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: NO City Money for Racing/Business!! Taxpayers JEWED Again for WEM!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 14:16:46 GMT, "PV" 
wrote:
>"NotMyName"  wrote in message 
>news:60j9c2pv3hhj7q5ufo635gibmfd8v49t7v@4ax.com...
>> Today's newspapers are reporting that the promoters continue to lose
>> on their $15 million so-called investment. due to a huge drop of more
>> than 27,000 less suckers attending the races this year!!
>>
>> Hooray, and I hope for even less attendees next year, if there will be
>> a next year.
>
>Yep, only 172,000 people attended over three days, but this time 
>complimentary passes were not factored in like last year, so only 172,000+ 
>paying fans were there.

There is no proff that the 172,000 who attended this year PAID to
attend, any more than the fictitious number last year included
allegedly some non-paying attendeed.
After all, the cops and city officials standing around never paid,
either year!

>You really are a bitter human being aren't you?
>

Like most normal people, I resent tax money being given to a damn
BUSINESS!!
Either make it on your own, or go BANKRUPT, as in the real world!!

>PV 




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:33 EDT 2007
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: NO City Money for Racing/Business!! Taxpayers JEWED Again for WEM!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 20:47:51 GMT, Sew 
wrote:
>On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 14:34:07 -0500, "Mr Frederick"
> wrote:
>
>>A- West Edmonton Mall is not the sponsor, it is the title holder.  For a 
>>list of sponsors too long to list here go to 
>>http://www.grandprixedmonton.com/v2/raceInfo_sponsors.php
>>B - There was an absolutely huge crowd there, so a lot of money came into 
>>the economy.  Last year there were 200,000 people, I'll bet this years's 
>>total ends up similar.
>
>I sure hope that you are wrong and that the race turned out to be a
>disaster. To many businesses with too many write offs and really, all
>taxpayers supporting it and not really the businesses. 

This year it IS a disaster, with about 30,000 less attendees than last
year!!

All the media are quoting the promoters as admitting at least 27,000
less people attending this year.

That means that despite the city taxpayers getting JEWED to give
another $650,000 of taxpayer money, it resulted in fewer people
wasting their money to attend the Triple5 races!!



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:33 EDT 2007
Article: 542344 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics,can.general,edm.general,tor.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton now ranks as Canada's most murderous metropolitan area
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <0uSvg.120046$I61.47735@clgrps13>
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And, the news headlines for today Monday 24 July 2006 - ANOTHER 3
MURDERS between Thursday and this afternoon!!

The clueless cop thugs have no clues, or arrests of murderers, leading
many to suspect that perhaps some of the murders are being done by
fellow cops?



In a banner headline story across page B1 of the Edmonton Journal for
21 July 2006, Statistics Canada reports that Edmonton Canada is now
the crime capital of Canada!

The Edmonton region homicide/murder rate is documented at 4.3 per
100,000 people, compared to only 2.0 for crime-ridden Toronto!!

And, the Edmonton stats do not include bodies found outside the area,
>from the notorious Edmonton serial killer of female prostitiutes!

And the city wonders why it is getting such bad international
publicity, mainly caused by the crooked cops, who apparently can not
even catch a cold, let alone the serial murderer, who is suspected by
many, to be either a cop, judge or criminologist.


On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 21:22:04 GMT, Chom Noamsky  wrote:

>The per 100,000 murder rate in Edmonton now at 4.3.  Even more murderous
>than Regina, if you can believe it.  Toronto is 2.0.  In 2005, you were 2.3
>times as likely to become a victim of homicide in Edmonton than Toronto.  
>
>Someone told me once that conservative governments are tough on criminals.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:34 EDT 2007
Article: 542500 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: NO City Money for Racing/Business!! Taxpayers JEWED Again for WEM!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <2q1fc2tc9ro22n2m6q29rntqqvljjcjgi8@4ax.com>
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On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 20:47:51 GMT, Sew 
wrote:
>On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 14:34:07 -0500, "Mr Frederick"
> wrote:
>
>>A- West Edmonton Mall is not the sponsor, it is the title holder.  For a 
>>list of sponsors too long to list here go to 
>>http://www.grandprixedmonton.com/v2/raceInfo_sponsors.php
>>B - There was an absolutely huge crowd there, so a lot of money came into 
>>the economy.  Last year there were 200,000 people, I'll bet this years's 
>>total ends up similar.
>
>I sure hope that you are wrong and that the race turned out to be a
>disaster. To many businesses with too many write offs and really, all
>taxpayers supporting it and not really the businesses. 

This year it IS a disaster, with about 30,000 less attendees than last
year!!

All the media are quoting the promoters as admitting at least 27,000
less people attending this year.

That means that despite the city taxpayers getting JEWED to give
another $650,000 of taxpayer money, it resulted in fewer people
wasting their money to attend the Triple5 races!!

In other words, a WASTE of the taxpayers' $650,000!!



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:34 EDT 2007
Article: 542511 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics,can.general,edm.general,tor.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton now ranks as Canada's most murderous metropolitan area
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <335fc29b4l9v5mk9bikp7kp0dvb7oq7o3m@4ax.com>
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Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

And, the news headlines for  Monday 24 July 2006 - ANOTHER 3 MURDERS
between Thursday and this afternoon!!

The clueless cop thugs have no clues, or arrests of murderers, leading
many to suspect that perhaps some of the murders are being done by
fellow cops?



In a banner headline story across page B1 of the Edmonton Journal for
21 July 2006, Statistics Canada reports that Edmonton Canada is now
the crime capital of Canada!

The Edmonton region homicide/murder rate is documented at 4.3 per
100,000 people, compared to only 2.0 for crime-ridden Toronto!!

And, the Edmonton stats do not include bodies found outside the area,
>from the notorious Edmonton serial killer of female prostitiutes!

And the city wonders why it is getting such bad international
publicity, mainly caused by the crooked cops, who apparently can not
even catch a cold, let alone the serial murderer, who is suspected by
many, to be either a cop, judge or criminologist.


On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 21:22:04 GMT, Chom Noamsky  wrote:

>The per 100,000 murder rate in Edmonton now at 4.3.  Even more murderous
>than Regina, if you can believe it.  Toronto is 2.0.  In 2005, you were 2.3
>times as likely to become a victim of homicide in Edmonton than Toronto.  
>
>Someone told me once that conservative governments are tough on criminals.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:34 EDT 2007
Article: 542512 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: ab.general,edm.general,calgary.general,soc.culture.canada,rec.travel.usa-canada
Subject: Statistics Canada Admits-Edmonton Is Crime Center of Canada!
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In a banner headline story across page B1 of the Edmonton Journal for
21 July 2006, Statistics Canada reports that Edmonton Canada is now
the crime capital of Canada!

The Edmonton region homicide/murder rate is documented at 4.3 per
100,000 people, compared to only 2.0 for crime-ridden Toronto!!

And, the Edmonton stats do not include bodies found outside the area,
>from the notorious Edmonton serial killer of female prostitiutes!

And the city wonders why it is getting such bad international
publicity, mainly caused by the crooked cops, who apparently can not
even catch a cold, let alone the serial murderer, who is suspected by
many, to be either a cop, judge or criminologist.


From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:34 EDT 2007
Article: 542538 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: alt.privacy.anon-server,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: WARNING - ISP Netidentity No Longer USA based, but in Canada!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
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On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 16:23:57 +0000 (UTC), Zax
 wrote:

>On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:11:01 -0600, Sara Salzman wrote in
>Message-Id: :
>
>> WARNING - ISP Netidentity No Longer USA based, but in Canada!!
>
>Shouldn't this read:
>RELAX - ISP Netidentity No Longer USA based, but in Canada!!
>
>I find it hard to believe that Canana is more repressive in terms of
>freedom of speech than the US (or EU).

There is no constitutional; right in Canada to freedom of speech!!

To add insult to injury, TRUTH IS NO DEFENCE in law, when charged by
Bnai Brith, Mossad, or any other ZYD group!!
Just ask Ernst Zundel.

ISP willingly co-operate with police in Canada, who do not need a
warrant to snoop on a subscriber!!


From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:35 EDT 2007
Article: 542570 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: alt.privacy.anon-server,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: WARNING - ISP Netidentity No Longer USA based, but in Canada!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 16:23:57 +0000 (UTC), Zax
 wrote:

>On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:11:01 -0600, Sara Salzman wrote in
>Message-Id: :
>
>> WARNING - ISP Netidentity No Longer USA based, but in Canada!!
>
>Shouldn't this read:
>RELAX - ISP Netidentity No Longer USA based, but in Canada!!
>
>I find it hard to believe that Canana is more repressive in terms of
>freedom of speech than the US (or EU).

There is no constitutional; right in Canada to freedom of speech!!

To add insult to injury, TRUTH IS NO DEFENCE in law, when charged by
Bnai Brith, Mossad, or any other ZYD group!!
Just ask Ernst Zundel.

ISP willingly co-operate with police in Canada, who do not need a
warrant to snoop on a subscriber!!


From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:35 EDT 2007
Article: 542626 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: NO City Money for Racing/Business!! Taxpayers JEWED Again for WEM!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 20:47:51 GMT, Sew 
wrote:
>On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 14:34:07 -0500, "Mr Frederick"
> wrote:
>
>>A- West Edmonton Mall is not the sponsor, it is the title holder.  For a 
>>list of sponsors too long to list here go to 
>>http://www.grandprixedmonton.com/v2/raceInfo_sponsors.php
>>B - There was an absolutely huge crowd there, so a lot of money came into 
>>the economy.  Last year there were 200,000 people, I'll bet this years's 
>>total ends up similar.
>
>I sure hope that you are wrong and that the race turned out to be a
>disaster. To many businesses with too many write offs and really, all
>taxpayers supporting it and not really the businesses. 

This year it IS a disaster, with about 30,000 less attendees than last
year!!

All the media are quoting the promoters as admitting at least 27,000
less people attending this year.

That means that despite the city taxpayers getting JEWED to give
another $650,000 of taxpayer money, it resulted in fewer people
wasting their money to attend the Triple5 races!!

In other words, a WASTE of the taxpayers' $650,000!!



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:35 EDT 2007
Article: 542630 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: can.politics,can.general,edm.general,tor.general,soc.culture.canada,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton now ranks as Canada's most murderous metropolitan area
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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And, the news headlines for  Monday 24 July 2006 - ANOTHER 3 MURDERS
between Thursday and this afternoon!!

The clueless cop thugs have no clues, or arrests of murderers, leading
many to suspect that perhaps some of the murders are being done by
fellow cops?



In a banner headline story across page B1 of the Edmonton Journal for
21 July 2006, Statistics Canada reports that Edmonton Canada is now
the crime capital of Canada!

The Edmonton region homicide/murder rate is documented at 4.3 per
100,000 people, compared to only 2.0 for crime-ridden Toronto!!

And, the Edmonton stats do not include bodies found outside the area,
>from the notorious Edmonton serial killer of female prostitiutes!

And the city wonders why it is getting such bad international
publicity, mainly caused by the crooked cops, who apparently can not
even catch a cold, let alone the serial murderer, who is suspected by
many, to be either a cop, judge or criminologist.


On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 21:22:04 GMT, Chom Noamsky  wrote:

>The per 100,000 murder rate in Edmonton now at 4.3.  Even more murderous
>than Regina, if you can believe it.  Toronto is 2.0.  In 2005, you were 2.3
>times as likely to become a victim of homicide in Edmonton than Toronto.  
>
>Someone told me once that conservative governments are tough on criminals.



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:35 EDT 2007
Article: 542821 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,calgary.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Murdering cops in Edmonton - Again!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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Yes, in Deadmonton, a son of a bitch's life IS considered more
important, by the 2 legged SOBs who are thugs on the Police farce,
than are the lives of humans.

That is why there are so many complaints and charges against the
Edmonton Gestapo/KGB for police brutality!!

It seems they feel that by shooting dead a suspect, they won't have a
live witness to their criminal acts!!


On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 16:48:56 GMT, "Garry"  wrote:

>Is a dogs life more important than a humans? Apparently so if it belongs to 
>the Edmonton Police.
>
>Garry Brigham 




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:35 EDT 2007
Article: 542882 of soc.culture.canada
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,calgary.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Murdering cops in Edmonton - Again!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 03:49:17 GMT, Sew 
wrote:

>On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 00:48:04 GMT, NotMyName
> wrote:
>
>>Yes, in Deadmonton, a son of a bitch's life IS considered more
>>important, by the 2 legged SOBs who are thugs on the Police farce,
>>than are the lives of humans.
>>
>>That is why there are so many complaints and charges against the
>>Edmonton Gestapo/KGB for police brutality!!
>>
>>It seems they feel that by shooting dead a suspect, they won't have a
>>live witness to their criminal acts!!
>
>So you are in favour of taxpayers paying 80,000.00 a year or more to
>keep one of these criminals in jail for the rest of their lives? They
>commit a crime and we have to pay for it forever. Time to bring back
>the death penalty. Maybe then they will reconsider when they plan to
>break the laws of this country, if they can find them all of course. 

On the contrary, I support the death penalty, after trial, NOT when
the crooked cops want to kill someone in their custody!!

After all, an executed criminal will never re-offend.

>>On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 16:48:56 GMT, "Garry"  wrote:
>>
>>>Is a dogs life more important than a humans? Apparently so if it belongs to 
>>>the Edmonton Police.
>>>
>>>Garry Brigham 
>>



From Boadicea@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:36 EDT 2007
Article: 543014 of soc.culture.canada
Xref: sn-us can.politics:1353012 misc.immigration.usa:229224 soc.culture.canada:543014
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: Boadicea 
Newsgroups: can.politics,misc.immigration.usa,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Help, need info on migrating to Canada from the US
Organization: Proposition13
Reply-To: Boadicea@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <1154237643.946591.186000@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>
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NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2006 08:46:50 MDT

In other words, you are an admitted criminal.

You should fit right in with all the other criminals and garbage
people that Canada regularly admits.

However, how can you enter Canada from the USa, when one must be
examined on the US and Canadian borders?
Are you using counterfeit papers now?

Why not just go back to your homeland?


On 29 Jul 2006 22:34:04 -0700, "Pedro" 
wrote:

>Hello All.
>I'm a Peruvian citizen, I entered the US 9 Years ago under a tourist
>visa and I never left since then.
>I was caught by immigration officials 2 years ago and a Immigration
>Judge gave me a Voluntary departure order, which I did not follow.
>I am looking into the possibility of moving to Canada and start my life
>again there.
>I know that I have done wrong by disobeying US immigration laws, and
>the consequence is that now I do not have any options for getting legal
>residence in the US.
>Have anyone here been in this situation? I am planning to follow ALL
>the steps to legally migrate to Canada and establish my life there, but
>I need to know where to start.
>
>I truly appreciate your answers.
>
>Best Regards
>
>Pedro S.



From Boadicea@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:36 EDT 2007
Article: 543033 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: Boadicea 
Newsgroups: can.politics,misc.immigration.usa,can.general,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa
Subject: Re: Help, need info on migrating to Canada from the US
Organization: Proposition13
Reply-To: Boadicea@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: <79ppc2leu9dc61lp9nj9l1thc68nfh7kl2@4ax.com>
References: <1154237643.946591.186000@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> <1154275860.479358.243570@s13g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>
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NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2006 11:00:16 MDT

In other words, you are an admitted criminal.

You should fit right in with all the other criminals and garbage
people that Canada regularly admits.

However, how can you enter Canada from the USa, when one must be
examined on the US and Canadian borders?
Are you using counterfeit papers now?

Why not just go back to your homeland?
Better yet, get yourself arrested by INS, and get free room and board!

You failed to say, what, if any qualifications you have that would
make you a wanted immigrant in any country.....


On 30 Jul 2006 09:11:00 -0700, "Pedro" 
wrote:

>Hello Again.

>I searched for the term "troll" and found out that refers to someone
>who tries to disrupt a newsgroup
>(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll). That is absolutely not
>my intention, I believe that I have a valid question and I'm looking
>for answers from people who know about the matter.
>I do not want to go back to Peru because I feel I have much more
>opportunities in North America then in my home country. I am not
>stealing from anyone and I have never committed any crime other than
>overstaying my visa.
>If you could please, give me some advice on Canadian Immigration based
>on my case I would be truly thankful.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Pedro S. (Not a troll)
>
>
>Pedro wrote:
>> Hello All.
>> I'm a Peruvian citizen, I entered the US 9 Years ago under a tourist
>> visa and I never left since then.
>> I was caught by immigration officials 2 years ago and a Immigration
>> Judge gave me a Voluntary departure order, which I did not follow.
>> I am looking into the possibility of moving to Canada and start my life
>> again there.
>> I know that I have done wrong by disobeying US immigration laws, and
>> the consequence is that now I do not have any options for getting legal
>> residence in the US.
>> Have anyone here been in this situation? I am planning to follow ALL
>> the steps to legally migrate to Canada and establish my life there, but
>> I need to know where to start.
>> 
>> I truly appreciate your answers.
>> 
>> Best Regards
>> 
>> Pedro S.



From JohnBuchan@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 19:54:36 EDT 2007
Article: 543108 of soc.culture.canada
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: John Buchan 
Newsgroups: edm.general,edm.politics,ab.general,calgary.general,can.general,soc.culture.canada
Subject: Re: Murdering cops in Edmonton - Again!
Organization: Proposition13
Reply-To: JohnBuchan@roc.usenetexchange.com
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On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 03:49:17 GMT, Sew 
wrote:

>On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 00:48:04 GMT, NotMyName
> wrote:
>
>>Yes, in Deadmonton, a son of a bitch's life IS considered more
>>important, by the 2 legged SOBs who are thugs on the Police farce,
>>than are the lives of humans.
>>
>>That is why there are so many complaints and charges against the
>>Edmonton Gestapo/KGB for police brutality!!
>>
>>It seems they feel that by shooting dead a suspect, they won't have a
>>live witness to their criminal acts!!
>
>So you are in favour of taxpayers paying 80,000.00 a year or more to
>keep one of these criminals in jail for the rest of their lives? They
>commit a crime and we have to pay for it forever. Time to bring back
>the death penalty. Maybe then they will reconsider when they plan to
>break the laws of this country, if they can find them all of course. 

On the contrary, I support the death penalty, after trial, NOT when
the crooked cops want to kill someone in their custody!!

After all, an executed criminal will never re-offend.

>>On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 16:48:56 GMT, "Garry"  wrote:
>>
>>>Is a dogs life more important than a humans? Apparently so if it belongs to 
>>>the Edmonton Police.
>>>
>>>Garry Brigham 
>>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:25 EDT 2007
Article: 555431 of soc.culture.europe
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.singapore,soc.culture.indonesia,soc.culture.australian,alt.activism.death-penalty,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.europe
Subject: Re: 2 more Aussie Drug Traffickers to be Hanged - GOOD!
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At least the government of Indonesia know what to do with garbage
people, such as drug dealers.

They know, as do other sensible governments in the area, that an
executed criminal will never re-offend!!

Further, an executed waste of skin, will not cost the taxpayers for
the upkeep in some pampering prison system!!

If only the justice systems in North America would follow suit!!!


On 17 Feb 2006 18:43:24 -0800, "LifeManTalking" 
wrote:

>AUSTRALIA - Few Australians have much sympathy for Andrew Chan and
>Myuran Sukumaran, the two drug traffickers sentenced to death in Bali
>this week for their failed bid to smuggle more than 8kg of heroin on to
>the streets of Sydney.

>The lives of too many of their young people have been destroyed by
>drugs and, as innumerable letters to newspapers and callers to talkback
>radio have pointed out, Chan and Sukumaran could never have been in any
>doubt of the risk they took in running narcotics through Indonesia.

>But the prospect of the pair being taken from Kerobokan jail, tied to a
>tree in some lonely clearing, and shot by a paramilitary firing squad
>raises deep and disturbing moral, political and diplomatic dilemmas for
>a nation that last executed a criminal almost 40 years ago and now
>opposes the death penalty worldwide.

>Their own police provided the information that inevitably led to
>Tuesday's sentence. Their Government welcomed the death penalty given
>to the Bali bombers but opposes the same fate for Australian drug
>traffickers, and public opinion is repulsed by the prospect of
>executions at home but inconsistently accepts them abroad.

>It is a diplomatic minefield that Canberra traversed when
>Vietnamese-born Melburnian Van Tuong Nguyen was hanged in Singapore in
>December for taking heroin through Changi airport, despite Australian
>appeals for clemency.

>It is also a minefield that the nation will confront time and again:
>despite repeated warnings and the appalling reality of executions,
>there will always be people foolish enough to strap drugs to their
>bodies or conceal it in their luggage.

>Almost all will pass through Southeast Asia, the source of most of
>Australia's heroin (the Bali Nine consignment originated in Thailand)
>and where every country but Cambodia compulsorily hangs, shoots or
>lethally injects traffickers.

>Mike Phelan, the head of international operations for the Australian
>Federal Police and the man responsible for giving Indonesia the
>information it needed to arrest the Bali Nine, sees no end to the queue
>of couriers the trade calls "mules".

>"It continues to astound me that people attempt importations and move
>drugs through transit countries knowing that the death penalty exists,"
>he told ABC's Australian Story. "Many young lives get thrown away for
>the law of quick dollars."

>The AFP's role in the arrest of the Bali Nine is among the most
>sensitive of the issues facing Prime Minister John Howard, who has
>already weathered a barrage of criticism that has extended even into
>his own party room.

>The AFP caught the first whispers of a major heroin importing run in
>February last year and, in April, asked the Indonesian police to help
>uncover the members of the syndicate and the source of their supplies.

>Between them, the two forces discovered most of the names and built a
>remarkably accurate picture of their operation, including details of a
>previous successful run and another aborted attempt.

>This co-operation has become increasingly commonplace, spurred by the
>determination of all countries in the region to attack drug trafficking
>and terrorism. Intelligence swapping is required under a number of
>treaties.

>"We make no secret of the fact that the AFP has a policy of forward
>engagement where we want to stop the crimes at the source and (prevent
>them) from reaching Australian shores," Phelan said. "That's a practice
>we will continue to operate within."

>What worries many Australians is the fact that the AFP in effect turned
>over a group of young Australians to a country it knew was likely to
>execute them, rather than arresting them when they arrived home.

>The most emotional response centred on Scott Rush, 20, a drug mule who
>was jailed for life. His family, through lawyer Bob Myers, vainly asked
>the AFP to warn Rush of their interest before he left Australia.

>"No Australian public servant has the right to expose any Australian
>citizen to the death penalty," Myers told Australian Story.

>Rush and fellow mules Renae Lawrence, Martin Stephens and Michael
>Czugaj took the AFP to the Federal Court, claiming it had acted
>illegally by exposing them to the death penalty.

>While a large part of public opinion agreed, the court dismissed the
>action.

>The Government has also sidestepped criticism, pointing out that while
>the relevant treaty with Indonesia contains a clause allowing the
>Attorney-General to refuse to provide evidence if an Australian was
>charged with an offence carrying the death penalty, the AFP was free to
>do as it thought best until charges were laid.

>By the time the Bali Nine were formally charged, all the damaging
>evidence had been gathered.

>Phelan is unrepentant: "Basically all transit countries through which
>drugs come to Australia have the death penalty. The AFP cannot pick and
>choose who it chooses to cooperate with."

>International teamwork in the past few years has significantly reduced
>the flow of drugs into Australia. The most recent Australian Crime
>Commission figures, for 2003-04, show the lowest seizures of heroin for
>a decade.

>Refusal to co-operate abroad would outrage regional governments and
>threaten mutual action against other drug syndicates and terrorism.

>Public opinion in Southeast Asia also strongly favours the death
>penalty for traffickers, with polls in Singapore and Thailand showing
>support of up to 80 per cent.

>In Australia, opinion is more confused. A Morgan poll in November found
>that while only 27 per cent of Australians favoured the death penalty
>for murder, 57 per cent believed drug traffickers caught in Asia should
>die.

>Yet in the specific case of Van Nguyen, opinion was evenly divided.

>In The Australian, a newspoll found that more than 50 per cent of
>Australians favoured the death sentence for people convicted of major
>acts of terrorism.

>Howard now has to weigh all these conflicting factors in framing
>Canberra's approach to the executions of Chan and Sukumaran. He has
>said publicly he has no sympathy for the two men but will vigorously
>pursue Australia's long-standing opposition to the death penalty.

>How that is carried out will test Australian diplomacy.

>Apart from the risks to a fragile relationship, observers have pointed
>out that any blunt approach will almost certainly stiffen backs in
>Jakarta and end any chance of clemency.

>Hopes of saving Chan and Sukumaran now rest with Indonesia's
>inconsistent record in carrying out executions, the fact that in recent
>times only three of the more than 85 prisoners on death row have been
>shot, and the lengthy legal road still to be travelled.

>It may be years before their case moves through the Denpasar provincial
>High Court and the two reviews possible through the Supreme Court in
>Jakarta.

>And though President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono has said he will never
>grant clemency to drug traffickers, time and quiet diplomacy may change
>his mind.

>Death penalty Australia's double dilemma 
>
>18.02.06
>By Greg Ansley



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Subject: Re: Unqualified Bookkeepers Allowed to Guarantee for Passports in Canada!! - Repost & More!
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On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 23:28:36 -0400, "Gary Renzetti"
 wrote:

>Frank,
>You are posting absolute horseshit.
>A Canadian bookkeeper can NOT "guarantor" a passport application, period! 

Unqualified bookkeepers, with no training, but who pay the $200 fee,
and join the Society of Professional Accountants run by Laura Waters,
are now permitted by the Canadian government to sign as guarantors for
passports.

In fact, CGA Alberta also accepted 52 unqualified bookkeepers in 1988
as members when they paid their fees, and these unqualified
bookkeepers are also allowed to sign as passport guarantors!!

Is this how Israel is now getting lots of passports for their MOSSAD
criminals?


>Saying that, a Canadian accountant *can*, which sticks in my tookis. 
>Somehow, the Canadian government thinks that an accountant is more 
>trustworthy than a Canadian-born bricklayer or for that matter, a 
>Canadian-born prostitute (say what?). Accountants, in my experience with the 
>breed, are a helluva lot less honest than either bricklayers or whores.

On this point you will get no argument from me.
Just look at all the massive commercial frauds in Canada and the USa,
all involving prominent accounting firms!!

That is why CA stands for CROOKED ACCOUNTANT!!


>How the fuck does a university education make someone a reliable, 
>trustworthy person?

>"Frank Arthur"  wrote in message 
>news:obfaa2pmokcjfs1iq4ss2ur2n5jfrbao97@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 09:36:57 -0700, Adenoid Heinkel
>>  wrote:
>>
>> Not just the US authorities, but also those throughout Europe as well
>> as Asia should be highly suspicious of ALL Canadian passports and
>> their holders.
>>
>> Not only are unqualified bookkeepers , WHO HAVE NO UNIVERSITY
>> OR SIMILARTLY APPROVED COURSES OF INSTRUCTION!,approved
>> by the Canadiangovernment to guarantee people applying for a Canadian
>> passport, but do not forget the many tens of thousands of Canadian 
>> passports
>> supposed "LOST" each year by the Canadian Passport department.
>>
>> Quite apart from the thousands of passports fabricated by the
>> Israelis!!
>>
>> Now, the USA will require that Canadians entering the USA  as of next year
>> must also have a valid passport.
>>
>> With lax guarantors in Canada, no wonder the US authorities, and in New
>> Zealand are concerned!!
>>
>> Notice that the traditional bookkeepers/accountants are not objecting to
>> including these unqualified bookkeepers as being the same as CA,CGA,CMA.
>>
>> Could this be because the older groups are too busy fighting all the 
>> lawsuits
>> for CRIMINAL fraud involving their members=CA,CGA?
>>
>> The CAs and CGAs do not care that the unqualified PA, APA and RPA , all of
>> whom have no university education or similar qualifications for their
>> competency, are now equal in status to gurantee Canadian passports,
>> since all are now equal in non-credibility!!
>>
>>>On Sun, 14 Nov 2004 18:57:24 -0700, dandelion 
>>>wrote:
>>
>>>>No wonder the INS makes it difficult for Canadians to enter the USA.
>>
>>>>They should make it even harder,especially since thousands of Canadian
>>>>passports are stolen with ease each year from Canadian Government
>>>>offices, as admitted regularly to media!!
>>
>>>>On 26 Sep 2004 12:20:32 -0700, heinrichhimmelfarb@xmail.net
>>>>(HeinrichHimmelfarb) wrote:
>>
>>>>>A qualified Engineer wonders about the so-called standards for a
>>>>>Guarantor for a Canadian Passport.
>>
>>>>>Read the article following HIS posting, then complain to your MP.
>>
>>>>>From: "HCH" 
>>>>>Newsgroups: soc.culture.canada
>>>>>Subject: The Passport Guarantor
>>>>>Date: Fri, 24 Sep 2004 22:19:31 -0400
>>
>>>>>The information required on the Canadian Passport Application Forms is
>>>>>weird. This Declaration of Guarantor is really bizarre. Being a
>>>>>Professional Engineer (I'm retired now), born outside Canada but a
>>>>>Canadian Citizen, makes me MORE trustworthy than a full-blooded
>>>>>Canadian who is an Electrician or Carpenter or with whatever trade.
>>>>>The Application form tells me that a person BORN in Canada and a
>>>>>trades-person can NOT be trusted; it also tells me that a person with
>>>>>a professional states + and only 3 years in Canada + a Canadian
>>>>>citizen CAN be trusted (corrupt or not). Hello, that looks to me as
>>>>>PURE discrimination. Which THINKING TANK added such a stupid
>>>>>requirement? They must have been at that day brain-dead. Then further
>>>>>down the application form TWO more persons are required to vouch for
>>>>>you. No Passport for you if don't want to involve anyone.
>>
>>>>>ENOUGH TO CAUSE US IMMIGRATION TO BAR CANADIANS!!
>>>>>Newsgroups: can.legal,can.general,tor.general,
>>>>>soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.usa
>>>>>Subject: Canada Passport Guarantors-WHY Unqualified Bookkeepers!!
>>
>>>>>Info provided as courtesy to public, under FOI.
>>
>>>>>Good Morning
>>
>>>>>I just had a call from the passport office in Ottawa and the PA's have
>>>>>been officially approved as guarantors for passports as of March 3, 
>>>>>2003.
>>>>>
>>>>>As the passport office has a loggin to our website to electronically
>>>>>check for current paid up members, please make sure that all information 
>>>>>on
>>>>>your website listing is correct and up to date and that your account is 
>>>>>in
>>>>>good standing.
>>
>>>>>Laura Waters-Taverner, PA
>>>>>President
>>
>>>>>MEMBERS OF THIS GROUP (professional accountants) ARE NOT RECOGNISED AS
>>>>>QUALIFIED ACCOUNTANTS, BY THE GOVERNMENT OF ALBERTA, WHO ONLY
>>>>>RECOGNISE CA, CGA, AND CMA!!
>>
>>>>>The Canadian Passport Office has no business allowing these
>>>>>unqualified bookkeepers to be Guarantors for Passports, when even the 
>>>>>province
>>>>>does not recognise them as qualified accountants!!
>>
>>>>>In fact, these people could even be guaranteeing for undesirable,
>>>>>criminals, terrorists and others that the USA would like to keep
>>>>>from entering the USA!!
>>
>>>>>The phone for MICHAEL HUTTON, Director Passport Canada is:
>>>>>1-819-994-3530
>>
>>>>>Even qualified, investigated Commissioners for Oaths are not permitted
>>>>>as Guarantors for Passports, while unqualified, unvetted bookkeepers
>>>>>are!!
>>
>>>>>The US INS are now really getting annoyed with Canada, and Canadian
>>>>>passports.
>>>>>They claim that criminals, dope dealers, and even terrorists will now
>>>>>find it even easier to get Canadian passports.
>>
>>>>>It seems Passports Canada just does not give a damn!!!
>>
>> _________________________________________
>> Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>> More than 140,000 groups
>> Unlimited download
>> http://www.usenetzone.com to open account 
>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:26 EDT 2007
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Subject: Re: "GIs eyed in alleged rape, murders in Iraq" (AP) Deserve Beheading!
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Time for the Iraqis to apply local/islamic law on the criminal yanks
and other occupiers!

Public beheadings would certainly discourage further rapes and similar
crimes.


On 1 Jul 2006 00:00:32 -0700, "Barry Schier" 
wrote:

>{Preface}
>
>(Insert a quote from President Bush about how the U.S. "intervention
>in" (Translator's note: Orwellian doublespreak "intervention in" means
>in plain English "occupation of") Iraq helps the people of that
>country, etc.here)
>-- Barry Schier
>
>{Article}
>
>GIs eyed in alleged rape, murders in Iraq
>By RYAN LENZ, Associated Press Writer
>
>
>
>BEIJI, Iraq - A group of American soldiers in an insurgent-riddled town
>allegedly noticed a young Iraqi woman when on patrol and later returned
>to rape her, according to U.S. officials Friday. In an apparent
>cover-up attempt, she and three members of her family then were killed
>and her body was set on fire.
>
>
>Five U.S. troops are being investigated, a U.S. military official told
>The Associated Press.
>
>It is the fifth pending case involving alleged slayings of Iraqi
>civilians by U.S. troops.
>
>The suspects in the killing, which took place in March, were from the
>same platoon as two soldiers kidnapped and killed south of Baghdad this
>month, said the official, who is close to the investigation and spoke
>on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the case.
>
>One soldier was arrested after admitting his role in the alleged attack
>on the family, the U.S. official said. The official said the rape and
>killings appear to have been a "crime of opportunity," noting that the
>soldiers had not been attacked by insurgents but had noticed the woman
>on previous patrols.
>
>One of the family members they allegedly killed was a child, said a
>senior Army official who also requested anonymity because the
>investigation is ongoing. Some of the suspects allegedly burned the
>woman's body to cover up the attack, the U.S. official said.
>
>In Baghdad, the U.S. military issued a sparse statement, saying only
>that Maj. Gen. James D. Thurman, commander of the 4th Infantry
>Division, ordered a criminal investigation into the alleged slaying of
>a family of four in Mahmoudiya, 20 miles south of Baghdad.
>
>However, the U.S. official said the soldiers were assigned to the 502nd
>Infantry Regiment. The official told the AP that the suspects were from
>the same platoon as two slain soldiers whose mutilated bodies were
>found June 19, three days after they were abducted by insurgents near
>Youssifiyah southwest of Baghdad.
>
>The military has said one and possibly both of the slain soldiers were
>tortured and beheaded. The official said the mutilation of the slain
>soldiers stirred feelings of guilt and led at least one member of the
>platoon to reveal the rape-slaying on June 22.
>
>According to the senior Army official, the alleged incident was first
>revealed by a soldier during a routine counseling-type session. The
>official said that soldier did not witness the incident but heard about
>it.
>
>A second soldier, who also was not involved, said he overhead soldiers
>conspiring to commit the crimes and then later saw bloodstains on their
>clothes, the official said.
>
>Before the soldier disclosed the alleged assault, senior officers had
>been aware of the family's death but believed it was a result of
>sectarian violence, the official said.
>
>One of the five suspects has already been discharged for unspecified
>charges unrelated to the killings and is believed to be in the United
>States, two U.S. officials said on condition of anonymity because the
>investigation is ongoing. The others have had their weapons taken away
>and are confined to a U.S. base near Mahmoudiya.
>
>The allegations of rape could generate a particularly strong backlash
>in        Iraq, a conservative, strongly religious society in which
>many women will not even shake hands with men who are not close
>relatives.
>
>The case is among the most serious against U.S. soldiers allegedly
>involved in the deaths of Iraqi civilians. At least 14 U.S. troops have
>been convicted.
>
>Last week, seven Marines and one Navy medic were charged with
>premeditated murder in the shooting death of an Iraqi man near Fallujah
>west of Baghdad.
>
>U.S. officials are also investigating allegations that U.S. Marines
>killed two dozen unarmed Iraqi civilians Nov. 19 in the western town of
>Haditha in a revenge attack after a fellow Marine died in a roadside
>bombing.
>
>Other cases involve the deaths of three male detainees in Salahuddin
>province in May, the shooting death of unarmed Iraqi man near Ramadi in
>February, and the death of an Iraqi soldier after an interrogation in
>2003 at a detention camp in Qaim.
>
>The allegations have aroused public anger against the U.S. military
>presence at a time when the new Iraqi government and U.S. authorities
>are trying to reach out to disaffected Sunni Arabs to quell the
>insurgency and calm sectarian tensions.
>
>On Saturday, Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki leaves for a whirlwind trip
>to Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and the United Arab Emirates to seek support
>for his national reconciliation initiative, which includes an amnesty
>for the mostly Sunni insurgents.
>
>Al-Maliki is also expected to brief the Sunni leadership of those three
>countries on his efforts to deal with the divisions between Shiites and
>Sunnis. Iraq's neighbors in the Persian Gulf fear sectarian tensions
>will spill over into their countries, which are dominated by Sunnis but
>have large Shiite minorities.
>
>On Friday, radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr rejected al-Maliki's
>initiative because it does not include a timetable for the withdrawal
>of U.S.-led foreign troops.
>
>"We demand the occupation forces to leave the country, or at least a
>timetable should be set for their withdrawal," al-Sadr said during a
>sermon.
>
>Despite al-Maliki's efforts, there has been no letup in Iraq's
>violence. The U.S. military reported four more American service members
>have died, including a Marine killed Friday in fighting west of
>Baghdad. Three Army soldiers died in combat the day before, the
>military said.
>
>___
>
>AP correspondent Ryan Lenz is embedded with the 101st Airborne Division
>in Beiji, Iraq. He was previously embedded with the 502nd Infantry
>Regiment in Mahmoudiya. AP correspondent Lolita C. Baldor in Washington
>contributed to this report.



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Subject: Re: Singapore is doing Australians a BIG FAVOUR!!! (Re: An Australian thank Singapore)
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On Sat, 26 Nov 2005 23:29:35 +1100, "Just JT" 
wrote:
>"Daeron"  wrote:

>> As it happens, yes I am Australian so yes the drugs were intended for me
>> and my nation. But neither I nor my community want Nguyen to be executed
>> for trying to do this stupid and wicked thing for his brother.
>~~~~~~~~~~~~
>F*ck off and speak for yourself, bleeding heart lefty! I live am Australian 
>and I AM HAPPY THAT THIS SCUMBAG DRUG CARRIER NGUYEN WILL PAY FOR HIS LIFE. 
>Australia should REINTRODUCE the death penalty for heinous crimes such as 
>DRUG TRAFFICKING.

>> And I see no reason that Singapore should have to pay for his imprisonment
>> either, just because it managed to pickup this person in transit whom the
>> Australian customs may or may not have caught. I think it is only fair 
>> that
>> he be transported to Australia for Australia to pay the costs.
>~~~~~~~~~~~~
>F*CK OFF AGAIN. Our taxpayers' money is better spent on PROTECTING and 
>SUPPORTING LAW-ABIDING CITIZENS like you and me. These CRIMINALS SHOULD ALL 
>DIE DIE DIE!!

>SINGAPORE, I SALUTE YOU FOR EXECUTING THIS DRUG CARRIER!!!

Singapore must be thanked for saving taxpayers in Australia many
millions in costs and maintenance of this garbage creature.
Send Singapore a good present for Chinese New Year 29 January.

Be sure to include for immediate extermination, those judges who have
approved special rights for the AIDS-spreading fags, as well as judges
giving special deals for multiple murderers!!

In much of Europe, and the Middle East, such disease spreaders get
their just punishment, which in some cases merits the DP!

Tomorrow another drug dealer will get the Singapore Long Drop!!
HOORAY!!

On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 13:34:37 -0700, Ernst Zundholtz
 wrote:

>DP=Good Ways to Eliminate Garbage,especially AIDS-spreading fags, and multiple murderers!!

>This is an old article, which certainly is germane,
>since many US states, and foreign countries are
>starting to agree with the policies of Don Kool.

>There has been much discussion regarding the advantages
>of televising executions.

>A few more thoughts on the subject.

>The State can in fact auction off the rights to each and every
>execution. The proceeds thereof could be allocated to the
>VICTIMS of the criminals executed.

>The victims and their families should have the RIGHT to
>not only determine the method of execution, but should also
>have the right and privilege of executing the criminals themselves.

>Some of the types of criminals meriting execution,
>but not limited to such, would include:

>         AIDS spreaders
>         rapists
>         drug dealers
>         home invaders
>         armed robbers
>         pederasts and similar child molesters
>         crooked liars/lawyers
>         corrupt judges
>         corrupt politicians
>         insane anti-DP supporters such as despicable Desi??
>         members of parole boards allowing dangerous criminals free
>         useless psychiatrists & welfare staff responsible for
>              criminals being released

>Additional reasons for meriting the death penalty would include:

>any spreader of any disease,including STD - this would
>     obviously  include most faggots
>white collar criminals causing losses of more than 100,000
>     dollars  (just ask senior citizens who have been swindled,
>     how they would   exterminate those who preyed upon them!!)

>More suggestions for both categories are invited.

>Some popular methods for extermination of such vermin would include:

>         crucifixion, as recommended by intphase
>         vivisection
>         medical experiments without anaesthetic
>         target practice for police and military
>         beheading
>         hanging
>         barbecueing by electrocution
>         drawing & quartering
>         guillotining, very popular in France
>         flaying alive until dead
>         stoning to death - popular in some jurisdictions

>Suggestions are invited, on all the above points.


If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
then visit  www.freedomsite.org

Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

"At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth 
is a revolutionary act." 
(George Orwell)

David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'

"All truth passes through three stages. 
First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, 
and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
(Arthur Schopenhauer)

"The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely, 
but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak 
falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if 
they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
against them -- except force." -- John Bryant  

"To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an 
acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer 
and impossible to ignore."
--John Bryant

If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
then visit  www.freedomsite.org

Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

"At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth 
is a revolutionary act." 
(George Orwell)

David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'

"All truth passes through three stages. 
First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, 
and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
(Arthur Schopenhauer)

"The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely, 
but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak 
falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if 
they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
against them -- except force." -- John Bryant  

"To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an 
acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer 
and impossible to ignore."
--John Bryant


Posted by: 
Patrick Lee Humphrey
7500 Bellerive #1807
Houston, Texas 77036-3040
1-713-266-7764

Steven Horn (KCOM)
1836 NW 11th St
Oklahoma City, OK 73106
(405) 524-0576

together with
Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive & 
Henry 
CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even 
VISIT me at:
55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132

We all like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
We are together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
We like young children, so that we can train them our way.


Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
office: VISIT at:
#5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
or call: 1-250-616-9431

As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is 
called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material 
should give an indication as to the why.

"I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]

Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like 
a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
even if he or she were not naked"?
http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg

For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David
Michael's
detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and
is
known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a
grosvenor!! 
It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases,
just 
to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.

Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: Flavia18@verizon.net, especially
late nights.

Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or  
send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
work:(780)492-0473

And also: George Firestone: "George" 

Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!

For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
JEW-WATCH:
http://www.jewwatch.com

Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!

Or, other useful websites include:
ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
IHR - www.ihr.org
OSTARA - www.ostara.org
PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press, 
    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com

Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
They have lots of information, as well as books and records.

They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.

As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a 
victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.

In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
for many years around the world.

Reply-To: "George" 




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:27 EDT 2007
Article: 555564 of soc.culture.europe
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Newsgroups: uk.politics.misc,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.swiss,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.ukrainian,soc.culture.polish,soc.culture.palestine
Subject: Re:  Selling Slave-Sex in Israel- Filthy ZYDS - Repost
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On 27 Nov 2005 16:19:47 -0800, "Ariadne" wrote:
>Jason P wrote:
>> By Paula Amann

>> Washington Jewish Week/Jewsweek - 2001

>> http://www.jewsweek.com/society/059.htm

>> They come to Israel from the Ukraine, Russia, and Moldova looking for
>> freedom. Instead they are sold as sex slaves. And you thought Israel
>> was holy.

>> Jewsweek.com | Their names are Natalya, Oxana or Svetlana. They come to
>> Israel, as immigrants do, for a better life. But their dreams of
>> working as a waitress, nurse, or au pair turn nightmarish upon their
>> arrival.

>> Their fellow countryman who met them at the airport, speaking the
>> language of home, takes them to a locked apartment with barred windows
>> and a phone that only takes incoming calls, where they are forced to
>> provide sexual services to strangers.

>> Those who rebel risk being raped, beaten, or starved. Even those who
>> knew they were going into prostitution are shocked by the stark
>> conditions, the pay of roughly 20 shekalim ($5) a day or less for their
>> labor.

>> This disturbing story unfolds all too often at the hotline for Migrant
>> Workers, a Tel Aviv agency founded in 1998 to protect the human rights
>> of foreign workers, victims of sex trafficking among them. The hotline
>> takes as its motto the familiar line from Exodus 22:20: "You shall not
>> wrong a stranger or oppress him, for you were strangers in the land of
>> Egypt."

>> Agency director and co-founder Sigal Rozen, along with the group's
>> counsel, Nomi Levenkron, were in Washington, D.C., last week to give a
>> lecture at the Johns Hopkins Nitze School of Advanced International
>> Studies, to network and to speak with supporters. Among them are the
>> New Israel Fund, which has given the hotline a total of $19,000 during
>> the past year and a half.

>> In an interview, Rozen called sex trafficking an "unorganized crime,"
>> based largely on personal networks of immigrants from the Ukraine,
>> Russia, and Moldova.

>> "... "It's easier being a trafficker than being a plumber ..."   --Nomi
>> Levenkron

>> Those three countries alone accounted for 91 percent of the 474 women
>> arrested in brothels and deported from Israel in 2000, according to
>> figures compiled by hotline volunteers during visits to the Neveh
>> Tirzah women's prison.

>> These statistics represent only a fraction of the problem. Police
>> spokespersons have set the number of women brought into the country to
>> work in the sex industry at 2,000-3,000 annually, the number of
>> brothels at 250, Rozen said.

>> "It's Misha that knows Sasha that knows Vladimir," added Levenkron,
>> noting the economic incentive to be a pimp or work with one. "It's
>> easier being a trafficker than being a plumber."

>> One day she got a phone call from a rape crisis center where a woman
>> pleaded to be arrested and deported.

>> This young Moldovian had twice tried to escape her pimp and at 18, was
>> burned out on prostitution and just wanted to go home.

>> "She's so young and sweet," reflected Levenkron. "She came to Israel to
>> be a waitress."

>> A year ago this month, Israel passed the Law Against Trafficking Women.
>> Before that time, other laws existed against soliciting, pimping, and
>> running brothels.

>> Yet hotline staff point out that few pimps involved in trafficking ever
>> face a judge, with the majority of prostitutes deported without ever
>> facing a trial that might involve their testimony against their pimps.
>> Out of 459 women deported in 1998, only 35 cases went to trial; out of
>> 253 in 1999, a scant five ended up in the courtroom.

>> Judicial indifference is compounded by police complicity, Levenkron
>> argued.

>> The 18-year-old Moldovian, it turned out, had at one point in her
>> misadventures, found herself in a Tel Aviv police station where some of
>> the officers, who were her clients, recognized her and moved to call
>> her pimp.

>> Overhearing their plans, the woman fled and moved in with a
>> client-turned-boyfriend.

>> But somehow the pimp found her again, threatened the boyfriend. The
>> young woman, with no place to go, went back to the brothel. Now the
>> case hangs in the courts, where Levenkron has faint hopes for a
>> positive outcome.

>> The police role in such trafficking ranges from casual to highly
>> serious, she alleged.

>> "There are police who just come as clients, those who get special
>> discounts because of their good relationships with the owner of the
>> place and those that inform the owner about police operations,"
>> explained Levenkron.

>> One young Beersheva prostitute told the attorney she was forced to work
>> seven days a week unless a police raid was expected.

>> Widespread fear of violence from pimps has muted the public outcry, say
>> hotline staff. When Levenkron filed a suit on behalf of a
>> Beersheva-based woman, a 20-year-old Moldovian who had survived six
>> pimps and multiple rapes, several of the lawyer's friends came to her
>> home to bid her a final farewell, in anticipation of her imminent
>> death, she said.

>> INTERNATIONAL PROBLEM

>> Worldwide, trafficking in persons for domestic service, forced labor,
>> and prostitution ranks third after drugs and guns among the activities
>> of international crime, according to a congressional service report
>> released May 10, 2000. For comparison, about 50,000 people are brought
>> to the United States annually, the report stated.

>> The rise in trafficking seen over the 1990s was fueled by feeble
>> economies in source countries, such as the former Soviet Union and
>> Southeast Asia, along with weak penalties for traffickers, said a
>> government official familiar with these issues.

>> Last October, the United States passed its own law addressing this
>> problem, the Victims of Trafficking and Violence Protection Act, which
>> calls on the State Department to report annually on the scope of
>> trafficking in various countries and measures taken to combat it. The
>> report was due for release on June 1, but its publication has been
>> delayed.

>> In Israel today, official policy on trafficking is to arrest and deport
>> foreign sex workers. The women are held for an average of 30 days under
>> crowded and sometimes harsh conditions, longer if they testify in court
>> against their pimps, according to hotline data.

>> Rozen and Levenkron take issue with this approach. "Deporting women
>> doesn't make things better," said Levenkron. "I'm tired of shouting
>> this all over Israel so I've come here [to the United States] to shout
>> about it."

>> Rozen contends that a one-year work permit in specified fields such as
>> home health care or child care, before their return home, would put the
>> former prostitutes in a stronger position to take care of themselves.

>> Gruesome albeit unsubstantiated stories abound, she says, about revenge
>> attacks on returning women and their families by the original
>> trafficker in the home country.

>> A nest egg from a year's legitimate work, Rozen suggests, would allow
>> victims to re-establish themselves in a new community and stay out of
>> the clutches of traffickers in the future.

>> Meanwhile, Levenkron is seeking professional back-up in her job
>> representing the victims of trafficking.

>> "I am the [hotline] legal department," laments Levenkron. "We need
>> lawyers and we need public awareness."



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:28 EDT 2007
Article: 555727 of soc.culture.europe
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.russian:437448 soc.culture.french:457150 soc.culture.europe:555727 soc.culture.usa:1883723 alt.politics.europe:60722 uk.politics.misc:1746242
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.russian,soc.culture.french,soc.culture.france,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.usa,alt.politics.europe,uk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: French fraudsters make fake Beaujolais - Again!
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The frogs are known for doing this - faking their wines - every few
years, to get more millions of dollars from ignorant, stupid yanks!!

Guess the frenchies know that the yanks are continually stupid snobs,
but really slobs, and neither the government of France or that in the
US gives a damn.

Why not just boycott all products from France?

On Wed, 5 Jul 2006 17:55:44 -0400, "Oopla"
 wrote:

>The French were mixing crappy wine with more expensive ones. If you buy 
>French wine you won't know what you're getting.

>I suppose soon we'll be hearing how the French cheated to get into the World 
>Cup.

>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5152598.stm



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Newsgroups: alt.revisionism,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.europe,alt.politics.europe,soc.culture.german,soc.culture.swiss,soc.culture.palestine
Subject: Re: jews rush to extort money from Hungary
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Were these the Hungarian Jews who were saved by the Zionazi ZYD
KOLLABORATOR KASTNER?


On Fri, 7 Jul 2006 22:25:47 +0200, "Heinrich" 
wrote:

>Hundreds of Holocaust survivors flocked to Los Angeles' Jewish social 
>service agencies to get help as they rush to apply for a restitution program 
>offered by the Hungarian government.

>The paperwork must be postmarked and on its way to Budapest by July 31.

>The large turnout overwhelmed the legal service group Bet Tzedek, whose 
>officials hastily scheduled extra sessions to help with the complicated 
>paperwork. Officials there said they expected about 50 or so of the 
>approximately 10,000 Holocaust survivors in Los Angeles to sign up for the 
>sessions. Instead, five times as many have sought help.

>lol

>http://www.dailybreeze.com/news/regstate/articles/3284451.html

Subject: KASTNER Case=ZYD ACCOMPLICE WITH NAZIS [88]

Now there are at least another 50 documented cases like KASTNER, and
RUMKOWSKI!!
The ZHIDS COLLABORATED WITH NAZIS!!

Even the notorious Simon WIESENTHAL is proven to have been a nazi 
GESTAPO COLLABORATOR!!


On 24 Oct 2004 17:22:19 -0000, DerStuermer  wrote:

>Mamzer Kenneth McVay,SOBC, the well-known fag and mamser in Canada,
>Fag McVay of Vancouver, convicted of child molesting
>and car theft in California and Oregon, and still
>unemployed  gas pump boy, mastermind of the
>Canadian branch of NAMBLA, and now finally dying as a
>diseased AIDS-spreader,wants all to know about all
>his fellow ZHID criminals and perverts.
>Here is the latest.......
>
>From: Elias Davidsson (edavid@itn.is)
>Subject: Zionism. The Kastner case (1/2)
>Newsgroups: soc.culture.israel
>Date: 1997/07/12
>
>The Kastner Case
>-----------------
>
>Introduction
>
>Rather than answer every complaint in the same detail, we are taking
>up the issue which the VJBD has declared to be the most offensive of all
>and will show that on this question 'The documentation available is
>overwhelming and its message is thundering", just as Palestine Speaks
>claimed in one of the extracts complained about by the VJBD.
>
>Since the accusation of direct Zionist cooperation and assistance in
>the extermination of hundreds of thousands of Jewish people, and the
>accusation that this flowed logically from shared aims, are clearly the
>most 'extreme' and 'offensive' accusations of Nazi-Zionist collaboration
>broadcast on 3CR programs, we will deal with this first, and in greater detail.
>
>Since the 'Kastner case' is the subject of most of the broadcasts
>concerning collaboration which have been specifically complained
>about, we shall go into this in greatest detail, and have put some books
>in as evidence about it. Having answered the VJBD where its case appears
>strongest, and on the points to which it has given greatest emphasis,we
>hope it may become apparent to the Tribunal that things are not quite
>what they may have appeared before this inquiry began.
>
>The most notorious case of Nazi-Zionist collaboration is that
>involving Rudolf Kastner.
>
>Most Jewish people in Australia have never heard of Rudolf Kastner.
>Those who have, are generally under the impression that there is some
>'controversy' about negotiations he undertook for 'the purchase of
>Jewish lives for money and military equipment', but that he was 'fully
>rehabilitated' by the Supreme Court of Israel.
>
>That is exactly the line taken by Dr. John Foster, the Victorian
>Jewish Board of Deputies expert witness, in his evidence condemning
>3CR for anti-semitism.
>
>It is quite clear from this evidence, that Dr. Foster does not know
>anything at all about the Kastner case, since he does not even know
>what Kastner was accused of.
>
>This may not be his fault however, since one cannot read an accurate
>account of the Kastner case in any of the widely available works dealing
>with the Holocaust, either in bookshops or libraries. Apart from 3CR, the
>suppression of information has been so complete, that even an expert
>like Dr. Foster, specifically asked to give evidence on the matter, has
>been unable to find out what it is all about.
>
>The Accusations
>----------------
>Briefly, the accusations against Kastner are as follows:
>
>"Dr. Rudolf Verba, a Doctor of Science now serving at the British
>Medical Research Council, was one of the few escapees from Auschwitz.
>In his memoirs published in February, 1961, in the London Daily Herald,
>he wrote:
>
>'I am a Jew. In spite of that - indeed because of that - I accuse
>certain Jewish leaders of one of the most ghastly deeds of the war.
>
>This small group of quislings knew what was happening to their
>brethren in Hitler's gas chambers and bought their their own lives with
>the price of silence. Among them was Dr. Kastner, leader of the council
>which spoke for all Jews in Hungary. While I was prisoner number 44070 at
>Auschwitz - the number is still on my arm - I compiled careful statistics
>of the exterminations...I took these terrible statistics with me when I
>escaped in 1944 and I was able to give Hungarian Zionist leaders three weeks
>notice that Eichmann planned to send a million of their Jews to his gas
>chambers...Kastner went to Eichmann and told him, 'I know of your
>plans; spare some Jews of my choice and I shall keep quiet.'
>
>Eichmann not only agreed, but dressed Kastner up in S.S. uniform and
>took him to Belsen to trace some of his friends. Nor did the sordid
>bargaining end there.
>
>Kastner paid Eichmann several thousand dollars. With this little
>fortune, Eichmann was able to buy his way to freedom when Germany collapsed,
>to set himself up in the Argentine..."(Ben Hecht, op.cit. pp261-2)
>
>These accusations are confirmed by the 'Eichmann Confessions'
>published in Life magazine, 28 November and 5 December 1960:
>
>"I resolved to show how well a job could be done when the commander
>stands 100% behind it. By shipping the Jews off in a lightning operation,
>I wanted to set an example for future campaigns elsewhere...In obedience to
>Himmler's directive I now concentrated on negotiations with the Jewish
>political officials in Budapest...Among them Dr. Rudolph Kastner,
>authorized representative of the Zionist Movement. This Dr. Kastner
>was a young man about my age, an ice-cold lawyer and a fanatical Zionist.
>He agreed to help keep the Jews from resisting deportation - and even
>keep order in the collection camps - if I could close my eyes and let a
>few hundred or a few thousand young Jews emigrate illegally to Palestine.
>It was a good bargain. For keeping order in the camps, the price...was
>not too high for me.
>
>.We trusted each other perfectly. When he was with me, Kastner smoke
>cigarets as though he was in a coffeehouse. While we talked he would
>smoke one aromatic cigaret after another, taking them from a silver case
>and lighting them with a silver lighter. With his great polish and reserve
>he would have made an ideal Gestapo officer himself.
>
>Dr. Kastner's main concern was to make it possible for a select group
>of Hungarian Jews to emigrate to Israel...
>
>As a matter of fact, there was a very strong similarity between our
>attitudes in the S.S. and the viewpoint of these immensely idealistic
>Zionist leaders....I believe that Kastner would have sacrificed a
>thousand or a hundred thousand of his blood to achieve his political
>goal...'You can have the others', he would say, 'but let me have this
>group here'. And because Kastner rendered us a great service by helping
>keep the deportation camps peaceful, I would let his groups escape.
>After all, I was not concerned with small groups of a thousand or so Jews...
>That was the 'gentleman's agreement' I had with Kastner" (Hecht, ibid, p.26ö-61)
>
>Quite clearly these accusations, whether true or false, do not relate
>merely to 'the purchase of Jewish lives for money and military
>equipment', as Dr. Foster imagines, and the term 'collaboration' is the term
>that would apply. It seems unlikely that if Dr. Foster had known what the
>accusation actually was, he would have condemned 3CR saying 'In these
>circumstances, to talk of collaboration is malicious and absurd'.
>
>Are the accusations against Kastner true?
>
>According to the Government of Israel, they are a lie. When Malchiel
>Greenwald, a strongly pro-Zionist Israeli citizen published these
>accusations against Kastner, the Israeli Government did rather more
>than demand that his views should not be broadcast. Because a prominent
>Zionist official (Dr. Kastner was a spokesman for the Ministry of Trade and
>Industry) was involved, the Attorney General of the State of Israel
>prosecuted Greenwald for criminal libel.
>
>The Verdict
>------------
>Let the verdict of Judge Benjamin Halevi in Israel's District Court of
>Jerusalem speak for itself, given in criminal case No. 124 of 1953.
>The Attorney General v. Malchiel Greenwald. This material should be
>studied carefully, since a substantial extract from it, broadcast on 3CR,
>has been complained about by the VJBD as allegedly offensive to the Jewish
>community, likely to promote anti-semitism, likely to promote racism,
>in bad taste and contrary to common sense.
>
>It is the actual words used that are the subject of the Board's
>complaint, not the manner of their representation by 3CR. Presumably
>the Board itself was not aware just whose words they were when it made
>its' complaint, which shows how complete suppression of information can
>backfire on the censors themselves.
>
>Here then are excerpts from the verdict of Judge Halevi, who later
>became one of the panel of three judges that tried Eichmann:
>
>"The masses of Jews from Hungary's ghettos obediently boarded the
>deportation trains without knowing their fate. They were full of
>confidence in the false information that they were being transferred to
>Kenyermeze.
>
>The Nazis could not have misled the masses of Jews so conclusively had
>they not spread their false information through Jewish channels.
>
>The Jews of the ghettos would not have trusted the Nazi or Hungarian
>rulers. But they had trust in their Jewish leaders. Eichmann and
>others used this known fact as part of their calculated plan to mislead
>the Jews.
>They were able to deport the Jews to their extermination by the help
>of Jewish leaders.
>
>The false information was spread by the Jewish leaders. The local
>leaders of the Jews of Kluj and Nodvarod knew that other leaders were
>spreading such false information and did not protest.
>
>Those of the Jews who tried to warn their friends of the truth were
>persecuted by the Jewish leaders in charge of the local 'rescue work'.
>
>The trust of the Jews in the misleading information and their lack of
>knowledge that their wives, children and themselves were about to be
>deported to the gas chambers of Auschwitz led the victims to remain
>quiescent in their ghettos. It seduced them into not resisting or
>hampering the deportation orders.
>
>Dozens of thousands of Jews were guarded in their ghettos by a few
>dozen police. Yet even vigorous young Jews made no attemptt to overpower
>these few guards and escape to nearby Rumania. No resistance activities to
>the deportations were organized in these ghettos.
>
>And the Jewish leaders did everything in their power to soothe the
>Jews in the ghettos and to prevent such resistance activities.
>
>The same Jews who spread in Kluj and Nodvarod the false rumor of
>Kenyermeze, or confirmed it, the same public leaders who did not warn
>their own people against the misleading statements, the same Jewish leaders
>who did not organize any resistance or any sabotage of
>deportations...these same leaders did not join the people of their community
>in their ride to Auschwitz, but were all included in the Rescue train.
>
>The Nazi organizers of extermination and the perpetrators of
>extermination permitted Rudolf Kastner and the members of the Jewish Council
>in Budapest to save themselves, their relatives, and friends. The Nazis did
>this as a means of making the local Jewish leaders, whom they favoured,
>dependent on the Nazi regime, dependent on its good will during the time of
>its fatal deportation schedule. In short, the Nazis succeeded in bringing the
>Jewish leaders into oollaboration with the Nazis at the time of the
>catastrophe.
>
>The Nazi chiefs knew that the Zionists were a most vital element in
>Jewry and the most trusted by the Jews.
>
>The Nazis drew a lesson from the Warsaw ghetto and other belligerent
>ghettos. They learned that Jews were able to sell their lives very
>expensively if honorably guided.
>
>Eichmann did not want a second Warsaw. For this reason, the Nazis
>exerted themselves to mislead and bribe the Jewish leaders.
>
>The personality of Rudolph Kastner made him a convenient catspaw for
>Eichmann and his clique, to draw into collaboration and make their
>task easier.
>
>The question here is not, as stated by the Attorney General in his
>summation, whether members of the Jewish Rescue Committee were or were
>not capable of fulfilling their duty without the patronage of the S.S.
>chiefs.
>It is obvious that without such S.S. Nazi patronage the Jewish Rescue
>Committee could not have existed, and could have acted only as an
>underground.
>
>The question is, as put by the lawyer for the defense, why were the
>Nazis interested in the existence of the Rescue Committee? Why did
>the S.S. chiefs make every effort to encourage the existence of the
>Jewish Rescue Committee? Did the exterminators turn into rescuers?
>
>The same question rises concerning the rescue of prominent Jews by
>these German killers of Jews. Was the rescue of such Jews a part of
>the extermination plan of the killers ?
>
>The support given by the extermination leaders to Kastner's Rescue
>Committee proves that indeed there was a place for Kastner and his
>friends in their Final Solution for the Jews of Hungary - their total
>annihilation.
>
>The Nazi's patronage of Kastner, and their agreement to let him save
>six hundred prominent Jews, were part of the plan to exterminate the Jews.
>Kastner was given a chance to add a few more to that number. The bait
>attracted him. The opportunity of rescuing prominent people appealed
>to him greatly. He considered the rescue of the most important Jews as a
>great personal success and a success for Zionism. It was a success that
>would also justify his conduct - his political negotiation with Nazis and
>the Nazi patronage of his committee.
>
>When Kastner received this present from the Nazis, Kastner sold his
>soul to the German Satan. The sacrifice of the vital interests of the majority
>of the Jews, in order to rescue the prominents, was the basic element in the
>agreement between Kastner and the Nazis. This agreement fixed the division of
>the nation into two unequal camps: a small fragment of prominents, whom the
>Nazis promised Kastner to save, on the one hand, and the great majority of
>Hungarian Jews whom the Nazis designated for death, on the other hand.
>An imperative condition for the rescue of the first camp by the Nazis was that
>Kastner will not interfere in the action of the Nazis against the other camp
>and will not hamper them in its extermination. Kastner fulfilled this
>condition. He concentrated his efforts in the rescue of the prominents
>and treated the camp of the doomed as if they had already been wiped out
>from the book of the living.
>
>One cannot estimate the damage caused by Kastner's collaboration and
>put down the number of victims which it cost Hungarian Jews. These are not
>only the thousands of Jews in Nodvarod or any other community in the border
>area, Jews who could escape through the border, had the chief of their
>rescue committee fulfilled his duty toward them.
>
>All of Kastner's answers in his final testimony were a constant effort
>to evade this truth.
>
>Kastner has tried to escape through every crack he could find in the
>wall of evidence. When one crack was sealed in his face, he drated quickly
>to another."
>
>(Judgement of Judge Benjamin Halevi, Criminal Case 124/53; Attorney
>General
>v. Malchiel Greenwald, District Court, Jerusalem, June 22, 1955).
>
>Judge Halevi reverts to the meeting of Kastner with the S.S. officers
>Becher and Rudolf Hoess, commandant of Auschwitz at the time when the
>'new line' of rescuing Jews was revealed by Hoess. He says:
>
>"From this gathering in Budapest, it is obvious that the 'new line'
>stretched from Himmler to Hoess, from Jutner to Becher and Krumey.
>
>According to Kastner, however, these Nazis were all active in rescuing
>Jews.
>
>This meeting of these important German guests in Budapest exposes the
>'rescue' work of Becher in its true light. It reveals also the extent
>of Kastner's involvement in the inner circle of the chief German war
>criminals.
>
>Just as the Nazi war criminals knew they needed an alibi and hoped to
>achieve it by the rescue of a few Jews at the eleventh hour, so
>Kastner also needed an alibi for himself.
>
>Collaboration between the Jewish Agency Rescue Committee and the
>Exterminators of the Jews was solidifed in Budapest and Vienna.
>Kastner's duties were part and parcel of the genral duties of the S.S.
>
>In addition to its Extermination Department and Looting Department,
>the Nazi S.S. opened a Rescue Department headed by Kastner.
>
>All these extermination, robbery and rescue activities of the S.S.
>were coordinated under the management of Heinrich Himmler". (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi continues:
>
>"Kastner perjured himself knowingly in his testimony before this court
>when he denied he had interceded in Becher's hehalf. Moreover, he concealed
>the important fact that he interceded for Becher in the name of the Jewish
>Agency and the Jewish World Congress.
>
>As to the contents of Kastner's affidavit, it was enough for the
>defense to prove Becher was a war criminal. It was up to the prosecution to
>remove Becher from this status, if they wished to negate the affidavit.
>
>The Attorney General admitted in his summation that Becher was a war
>criminal.
>
>The lies in the contents of Kastner's affidavit, the lies in his
>testimony concerning the document, and Kastner's knowing participation in the
>activities of Nazi war criminals, and his participation in the last
>minute fake rescue activities - all these combine to show one overwhelming
>truth - that this affidavit was not given in good faith.
>
>Kastner knew well, as he himself testified, that Becher had never
>stood up against the stream of Jewish extermination, as Kastner has
>declared in the affidavit.
>
>The aims of Becher and his superior, Himmler, were not to save Jews
>but to serve the Nazi regime with full compliance. These is not truth
>and no good faith in Kastner's testimony, 'I never doubted for one moment
>the good intention of good Becher'.
>
>It is clear that the positive recommandation by Kastner, not only in
>his own name but also in the name of the Jewish Agency and the Jewish
>World Congress was of decisive importance for Becher. Kastner did not
>exaggerate when he said that Becher was released by the Allies because
>of his personal intervention. The lies in the affidavit of Kastner and the
>contradictions and various pretexts, which were proven to be lies, were
>sufficient to annul the value of his statements and to prove that there
>was no good faith in his testimony in favor of this German war criminal.
>Kastner's affidavit in favor of Becher was a willfully false affidavit
>given in favor of a war criminal to save him from trial and punishment
>in Nuremberg.
>
>Therefore, the defendant, Malchiel Greenwald, was correct in his
>accusations against Rudolf Kastner in the first, second and fourth of
>his statements." (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi's verdict found Malchiel Greenwald generally innocent of
>libel against Kastner, but fined him one Israeli pound for the one unproven
>accusation - that Kastner had actually collected money from his Nazi
>partners for his aide to their slaughter program. The judge also
>ordered the Government of Israel to pay Greenwald two hundred Israeli
>pounds as court costs.
>
>In fairness to Kastner it should me mentioned that as well as having
>been unpaid, it was never established that he ever wore S.S. uniform.
>
>Nevertheless, this verdict, and the evidence on which it was based,
>completely establishes the truth of everything said on 3CR about the
>matter.
>
>If the story ended there, it would only prove conclusively that the
>individual Kastner was a collaborator and the Israeli Government had
>attempted to defend him, although facts brought out in the trial
>pointed to much more than that.
>
>But the story does not end there.
>
>The Reaction
>-------------
>Public opinion in Israel was almost unanimous in demanding that
>Kastner and his associates should be put on trial. Remember that up to
>now it was Kastner's accuser who was on trial.
>
>The Communist Party newspaper Kol Ha'am (Voice of the People) wrote:
>
>"All those whose relatives were butchered by the Germans in Hungary
>know now clearly that Jewish hands helped the mass murder" (23 June 1955)
>
>In the authoritative Israeli newspaper Ha'aretz, the leading political
>journalist, Dr. Moshe Keren wrote:
>
>"Kastner must be brought to trial as a Nazi collaborator. And at this
>trial, Kastner should defend himself as a private citizen, and not be
>defended by the Israeli Government..." (14 July 1955).
>
>*Haboker*, the pro-Government General Zionist party paper stated:
>
>"The public wants to know the real facts about Kastner, and not about
>him alone. The only way to find out the truth is to put all the Rescue
>Committee people on trial and give them a chance to offer their
>defense." (23 June 1955)
>
>But public opinion was not quite unanimous. The problem with bringing
>Kastner and his associates to trial was that his associates were the
>Government of Israel.
>
>As the evening paper *Yedi'ot Aharonot* said:
>
>"If Kastner is brought to trial the entire government faces a total
>political and national collapse - as a result of what such a trial may
> disclose." (23 June 1955)
>
>Accordingly, the Government of Israel did not put Kastner on trial,
>instead it filed an appeal against the acquittal of Greenwald for criminal
>libel.
>
>As Dr. Karlebach wrote in Israel's largest evening newspaper,
>*Ma'ariv*:
>
>"What is going on here? The Attorney General has to mobilize all the
>government power, appear himself in court, to justify and defend
>collaboration with Himmler! And in order to defend a quisling, the
>government must drag through the streets one of the grimmest stories
>of our history!
>
>At 11 P.M. the verdict was given. At 11 A.M. next morning the
>government announces the defense of Kastner will be renewed - an appeal filed.
>What exemplary expediency! Since when does this government possess such
>lawyer-genius who can weigh in one night the legal chances of an
>appeal on a detailed, complex verdict of three hundred pages?! (24 June 1955)
>
>At the appeal hearings before the Supreme Court, the Attorney General
>of Israel, Chaim Cohen, explained clearly why the Government of Israel
>was defending Kastner so strongly:  "The man Kastner does not stand here
>as a private individual. He was a recognized representative, official or
>non-official of the Jewish National Institutes in Palestine and of the
>Zionist Executive; and I come here in this court to defend the
>representative of our national institutions." (Hecht, p. 268)
>
>The truth of this statement cannot be denied. Kastner's collaboration
>was not that of an individual. It was the collaboration of the Zionist
>leadership.
>
>So far, it has only been established that the Government of Israel
>continued to support a Nazi collaborator after the facts about his
>collaboration had been conclusively established in an Israeli court.
>But the story gets worse.
>
>The Supreme Court of Israel unanimously found that Becher was indeed a
>Nazi war criminal and that Kastner had without justification, and in the
>name of the Jewish Agency, helped Becher to escape justice. On this point
>Greenwald was acquitted of libel and Kastner was not 'fully rehabilitated'.
>
>The Supreme Court also accepted the FACTS established in the lower
>court - that Kastner DELIBERATELY concealed the truth about Auschwitz from the
>majority of Hungarian Jews in exchange for Nazi permission to take a
>thousand or so to Palestine. Again, Kastner was far from being 'fully
>rehabilitated'.
>
>The Majority Judgement
>-------------------------
>But now comes the really nasty bit. After unanimously acknowledging
>these FACTS, the Supreme Court of Israel, by a majority of three to two,
>found that Kastner's actions were MORALLY JUSTIFIABLE and convicted
>Greenwald of criminal libel for calling this 'collaboration'.
>
>In saying that 3CR broadcasts concealed the fact that Kastner had been
>fully rehabilitated by the Israeli Supreme Court, Dr. Foster is
>totally missing the point.
>
>Kastner's actions only proved that HE was a Nazi collaborator. It is
>the defense of these actions by the Government and Courts of Israel that
>prove conclusively that ZIONISM approves of Nazi collaboration.
>
>The majority of the Supreme Court of Israel did not REHABILITATE
>Kastner.
>They JOINED him.
>
>Let us read from the majority judgement of Supreme Court Judge Shlomo
>Chesin:
>
>"...What point was there in telling the people boarding the trains in
>Kluj, people struck by fate and persecuted, as to what awaits them at the
>end of their journey...Kastner spoke in detail of the situation, saying,
>'The Hungarian Jew was a branch which long ago dried up on the tree'. This
>vivid description coincides with the testimony of another witness about the
>Hungarian Jews, 'This was a big Jewish community in Hungary, without any
>ideological Jewish backbone' (Moshe Shweiger, a Kastner aide in Budapest,
>protocol 465).
>
>I fully agree with my friend, Judge Agranot, when he states that, 'The
>Jews of Hungary, including those in the countryside, were not capable,
>neither physically nor mentally, to carry out resistance operations with force
>against the deportation scheme'...From this point of view no rescue
>achievement could have resulted by disclosing the Auschwitz news to
>the Jewish leaders there, and this...is a consideration which on can
>properly conclude that Kastner had in front of his eyes.
>
>.And I take one more step. I am certain that the silence of Kastner
>when he arrived in Kluj was premeditated and calculated and did not result
>from his great dispair because of the helplessness of the Jewish community.
>Even then, I say, this is still not considered willful collaboration and
>assistance in the extermination, because all the signs indicate that
>Kastner's efforts were aimed at rescue and rescue on a big scale...And
>towards the end I take one last step. In doing so I go very far and
>say that even if Kastner ordered himself to keep silent knowingly, in
>submission to the strong will of the Nazis, in order to save a few
>Jews from Hell - this is still no proof that he stained his hands by
>collaborating with the enemies of his people and carrying out their
>plan to exterminate most of the Jewish community in Hungary.
>
>Even if, through these activities of his - or rather, his omission -
>the extermination became easier. And as to the moral issue, the question
>is not whether a man is allowed to kill many in order to save a few, or
>vice-versa. The question is altogether in another sphere and should be
>defined as follows: A man is aware that a whole community is awaiting
>its doom. He is allowed to make efforts to save a few, although part of
>his efforts involve concealment of truth from the many or should he
>disclose the truth to many though it is his best opinion that this way
>everybody will perish. I think that the answer is clear. What good will the
>blood of the few bring if everybody is to perish?...As I said, I am not arguing
>with the basic factual findings of the learned President of the Jewish
>District Court (Judge Halevi) but it seems to me, with all due respect, that
>his findings do not, as of necessity, demand the conclusion he has arrived
>at.
>That is to say, collaboration on the part of Kastner in the extermination
>of the Jews. And that they better coincide with bad leadership both
>from a moral and public point of view...
>
>In my opinion, one can say outright that if you find out that Kastner
>collaborated with the enemy because he did not disclose to the people
>who boarded the trains in Kluj that they were being led to extermination,
>one has to put on trial today Danzig, Herman, Hanzi, Brand, Revis and
>Marton, and many more leaders and half-leaders who gagged themselves in an
>hour of crisis and did not inform others of what was known to them and did not
>warn and did not cry out of the coming danger....
>
>Because of all this I cannot confirm the conclusion of the District Court
>with regard to the accusation that Greenwald has thrown on Kastner of
>collaboration with the Nazis in exterminating the Jewish people in
>Hungary during the last war." (Hecht, ibid, pp.270-2)
>
>In other words, the Court approved of Kastner's contempt for the
>Hungarian Jews and could not allow him to be condemned for doing exactly what
>many other Zionist leaders had half-leaders did - concealing their
>knowledge of the Nazi extermination plans so that Jews would board the trains to
>Auschwitz peacefully while their Zionist 'leaders' boarded a different
>train for Palestine.
>
>The Minority Judgement
>--------------------------
>It cannot be said that ALL top Zionists leaders actively approved of
>Nazi collaboration in this way. Indeed the most precise answer to this
>sickening judgement of Judge Chesin is provided in the minority judgement of
>Supreme Court Judge Moshe Silberg:
>
>"I do not say that he was the only man who possessed information among
>the leaders. It is quite possible that somebody else as well does not have
>a clear conscience with regards to this concealment. But we are dealing
>here with the guilt of Kastner and we do not have to make judgements on the
>guilt of others....
>
>The declaration of the learned Attorney General therefore shrinks into
>an opinion....'Kastner was convinced and believed that there was no ray
>of hope for the Jews of Hungary, almost for none of them, and as he, as a
>result of his personal dispair, did not disclose the secret of the
>extermination in order not to endanger or frustrate the rescue of the
>few - therefore he acted in good faith and should not be accused of
>collaborating with the Nazis in expediting the extermination of the Jews,
>even though, in fact, he brought about its result.'
>
>I am compelled to state that it is very difficult for me to conceive
>such an intention. Is this good faith? Can a single man, even in
>cooperation with some of his friends, yield to despair on behalf and
>without the knowledge of 800,000 other people? This is, in my opinion, the
>decisive consideration in the problem facing us. The charge emanating from
>the testimony of the witnesses against Kastner is that had they known of
>the Auschwitz secret, then thousands or tens of thousands would have been
>able to save their lives by local, partial, specific or indirect rescue
>operations like local revolts, resistance, escapes, hidings,
>concealment of children with Gentiles, forging of documents, ransom money,
>bribery, etc - and when this is the case and when one deals with many hundreds
>of thousands, how does a human being, a mortal, reject with complete
>certainty and with an extreme 'no' the efficiency of all the many and varied
>rescue ways? How can he examine the tens of thousands of possibilities? Does
>he decide instead of God? Indeed, he who can act with such a usurpation
>of the last hope of hundreds of thousands is not entitled to claim good faith
>as his defense. The penetrating question quo warrento is a good answer to
>a claim of such good faith...
>
>If the superintendent of a big hospital lets thousands of sick people
>die so that he may devote himself to the sure rescue of one soul, he will
>come out guilty, at least morally, even if it is proven that he as an
>individual erroneously thought that there was no hope of saving the other
>patients. He is a collaborator with the angel of death.
>
>Either a complete atrophy of the soul or a blind involvement with
>complete loss of senses and proportion in his small but personal rescue
>operation could bring a man to such a gigantic, hazardous play.
>
>And if all this is not enough to annul the claim of good faith which
>was put before us on behalf of Kastner by the Attorney General, then
>Kastner himself comes and annuls it altogether. Not only did he never make
>this claim, but his own words prove the contrary. He writes in his report
>to the Jewish Agency that the Committee sent emissaries to many ghettos in
>the countryside and pleaded with them to organize escapes and to refuse to
>board the trains. And though the story of these pleadings is untrue,
>and the silence of Kastner in Kluj is proven, the very uttering of these
>statements entirely contradicts the claim that Kastner had concealed
>the news about the fate of the ghetto inmates in good faith and only as a
>result of his complete despairing of the chances of escaping or
>resisting the Germans. You can not claim at the same time helplessness and
>activity.
>Anyway, such a claim is not convincing...
>
>We can sum up with three facts:
>A. That the Nazis didn't want to have a great revolt - 'Second Warsaw'
>- nor small revolts, and their passion was to have the extermination
>machine working smoothly without resistance. This fact was known to Kastner
>from the best source - from Eichmann himself - And he had additional proofs
>of that when he witnessed all the illusionary and misleading tactics
>which were being taken by the Nazis from the first moment of occupation.
>B. That the most efficient means to paralyze the resistance with - or
>the escape of a victim is to conceal from him the plot of the coming
>murder.
>This fact is known to every man and one does not need any proof of
>evidence for this.
>C. That he, Kastner, in order to carry out the rescue plan for the few
>prominents, fulfilled knowingly and without good faith the said desire
>of the Nazis, thus expediting the work of exterminating the masses.
>
>And also the rescue of Becher by Kastner...He who is capable of
>rescuing this Becher from hanging proves that the atrocities of this great
>war criminal were not so horryfying or despicable in his eyes...I couldn't
>base the main guilt of Kastner on this fact had it been alone, but when it
>is attached even from afar to the whole scene of events it throws
>retroactive light on the whole affair and serves as a dozen proofs of our
>conclusion." (Supreme Court Judge, Moshe Silberg, 1957)
>
>Conclusion
>-----------
>If that had been the majority judgement, one could say that whatever
>their attitudes to the Arabs, and whatever their past behaviour might have
>been under pressure, the Zionist leadership today did not advocate
>collaboration with the Nazis.
>
>One could then at least understand the complaints by Mr. Bloch,
>President of the Victorian Jewish Board of Deputies, about the 'dragging in
>of alleged episodes in the history of Jewish/Nazi relationships'.
>
>But Judge Silberg's judgement was that of a minority.
>
>The Kastner case is therefore not an alleged episode in past history,
>being 'dragged in' to discredit an opponent.
>
>It is a continuing controversy in which the top Zionist leadership of
>Israel stand indicted of continuing to publicly defend collaboration
>with the Nazis in the extermination of Jews.
>
>Despite the unanimous finding of the Supreme Court of Israel that Kurt
>Becher was a major war criminal, the Jewish Agency (World Zionist
>Organization) refused to withdraw the fraudulent certificate Kastner
>gave on their behalf, which saved Becher from hanging, and allowed him to
>remain a free man in West Germany, the head of several corporations and with
>an estimated personal worth of $30 million.
>
>Becher has even used his certification as a 'good' SS officer to give
>evidence in support of his associates at other war crimes trials in
>West Germany.
>
>Since the prosecution, representing the Israeli Government agreed with
>the Supreme Court that Becher was a major war criminal, one can only
>presure that the Israeli Government did not want him put on trial for
>fear of what might come out.
>
>Likewise, none of Kastner's associates on the Zionist Relief and
>Rescue Committee or his bosses in the Jewish Agency have ever been put on
>trial as demanded by Israeli public opinion. Let alone the hundreds of
>'prominents' who helped Kastner to reassure the Hungarian Jews that they
>were going to Kenyermeze and not Auschwitz, in exchange for tickets on
>the one train that took them eventually to Palestine.
>
>As for Kastner himself, he will cause no further embarassment to the
>Zionist leadership with his undisputed claims that everything he did
>was approved by the Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) leadership
>in Palestine. He is, as Dr. Foster so delicately puts it, 'now dead'. Or
>putting it less delicately, on 3 March 1957 he was shot by Zeer
>Eckstein - immediately after the appeal hearings were concluded, and
>before the judgement 'rehabilitating' him was delivered. Eckstein was
>not a Hungarian avenger. He was a paid undercover agent of the Israeli
>secret service.
>(Hecht, ibid., p.208. Another 'fantastic allegation' no doubt; but
>admitted in court during the murder trial).
>
>Clearly this issue has a major indirect relevance to the Arab-Israeli
>dispute. Apart from countering Israel's cynical use of the holocaust
>as a propaganda weapon, it answers a very real concern that many people
>have about the State of Israel and the Jews. This concern is whether,
>if Jews had a State of their own during the holocaust many more could
>have been saved, and whether this is not an essential future consideration,
>at least as an insurance policy.
>
>The facts of the Kastner case show that the very existence of the
>Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) was an actual help to the Nazis
>and that more could have been saved if the Zionist movement had not
>existed.
>Having a State that approves of actions like those of Kastner for an
>insurance policy, is like using petro for a fire extinguisher.
>
>Zionism is not the answer to anti-semitism, but a cowardly proposal to
>run away from it. The only answer to anti-semitism is to fight back.
>
>We shall go on to prove this in detail.
>-------------------------------------------------------------------
>Elias Davidsson - Oldugata 50 - 101 Reykjavik - Iceland
>Tel. (354)-552-6444     Fax: (354)-552-6579
>Email: edavid@itn.is     URL:  http://www.nyherji.is/~edavid


If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
then visit  www.freedomsite.org

Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

"At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth 
is a revolutionary act." 
(George Orwell)

David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'

"All truth passes through three stages. 
First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, 
and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
(Arthur Schopenhauer)

"The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely, 
but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak 
falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if 
they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
against them -- except force." -- John Bryant  

"To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an 
acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer 
and impossible to ignore."
--John Bryant


Posted by: 
Patrick Lee Humphrey
7500 Bellerive #1807
Houston, Texas 77036-3040
1-713-266-7764

Steven Horn (KCOM)
1836 NW 11th St
Oklahoma City, OK 73106
(405) 524-0576

together with
Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive & 
Henry 
CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even 
VISIT me at:
55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132

We all like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
We are together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
We like young children, so that we can train them our way.


Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
office: VISIT at:
#5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
or call: 1-250-616-9431

As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is 
called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material 
should give an indication as to the why.

"I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]

Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like 
a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
even if he or she were not naked"?
http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg

For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David
Michael's
detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and
is
known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a
grosvenor!! 
It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases,
just 
to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.

Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: Flavia18@verizon.net, especially
late nights.

Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or  
send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
work:(780)492-0473

And also: George Firestone: "George" ,
and davejoll@ihug.co.nz.

Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!

For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
JEW-WATCH:
http://www.jewwatch.com

Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!

Or, other useful websites include:
ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
IHR - www.ihr.org
OSTARA - www.ostara.org
PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press, 
    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com

Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
They have lots of information, as well as books and records.

They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.

As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a 
victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.

In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
for many years around the world.

Reply-To: "George"
,
or to Art@Arthurian.com
Feel free to subscribe us to maillists for sex, homosexuals and the
like.

~~




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:31 EDT 2007
Article: 555952 of soc.culture.europe
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: rec.travel.usa-canada,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.palestine,soc.culture.polish
Subject: Re: STUDY IN CANADA WITHOUT TOEFL / IELTS / GMAT / GRE = SCAM!! - Repost
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <1117131759.151147.175750@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>  <059eb1d2oelkdocgrpmckn01g7pvcooco3@4ax.com> 
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On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 20:17:38 GMT, JamesD  wrote:

George is completely correct on all points
The original posting smells like a swindle on stupid people from
abroad.

>>On Mon, 30 May 2005 10:35:32 -0600, George  
>>wrote:

It sure smells like a swindle, since reputable Canadian schools and
universities NEVER USE recruiting firms!! As for them claiming to
represent 51 such institutions, which is almost all there are in
Canada, take it with a bucket of fertiliser!!

Immigration consultants need to be registered with Canada Immigration,
but this firm does not seem to have a listing with the government of
Canada!

Their claim that "demanding programs that lead you to immigration are
as below" is pure poppycock, since the immigration requirements change
monthly, depending on job vacancies that are unfilled by residents in
Canada!!

IN OTHER WORDS, SAVE YOUR MONEY, AND TIME, BY AVOIDING SCAM 
ARTISTS AND SWINDLERS.

IF YOU MUST CONSIDER EMIGRATING TO CANADA, THEN GET ALL THE
INFORMATION FOR FREE, FROM YOUR NEAREST CANADA CONSUL, OR EMBASSY,
 OR HIGH COMMISSION.


>>>On 26 May 2005 11:22:39 -0700, rgarg@zeeinfotech.com wrote:
>>>
>>>>Dear Prospective Students,
>>>
>>>>Looking for Graduate/Under Graduate/PG Diploma/Diploma/High School
>>>>Programs in Canada!
>>>
>>>>We would like to introduce Zee InfoTech Inc, Overseas Education and
>>>>Immigration consultants of Canada. Located in the Beautiful British
>>>>Columbia, Canada "Zee InfoTech Inc. is bound by strict professional
>>>>standards of practice". Our Head Office is located in Coquitlam,
>>>>BC's most prime location with average daily MBA/MSc/Diploma/High
>>>>Schooling enrolment of 4-5 students from across the world.
>>>
>>>>Zee InfoTech Inc. is representing more than 51 colleges and
>>>>Universities of Canada to recruit overseas students. We would like to
>>>>enrol all the prospective students for MBA/MSc/Diploma/High Schooling
>>>>Program or other Graduate and Post Graduate Programs at Canadian
>>>>Colleges/Universities who are willing to pursue their further studies
>>>>in Canada.
>>>
>>>>The highest demanding programs that lead you to Immigration are as
>>>>below:-
>>>>
>>>>·           Master in Business Administration
>>>>
>>>>·           Master in Computer Science
>>>>
>>>>·           Bachelor in Computer Science
>>>>
>>>>·           Bachelor in Business Administration
>>>>
>>>>·           Advanced Business Management and E-Commerce
>>>>
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>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>·           Practical Nursing
>>>>
>>>>·           Pharmacy Technician
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>>>>
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>>>>·           Tourism Hospitality Management and Business Management
>>>>and E-Com.
>
>>>>·           Tourism Hospitality Management and Professional Buss.
>>>>Management
>
>>>>·           Network Systems Analyst
>
>>>>·           Multimedia Design and Communication
>
>>>>·           More than 100 other Diploma/Under Graduate and Graduate
>>>>Program are available.
>
>>>>We are recruiting International students now for September 2005 Intake.
>
>>>>To register, please contact us by phone or email or Apply
>>>>Online........



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:31 EDT 2007
Article: 555958 of soc.culture.europe
Xref: sn-us pl.soc.polityka:1034986 soc.culture.polish:725965 alt.politics.europe:60805 soc.culture.europe:555958 soc.culture.swiss:63807 soc.culture.german:364739 soc.culture.russian:437738
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: pl.soc.polityka,soc.culture.polish,alt.politics.europe,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.swiss,soc.culture.german,soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: KATYN=MURDERS OF  POLISH  BY ZYDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! Like Vinnitsa!! NEVER  FORGET!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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With even the Soviets forced to admit that it was their ZYD NKVD who
did the murders at KATYN, why are you apologising for them?

Historians and experts proved it was NOt the Germans!

Were you one of the killers, or perhaps your father, uncle or?


On Sat, 8 Jul 2006 11:54:59 -0700, "Peter Wielki" 
wrote:

>Actually, in Katyn there were Russians and Ukraninians that did the crime, 
>as far as I know.
>
>But yeah, let's blame it on JEWS!!!  Germans did it too, right Frankie?


>"Frank Arthur"  wrote in message 
>news:ummva2ddrk9aik6jnqimp9mseb9b5ap4g1@4ax.com...
>> True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZYDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary of 
>> the
>> discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland 
>> had
>> been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated to 
>> The
>> Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis, who
>> invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely used 
>> the
>> word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler learned, 
>> as
>> dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers from a 
>> single
>> narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: its intent was 
>> to
>> eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its perceived
>> guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the
>> exiled Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn, 
>> outside
>> Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and
>> the terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the 
>> relationship
>> between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him, 
>> awarding
>> him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his future murder 
>> victims.
>> And when Stalin jested that they should settle the German problem once and 
>> for
>> all by killing 50,000 German officers, Churchill merely protested sulkily, 
>> and
>> Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one 
>> by
>> which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three knew 
>> of
>> the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, all 
>> three -
>> two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich 
>> five
>> years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn: once
>> Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with almost
>> anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn into 
>> the
>> diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan Government 
>> in
>> the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a memorial in London to the
>> victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>>>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>>>Katyn
>>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>>>of Poland.
>>
>>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>>>in 1940.
>>
>>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>>>Russia.
>>
>>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>>>FBI.
>>
>>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>>>of them did.
>>
>>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>>>killings.
>>
>> ISRAEL REFUSED TO PROSECUTE THESAE ZHID MURDERERS!!
>>
>>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>>>decided.
>>
>>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>>>feeling.
>>
>>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews/ZHIDS  isn't surprising. What is
>>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>> ++++++++++++++
>>
>> American Renaissance
>> http://www.amren.com
>>
>> Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>> http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>> Euro-American Students Union
>> http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>> Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>> http://www.14words.com
>>
>> National Alliance
>> http://www.natvan.com
>>
>> Stormfront
>> http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>> Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>> http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>>
>> First,let us kill all the lawyers! - W.Shakespeare
>> First, we get rid of all the politicians! - Mao tse Dung
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled-as fertiliser!!
>> Me
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Newsgroups:
>> pl.regionalne.krakow,pl.regionalne.lodz,pl.regionalne.warszawa,soc.culture.polish,alt.politics.europe
>> Subject: KATYN=MURDERS BY ZHIDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZHIDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:
>> soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary
>> of the discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland
>> had been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated
>> to The Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis,
>> who invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely
>> used the word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler
>> learned, as dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers
>> from a single narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: 
>> its
>> intent was to eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its
>> perceived guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the exiled
>> Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn,
>> outside Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. 
>> A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and the
>> terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the
>> relationship between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him,
>> awarding him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his
>> future murder victims. And when Stalin jested that they should settle the
>> German problem once and for all by killing 50,000 German officers, 
>> Churchill
>> merely protested sulkily, and Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing
>> only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one
>> by which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three
>> knew of the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, 
>> all
>> three - two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to
>> those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich
>> five years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn:
>> once Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with
>> almost anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn
>> into the diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan
>> Government in the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a
>> memorial in London to the victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>> >>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>> >>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>> >>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>> >>>>Katyn
>>> >>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>> >>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>> >>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>> >>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>> >>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>> >>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>> >>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>> >>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>> >>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>> >>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>> >>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>> >>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>> >>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>> >>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>> >>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>> >>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>> >>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>> >>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>> >>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>> >>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>> >>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>> >>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>> >>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>> >>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>> >>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>> >>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>> >>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>> >>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>> >>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>> >>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>> >>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>> >>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>> >>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>> >>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>> >>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>> >>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>> >>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>> >>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>> >>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>> >>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>> >>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>> >>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>> >>>>of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>> >>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>> >>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>> >>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>> >>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>> >>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>> >>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>> >>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>> >>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>in 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>> >>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>> >>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>> >>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>> >>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>> >>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>> >>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>> >>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>> >>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>> >>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>> >>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>> >>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>> >>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>> >>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>> >>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>> >>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>> >>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>> >>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>> >>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>> >>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>> >>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>> >>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>> >>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>> >>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>> >>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>> >>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>> >>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>> >>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>> >>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>> >>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>> >>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>> >>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>> >>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>> >>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>> >>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>> >>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>> >>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>> >>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>> >>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>> >>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>> >>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>> >>>>Russia.
>>
>>> >>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>> >>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>> >>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>> >>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>> >>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>> >>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>> >>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>> >>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>> >>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>> >>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>> >>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>> >>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>> >>>>FBI.
>>
>>> >>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>> >>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>> >>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>> >>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>> >>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>> >>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>> >>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>> >>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>> >>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>> >>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>> >>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>> >>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>> >>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>> >>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>> >>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>> >>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>> >>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>> >>>>of them did.
>>
>>> >>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>> >>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>> >>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>> >>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>> >>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>> >>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>> >>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>> >>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>> >>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>> >>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>> >>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>> >>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>> >>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>> >>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>> >>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>> >>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>> >>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>> >>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>> >>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>> >>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>> >>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>> >>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>> >>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>> >>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>> >>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>> >>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>> >>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>> >>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>> >>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>> >>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>> >>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>> >>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>> >>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>> >>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>> >>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>> >>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>> >>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>> >>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>> >>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>> >>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>> >>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>> >>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>> >>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>> >>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>> >>>>killings.
>>
>>> >>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>> >>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>> >>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>> >>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>> >>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>> >>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>> >>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>> >>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>> >>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>> >>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>> >>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>> >>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>> >>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>> >>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>> >>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>> >>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>> >>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>> >>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>> >>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>> >>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>> >>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>> >>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>> >>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>> >>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>> >>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>> >>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>> >>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>> >>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>> >>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>> >>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>> >>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>> >>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>> >>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>> >>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>> >>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>> >>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>> >>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>> >>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>> >>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>> >>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>> >>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>> >>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>> >>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>> >>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>> >>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>> >>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>> >>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>> >>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>> >>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>> >>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>> >>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>> >>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>> >>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>> >>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>> >>>>decided.
>>
>>> >>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>> >>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>> >>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>> >>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>> >>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>> >>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>> >>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>> >>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>> >>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>> >>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>> >>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>> >>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>> >>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>> >>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>> >>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>> >>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>> >>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>> >>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>> >>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>> >>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>> >>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>> >>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>> >>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>> >>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>> >>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>> >>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>> >>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>> >>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>> >>>>feeling.
>>
>>> >>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews isn't surprising. What is
>>> >>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>> >>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>> >>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>> >>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>> >>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>> >>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>> >>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>> >>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>> >>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>> >>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>> >>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>> >>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>> >>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>> >>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>> >>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>> >>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>>> >>>>++++++++++++++
>>
>>> >>>>American Renaissance
>>> >>>>http://www.amren.com
>>
>>> >>>>Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>>> >>>>http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>>> >>>>Euro-American Students Union
>>> >>>>http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>>> >>>>Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>>> >>>>http://www.14words.com
>>
>>> >>>>National Alliance
>>> >>>>http://www.natvan.com
>>
>>> >>>>Stormfront
>>> >>>>http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>>> >>>>Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>>> >>>>http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>> I like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, PAMYAT, HAMAS or Aryan Nations,etc.
>>
>> CALL late nights best, or even VISIT me:
>> Donald Ray Ellis
>> aka Pat Blakely/RevWhite/Mike Kalvatis/Rob Stewart ET AL
>> 108 E. Victory Street
>> Star City, Arkansas 71667
>> Tel: (870) 628-1437
>> Email: voiceofreason@blakely.harrogate.net
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> Posted by:
>> Patrick Lee Humphrey
>> 7500 Bellerive #1807
>> Houston, Texas 77036-3040
>> 1-713-266-7764
>>
>> Steven Horn (KCOM)
>> 1836 NW 11th St
>> Oklahoma City, OK 73106
>> (405) 524-0576
>>
>> together with
>>
>> Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive &
>> Henry who like
>> late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>>
>> CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
>> Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even
>> VISIT me at:
>> 55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132
>>
>>
>> Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
>> office: VISIT at:
>> #5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
>> Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
>> or call: 1-250-616-9431
>>
>> As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is
>> called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material
>> should give an indication as to the why.
>>
>> "I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
>> proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
>> yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
>> seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
>> my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
>> moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
>> http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
>> also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]
>>
>> Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like
>> a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
>> even if he or she were not naked"?
>> http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg
>>
>> For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
>> background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David Michael's
>> detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and is
>> known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a grosvenor!!
>> It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases, just
>> to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.
>>
>> Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
>> NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
>> Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: FlaviaR@verizon.net, especially late 
>> nights.
>>
>> Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
>> Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
>> I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or
>> send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
>> work:(780)492-0473
>>
>> And also: George Firestone: "George" 
>>
>> Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
>> Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!
>>
>> For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
>> JEW-WATCH:
>> http://www.jewwatch.com
>>
>> Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
>> NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
>> people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Or, other useful websites include:
>> ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
>> IHR - www.ihr.org
>> OSTARA - www.ostara.org
>> PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
>> Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
>> AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
>> THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press,
>>    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
>>    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com
>>
>> Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
>> They have lots of information, as well as books and records.
>>
>> They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
>> and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.
>>
>> As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a
>> victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
>> of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
>> May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.
>>
>> In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
>> for many years around the world.
>>
>> Reply-To: "George" 
>>
>> _________________________________________
>> Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>> More than 140,000 groups
>> Unlimited download
>> http://www.usenetzone.com to open account 
>



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:35 EDT 2007
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Subject: Re: KATYN=MURDERS OF  POLISH  BY ZYDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! Like Vinnitsa!! NEVER  FORGET!
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With even the Soviets forced to admit that it was their ZYD NKVD who
did the murders at KATYN, why are you apologising for them?

Historians and experts proved it was NOt the Germans!

Were you one of the killers, or perhaps your father, uncle or?


On Sat, 8 Jul 2006 11:54:59 -0700, "Peter Wielki" 
wrote:

>Actually, in Katyn there were Russians and Ukraninians that did the crime, 
>as far as I know.
>
>But yeah, let's blame it on JEWS!!!  Germans did it too, right Frankie?


>"Frank Arthur"  wrote in message 
>news:ummva2ddrk9aik6jnqimp9mseb9b5ap4g1@4ax.com...
>> True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZYDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary of 
>> the
>> discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland 
>> had
>> been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated to 
>> The
>> Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis, who
>> invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely used 
>> the
>> word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler learned, 
>> as
>> dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers from a 
>> single
>> narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: its intent was 
>> to
>> eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its perceived
>> guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the
>> exiled Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn, 
>> outside
>> Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and
>> the terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the 
>> relationship
>> between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him, 
>> awarding
>> him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his future murder 
>> victims.
>> And when Stalin jested that they should settle the German problem once and 
>> for
>> all by killing 50,000 German officers, Churchill merely protested sulkily, 
>> and
>> Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one 
>> by
>> which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three knew 
>> of
>> the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, all 
>> three -
>> two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich 
>> five
>> years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn: once
>> Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with almost
>> anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn into 
>> the
>> diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan Government 
>> in
>> the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a memorial in London to the
>> victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>>>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>>>Katyn
>>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>>>of Poland.
>>
>>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>>>in 1940.
>>
>>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>>>Russia.
>>
>>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>>>FBI.
>>
>>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>>>of them did.
>>
>>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>>>killings.
>>
>> ISRAEL REFUSED TO PROSECUTE THESAE ZHID MURDERERS!!
>>
>>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>>>decided.
>>
>>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>>>feeling.
>>
>>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews/ZHIDS  isn't surprising. What is
>>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>> ++++++++++++++
>>
>> American Renaissance
>> http://www.amren.com
>>
>> Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>> http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>> Euro-American Students Union
>> http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>> Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>> http://www.14words.com
>>
>> National Alliance
>> http://www.natvan.com
>>
>> Stormfront
>> http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>> Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>> http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>>
>> First,let us kill all the lawyers! - W.Shakespeare
>> First, we get rid of all the politicians! - Mao tse Dung
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled-as fertiliser!!
>> Me
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Newsgroups:
>> pl.regionalne.krakow,pl.regionalne.lodz,pl.regionalne.warszawa,soc.culture.polish,alt.politics.europe
>> Subject: KATYN=MURDERS BY ZHIDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZHIDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:
>> soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary
>> of the discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland
>> had been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated
>> to The Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis,
>> who invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely
>> used the word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler
>> learned, as dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers
>> from a single narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: 
>> its
>> intent was to eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its
>> perceived guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the exiled
>> Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn,
>> outside Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. 
>> A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and the
>> terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the
>> relationship between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him,
>> awarding him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his
>> future murder victims. And when Stalin jested that they should settle the
>> German problem once and for all by killing 50,000 German officers, 
>> Churchill
>> merely protested sulkily, and Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing
>> only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one
>> by which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three
>> knew of the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, 
>> all
>> three - two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to
>> those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich
>> five years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn:
>> once Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with
>> almost anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn
>> into the diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan
>> Government in the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a
>> memorial in London to the victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>> >>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>> >>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>> >>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>> >>>>Katyn
>>> >>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>> >>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>> >>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>> >>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>> >>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>> >>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>> >>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>> >>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>> >>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>> >>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>> >>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>> >>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>> >>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>> >>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>> >>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>> >>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>> >>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>> >>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>> >>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>> >>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>> >>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>> >>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>> >>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>> >>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>> >>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>> >>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>> >>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>> >>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>> >>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>> >>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>> >>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>> >>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>> >>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>> >>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>> >>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>> >>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>> >>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>> >>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>> >>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>> >>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>> >>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>> >>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>> >>>>of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>> >>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>> >>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>> >>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>> >>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>> >>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>> >>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>> >>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>> >>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>in 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>> >>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>> >>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>> >>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>> >>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>> >>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>> >>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>> >>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>> >>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>> >>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>> >>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>> >>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>> >>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>> >>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>> >>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>> >>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>> >>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>> >>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>> >>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>> >>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>> >>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>> >>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>> >>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>> >>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>> >>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>> >>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>> >>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>> >>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>> >>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>> >>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>> >>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>> >>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>> >>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>> >>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>> >>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>> >>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>> >>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>> >>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>> >>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>> >>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>> >>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>> >>>>Russia.
>>
>>> >>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>> >>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>> >>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>> >>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>> >>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>> >>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>> >>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>> >>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>> >>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>> >>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>> >>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>> >>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>> >>>>FBI.
>>
>>> >>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>> >>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>> >>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>> >>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>> >>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>> >>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>> >>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>> >>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>> >>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>> >>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>> >>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>> >>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>> >>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>> >>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>> >>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>> >>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>> >>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>> >>>>of them did.
>>
>>> >>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>> >>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>> >>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>> >>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>> >>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>> >>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>> >>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>> >>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>> >>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>> >>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>> >>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>> >>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>> >>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>> >>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>> >>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>> >>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>> >>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>> >>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>> >>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>> >>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>> >>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>> >>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>> >>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>> >>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>> >>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>> >>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>> >>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>> >>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>> >>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>> >>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>> >>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>> >>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>> >>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>> >>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>> >>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>> >>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>> >>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>> >>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>> >>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>> >>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>> >>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>> >>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>> >>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>> >>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>> >>>>killings.
>>
>>> >>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>> >>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>> >>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>> >>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>> >>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>> >>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>> >>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>> >>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>> >>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>> >>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>> >>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>> >>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>> >>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>> >>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>> >>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>> >>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>> >>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>> >>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>> >>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>> >>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>> >>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>> >>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>> >>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>> >>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>> >>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>> >>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>> >>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>> >>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>> >>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>> >>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>> >>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>> >>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>> >>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>> >>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>> >>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>> >>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>> >>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>> >>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>> >>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>> >>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>> >>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>> >>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>> >>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>> >>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>> >>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>> >>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>> >>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>> >>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>> >>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>> >>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>> >>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>> >>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>> >>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>> >>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>> >>>>decided.
>>
>>> >>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>> >>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>> >>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>> >>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>> >>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>> >>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>> >>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>> >>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>> >>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>> >>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>> >>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>> >>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>> >>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>> >>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>> >>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>> >>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>> >>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>> >>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>> >>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>> >>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>> >>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>> >>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>> >>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>> >>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>> >>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>> >>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>> >>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>> >>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>> >>>>feeling.
>>
>>> >>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews isn't surprising. What is
>>> >>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>> >>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>> >>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>> >>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>> >>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>> >>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>> >>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>> >>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>> >>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>> >>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>> >>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>> >>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>> >>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>> >>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>> >>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>> >>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>>> >>>>++++++++++++++
>>
>>> >>>>American Renaissance
>>> >>>>http://www.amren.com
>>
>>> >>>>Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>>> >>>>http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>>> >>>>Euro-American Students Union
>>> >>>>http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>>> >>>>Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>>> >>>>http://www.14words.com
>>
>>> >>>>National Alliance
>>> >>>>http://www.natvan.com
>>
>>> >>>>Stormfront
>>> >>>>http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>>> >>>>Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>>> >>>>http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>> I like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, PAMYAT, HAMAS or Aryan Nations,etc.
>>
>> CALL late nights best, or even VISIT me:
>> Donald Ray Ellis
>> aka Pat Blakely/RevWhite/Mike Kalvatis/Rob Stewart ET AL
>> 108 E. Victory Street
>> Star City, Arkansas 71667
>> Tel: (870) 628-1437
>> Email: voiceofreason@blakely.harrogate.net
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> Posted by:
>> Patrick Lee Humphrey
>> 7500 Bellerive #1807
>> Houston, Texas 77036-3040
>> 1-713-266-7764
>>
>> Steven Horn (KCOM)
>> 1836 NW 11th St
>> Oklahoma City, OK 73106
>> (405) 524-0576
>>
>> together with
>>
>> Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive &
>> Henry who like
>> late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>>
>> CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
>> Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even
>> VISIT me at:
>> 55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132
>>
>>
>> Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
>> office: VISIT at:
>> #5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
>> Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
>> or call: 1-250-616-9431
>>
>> As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is
>> called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material
>> should give an indication as to the why.
>>
>> "I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
>> proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
>> yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
>> seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
>> my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
>> moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
>> http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
>> also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]
>>
>> Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like
>> a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
>> even if he or she were not naked"?
>> http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg
>>
>> For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
>> background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David Michael's
>> detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and is
>> known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a grosvenor!!
>> It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases, just
>> to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.
>>
>> Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
>> NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
>> Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: FlaviaR@verizon.net, especially late 
>> nights.
>>
>> Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
>> Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
>> I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or
>> send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
>> work:(780)492-0473
>>
>> And also: George Firestone: "George" 
>>
>> Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
>> Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!
>>
>> For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
>> JEW-WATCH:
>> http://www.jewwatch.com
>>
>> Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
>> NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
>> people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Or, other useful websites include:
>> ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
>> IHR - www.ihr.org
>> OSTARA - www.ostara.org
>> PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
>> Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
>> AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
>> THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press,
>>    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
>>    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com
>>
>> Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
>> They have lots of information, as well as books and records.
>>
>> They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
>> and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.
>>
>> As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a
>> victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
>> of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
>> May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.
>>
>> In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
>> for many years around the world.
>>
>> Reply-To: "George" 
>>
>> _________________________________________
>> Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>> More than 140,000 groups
>> Unlimited download
>> http://www.usenetzone.com to open account 
>



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On 27 Nov 2005 16:19:47 -0800, "Ariadne" wrote:
>Jason P wrote:
>> By Paula Amann

>> Washington Jewish Week/Jewsweek - 2001

>> http://www.jewsweek.com/society/059.htm

>> They come to Israel from the Ukraine, Russia, and Moldova looking for
>> freedom. Instead they are sold as sex slaves. And you thought Israel
>> was holy.

>> Jewsweek.com | Their names are Natalya, Oxana or Svetlana. They come to
>> Israel, as immigrants do, for a better life. But their dreams of
>> working as a waitress, nurse, or au pair turn nightmarish upon their
>> arrival.

>> Their fellow countryman who met them at the airport, speaking the
>> language of home, takes them to a locked apartment with barred windows
>> and a phone that only takes incoming calls, where they are forced to
>> provide sexual services to strangers.

>> Those who rebel risk being raped, beaten, or starved. Even those who
>> knew they were going into prostitution are shocked by the stark
>> conditions, the pay of roughly 20 shekalim ($5) a day or less for their
>> labor.

>> This disturbing story unfolds all too often at the hotline for Migrant
>> Workers, a Tel Aviv agency founded in 1998 to protect the human rights
>> of foreign workers, victims of sex trafficking among them. The hotline
>> takes as its motto the familiar line from Exodus 22:20: "You shall not
>> wrong a stranger or oppress him, for you were strangers in the land of
>> Egypt."

>> Agency director and co-founder Sigal Rozen, along with the group's
>> counsel, Nomi Levenkron, were in Washington, D.C., last week to give a
>> lecture at the Johns Hopkins Nitze School of Advanced International
>> Studies, to network and to speak with supporters. Among them are the
>> New Israel Fund, which has given the hotline a total of $19,000 during
>> the past year and a half.

>> In an interview, Rozen called sex trafficking an "unorganized crime,"
>> based largely on personal networks of immigrants from the Ukraine,
>> Russia, and Moldova.

>> "... "It's easier being a trafficker than being a plumber ..."   --Nomi
>> Levenkron

>> Those three countries alone accounted for 91 percent of the 474 women
>> arrested in brothels and deported from Israel in 2000, according to
>> figures compiled by hotline volunteers during visits to the Neveh
>> Tirzah women's prison.

>> These statistics represent only a fraction of the problem. Police
>> spokespersons have set the number of women brought into the country to
>> work in the sex industry at 2,000-3,000 annually, the number of
>> brothels at 250, Rozen said.

>> "It's Misha that knows Sasha that knows Vladimir," added Levenkron,
>> noting the economic incentive to be a pimp or work with one. "It's
>> easier being a trafficker than being a plumber."

>> One day she got a phone call from a rape crisis center where a woman
>> pleaded to be arrested and deported.

>> This young Moldovian had twice tried to escape her pimp and at 18, was
>> burned out on prostitution and just wanted to go home.

>> "She's so young and sweet," reflected Levenkron. "She came to Israel to
>> be a waitress."

>> A year ago this month, Israel passed the Law Against Trafficking Women.
>> Before that time, other laws existed against soliciting, pimping, and
>> running brothels.

>> Yet hotline staff point out that few pimps involved in trafficking ever
>> face a judge, with the majority of prostitutes deported without ever
>> facing a trial that might involve their testimony against their pimps.
>> Out of 459 women deported in 1998, only 35 cases went to trial; out of
>> 253 in 1999, a scant five ended up in the courtroom.

>> Judicial indifference is compounded by police complicity, Levenkron
>> argued.

>> The 18-year-old Moldovian, it turned out, had at one point in her
>> misadventures, found herself in a Tel Aviv police station where some of
>> the officers, who were her clients, recognized her and moved to call
>> her pimp.

>> Overhearing their plans, the woman fled and moved in with a
>> client-turned-boyfriend.

>> But somehow the pimp found her again, threatened the boyfriend. The
>> young woman, with no place to go, went back to the brothel. Now the
>> case hangs in the courts, where Levenkron has faint hopes for a
>> positive outcome.

>> The police role in such trafficking ranges from casual to highly
>> serious, she alleged.

>> "There are police who just come as clients, those who get special
>> discounts because of their good relationships with the owner of the
>> place and those that inform the owner about police operations,"
>> explained Levenkron.

>> One young Beersheva prostitute told the attorney she was forced to work
>> seven days a week unless a police raid was expected.

>> Widespread fear of violence from pimps has muted the public outcry, say
>> hotline staff. When Levenkron filed a suit on behalf of a
>> Beersheva-based woman, a 20-year-old Moldovian who had survived six
>> pimps and multiple rapes, several of the lawyer's friends came to her
>> home to bid her a final farewell, in anticipation of her imminent
>> death, she said.

>> INTERNATIONAL PROBLEM

>> Worldwide, trafficking in persons for domestic service, forced labor,
>> and prostitution ranks third after drugs and guns among the activities
>> of international crime, according to a congressional service report
>> released May 10, 2000. For comparison, about 50,000 people are brought
>> to the United States annually, the report stated.

>> The rise in trafficking seen over the 1990s was fueled by feeble
>> economies in source countries, such as the former Soviet Union and
>> Southeast Asia, along with weak penalties for traffickers, said a
>> government official familiar with these issues.

>> Last October, the United States passed its own law addressing this
>> problem, the Victims of Trafficking and Violence Protection Act, which
>> calls on the State Department to report annually on the scope of
>> trafficking in various countries and measures taken to combat it. The
>> report was due for release on June 1, but its publication has been
>> delayed.

>> In Israel today, official policy on trafficking is to arrest and deport
>> foreign sex workers. The women are held for an average of 30 days under
>> crowded and sometimes harsh conditions, longer if they testify in court
>> against their pimps, according to hotline data.

>> Rozen and Levenkron take issue with this approach. "Deporting women
>> doesn't make things better," said Levenkron. "I'm tired of shouting
>> this all over Israel so I've come here [to the United States] to shout
>> about it."

>> Rozen contends that a one-year work permit in specified fields such as
>> home health care or child care, before their return home, would put the
>> former prostitutes in a stronger position to take care of themselves.

>> Gruesome albeit unsubstantiated stories abound, she says, about revenge
>> attacks on returning women and their families by the original
>> trafficker in the home country.

>> A nest egg from a year's legitimate work, Rozen suggests, would allow
>> victims to re-establish themselves in a new community and stay out of
>> the clutches of traffickers in the future.

>> Meanwhile, Levenkron is seeking professional back-up in her job
>> representing the victims of trafficking.

>> "I am the [hotline] legal department," laments Levenkron. "We need
>> lawyers and we need public awareness."



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:40 EDT 2007
Article: 556276 of soc.culture.europe
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.singapore:1317036 soc.culture.indonesia:410260 soc.culture.australian:394076 alt.activism.death-penalty:413375 soc.culture.canada:541029 soc.culture.europe:556276
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From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.singapore,soc.culture.indonesia,soc.culture.australian,alt.activism.death-penalty,soc.culture.canada,soc.culture.europe
Subject: Re: 2 more Aussie Drug Traffickers to be Hanged - GOOD!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
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At least the government of Indonesia know what to do with garbage
people, such as drug dealers.

They know, as do other sensible governments in the area, that an
executed criminal will never re-offend!!

Further, an executed waste of skin, will not cost the taxpayers for
the upkeep in some pampering prison system!!

If only the justice systems in North America would follow suit!!!


On 17 Feb 2006 18:43:24 -0800, "LifeManTalking" 
wrote:

>AUSTRALIA - Few Australians have much sympathy for Andrew Chan and
>Myuran Sukumaran, the two drug traffickers sentenced to death in Bali
>this week for their failed bid to smuggle more than 8kg of heroin on to
>the streets of Sydney.

>The lives of too many of their young people have been destroyed by
>drugs and, as innumerable letters to newspapers and callers to talkback
>radio have pointed out, Chan and Sukumaran could never have been in any
>doubt of the risk they took in running narcotics through Indonesia.

>But the prospect of the pair being taken from Kerobokan jail, tied to a
>tree in some lonely clearing, and shot by a paramilitary firing squad
>raises deep and disturbing moral, political and diplomatic dilemmas for
>a nation that last executed a criminal almost 40 years ago and now
>opposes the death penalty worldwide.

>Their own police provided the information that inevitably led to
>Tuesday's sentence. Their Government welcomed the death penalty given
>to the Bali bombers but opposes the same fate for Australian drug
>traffickers, and public opinion is repulsed by the prospect of
>executions at home but inconsistently accepts them abroad.

>It is a diplomatic minefield that Canberra traversed when
>Vietnamese-born Melburnian Van Tuong Nguyen was hanged in Singapore in
>December for taking heroin through Changi airport, despite Australian
>appeals for clemency.

>It is also a minefield that the nation will confront time and again:
>despite repeated warnings and the appalling reality of executions,
>there will always be people foolish enough to strap drugs to their
>bodies or conceal it in their luggage.

>Almost all will pass through Southeast Asia, the source of most of
>Australia's heroin (the Bali Nine consignment originated in Thailand)
>and where every country but Cambodia compulsorily hangs, shoots or
>lethally injects traffickers.

>Mike Phelan, the head of international operations for the Australian
>Federal Police and the man responsible for giving Indonesia the
>information it needed to arrest the Bali Nine, sees no end to the queue
>of couriers the trade calls "mules".

>"It continues to astound me that people attempt importations and move
>drugs through transit countries knowing that the death penalty exists,"
>he told ABC's Australian Story. "Many young lives get thrown away for
>the law of quick dollars."

>The AFP's role in the arrest of the Bali Nine is among the most
>sensitive of the issues facing Prime Minister John Howard, who has
>already weathered a barrage of criticism that has extended even into
>his own party room.

>The AFP caught the first whispers of a major heroin importing run in
>February last year and, in April, asked the Indonesian police to help
>uncover the members of the syndicate and the source of their supplies.

>Between them, the two forces discovered most of the names and built a
>remarkably accurate picture of their operation, including details of a
>previous successful run and another aborted attempt.

>This co-operation has become increasingly commonplace, spurred by the
>determination of all countries in the region to attack drug trafficking
>and terrorism. Intelligence swapping is required under a number of
>treaties.

>"We make no secret of the fact that the AFP has a policy of forward
>engagement where we want to stop the crimes at the source and (prevent
>them) from reaching Australian shores," Phelan said. "That's a practice
>we will continue to operate within."

>What worries many Australians is the fact that the AFP in effect turned
>over a group of young Australians to a country it knew was likely to
>execute them, rather than arresting them when they arrived home.

>The most emotional response centred on Scott Rush, 20, a drug mule who
>was jailed for life. His family, through lawyer Bob Myers, vainly asked
>the AFP to warn Rush of their interest before he left Australia.

>"No Australian public servant has the right to expose any Australian
>citizen to the death penalty," Myers told Australian Story.

>Rush and fellow mules Renae Lawrence, Martin Stephens and Michael
>Czugaj took the AFP to the Federal Court, claiming it had acted
>illegally by exposing them to the death penalty.

>While a large part of public opinion agreed, the court dismissed the
>action.

>The Government has also sidestepped criticism, pointing out that while
>the relevant treaty with Indonesia contains a clause allowing the
>Attorney-General to refuse to provide evidence if an Australian was
>charged with an offence carrying the death penalty, the AFP was free to
>do as it thought best until charges were laid.

>By the time the Bali Nine were formally charged, all the damaging
>evidence had been gathered.

>Phelan is unrepentant: "Basically all transit countries through which
>drugs come to Australia have the death penalty. The AFP cannot pick and
>choose who it chooses to cooperate with."

>International teamwork in the past few years has significantly reduced
>the flow of drugs into Australia. The most recent Australian Crime
>Commission figures, for 2003-04, show the lowest seizures of heroin for
>a decade.

>Refusal to co-operate abroad would outrage regional governments and
>threaten mutual action against other drug syndicates and terrorism.

>Public opinion in Southeast Asia also strongly favours the death
>penalty for traffickers, with polls in Singapore and Thailand showing
>support of up to 80 per cent.

>In Australia, opinion is more confused. A Morgan poll in November found
>that while only 27 per cent of Australians favoured the death penalty
>for murder, 57 per cent believed drug traffickers caught in Asia should
>die.

>Yet in the specific case of Van Nguyen, opinion was evenly divided.

>In The Australian, a newspoll found that more than 50 per cent of
>Australians favoured the death sentence for people convicted of major
>acts of terrorism.

>Howard now has to weigh all these conflicting factors in framing
>Canberra's approach to the executions of Chan and Sukumaran. He has
>said publicly he has no sympathy for the two men but will vigorously
>pursue Australia's long-standing opposition to the death penalty.

>How that is carried out will test Australian diplomacy.

>Apart from the risks to a fragile relationship, observers have pointed
>out that any blunt approach will almost certainly stiffen backs in
>Jakarta and end any chance of clemency.

>Hopes of saving Chan and Sukumaran now rest with Indonesia's
>inconsistent record in carrying out executions, the fact that in recent
>times only three of the more than 85 prisoners on death row have been
>shot, and the lengthy legal road still to be travelled.

>It may be years before their case moves through the Denpasar provincial
>High Court and the two reviews possible through the Supreme Court in
>Jakarta.

>And though President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono has said he will never
>grant clemency to drug traffickers, time and quiet diplomacy may change
>his mind.

>Death penalty Australia's double dilemma 
>
>18.02.06
>By Greg Ansley



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:40 EDT 2007
Article: 556498 of soc.culture.europe
Xref: sn-us misc.transport.rail.europe:61163 rec.travel.europe:862052 alt.politics.europe:60889 soc.culture.europe:556498
Path: sn-us!sn-feed-sjc-04!sn-xt-sjc-10!sn-xt-sjc-06!sn-xt-sjc-14!supernews.com!pd7cy1no!pd7cy2no!shaw.ca!pd7tw2no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail
X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: misc.transport.rail.europe,rec.travel.europe,alt.politics.europe,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.austrian
Subject: Re: Austrian / Hungarian border
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <44b6b085$0$69399$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net>  
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Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

The whole header, and followups smells as a SCAM.

I suspect that some people trafickers are asking for info, on where
they can infiltrate more illegals into Austria, either for the sex
trade, or as slave labor!!

Suggest Interpol may already have a file on the original poster?
For sure the authotities in Vienna are very interested.

On Fri, 14 Jul 2006 21:39:07 +0200, Dave Frightens Me
 wrote:
>On Fri, 14 Jul 2006 16:05:49 +0200, Ulf Kutzner
> wrote:
>>Roger Tamworth schrieb:
>>
>>> My sister is writing an assignment about immigration from Eastern Europe.
>>> 
>>> She is interested in what the current status is of the border between Hungry 
>>> and Austria.
>>> 
>>> More specifically, is there passport control on:
>>> 
>>> 1  Each road crossing the border
>>> 2  Train stations either side of the border
>>> 3  Green field type borders areas between roads

>>For illegal crossing? Ask the border patrol services. Seen a report 
>>about them. They are working with infrared detection.
>
>I can't imagine it would be a big problem to cross that border at this
>time. There would certainly be plenty of places in the hills you could
>cross with few problems.
>
>I'd do some research first of course, but I'm sure it's doable.

>DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
>---



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:41 EDT 2007
Article: 556555 of soc.culture.europe
Xref: sn-us soc.culture.europe:556555 rec.travel.usa-canada:308225 can.general:353835 soc.culture.canada:541255 ab.general:110252 calgary.general:352311
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: soc.culture.europe,rec.travel.usa-canada,can.general,soc.culture.canada,ab.general,calgary.general
Subject: Re: Edmonton Canada Gestapo  Bad International Reputation - AVOID Edmonton - MORE!!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <448db2lak73o438hejp4dkorcauflr2ufp@4ax.com>    
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Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

Regrettably, all the news reports are correct and TRUE.

Police brutality in Edmonton is so rampant, the Edmonton Journal
newspaper, as well as the TV stations hardly have a day pass, without
yet another expose of more police brutality!!

The media need not fabricate the stories, since the Courts carry the
charges!!

Your comments seem to be along the line of "shoot the messenger of bad
news!"

By the way, reference to Calgary merely confirms the truth, that
Calgary does not have the same problem with crooked cops!
In other words a great place to visit, unlike the cesspool of
Edmonton.


On Sat, 15 Jul 2006 05:01:38 GMT, "Alohacyberian"
 wrote:
>"Alan Pollock"  wrote in message 
>news:e99ivp$mvk$1@reader2.panix.com...
>> In rec.travel.usa-canada Alohacyberian  wrote:
>>
>>> The comments are so strident that I take them with a grain of salt.  If 
>>> they  were toned down serious people might take them more seriously.  KM
>>
>> It's easy to take some factual basis remote or not, fondle, spin and 
>> expand  into impressions designed to make the vulnerable believe a truth that just
>> doesn't exist.
>>
>> An example - albeit a touch more subtle but not by much - is Michael 
>> Moore's  "documentary" in effect a mockumentary called Farenheit 9-11.
>>
>> I must honestly add that I haven't researched Edmonton because quite 
>> frankly I  could care less. However the hate-posts here have had the opposite of 
>> their  intended effect on me.
>>
>> Edmonton's quite possibly a very good place to visit.
>>
>> Anybody who uses techniques like that of the posters is unworthy of my
>> respect, so in my book Edmonton's still a virgin, at the very least.
>>
>> The haters keep putting ketchup on the eggs of their own undoing. Nex
>>
>I have a friend who lives in Ontario and travels to Calgary, Alberta once a 
>year.  I asked him if he ever goes to Edmonton and he said that he'd been 
>there a few times and hadn't heard anything bad about it.  He was unaware of 
>the flap we've read here.  I, too will probably never go to Edmonton, 
>especially as long as Banff and Lake Louise are alternatives.  So yes, your 
>comparison of the shrill conjectures about Edmonton in this forum to Michael 
>Moore's schlockumentaries do seem apropos.  KM



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:41 EDT 2007
Article: 556782 of soc.culture.europe
Xref: sn-us misc.transport.rail.europe:61185 rec.travel.europe:863084 alt.politics.europe:60917 soc.culture.europe:556782
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: misc.transport.rail.europe,rec.travel.europe,alt.politics.europe,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.austrian
Subject: Re: Austrian / Hungarian border - From Human Trafickers?
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References: <44b6b085$0$69399$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net>  
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Organization: Shaw Residential Internet

The whole header, and followups smells as a SCAM.

I suspect that some people trafickers are asking for info, on where
they can infiltrate more illegals into Austria, either for the sex
trade, or as slave labor!!

Suggest Interpol may already have a file on the original poster?
For sure the authotities in Vienna are very interested.

On Fri, 14 Jul 2006 21:39:07 +0200, Dave Frightens Me
 wrote:
>On Fri, 14 Jul 2006 16:05:49 +0200, Ulf Kutzner
> wrote:
>>Roger Tamworth schrieb:
>>
>>> My sister is writing an assignment about immigration from Eastern Europe.
>>> 
>>> She is interested in what the current status is of the border between Hungry 
>>> and Austria.
>>> 
>>> More specifically, is there passport control on:
>>> 
>>> 1  Each road crossing the border
>>> 2  Train stations either side of the border
>>> 3  Green field type borders areas between roads

>>For illegal crossing? Ask the border patrol services. Seen a report 
>>about them. They are working with infrared detection.
>
>I can't imagine it would be a big problem to cross that border at this
>time. There would certainly be plenty of places in the hills you could
>cross with few problems.
>
>I'd do some research first of course, but I'm sure it's doable.

>DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
>---



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Oct 13 23:21:42 EDT 2007
Article: 556783 of soc.culture.europe
Xref: sn-us pl.soc.polityka:1038926 soc.culture.polish:727645 alt.politics.europe:60918 soc.culture.europe:556783 soc.culture.swiss:63831 soc.culture.german:365075 soc.culture.russian:438350
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X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.151.193.236
From: NotMyName 
Newsgroups: pl.soc.polityka,soc.culture.polish,alt.politics.europe,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.swiss,soc.culture.german,soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: KATYN=MURDERS OF  POLISH  BY ZYDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! Like Vinnitsa!! NEVER  FORGET!
Reply-To: NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com
Message-ID: 
References:   
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With even the Soviets forced to admit that it was their ZYD NKVD who
did the murders at KATYN, why are you apologising for them?

Historians and experts proved it was NOT the Germans!

Were you one of the killers, or perhaps your father, uncle or?


On Sat, 8 Jul 2006 11:54:59 -0700, "Peter Wielki" 
wrote:

>Actually, in Katyn there were Russians and Ukraninians that did the crime, 
>as far as I know.
>
>But yeah, let's blame it on JEWS!!!  Germans did it too, right Frankie?


>"Frank Arthur"  wrote in message 
>news:ummva2ddrk9aik6jnqimp9mseb9b5ap4g1@4ax.com...
>> True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZYDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary of 
>> the
>> discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland 
>> had
>> been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated to 
>> The
>> Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis, who
>> invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely used 
>> the
>> word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler learned, 
>> as
>> dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers from a 
>> single
>> narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: its intent was 
>> to
>> eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its perceived
>> guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the
>> exiled Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn, 
>> outside
>> Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and
>> the terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the 
>> relationship
>> between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him, 
>> awarding
>> him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his future murder 
>> victims.
>> And when Stalin jested that they should settle the German problem once and 
>> for
>> all by killing 50,000 German officers, Churchill merely protested sulkily, 
>> and
>> Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one 
>> by
>> which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three knew 
>> of
>> the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, all 
>> three -
>> two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich 
>> five
>> years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn: once
>> Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with almost
>> anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn into 
>> the
>> diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan Government 
>> in
>> the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a memorial in London to the
>> victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>>>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>>>Katyn
>>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>>>of Poland.
>>
>>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>>>in 1940.
>>
>>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>>>Russia.
>>
>>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>>>FBI.
>>
>>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>>>of them did.
>>
>>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>>>killings.
>>
>> ISRAEL REFUSED TO PROSECUTE THESAE ZHID MURDERERS!!
>>
>>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>>>decided.
>>
>>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>>>feeling.
>>
>>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews/ZHIDS  isn't surprising. What is
>>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>> ++++++++++++++
>>
>> American Renaissance
>> http://www.amren.com
>>
>> Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>> http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>> Euro-American Students Union
>> http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>> Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>> http://www.14words.com
>>
>> National Alliance
>> http://www.natvan.com
>>
>> Stormfront
>> http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>> Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>> http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>>
>> First,let us kill all the lawyers! - W.Shakespeare
>> First, we get rid of all the politicians! - Mao tse Dung
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled-as fertiliser!!
>> Me
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Newsgroups:
>> pl.regionalne.krakow,pl.regionalne.lodz,pl.regionalne.warszawa,soc.culture.polish,alt.politics.europe
>> Subject: KATYN=MURDERS BY ZHIDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZHIDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:
>> soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary
>> of the discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland
>> had been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated
>> to The Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis,
>> who invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely
>> used the word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler
>> learned, as dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers
>> from a single narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: 
>> its
>> intent was to eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its
>> perceived guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the exiled
>> Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn,
>> outside Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. 
>> A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and the
>> terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the
>> relationship between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him,
>> awarding him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his
>> future murder victims. And when Stalin jested that they should settle the
>> German problem once and for all by killing 50,000 German officers, 
>> Churchill
>> merely protested sulkily, and Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing
>> only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one
>> by which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three
>> knew of the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, 
>> all
>> three - two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to
>> those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich
>> five years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn:
>> once Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with
>> almost anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn
>> into the diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan
>> Government in the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a
>> memorial in London to the victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>> >>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>> >>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>> >>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>> >>>>Katyn
>>> >>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>> >>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>> >>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>> >>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>> >>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>> >>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>> >>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>> >>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>> >>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>> >>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>> >>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>> >>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>> >>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>> >>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>> >>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>> >>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>> >>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>> >>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>> >>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>> >>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>> >>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>> >>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>> >>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>> >>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>> >>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>> >>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>> >>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>> >>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>> >>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>> >>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>> >>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>> >>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>> >>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>> >>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>> >>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>> >>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>> >>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>> >>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>> >>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>> >>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>> >>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>> >>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>> >>>>of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>> >>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>> >>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>> >>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>> >>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>> >>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>> >>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>> >>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>> >>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>in 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>> >>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>> >>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>> >>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>> >>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>> >>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>> >>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>> >>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>> >>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>> >>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>> >>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>> >>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>> >>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>> >>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>> >>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>> >>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>> >>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>> >>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>> >>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>> >>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>> >>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>> >>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>> >>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>> >>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>> >>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>> >>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>> >>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>> >>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>> >>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>> >>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>> >>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>> >>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>> >>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>> >>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>> >>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>> >>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>> >>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>> >>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>> >>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>> >>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>> >>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>> >>>>Russia.
>>
>>> >>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>> >>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>> >>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>> >>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>> >>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>> >>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>> >>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>> >>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>> >>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>> >>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>> >>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>> >>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>> >>>>FBI.
>>
>>> >>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>> >>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>> >>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>> >>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>> >>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>> >>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>> >>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>> >>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>> >>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>> >>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>> >>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>> >>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>> >>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>> >>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>> >>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>> >>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>> >>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>> >>>>of them did.
>>
>>> >>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>> >>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>> >>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>> >>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>> >>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>> >>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>> >>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>> >>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>> >>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>> >>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>> >>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>> >>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>> >>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>> >>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>> >>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>> >>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>> >>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>> >>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>> >>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>> >>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>> >>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>> >>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>> >>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>> >>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>> >>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>> >>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>> >>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>> >>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>> >>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>> >>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>> >>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>> >>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>> >>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>> >>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>> >>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>> >>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>> >>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>> >>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>> >>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>> >>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>> >>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>> >>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>> >>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>> >>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>> >>>>killings.
>>
>>> >>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>> >>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>> >>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>> >>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>> >>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>> >>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>> >>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>> >>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>> >>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>> >>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>> >>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>> >>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>> >>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>> >>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>> >>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>> >>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>> >>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>> >>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>> >>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>> >>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>> >>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>> >>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>> >>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>> >>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>> >>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>> >>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>> >>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>> >>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>> >>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>> >>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>> >>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>> >>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>> >>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>> >>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>> >>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>> >>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>> >>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>> >>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>> >>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>> >>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>> >>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>> >>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>> >>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>> >>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>> >>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>> >>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>> >>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>> >>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>> >>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>> >>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>> >>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>> >>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>> >>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>> >>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>> >>>>decided.
>>
>>> >>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>> >>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>> >>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>> >>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>> >>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>> >>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>> >>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>> >>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>> >>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>> >>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>> >>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>> >>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>> >>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>> >>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>> >>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>> >>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>> >>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>> >>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>> >>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>> >>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>> >>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>> >>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>> >>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>> >>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>> >>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>> >>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>> >>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>> >>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>> >>>>feeling.
>>
>>> >>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews isn't surprising. What is
>>> >>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>> >>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>> >>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>> >>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>> >>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>> >>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>> >>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>> >>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>> >>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>> >>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>> >>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>> >>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>> >>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>> >>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>> >>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>> >>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>>> >>>>++++++++++++++
>>
>>> >>>>American Renaissance
>>> >>>>http://www.amren.com
>>
>>> >>>>Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>>> >>>>http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>>> >>>>Euro-American Students Union
>>> >>>>http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>>> >>>>Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>>> >>>>http://www.14words.com
>>
>>> >>>>National Alliance
>>> >>>>http://www.natvan.com
>>
>>> >>>>Stormfront
>>> >>>>http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>>> >>>>Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>>> >>>>http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>> I like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, PAMYAT, HAMAS or Aryan Nations,etc.
>>
>> CALL late nights best, or even VISIT me:
>> Donald Ray Ellis
>> aka Pat Blakely/RevWhite/Mike Kalvatis/Rob Stewart ET AL
>> 108 E. Victory Street
>> Star City, Arkansas 71667
>> Tel: (870) 628-1437
>> Email: voiceofreason@blakely.harrogate.net
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> Posted by:
>> Patrick Lee Humphrey
>> 7500 Bellerive #1807
>> Houston, Texas 77036-3040
>> 1-713-266-7764
>>
>> Steven Horn (KCOM)
>> 1836 NW 11th St
>> Oklahoma City, OK 73106
>> (405) 524-0576
>>
>> together with
>>
>> Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive &
>> Henry who like
>> late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>>
>> CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
>> Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even
>> VISIT me at:
>> 55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132
>>
>>
>> Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
>> office: VISIT at:
>> #5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
>> Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
>> or call: 1-250-616-9431
>>
>> As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is
>> called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material
>> should give an indication as to the why.
>>
>> "I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
>> proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
>> yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
>> seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
>> my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
>> moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
>> http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
>> also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]
>>
>> Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like
>> a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
>> even if he or she were not naked"?
>> http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg
>>
>> For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
>> background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David Michael's
>> detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and is
>> known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a grosvenor!!
>> It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases, just
>> to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.
>>
>> Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
>> NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
>> Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: FlaviaR@verizon.net, especially late 
>> nights.
>>
>> Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
>> Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
>> I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or
>> send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
>> work:(780)492-0473
>>
>> And also: George Firestone: "George" 
>>
>> Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
>> Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!
>>
>> For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
>> JEW-WATCH:
>> http://www.jewwatch.com
>>
>> Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
>> NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
>> people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Or, other useful websites include:
>> ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
>> IHR - www.ihr.org
>> OSTARA - www.ostara.org
>> PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
>> Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
>> AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
>> THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press,
>>    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
>>    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com
>>
>> Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
>> They have lots of information, as well as books and records.
>>
>> They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
>> and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.
>>
>> As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a
>> victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
>> of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
>> May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.
>>
>> In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
>> for many years around the world.
>>
>> Reply-To: "George" 
>>
>> _________________________________________
>> Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>> More than 140,000 groups
>> Unlimited download
>> http://www.usenetzone.com to open account 
>



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Subject: Re: "GIs eyed in alleged rape, murders in Iraq" (AP) Deserve Beheading!
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Time for the Iraqis to apply local/islamic law on the criminal yanks
and other occupiers!

Public beheadings would certainly discourage further rapes and similar
crimes.


On 1 Jul 2006 00:00:32 -0700, "Barry Schier" 
wrote:

>{Preface}
>
>(Insert a quote from President Bush about how the U.S. "intervention
>in" (Translator's note: Orwellian doublespreak "intervention in" means
>in plain English "occupation of") Iraq helps the people of that
>country, etc.here)
>-- Barry Schier
>
>{Article}
>
>GIs eyed in alleged rape, murders in Iraq
>By RYAN LENZ, Associated Press Writer
>
>
>
>BEIJI, Iraq - A group of American soldiers in an insurgent-riddled town
>allegedly noticed a young Iraqi woman when on patrol and later returned
>to rape her, according to U.S. officials Friday. In an apparent
>cover-up attempt, she and three members of her family then were killed
>and her body was set on fire.
>
>
>Five U.S. troops are being investigated, a U.S. military official told
>The Associated Press.
>
>It is the fifth pending case involving alleged slayings of Iraqi
>civilians by U.S. troops.
>
>The suspects in the killing, which took place in March, were from the
>same platoon as two soldiers kidnapped and killed south of Baghdad this
>month, said the official, who is close to the investigation and spoke
>on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the case.
>
>One soldier was arrested after admitting his role in the alleged attack
>on the family, the U.S. official said. The official said the rape and
>killings appear to have been a "crime of opportunity," noting that the
>soldiers had not been attacked by insurgents but had noticed the woman
>on previous patrols.
>
>One of the family members they allegedly killed was a child, said a
>senior Army official who also requested anonymity because the
>investigation is ongoing. Some of the suspects allegedly burned the
>woman's body to cover up the attack, the U.S. official said.
>
>In Baghdad, the U.S. military issued a sparse statement, saying only
>that Maj. Gen. James D. Thurman, commander of the 4th Infantry
>Division, ordered a criminal investigation into the alleged slaying of
>a family of four in Mahmoudiya, 20 miles south of Baghdad.
>
>However, the U.S. official said the soldiers were assigned to the 502nd
>Infantry Regiment. The official told the AP that the suspects were from
>the same platoon as two slain soldiers whose mutilated bodies were
>found June 19, three days after they were abducted by insurgents near
>Youssifiyah southwest of Baghdad.
>
>The military has said one and possibly both of the slain soldiers were
>tortured and beheaded. The official said the mutilation of the slain
>soldiers stirred feelings of guilt and led at least one member of the
>platoon to reveal the rape-slaying on June 22.
>
>According to the senior Army official, the alleged incident was first
>revealed by a soldier during a routine counseling-type session. The
>official said that soldier did not witness the incident but heard about
>it.
>
>A second soldier, who also was not involved, said he overhead soldiers
>conspiring to commit the crimes and then later saw bloodstains on their
>clothes, the official said.
>
>Before the soldier disclosed the alleged assault, senior officers had
>been aware of the family's death but believed it was a result of
>sectarian violence, the official said.
>
>One of the five suspects has already been discharged for unspecified
>charges unrelated to the killings and is believed to be in the United
>States, two U.S. officials said on condition of anonymity because the
>investigation is ongoing. The others have had their weapons taken away
>and are confined to a U.S. base near Mahmoudiya.
>
>The allegations of rape could generate a particularly strong backlash
>in        Iraq, a conservative, strongly religious society in which
>many women will not even shake hands with men who are not close
>relatives.
>
>The case is among the most serious against U.S. soldiers allegedly
>involved in the deaths of Iraqi civilians. At least 14 U.S. troops have
>been convicted.
>
>Last week, seven Marines and one Navy medic were charged with
>premeditated murder in the shooting death of an Iraqi man near Fallujah
>west of Baghdad.
>
>U.S. officials are also investigating allegations that U.S. Marines
>killed two dozen unarmed Iraqi civilians Nov. 19 in the western town of
>Haditha in a revenge attack after a fellow Marine died in a roadside
>bombing.
>
>Other cases involve the deaths of three male detainees in Salahuddin
>province in May, the shooting death of unarmed Iraqi man near Ramadi in
>February, and the death of an Iraqi soldier after an interrogation in
>2003 at a detention camp in Qaim.
>
>The allegations have aroused public anger against the U.S. military
>presence at a time when the new Iraqi government and U.S. authorities
>are trying to reach out to disaffected Sunni Arabs to quell the
>insurgency and calm sectarian tensions.
>
>On Saturday, Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki leaves for a whirlwind trip
>to Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and the United Arab Emirates to seek support
>for his national reconciliation initiative, which includes an amnesty
>for the mostly Sunni insurgents.
>
>Al-Maliki is also expected to brief the Sunni leadership of those three
>countries on his efforts to deal with the divisions between Shiites and
>Sunnis. Iraq's neighbors in the Persian Gulf fear sectarian tensions
>will spill over into their countries, which are dominated by Sunnis but
>have large Shiite minorities.
>
>On Friday, radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr rejected al-Maliki's
>initiative because it does not include a timetable for the withdrawal
>of U.S.-led foreign troops.
>
>"We demand the occupation forces to leave the country, or at least a
>timetable should be set for their withdrawal," al-Sadr said during a
>sermon.
>
>Despite al-Maliki's efforts, there has been no letup in Iraq's
>violence. The U.S. military reported four more American service members
>have died, including a Marine killed Friday in fighting west of
>Baghdad. Three Army soldiers died in combat the day before, the
>military said.
>
>___
>
>AP correspondent Ryan Lenz is embedded with the 101st Airborne Division
>in Beiji, Iraq. He was previously embedded with the 502nd Infantry
>Regiment in Mahmoudiya. AP correspondent Lolita C. Baldor in Washington
>contributed to this report.



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Subject: Re: Europe Doubts Jewish Claims/ the Holohoax is dead-Remember KASTNER, Rumkowski, Wiesenthal=KOLLABORATORS with Nazis!!
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Now there are at least another 50 documented cases like KASTNER, and
RUMKOWSKI!!
The ZYDS COLLABORATED WITH NAZIS!!

Even the notorious Simon WIESENTHAL is proven to have been a nazi
GESTAPO  COLLABORATOR!!


On 24 Oct 2004 17:22:19 -0000, DerStuermer  wrote:

>Mamzer Kenneth McVay,SOBC, the well-known fag and mamser in Canada,
>Fag McVay of Vancouver, convicted of child molesting
>and car theft in California and Oregon, and still
>unemployed  gas pump boy, mastermind of the
>Canadian branch of NAMBLA, and now finally dying as a
>diseased AIDS-spreader,wants all to know about all
>his fellow ZHID criminals and perverts.
>Here is the latest.......

>From: Elias Davidsson (edavid@itn.is)
>Subject: Zionism. The Kastner case (1/2)
>Newsgroups: soc.culture.israel
>Date: 1997/07/12

>The Kastner Case
>-----------------

>Introduction

>Rather than answer every complaint in the same detail, we are taking
>up the issue which the VJBD has declared to be the most offensive of all
>and will show that on this question 'The documentation available is
>overwhelming and its message is thundering", just as Palestine Speaks
>claimed in one of the extracts complained about by the VJBD.

>Since the accusation of direct Zionist cooperation and assistance in
>the extermination of hundreds of thousands of Jewish people, and the
>accusation that this flowed logically from shared aims, are clearly the
>most 'extreme' and 'offensive' accusations of Nazi-Zionist collaboration
>broadcast on 3CR programs, we will deal with this first, and in greater detail.
>
>Since the 'Kastner case' is the subject of most of the broadcasts
>concerning collaboration which have been specifically complained
>about, we shall go into this in greatest detail, and have put some books
>in as evidence about it. Having answered the VJBD where its case appears
>strongest, and on the points to which it has given greatest emphasis,we
>hope it may become apparent to the Tribunal that things are not quite
>what they may have appeared before this inquiry began.
>
>The most notorious case of Nazi-Zionist collaboration is that
>involving Rudolf Kastner.
>
>Most Jewish people in Australia have never heard of Rudolf Kastner.
>Those who have, are generally under the impression that there is some
>'controversy' about negotiations he undertook for 'the purchase of
>Jewish lives for money and military equipment', but that he was 'fully
>rehabilitated' by the Supreme Court of Israel.
>
>That is exactly the line taken by Dr. John Foster, the Victorian
>Jewish Board of Deputies expert witness, in his evidence condemning
>3CR for anti-semitism.
>
>It is quite clear from this evidence, that Dr. Foster does not know
>anything at all about the Kastner case, since he does not even know
>what Kastner was accused of.
>
>This may not be his fault however, since one cannot read an accurate
>account of the Kastner case in any of the widely available works dealing
>with the Holocaust, either in bookshops or libraries. Apart from 3CR, the
>suppression of information has been so complete, that even an expert
>like Dr. Foster, specifically asked to give evidence on the matter, has
>been unable to find out what it is all about.
>
>The Accusations
>----------------
>Briefly, the accusations against Kastner are as follows:
>
>"Dr. Rudolf Verba, a Doctor of Science now serving at the British
>Medical Research Council, was one of the few escapees from Auschwitz.
>In his memoirs published in February, 1961, in the London Daily Herald,
>he wrote:
>
>'I am a Jew. In spite of that - indeed because of that - I accuse
>certain Jewish leaders of one of the most ghastly deeds of the war.
>
>This small group of quislings knew what was happening to their
>brethren in Hitler's gas chambers and bought their their own lives with
>the price of silence. Among them was Dr. Kastner, leader of the council
>which spoke for all Jews in Hungary. While I was prisoner number 44070 at
>Auschwitz - the number is still on my arm - I compiled careful statistics
>of the exterminations...I took these terrible statistics with me when I
>escaped in 1944 and I was able to give Hungarian Zionist leaders three weeks
>notice that Eichmann planned to send a million of their Jews to his gas
>chambers...Kastner went to Eichmann and told him, 'I know of your
>plans; spare some Jews of my choice and I shall keep quiet.'
>
>Eichmann not only agreed, but dressed Kastner up in S.S. uniform and
>took him to Belsen to trace some of his friends. Nor did the sordid
>bargaining end there.
>
>Kastner paid Eichmann several thousand dollars. With this little
>fortune, Eichmann was able to buy his way to freedom when Germany collapsed,
>to set himself up in the Argentine..."(Ben Hecht, op.cit. pp261-2)
>
>These accusations are confirmed by the 'Eichmann Confessions'
>published in Life magazine, 28 November and 5 December 1960:
>
>"I resolved to show how well a job could be done when the commander
>stands 100% behind it. By shipping the Jews off in a lightning operation,
>I wanted to set an example for future campaigns elsewhere...In obedience to
>Himmler's directive I now concentrated on negotiations with the Jewish
>political officials in Budapest...Among them Dr. Rudolph Kastner,
>authorized representative of the Zionist Movement. This Dr. Kastner
>was a young man about my age, an ice-cold lawyer and a fanatical Zionist.
>He agreed to help keep the Jews from resisting deportation - and even
>keep order in the collection camps - if I could close my eyes and let a
>few hundred or a few thousand young Jews emigrate illegally to Palestine.
>It was a good bargain. For keeping order in the camps, the price...was
>not too high for me.
>
>.We trusted each other perfectly. When he was with me, Kastner smoke
>cigarets as though he was in a coffeehouse. While we talked he would
>smoke one aromatic cigaret after another, taking them from a silver case
>and lighting them with a silver lighter. With his great polish and reserve
>he would have made an ideal Gestapo officer himself.
>
>Dr. Kastner's main concern was to make it possible for a select group
>of Hungarian Jews to emigrate to Israel...
>
>As a matter of fact, there was a very strong similarity between our
>attitudes in the S.S. and the viewpoint of these immensely idealistic
>Zionist leaders....I believe that Kastner would have sacrificed a
>thousand or a hundred thousand of his blood to achieve his political
>goal...'You can have the others', he would say, 'but let me have this
>group here'. And because Kastner rendered us a great service by helping
>keep the deportation camps peaceful, I would let his groups escape.
>After all, I was not concerned with small groups of a thousand or so Jews...
>That was the 'gentleman's agreement' I had with Kastner" (Hecht, ibid, p.26ö-61)
>
>Quite clearly these accusations, whether true or false, do not relate
>merely to 'the purchase of Jewish lives for money and military
>equipment', as Dr. Foster imagines, and the term 'collaboration' is the term
>that would apply. It seems unlikely that if Dr. Foster had known what the
>accusation actually was, he would have condemned 3CR saying 'In these
>circumstances, to talk of collaboration is malicious and absurd'.
>
>Are the accusations against Kastner true?
>
>According to the Government of Israel, they are a lie. When Malchiel
>Greenwald, a strongly pro-Zionist Israeli citizen published these
>accusations against Kastner, the Israeli Government did rather more
>than demand that his views should not be broadcast. Because a prominent
>Zionist official (Dr. Kastner was a spokesman for the Ministry of Trade and
>Industry) was involved, the Attorney General of the State of Israel
>prosecuted Greenwald for criminal libel.
>
>The Verdict
>------------
>Let the verdict of Judge Benjamin Halevi in Israel's District Court of
>Jerusalem speak for itself, given in criminal case No. 124 of 1953.
>The Attorney General v. Malchiel Greenwald. This material should be
>studied carefully, since a substantial extract from it, broadcast on 3CR,
>has been complained about by the VJBD as allegedly offensive to the Jewish
>community, likely to promote anti-semitism, likely to promote racism,
>in bad taste and contrary to common sense.
>
>It is the actual words used that are the subject of the Board's
>complaint, not the manner of their representation by 3CR. Presumably
>the Board itself was not aware just whose words they were when it made
>its' complaint, which shows how complete suppression of information can
>backfire on the censors themselves.
>
>Here then are excerpts from the verdict of Judge Halevi, who later
>became one of the panel of three judges that tried Eichmann:
>
>"The masses of Jews from Hungary's ghettos obediently boarded the
>deportation trains without knowing their fate. They were full of
>confidence in the false information that they were being transferred to
>Kenyermeze.
>
>The Nazis could not have misled the masses of Jews so conclusively had
>they not spread their false information through Jewish channels.
>
>The Jews of the ghettos would not have trusted the Nazi or Hungarian
>rulers. But they had trust in their Jewish leaders. Eichmann and
>others used this known fact as part of their calculated plan to mislead
>the Jews.
>They were able to deport the Jews to their extermination by the help
>of Jewish leaders.
>
>The false information was spread by the Jewish leaders. The local
>leaders of the Jews of Kluj and Nodvarod knew that other leaders were
>spreading such false information and did not protest.
>
>Those of the Jews who tried to warn their friends of the truth were
>persecuted by the Jewish leaders in charge of the local 'rescue work'.
>
>The trust of the Jews in the misleading information and their lack of
>knowledge that their wives, children and themselves were about to be
>deported to the gas chambers of Auschwitz led the victims to remain
>quiescent in their ghettos. It seduced them into not resisting or
>hampering the deportation orders.
>
>Dozens of thousands of Jews were guarded in their ghettos by a few
>dozen police. Yet even vigorous young Jews made no attemptt to overpower
>these few guards and escape to nearby Rumania. No resistance activities to
>the deportations were organized in these ghettos.
>
>And the Jewish leaders did everything in their power to soothe the
>Jews in the ghettos and to prevent such resistance activities.
>
>The same Jews who spread in Kluj and Nodvarod the false rumor of
>Kenyermeze, or confirmed it, the same public leaders who did not warn
>their own people against the misleading statements, the same Jewish leaders
>who did not organize any resistance or any sabotage of
>deportations...these same leaders did not join the people of their community
>in their ride to Auschwitz, but were all included in the Rescue train.
>
>The Nazi organizers of extermination and the perpetrators of
>extermination permitted Rudolf Kastner and the members of the Jewish Council
>in Budapest to save themselves, their relatives, and friends. The Nazis did
>this as a means of making the local Jewish leaders, whom they favoured,
>dependent on the Nazi regime, dependent on its good will during the time of
>its fatal deportation schedule. In short, the Nazis succeeded in bringing the
>Jewish leaders into oollaboration with the Nazis at the time of the
>catastrophe.
>
>The Nazi chiefs knew that the Zionists were a most vital element in
>Jewry and the most trusted by the Jews.
>
>The Nazis drew a lesson from the Warsaw ghetto and other belligerent
>ghettos. They learned that Jews were able to sell their lives very
>expensively if honorably guided.
>
>Eichmann did not want a second Warsaw. For this reason, the Nazis
>exerted themselves to mislead and bribe the Jewish leaders.
>
>The personality of Rudolph Kastner made him a convenient catspaw for
>Eichmann and his clique, to draw into collaboration and make their
>task easier.
>
>The question here is not, as stated by the Attorney General in his
>summation, whether members of the Jewish Rescue Committee were or were
>not capable of fulfilling their duty without the patronage of the S.S.
>chiefs.
>It is obvious that without such S.S. Nazi patronage the Jewish Rescue
>Committee could not have existed, and could have acted only as an
>underground.
>
>The question is, as put by the lawyer for the defense, why were the
>Nazis interested in the existence of the Rescue Committee? Why did
>the S.S. chiefs make every effort to encourage the existence of the
>Jewish Rescue Committee? Did the exterminators turn into rescuers?
>
>The same question rises concerning the rescue of prominent Jews by
>these German killers of Jews. Was the rescue of such Jews a part of
>the extermination plan of the killers ?
>
>The support given by the extermination leaders to Kastner's Rescue
>Committee proves that indeed there was a place for Kastner and his
>friends in their Final Solution for the Jews of Hungary - their total
>annihilation.
>
>The Nazi's patronage of Kastner, and their agreement to let him save
>six hundred prominent Jews, were part of the plan to exterminate the Jews.
>Kastner was given a chance to add a few more to that number. The bait
>attracted him. The opportunity of rescuing prominent people appealed
>to him greatly. He considered the rescue of the most important Jews as a
>great personal success and a success for Zionism. It was a success that
>would also justify his conduct - his political negotiation with Nazis and
>the Nazi patronage of his committee.
>
>When Kastner received this present from the Nazis, Kastner sold his
>soul to the German Satan. The sacrifice of the vital interests of the majority
>of the Jews, in order to rescue the prominents, was the basic element in the
>agreement between Kastner and the Nazis. This agreement fixed the division of
>the nation into two unequal camps: a small fragment of prominents, whom the
>Nazis promised Kastner to save, on the one hand, and the great majority of
>Hungarian Jews whom the Nazis designated for death, on the other hand.
>An imperative condition for the rescue of the first camp by the Nazis was that
>Kastner will not interfere in the action of the Nazis against the other camp
>and will not hamper them in its extermination. Kastner fulfilled this
>condition. He concentrated his efforts in the rescue of the prominents
>and treated the camp of the doomed as if they had already been wiped out
>from the book of the living.
>
>One cannot estimate the damage caused by Kastner's collaboration and
>put down the number of victims which it cost Hungarian Jews. These are not
>only the thousands of Jews in Nodvarod or any other community in the border
>area, Jews who could escape through the border, had the chief of their
>rescue committee fulfilled his duty toward them.
>
>All of Kastner's answers in his final testimony were a constant effort
>to evade this truth.
>
>Kastner has tried to escape through every crack he could find in the
>wall of evidence. When one crack was sealed in his face, he drated quickly
>to another."
>
>(Judgement of Judge Benjamin Halevi, Criminal Case 124/53; Attorney
>General
>v. Malchiel Greenwald, District Court, Jerusalem, June 22, 1955).
>
>Judge Halevi reverts to the meeting of Kastner with the S.S. officers
>Becher and Rudolf Hoess, commandant of Auschwitz at the time when the
>'new line' of rescuing Jews was revealed by Hoess. He says:
>
>"From this gathering in Budapest, it is obvious that the 'new line'
>stretched from Himmler to Hoess, from Jutner to Becher and Krumey.
>
>According to Kastner, however, these Nazis were all active in rescuing
>Jews.
>
>This meeting of these important German guests in Budapest exposes the
>'rescue' work of Becher in its true light. It reveals also the extent
>of Kastner's involvement in the inner circle of the chief German war
>criminals.
>
>Just as the Nazi war criminals knew they needed an alibi and hoped to
>achieve it by the rescue of a few Jews at the eleventh hour, so
>Kastner also needed an alibi for himself.
>
>Collaboration between the Jewish Agency Rescue Committee and the
>Exterminators of the Jews was solidifed in Budapest and Vienna.
>Kastner's duties were part and parcel of the genral duties of the S.S.
>
>In addition to its Extermination Department and Looting Department,
>the Nazi S.S. opened a Rescue Department headed by Kastner.
>
>All these extermination, robbery and rescue activities of the S.S.
>were coordinated under the management of Heinrich Himmler". (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi continues:
>
>"Kastner perjured himself knowingly in his testimony before this court
>when he denied he had interceded in Becher's hehalf. Moreover, he concealed
>the important fact that he interceded for Becher in the name of the Jewish
>Agency and the Jewish World Congress.
>
>As to the contents of Kastner's affidavit, it was enough for the
>defense to prove Becher was a war criminal. It was up to the prosecution to
>remove Becher from this status, if they wished to negate the affidavit.
>
>The Attorney General admitted in his summation that Becher was a war
>criminal.
>
>The lies in the contents of Kastner's affidavit, the lies in his
>testimony concerning the document, and Kastner's knowing participation in the
>activities of Nazi war criminals, and his participation in the last
>minute fake rescue activities - all these combine to show one overwhelming
>truth - that this affidavit was not given in good faith.
>
>Kastner knew well, as he himself testified, that Becher had never
>stood up against the stream of Jewish extermination, as Kastner has
>declared in the affidavit.
>
>The aims of Becher and his superior, Himmler, were not to save Jews
>but to serve the Nazi regime with full compliance. These is not truth
>and no good faith in Kastner's testimony, 'I never doubted for one moment
>the good intention of good Becher'.
>
>It is clear that the positive recommandation by Kastner, not only in
>his own name but also in the name of the Jewish Agency and the Jewish
>World Congress was of decisive importance for Becher. Kastner did not
>exaggerate when he said that Becher was released by the Allies because
>of his personal intervention. The lies in the affidavit of Kastner and the
>contradictions and various pretexts, which were proven to be lies, were
>sufficient to annul the value of his statements and to prove that there
>was no good faith in his testimony in favor of this German war criminal.
>Kastner's affidavit in favor of Becher was a willfully false affidavit
>given in favor of a war criminal to save him from trial and punishment
>in Nuremberg.
>
>Therefore, the defendant, Malchiel Greenwald, was correct in his
>accusations against Rudolf Kastner in the first, second and fourth of
>his statements." (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi's verdict found Malchiel Greenwald generally innocent of
>libel against Kastner, but fined him one Israeli pound for the one unproven
>accusation - that Kastner had actually collected money from his Nazi
>partners for his aide to their slaughter program. The judge also
>ordered the Government of Israel to pay Greenwald two hundred Israeli
>pounds as court costs.
>
>In fairness to Kastner it should me mentioned that as well as having
>been unpaid, it was never established that he ever wore S.S. uniform.
>
>Nevertheless, this verdict, and the evidence on which it was based,
>completely establishes the truth of everything said on 3CR about the
>matter.
>
>If the story ended there, it would only prove conclusively that the
>individual Kastner was a collaborator and the Israeli Government had
>attempted to defend him, although facts brought out in the trial
>pointed to much more than that.
>
>But the story does not end there.
>
>The Reaction
>-------------
>Public opinion in Israel was almost unanimous in demanding that
>Kastner and his associates should be put on trial. Remember that up to
>now it was Kastner's accuser who was on trial.
>
>The Communist Party newspaper Kol Ha'am (Voice of the People) wrote:
>
>"All those whose relatives were butchered by the Germans in Hungary
>know now clearly that Jewish hands helped the mass murder" (23 June 1955)
>
>In the authoritative Israeli newspaper Ha'aretz, the leading political
>journalist, Dr. Moshe Keren wrote:
>
>"Kastner must be brought to trial as a Nazi collaborator. And at this
>trial, Kastner should defend himself as a private citizen, and not be
>defended by the Israeli Government..." (14 July 1955).
>
>*Haboker*, the pro-Government General Zionist party paper stated:
>
>"The public wants to know the real facts about Kastner, and not about
>him alone. The only way to find out the truth is to put all the Rescue
>Committee people on trial and give them a chance to offer their
>defense." (23 June 1955)
>
>But public opinion was not quite unanimous. The problem with bringing
>Kastner and his associates to trial was that his associates were the
>Government of Israel.
>
>As the evening paper *Yedi'ot Aharonot* said:
>
>"If Kastner is brought to trial the entire government faces a total
>political and national collapse - as a result of what such a trial may
> disclose." (23 June 1955)
>
>Accordingly, the Government of Israel did not put Kastner on trial,
>instead it filed an appeal against the acquittal of Greenwald for criminal
>libel.
>
>As Dr. Karlebach wrote in Israel's largest evening newspaper,
>*Ma'ariv*:
>
>"What is going on here? The Attorney General has to mobilize all the
>government power, appear himself in court, to justify and defend
>collaboration with Himmler! And in order to defend a quisling, the
>government must drag through the streets one of the grimmest stories
>of our history!
>
>At 11 P.M. the verdict was given. At 11 A.M. next morning the
>government announces the defense of Kastner will be renewed - an appeal filed.
>What exemplary expediency! Since when does this government possess such
>lawyer-genius who can weigh in one night the legal chances of an
>appeal on a detailed, complex verdict of three hundred pages?! (24 June 1955)
>
>At the appeal hearings before the Supreme Court, the Attorney General
>of Israel, Chaim Cohen, explained clearly why the Government of Israel
>was defending Kastner so strongly:  "The man Kastner does not stand here
>as a private individual. He was a recognized representative, official or
>non-official of the Jewish National Institutes in Palestine and of the
>Zionist Executive; and I come here in this court to defend the
>representative of our national institutions." (Hecht, p. 268)
>
>The truth of this statement cannot be denied. Kastner's collaboration
>was not that of an individual. It was the collaboration of the Zionist
>leadership.
>
>So far, it has only been established that the Government of Israel
>continued to support a Nazi collaborator after the facts about his
>collaboration had been conclusively established in an Israeli court.
>But the story gets worse.
>
>The Supreme Court of Israel unanimously found that Becher was indeed a
>Nazi war criminal and that Kastner had without justification, and in the
>name of the Jewish Agency, helped Becher to escape justice. On this point
>Greenwald was acquitted of libel and Kastner was not 'fully rehabilitated'.
>
>The Supreme Court also accepted the FACTS established in the lower
>court - that Kastner DELIBERATELY concealed the truth about Auschwitz from the
>majority of Hungarian Jews in exchange for Nazi permission to take a
>thousand or so to Palestine. Again, Kastner was far from being 'fully
>rehabilitated'.
>
>The Majority Judgement
>-------------------------
>But now comes the really nasty bit. After unanimously acknowledging
>these FACTS, the Supreme Court of Israel, by a majority of three to two,
>found that Kastner's actions were MORALLY JUSTIFIABLE and convicted
>Greenwald of criminal libel for calling this 'collaboration'.
>
>In saying that 3CR broadcasts concealed the fact that Kastner had been
>fully rehabilitated by the Israeli Supreme Court, Dr. Foster is
>totally missing the point.
>
>Kastner's actions only proved that HE was a Nazi collaborator. It is
>the defense of these actions by the Government and Courts of Israel that
>prove conclusively that ZIONISM approves of Nazi collaboration.
>
>The majority of the Supreme Court of Israel did not REHABILITATE
>Kastner.
>They JOINED him.
>
>Let us read from the majority judgement of Supreme Court Judge Shlomo
>Chesin:
>
>"...What point was there in telling the people boarding the trains in
>Kluj, people struck by fate and persecuted, as to what awaits them at the
>end of their journey...Kastner spoke in detail of the situation, saying,
>'The Hungarian Jew was a branch which long ago dried up on the tree'. This
>vivid description coincides with the testimony of another witness about the
>Hungarian Jews, 'This was a big Jewish community in Hungary, without any
>ideological Jewish backbone' (Moshe Shweiger, a Kastner aide in Budapest,
>protocol 465).
>
>I fully agree with my friend, Judge Agranot, when he states that, 'The
>Jews of Hungary, including those in the countryside, were not capable,
>neither physically nor mentally, to carry out resistance operations with force
>against the deportation scheme'...From this point of view no rescue
>achievement could have resulted by disclosing the Auschwitz news to
>the Jewish leaders there, and this...is a consideration which on can
>properly conclude that Kastner had in front of his eyes.
>
>.And I take one more step. I am certain that the silence of Kastner
>when he arrived in Kluj was premeditated and calculated and did not result
>from his great dispair because of the helplessness of the Jewish community.
>Even then, I say, this is still not considered willful collaboration and
>assistance in the extermination, because all the signs indicate that
>Kastner's efforts were aimed at rescue and rescue on a big scale...And
>towards the end I take one last step. In doing so I go very far and
>say that even if Kastner ordered himself to keep silent knowingly, in
>submission to the strong will of the Nazis, in order to save a few
>Jews from Hell - this is still no proof that he stained his hands by
>collaborating with the enemies of his people and carrying out their
>plan to exterminate most of the Jewish community in Hungary.
>
>Even if, through these activities of his - or rather, his omission -
>the extermination became easier. And as to the moral issue, the question
>is not whether a man is allowed to kill many in order to save a few, or
>vice-versa. The question is altogether in another sphere and should be
>defined as follows: A man is aware that a whole community is awaiting
>its doom. He is allowed to make efforts to save a few, although part of
>his efforts involve concealment of truth from the many or should he
>disclose the truth to many though it is his best opinion that this way
>everybody will perish. I think that the answer is clear. What good will the
>blood of the few bring if everybody is to perish?...As I said, I am not arguing
>with the basic factual findings of the learned President of the Jewish
>District Court (Judge Halevi) but it seems to me, with all due respect, that
>his findings do not, as of necessity, demand the conclusion he has arrived
>at.
>That is to say, collaboration on the part of Kastner in the extermination
>of the Jews. And that they better coincide with bad leadership both
>from a moral and public point of view...
>
>In my opinion, one can say outright that if you find out that Kastner
>collaborated with the enemy because he did not disclose to the people
>who boarded the trains in Kluj that they were being led to extermination,
>one has to put on trial today Danzig, Herman, Hanzi, Brand, Revis and
>Marton, and many more leaders and half-leaders who gagged themselves in an
>hour of crisis and did not inform others of what was known to them and did not
>warn and did not cry out of the coming danger....
>
>Because of all this I cannot confirm the conclusion of the District Court
>with regard to the accusation that Greenwald has thrown on Kastner of
>collaboration with the Nazis in exterminating the Jewish people in
>Hungary during the last war." (Hecht, ibid, pp.270-2)
>
>In other words, the Court approved of Kastner's contempt for the
>Hungarian Jews and could not allow him to be condemned for doing exactly what
>many other Zionist leaders had half-leaders did - concealing their
>knowledge of the Nazi extermination plans so that Jews would board the trains to
>Auschwitz peacefully while their Zionist 'leaders' boarded a different
>train for Palestine.
>
>The Minority Judgement
>--------------------------
>It cannot be said that ALL top Zionists leaders actively approved of
>Nazi collaboration in this way. Indeed the most precise answer to this
>sickening judgement of Judge Chesin is provided in the minority judgement of
>Supreme Court Judge Moshe Silberg:
>
>"I do not say that he was the only man who possessed information among
>the leaders. It is quite possible that somebody else as well does not have
>a clear conscience with regards to this concealment. But we are dealing
>here with the guilt of Kastner and we do not have to make judgements on the
>guilt of others....
>
>The declaration of the learned Attorney General therefore shrinks into
>an opinion....'Kastner was convinced and believed that there was no ray
>of hope for the Jews of Hungary, almost for none of them, and as he, as a
>result of his personal dispair, did not disclose the secret of the
>extermination in order not to endanger or frustrate the rescue of the
>few - therefore he acted in good faith and should not be accused of
>collaborating with the Nazis in expediting the extermination of the Jews,
>even though, in fact, he brought about its result.'
>
>I am compelled to state that it is very difficult for me to conceive
>such an intention. Is this good faith? Can a single man, even in
>cooperation with some of his friends, yield to despair on behalf and
>without the knowledge of 800,000 other people? This is, in my opinion, the
>decisive consideration in the problem facing us. The charge emanating from
>the testimony of the witnesses against Kastner is that had they known of
>the Auschwitz secret, then thousands or tens of thousands would have been
>able to save their lives by local, partial, specific or indirect rescue
>operations like local revolts, resistance, escapes, hidings,
>concealment of children with Gentiles, forging of documents, ransom money,
>bribery, etc - and when this is the case and when one deals with many hundreds
>of thousands, how does a human being, a mortal, reject with complete
>certainty and with an extreme 'no' the efficiency of all the many and varied
>rescue ways? How can he examine the tens of thousands of possibilities? Does
>he decide instead of God? Indeed, he who can act with such a usurpation
>of the last hope of hundreds of thousands is not entitled to claim good faith
>as his defense. The penetrating question quo warrento is a good answer to
>a claim of such good faith...
>
>If the superintendent of a big hospital lets thousands of sick people
>die so that he may devote himself to the sure rescue of one soul, he will
>come out guilty, at least morally, even if it is proven that he as an
>individual erroneously thought that there was no hope of saving the other
>patients. He is a collaborator with the angel of death.
>
>Either a complete atrophy of the soul or a blind involvement with
>complete loss of senses and proportion in his small but personal rescue
>operation could bring a man to such a gigantic, hazardous play.
>
>And if all this is not enough to annul the claim of good faith which
>was put before us on behalf of Kastner by the Attorney General, then
>Kastner himself comes and annuls it altogether. Not only did he never make
>this claim, but his own words prove the contrary. He writes in his report
>to the Jewish Agency that the Committee sent emissaries to many ghettos in
>the countryside and pleaded with them to organize escapes and to refuse to
>board the trains. And though the story of these pleadings is untrue,
>and the silence of Kastner in Kluj is proven, the very uttering of these
>statements entirely contradicts the claim that Kastner had concealed
>the news about the fate of the ghetto inmates in good faith and only as a
>result of his complete despairing of the chances of escaping or
>resisting the Germans. You can not claim at the same time helplessness and
>activity.
>Anyway, such a claim is not convincing...
>
>We can sum up with three facts:
>A. That the Nazis didn't want to have a great revolt - 'Second Warsaw'
>- nor small revolts, and their passion was to have the extermination
>machine working smoothly without resistance. This fact was known to Kastner
>from the best source - from Eichmann himself - And he had additional proofs
>of that when he witnessed all the illusionary and misleading tactics
>which were being taken by the Nazis from the first moment of occupation.
>B. That the most efficient means to paralyze the resistance with - or
>the escape of a victim is to conceal from him the plot of the coming
>murder.
>This fact is known to every man and one does not need any proof of
>evidence for this.
>C. That he, Kastner, in order to carry out the rescue plan for the few
>prominents, fulfilled knowingly and without good faith the said desire
>of the Nazis, thus expediting the work of exterminating the masses.
>
>And also the rescue of Becher by Kastner...He who is capable of
>rescuing this Becher from hanging proves that the atrocities of this great
>war criminal were not so horryfying or despicable in his eyes...I couldn't
>base the main guilt of Kastner on this fact had it been alone, but when it
>is attached even from afar to the whole scene of events it throws
>retroactive light on the whole affair and serves as a dozen proofs of our
>conclusion." (Supreme Court Judge, Moshe Silberg, 1957)
>
>Conclusion
>-----------
>If that had been the majority judgement, one could say that whatever
>their attitudes to the Arabs, and whatever their past behaviour might have
>been under pressure, the Zionist leadership today did not advocate
>collaboration with the Nazis.
>
>One could then at least understand the complaints by Mr. Bloch,
>President of the Victorian Jewish Board of Deputies, about the 'dragging in
>of alleged episodes in the history of Jewish/Nazi relationships'.
>
>But Judge Silberg's judgement was that of a minority.
>
>The Kastner case is therefore not an alleged episode in past history,
>being 'dragged in' to discredit an opponent.
>
>It is a continuing controversy in which the top Zionist leadership of
>Israel stand indicted of continuing to publicly defend collaboration
>with the Nazis in the extermination of Jews.
>
>Despite the unanimous finding of the Supreme Court of Israel that Kurt
>Becher was a major war criminal, the Jewish Agency (World Zionist
>Organization) refused to withdraw the fraudulent certificate Kastner
>gave on their behalf, which saved Becher from hanging, and allowed him to
>remain a free man in West Germany, the head of several corporations and with
>an estimated personal worth of $30 million.
>
>Becher has even used his certification as a 'good' SS officer to give
>evidence in support of his associates at other war crimes trials in
>West Germany.
>
>Since the prosecution, representing the Israeli Government agreed with
>the Supreme Court that Becher was a major war criminal, one can only
>presure that the Israeli Government did not want him put on trial for
>fear of what might come out.
>
>Likewise, none of Kastner's associates on the Zionist Relief and
>Rescue Committee or his bosses in the Jewish Agency have ever been put on
>trial as demanded by Israeli public opinion. Let alone the hundreds of
>'prominents' who helped Kastner to reassure the Hungarian Jews that they
>were going to Kenyermeze and not Auschwitz, in exchange for tickets on
>the one train that took them eventually to Palestine.
>
>As for Kastner himself, he will cause no further embarassment to the
>Zionist leadership with his undisputed claims that everything he did
>was approved by the Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) leadership
>in Palestine. He is, as Dr. Foster so delicately puts it, 'now dead'. Or
>putting it less delicately, on 3 March 1957 he was shot by Zeer
>Eckstein - immediately after the appeal hearings were concluded, and
>before the judgement 'rehabilitating' him was delivered. Eckstein was
>not a Hungarian avenger. He was a paid undercover agent of the Israeli
>secret service.
>(Hecht, ibid., p.208. Another 'fantastic allegation' no doubt; but
>admitted in court during the murder trial).
>
>Clearly this issue has a major indirect relevance to the Arab-Israeli
>dispute. Apart from countering Israel's cynical use of the holocaust
>as a propaganda weapon, it answers a very real concern that many people
>have about the State of Israel and the Jews. This concern is whether,
>if Jews had a State of their own during the holocaust many more could
>have been saved, and whether this is not an essential future consideration,
>at least as an insurance policy.
>
>The facts of the Kastner case show that the very existence of the
>Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) was an actual help to the Nazis
>and that more could have been saved if the Zionist movement had not
>existed.
>Having a State that approves of actions like those of Kastner for an
>insurance policy, is like using petro for a fire extinguisher.
>
>Zionism is not the answer to anti-semitism, but a cowardly proposal to
>run away from it. The only answer to anti-semitism is to fight back.
>
>We shall go on to prove this in detail.
>-------------------------------------------------------------------
>Elias Davidsson - Oldugata 50 - 101 Reykjavik - Iceland
>Tel. (354)-552-6444     Fax: (354)-552-6579
>Email: edavid@itn.is     URL:  http://www.nyherji.is/~edavid


If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
then visit  www.freedomsite.org

Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

"At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
is a revolutionary act."
(George Orwell)

David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'

"All truth passes through three stages.
First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
(Arthur Schopenhauer)

"The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
against them -- except force." -- John Bryant

"To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
and impossible to ignore."
--John Bryant


Posted by:
Patrick Lee Humphrey
7500 Bellerive #1807
Houston, Texas 77036-3040
1-713-266-7764

Steven Horn (KCOM)
1836 NW 11th St
Oklahoma City, OK 73106
(405) 524-0576

together with
Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive &
Henry
CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even
VISIT me at:
55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132

We all like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
We are together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
We like young children, so that we can train them our way.


Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
office: VISIT at:
#5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
or call: 1-250-616-9431

As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is
called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material
should give an indication as to the why.

"I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]

Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like
a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
even if he or she were not naked"?
http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg

For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David
Michael's
detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and
is
known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a
grosvenor!!
It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases,
just
to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.

Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: Flavia18@verizon.net, especially
late nights.

Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or
send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
work:(780)492-0473

And also: George Firestone: "George" ,
and davejoll@ihug.co.nz.

Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!

For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
JEW-WATCH:
http://www.jewwatch.com

Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!

Or, other useful websites include:
ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
IHR - www.ihr.org
OSTARA - www.ostara.org
PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press,
    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com

Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
They have lots of information, as well as books and records.

They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.

As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a
victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.

In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
for many years around the world.



On Thu, 29 Jun 2006 07:21:14 GMT, "princeandy"  wrote:

>WHAT DOUBTS????
>
>>Here then are excerpts from the verdict of Judge Halevi, who later
>>became one of the panel of three judges that tried Eichmann:
>>
>>"The masses of Jews from Hungary's ghettos obediently boarded the
>>deportation trains without knowing their fate. They were full of
>>confidence in the false information that they were being transferred to
>>Kenyermeze.
>>
>>The Nazis could not have misled the masses of Jews so conclusively had
>>they not spread their false information through Jewish channels.
>>
>>The Jews of the ghettos would not have trusted the Nazi or Hungarian
>>rulers. But they had trust in their Jewish leaders. Eichmann and
>>others used this known fact as part of their calculated plan to mislead
>>the Jews.
>>They were able to deport the Jews to their extermination by the help
>>of Jewish leaders.
>>
>>The false information was spread by the Jewish leaders. The local
>>leaders of the Jews of Kluj and Nodvarod knew that other leaders were
>>spreading such false information and did not protest.
>>
>>Those of the Jews who tried to warn their friends of the truth were
>>persecuted by the Jewish leaders in charge of the local 'rescue work'.
>>
>>The trust of the Jews in the misleading information and their lack of
>>knowledge that their wives, children and themselves were about to be
>>deported to the gas chambers of Auschwitz led the victims to remain
>>quiescent in their ghettos. It seduced them into not resisting or
>>hampering the deportation orders.
>>
>>Dozens of thousands of Jews were guarded in their ghettos by a few
>>dozen police. Yet even vigorous young Jews made no attemptt to overpower
>>these few guards and escape to nearby Rumania. No resistance activities to
>>the deportations were organized in these ghettos.
>>
>>And the Jewish leaders did everything in their power to soothe the
>>Jews in the ghettos and to prevent such resistance activities.
>>
>>The same Jews who spread in Kluj and Nodvarod the false rumor of
>>Kenyermeze, or confirmed it, the same public leaders who did not warn
>>their own people against the misleading statements, the same Jewish leaders
>>who did not organize any resistance or any sabotage of
>>deportations...these same leaders did not join the people of their
>community
>>in their ride to Auschwitz, but were all included in the Rescue train.
>>
>>The Nazi organizers of extermination and the perpetrators of
>>extermination permitted Rudolf Kastner and the members of the Jewish
>Council
>>in Budapest to save themselves, their relatives, and friends. The Nazis did
>>this as a means of making the local Jewish leaders, whom they favoured,
>>dependent on the Nazi regime, dependent on its good will during the time of
>>its fatal deportation schedule. In short, the Nazis succeeded in bringing
>the
>>Jewish leaders into oollaboration with the Nazis at the time of the
>>catastrophe.
>>
>>The Nazi chiefs knew that the Zionists were a most vital element in
>>Jewry and the most trusted by the Jews.
>>
>>The Nazis drew a lesson from the Warsaw ghetto and other belligerent
>>ghettos. They learned that Jews were able to sell their lives very
>>expensively if honorably guided.
>>
>>Eichmann did not want a second Warsaw. For this reason, the Nazis
>>exerted themselves to mislead and bribe the Jewish leaders.
>>
>>The personality of Rudolph Kastner made him a convenient catspaw for
>>Eichmann and his clique, to draw into collaboration and make their
>>task easier.
>>
>>The question here is not, as stated by the Attorney General in his
>>summation, whether members of the Jewish Rescue Committee were or were
>>not capable of fulfilling their duty without the patronage of the S.S.
>>chiefs.
>>It is obvious that without such S.S. Nazi patronage the Jewish Rescue
>>Committee could not have existed, and could have acted only as an
>>underground.
>>
>>The question is, as put by the lawyer for the defense, why were the
>>Nazis interested in the existence of the Rescue Committee? Why did
>>the S.S. chiefs make every effort to encourage the existence of the
>>Jewish Rescue Committee? Did the exterminators turn into rescuers?
>>
>>The same question rises concerning the rescue of prominent Jews by
>>these German killers of Jews. Was the rescue of such Jews a part of
>>the extermination plan of the killers ?
>>
>>The support given by the extermination leaders to Kastner's Rescue
>>Committee proves that indeed there was a place for Kastner and his
>>friends in their Final Solution for the Jews of Hungary - their total
>>annihilation.
>>
>>The Nazi's patronage of Kastner, and their agreement to let him save
>>six hundred prominent Jews, were part of the plan to exterminate the Jews.
>>Kastner was given a chance to add a few more to that number. The bait
>>attracted him. The opportunity of rescuing prominent people appealed
>>to him greatly. He considered the rescue of the most important Jews as a
>>great personal success and a success for Zionism. It was a success that
>>would also justify his conduct - his political negotiation with Nazis and
>>the Nazi patronage of his committee.
>>
>>When Kastner received this present from the Nazis, Kastner sold his
>>soul to the German Satan. The sacrifice of the vital interests of the
>majority
>>of the Jews, in order to rescue the prominents, was the basic element in
>the
>>agreement between Kastner and the Nazis. This agreement fixed the division
>of
>>the nation into two unequal camps: a small fragment of prominents, whom the
>>Nazis promised Kastner to save, on the one hand, and the great majority of
>>Hungarian Jews whom the Nazis designated for death, on the other hand.
>>An imperative condition for the rescue of the first camp by the Nazis was
>that
>>Kastner will not interfere in the action of the Nazis against the other
>camp
>>and will not hamper them in its extermination. Kastner fulfilled this
>>condition. He concentrated his efforts in the rescue of the prominents
>>and treated the camp of the doomed as if they had already been wiped out
>>from the book of the living.
>>
>>One cannot estimate the damage caused by Kastner's collaboration and
>>put down the number of victims which it cost Hungarian Jews. These are not
>>only the thousands of Jews in Nodvarod or any other community in the border
>>area, Jews who could escape through the border, had the chief of their
>>rescue committee fulfilled his duty toward them.
>>
>>All of Kastner's answers in his final testimony were a constant effort
>>to evade this truth.
>>
>>Kastner has tried to escape through every crack he could find in the
>>wall of evidence. When one crack was sealed in his face, he drated quickly
>>to another."
>>
>>(Judgement of Judge Benjamin Halevi, Criminal Case 124/53; Attorney
>>General
>>v. Malchiel Greenwald, District Court, Jerusalem, June 22, 1955).
>>
>>Judge Halevi reverts to the meeting of Kastner with the S.S. officers
>>Becher and Rudolf Hoess, commandant of Auschwitz at the time when the
>>'new line' of rescuing Jews was revealed by Hoess. He says:
>>
>>"From this gathering in Budapest, it is obvious that the 'new line'
>>stretched from Himmler to Hoess, from Jutner to Becher and Krumey.
>>
>>According to Kastner, however, these Nazis were all active in rescuing
>>Jews.
>>
>>This meeting of these important German guests in Budapest exposes the
>>'rescue' work of Becher in its true light. It reveals also the extent
>>of Kastner's involvement in the inner circle of the chief German war
>>criminals.
>>
>>Just as the Nazi war criminals knew they needed an alibi and hoped to
>>achieve it by the rescue of a few Jews at the eleventh hour, so
>>Kastner also needed an alibi for himself.
>>
>>Collaboration between the Jewish Agency Rescue Committee and the
>>Exterminators of the Jews was solidifed in Budapest and Vienna.
>>Kastner's duties were part and parcel of the genral duties of the S.S.
>>
>>In addition to its Extermination Department and Looting Department,
>>the Nazi S.S. opened a Rescue Department headed by Kastner.
>>
>>All these extermination, robbery and rescue activities of the S.S.
>>were coordinated under the management of Heinrich Himmler". (ibid)
>>
>>Judge Halevi continues:
>>
>>"Kastner perjured himself knowingly in his testimony before this court
>>when he denied he had interceded in Becher's hehalf. Moreover, he concealed
>>the important fact that he interceded for Becher in the name of the Jewish
>>Agency and the Jewish World Congress.
>>
>>As to the contents of Kastner's affidavit, it was enough for the
>>defense to prove Becher was a war criminal. It was up to the prosecution to
>>remove Becher from this status, if they wished to negate the affidavit.
>>
>>The Attorney General admitted in his summation that Becher was a war
>>criminal.
>
>"Salah Jafar"  wrote in message
>news:9Zamg.4103$DI2.3584@trnddc05...
>Europe doubts Israel's claims
>
>THERE IS NO DOBT THE ONLY DOUBT IS WHO IS TO BLAME FOR THE WHOLE MESS? DID
>THE JEWS/ZIONISTS CAUSE THE WHOLE MESS AND THEN SUFFER THE FAITH OF BEINGING
>IMPRISONED WHEN THE WHOLE POPULATION WAS STARVING.
>AS THE ALLIED  WINNERS THEMSELVES WERE ON SEVERE RATIONING, WHICH WAS A GOOD
>THING FOR SOME COUNTRIES WHERE HEART AND OTHER PROBLEMS INDUCED BY SMOKING
>AND OVER EATING WERE DOWN DURING WAR YEARS.
>
>
>
>TIME ACADEMICS STOPPED  JEWS AND SUPPORTERS TO ENJOYING  A GOOD LIVING  ON
>LIES AND DISHONEST PRACTICES IN CORRUPTING OUR HISTORY WHILE SUPPORTING THE
>JAILING OF  HONEST ACADEMICS TRYING TO PRESENT AND INCORPORATE THE TRUTH IN
>WHAT IS MAINLY OUR HISTORY OF WWII AND NOT THE SOLE PROPERTY OF THE
>JEWQW/ZIONIST/ISRAELI CLIQUE TO USE TO SUPPORT FURTHER LIES AND
>MISREPRESENTATIONS ABOUT THE PRACTICES OF THE ZIONISTS AND SAME GROUP WHO
>ARE IN POWER IN ISRAEL.
>
>"Yisroel Markov"  wrote in message
>news:c58u72tfjrt2dafgrbko9qs33rutp5jh5h@4ax.com...
>> UK to Israeli Profs: Class Dismissed
>> ------------------------------------
>> The weird movement to boycott Israeli academics
>> By Ari Paul
>
>NOTHING WEIRD , THE WEIRD IS THE STANDING BACK AND ACTUALLY ALLOWING THE
>PAMPERED AND EGOTISTICAL JEWISH/ZIONIST/ISRAELI ACADEMICS BLUFF THEM INTO
>NOT CONTRADICTING ALL THE LIES THEY HAVE ACTUALLY MADE A PART OF WWII
>HISTORY AND ALLOWED AND SUPPORTED THE JAILING OF JEWISH AND NONJEWISH
>HISTORIANS DOING NO MORE THAN THEIR JOB BY MAKING AN HONEST EVALUATION OF
>THE HOLOCAUST CLAIMS AS NOT SUPPORTED BY HISTORICAL FACT.
>
>AND IN SO DOING SUPPORTING THE LIES AND PROPAGANDA SPREAD BY ISRAEL AND
>SUPPORTERS WHO ARE NOT EITHER LOYAL CITIZENS OR HONEST MEN/WOMEN.
>
>ALLOWING THESE FRAUDS TO ENJOY A GOOD LIVING WHILE ALLOWING HONEST ACADEMICS
>TO BE PERSECUTED.
>
>WALK OPENLY OVER OUR , I HOPE, STRONGLY HELD BELIEFS OF FREEDOM OF SPEECH
>AND ASSOCIATION. AND RIGHTS THAT THEY HAVE NEVER INCORPORATED OR PRACTISED
>IN ANY STATE IN WHICH THEY HAVE HAD A POSITION OF CONTROL.
>
>WARNING To People in Austria; Belgium; France; Germany;
>Israel; Spain and Switzerland. You can be fined,imprisoned or both for
>discussing the topics set forth in this article.
>
>Israeli stats
>http://www.ifamericansknew.org/
>
>
>Jews and Palestinians genetically similar.
>http://www.khazaria.com/genetics/abstracts.html
>
>War without end
>http://www.itszone.co.uk/zone0/viewtopic.php?t=39590
>
>
>Yes and you have no quarrel with the US?
>They dont have to, they use their army to shoot, run over and mistreat
>physically and sexually helpless children. What can a Palestinian do when
>the mighty money contributing yanks cannot protect their citizens.
>
>http://www.thenausea.com/elements/thenotforgotten/rachel/index.html
>http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/16/rafah.death/
>http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/79400p-72974c.html
>One guy gets 10 years, the other gets a raise and promotion??
>
>And the chimp smirks on
>_ HYPERLINK "http://www.smirkingchimp.com/print.php?sid=26276" __
>http://www.smirkingchimp.com/print.php?sid=26276
>
>
>
>http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/01AA7ECA-7018-447B-A10D-9E4139D4788A.
>htm
>
>_
>American and Australian shot by Israelis
>Chris McGreal talks to the relatives of three British and American victims
>http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,1066817,00.html
>http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/16/rafah.death/
>http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,1066817,00.html
>http://www.rachelcorrie.org/
>
>http://www.thenausea.com/elements/thenotforgotten/rachel/index.html
>
>http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,916299,00.html
>http://www.omjp.org/rachelphotos.html
>http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8853425952359751341&q=Palestinian+p
>eople
>
>
>http://www.nogw.com/israeliatrocities.html
>http://www.palestinefacts.org/index.php
>http://www.palestinechronicle.com/story-2003112917164320.htm
>http://thirdworldtraveler.com/Israel/IsraelsTortureBan.html
>
>http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0197/9701007.htm
>
>Christian homes being knocked down???
>http://sf.indymedia.org/news/2003/05/1607911.php
>
>
>(Wanderer, Oct. 12, 1989, p. 7; National Review, March 16, 1992, p. S-5).
>
>Israeli soldiers can beat up a priest on the West Bank, then shoot up his
>church during Mass, and only the Catholic press takes note...If Christians
>had done such a thing to a synagogue, anywhere, it would have been
>front-page news, everywhere. (Wanderer, Oct. 12, 1989, p. 7; National
>Review, March 16, 1992, p. S-5).
>
>Farmers harassed and shot in israel
>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3757004.stm
>http://www.itszone.co.uk/zone0/viewtopic.php?t=53042
>
>
>Zionist settler deliberately hits and kills Palestinian old man
>http://www.palestine-info.co.uk/am/publish/article_3293.shtml
>http://www.palestine-info.co.uk/am/publish/article_3396.shtml
>http://judicial-inc.biz/School_shooting.htm
>
>
>
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.nationalism.white/msg/20deae4bed
>c378ab?q=&rnum=1
>In a letter to the conference host, UNESCO Director-General Koichiro
>Matsuura,
>the protesters said the Wiesenthal center, "under the deceitful cover of the
>struggle against anti-Semitism, is on the contrary encouraging intolerance
>and
>racism in our societies."
>
>Jon and David Kimche
>http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v13/v13n4p29_Weber.html
>The SS was particularly enthusiastic in its support for Zionism. An internal
>June 1934 SS position paper urged active and wide-ranging support for
>Zionism by the government and the Party as the best way to encourage
>emigration of Germany's Jews to Palestine.
>
>The Jewish Agency delegation headed by Golda Meir (Meirson) ignored a German
>offer to allow Jews to emigrate to other countries for $250 a head, and the
>other Jewish groups  made no effort to influence the United States and the
>32 other countries attending the conference to allow immigration of German
>and Austrian Jews.
>http://www.jews-for-allah.org/Jews-not-for-Judaism/Jews-who-helped-nazis-hit
>ler.htm
>
>
>Marlon Brando.
>http://www.theunjustmedia.com/ben%20stein%20on%20jewish%20media%20control.ht
>m
>
>If one wants to exterminate an entire race, one would start with the leaders
>first and
>
>Why did Rabbi Baeck never leave the Third Reich
>
>On March 24, 1933, the Jewish World Congress, then under the leadership of
>Chaim
>Holocaust Calendar
>Jewish dominance
>
>Rabbi to Publish Book on Jewish Supremacy
>... One is Rabbi Saadya Grama, author of an upcoming book "On the Exalted
>Nature of Israel and Understanding ... Written by Rabbi Saadya Grama - an
>alumnus of Beth Medrash Govoha, the ...
>more hits from:
>ttp://atheism.about.com/b/a/057831.htm?terms=published+book  -  25 KB
>
>The Jews declared war against Germany
>On March 24, 1933, the Jewish World Congress, then under the leadership of
>Chaim Weizman, declared war on Germany on behalf of the Jews of the world.
>http://www.corax.org/revisionism/misc/encampment.html
>
>
>http://www.rense.com/general45/zzo.htm
>The Zionist Jewish Role In  - Causing World War II
>"In 1941, a Jewish writer, Theodor N. Kaufman, wrote Germany Must Perish.
>Kaufman set out a plan for the total destruction of the German population by
>a very simple method: the mass sterilisation of all German men and women
>between the age of puberty and sixty years."
>
>From a pre-1993 edition of John Tyndall's Spearhead magazine
>12-9-3
>
>
>
>http://www.corax.org/revisionism/misc/encampment.html
>Immediately after Japan declared war on the United States of America, the
>order was issued to round up all Americans of Japanese ancestry and imprison
>them in large camps. A declaration of war entitles any nation to imprison
>its enemy and their sympathizers.
>On March 24, 1933, the Jewish World Congress, then under the leadership of
>Chaim Weizman, declared war on Germany on behalf of the Jews of the world.
>The basic question arises; what were the Germans supposed to do with their
>large Jewish population?
>
>http://www.heretical.com/mkilliam/wwii.html
>That second war was later made certain, not by the intentions of Hitler but
>by the determination of his eternal enemies to destroy the new Germany that
>he had created.
>By the Treaty of Versailles on 28 June 1919 and the Treaty of St. Germain on
>20 September of the same year, the German people were thoroughly humiliated.
>The British Prime Minister, Lloyd George, wrote:
>'The international bankers swept statesmen, politicians, journalists and
>jurists all to one side and issued their orders with the imperiousness of
>absolute monarchs.'
>
>
>
>
>http://www.msnbc.com/news/606092.asp?0si=-&cp1=1
>Who has said, America and Israel? I'll pick Israel every time. That is a guy
>who was educated, worked in intelligence in the air force in America
>ALIEN CONTROL
>Is US like Germany of the '30s? Published on Friday, June 11, 2004 by the
>Chicago Sun Times  by Andrew Greeley
>http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0611-10.htm
>
>The Daily Mail reported on 10 July 1933:
>'The German nation, moreover, was rapidly falling under the control of its
>alien elements. In the last days of the pre-Hitler regime there were twenty
>times as many Jewish government officials in Germany as had existed before
>the war. Israelites of international attachments were insinuating themselves
>into key positions in the German administrative machine.'
>Resentment and resistance began to build up against the alien horde and in
>the year before Adolf Hitler came to power Bernard Lecache, President of the
>World Jewish League, stated:
>'Germany is our public enemy number one. It is our object to declare war
>without mercy against her.'
>On that same day, 24 March 1933, on the front page of the London Daily
>Express appeared the main headlines: "Judaea declares war on Germany: Jews
>of all the world unite", and followed with:
>'The Israelite people of the entire world declare economic and financial war
>on Germany. The appearance of the Swastika as the symbol of the new Germany
>revives the old war symbol of the Jews. Fourteen million Jews stand as one
>body to declare war on Germany. The Jewish wholesale dealer leaves his
>business, the banker his bank, the shopkeeper his shop, the beggar his
>miserable hut in order to combine forces in the holy war against Hitler's
>people.'
>The German government was removing Jews from influential positions and
>transferring power back to the German people. This declaration of war by the
>Jews on Germany was repeated throughout the world. The first boycott of
>Jewish business concerns came after this Jewish declaration of war in April
>1933.
>
>
>http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/Holocaust/stlouis.html
>
>http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/opposition/cannonfodder.htm
>We implore and beseech our Jewish brethren to realize that the Zionists are
>not the saviours of the Jewish People and guarantors of their safety, but
>rather the instigators and original cause of Jewish suffering in the Holy
>Land and worldwide.
>
>
>http://www.aldeilis.net/zion/zionhol01.html
>
>The Zionist Federation of Germany (ZVfD), an organisation representing a
>tiny minority of German Jews, was selected by the Nazis as the body to
>represent the Jews of the Reich.
>The best example of this was the 'Transfer Agreement' of 1934. Immediately
>after the Nazi takeover in 1933, Jews all over the world supported or were
>organising a world wide boycott of German goods. This campaign hurt the Nazi
>regime and the German authorities searched frantically for a way disabling
>the boycott. It was clear that if Jews and Jewish organisations were to pull
>out, the campaign would collapse.
>This problem was solved by the ZVfD. A letter sent to the Nazi party as
>early as 21.6.33, outlined the degree of agreement that existed between the
>two organisations on the questions of race, nation, and the nature of the
>'Jewish problem', and it offered to collaborate with the new regime:
>
>In their eagerness to gain credence and the backing of the new regime, the
>Zionist organisation managed to undermine the boycott. The main public act
>was the signature of the 'Transfer Agreement' with the Nazi authorities
>during the Zionist Congress of 1934. In essence, the agreement was designed
>to get Germany's Jews out of the country and into Mandate Palestine. It
>provided a possibility for Jews to take a sizeable part of their property
>out of the country, through a transfer of German goods to Palestine. This
>right was denied to Jews leaving for any other destination (emphasis - ED).
>The Zionist Organisation was the acting agent, through its financial
>organisations. This agreement operated on a number of fronts 'helping' Jews
>to leave the country, breaking the ring of the boycott, exporting German
>goods in large quantities to Palestine, and last but not least, enabling the
>regime to be seen as humane and reasonable even towards its avowed enemies,
>the Jews. After all, they argued, the Jews do not belong in Europe and now
>the Jews come and agree with them.
>
>After news of the agreement broke, the boycott was doomed. If the Zionist
>Organisation found it possible and necessary to deal with the Nazis, and
>import their goods, who could argue for a boycott? This was not the first
>time that the interests of both movements were presented to the German
>public as complementary. Baron Von Mildenstein, the first head of the Jewish
>Department of the SS, later followed by Eichmann, was invited to travel to
>Palestine. This he did in early 1933, in the company of a Zionist leader,
>Kurt Tuchler. Having spent six months in Palestine, he wrote a series of
>favourable articles in Der Sturmer describing the 'new Jew' of Zionism, a
>Jew Nazis could accept and understand.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>The declared enemy was now right in the middle of their country. Bankers,
>industrialists, media moguls, movie producers, merchants, and others,
>overnight became enemies of Germany.
>No nation in the world would have allowed their declared enemies to freely
>roam around the country. The Germans, however, never implemented measures
>against the Jews as drastic as the United States did with their Japanese
>citizens.
>
>http://www.corax.org/revisionism/misc/encampment.html
>On March 24, 1933, the Jewish World Congress, then under the leadership of
>Chaim Weizman, declared war on Germany on behalf of the Jews of the world.
>
>thousands of Jews were not bothered by the Nazis or by the fate of their
>"convicted" co-religionists. They went on with their daily lives in Germany
>while the world was running amok about the "harsh treatment of Jews in
>Germany." To illustrate the true "fate of the Jews," one has to look at some
>of the prominent Jewish leaders living in Germany at the time.
>These are very important questions, because so many prominent Jews survived
>the alleged Holocaust. Simon Wiesenthal, Eli Wiesel, Leo Baeck, Max
>Nussbaum, and so many more like them. As a matter of fact, approximately 4.5
>million Jews "survived."
>
>Why did Rabbi Baeck never leave the Third Reich, the land of concentration
>camps and "gas chambers," with all the other 300,000 German Jews who were
>allowed to leave for more lucrative lands?
>
>
>By all accounts, Rabbi Dr. Leo Baeck must have had a very comfortable
>existence under the National Socialist Government in Germany. Born in 1873
>in Posen, he became a Rabbi in 1897 in Oppeln/Silesia. Interestingly, he was
>a Rabbi in Berlin from 1912 until 1943, when he himself was interned at the
>Theresienstadt camp, a camp where most of the prominent Jews and resistance
>activists were housed. After the war Leo Baeck immigrated to England.
>
>Why did Rabbi Baeck never leave the Third Reich, the land of concentration
>camps and "gas chambers," with all the other 300,000 German Jews who were
>allowed to leave for more lucrative lands?
>
>Another question should be put to all those false Holocaust "experts" by
>asking them how many Jews were gassed in Dachau? As a matter of fact, no one
>was ever "gassed" in Germany, or in territories under German control, as has
>been established in court
>
>In Schuld und Schicksal (Guilt and Fate) Burg dealt with the Warsaw and Lodz
>ghettos. When the German troops occupied Warsaw, they wanted to concentrate
>the Jewish population. Real ghettos had been there for centuries but the
>assimilated or emancipated Jews had lived far way from the ghettos. Now the
>Germans wanted to have the Jews all together. In a practical sense, the
>ghetto was also organized for the protection of the Jewish population.
>(26-6885, 6886)
>The Zionists were happy with this arrangement. An appointed Jewish Council
>was the governing body of the ghetto. They had their own police, jails and
>everything else. Naturally, there were some who were cruel. One of these was
>the vice president of the police, who was later executed. In Burg's eyes,
>this execution was evidence that Jews defended themselves against the
>minority of Zionists who were using the majority of Jews for their own
>purposes. (26-6886, 6887)
>
>Then, when hundreds of thousands of civilians died in massive Allied bombing
>raids against German civilians ... and only then ... Rabbi Baeck got out.
>And where did he go? To Theresienstadt, because the concentration camp was
>never bombed by the Allies, and was the safest place for a Jew to be.
>Why did Rabbi Baeck never leave the Third Reich, the land of concentration
>camps and "gas chambers," with all the other 300,000 German Jews who were
>allowed to leave for more lucrative lands?
>It must have been relatively easy to leave Germany. Max Nussbaum, Chief
>Rabbi of Berlin until 1940 (who later became Chief Rabbi of Beverly Hills,
>CA), immigrated to New York at the advice of Rabbi Stephen Wise. Did Rabbi
>Wise already know of the coming war between the United States and Germany in
>1940?
>One must assume that Rabbi Baeck knew about Rabbi Nussbaum's plan to move to
>New York, but again Baeck remained in Berlin. A riddle to be sure, unless
>the horrors of Nazism were not that horrible for the Jews after all.
>Ø > IS IT TRUE that in 1941 and again in 1942, the German Gestapo offered
>all
>> > European Jews transit to Spain, if they would relinquish all their
>property
>> > in Germany and Occupied France; on condition that:
>> > a) none of the deportees travel from Spain to Palestine;<
>
>YES THAT OFFER WAS MADE. THE JEWS CAN THANK THE ZIONISTS WHO DECLINED FOR
>THEIR VARIOUS REASONS.
>Under the guise of "love of Israel", the Zionist "statesmen" seduced many
>Jews to replace devotion to the Torah and its Sages with devotion to the
>scoundrel who founded Zionism
>http://www.jewsnotzionists.org/tenquestions.htm
>The Jewish Agency delegation headed by Golda Meir (Meirson) ignored a German
>offer to allow Jews to emigrate to other countries for $250 a head, and the
>other Jewish groups  made no effort to influence the United States and the
>32 other countries attending the conference to allow immigration of German
>and Austrian Jews.
>http://www.jews-for-allah.org/Jews-not-for-Judaism/Jews-who-helped-nazis-hit
>ler.htm
>Ø
>
>
>
>By Max Hastings
>
>LONDON: Whatever the outcome of the current Palestinian chaos, meaningful
>negotiations with Israel seem unlikely. The most plausible scenario is that
>Ehud Olmert will proceed unilaterally to draw new boundaries for his
>country, which will absorb significant Palestinian land, and
>institutionalise such dominance of the West Bank as to make a Palestinian
>state unworkable.
>
>If this is the future, it is likely to yield fruits as bitter for Israelis
>as for Palestinians. The world, far from becoming more willing to acquiesce
>in Israel's expansion, is becoming less so. The generation of European
>non-Jews for whom the Holocaust is a seminal memory is dying. With them
>perishes much vicarious guilt.
>
>Younger Europeans, not to mention the rest of the world, are more sceptical
>about Israel's territorial claims. They are less susceptible to moral
>arguments about redress for past horrors, which have underpinned Israeli
>actions for almost 60 years. We may hope that it will never become
>respectable to be anti-semitic.
>
>However, Israel is discovering that it can no longer frighten non-Jews out
>of opposing its policies merely by accusing them of anti-semitism.
>
>There is also evidence of growing disenchantment with Israel in the Jewish
>diaspora. Feelings have changed since 1948 and the days when Jews around the
>world thought it a duty to support "their" nation in the promised land right
>or wrong, in good times or bad. David Goldberg, the former rabbi of the
>Liberal Jewish Synagogue in London, has just published a book that will
>rouse plenty of wrath in Israel. Entitled The Divided Self, its theme is
>that in modern times the Jews of the diaspora have preserved the honour and
>heritage of the Jewish people far more convincingly than Israel's citizens.
>
>Goldberg, whom I should acknowledge as a friend, rejects the Zionist conceit
>that the only proper place for Jews is in Israel. He discerns an unhealthy
>artificiality about the society constructed beside the Mediterranean since
>1948: "to assert itself, it must be rigid and inflexible". He notes that
>while genealogy has become a popular enthusiasm of diaspora Jews, Israelis
>prefer archaeology, "pursuing the distant past to authenticate an ancient
>connection with the land" in the absence of any more recent claim.
>
>He tells a good story of returning on a boat from Israel to Marseilles in
>1958, after a stint on a kibbutz. His efforts to make headway with pretty
>blond American passengers were thwarted by the presence of a tanned,
>muscular Israeli paratrooper, who effortlessly cut him out. When the boat
>stopped at Naples, this hero of Sinai announced that he was off to buy a
>watch. Beware of fakes, advised Goldberg, magnanimous in sexual defeat. The
>soldier ignored him, and was later seen hurling a worthless purchase into
>the sea.
>
>If we were talking about Christians here, it might be called a parable.
>Goldberg believes that Israel has allowed military prowess to blind it to
>wisdom: "the Jewish fox knows many things, the Jewish hedgehog only one big
>thing". Or you may prefer a Talmudic saying: "better a live dog than a dead
>lion".
>
>Goldberg defines the virtues of diaspora Jews, "adapting to novel
>circumstances and responding to changing times", in terms that would rouse
>the contempt of many Israelis. "Two thousand years of powerlessness have
>honed the antennae to detect where self-interest lies, what is on or not on
>... The experience ... of learning to live circumspectly among more numerous
>and powerful neighbours is a surer guarantee of survival than the
>triumphalist illusions of a mere 50-odd years of statehood."
>
>Some Israelis would say that this is the language of the ghetto, reflecting
>a willingness to defer, even to cringe; of exactly the kind their state was
>created to remove from the Jewish psyche.
>
>Yet Goldberg's book reflects a declining willingness among many diaspora
>Jews to write blank cheques for Israel, either literally or figuratively.
>
>It is a painful experience for some Jews who achieve good and even great
>things in their own societies to find themselves cast as sin-eaters for the
>Jewish state.
>
>Most are reluctant to speak out as frankly against Israel's West Bank
>policies as Goldberg has, and as did the late and great Rabbi John Rayner,
>who came here from Germany with the kindertransport. But with each
>generation the emotional distance between Israel and the diaspora is
>growing.-Dawn/The Guardian News Service
>
>
>



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On 27 Nov 2005 16:19:47 -0800, "Ariadne" wrote:
>Jason P wrote:
>> By Paula Amann

>> Washington Jewish Week/Jewsweek - 2001

>> http://www.jewsweek.com/society/059.htm

>> They come to Israel from the Ukraine, Russia, and Moldova looking for
>> freedom. Instead they are sold as sex slaves. And you thought Israel
>> was holy.

>> Jewsweek.com | Their names are Natalya, Oxana or Svetlana. They come to
>> Israel, as immigrants do, for a better life. But their dreams of
>> working as a waitress, nurse, or au pair turn nightmarish upon their
>> arrival.

>> Their fellow countryman who met them at the airport, speaking the
>> language of home, takes them to a locked apartment with barred windows
>> and a phone that only takes incoming calls, where they are forced to
>> provide sexual services to strangers.

>> Those who rebel risk being raped, beaten, or starved. Even those who
>> knew they were going into prostitution are shocked by the stark
>> conditions, the pay of roughly 20 shekalim ($5) a day or less for their
>> labor.

>> This disturbing story unfolds all too often at the hotline for Migrant
>> Workers, a Tel Aviv agency founded in 1998 to protect the human rights
>> of foreign workers, victims of sex trafficking among them. The hotline
>> takes as its motto the familiar line from Exodus 22:20: "You shall not
>> wrong a stranger or oppress him, for you were strangers in the land of
>> Egypt."

>> Agency director and co-founder Sigal Rozen, along with the group's
>> counsel, Nomi Levenkron, were in Washington, D.C., last week to give a
>> lecture at the Johns Hopkins Nitze School of Advanced International
>> Studies, to network and to speak with supporters. Among them are the
>> New Israel Fund, which has given the hotline a total of $19,000 during
>> the past year and a half.

>> In an interview, Rozen called sex trafficking an "unorganized crime,"
>> based largely on personal networks of immigrants from the Ukraine,
>> Russia, and Moldova.

>> "... "It's easier being a trafficker than being a plumber ..."   --Nomi
>> Levenkron

>> Those three countries alone accounted for 91 percent of the 474 women
>> arrested in brothels and deported from Israel in 2000, according to
>> figures compiled by hotline volunteers during visits to the Neveh
>> Tirzah women's prison.

>> These statistics represent only a fraction of the problem. Police
>> spokespersons have set the number of women brought into the country to
>> work in the sex industry at 2,000-3,000 annually, the number of
>> brothels at 250, Rozen said.

>> "It's Misha that knows Sasha that knows Vladimir," added Levenkron,
>> noting the economic incentive to be a pimp or work with one. "It's
>> easier being a trafficker than being a plumber."

>> One day she got a phone call from a rape crisis center where a woman
>> pleaded to be arrested and deported.

>> This young Moldovian had twice tried to escape her pimp and at 18, was
>> burned out on prostitution and just wanted to go home.

>> "She's so young and sweet," reflected Levenkron. "She came to Israel to
>> be a waitress."

>> A year ago this month, Israel passed the Law Against Trafficking Women.
>> Before that time, other laws existed against soliciting, pimping, and
>> running brothels.

>> Yet hotline staff point out that few pimps involved in trafficking ever
>> face a judge, with the majority of prostitutes deported without ever
>> facing a trial that might involve their testimony against their pimps.
>> Out of 459 women deported in 1998, only 35 cases went to trial; out of
>> 253 in 1999, a scant five ended up in the courtroom.

>> Judicial indifference is compounded by police complicity, Levenkron
>> argued.

>> The 18-year-old Moldovian, it turned out, had at one point in her
>> misadventures, found herself in a Tel Aviv police station where some of
>> the officers, who were her clients, recognized her and moved to call
>> her pimp.

>> Overhearing their plans, the woman fled and moved in with a
>> client-turned-boyfriend.

>> But somehow the pimp found her again, threatened the boyfriend. The
>> young woman, with no place to go, went back to the brothel. Now the
>> case hangs in the courts, where Levenkron has faint hopes for a
>> positive outcome.

>> The police role in such trafficking ranges from casual to highly
>> serious, she alleged.

>> "There are police who just come as clients, those who get special
>> discounts because of their good relationships with the owner of the
>> place and those that inform the owner about police operations,"
>> explained Levenkron.

>> One young Beersheva prostitute told the attorney she was forced to work
>> seven days a week unless a police raid was expected.

>> Widespread fear of violence from pimps has muted the public outcry, say
>> hotline staff. When Levenkron filed a suit on behalf of a
>> Beersheva-based woman, a 20-year-old Moldovian who had survived six
>> pimps and multiple rapes, several of the lawyer's friends came to her
>> home to bid her a final farewell, in anticipation of her imminent
>> death, she said.

>> INTERNATIONAL PROBLEM

>> Worldwide, trafficking in persons for domestic service, forced labor,
>> and prostitution ranks third after drugs and guns among the activities
>> of international crime, according to a congressional service report
>> released May 10, 2000. For comparison, about 50,000 people are brought
>> to the United States annually, the report stated.

>> The rise in trafficking seen over the 1990s was fueled by feeble
>> economies in source countries, such as the former Soviet Union and
>> Southeast Asia, along with weak penalties for traffickers, said a
>> government official familiar with these issues.

>> Last October, the United States passed its own law addressing this
>> problem, the Victims of Trafficking and Violence Protection Act, which
>> calls on the State Department to report annually on the scope of
>> trafficking in various countries and measures taken to combat it. The
>> report was due for release on June 1, but its publication has been
>> delayed.

>> In Israel today, official policy on trafficking is to arrest and deport
>> foreign sex workers. The women are held for an average of 30 days under
>> crowded and sometimes harsh conditions, longer if they testify in court
>> against their pimps, according to hotline data.

>> Rozen and Levenkron take issue with this approach. "Deporting women
>> doesn't make things better," said Levenkron. "I'm tired of shouting
>> this all over Israel so I've come here [to the United States] to shout
>> about it."

>> Rozen contends that a one-year work permit in specified fields such as
>> home health care or child care, before their return home, would put the
>> former prostitutes in a stronger position to take care of themselves.

>> Gruesome albeit unsubstantiated stories abound, she says, about revenge
>> attacks on returning women and their families by the original
>> trafficker in the home country.

>> A nest egg from a year's legitimate work, Rozen suggests, would allow
>> victims to re-establish themselves in a new community and stay out of
>> the clutches of traffickers in the future.

>> Meanwhile, Levenkron is seeking professional back-up in her job
>> representing the victims of trafficking.

>> "I am the [hotline] legal department," laments Levenkron. "We need
>> lawyers and we need public awareness."



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Were these the Hungarian Jews who were saved by the Zionazi ZYD
KOLLABORATOR KASTNER?


On Fri, 7 Jul 2006 22:25:47 +0200, "Heinrich" 
wrote:

>Hundreds of Holocaust survivors flocked to Los Angeles' Jewish social 
>service agencies to get help as they rush to apply for a restitution program 
>offered by the Hungarian government.

>The paperwork must be postmarked and on its way to Budapest by July 31.

>The large turnout overwhelmed the legal service group Bet Tzedek, whose 
>officials hastily scheduled extra sessions to help with the complicated 
>paperwork. Officials there said they expected about 50 or so of the 
>approximately 10,000 Holocaust survivors in Los Angeles to sign up for the 
>sessions. Instead, five times as many have sought help.

>lol

>http://www.dailybreeze.com/news/regstate/articles/3284451.html

Subject: KASTNER Case=ZYD ACCOMPLICE WITH NAZIS [88]

Now there are at least another 50 documented cases like KASTNER, and
RUMKOWSKI!!
The ZHIDS COLLABORATED WITH NAZIS!!

Even the notorious Simon WIESENTHAL is proven to have been a nazi 
GESTAPO COLLABORATOR!!


On 24 Oct 2004 17:22:19 -0000, DerStuermer  wrote:

>Mamzer Kenneth McVay,SOBC, the well-known fag and mamser in Canada,
>Fag McVay of Vancouver, convicted of child molesting
>and car theft in California and Oregon, and still
>unemployed  gas pump boy, mastermind of the
>Canadian branch of NAMBLA, and now finally dying as a
>diseased AIDS-spreader,wants all to know about all
>his fellow ZHID criminals and perverts.
>Here is the latest.......
>
>From: Elias Davidsson (edavid@itn.is)
>Subject: Zionism. The Kastner case (1/2)
>Newsgroups: soc.culture.israel
>Date: 1997/07/12
>
>The Kastner Case
>-----------------
>
>Introduction
>
>Rather than answer every complaint in the same detail, we are taking
>up the issue which the VJBD has declared to be the most offensive of all
>and will show that on this question 'The documentation available is
>overwhelming and its message is thundering", just as Palestine Speaks
>claimed in one of the extracts complained about by the VJBD.
>
>Since the accusation of direct Zionist cooperation and assistance in
>the extermination of hundreds of thousands of Jewish people, and the
>accusation that this flowed logically from shared aims, are clearly the
>most 'extreme' and 'offensive' accusations of Nazi-Zionist collaboration
>broadcast on 3CR programs, we will deal with this first, and in greater detail.
>
>Since the 'Kastner case' is the subject of most of the broadcasts
>concerning collaboration which have been specifically complained
>about, we shall go into this in greatest detail, and have put some books
>in as evidence about it. Having answered the VJBD where its case appears
>strongest, and on the points to which it has given greatest emphasis,we
>hope it may become apparent to the Tribunal that things are not quite
>what they may have appeared before this inquiry began.
>
>The most notorious case of Nazi-Zionist collaboration is that
>involving Rudolf Kastner.
>
>Most Jewish people in Australia have never heard of Rudolf Kastner.
>Those who have, are generally under the impression that there is some
>'controversy' about negotiations he undertook for 'the purchase of
>Jewish lives for money and military equipment', but that he was 'fully
>rehabilitated' by the Supreme Court of Israel.
>
>That is exactly the line taken by Dr. John Foster, the Victorian
>Jewish Board of Deputies expert witness, in his evidence condemning
>3CR for anti-semitism.
>
>It is quite clear from this evidence, that Dr. Foster does not know
>anything at all about the Kastner case, since he does not even know
>what Kastner was accused of.
>
>This may not be his fault however, since one cannot read an accurate
>account of the Kastner case in any of the widely available works dealing
>with the Holocaust, either in bookshops or libraries. Apart from 3CR, the
>suppression of information has been so complete, that even an expert
>like Dr. Foster, specifically asked to give evidence on the matter, has
>been unable to find out what it is all about.
>
>The Accusations
>----------------
>Briefly, the accusations against Kastner are as follows:
>
>"Dr. Rudolf Verba, a Doctor of Science now serving at the British
>Medical Research Council, was one of the few escapees from Auschwitz.
>In his memoirs published in February, 1961, in the London Daily Herald,
>he wrote:
>
>'I am a Jew. In spite of that - indeed because of that - I accuse
>certain Jewish leaders of one of the most ghastly deeds of the war.
>
>This small group of quislings knew what was happening to their
>brethren in Hitler's gas chambers and bought their their own lives with
>the price of silence. Among them was Dr. Kastner, leader of the council
>which spoke for all Jews in Hungary. While I was prisoner number 44070 at
>Auschwitz - the number is still on my arm - I compiled careful statistics
>of the exterminations...I took these terrible statistics with me when I
>escaped in 1944 and I was able to give Hungarian Zionist leaders three weeks
>notice that Eichmann planned to send a million of their Jews to his gas
>chambers...Kastner went to Eichmann and told him, 'I know of your
>plans; spare some Jews of my choice and I shall keep quiet.'
>
>Eichmann not only agreed, but dressed Kastner up in S.S. uniform and
>took him to Belsen to trace some of his friends. Nor did the sordid
>bargaining end there.
>
>Kastner paid Eichmann several thousand dollars. With this little
>fortune, Eichmann was able to buy his way to freedom when Germany collapsed,
>to set himself up in the Argentine..."(Ben Hecht, op.cit. pp261-2)
>
>These accusations are confirmed by the 'Eichmann Confessions'
>published in Life magazine, 28 November and 5 December 1960:
>
>"I resolved to show how well a job could be done when the commander
>stands 100% behind it. By shipping the Jews off in a lightning operation,
>I wanted to set an example for future campaigns elsewhere...In obedience to
>Himmler's directive I now concentrated on negotiations with the Jewish
>political officials in Budapest...Among them Dr. Rudolph Kastner,
>authorized representative of the Zionist Movement. This Dr. Kastner
>was a young man about my age, an ice-cold lawyer and a fanatical Zionist.
>He agreed to help keep the Jews from resisting deportation - and even
>keep order in the collection camps - if I could close my eyes and let a
>few hundred or a few thousand young Jews emigrate illegally to Palestine.
>It was a good bargain. For keeping order in the camps, the price...was
>not too high for me.
>
>.We trusted each other perfectly. When he was with me, Kastner smoke
>cigarets as though he was in a coffeehouse. While we talked he would
>smoke one aromatic cigaret after another, taking them from a silver case
>and lighting them with a silver lighter. With his great polish and reserve
>he would have made an ideal Gestapo officer himself.
>
>Dr. Kastner's main concern was to make it possible for a select group
>of Hungarian Jews to emigrate to Israel...
>
>As a matter of fact, there was a very strong similarity between our
>attitudes in the S.S. and the viewpoint of these immensely idealistic
>Zionist leaders....I believe that Kastner would have sacrificed a
>thousand or a hundred thousand of his blood to achieve his political
>goal...'You can have the others', he would say, 'but let me have this
>group here'. And because Kastner rendered us a great service by helping
>keep the deportation camps peaceful, I would let his groups escape.
>After all, I was not concerned with small groups of a thousand or so Jews...
>That was the 'gentleman's agreement' I had with Kastner" (Hecht, ibid, p.26ö-61)
>
>Quite clearly these accusations, whether true or false, do not relate
>merely to 'the purchase of Jewish lives for money and military
>equipment', as Dr. Foster imagines, and the term 'collaboration' is the term
>that would apply. It seems unlikely that if Dr. Foster had known what the
>accusation actually was, he would have condemned 3CR saying 'In these
>circumstances, to talk of collaboration is malicious and absurd'.
>
>Are the accusations against Kastner true?
>
>According to the Government of Israel, they are a lie. When Malchiel
>Greenwald, a strongly pro-Zionist Israeli citizen published these
>accusations against Kastner, the Israeli Government did rather more
>than demand that his views should not be broadcast. Because a prominent
>Zionist official (Dr. Kastner was a spokesman for the Ministry of Trade and
>Industry) was involved, the Attorney General of the State of Israel
>prosecuted Greenwald for criminal libel.
>
>The Verdict
>------------
>Let the verdict of Judge Benjamin Halevi in Israel's District Court of
>Jerusalem speak for itself, given in criminal case No. 124 of 1953.
>The Attorney General v. Malchiel Greenwald. This material should be
>studied carefully, since a substantial extract from it, broadcast on 3CR,
>has been complained about by the VJBD as allegedly offensive to the Jewish
>community, likely to promote anti-semitism, likely to promote racism,
>in bad taste and contrary to common sense.
>
>It is the actual words used that are the subject of the Board's
>complaint, not the manner of their representation by 3CR. Presumably
>the Board itself was not aware just whose words they were when it made
>its' complaint, which shows how complete suppression of information can
>backfire on the censors themselves.
>
>Here then are excerpts from the verdict of Judge Halevi, who later
>became one of the panel of three judges that tried Eichmann:
>
>"The masses of Jews from Hungary's ghettos obediently boarded the
>deportation trains without knowing their fate. They were full of
>confidence in the false information that they were being transferred to
>Kenyermeze.
>
>The Nazis could not have misled the masses of Jews so conclusively had
>they not spread their false information through Jewish channels.
>
>The Jews of the ghettos would not have trusted the Nazi or Hungarian
>rulers. But they had trust in their Jewish leaders. Eichmann and
>others used this known fact as part of their calculated plan to mislead
>the Jews.
>They were able to deport the Jews to their extermination by the help
>of Jewish leaders.
>
>The false information was spread by the Jewish leaders. The local
>leaders of the Jews of Kluj and Nodvarod knew that other leaders were
>spreading such false information and did not protest.
>
>Those of the Jews who tried to warn their friends of the truth were
>persecuted by the Jewish leaders in charge of the local 'rescue work'.
>
>The trust of the Jews in the misleading information and their lack of
>knowledge that their wives, children and themselves were about to be
>deported to the gas chambers of Auschwitz led the victims to remain
>quiescent in their ghettos. It seduced them into not resisting or
>hampering the deportation orders.
>
>Dozens of thousands of Jews were guarded in their ghettos by a few
>dozen police. Yet even vigorous young Jews made no attemptt to overpower
>these few guards and escape to nearby Rumania. No resistance activities to
>the deportations were organized in these ghettos.
>
>And the Jewish leaders did everything in their power to soothe the
>Jews in the ghettos and to prevent such resistance activities.
>
>The same Jews who spread in Kluj and Nodvarod the false rumor of
>Kenyermeze, or confirmed it, the same public leaders who did not warn
>their own people against the misleading statements, the same Jewish leaders
>who did not organize any resistance or any sabotage of
>deportations...these same leaders did not join the people of their community
>in their ride to Auschwitz, but were all included in the Rescue train.
>
>The Nazi organizers of extermination and the perpetrators of
>extermination permitted Rudolf Kastner and the members of the Jewish Council
>in Budapest to save themselves, their relatives, and friends. The Nazis did
>this as a means of making the local Jewish leaders, whom they favoured,
>dependent on the Nazi regime, dependent on its good will during the time of
>its fatal deportation schedule. In short, the Nazis succeeded in bringing the
>Jewish leaders into oollaboration with the Nazis at the time of the
>catastrophe.
>
>The Nazi chiefs knew that the Zionists were a most vital element in
>Jewry and the most trusted by the Jews.
>
>The Nazis drew a lesson from the Warsaw ghetto and other belligerent
>ghettos. They learned that Jews were able to sell their lives very
>expensively if honorably guided.
>
>Eichmann did not want a second Warsaw. For this reason, the Nazis
>exerted themselves to mislead and bribe the Jewish leaders.
>
>The personality of Rudolph Kastner made him a convenient catspaw for
>Eichmann and his clique, to draw into collaboration and make their
>task easier.
>
>The question here is not, as stated by the Attorney General in his
>summation, whether members of the Jewish Rescue Committee were or were
>not capable of fulfilling their duty without the patronage of the S.S.
>chiefs.
>It is obvious that without such S.S. Nazi patronage the Jewish Rescue
>Committee could not have existed, and could have acted only as an
>underground.
>
>The question is, as put by the lawyer for the defense, why were the
>Nazis interested in the existence of the Rescue Committee? Why did
>the S.S. chiefs make every effort to encourage the existence of the
>Jewish Rescue Committee? Did the exterminators turn into rescuers?
>
>The same question rises concerning the rescue of prominent Jews by
>these German killers of Jews. Was the rescue of such Jews a part of
>the extermination plan of the killers ?
>
>The support given by the extermination leaders to Kastner's Rescue
>Committee proves that indeed there was a place for Kastner and his
>friends in their Final Solution for the Jews of Hungary - their total
>annihilation.
>
>The Nazi's patronage of Kastner, and their agreement to let him save
>six hundred prominent Jews, were part of the plan to exterminate the Jews.
>Kastner was given a chance to add a few more to that number. The bait
>attracted him. The opportunity of rescuing prominent people appealed
>to him greatly. He considered the rescue of the most important Jews as a
>great personal success and a success for Zionism. It was a success that
>would also justify his conduct - his political negotiation with Nazis and
>the Nazi patronage of his committee.
>
>When Kastner received this present from the Nazis, Kastner sold his
>soul to the German Satan. The sacrifice of the vital interests of the majority
>of the Jews, in order to rescue the prominents, was the basic element in the
>agreement between Kastner and the Nazis. This agreement fixed the division of
>the nation into two unequal camps: a small fragment of prominents, whom the
>Nazis promised Kastner to save, on the one hand, and the great majority of
>Hungarian Jews whom the Nazis designated for death, on the other hand.
>An imperative condition for the rescue of the first camp by the Nazis was that
>Kastner will not interfere in the action of the Nazis against the other camp
>and will not hamper them in its extermination. Kastner fulfilled this
>condition. He concentrated his efforts in the rescue of the prominents
>and treated the camp of the doomed as if they had already been wiped out
>from the book of the living.
>
>One cannot estimate the damage caused by Kastner's collaboration and
>put down the number of victims which it cost Hungarian Jews. These are not
>only the thousands of Jews in Nodvarod or any other community in the border
>area, Jews who could escape through the border, had the chief of their
>rescue committee fulfilled his duty toward them.
>
>All of Kastner's answers in his final testimony were a constant effort
>to evade this truth.
>
>Kastner has tried to escape through every crack he could find in the
>wall of evidence. When one crack was sealed in his face, he drated quickly
>to another."
>
>(Judgement of Judge Benjamin Halevi, Criminal Case 124/53; Attorney
>General
>v. Malchiel Greenwald, District Court, Jerusalem, June 22, 1955).
>
>Judge Halevi reverts to the meeting of Kastner with the S.S. officers
>Becher and Rudolf Hoess, commandant of Auschwitz at the time when the
>'new line' of rescuing Jews was revealed by Hoess. He says:
>
>"From this gathering in Budapest, it is obvious that the 'new line'
>stretched from Himmler to Hoess, from Jutner to Becher and Krumey.
>
>According to Kastner, however, these Nazis were all active in rescuing
>Jews.
>
>This meeting of these important German guests in Budapest exposes the
>'rescue' work of Becher in its true light. It reveals also the extent
>of Kastner's involvement in the inner circle of the chief German war
>criminals.
>
>Just as the Nazi war criminals knew they needed an alibi and hoped to
>achieve it by the rescue of a few Jews at the eleventh hour, so
>Kastner also needed an alibi for himself.
>
>Collaboration between the Jewish Agency Rescue Committee and the
>Exterminators of the Jews was solidifed in Budapest and Vienna.
>Kastner's duties were part and parcel of the genral duties of the S.S.
>
>In addition to its Extermination Department and Looting Department,
>the Nazi S.S. opened a Rescue Department headed by Kastner.
>
>All these extermination, robbery and rescue activities of the S.S.
>were coordinated under the management of Heinrich Himmler". (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi continues:
>
>"Kastner perjured himself knowingly in his testimony before this court
>when he denied he had interceded in Becher's hehalf. Moreover, he concealed
>the important fact that he interceded for Becher in the name of the Jewish
>Agency and the Jewish World Congress.
>
>As to the contents of Kastner's affidavit, it was enough for the
>defense to prove Becher was a war criminal. It was up to the prosecution to
>remove Becher from this status, if they wished to negate the affidavit.
>
>The Attorney General admitted in his summation that Becher was a war
>criminal.
>
>The lies in the contents of Kastner's affidavit, the lies in his
>testimony concerning the document, and Kastner's knowing participation in the
>activities of Nazi war criminals, and his participation in the last
>minute fake rescue activities - all these combine to show one overwhelming
>truth - that this affidavit was not given in good faith.
>
>Kastner knew well, as he himself testified, that Becher had never
>stood up against the stream of Jewish extermination, as Kastner has
>declared in the affidavit.
>
>The aims of Becher and his superior, Himmler, were not to save Jews
>but to serve the Nazi regime with full compliance. These is not truth
>and no good faith in Kastner's testimony, 'I never doubted for one moment
>the good intention of good Becher'.
>
>It is clear that the positive recommandation by Kastner, not only in
>his own name but also in the name of the Jewish Agency and the Jewish
>World Congress was of decisive importance for Becher. Kastner did not
>exaggerate when he said that Becher was released by the Allies because
>of his personal intervention. The lies in the affidavit of Kastner and the
>contradictions and various pretexts, which were proven to be lies, were
>sufficient to annul the value of his statements and to prove that there
>was no good faith in his testimony in favor of this German war criminal.
>Kastner's affidavit in favor of Becher was a willfully false affidavit
>given in favor of a war criminal to save him from trial and punishment
>in Nuremberg.
>
>Therefore, the defendant, Malchiel Greenwald, was correct in his
>accusations against Rudolf Kastner in the first, second and fourth of
>his statements." (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi's verdict found Malchiel Greenwald generally innocent of
>libel against Kastner, but fined him one Israeli pound for the one unproven
>accusation - that Kastner had actually collected money from his Nazi
>partners for his aide to their slaughter program. The judge also
>ordered the Government of Israel to pay Greenwald two hundred Israeli
>pounds as court costs.
>
>In fairness to Kastner it should me mentioned that as well as having
>been unpaid, it was never established that he ever wore S.S. uniform.
>
>Nevertheless, this verdict, and the evidence on which it was based,
>completely establishes the truth of everything said on 3CR about the
>matter.
>
>If the story ended there, it would only prove conclusively that the
>individual Kastner was a collaborator and the Israeli Government had
>attempted to defend him, although facts brought out in the trial
>pointed to much more than that.
>
>But the story does not end there.
>
>The Reaction
>-------------
>Public opinion in Israel was almost unanimous in demanding that
>Kastner and his associates should be put on trial. Remember that up to
>now it was Kastner's accuser who was on trial.
>
>The Communist Party newspaper Kol Ha'am (Voice of the People) wrote:
>
>"All those whose relatives were butchered by the Germans in Hungary
>know now clearly that Jewish hands helped the mass murder" (23 June 1955)
>
>In the authoritative Israeli newspaper Ha'aretz, the leading political
>journalist, Dr. Moshe Keren wrote:
>
>"Kastner must be brought to trial as a Nazi collaborator. And at this
>trial, Kastner should defend himself as a private citizen, and not be
>defended by the Israeli Government..." (14 July 1955).
>
>*Haboker*, the pro-Government General Zionist party paper stated:
>
>"The public wants to know the real facts about Kastner, and not about
>him alone. The only way to find out the truth is to put all the Rescue
>Committee people on trial and give them a chance to offer their
>defense." (23 June 1955)
>
>But public opinion was not quite unanimous. The problem with bringing
>Kastner and his associates to trial was that his associates were the
>Government of Israel.
>
>As the evening paper *Yedi'ot Aharonot* said:
>
>"If Kastner is brought to trial the entire government faces a total
>political and national collapse - as a result of what such a trial may
> disclose." (23 June 1955)
>
>Accordingly, the Government of Israel did not put Kastner on trial,
>instead it filed an appeal against the acquittal of Greenwald for criminal
>libel.
>
>As Dr. Karlebach wrote in Israel's largest evening newspaper,
>*Ma'ariv*:
>
>"What is going on here? The Attorney General has to mobilize all the
>government power, appear himself in court, to justify and defend
>collaboration with Himmler! And in order to defend a quisling, the
>government must drag through the streets one of the grimmest stories
>of our history!
>
>At 11 P.M. the verdict was given. At 11 A.M. next morning the
>government announces the defense of Kastner will be renewed - an appeal filed.
>What exemplary expediency! Since when does this government possess such
>lawyer-genius who can weigh in one night the legal chances of an
>appeal on a detailed, complex verdict of three hundred pages?! (24 June 1955)
>
>At the appeal hearings before the Supreme Court, the Attorney General
>of Israel, Chaim Cohen, explained clearly why the Government of Israel
>was defending Kastner so strongly:  "The man Kastner does not stand here
>as a private individual. He was a recognized representative, official or
>non-official of the Jewish National Institutes in Palestine and of the
>Zionist Executive; and I come here in this court to defend the
>representative of our national institutions." (Hecht, p. 268)
>
>The truth of this statement cannot be denied. Kastner's collaboration
>was not that of an individual. It was the collaboration of the Zionist
>leadership.
>
>So far, it has only been established that the Government of Israel
>continued to support a Nazi collaborator after the facts about his
>collaboration had been conclusively established in an Israeli court.
>But the story gets worse.
>
>The Supreme Court of Israel unanimously found that Becher was indeed a
>Nazi war criminal and that Kastner had without justification, and in the
>name of the Jewish Agency, helped Becher to escape justice. On this point
>Greenwald was acquitted of libel and Kastner was not 'fully rehabilitated'.
>
>The Supreme Court also accepted the FACTS established in the lower
>court - that Kastner DELIBERATELY concealed the truth about Auschwitz from the
>majority of Hungarian Jews in exchange for Nazi permission to take a
>thousand or so to Palestine. Again, Kastner was far from being 'fully
>rehabilitated'.
>
>The Majority Judgement
>-------------------------
>But now comes the really nasty bit. After unanimously acknowledging
>these FACTS, the Supreme Court of Israel, by a majority of three to two,
>found that Kastner's actions were MORALLY JUSTIFIABLE and convicted
>Greenwald of criminal libel for calling this 'collaboration'.
>
>In saying that 3CR broadcasts concealed the fact that Kastner had been
>fully rehabilitated by the Israeli Supreme Court, Dr. Foster is
>totally missing the point.
>
>Kastner's actions only proved that HE was a Nazi collaborator. It is
>the defense of these actions by the Government and Courts of Israel that
>prove conclusively that ZIONISM approves of Nazi collaboration.
>
>The majority of the Supreme Court of Israel did not REHABILITATE
>Kastner.
>They JOINED him.
>
>Let us read from the majority judgement of Supreme Court Judge Shlomo
>Chesin:
>
>"...What point was there in telling the people boarding the trains in
>Kluj, people struck by fate and persecuted, as to what awaits them at the
>end of their journey...Kastner spoke in detail of the situation, saying,
>'The Hungarian Jew was a branch which long ago dried up on the tree'. This
>vivid description coincides with the testimony of another witness about the
>Hungarian Jews, 'This was a big Jewish community in Hungary, without any
>ideological Jewish backbone' (Moshe Shweiger, a Kastner aide in Budapest,
>protocol 465).
>
>I fully agree with my friend, Judge Agranot, when he states that, 'The
>Jews of Hungary, including those in the countryside, were not capable,
>neither physically nor mentally, to carry out resistance operations with force
>against the deportation scheme'...From this point of view no rescue
>achievement could have resulted by disclosing the Auschwitz news to
>the Jewish leaders there, and this...is a consideration which on can
>properly conclude that Kastner had in front of his eyes.
>
>.And I take one more step. I am certain that the silence of Kastner
>when he arrived in Kluj was premeditated and calculated and did not result
>from his great dispair because of the helplessness of the Jewish community.
>Even then, I say, this is still not considered willful collaboration and
>assistance in the extermination, because all the signs indicate that
>Kastner's efforts were aimed at rescue and rescue on a big scale...And
>towards the end I take one last step. In doing so I go very far and
>say that even if Kastner ordered himself to keep silent knowingly, in
>submission to the strong will of the Nazis, in order to save a few
>Jews from Hell - this is still no proof that he stained his hands by
>collaborating with the enemies of his people and carrying out their
>plan to exterminate most of the Jewish community in Hungary.
>
>Even if, through these activities of his - or rather, his omission -
>the extermination became easier. And as to the moral issue, the question
>is not whether a man is allowed to kill many in order to save a few, or
>vice-versa. The question is altogether in another sphere and should be
>defined as follows: A man is aware that a whole community is awaiting
>its doom. He is allowed to make efforts to save a few, although part of
>his efforts involve concealment of truth from the many or should he
>disclose the truth to many though it is his best opinion that this way
>everybody will perish. I think that the answer is clear. What good will the
>blood of the few bring if everybody is to perish?...As I said, I am not arguing
>with the basic factual findings of the learned President of the Jewish
>District Court (Judge Halevi) but it seems to me, with all due respect, that
>his findings do not, as of necessity, demand the conclusion he has arrived
>at.
>That is to say, collaboration on the part of Kastner in the extermination
>of the Jews. And that they better coincide with bad leadership both
>from a moral and public point of view...
>
>In my opinion, one can say outright that if you find out that Kastner
>collaborated with the enemy because he did not disclose to the people
>who boarded the trains in Kluj that they were being led to extermination,
>one has to put on trial today Danzig, Herman, Hanzi, Brand, Revis and
>Marton, and many more leaders and half-leaders who gagged themselves in an
>hour of crisis and did not inform others of what was known to them and did not
>warn and did not cry out of the coming danger....
>
>Because of all this I cannot confirm the conclusion of the District Court
>with regard to the accusation that Greenwald has thrown on Kastner of
>collaboration with the Nazis in exterminating the Jewish people in
>Hungary during the last war." (Hecht, ibid, pp.270-2)
>
>In other words, the Court approved of Kastner's contempt for the
>Hungarian Jews and could not allow him to be condemned for doing exactly what
>many other Zionist leaders had half-leaders did - concealing their
>knowledge of the Nazi extermination plans so that Jews would board the trains to
>Auschwitz peacefully while their Zionist 'leaders' boarded a different
>train for Palestine.
>
>The Minority Judgement
>--------------------------
>It cannot be said that ALL top Zionists leaders actively approved of
>Nazi collaboration in this way. Indeed the most precise answer to this
>sickening judgement of Judge Chesin is provided in the minority judgement of
>Supreme Court Judge Moshe Silberg:
>
>"I do not say that he was the only man who possessed information among
>the leaders. It is quite possible that somebody else as well does not have
>a clear conscience with regards to this concealment. But we are dealing
>here with the guilt of Kastner and we do not have to make judgements on the
>guilt of others....
>
>The declaration of the learned Attorney General therefore shrinks into
>an opinion....'Kastner was convinced and believed that there was no ray
>of hope for the Jews of Hungary, almost for none of them, and as he, as a
>result of his personal dispair, did not disclose the secret of the
>extermination in order not to endanger or frustrate the rescue of the
>few - therefore he acted in good faith and should not be accused of
>collaborating with the Nazis in expediting the extermination of the Jews,
>even though, in fact, he brought about its result.'
>
>I am compelled to state that it is very difficult for me to conceive
>such an intention. Is this good faith? Can a single man, even in
>cooperation with some of his friends, yield to despair on behalf and
>without the knowledge of 800,000 other people? This is, in my opinion, the
>decisive consideration in the problem facing us. The charge emanating from
>the testimony of the witnesses against Kastner is that had they known of
>the Auschwitz secret, then thousands or tens of thousands would have been
>able to save their lives by local, partial, specific or indirect rescue
>operations like local revolts, resistance, escapes, hidings,
>concealment of children with Gentiles, forging of documents, ransom money,
>bribery, etc - and when this is the case and when one deals with many hundreds
>of thousands, how does a human being, a mortal, reject with complete
>certainty and with an extreme 'no' the efficiency of all the many and varied
>rescue ways? How can he examine the tens of thousands of possibilities? Does
>he decide instead of God? Indeed, he who can act with such a usurpation
>of the last hope of hundreds of thousands is not entitled to claim good faith
>as his defense. The penetrating question quo warrento is a good answer to
>a claim of such good faith...
>
>If the superintendent of a big hospital lets thousands of sick people
>die so that he may devote himself to the sure rescue of one soul, he will
>come out guilty, at least morally, even if it is proven that he as an
>individual erroneously thought that there was no hope of saving the other
>patients. He is a collaborator with the angel of death.
>
>Either a complete atrophy of the soul or a blind involvement with
>complete loss of senses and proportion in his small but personal rescue
>operation could bring a man to such a gigantic, hazardous play.
>
>And if all this is not enough to annul the claim of good faith which
>was put before us on behalf of Kastner by the Attorney General, then
>Kastner himself comes and annuls it altogether. Not only did he never make
>this claim, but his own words prove the contrary. He writes in his report
>to the Jewish Agency that the Committee sent emissaries to many ghettos in
>the countryside and pleaded with them to organize escapes and to refuse to
>board the trains. And though the story of these pleadings is untrue,
>and the silence of Kastner in Kluj is proven, the very uttering of these
>statements entirely contradicts the claim that Kastner had concealed
>the news about the fate of the ghetto inmates in good faith and only as a
>result of his complete despairing of the chances of escaping or
>resisting the Germans. You can not claim at the same time helplessness and
>activity.
>Anyway, such a claim is not convincing...
>
>We can sum up with three facts:
>A. That the Nazis didn't want to have a great revolt - 'Second Warsaw'
>- nor small revolts, and their passion was to have the extermination
>machine working smoothly without resistance. This fact was known to Kastner
>from the best source - from Eichmann himself - And he had additional proofs
>of that when he witnessed all the illusionary and misleading tactics
>which were being taken by the Nazis from the first moment of occupation.
>B. That the most efficient means to paralyze the resistance with - or
>the escape of a victim is to conceal from him the plot of the coming
>murder.
>This fact is known to every man and one does not need any proof of
>evidence for this.
>C. That he, Kastner, in order to carry out the rescue plan for the few
>prominents, fulfilled knowingly and without good faith the said desire
>of the Nazis, thus expediting the work of exterminating the masses.
>
>And also the rescue of Becher by Kastner...He who is capable of
>rescuing this Becher from hanging proves that the atrocities of this great
>war criminal were not so horryfying or despicable in his eyes...I couldn't
>base the main guilt of Kastner on this fact had it been alone, but when it
>is attached even from afar to the whole scene of events it throws
>retroactive light on the whole affair and serves as a dozen proofs of our
>conclusion." (Supreme Court Judge, Moshe Silberg, 1957)
>
>Conclusion
>-----------
>If that had been the majority judgement, one could say that whatever
>their attitudes to the Arabs, and whatever their past behaviour might have
>been under pressure, the Zionist leadership today did not advocate
>collaboration with the Nazis.
>
>One could then at least understand the complaints by Mr. Bloch,
>President of the Victorian Jewish Board of Deputies, about the 'dragging in
>of alleged episodes in the history of Jewish/Nazi relationships'.
>
>But Judge Silberg's judgement was that of a minority.
>
>The Kastner case is therefore not an alleged episode in past history,
>being 'dragged in' to discredit an opponent.
>
>It is a continuing controversy in which the top Zionist leadership of
>Israel stand indicted of continuing to publicly defend collaboration
>with the Nazis in the extermination of Jews.
>
>Despite the unanimous finding of the Supreme Court of Israel that Kurt
>Becher was a major war criminal, the Jewish Agency (World Zionist
>Organization) refused to withdraw the fraudulent certificate Kastner
>gave on their behalf, which saved Becher from hanging, and allowed him to
>remain a free man in West Germany, the head of several corporations and with
>an estimated personal worth of $30 million.
>
>Becher has even used his certification as a 'good' SS officer to give
>evidence in support of his associates at other war crimes trials in
>West Germany.
>
>Since the prosecution, representing the Israeli Government agreed with
>the Supreme Court that Becher was a major war criminal, one can only
>presure that the Israeli Government did not want him put on trial for
>fear of what might come out.
>
>Likewise, none of Kastner's associates on the Zionist Relief and
>Rescue Committee or his bosses in the Jewish Agency have ever been put on
>trial as demanded by Israeli public opinion. Let alone the hundreds of
>'prominents' who helped Kastner to reassure the Hungarian Jews that they
>were going to Kenyermeze and not Auschwitz, in exchange for tickets on
>the one train that took them eventually to Palestine.
>
>As for Kastner himself, he will cause no further embarassment to the
>Zionist leadership with his undisputed claims that everything he did
>was approved by the Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) leadership
>in Palestine. He is, as Dr. Foster so delicately puts it, 'now dead'. Or
>putting it less delicately, on 3 March 1957 he was shot by Zeer
>Eckstein - immediately after the appeal hearings were concluded, and
>before the judgement 'rehabilitating' him was delivered. Eckstein was
>not a Hungarian avenger. He was a paid undercover agent of the Israeli
>secret service.
>(Hecht, ibid., p.208. Another 'fantastic allegation' no doubt; but
>admitted in court during the murder trial).
>
>Clearly this issue has a major indirect relevance to the Arab-Israeli
>dispute. Apart from countering Israel's cynical use of the holocaust
>as a propaganda weapon, it answers a very real concern that many people
>have about the State of Israel and the Jews. This concern is whether,
>if Jews had a State of their own during the holocaust many more could
>have been saved, and whether this is not an essential future consideration,
>at least as an insurance policy.
>
>The facts of the Kastner case show that the very existence of the
>Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) was an actual help to the Nazis
>and that more could have been saved if the Zionist movement had not
>existed.
>Having a State that approves of actions like those of Kastner for an
>insurance policy, is like using petro for a fire extinguisher.
>
>Zionism is not the answer to anti-semitism, but a cowardly proposal to
>run away from it. The only answer to anti-semitism is to fight back.
>
>We shall go on to prove this in detail.
>-------------------------------------------------------------------
>Elias Davidsson - Oldugata 50 - 101 Reykjavik - Iceland
>Tel. (354)-552-6444     Fax: (354)-552-6579
>Email: edavid@itn.is     URL:  http://www.nyherji.is/~edavid


If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
then visit  www.freedomsite.org

Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

"At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth 
is a revolutionary act." 
(George Orwell)

David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'

"All truth passes through three stages. 
First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, 
and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
(Arthur Schopenhauer)

"The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely, 
but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak 
falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if 
they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
against them -- except force." -- John Bryant  

"To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an 
acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer 
and impossible to ignore."
--John Bryant


Posted by: 
Patrick Lee Humphrey
7500 Bellerive #1807
Houston, Texas 77036-3040
1-713-266-7764

Steven Horn (KCOM)
1836 NW 11th St
Oklahoma City, OK 73106
(405) 524-0576

together with
Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive & 
Henry 
CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even 
VISIT me at:
55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132

We all like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
We are together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
We like young children, so that we can train them our way.


Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
office: VISIT at:
#5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
or call: 1-250-616-9431

As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is 
called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material 
should give an indication as to the why.

"I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]

Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like 
a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
even if he or she were not naked"?
http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg

For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David
Michael's
detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and
is
known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a
grosvenor!! 
It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases,
just 
to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.

Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: Flavia18@verizon.net, especially
late nights.

Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or  
send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
work:(780)492-0473

And also: George Firestone: "George" ,
and davejoll@ihug.co.nz.

Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!

For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
JEW-WATCH:
http://www.jewwatch.com

Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!

Or, other useful websites include:
ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
IHR - www.ihr.org
OSTARA - www.ostara.org
PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press, 
    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com

Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
They have lots of information, as well as books and records.

They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.

As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a 
victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.

In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
for many years around the world.

Reply-To: "George"
,
or to Art@Arthurian.com
Feel free to subscribe us to maillists for sex, homosexuals and the
like.

~~




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Thu Dec 20 14:12:53 EST 2007
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Newsgroups: pl.soc.polityka,soc.culture.polish,alt.politics.europe,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.swiss,soc.culture.german,soc.culture.russian
Subject: Re: KATYN=MURDERS OF  POLISH  BY ZYDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! Like Vinnitsa!! NEVER  FORGET!
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With even the Soviets forced to admit that it was their ZYD NKVD who
did the murders at KATYN, why are you apologising for them?

Historians and experts proved it was NOt the Germans!

Were you one of the killers, or perhaps your father, uncle or?


On Sat, 8 Jul 2006 11:54:59 -0700, "Peter Wielki" 
wrote:

>Actually, in Katyn there were Russians and Ukraninians that did the crime, 
>as far as I know.
>
>But yeah, let's blame it on JEWS!!!  Germans did it too, right Frankie?


>"Frank Arthur"  wrote in message 
>news:ummva2ddrk9aik6jnqimp9mseb9b5ap4g1@4ax.com...
>> True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZYDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary of 
>> the
>> discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland 
>> had
>> been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated to 
>> The
>> Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis, who
>> invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely used 
>> the
>> word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler learned, 
>> as
>> dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers from a 
>> single
>> narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: its intent was 
>> to
>> eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its perceived
>> guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the
>> exiled Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn, 
>> outside
>> Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and
>> the terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the 
>> relationship
>> between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him, 
>> awarding
>> him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his future murder 
>> victims.
>> And when Stalin jested that they should settle the German problem once and 
>> for
>> all by killing 50,000 German officers, Churchill merely protested sulkily, 
>> and
>> Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one 
>> by
>> which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three knew 
>> of
>> the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, all 
>> three -
>> two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich 
>> five
>> years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn: once
>> Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with almost
>> anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn into 
>> the
>> diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan Government 
>> in
>> the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a memorial in London to the
>> victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>>>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>>>Katyn
>>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>>>of Poland.
>>
>>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>>>in 1940.
>>
>>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>>>Russia.
>>
>>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>>>FBI.
>>
>>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>>>of them did.
>>
>>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>>>killings.
>>
>> ISRAEL REFUSED TO PROSECUTE THESAE ZHID MURDERERS!!
>>
>>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>>>decided.
>>
>>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>>>feeling.
>>
>>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews/ZHIDS  isn't surprising. What is
>>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>> ++++++++++++++
>>
>> American Renaissance
>> http://www.amren.com
>>
>> Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>> http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>> Euro-American Students Union
>> http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>> Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>> http://www.14words.com
>>
>> National Alliance
>> http://www.natvan.com
>>
>> Stormfront
>> http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>> Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>> http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>>
>> First,let us kill all the lawyers! - W.Shakespeare
>> First, we get rid of all the politicians! - Mao tse Dung
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled-as fertiliser!!
>> Me
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Newsgroups:
>> pl.regionalne.krakow,pl.regionalne.lodz,pl.regionalne.warszawa,soc.culture.polish,alt.politics.europe
>> Subject: KATYN=MURDERS BY ZHIDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZHIDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:
>> soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary
>> of the discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland
>> had been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated
>> to The Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis,
>> who invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely
>> used the word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler
>> learned, as dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers
>> from a single narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: 
>> its
>> intent was to eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its
>> perceived guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the exiled
>> Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn,
>> outside Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. 
>> A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and the
>> terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the
>> relationship between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him,
>> awarding him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his
>> future murder victims. And when Stalin jested that they should settle the
>> German problem once and for all by killing 50,000 German officers, 
>> Churchill
>> merely protested sulkily, and Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing
>> only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one
>> by which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three
>> knew of the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, 
>> all
>> three - two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to
>> those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich
>> five years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn:
>> once Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with
>> almost anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn
>> into the diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan
>> Government in the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a
>> memorial in London to the victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>> >>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>> >>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>> >>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>> >>>>Katyn
>>> >>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>> >>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>> >>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>> >>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>> >>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>> >>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>> >>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>> >>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>> >>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>> >>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>> >>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>> >>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>> >>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>> >>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>> >>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>> >>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>> >>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>> >>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>> >>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>> >>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>> >>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>> >>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>> >>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>> >>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>> >>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>> >>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>> >>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>> >>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>> >>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>> >>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>> >>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>> >>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>> >>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>> >>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>> >>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>> >>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>> >>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>> >>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>> >>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>> >>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>> >>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>> >>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>> >>>>of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>> >>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>> >>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>> >>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>> >>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>> >>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>> >>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>> >>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>> >>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>in 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>> >>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>> >>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>> >>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>> >>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>> >>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>> >>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>> >>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>> >>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>> >>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>> >>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>> >>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>> >>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>> >>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>> >>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>> >>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>> >>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>> >>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>> >>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>> >>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>> >>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>> >>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>> >>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>> >>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>> >>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>> >>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>> >>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>> >>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>> >>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>> >>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>> >>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>> >>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>> >>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>> >>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>> >>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>> >>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>> >>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>> >>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>> >>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>> >>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>> >>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>> >>>>Russia.
>>
>>> >>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>> >>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>> >>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>> >>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>> >>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>> >>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>> >>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>> >>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>> >>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>> >>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>> >>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>> >>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>> >>>>FBI.
>>
>>> >>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>> >>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>> >>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>> >>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>> >>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>> >>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>> >>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>> >>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>> >>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>> >>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>> >>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>> >>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>> >>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>> >>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>> >>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>> >>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>> >>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>> >>>>of them did.
>>
>>> >>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>> >>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>> >>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>> >>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>> >>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>> >>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>> >>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>> >>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>> >>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>> >>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>> >>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>> >>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>> >>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>> >>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>> >>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>> >>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>> >>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>> >>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>> >>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>> >>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>> >>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>> >>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>> >>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>> >>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>> >>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>> >>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>> >>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>> >>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>> >>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>> >>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>> >>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>> >>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>> >>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>> >>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>> >>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>> >>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>> >>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>> >>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>> >>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>> >>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>> >>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>> >>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>> >>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>> >>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>> >>>>killings.
>>
>>> >>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>> >>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>> >>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>> >>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>> >>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>> >>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>> >>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>> >>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>> >>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>> >>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>> >>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>> >>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>> >>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>> >>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>> >>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>> >>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>> >>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>> >>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>> >>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>> >>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>> >>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>> >>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>> >>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>> >>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>> >>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>> >>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>> >>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>> >>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>> >>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>> >>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>> >>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>> >>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>> >>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>> >>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>> >>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>> >>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>> >>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>> >>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>> >>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>> >>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>> >>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>> >>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>> >>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>> >>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>> >>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>> >>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>> >>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>> >>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>> >>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>> >>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>> >>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>> >>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>> >>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>> >>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>> >>>>decided.
>>
>>> >>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>> >>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>> >>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>> >>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>> >>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>> >>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>> >>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>> >>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>> >>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>> >>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>> >>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>> >>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>> >>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>> >>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>> >>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>> >>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>> >>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>> >>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>> >>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>> >>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>> >>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>> >>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>> >>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>> >>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>> >>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>> >>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>> >>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>> >>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>> >>>>feeling.
>>
>>> >>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews isn't surprising. What is
>>> >>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>> >>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>> >>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>> >>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>> >>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>> >>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>> >>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>> >>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>> >>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>> >>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>> >>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>> >>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>> >>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>> >>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>> >>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>> >>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>>> >>>>++++++++++++++
>>
>>> >>>>American Renaissance
>>> >>>>http://www.amren.com
>>
>>> >>>>Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>>> >>>>http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>>> >>>>Euro-American Students Union
>>> >>>>http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>>> >>>>Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>>> >>>>http://www.14words.com
>>
>>> >>>>National Alliance
>>> >>>>http://www.natvan.com
>>
>>> >>>>Stormfront
>>> >>>>http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>>> >>>>Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>>> >>>>http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>> I like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, PAMYAT, HAMAS or Aryan Nations,etc.
>>
>> CALL late nights best, or even VISIT me:
>> Donald Ray Ellis
>> aka Pat Blakely/RevWhite/Mike Kalvatis/Rob Stewart ET AL
>> 108 E. Victory Street
>> Star City, Arkansas 71667
>> Tel: (870) 628-1437
>> Email: voiceofreason@blakely.harrogate.net
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> Posted by:
>> Patrick Lee Humphrey
>> 7500 Bellerive #1807
>> Houston, Texas 77036-3040
>> 1-713-266-7764
>>
>> Steven Horn (KCOM)
>> 1836 NW 11th St
>> Oklahoma City, OK 73106
>> (405) 524-0576
>>
>> together with
>>
>> Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive &
>> Henry who like
>> late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>>
>> CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
>> Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even
>> VISIT me at:
>> 55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132
>>
>>
>> Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
>> office: VISIT at:
>> #5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
>> Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
>> or call: 1-250-616-9431
>>
>> As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is
>> called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material
>> should give an indication as to the why.
>>
>> "I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
>> proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
>> yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
>> seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
>> my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
>> moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
>> http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
>> also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]
>>
>> Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like
>> a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
>> even if he or she were not naked"?
>> http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg
>>
>> For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
>> background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David Michael's
>> detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and is
>> known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a grosvenor!!
>> It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases, just
>> to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.
>>
>> Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
>> NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
>> Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: FlaviaR@verizon.net, especially late 
>> nights.
>>
>> Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
>> Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
>> I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or
>> send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
>> work:(780)492-0473
>>
>> And also: George Firestone: "George" 
>>
>> Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
>> Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!
>>
>> For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
>> JEW-WATCH:
>> http://www.jewwatch.com
>>
>> Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
>> NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
>> people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Or, other useful websites include:
>> ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
>> IHR - www.ihr.org
>> OSTARA - www.ostara.org
>> PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
>> Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
>> AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
>> THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press,
>>    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
>>    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com
>>
>> Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
>> They have lots of information, as well as books and records.
>>
>> They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
>> and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.
>>
>> As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a
>> victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
>> of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
>> May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.
>>
>> In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
>> for many years around the world.
>>
>> Reply-To: "George" 
>>
>> _________________________________________
>> Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>> More than 140,000 groups
>> Unlimited download
>> http://www.usenetzone.com to open account 
>



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Subject: Re: KATYN=MURDERS OF  POLISH  BY ZYDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! Like Vinnitsa!! NEVER  FORGET!
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With even the Soviets forced to admit that it was their ZYD NKVD who
did the murders at KATYN, why are you apologising for them?

Historians and experts proved it was NOt the Germans!

Were you one of the killers, or perhaps your father, uncle or?


On Sat, 8 Jul 2006 11:54:59 -0700, "Peter Wielki" 
wrote:

>Actually, in Katyn there were Russians and Ukraninians that did the crime, 
>as far as I know.
>
>But yeah, let's blame it on JEWS!!!  Germans did it too, right Frankie?


>"Frank Arthur"  wrote in message 
>news:ummva2ddrk9aik6jnqimp9mseb9b5ap4g1@4ax.com...
>> True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZYDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary of 
>> the
>> discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland 
>> had
>> been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated to 
>> The
>> Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis, who
>> invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely used 
>> the
>> word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler learned, 
>> as
>> dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers from a 
>> single
>> narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: its intent was 
>> to
>> eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its perceived
>> guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the
>> exiled Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn, 
>> outside
>> Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and
>> the terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the 
>> relationship
>> between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him, 
>> awarding
>> him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his future murder 
>> victims.
>> And when Stalin jested that they should settle the German problem once and 
>> for
>> all by killing 50,000 German officers, Churchill merely protested sulkily, 
>> and
>> Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one 
>> by
>> which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three knew 
>> of
>> the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, all 
>> three -
>> two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich 
>> five
>> years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn: once
>> Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with almost
>> anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn into 
>> the
>> diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan Government 
>> in
>> the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a memorial in London to the
>> victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>>>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>>>Katyn
>>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>>>of Poland.
>>
>>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>>>in 1940.
>>
>>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>>>Russia.
>>
>>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>>>FBI.
>>
>>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>>>of them did.
>>
>>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>>>killings.
>>
>> ISRAEL REFUSED TO PROSECUTE THESAE ZHID MURDERERS!!
>>
>>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>>>decided.
>>
>>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>>>feeling.
>>
>>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews/ZHIDS  isn't surprising. What is
>>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>> ++++++++++++++
>>
>> American Renaissance
>> http://www.amren.com
>>
>> Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>> http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>> Euro-American Students Union
>> http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>> Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>> http://www.14words.com
>>
>> National Alliance
>> http://www.natvan.com
>>
>> Stormfront
>> http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>> Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>> http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>>
>> First,let us kill all the lawyers! - W.Shakespeare
>> First, we get rid of all the politicians! - Mao tse Dung
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled-as fertiliser!!
>> Me
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Newsgroups:
>> pl.regionalne.krakow,pl.regionalne.lodz,pl.regionalne.warszawa,soc.culture.polish,alt.politics.europe
>> Subject: KATYN=MURDERS BY ZHIDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZHIDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:
>> soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary
>> of the discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland
>> had been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated
>> to The Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis,
>> who invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely
>> used the word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler
>> learned, as dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers
>> from a single narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: 
>> its
>> intent was to eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its
>> perceived guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the exiled
>> Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn,
>> outside Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. 
>> A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and the
>> terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the
>> relationship between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him,
>> awarding him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his
>> future murder victims. And when Stalin jested that they should settle the
>> German problem once and for all by killing 50,000 German officers, 
>> Churchill
>> merely protested sulkily, and Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing
>> only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one
>> by which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three
>> knew of the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, 
>> all
>> three - two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to
>> those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich
>> five years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn:
>> once Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with
>> almost anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn
>> into the diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan
>> Government in the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a
>> memorial in London to the victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>> >>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>> >>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>> >>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>> >>>>Katyn
>>> >>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>> >>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>> >>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>> >>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>> >>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>> >>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>> >>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>> >>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>> >>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>> >>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>> >>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>> >>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>> >>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>> >>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>> >>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>> >>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>> >>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>> >>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>> >>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>> >>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>> >>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>> >>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>> >>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>> >>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>> >>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>> >>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>> >>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>> >>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>> >>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>> >>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>> >>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>> >>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>> >>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>> >>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>> >>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>> >>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>> >>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>> >>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>> >>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>> >>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>> >>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>> >>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>> >>>>of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>> >>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>> >>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>> >>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>> >>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>> >>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>> >>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>> >>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>> >>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>in 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>> >>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>> >>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>> >>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>> >>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>> >>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>> >>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>> >>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>> >>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>> >>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>> >>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>> >>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>> >>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>> >>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>> >>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>> >>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>> >>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>> >>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>> >>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>> >>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>> >>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>> >>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>> >>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>> >>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>> >>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>> >>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>> >>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>> >>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>> >>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>> >>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>> >>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>> >>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>> >>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>> >>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>> >>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>> >>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>> >>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>> >>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>> >>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>> >>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>> >>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>> >>>>Russia.
>>
>>> >>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>> >>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>> >>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>> >>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>> >>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>> >>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>> >>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>> >>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>> >>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>> >>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>> >>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>> >>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>> >>>>FBI.
>>
>>> >>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>> >>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>> >>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>> >>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>> >>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>> >>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>> >>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>> >>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>> >>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>> >>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>> >>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>> >>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>> >>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>> >>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>> >>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>> >>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>> >>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>> >>>>of them did.
>>
>>> >>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>> >>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>> >>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>> >>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>> >>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>> >>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>> >>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>> >>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>> >>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>> >>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>> >>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>> >>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>> >>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>> >>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>> >>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>> >>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>> >>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>> >>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>> >>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>> >>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>> >>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>> >>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>> >>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>> >>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>> >>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>> >>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>> >>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>> >>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>> >>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>> >>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>> >>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>> >>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>> >>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>> >>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>> >>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>> >>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>> >>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>> >>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>> >>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>> >>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>> >>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>> >>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>> >>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>> >>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>> >>>>killings.
>>
>>> >>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>> >>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>> >>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>> >>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>> >>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>> >>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>> >>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>> >>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>> >>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>> >>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>> >>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>> >>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>> >>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>> >>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>> >>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>> >>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>> >>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>> >>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>> >>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>> >>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>> >>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>> >>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>> >>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>> >>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>> >>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>> >>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>> >>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>> >>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>> >>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>> >>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>> >>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>> >>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>> >>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>> >>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>> >>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>> >>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>> >>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>> >>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>> >>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>> >>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>> >>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>> >>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>> >>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>> >>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>> >>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>> >>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>> >>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>> >>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>> >>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>> >>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>> >>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>> >>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>> >>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>> >>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>> >>>>decided.
>>
>>> >>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>> >>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>> >>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>> >>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>> >>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>> >>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>> >>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>> >>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>> >>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>> >>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>> >>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>> >>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>> >>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>> >>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>> >>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>> >>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>> >>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>> >>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>> >>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>> >>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>> >>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>> >>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>> >>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>> >>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>> >>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>> >>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>> >>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>> >>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>> >>>>feeling.
>>
>>> >>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews isn't surprising. What is
>>> >>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>> >>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>> >>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>> >>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>> >>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>> >>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>> >>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>> >>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>> >>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>> >>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>> >>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>> >>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>> >>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>> >>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>> >>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>> >>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>>> >>>>++++++++++++++
>>
>>> >>>>American Renaissance
>>> >>>>http://www.amren.com
>>
>>> >>>>Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>>> >>>>http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>>> >>>>Euro-American Students Union
>>> >>>>http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>>> >>>>Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>>> >>>>http://www.14words.com
>>
>>> >>>>National Alliance
>>> >>>>http://www.natvan.com
>>
>>> >>>>Stormfront
>>> >>>>http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>>> >>>>Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>>> >>>>http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>> I like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, PAMYAT, HAMAS or Aryan Nations,etc.
>>
>> CALL late nights best, or even VISIT me:
>> Donald Ray Ellis
>> aka Pat Blakely/RevWhite/Mike Kalvatis/Rob Stewart ET AL
>> 108 E. Victory Street
>> Star City, Arkansas 71667
>> Tel: (870) 628-1437
>> Email: voiceofreason@blakely.harrogate.net
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> Posted by:
>> Patrick Lee Humphrey
>> 7500 Bellerive #1807
>> Houston, Texas 77036-3040
>> 1-713-266-7764
>>
>> Steven Horn (KCOM)
>> 1836 NW 11th St
>> Oklahoma City, OK 73106
>> (405) 524-0576
>>
>> together with
>>
>> Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive &
>> Henry who like
>> late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>>
>> CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
>> Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even
>> VISIT me at:
>> 55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132
>>
>>
>> Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
>> office: VISIT at:
>> #5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
>> Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
>> or call: 1-250-616-9431
>>
>> As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is
>> called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material
>> should give an indication as to the why.
>>
>> "I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
>> proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
>> yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
>> seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
>> my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
>> moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
>> http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
>> also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]
>>
>> Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like
>> a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
>> even if he or she were not naked"?
>> http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg
>>
>> For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
>> background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David Michael's
>> detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and is
>> known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a grosvenor!!
>> It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases, just
>> to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.
>>
>> Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
>> NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
>> Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: FlaviaR@verizon.net, especially late 
>> nights.
>>
>> Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
>> Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
>> I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or
>> send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
>> work:(780)492-0473
>>
>> And also: George Firestone: "George" 
>>
>> Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
>> Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!
>>
>> For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
>> JEW-WATCH:
>> http://www.jewwatch.com
>>
>> Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
>> NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
>> people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Or, other useful websites include:
>> ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
>> IHR - www.ihr.org
>> OSTARA - www.ostara.org
>> PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
>> Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
>> AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
>> THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press,
>>    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
>>    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com
>>
>> Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
>> They have lots of information, as well as books and records.
>>
>> They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
>> and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.
>>
>> As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a
>> victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
>> of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
>> May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.
>>
>> In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
>> for many years around the world.
>>
>> Reply-To: "George" 
>>
>> _________________________________________
>> Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>> More than 140,000 groups
>> Unlimited download
>> http://www.usenetzone.com to open account 
>



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On 27 Nov 2005 16:19:47 -0800, "Ariadne" wrote:
>Jason P wrote:
>> By Paula Amann

>> Washington Jewish Week/Jewsweek - 2001

>> http://www.jewsweek.com/society/059.htm

>> They come to Israel from the Ukraine, Russia, and Moldova looking for
>> freedom. Instead they are sold as sex slaves. And you thought Israel
>> was holy.

>> Jewsweek.com | Their names are Natalya, Oxana or Svetlana. They come to
>> Israel, as immigrants do, for a better life. But their dreams of
>> working as a waitress, nurse, or au pair turn nightmarish upon their
>> arrival.

>> Their fellow countryman who met them at the airport, speaking the
>> language of home, takes them to a locked apartment with barred windows
>> and a phone that only takes incoming calls, where they are forced to
>> provide sexual services to strangers.

>> Those who rebel risk being raped, beaten, or starved. Even those who
>> knew they were going into prostitution are shocked by the stark
>> conditions, the pay of roughly 20 shekalim ($5) a day or less for their
>> labor.

>> This disturbing story unfolds all too often at the hotline for Migrant
>> Workers, a Tel Aviv agency founded in 1998 to protect the human rights
>> of foreign workers, victims of sex trafficking among them. The hotline
>> takes as its motto the familiar line from Exodus 22:20: "You shall not
>> wrong a stranger or oppress him, for you were strangers in the land of
>> Egypt."

>> Agency director and co-founder Sigal Rozen, along with the group's
>> counsel, Nomi Levenkron, were in Washington, D.C., last week to give a
>> lecture at the Johns Hopkins Nitze School of Advanced International
>> Studies, to network and to speak with supporters. Among them are the
>> New Israel Fund, which has given the hotline a total of $19,000 during
>> the past year and a half.

>> In an interview, Rozen called sex trafficking an "unorganized crime,"
>> based largely on personal networks of immigrants from the Ukraine,
>> Russia, and Moldova.

>> "... "It's easier being a trafficker than being a plumber ..."   --Nomi
>> Levenkron

>> Those three countries alone accounted for 91 percent of the 474 women
>> arrested in brothels and deported from Israel in 2000, according to
>> figures compiled by hotline volunteers during visits to the Neveh
>> Tirzah women's prison.

>> These statistics represent only a fraction of the problem. Police
>> spokespersons have set the number of women brought into the country to
>> work in the sex industry at 2,000-3,000 annually, the number of
>> brothels at 250, Rozen said.

>> "It's Misha that knows Sasha that knows Vladimir," added Levenkron,
>> noting the economic incentive to be a pimp or work with one. "It's
>> easier being a trafficker than being a plumber."

>> One day she got a phone call from a rape crisis center where a woman
>> pleaded to be arrested and deported.

>> This young Moldovian had twice tried to escape her pimp and at 18, was
>> burned out on prostitution and just wanted to go home.

>> "She's so young and sweet," reflected Levenkron. "She came to Israel to
>> be a waitress."

>> A year ago this month, Israel passed the Law Against Trafficking Women.
>> Before that time, other laws existed against soliciting, pimping, and
>> running brothels.

>> Yet hotline staff point out that few pimps involved in trafficking ever
>> face a judge, with the majority of prostitutes deported without ever
>> facing a trial that might involve their testimony against their pimps.
>> Out of 459 women deported in 1998, only 35 cases went to trial; out of
>> 253 in 1999, a scant five ended up in the courtroom.

>> Judicial indifference is compounded by police complicity, Levenkron
>> argued.

>> The 18-year-old Moldovian, it turned out, had at one point in her
>> misadventures, found herself in a Tel Aviv police station where some of
>> the officers, who were her clients, recognized her and moved to call
>> her pimp.

>> Overhearing their plans, the woman fled and moved in with a
>> client-turned-boyfriend.

>> But somehow the pimp found her again, threatened the boyfriend. The
>> young woman, with no place to go, went back to the brothel. Now the
>> case hangs in the courts, where Levenkron has faint hopes for a
>> positive outcome.

>> The police role in such trafficking ranges from casual to highly
>> serious, she alleged.

>> "There are police who just come as clients, those who get special
>> discounts because of their good relationships with the owner of the
>> place and those that inform the owner about police operations,"
>> explained Levenkron.

>> One young Beersheva prostitute told the attorney she was forced to work
>> seven days a week unless a police raid was expected.

>> Widespread fear of violence from pimps has muted the public outcry, say
>> hotline staff. When Levenkron filed a suit on behalf of a
>> Beersheva-based woman, a 20-year-old Moldovian who had survived six
>> pimps and multiple rapes, several of the lawyer's friends came to her
>> home to bid her a final farewell, in anticipation of her imminent
>> death, she said.

>> INTERNATIONAL PROBLEM

>> Worldwide, trafficking in persons for domestic service, forced labor,
>> and prostitution ranks third after drugs and guns among the activities
>> of international crime, according to a congressional service report
>> released May 10, 2000. For comparison, about 50,000 people are brought
>> to the United States annually, the report stated.

>> The rise in trafficking seen over the 1990s was fueled by feeble
>> economies in source countries, such as the former Soviet Union and
>> Southeast Asia, along with weak penalties for traffickers, said a
>> government official familiar with these issues.

>> Last October, the United States passed its own law addressing this
>> problem, the Victims of Trafficking and Violence Protection Act, which
>> calls on the State Department to report annually on the scope of
>> trafficking in various countries and measures taken to combat it. The
>> report was due for release on June 1, but its publication has been
>> delayed.

>> In Israel today, official policy on trafficking is to arrest and deport
>> foreign sex workers. The women are held for an average of 30 days under
>> crowded and sometimes harsh conditions, longer if they testify in court
>> against their pimps, according to hotline data.

>> Rozen and Levenkron take issue with this approach. "Deporting women
>> doesn't make things better," said Levenkron. "I'm tired of shouting
>> this all over Israel so I've come here [to the United States] to shout
>> about it."

>> Rozen contends that a one-year work permit in specified fields such as
>> home health care or child care, before their return home, would put the
>> former prostitutes in a stronger position to take care of themselves.

>> Gruesome albeit unsubstantiated stories abound, she says, about revenge
>> attacks on returning women and their families by the original
>> trafficker in the home country.

>> A nest egg from a year's legitimate work, Rozen suggests, would allow
>> victims to re-establish themselves in a new community and stay out of
>> the clutches of traffickers in the future.

>> Meanwhile, Levenkron is seeking professional back-up in her job
>> representing the victims of trafficking.

>> "I am the [hotline] legal department," laments Levenkron. "We need
>> lawyers and we need public awareness."



From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Thu Dec 20 14:13:01 EST 2007
Article: 63831 of soc.culture.swiss
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Subject: Re: KATYN=MURDERS OF  POLISH  BY ZYDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! Like Vinnitsa!! NEVER  FORGET!
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With even the Soviets forced to admit that it was their ZYD NKVD who
did the murders at KATYN, why are you apologising for them?

Historians and experts proved it was NOT the Germans!

Were you one of the killers, or perhaps your father, uncle or?


On Sat, 8 Jul 2006 11:54:59 -0700, "Peter Wielki" 
wrote:

>Actually, in Katyn there were Russians and Ukraninians that did the crime, 
>as far as I know.
>
>But yeah, let's blame it on JEWS!!!  Germans did it too, right Frankie?


>"Frank Arthur"  wrote in message 
>news:ummva2ddrk9aik6jnqimp9mseb9b5ap4g1@4ax.com...
>> True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZYDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary of 
>> the
>> discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland 
>> had
>> been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated to 
>> The
>> Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis, who
>> invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely used 
>> the
>> word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler learned, 
>> as
>> dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers from a 
>> single
>> narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: its intent was 
>> to
>> eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its perceived
>> guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the
>> exiled Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn, 
>> outside
>> Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and
>> the terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the 
>> relationship
>> between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him, 
>> awarding
>> him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his future murder 
>> victims.
>> And when Stalin jested that they should settle the German problem once and 
>> for
>> all by killing 50,000 German officers, Churchill merely protested sulkily, 
>> and
>> Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one 
>> by
>> which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three knew 
>> of
>> the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, all 
>> three -
>> two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich 
>> five
>> years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn: once
>> Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with almost
>> anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn into 
>> the
>> diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan Government 
>> in
>> the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a memorial in London to the
>> victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>>>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>>>Katyn
>>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>>>of Poland.
>>
>>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>>>in 1940.
>>
>>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>>>Russia.
>>
>>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>>>FBI.
>>
>>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>>>of them did.
>>
>>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>>>killings.
>>
>> ISRAEL REFUSED TO PROSECUTE THESAE ZHID MURDERERS!!
>>
>>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>>>decided.
>>
>>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>>>feeling.
>>
>>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews/ZHIDS  isn't surprising. What is
>>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>> ++++++++++++++
>>
>> American Renaissance
>> http://www.amren.com
>>
>> Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>> http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>> Euro-American Students Union
>> http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>> Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>> http://www.14words.com
>>
>> National Alliance
>> http://www.natvan.com
>>
>> Stormfront
>> http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>> Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>> http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>>
>> First,let us kill all the lawyers! - W.Shakespeare
>> First, we get rid of all the politicians! - Mao tse Dung
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled-as fertiliser!!
>> Me
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Newsgroups:
>> pl.regionalne.krakow,pl.regionalne.lodz,pl.regionalne.warszawa,soc.culture.polish,alt.politics.europe
>> Subject: KATYN=MURDERS BY ZHIDS/SOVIET NKVD!!! True,Just Like Vinnitsa!!
>>
>> The filthy ZHIDS can no longer lie about KATYN and try to blame the
>> Germans.
>>
>> Even the Soviets had to admit the truth, and also about Vinnitsa.
>>
>> No wonder around the world more and more people are starting to really
>> dislike the filthy ZHIDS!!
>>
>>
>> Latest update follows:
>> From: "Strider" 
>> Newsgroups:
>> soc.culture.jewish,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.usa,soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.yugoslavia
>> Subject: Jewish Copmmissars murdered these Poles
>>
>> Our shame still lies in the Katyn forest
>> By Kevin Myers
>> (Filed: 27/04/2003)
>>
>>
>> Today Poles all over the world will commemorate the 60th anniversary
>> of the discovery of the war crime which didn't occur. And the
>> non-existence of this atrocity constituted democracy's most sordid 
>> exercise in
>> realpolitik of the entire 20th century. The Soviet Union captured 180,000
>> Polish soldiers during its invasion of Poland in 1939. Most were herded 
>> off to
>> slave-camps in Siberia, but 22,000 officers were not. In April 1940, on
>> Stalin's orders, each was bound with barbed wire and executed with a 
>> single
>> shot to the head.
>>
>> This was a colossal undertaking: the death toll was greater than that
>> on the most calamitous day in British military history - the Somme, July 
>> 1,
>> 1916.
>> More importantly, the massacres occurred before the German invasions
>> of France and the Low Countries. And although hundreds of Jews in Poland
>> had been murdered, these were improvised butcheries, essentially unrelated
>> to The Final Solution, which had not yet begun.
>>
>> So the first systematic mass murder of defenceless innocents in the
>> Second World War was not by the Nazis, but by the Soviet Union, just over 
>> a
>> year before the USSR became Britain's official best friend. This shouldn't
>> surprise us: after all, it had been the Soviets, and not the Nazis,
>> who invented industrialised murder. From the revolution on, they freely
>> used the word "exterminate" of their enemies. Hitler listened; and Hitler
>> learned, as dictators do. Moreover, the careful murder of so many officers
>> from a single narrow stratum of Polish society was truly proto-genocide: 
>> its
>> intent was to eliminate Polish identity by the extermination of all its
>> perceived guardians.
>>
>> In 1943, via two sources - through a population census within the exiled
>> Polish community living in the USSR, and from the Germans, who had
>> discovered the site of one of the massacres, in the woods of Katyn,
>> outside Smolensk - the British discovered the fate of the Polish officers. 
>> A
>> devastating report from the British ambassador to the Polish
>> government-in-exile, Owen O'Malley, left no doubt about the matter.
>>
>> The British Government's public response was to dismiss the Nazi
>> discoveries as propaganda and tell the Polish government-in-exile to 
>> forget
>> Katyn and to proceed with beating the real enemy, Germany.
>>
>> War is war, and in peace it is impossible to replicate the fevers and the
>> terrors it induces. So no useful moral judgment can be made about
>> those who decided in 1943 publicly to accept lies as fact, and to conceal 
>> the
>> truth as regrettable but necessary strategy. But it was statecraft at its 
>> most
>> pusillanimous to allow those lies to become a cornerstone of the
>> relationship between the Western allies and the Soviet Union.
>>
>> That is what happened when the three leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt
>> and Stalin - met at Teheran in November 1943. Far from berating the Soviet
>> Leader for the massacres, the two democratic leaders propitiated him,
>> awarding him the Polish land he had stolen even as he seized his
>> future murder victims. And when Stalin jested that they should settle the
>> German problem once and for all by killing 50,000 German officers, 
>> Churchill
>> merely protested sulkily, and Roosevelt light-heartedly suggested killing
>> only 49,000.
>>
>> But nobody mentioned Katyn. How was this possible? For the massacre of
>> the Poles was surely the secret subtext to this grisly exchange, and one
>> by which Stalin was taking the measure of his two confreres. All three
>> knew of the murders, and the bodyguard of lies around them: and silently, 
>> all
>> three - two of them abjectly, the third triumphantly - assented to
>> those lies.
>>
>> Teheran was the true nadir of international diplomacy, morally far
>> more ignoble and strategically far more catastrophic than either Munich
>> five years before or Yalta a year later. And the key to Teheran was Katyn:
>> once Stalin had got away with that, he realised he could get away with
>> almost anything.
>>
>> Moreover, the fiction of Katyn took root within the Foreign Office.
>> There, nourished on complicit cowardice and malformed in the darkness of
>> pathological guilt, the temporary tactic of 1943 was in time to turn
>> into the diseased plant of enduring policy. It even caused the Callaghan
>> Government in the 1970s vehemently to oppose the erection of a
>> memorial in London to the victims of Katyn.
>>
>> Denial, in its purest psychiatric sense, of Katyn also infused much
>> consideration of the 20th century: how else could Roy Jenkins have
>> written a life of Churchill without once referring to Katyn, the Great Lie 
>> of
>> which the prime minister was prime mover? How else could so many 
>> historians
>> -
>> Norman Davies aside - simply ignore the extraordinary Western
>> collusion in covering up communist atrocities, and the profound impact 
>> this
>> must have had on Kremlin thinking?
>>
>> On Thursday the FCO publishes a report, British reactions to the Katyn
>> Massacre, in a belated attempt at expiation for Britain's repeated
>> cover-ups of this terrible affair. But it cannot undo the evil of the
>> extermination of the Polish officer corps which, far from being the 
>> subject of
>> a war-crimes trial, was embraced and rewarded at Teheran; and from that 
>> city,
>> the communism of Katyn was soon to march forth and conquer half the world.
>>
>> My thanks to you for reposting this article.
>> A brilliant truthful piece.
>> Ed Kadach
>>
>> mahdi@alahram.com wrote:
>>> >>On Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:06:50 GMT, morgan@shamrock.com wrote:
>>> >>>On 1 May 1998 13:08:00 +0200, Irmin@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>>> >>>>American Dissident Voices Broadcast of April 25, 1998
>>
>>> >>>>Katyn
>>> >>>>by Dr. William Pierce
>>
>>> >>>>A background noise that seems never to go away is the constant
>>> >>>>whining and yammering of the Jews about how the world owes them a
>>> >>>>living because of their losses during the so-called "Holocaust."
>>> >>>>They do it, of course, because they make such a big profit on it.
>>> >>>>The latest flare-up of this Jewish play for a handout came more
>>> >>>>than a year ago when they began demanding that the Swiss pay them
>>> >>>>$7 billion, which "Holocaust" victims allegedly had stashed in
>>> >>>>numbered Swiss accounts before being hauled off to gas chambers
>>> >>>>during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>With a few "bought" Gentile politicians fronting for them, the
>>> >>>>foremost among these being New York's Senator Alphonse D'Amato,
>>> >>>>the Jews threatened Switzerland with a boycott by the U.S.
>>> >>>>government if their demands were not met. Instead of laughing in
>>> >>>>their faces, telling the Jews to go to hell, and gearing up for
>>> >>>>countermeasures against Israel and other Jewish interests if the
>>> >>>>Jews tried to proceed with a boycott, the Swiss politicians tried
>>> >>>>to placate the Jews by offering to buy themoff. The Jews took the
>>> >>>>Swiss response as a sign of weakness and escalated their demands.
>>
>>> >>>>The average Swiss citizen seems to have a little more pride than
>>> >>>>Switzerland's elected officials, however, and resentment against
>>> >>>>the Jews' extortion efforts is building in Switzerland now to the
>>> >>>>point that some of that country's richest Jews are wearing
>>> >>>>bulletproof vests whenever they must go out in public.
>>
>>> >>>>In general, however, this "Holocaust"-based extortion racket
>>> >>>>works quite well for the Jews, and they have expanded their
>>> >>>>demands for World War Two reparations to include a number of
>>> >>>>other countries besides Switzerland. They are even whining that
>>> >>>>the Vatican owes them because Pope Pius XII didn't do enough to
>>> >>>>save them from the Germans during the war. The Jews' brazenness
>>> >>>>in this whole business is quite breathtaking.
>>
>>> >>>>Their brazenness, of course, is justified, because by and large
>>> >>>>they have been getting away with it. And they have been getting
>>> >>>>away with it because with their media control they have been able
>>> >>>>to distort the general public's whole perception of what happened
>>> >>>>during the Second World War. They have been able to portray
>>> >>>>themselves as innocent victims and just about everyone else as
>>> >>>>persecutors and aggressors, even the people who were fighting on
>>> >>>>the Jewish side against the Germans during the war. For example,
>>> >>>>they have done quite a bit of whining that after the Red Army
>>> >>>>drove the Germans from Poland, the Poles took the opportunity to
>>> >>>>lynch hundreds of Jews in 1945 and 1946: Jews whom the Germans
>>> >>>>somehow had failed to get rid of during their wartime occupation
>>> >>>>of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>Now, why would the Poles do something like that? Why would they
>>> >>>>lynch the poor Jews, who had been on their side during the war?
>>> >>>>If you learned about the war from watching Steven Spielberg
>>> >>>>propaganda films and other mass-media sources, you probably
>>> >>>>believe that it was because of religious anti-Semitism on the
>>> >>>>part of the Catholic Poles. Let me tell you the real reason why
>>> >>>>so many Poles hated Jews after the war. It's something the
>>> >>>>Jew-controlled media in America have tried hard to keep covered
>>> >>>>up. Let me tell you about what happened in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>in 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>In September 1939 Poland was invaded from the west by Germany and
>>> >>>>from the east by the Soviet Union. The Germans wanted back the
>>> >>>>territory in western Poland, including the city of Danzig, which
>>> >>>>had been taken from them at the end of the First World War. The
>>> >>>>Soviets wanted eastern Poland. The Germans and the Soviets
>>> >>>>divided Poland between them, with the boundary running roughly
>>> >>>>along the River Bug.
>>
>>> >>>>Britain and France, both under strong Jewish pressure, declared
>>> >>>>war on Germany in September 1939, ostensibly because of Germany's
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland. They did not declare war on the Soviet Union,
>>> >>>>which also had invaded Poland. In the United States and in
>>> >>>>western Europe, where the Jews held a deathgrip on the mass
>>> >>>>media, a great deal of anti-German propaganda was based on the
>>> >>>>German grab for Polish territory -- much of which, of course,
>>> >>>>actually was historically German territory -- and nothing was
>>> >>>>said of the Soviet occupation and annexation of eastern Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>The reason for this anti-German and pro-Soviet bias by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media was that the Jews were riding high in the Soviet Union as
>>> >>>>commissars and communist party bosses under Stalin, while in
>>> >>>>Germany Hitler had undertaken a program since 1933 of freeing
>>> >>>>Germany from all Jewish influence. Jews had been weeded out of
>>> >>>>the media, the law, the schools, and other areas of economic and
>>> >>>>cultural life in Germany. Before Hitler became chancellor in 1933
>>> >>>>the Jews had done in Germany what they do in every country where
>>> >>>>they gain a foothold: they had monopolized large sections of the
>>> >>>>mass media and certain professions and were doing their best to
>>> >>>>distort German culture, German society, and the German economy
>>> >>>>to suit themselves. Hitler put a stop to that, and two-thirds of
>>> >>>>the 1933 Jewish population of Germany had emigrated by the
>>> >>>>invasion of Poland in September 1939. So the Jews hated Germany
>>> >>>>and were determined to do whatever they could to destroy her.
>>
>>> >>>>For his part, Hitler hoped to avoid war with Britain and France.
>>> >>>>He hoped that after his quick victory in western Poland he could
>>> >>>>make peace with Britain and France. He was determined, however,
>>> >>>>to stamp out communism wherever he encountered it. Not only did
>>> >>>>he hate communism on ideological grounds, but he had sworn to
>>> >>>>fight communism when the communists in Germany betrayed his
>>> >>>>country at the end of the First World War. Hitler also saw the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union as a threat to all of Europe, and he was determined
>>> >>>>to break the power of that country when he could, even though
>>> >>>>there was an uneasy non-aggression pact between Germany and the
>>> >>>>Soviet Union in 1939, at the time of their partition of Poland.
>>
>>> >>>>In the spring of 1941 massive troop movements and other
>>> >>>>developments inside the Soviet Union convinced Hitler that Stalin
>>> >>>>was preparing to invade the west with the Red Army, and so in
>>> >>>>June 1941 Hitler made a preemptive strike. German forces smashed
>>> >>>>through the Red Army and made rapid advances, first through
>>> >>>>Soviet-occupied eastern Poland and then through Ukraine and into
>>> >>>>Russia.
>>
>>> >>>>A year and a half later, in February 1943, German forces near
>>> >>>>Smolensk, in western Russia, investigated reports they heard from
>>> >>>>Russian civilians to the effect that a large number of prisoners
>>> >>>>had been murdered by the Soviet secret police in the area nearly
>>> >>>>three years earlier. The German investigators were led by local
>>> >>>>Russians to a series of mounds in a wooded area known locally as
>>> >>>>Katyn Forest, about 10 miles west of Smolensk. The forest is
>>> >>>>named for a village, Katyn, which it surrounds. The forest had
>>> >>>>been privately owned prior to the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917,
>>> >>>>but after the communist takeover of Russia the area had been
>>> >>>>confiscated by the government and part of the forest had been
>>> >>>>turned over to the NKVD, the Soviet equivalent of the American
>>> >>>>FBI.
>>
>>> >>>>The Germans began digging in the mounds in the Katyn forest and
>>> >>>>made a horrible discovery. They found corpse after corpse, each
>>> >>>>with its hands bound behind its back and a bullet hole in the
>>> >>>>base of its skull. They continued their excavations for more than
>>> >>>>a month, and eventually uncovered more than 4,000 corpses. Other
>>> >>>>bodies may have remained buried in other mounds, but the Germans
>>> >>>>had no time to dig up the whole forest. Instead they called in
>>> >>>>the International Red Cross and representatives of various
>>> >>>>neutral countries to examine their findings. They also brought in
>>> >>>>groups of Allied prisoners of war, including Americans, from
>>> >>>>prison camps in Germany to view the graves in the Katyn forest.
>>> >>>>They gave these international inspectors complete freedom to
>>> >>>>examine the exhumed bodies, permitted doctors among them to
>>> >>>>conduct autopsies, even allowed them to dig up other bodies from
>>> >>>>one of the mounds which had not been completely excavated. The
>>> >>>>Germans asked only that the inspectors report back truthfully to
>>> >>>>their own governments about their observations. And in fact, most
>>> >>>>of them did.
>>
>>> >>>>What they reported was that the bodies were those of Polish
>>> >>>>military officers, along with a number of civilian cultural and
>>> >>>>business leaders and intellectuals -- scientists, writers, poets
>>> >>>>-- who had been in the portion of Poland occupied by the Soviet
>>> >>>>Union in September 1939. Altogether the Soviet secret police had
>>> >>>>rounded up some 15,000 Polish leaders in 1939 -- including nearly
>>> >>>>half of the entire Polish officer's corps, the half that had had
>>> >>>>the misfortune of being in eastern Poland at the time -- and put
>>> >>>>them in three concentration camps in Russia: at Starobelsk,
>>> >>>>Kozelsk, and Ostashkov. All of the bodies unearthed in the
>>> >>>>Katyn forest were of Polish leaders who had been confined at one
>>> >>>>of these camps: Starobelsk.
>>
>>> >>>>Rounding up a country's leaders and killing them was standard
>>> >>>>practice for the communists. The theory was that the leaders were
>>> >>>>bourgeois oppressors of the working class and deserved to die. As
>>> >>>>egalitarians the communists did not regard the Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals as inherently better or more valuable human
>>> >>>>material than the average Polish criminal or welfare bum; the
>>> >>>>officers had simply used their class advantage to gain a better
>>> >>>>life-style for themselves. Of course, no one really believed that
>>> >>>>theory except the criminals and welfare bums and other resentful
>>> >>>>losers and ne'er-do-wells who made up the natural communist
>>> >>>>constituency. As a practical matter, however, killing all the
>>> >>>>leaders and potential leaders of a conquered people made them
>>> >>>>easier to govern. That's what the Marxists had done in Russia,
>>> >>>>Ukraine, and the Baltic countries.
>>
>>> >>>>In the case of the Poles there was a bit of a diplomatic problem,
>>> >>>>though. The Poles supported the war Britain and France had
>>> >>>>declared against Germany, purportedly on their behalf, because
>>> >>>>they viewed that as their one hope for getting back at least the
>>> >>>>western part of their country. They were not happy about the
>>> >>>>Russians taking the eastern part of Poland, but the Russians at
>>> >>>>least were fellow Slavs. The thing to do was get rid of the
>>> >>>>Germans first and then worry about the Russians. This Polish
>>> >>>>strategy suited Stalin fine. But it made it desirable for him to
>>> >>>>avoid alienating the Poles any more than necessary. When Polish
>>> >>>>exiles asked about their imprisoned leaders in late 1939 and
>>> >>>>early 1940, the Soviet government promised that they would be
>>> >>>>released shortly. Meanwhile, the decision had been made to kill
>>> >>>>all of them. And so in April 1940 the Polish leaders were taken
>>> >>>>from the three camps where they had been imprisoned, trucked off
>>> >>>>to various liquidation sites, and murdered. The ones who had been
>>> >>>>imprisoned at Starobelsk all went to the NKVD area of the Katyn
>>> >>>>forest. After the war some of the NKVD executioners were
>>> >>>>interviewed in Israel and described how they had carried out the
>>> >>>>killings.
>>
>>> >>>>The Poles were driven up to the burial pits in long NKVD prison
>>> >>>>trucks known as "black ravens." They were pulled from the trucks
>>> >>>>one at a time by NKVD guards. Each Polish prisoner had his hands
>>> >>>>bound behind his back and then was dragged to the edge of a pit.
>>> >>>>There he was held by two NKVD men while a third fired a pistol
>>> >>>>bullet into the back of his head. Some of the officers had had
>>> >>>>their coats pulled over their heads to keep them from seeing what
>>> >>>>was happening before they were shot. Some struggled and were
>>> >>>>bayonetted by NKVD guards before being shot and thrown into the
>>> >>>>pit. When all of the officers from Starobelsk had been killed,
>>> >>>>some 4,400 of them, the Katyn forest burial pits were covered
>>> >>>>with dirt and pine trees were planted on them. The locations of
>>> >>>>the mass graves of the prisoners from the camps at Kozelsk and
>>> >>>>Ostashkov remain unknown, but none of the 15,000 Polish officers
>>> >>>>and intellectuals rounded up by the NKVD in September 1939 was
>>> >>>>seen alive after April 1940.
>>
>>> >>>>The Red Cross representatives and the Allied prisoners the
>>> >>>>Germans brought in to examine the mass graves in the Katyn forest
>>> >>>>understood after their examination not only who had been killed;
>>> >>>>they also understood who had killed them. This was apparent not
>>> >>>>only from the medical estimates of the length of time the bodies
>>> >>>>had been buried, but also from documentary evidence on the
>>> >>>>bodies. Diaries, news clippings, letters, and other personal
>>> >>>>papers removed from the clothing of the victims all told the same
>>> >>>>story: the latest dates on any of these papers were from
>>> >>>>mid-April 1940. The Polish leaders had been killed in April 1940,
>>> >>>>when they were prisoners of the Soviet Union and when the Katyn
>>> >>>>region was under Soviet control. And this is what they reported
>>> >>>>back to their governments.
>>
>>> >>>>So what do you think happened? Were the British and American
>>> >>>>governments horrified to discover that their "gallant Soviet
>>> >>>>ally," as the Soviet Union was referred to by the mass media, was
>>> >>>>a mass murderer? Did the British government, which had gone to
>>> >>>>war against Germany under the pretext of defending Poland, decide
>>> >>>>that it had made a mistake? Did anyone condemn the Soviet Union
>>> >>>>for this act of genocide against the Poles?
>>
>>> >>>>Of course not! The Allied governments ordered their people who
>>> >>>>had inspected the Katyn site to keep their mouths shut, and the
>>> >>>>Jewish media immediately began announcing that the Germans had
>>> >>>>done it. A mass murder of Polish officers and intellectuals by
>>> >>>>the Nazis had been discovered in the Katyn forest, the New York
>>> >>>>Times and the rest of the Jewish media shrieked. Poor Poles!
>>> >>>>Wicked Germans! The war must go on to free the poor Poles and
>>> >>>>punish the wicked Germans. And the war did go on, killing
>>> >>>>millions of more Germans, British, Americans, and other
>>> >>>>Europeans. And the Germans were indeed punished. The Poles, of
>>> >>>>course, were not freed. Instead they were turned over to the
>>> >>>>Reds, who had butchered their leaders in the Katyn forest, and
>>> >>>>made to suffer under communist rule for half a century.
>>
>>> >>>>The war went on after the German discovery of the mass graves in
>>> >>>>the Katyn forest, because its purpose from the beginning was not
>>> >>>>to free Poland but to destroy Germany, which had dared to free
>>> >>>>itself from the Jews. Roosevelt understood this. Churchill
>>> >>>>understood this. But the American and British people didn't
>>> >>>>understand it, of course, because they were lied to by the Jewish
>>> >>>>media and by their own governments, who in 1943 as in 1998 have
>>> >>>>done whatever has been politically expedient. And what has been
>>> >>>>politically expedient has been what the Jewish media bosses have
>>> >>>>decided.
>>
>>> >>>>The lies about Katyn were maintained by the media for some years
>>> >>>>after the end of the war, because these lies meshed nicely with
>>> >>>>the "Holocaust" story which was making so much money for the
>>> >>>>Jews. Nowadays, of course, the truth about the Katyn murders is
>>> >>>>generally accepted by historians everywhere. You can go into
>>> >>>>almost any large library and read about it and even see the
>>> >>>>gruesome photographs that the Germans took of the Polish bodies
>>> >>>>they dug up. One of several authoritative books on the subject is
>>> >>>>J.K. Zawodny's Death in the Forest: the Story of the Katyn
>>> >>>>Forest Massacre, published in 1962 by the University of Notre
>>> >>>>Dame Press. None of this is publicized a la Steven Spielberg, of
>>> >>>>course, for the illumination of American television audiences. It
>>> >>>>still might undermine the Jews' "Holocaust" racket.
>>
>>> >>>>In 1945 and 1946, although the deceived citizens of the western
>>> >>>>world didn't know the truth about Katyn, Polish patriots did. The
>>> >>>>word had gotten back to the Polish prisoners in German camps from
>>> >>>>the Poles the Germans had taken to examine the graves. After the
>>> >>>>war, when these Polish prisoners were freed, the word spread to
>>> >>>>other Poles. They knew that it was the communists, not the Nazis,
>>> >>>>who had murdered their leaders, who had beheaded their nation.
>>> >>>>And they knew who was behind communism, from the Jew Karl Marx,
>>> >>>>who had started the whole business, up to the Jewish commissars
>>> >>>>who lorded it over them in Soviet-occupied Poland. They knew who
>>> >>>>had welcomed their Soviet conquerors and then collaborated with
>>> >>>>those conquerors. And so it is hardly surprising that in 1945 and
>>> >>>>1946 a few Polish patriots organized lynchings of Jews in Poland,
>>> >>>>before the Reds had a chance to clamp down on all of Poland and
>>> >>>>suppress any further expressions of anti-communist or anti-Jewish
>>> >>>>feeling.
>>
>>> >>>>No, the Polish dislike of Jews isn't surprising. What is
>>> >>>>surprising is that so few patriots in America and Britain have
>>> >>>>expressed their outrage against the Jews, not only for what they
>>> >>>>did to the Poles during and after the war, but for what they have
>>> >>>>done to us: lying to us and using us to wage their wars for them.
>>> >>>>If patriots study the Katyn story and take its lesson to heart,
>>> >>>>they will understand why they cannot trust either the mass media
>>> >>>>or any government which dances to the tune played by the media.
>>> >>>>Franklin Roosevelt and Winston Churchill were as much liars and
>>> >>>>traitors as Bill Clinton and Tony Blair.
>>
>>> >>>>Anyway, you might remember Katyn the next time you hear the Jews
>>> >>>>or some of their bought politicians whining about how much gold
>>> >>>>was stolen from them by the Swiss or how badly the Poles and the
>>> >>>>Germans treated them during the Second World War.
>>
>>> >>>>The text above is based on a broadcast of the American Dissident
>>> >>>>Voices radio program sponsored by National Vanguard Books. To
>>> >>>>receive weekly ADV transcripts, mail: ADVlist@ListServe.com
>>> >>>>Write "subscribe" as the subject of your message.
>>
>>> >>>>++++++++++++++
>>
>>> >>>>American Renaissance
>>> >>>>http://www.amren.com
>>
>>> >>>>Campaign for Radical Truth in History
>>> >>>>http://www.hoffman-info.com
>>
>>> >>>>Euro-American Students Union
>>> >>>>http://esu.simplenet.com
>>
>>> >>>>Katja Lane's Fourteen Word Press
>>> >>>>http://www.14words.com
>>
>>> >>>>National Alliance
>>> >>>>http://www.natvan.com
>>
>>> >>>>Stormfront
>>> >>>>http://www.stormfront.org
>>
>>> >>>>Yggdrasil's White Nationalist Library
>>> >>>>http://www.ddc.net/ygg
>>
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>> I like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, PAMYAT, HAMAS or Aryan Nations,etc.
>>
>> CALL late nights best, or even VISIT me:
>> Donald Ray Ellis
>> aka Pat Blakely/RevWhite/Mike Kalvatis/Rob Stewart ET AL
>> 108 E. Victory Street
>> Star City, Arkansas 71667
>> Tel: (870) 628-1437
>> Email: voiceofreason@blakely.harrogate.net
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
>> then visit  www.freedomsite.org
>>
>> Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!
>>
>> "At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
>> is a revolutionary act."
>> (George Orwell)
>>
>> David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'
>>
>> "All truth passes through three stages.
>> First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
>> and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
>> (Arthur Schopenhauer)
>>
>> "The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
>> but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
>> falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
>> they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
>> against them -- except force." -- John Bryant
>>
>> "To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
>> acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
>> and impossible to ignore."
>> --John Bryant
>>
>>
>> Posted by:
>> Patrick Lee Humphrey
>> 7500 Bellerive #1807
>> Houston, Texas 77036-3040
>> 1-713-266-7764
>>
>> Steven Horn (KCOM)
>> 1836 NW 11th St
>> Oklahoma City, OK 73106
>> (405) 524-0576
>>
>> together with
>>
>> Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive &
>> Henry who like
>> late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
>> Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
>> I am together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
>> We like young children, so that we can train them our way.
>>
>> CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
>> Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even
>> VISIT me at:
>> 55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132
>>
>>
>> Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
>> office: VISIT at:
>> #5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
>> Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
>> or call: 1-250-616-9431
>>
>> As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is
>> called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material
>> should give an indication as to the why.
>>
>> "I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
>> proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
>> yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
>> seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
>> my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
>> moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
>> http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
>> also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]
>>
>> Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like
>> a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
>> even if he or she were not naked"?
>> http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg
>>
>> For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
>> background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David Michael's
>> detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and is
>> known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a grosvenor!!
>> It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases, just
>> to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.
>>
>> Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
>> NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
>> Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: FlaviaR@verizon.net, especially late 
>> nights.
>>
>> Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
>> Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
>> I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or
>> send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
>> work:(780)492-0473
>>
>> And also: George Firestone: "George" 
>>
>> Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
>> Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!
>>
>> For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
>> JEW-WATCH:
>> http://www.jewwatch.com
>>
>> Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
>> NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
>> people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!
>>
>> Or, other useful websites include:
>> ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
>> IHR - www.ihr.org
>> OSTARA - www.ostara.org
>> PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
>> Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
>> AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
>> THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press,
>>    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
>>    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com
>>
>> Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
>> They have lots of information, as well as books and records.
>>
>> They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
>> and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.
>>
>> As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a
>> victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
>> of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
>> May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.
>>
>> In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
>> for many years around the world.
>>
>> Reply-To: "George" 
>>
>> _________________________________________
>> Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
>> More than 140,000 groups
>> Unlimited download
>> http://www.usenetzone.com to open account 
>



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Subject: Re: jews rush to extort money from Hungary - Never Forget KASTNER ZIONAZI KOLLABORATEUR!!
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Were these the Hungarian Jews who were saved by the Zionazi ZYD
KOLLABORATOR KASTNER?


On Fri, 7 Jul 2006 22:25:47 +0200, "Heinrich" 
wrote:

>Hundreds of Holocaust survivors flocked to Los Angeles' Jewish social 
>service agencies to get help as they rush to apply for a restitution program 
>offered by the Hungarian government.

>The paperwork must be postmarked and on its way to Budapest by July 31.

>The large turnout overwhelmed the legal service group Bet Tzedek, whose 
>officials hastily scheduled extra sessions to help with the complicated 
>paperwork. Officials there said they expected about 50 or so of the 
>approximately 10,000 Holocaust survivors in Los Angeles to sign up for the 
>sessions. Instead, five times as many have sought help.

>lol

>http://www.dailybreeze.com/news/regstate/articles/3284451.html

Subject: KASTNER Case=ZYD ACCOMPLICE WITH NAZIS [88]

Now there are at least another 50 documented cases like KASTNER, and
RUMKOWSKI!!
The ZHIDS COLLABORATED WITH NAZIS!!

Even the notorious Simon WIESENTHAL is proven to have been a nazi 
GESTAPO COLLABORATOR!!


On 24 Oct 2004 17:22:19 -0000, DerStuermer  wrote:

>Mamzer Kenneth McVay,SOBC, the well-known fag and mamser in Canada,
>Fag McVay of Vancouver, convicted of child molesting
>and car theft in California and Oregon, and still
>unemployed  gas pump boy, mastermind of the
>Canadian branch of NAMBLA, and now finally dying as a
>diseased AIDS-spreader,wants all to know about all
>his fellow ZHID criminals and perverts.
>Here is the latest.......
>
>From: Elias Davidsson (edavid@itn.is)
>Subject: Zionism. The Kastner case (1/2)
>Newsgroups: soc.culture.israel
>Date: 1997/07/12
>
>The Kastner Case
>-----------------
>
>Introduction
>
>Rather than answer every complaint in the same detail, we are taking
>up the issue which the VJBD has declared to be the most offensive of all
>and will show that on this question 'The documentation available is
>overwhelming and its message is thundering", just as Palestine Speaks
>claimed in one of the extracts complained about by the VJBD.
>
>Since the accusation of direct Zionist cooperation and assistance in
>the extermination of hundreds of thousands of Jewish people, and the
>accusation that this flowed logically from shared aims, are clearly the
>most 'extreme' and 'offensive' accusations of Nazi-Zionist collaboration
>broadcast on 3CR programs, we will deal with this first, and in greater detail.
>
>Since the 'Kastner case' is the subject of most of the broadcasts
>concerning collaboration which have been specifically complained
>about, we shall go into this in greatest detail, and have put some books
>in as evidence about it. Having answered the VJBD where its case appears
>strongest, and on the points to which it has given greatest emphasis,we
>hope it may become apparent to the Tribunal that things are not quite
>what they may have appeared before this inquiry began.
>
>The most notorious case of Nazi-Zionist collaboration is that
>involving Rudolf Kastner.
>
>Most Jewish people in Australia have never heard of Rudolf Kastner.
>Those who have, are generally under the impression that there is some
>'controversy' about negotiations he undertook for 'the purchase of
>Jewish lives for money and military equipment', but that he was 'fully
>rehabilitated' by the Supreme Court of Israel.
>
>That is exactly the line taken by Dr. John Foster, the Victorian
>Jewish Board of Deputies expert witness, in his evidence condemning
>3CR for anti-semitism.
>
>It is quite clear from this evidence, that Dr. Foster does not know
>anything at all about the Kastner case, since he does not even know
>what Kastner was accused of.
>
>This may not be his fault however, since one cannot read an accurate
>account of the Kastner case in any of the widely available works dealing
>with the Holocaust, either in bookshops or libraries. Apart from 3CR, the
>suppression of information has been so complete, that even an expert
>like Dr. Foster, specifically asked to give evidence on the matter, has
>been unable to find out what it is all about.
>
>The Accusations
>----------------
>Briefly, the accusations against Kastner are as follows:
>
>"Dr. Rudolf Verba, a Doctor of Science now serving at the British
>Medical Research Council, was one of the few escapees from Auschwitz.
>In his memoirs published in February, 1961, in the London Daily Herald,
>he wrote:
>
>'I am a Jew. In spite of that - indeed because of that - I accuse
>certain Jewish leaders of one of the most ghastly deeds of the war.
>
>This small group of quislings knew what was happening to their
>brethren in Hitler's gas chambers and bought their their own lives with
>the price of silence. Among them was Dr. Kastner, leader of the council
>which spoke for all Jews in Hungary. While I was prisoner number 44070 at
>Auschwitz - the number is still on my arm - I compiled careful statistics
>of the exterminations...I took these terrible statistics with me when I
>escaped in 1944 and I was able to give Hungarian Zionist leaders three weeks
>notice that Eichmann planned to send a million of their Jews to his gas
>chambers...Kastner went to Eichmann and told him, 'I know of your
>plans; spare some Jews of my choice and I shall keep quiet.'
>
>Eichmann not only agreed, but dressed Kastner up in S.S. uniform and
>took him to Belsen to trace some of his friends. Nor did the sordid
>bargaining end there.
>
>Kastner paid Eichmann several thousand dollars. With this little
>fortune, Eichmann was able to buy his way to freedom when Germany collapsed,
>to set himself up in the Argentine..."(Ben Hecht, op.cit. pp261-2)
>
>These accusations are confirmed by the 'Eichmann Confessions'
>published in Life magazine, 28 November and 5 December 1960:
>
>"I resolved to show how well a job could be done when the commander
>stands 100% behind it. By shipping the Jews off in a lightning operation,
>I wanted to set an example for future campaigns elsewhere...In obedience to
>Himmler's directive I now concentrated on negotiations with the Jewish
>political officials in Budapest...Among them Dr. Rudolph Kastner,
>authorized representative of the Zionist Movement. This Dr. Kastner
>was a young man about my age, an ice-cold lawyer and a fanatical Zionist.
>He agreed to help keep the Jews from resisting deportation - and even
>keep order in the collection camps - if I could close my eyes and let a
>few hundred or a few thousand young Jews emigrate illegally to Palestine.
>It was a good bargain. For keeping order in the camps, the price...was
>not too high for me.
>
>.We trusted each other perfectly. When he was with me, Kastner smoke
>cigarets as though he was in a coffeehouse. While we talked he would
>smoke one aromatic cigaret after another, taking them from a silver case
>and lighting them with a silver lighter. With his great polish and reserve
>he would have made an ideal Gestapo officer himself.
>
>Dr. Kastner's main concern was to make it possible for a select group
>of Hungarian Jews to emigrate to Israel...
>
>As a matter of fact, there was a very strong similarity between our
>attitudes in the S.S. and the viewpoint of these immensely idealistic
>Zionist leaders....I believe that Kastner would have sacrificed a
>thousand or a hundred thousand of his blood to achieve his political
>goal...'You can have the others', he would say, 'but let me have this
>group here'. And because Kastner rendered us a great service by helping
>keep the deportation camps peaceful, I would let his groups escape.
>After all, I was not concerned with small groups of a thousand or so Jews...
>That was the 'gentleman's agreement' I had with Kastner" (Hecht, ibid, p.26ö-61)
>
>Quite clearly these accusations, whether true or false, do not relate
>merely to 'the purchase of Jewish lives for money and military
>equipment', as Dr. Foster imagines, and the term 'collaboration' is the term
>that would apply. It seems unlikely that if Dr. Foster had known what the
>accusation actually was, he would have condemned 3CR saying 'In these
>circumstances, to talk of collaboration is malicious and absurd'.
>
>Are the accusations against Kastner true?
>
>According to the Government of Israel, they are a lie. When Malchiel
>Greenwald, a strongly pro-Zionist Israeli citizen published these
>accusations against Kastner, the Israeli Government did rather more
>than demand that his views should not be broadcast. Because a prominent
>Zionist official (Dr. Kastner was a spokesman for the Ministry of Trade and
>Industry) was involved, the Attorney General of the State of Israel
>prosecuted Greenwald for criminal libel.
>
>The Verdict
>------------
>Let the verdict of Judge Benjamin Halevi in Israel's District Court of
>Jerusalem speak for itself, given in criminal case No. 124 of 1953.
>The Attorney General v. Malchiel Greenwald. This material should be
>studied carefully, since a substantial extract from it, broadcast on 3CR,
>has been complained about by the VJBD as allegedly offensive to the Jewish
>community, likely to promote anti-semitism, likely to promote racism,
>in bad taste and contrary to common sense.
>
>It is the actual words used that are the subject of the Board's
>complaint, not the manner of their representation by 3CR. Presumably
>the Board itself was not aware just whose words they were when it made
>its' complaint, which shows how complete suppression of information can
>backfire on the censors themselves.
>
>Here then are excerpts from the verdict of Judge Halevi, who later
>became one of the panel of three judges that tried Eichmann:
>
>"The masses of Jews from Hungary's ghettos obediently boarded the
>deportation trains without knowing their fate. They were full of
>confidence in the false information that they were being transferred to
>Kenyermeze.
>
>The Nazis could not have misled the masses of Jews so conclusively had
>they not spread their false information through Jewish channels.
>
>The Jews of the ghettos would not have trusted the Nazi or Hungarian
>rulers. But they had trust in their Jewish leaders. Eichmann and
>others used this known fact as part of their calculated plan to mislead
>the Jews.
>They were able to deport the Jews to their extermination by the help
>of Jewish leaders.
>
>The false information was spread by the Jewish leaders. The local
>leaders of the Jews of Kluj and Nodvarod knew that other leaders were
>spreading such false information and did not protest.
>
>Those of the Jews who tried to warn their friends of the truth were
>persecuted by the Jewish leaders in charge of the local 'rescue work'.
>
>The trust of the Jews in the misleading information and their lack of
>knowledge that their wives, children and themselves were about to be
>deported to the gas chambers of Auschwitz led the victims to remain
>quiescent in their ghettos. It seduced them into not resisting or
>hampering the deportation orders.
>
>Dozens of thousands of Jews were guarded in their ghettos by a few
>dozen police. Yet even vigorous young Jews made no attemptt to overpower
>these few guards and escape to nearby Rumania. No resistance activities to
>the deportations were organized in these ghettos.
>
>And the Jewish leaders did everything in their power to soothe the
>Jews in the ghettos and to prevent such resistance activities.
>
>The same Jews who spread in Kluj and Nodvarod the false rumor of
>Kenyermeze, or confirmed it, the same public leaders who did not warn
>their own people against the misleading statements, the same Jewish leaders
>who did not organize any resistance or any sabotage of
>deportations...these same leaders did not join the people of their community
>in their ride to Auschwitz, but were all included in the Rescue train.
>
>The Nazi organizers of extermination and the perpetrators of
>extermination permitted Rudolf Kastner and the members of the Jewish Council
>in Budapest to save themselves, their relatives, and friends. The Nazis did
>this as a means of making the local Jewish leaders, whom they favoured,
>dependent on the Nazi regime, dependent on its good will during the time of
>its fatal deportation schedule. In short, the Nazis succeeded in bringing the
>Jewish leaders into oollaboration with the Nazis at the time of the
>catastrophe.
>
>The Nazi chiefs knew that the Zionists were a most vital element in
>Jewry and the most trusted by the Jews.
>
>The Nazis drew a lesson from the Warsaw ghetto and other belligerent
>ghettos. They learned that Jews were able to sell their lives very
>expensively if honorably guided.
>
>Eichmann did not want a second Warsaw. For this reason, the Nazis
>exerted themselves to mislead and bribe the Jewish leaders.
>
>The personality of Rudolph Kastner made him a convenient catspaw for
>Eichmann and his clique, to draw into collaboration and make their
>task easier.
>
>The question here is not, as stated by the Attorney General in his
>summation, whether members of the Jewish Rescue Committee were or were
>not capable of fulfilling their duty without the patronage of the S.S.
>chiefs.
>It is obvious that without such S.S. Nazi patronage the Jewish Rescue
>Committee could not have existed, and could have acted only as an
>underground.
>
>The question is, as put by the lawyer for the defense, why were the
>Nazis interested in the existence of the Rescue Committee? Why did
>the S.S. chiefs make every effort to encourage the existence of the
>Jewish Rescue Committee? Did the exterminators turn into rescuers?
>
>The same question rises concerning the rescue of prominent Jews by
>these German killers of Jews. Was the rescue of such Jews a part of
>the extermination plan of the killers ?
>
>The support given by the extermination leaders to Kastner's Rescue
>Committee proves that indeed there was a place for Kastner and his
>friends in their Final Solution for the Jews of Hungary - their total
>annihilation.
>
>The Nazi's patronage of Kastner, and their agreement to let him save
>six hundred prominent Jews, were part of the plan to exterminate the Jews.
>Kastner was given a chance to add a few more to that number. The bait
>attracted him. The opportunity of rescuing prominent people appealed
>to him greatly. He considered the rescue of the most important Jews as a
>great personal success and a success for Zionism. It was a success that
>would also justify his conduct - his political negotiation with Nazis and
>the Nazi patronage of his committee.
>
>When Kastner received this present from the Nazis, Kastner sold his
>soul to the German Satan. The sacrifice of the vital interests of the majority
>of the Jews, in order to rescue the prominents, was the basic element in the
>agreement between Kastner and the Nazis. This agreement fixed the division of
>the nation into two unequal camps: a small fragment of prominents, whom the
>Nazis promised Kastner to save, on the one hand, and the great majority of
>Hungarian Jews whom the Nazis designated for death, on the other hand.
>An imperative condition for the rescue of the first camp by the Nazis was that
>Kastner will not interfere in the action of the Nazis against the other camp
>and will not hamper them in its extermination. Kastner fulfilled this
>condition. He concentrated his efforts in the rescue of the prominents
>and treated the camp of the doomed as if they had already been wiped out
>from the book of the living.
>
>One cannot estimate the damage caused by Kastner's collaboration and
>put down the number of victims which it cost Hungarian Jews. These are not
>only the thousands of Jews in Nodvarod or any other community in the border
>area, Jews who could escape through the border, had the chief of their
>rescue committee fulfilled his duty toward them.
>
>All of Kastner's answers in his final testimony were a constant effort
>to evade this truth.
>
>Kastner has tried to escape through every crack he could find in the
>wall of evidence. When one crack was sealed in his face, he drated quickly
>to another."
>
>(Judgement of Judge Benjamin Halevi, Criminal Case 124/53; Attorney
>General
>v. Malchiel Greenwald, District Court, Jerusalem, June 22, 1955).
>
>Judge Halevi reverts to the meeting of Kastner with the S.S. officers
>Becher and Rudolf Hoess, commandant of Auschwitz at the time when the
>'new line' of rescuing Jews was revealed by Hoess. He says:
>
>"From this gathering in Budapest, it is obvious that the 'new line'
>stretched from Himmler to Hoess, from Jutner to Becher and Krumey.
>
>According to Kastner, however, these Nazis were all active in rescuing
>Jews.
>
>This meeting of these important German guests in Budapest exposes the
>'rescue' work of Becher in its true light. It reveals also the extent
>of Kastner's involvement in the inner circle of the chief German war
>criminals.
>
>Just as the Nazi war criminals knew they needed an alibi and hoped to
>achieve it by the rescue of a few Jews at the eleventh hour, so
>Kastner also needed an alibi for himself.
>
>Collaboration between the Jewish Agency Rescue Committee and the
>Exterminators of the Jews was solidifed in Budapest and Vienna.
>Kastner's duties were part and parcel of the genral duties of the S.S.
>
>In addition to its Extermination Department and Looting Department,
>the Nazi S.S. opened a Rescue Department headed by Kastner.
>
>All these extermination, robbery and rescue activities of the S.S.
>were coordinated under the management of Heinrich Himmler". (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi continues:
>
>"Kastner perjured himself knowingly in his testimony before this court
>when he denied he had interceded in Becher's hehalf. Moreover, he concealed
>the important fact that he interceded for Becher in the name of the Jewish
>Agency and the Jewish World Congress.
>
>As to the contents of Kastner's affidavit, it was enough for the
>defense to prove Becher was a war criminal. It was up to the prosecution to
>remove Becher from this status, if they wished to negate the affidavit.
>
>The Attorney General admitted in his summation that Becher was a war
>criminal.
>
>The lies in the contents of Kastner's affidavit, the lies in his
>testimony concerning the document, and Kastner's knowing participation in the
>activities of Nazi war criminals, and his participation in the last
>minute fake rescue activities - all these combine to show one overwhelming
>truth - that this affidavit was not given in good faith.
>
>Kastner knew well, as he himself testified, that Becher had never
>stood up against the stream of Jewish extermination, as Kastner has
>declared in the affidavit.
>
>The aims of Becher and his superior, Himmler, were not to save Jews
>but to serve the Nazi regime with full compliance. These is not truth
>and no good faith in Kastner's testimony, 'I never doubted for one moment
>the good intention of good Becher'.
>
>It is clear that the positive recommandation by Kastner, not only in
>his own name but also in the name of the Jewish Agency and the Jewish
>World Congress was of decisive importance for Becher. Kastner did not
>exaggerate when he said that Becher was released by the Allies because
>of his personal intervention. The lies in the affidavit of Kastner and the
>contradictions and various pretexts, which were proven to be lies, were
>sufficient to annul the value of his statements and to prove that there
>was no good faith in his testimony in favor of this German war criminal.
>Kastner's affidavit in favor of Becher was a willfully false affidavit
>given in favor of a war criminal to save him from trial and punishment
>in Nuremberg.
>
>Therefore, the defendant, Malchiel Greenwald, was correct in his
>accusations against Rudolf Kastner in the first, second and fourth of
>his statements." (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi's verdict found Malchiel Greenwald generally innocent of
>libel against Kastner, but fined him one Israeli pound for the one unproven
>accusation - that Kastner had actually collected money from his Nazi
>partners for his aide to their slaughter program. The judge also
>ordered the Government of Israel to pay Greenwald two hundred Israeli
>pounds as court costs.
>
>In fairness to Kastner it should me mentioned that as well as having
>been unpaid, it was never established that he ever wore S.S. uniform.
>
>Nevertheless, this verdict, and the evidence on which it was based,
>completely establishes the truth of everything said on 3CR about the
>matter.
>
>If the story ended there, it would only prove conclusively that the
>individual Kastner was a collaborator and the Israeli Government had
>attempted to defend him, although facts brought out in the trial
>pointed to much more than that.
>
>But the story does not end there.
>
>The Reaction
>-------------
>Public opinion in Israel was almost unanimous in demanding that
>Kastner and his associates should be put on trial. Remember that up to
>now it was Kastner's accuser who was on trial.
>
>The Communist Party newspaper Kol Ha'am (Voice of the People) wrote:
>
>"All those whose relatives were butchered by the Germans in Hungary
>know now clearly that Jewish hands helped the mass murder" (23 June 1955)
>
>In the authoritative Israeli newspaper Ha'aretz, the leading political
>journalist, Dr. Moshe Keren wrote:
>
>"Kastner must be brought to trial as a Nazi collaborator. And at this
>trial, Kastner should defend himself as a private citizen, and not be
>defended by the Israeli Government..." (14 July 1955).
>
>*Haboker*, the pro-Government General Zionist party paper stated:
>
>"The public wants to know the real facts about Kastner, and not about
>him alone. The only way to find out the truth is to put all the Rescue
>Committee people on trial and give them a chance to offer their
>defense." (23 June 1955)
>
>But public opinion was not quite unanimous. The problem with bringing
>Kastner and his associates to trial was that his associates were the
>Government of Israel.
>
>As the evening paper *Yedi'ot Aharonot* said:
>
>"If Kastner is brought to trial the entire government faces a total
>political and national collapse - as a result of what such a trial may
> disclose." (23 June 1955)
>
>Accordingly, the Government of Israel did not put Kastner on trial,
>instead it filed an appeal against the acquittal of Greenwald for criminal
>libel.
>
>As Dr. Karlebach wrote in Israel's largest evening newspaper,
>*Ma'ariv*:
>
>"What is going on here? The Attorney General has to mobilize all the
>government power, appear himself in court, to justify and defend
>collaboration with Himmler! And in order to defend a quisling, the
>government must drag through the streets one of the grimmest stories
>of our history!
>
>At 11 P.M. the verdict was given. At 11 A.M. next morning the
>government announces the defense of Kastner will be renewed - an appeal filed.
>What exemplary expediency! Since when does this government possess such
>lawyer-genius who can weigh in one night the legal chances of an
>appeal on a detailed, complex verdict of three hundred pages?! (24 June 1955)
>
>At the appeal hearings before the Supreme Court, the Attorney General
>of Israel, Chaim Cohen, explained clearly why the Government of Israel
>was defending Kastner so strongly:  "The man Kastner does not stand here
>as a private individual. He was a recognized representative, official or
>non-official of the Jewish National Institutes in Palestine and of the
>Zionist Executive; and I come here in this court to defend the
>representative of our national institutions." (Hecht, p. 268)
>
>The truth of this statement cannot be denied. Kastner's collaboration
>was not that of an individual. It was the collaboration of the Zionist
>leadership.
>
>So far, it has only been established that the Government of Israel
>continued to support a Nazi collaborator after the facts about his
>collaboration had been conclusively established in an Israeli court.
>But the story gets worse.
>
>The Supreme Court of Israel unanimously found that Becher was indeed a
>Nazi war criminal and that Kastner had without justification, and in the
>name of the Jewish Agency, helped Becher to escape justice. On this point
>Greenwald was acquitted of libel and Kastner was not 'fully rehabilitated'.
>
>The Supreme Court also accepted the FACTS established in the lower
>court - that Kastner DELIBERATELY concealed the truth about Auschwitz from the
>majority of Hungarian Jews in exchange for Nazi permission to take a
>thousand or so to Palestine. Again, Kastner was far from being 'fully
>rehabilitated'.
>
>The Majority Judgement
>-------------------------
>But now comes the really nasty bit. After unanimously acknowledging
>these FACTS, the Supreme Court of Israel, by a majority of three to two,
>found that Kastner's actions were MORALLY JUSTIFIABLE and convicted
>Greenwald of criminal libel for calling this 'collaboration'.
>
>In saying that 3CR broadcasts concealed the fact that Kastner had been
>fully rehabilitated by the Israeli Supreme Court, Dr. Foster is
>totally missing the point.
>
>Kastner's actions only proved that HE was a Nazi collaborator. It is
>the defense of these actions by the Government and Courts of Israel that
>prove conclusively that ZIONISM approves of Nazi collaboration.
>
>The majority of the Supreme Court of Israel did not REHABILITATE
>Kastner.
>They JOINED him.
>
>Let us read from the majority judgement of Supreme Court Judge Shlomo
>Chesin:
>
>"...What point was there in telling the people boarding the trains in
>Kluj, people struck by fate and persecuted, as to what awaits them at the
>end of their journey...Kastner spoke in detail of the situation, saying,
>'The Hungarian Jew was a branch which long ago dried up on the tree'. This
>vivid description coincides with the testimony of another witness about the
>Hungarian Jews, 'This was a big Jewish community in Hungary, without any
>ideological Jewish backbone' (Moshe Shweiger, a Kastner aide in Budapest,
>protocol 465).
>
>I fully agree with my friend, Judge Agranot, when he states that, 'The
>Jews of Hungary, including those in the countryside, were not capable,
>neither physically nor mentally, to carry out resistance operations with force
>against the deportation scheme'...From this point of view no rescue
>achievement could have resulted by disclosing the Auschwitz news to
>the Jewish leaders there, and this...is a consideration which on can
>properly conclude that Kastner had in front of his eyes.
>
>.And I take one more step. I am certain that the silence of Kastner
>when he arrived in Kluj was premeditated and calculated and did not result
>from his great dispair because of the helplessness of the Jewish community.
>Even then, I say, this is still not considered willful collaboration and
>assistance in the extermination, because all the signs indicate that
>Kastner's efforts were aimed at rescue and rescue on a big scale...And
>towards the end I take one last step. In doing so I go very far and
>say that even if Kastner ordered himself to keep silent knowingly, in
>submission to the strong will of the Nazis, in order to save a few
>Jews from Hell - this is still no proof that he stained his hands by
>collaborating with the enemies of his people and carrying out their
>plan to exterminate most of the Jewish community in Hungary.
>
>Even if, through these activities of his - or rather, his omission -
>the extermination became easier. And as to the moral issue, the question
>is not whether a man is allowed to kill many in order to save a few, or
>vice-versa. The question is altogether in another sphere and should be
>defined as follows: A man is aware that a whole community is awaiting
>its doom. He is allowed to make efforts to save a few, although part of
>his efforts involve concealment of truth from the many or should he
>disclose the truth to many though it is his best opinion that this way
>everybody will perish. I think that the answer is clear. What good will the
>blood of the few bring if everybody is to perish?...As I said, I am not arguing
>with the basic factual findings of the learned President of the Jewish
>District Court (Judge Halevi) but it seems to me, with all due respect, that
>his findings do not, as of necessity, demand the conclusion he has arrived
>at.
>That is to say, collaboration on the part of Kastner in the extermination
>of the Jews. And that they better coincide with bad leadership both
>from a moral and public point of view...
>
>In my opinion, one can say outright that if you find out that Kastner
>collaborated with the enemy because he did not disclose to the people
>who boarded the trains in Kluj that they were being led to extermination,
>one has to put on trial today Danzig, Herman, Hanzi, Brand, Revis and
>Marton, and many more leaders and half-leaders who gagged themselves in an
>hour of crisis and did not inform others of what was known to them and did not
>warn and did not cry out of the coming danger....
>
>Because of all this I cannot confirm the conclusion of the District Court
>with regard to the accusation that Greenwald has thrown on Kastner of
>collaboration with the Nazis in exterminating the Jewish people in
>Hungary during the last war." (Hecht, ibid, pp.270-2)
>
>In other words, the Court approved of Kastner's contempt for the
>Hungarian Jews and could not allow him to be condemned for doing exactly what
>many other Zionist leaders had half-leaders did - concealing their
>knowledge of the Nazi extermination plans so that Jews would board the trains to
>Auschwitz peacefully while their Zionist 'leaders' boarded a different
>train for Palestine.
>
>The Minority Judgement
>--------------------------
>It cannot be said that ALL top Zionists leaders actively approved of
>Nazi collaboration in this way. Indeed the most precise answer to this
>sickening judgement of Judge Chesin is provided in the minority judgement of
>Supreme Court Judge Moshe Silberg:
>
>"I do not say that he was the only man who possessed information among
>the leaders. It is quite possible that somebody else as well does not have
>a clear conscience with regards to this concealment. But we are dealing
>here with the guilt of Kastner and we do not have to make judgements on the
>guilt of others....
>
>The declaration of the learned Attorney General therefore shrinks into
>an opinion....'Kastner was convinced and believed that there was no ray
>of hope for the Jews of Hungary, almost for none of them, and as he, as a
>result of his personal dispair, did not disclose the secret of the
>extermination in order not to endanger or frustrate the rescue of the
>few - therefore he acted in good faith and should not be accused of
>collaborating with the Nazis in expediting the extermination of the Jews,
>even though, in fact, he brought about its result.'
>
>I am compelled to state that it is very difficult for me to conceive
>such an intention. Is this good faith? Can a single man, even in
>cooperation with some of his friends, yield to despair on behalf and
>without the knowledge of 800,000 other people? This is, in my opinion, the
>decisive consideration in the problem facing us. The charge emanating from
>the testimony of the witnesses against Kastner is that had they known of
>the Auschwitz secret, then thousands or tens of thousands would have been
>able to save their lives by local, partial, specific or indirect rescue
>operations like local revolts, resistance, escapes, hidings,
>concealment of children with Gentiles, forging of documents, ransom money,
>bribery, etc - and when this is the case and when one deals with many hundreds
>of thousands, how does a human being, a mortal, reject with complete
>certainty and with an extreme 'no' the efficiency of all the many and varied
>rescue ways? How can he examine the tens of thousands of possibilities? Does
>he decide instead of God? Indeed, he who can act with such a usurpation
>of the last hope of hundreds of thousands is not entitled to claim good faith
>as his defense. The penetrating question quo warrento is a good answer to
>a claim of such good faith...
>
>If the superintendent of a big hospital lets thousands of sick people
>die so that he may devote himself to the sure rescue of one soul, he will
>come out guilty, at least morally, even if it is proven that he as an
>individual erroneously thought that there was no hope of saving the other
>patients. He is a collaborator with the angel of death.
>
>Either a complete atrophy of the soul or a blind involvement with
>complete loss of senses and proportion in his small but personal rescue
>operation could bring a man to such a gigantic, hazardous play.
>
>And if all this is not enough to annul the claim of good faith which
>was put before us on behalf of Kastner by the Attorney General, then
>Kastner himself comes and annuls it altogether. Not only did he never make
>this claim, but his own words prove the contrary. He writes in his report
>to the Jewish Agency that the Committee sent emissaries to many ghettos in
>the countryside and pleaded with them to organize escapes and to refuse to
>board the trains. And though the story of these pleadings is untrue,
>and the silence of Kastner in Kluj is proven, the very uttering of these
>statements entirely contradicts the claim that Kastner had concealed
>the news about the fate of the ghetto inmates in good faith and only as a
>result of his complete despairing of the chances of escaping or
>resisting the Germans. You can not claim at the same time helplessness and
>activity.
>Anyway, such a claim is not convincing...
>
>We can sum up with three facts:
>A. That the Nazis didn't want to have a great revolt - 'Second Warsaw'
>- nor small revolts, and their passion was to have the extermination
>machine working smoothly without resistance. This fact was known to Kastner
>from the best source - from Eichmann himself - And he had additional proofs
>of that when he witnessed all the illusionary and misleading tactics
>which were being taken by the Nazis from the first moment of occupation.
>B. That the most efficient means to paralyze the resistance with - or
>the escape of a victim is to conceal from him the plot of the coming
>murder.
>This fact is known to every man and one does not need any proof of
>evidence for this.
>C. That he, Kastner, in order to carry out the rescue plan for the few
>prominents, fulfilled knowingly and without good faith the said desire
>of the Nazis, thus expediting the work of exterminating the masses.
>
>And also the rescue of Becher by Kastner...He who is capable of
>rescuing this Becher from hanging proves that the atrocities of this great
>war criminal were not so horryfying or despicable in his eyes...I couldn't
>base the main guilt of Kastner on this fact had it been alone, but when it
>is attached even from afar to the whole scene of events it throws
>retroactive light on the whole affair and serves as a dozen proofs of our
>conclusion." (Supreme Court Judge, Moshe Silberg, 1957)
>
>Conclusion
>-----------
>If that had been the majority judgement, one could say that whatever
>their attitudes to the Arabs, and whatever their past behaviour might have
>been under pressure, the Zionist leadership today did not advocate
>collaboration with the Nazis.
>
>One could then at least understand the complaints by Mr. Bloch,
>President of the Victorian Jewish Board of Deputies, about the 'dragging in
>of alleged episodes in the history of Jewish/Nazi relationships'.
>
>But Judge Silberg's judgement was that of a minority.
>
>The Kastner case is therefore not an alleged episode in past history,
>being 'dragged in' to discredit an opponent.
>
>It is a continuing controversy in which the top Zionist leadership of
>Israel stand indicted of continuing to publicly defend collaboration
>with the Nazis in the extermination of Jews.
>
>Despite the unanimous finding of the Supreme Court of Israel that Kurt
>Becher was a major war criminal, the Jewish Agency (World Zionist
>Organization) refused to withdraw the fraudulent certificate Kastner
>gave on their behalf, which saved Becher from hanging, and allowed him to
>remain a free man in West Germany, the head of several corporations and with
>an estimated personal worth of $30 million.
>
>Becher has even used his certification as a 'good' SS officer to give
>evidence in support of his associates at other war crimes trials in
>West Germany.
>
>Since the prosecution, representing the Israeli Government agreed with
>the Supreme Court that Becher was a major war criminal, one can only
>presure that the Israeli Government did not want him put on trial for
>fear of what might come out.
>
>Likewise, none of Kastner's associates on the Zionist Relief and
>Rescue Committee or his bosses in the Jewish Agency have ever been put on
>trial as demanded by Israeli public opinion. Let alone the hundreds of
>'prominents' who helped Kastner to reassure the Hungarian Jews that they
>were going to Kenyermeze and not Auschwitz, in exchange for tickets on
>the one train that took them eventually to Palestine.
>
>As for Kastner himself, he will cause no further embarassment to the
>Zionist leadership with his undisputed claims that everything he did
>was approved by the Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) leadership
>in Palestine. He is, as Dr. Foster so delicately puts it, 'now dead'. Or
>putting it less delicately, on 3 March 1957 he was shot by Zeer
>Eckstein - immediately after the appeal hearings were concluded, and
>before the judgement 'rehabilitating' him was delivered. Eckstein was
>not a Hungarian avenger. He was a paid undercover agent of the Israeli
>secret service.
>(Hecht, ibid., p.208. Another 'fantastic allegation' no doubt; but
>admitted in court during the murder trial).
>
>Clearly this issue has a major indirect relevance to the Arab-Israeli
>dispute. Apart from countering Israel's cynical use of the holocaust
>as a propaganda weapon, it answers a very real concern that many people
>have about the State of Israel and the Jews. This concern is whether,
>if Jews had a State of their own during the holocaust many more could
>have been saved, and whether this is not an essential future consideration,
>at least as an insurance policy.
>
>The facts of the Kastner case show that the very existence of the
>Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) was an actual help to the Nazis
>and that more could have been saved if the Zionist movement had not
>existed.
>Having a State that approves of actions like those of Kastner for an
>insurance policy, is like using petro for a fire extinguisher.
>
>Zionism is not the answer to anti-semitism, but a cowardly proposal to
>run away from it. The only answer to anti-semitism is to fight back.
>
>We shall go on to prove this in detail.
>-------------------------------------------------------------------
>Elias Davidsson - Oldugata 50 - 101 Reykjavik - Iceland
>Tel. (354)-552-6444     Fax: (354)-552-6579
>Email: edavid@itn.is     URL:  http://www.nyherji.is/~edavid


If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
then visit  www.freedomsite.org

Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

"At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth 
is a revolutionary act." 
(George Orwell)

David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'

"All truth passes through three stages. 
First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, 
and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
(Arthur Schopenhauer)

"The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely, 
but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak 
falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if 
they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
against them -- except force." -- John Bryant  

"To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an 
acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer 
and impossible to ignore."
--John Bryant


Posted by: 
Patrick Lee Humphrey
7500 Bellerive #1807
Houston, Texas 77036-3040
1-713-266-7764

Steven Horn (KCOM)
1836 NW 11th St
Oklahoma City, OK 73106
(405) 524-0576

together with
Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive & 
Henry 
CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even 
VISIT me at:
55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132

We all like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
We are together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
We like young children, so that we can train them our way.


Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
office: VISIT at:
#5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
or call: 1-250-616-9431

As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is 
called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material 
should give an indication as to the why.

"I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]

Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like 
a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
even if he or she were not naked"?
http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg

For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David
Michael's
detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and
is
known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a
grosvenor!! 
It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases,
just 
to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.

Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: Flavia18@verizon.net, especially
late nights.

Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or  
send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
work:(780)492-0473

And also: George Firestone: "George" ,
and davejoll@ihug.co.nz.

Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!

For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
JEW-WATCH:
http://www.jewwatch.com

Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!

Or, other useful websites include:
ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
IHR - www.ihr.org
OSTARA - www.ostara.org
PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press, 
    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com

Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
They have lots of information, as well as books and records.

They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.

As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a 
victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.

In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
for many years around the world.

Reply-To: "George"
,
or to Art@Arthurian.com
Feel free to subscribe us to maillists for sex, homosexuals and the
like.

~~




From NotMyName@roc.usenetexchange.com Sat Dec 29 23:39:39 EST 2007
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Subject: Re: Europe Doubts Jewish Claims/ the Holohoax is dead-Remember KASTNER, Rumkowski, Wiesenthal=KOLLABORATORS with Nazis!!
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Now there are at least another 50 documented cases like KASTNER, and
RUMKOWSKI!!
The ZYDS COLLABORATED WITH NAZIS!!

Even the notorious Simon WIESENTHAL is proven to have been a nazi
GESTAPO  COLLABORATOR!!


On 24 Oct 2004 17:22:19 -0000, DerStuermer  wrote:

>Mamzer Kenneth McVay,SOBC, the well-known fag and mamser in Canada,
>Fag McVay of Vancouver, convicted of child molesting
>and car theft in California and Oregon, and still
>unemployed  gas pump boy, mastermind of the
>Canadian branch of NAMBLA, and now finally dying as a
>diseased AIDS-spreader,wants all to know about all
>his fellow ZHID criminals and perverts.
>Here is the latest.......

>From: Elias Davidsson (edavid@itn.is)
>Subject: Zionism. The Kastner case (1/2)
>Newsgroups: soc.culture.israel
>Date: 1997/07/12

>The Kastner Case
>-----------------

>Introduction

>Rather than answer every complaint in the same detail, we are taking
>up the issue which the VJBD has declared to be the most offensive of all
>and will show that on this question 'The documentation available is
>overwhelming and its message is thundering", just as Palestine Speaks
>claimed in one of the extracts complained about by the VJBD.

>Since the accusation of direct Zionist cooperation and assistance in
>the extermination of hundreds of thousands of Jewish people, and the
>accusation that this flowed logically from shared aims, are clearly the
>most 'extreme' and 'offensive' accusations of Nazi-Zionist collaboration
>broadcast on 3CR programs, we will deal with this first, and in greater detail.
>
>Since the 'Kastner case' is the subject of most of the broadcasts
>concerning collaboration which have been specifically complained
>about, we shall go into this in greatest detail, and have put some books
>in as evidence about it. Having answered the VJBD where its case appears
>strongest, and on the points to which it has given greatest emphasis,we
>hope it may become apparent to the Tribunal that things are not quite
>what they may have appeared before this inquiry began.
>
>The most notorious case of Nazi-Zionist collaboration is that
>involving Rudolf Kastner.
>
>Most Jewish people in Australia have never heard of Rudolf Kastner.
>Those who have, are generally under the impression that there is some
>'controversy' about negotiations he undertook for 'the purchase of
>Jewish lives for money and military equipment', but that he was 'fully
>rehabilitated' by the Supreme Court of Israel.
>
>That is exactly the line taken by Dr. John Foster, the Victorian
>Jewish Board of Deputies expert witness, in his evidence condemning
>3CR for anti-semitism.
>
>It is quite clear from this evidence, that Dr. Foster does not know
>anything at all about the Kastner case, since he does not even know
>what Kastner was accused of.
>
>This may not be his fault however, since one cannot read an accurate
>account of the Kastner case in any of the widely available works dealing
>with the Holocaust, either in bookshops or libraries. Apart from 3CR, the
>suppression of information has been so complete, that even an expert
>like Dr. Foster, specifically asked to give evidence on the matter, has
>been unable to find out what it is all about.
>
>The Accusations
>----------------
>Briefly, the accusations against Kastner are as follows:
>
>"Dr. Rudolf Verba, a Doctor of Science now serving at the British
>Medical Research Council, was one of the few escapees from Auschwitz.
>In his memoirs published in February, 1961, in the London Daily Herald,
>he wrote:
>
>'I am a Jew. In spite of that - indeed because of that - I accuse
>certain Jewish leaders of one of the most ghastly deeds of the war.
>
>This small group of quislings knew what was happening to their
>brethren in Hitler's gas chambers and bought their their own lives with
>the price of silence. Among them was Dr. Kastner, leader of the council
>which spoke for all Jews in Hungary. While I was prisoner number 44070 at
>Auschwitz - the number is still on my arm - I compiled careful statistics
>of the exterminations...I took these terrible statistics with me when I
>escaped in 1944 and I was able to give Hungarian Zionist leaders three weeks
>notice that Eichmann planned to send a million of their Jews to his gas
>chambers...Kastner went to Eichmann and told him, 'I know of your
>plans; spare some Jews of my choice and I shall keep quiet.'
>
>Eichmann not only agreed, but dressed Kastner up in S.S. uniform and
>took him to Belsen to trace some of his friends. Nor did the sordid
>bargaining end there.
>
>Kastner paid Eichmann several thousand dollars. With this little
>fortune, Eichmann was able to buy his way to freedom when Germany collapsed,
>to set himself up in the Argentine..."(Ben Hecht, op.cit. pp261-2)
>
>These accusations are confirmed by the 'Eichmann Confessions'
>published in Life magazine, 28 November and 5 December 1960:
>
>"I resolved to show how well a job could be done when the commander
>stands 100% behind it. By shipping the Jews off in a lightning operation,
>I wanted to set an example for future campaigns elsewhere...In obedience to
>Himmler's directive I now concentrated on negotiations with the Jewish
>political officials in Budapest...Among them Dr. Rudolph Kastner,
>authorized representative of the Zionist Movement. This Dr. Kastner
>was a young man about my age, an ice-cold lawyer and a fanatical Zionist.
>He agreed to help keep the Jews from resisting deportation - and even
>keep order in the collection camps - if I could close my eyes and let a
>few hundred or a few thousand young Jews emigrate illegally to Palestine.
>It was a good bargain. For keeping order in the camps, the price...was
>not too high for me.
>
>.We trusted each other perfectly. When he was with me, Kastner smoke
>cigarets as though he was in a coffeehouse. While we talked he would
>smoke one aromatic cigaret after another, taking them from a silver case
>and lighting them with a silver lighter. With his great polish and reserve
>he would have made an ideal Gestapo officer himself.
>
>Dr. Kastner's main concern was to make it possible for a select group
>of Hungarian Jews to emigrate to Israel...
>
>As a matter of fact, there was a very strong similarity between our
>attitudes in the S.S. and the viewpoint of these immensely idealistic
>Zionist leaders....I believe that Kastner would have sacrificed a
>thousand or a hundred thousand of his blood to achieve his political
>goal...'You can have the others', he would say, 'but let me have this
>group here'. And because Kastner rendered us a great service by helping
>keep the deportation camps peaceful, I would let his groups escape.
>After all, I was not concerned with small groups of a thousand or so Jews...
>That was the 'gentleman's agreement' I had with Kastner" (Hecht, ibid, p.26ö-61)
>
>Quite clearly these accusations, whether true or false, do not relate
>merely to 'the purchase of Jewish lives for money and military
>equipment', as Dr. Foster imagines, and the term 'collaboration' is the term
>that would apply. It seems unlikely that if Dr. Foster had known what the
>accusation actually was, he would have condemned 3CR saying 'In these
>circumstances, to talk of collaboration is malicious and absurd'.
>
>Are the accusations against Kastner true?
>
>According to the Government of Israel, they are a lie. When Malchiel
>Greenwald, a strongly pro-Zionist Israeli citizen published these
>accusations against Kastner, the Israeli Government did rather more
>than demand that his views should not be broadcast. Because a prominent
>Zionist official (Dr. Kastner was a spokesman for the Ministry of Trade and
>Industry) was involved, the Attorney General of the State of Israel
>prosecuted Greenwald for criminal libel.
>
>The Verdict
>------------
>Let the verdict of Judge Benjamin Halevi in Israel's District Court of
>Jerusalem speak for itself, given in criminal case No. 124 of 1953.
>The Attorney General v. Malchiel Greenwald. This material should be
>studied carefully, since a substantial extract from it, broadcast on 3CR,
>has been complained about by the VJBD as allegedly offensive to the Jewish
>community, likely to promote anti-semitism, likely to promote racism,
>in bad taste and contrary to common sense.
>
>It is the actual words used that are the subject of the Board's
>complaint, not the manner of their representation by 3CR. Presumably
>the Board itself was not aware just whose words they were when it made
>its' complaint, which shows how complete suppression of information can
>backfire on the censors themselves.
>
>Here then are excerpts from the verdict of Judge Halevi, who later
>became one of the panel of three judges that tried Eichmann:
>
>"The masses of Jews from Hungary's ghettos obediently boarded the
>deportation trains without knowing their fate. They were full of
>confidence in the false information that they were being transferred to
>Kenyermeze.
>
>The Nazis could not have misled the masses of Jews so conclusively had
>they not spread their false information through Jewish channels.
>
>The Jews of the ghettos would not have trusted the Nazi or Hungarian
>rulers. But they had trust in their Jewish leaders. Eichmann and
>others used this known fact as part of their calculated plan to mislead
>the Jews.
>They were able to deport the Jews to their extermination by the help
>of Jewish leaders.
>
>The false information was spread by the Jewish leaders. The local
>leaders of the Jews of Kluj and Nodvarod knew that other leaders were
>spreading such false information and did not protest.
>
>Those of the Jews who tried to warn their friends of the truth were
>persecuted by the Jewish leaders in charge of the local 'rescue work'.
>
>The trust of the Jews in the misleading information and their lack of
>knowledge that their wives, children and themselves were about to be
>deported to the gas chambers of Auschwitz led the victims to remain
>quiescent in their ghettos. It seduced them into not resisting or
>hampering the deportation orders.
>
>Dozens of thousands of Jews were guarded in their ghettos by a few
>dozen police. Yet even vigorous young Jews made no attemptt to overpower
>these few guards and escape to nearby Rumania. No resistance activities to
>the deportations were organized in these ghettos.
>
>And the Jewish leaders did everything in their power to soothe the
>Jews in the ghettos and to prevent such resistance activities.
>
>The same Jews who spread in Kluj and Nodvarod the false rumor of
>Kenyermeze, or confirmed it, the same public leaders who did not warn
>their own people against the misleading statements, the same Jewish leaders
>who did not organize any resistance or any sabotage of
>deportations...these same leaders did not join the people of their community
>in their ride to Auschwitz, but were all included in the Rescue train.
>
>The Nazi organizers of extermination and the perpetrators of
>extermination permitted Rudolf Kastner and the members of the Jewish Council
>in Budapest to save themselves, their relatives, and friends. The Nazis did
>this as a means of making the local Jewish leaders, whom they favoured,
>dependent on the Nazi regime, dependent on its good will during the time of
>its fatal deportation schedule. In short, the Nazis succeeded in bringing the
>Jewish leaders into oollaboration with the Nazis at the time of the
>catastrophe.
>
>The Nazi chiefs knew that the Zionists were a most vital element in
>Jewry and the most trusted by the Jews.
>
>The Nazis drew a lesson from the Warsaw ghetto and other belligerent
>ghettos. They learned that Jews were able to sell their lives very
>expensively if honorably guided.
>
>Eichmann did not want a second Warsaw. For this reason, the Nazis
>exerted themselves to mislead and bribe the Jewish leaders.
>
>The personality of Rudolph Kastner made him a convenient catspaw for
>Eichmann and his clique, to draw into collaboration and make their
>task easier.
>
>The question here is not, as stated by the Attorney General in his
>summation, whether members of the Jewish Rescue Committee were or were
>not capable of fulfilling their duty without the patronage of the S.S.
>chiefs.
>It is obvious that without such S.S. Nazi patronage the Jewish Rescue
>Committee could not have existed, and could have acted only as an
>underground.
>
>The question is, as put by the lawyer for the defense, why were the
>Nazis interested in the existence of the Rescue Committee? Why did
>the S.S. chiefs make every effort to encourage the existence of the
>Jewish Rescue Committee? Did the exterminators turn into rescuers?
>
>The same question rises concerning the rescue of prominent Jews by
>these German killers of Jews. Was the rescue of such Jews a part of
>the extermination plan of the killers ?
>
>The support given by the extermination leaders to Kastner's Rescue
>Committee proves that indeed there was a place for Kastner and his
>friends in their Final Solution for the Jews of Hungary - their total
>annihilation.
>
>The Nazi's patronage of Kastner, and their agreement to let him save
>six hundred prominent Jews, were part of the plan to exterminate the Jews.
>Kastner was given a chance to add a few more to that number. The bait
>attracted him. The opportunity of rescuing prominent people appealed
>to him greatly. He considered the rescue of the most important Jews as a
>great personal success and a success for Zionism. It was a success that
>would also justify his conduct - his political negotiation with Nazis and
>the Nazi patronage of his committee.
>
>When Kastner received this present from the Nazis, Kastner sold his
>soul to the German Satan. The sacrifice of the vital interests of the majority
>of the Jews, in order to rescue the prominents, was the basic element in the
>agreement between Kastner and the Nazis. This agreement fixed the division of
>the nation into two unequal camps: a small fragment of prominents, whom the
>Nazis promised Kastner to save, on the one hand, and the great majority of
>Hungarian Jews whom the Nazis designated for death, on the other hand.
>An imperative condition for the rescue of the first camp by the Nazis was that
>Kastner will not interfere in the action of the Nazis against the other camp
>and will not hamper them in its extermination. Kastner fulfilled this
>condition. He concentrated his efforts in the rescue of the prominents
>and treated the camp of the doomed as if they had already been wiped out
>from the book of the living.
>
>One cannot estimate the damage caused by Kastner's collaboration and
>put down the number of victims which it cost Hungarian Jews. These are not
>only the thousands of Jews in Nodvarod or any other community in the border
>area, Jews who could escape through the border, had the chief of their
>rescue committee fulfilled his duty toward them.
>
>All of Kastner's answers in his final testimony were a constant effort
>to evade this truth.
>
>Kastner has tried to escape through every crack he could find in the
>wall of evidence. When one crack was sealed in his face, he drated quickly
>to another."
>
>(Judgement of Judge Benjamin Halevi, Criminal Case 124/53; Attorney
>General
>v. Malchiel Greenwald, District Court, Jerusalem, June 22, 1955).
>
>Judge Halevi reverts to the meeting of Kastner with the S.S. officers
>Becher and Rudolf Hoess, commandant of Auschwitz at the time when the
>'new line' of rescuing Jews was revealed by Hoess. He says:
>
>"From this gathering in Budapest, it is obvious that the 'new line'
>stretched from Himmler to Hoess, from Jutner to Becher and Krumey.
>
>According to Kastner, however, these Nazis were all active in rescuing
>Jews.
>
>This meeting of these important German guests in Budapest exposes the
>'rescue' work of Becher in its true light. It reveals also the extent
>of Kastner's involvement in the inner circle of the chief German war
>criminals.
>
>Just as the Nazi war criminals knew they needed an alibi and hoped to
>achieve it by the rescue of a few Jews at the eleventh hour, so
>Kastner also needed an alibi for himself.
>
>Collaboration between the Jewish Agency Rescue Committee and the
>Exterminators of the Jews was solidifed in Budapest and Vienna.
>Kastner's duties were part and parcel of the genral duties of the S.S.
>
>In addition to its Extermination Department and Looting Department,
>the Nazi S.S. opened a Rescue Department headed by Kastner.
>
>All these extermination, robbery and rescue activities of the S.S.
>were coordinated under the management of Heinrich Himmler". (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi continues:
>
>"Kastner perjured himself knowingly in his testimony before this court
>when he denied he had interceded in Becher's hehalf. Moreover, he concealed
>the important fact that he interceded for Becher in the name of the Jewish
>Agency and the Jewish World Congress.
>
>As to the contents of Kastner's affidavit, it was enough for the
>defense to prove Becher was a war criminal. It was up to the prosecution to
>remove Becher from this status, if they wished to negate the affidavit.
>
>The Attorney General admitted in his summation that Becher was a war
>criminal.
>
>The lies in the contents of Kastner's affidavit, the lies in his
>testimony concerning the document, and Kastner's knowing participation in the
>activities of Nazi war criminals, and his participation in the last
>minute fake rescue activities - all these combine to show one overwhelming
>truth - that this affidavit was not given in good faith.
>
>Kastner knew well, as he himself testified, that Becher had never
>stood up against the stream of Jewish extermination, as Kastner has
>declared in the affidavit.
>
>The aims of Becher and his superior, Himmler, were not to save Jews
>but to serve the Nazi regime with full compliance. These is not truth
>and no good faith in Kastner's testimony, 'I never doubted for one moment
>the good intention of good Becher'.
>
>It is clear that the positive recommandation by Kastner, not only in
>his own name but also in the name of the Jewish Agency and the Jewish
>World Congress was of decisive importance for Becher. Kastner did not
>exaggerate when he said that Becher was released by the Allies because
>of his personal intervention. The lies in the affidavit of Kastner and the
>contradictions and various pretexts, which were proven to be lies, were
>sufficient to annul the value of his statements and to prove that there
>was no good faith in his testimony in favor of this German war criminal.
>Kastner's affidavit in favor of Becher was a willfully false affidavit
>given in favor of a war criminal to save him from trial and punishment
>in Nuremberg.
>
>Therefore, the defendant, Malchiel Greenwald, was correct in his
>accusations against Rudolf Kastner in the first, second and fourth of
>his statements." (ibid)
>
>Judge Halevi's verdict found Malchiel Greenwald generally innocent of
>libel against Kastner, but fined him one Israeli pound for the one unproven
>accusation - that Kastner had actually collected money from his Nazi
>partners for his aide to their slaughter program. The judge also
>ordered the Government of Israel to pay Greenwald two hundred Israeli
>pounds as court costs.
>
>In fairness to Kastner it should me mentioned that as well as having
>been unpaid, it was never established that he ever wore S.S. uniform.
>
>Nevertheless, this verdict, and the evidence on which it was based,
>completely establishes the truth of everything said on 3CR about the
>matter.
>
>If the story ended there, it would only prove conclusively that the
>individual Kastner was a collaborator and the Israeli Government had
>attempted to defend him, although facts brought out in the trial
>pointed to much more than that.
>
>But the story does not end there.
>
>The Reaction
>-------------
>Public opinion in Israel was almost unanimous in demanding that
>Kastner and his associates should be put on trial. Remember that up to
>now it was Kastner's accuser who was on trial.
>
>The Communist Party newspaper Kol Ha'am (Voice of the People) wrote:
>
>"All those whose relatives were butchered by the Germans in Hungary
>know now clearly that Jewish hands helped the mass murder" (23 June 1955)
>
>In the authoritative Israeli newspaper Ha'aretz, the leading political
>journalist, Dr. Moshe Keren wrote:
>
>"Kastner must be brought to trial as a Nazi collaborator. And at this
>trial, Kastner should defend himself as a private citizen, and not be
>defended by the Israeli Government..." (14 July 1955).
>
>*Haboker*, the pro-Government General Zionist party paper stated:
>
>"The public wants to know the real facts about Kastner, and not about
>him alone. The only way to find out the truth is to put all the Rescue
>Committee people on trial and give them a chance to offer their
>defense." (23 June 1955)
>
>But public opinion was not quite unanimous. The problem with bringing
>Kastner and his associates to trial was that his associates were the
>Government of Israel.
>
>As the evening paper *Yedi'ot Aharonot* said:
>
>"If Kastner is brought to trial the entire government faces a total
>political and national collapse - as a result of what such a trial may
> disclose." (23 June 1955)
>
>Accordingly, the Government of Israel did not put Kastner on trial,
>instead it filed an appeal against the acquittal of Greenwald for criminal
>libel.
>
>As Dr. Karlebach wrote in Israel's largest evening newspaper,
>*Ma'ariv*:
>
>"What is going on here? The Attorney General has to mobilize all the
>government power, appear himself in court, to justify and defend
>collaboration with Himmler! And in order to defend a quisling, the
>government must drag through the streets one of the grimmest stories
>of our history!
>
>At 11 P.M. the verdict was given. At 11 A.M. next morning the
>government announces the defense of Kastner will be renewed - an appeal filed.
>What exemplary expediency! Since when does this government possess such
>lawyer-genius who can weigh in one night the legal chances of an
>appeal on a detailed, complex verdict of three hundred pages?! (24 June 1955)
>
>At the appeal hearings before the Supreme Court, the Attorney General
>of Israel, Chaim Cohen, explained clearly why the Government of Israel
>was defending Kastner so strongly:  "The man Kastner does not stand here
>as a private individual. He was a recognized representative, official or
>non-official of the Jewish National Institutes in Palestine and of the
>Zionist Executive; and I come here in this court to defend the
>representative of our national institutions." (Hecht, p. 268)
>
>The truth of this statement cannot be denied. Kastner's collaboration
>was not that of an individual. It was the collaboration of the Zionist
>leadership.
>
>So far, it has only been established that the Government of Israel
>continued to support a Nazi collaborator after the facts about his
>collaboration had been conclusively established in an Israeli court.
>But the story gets worse.
>
>The Supreme Court of Israel unanimously found that Becher was indeed a
>Nazi war criminal and that Kastner had without justification, and in the
>name of the Jewish Agency, helped Becher to escape justice. On this point
>Greenwald was acquitted of libel and Kastner was not 'fully rehabilitated'.
>
>The Supreme Court also accepted the FACTS established in the lower
>court - that Kastner DELIBERATELY concealed the truth about Auschwitz from the
>majority of Hungarian Jews in exchange for Nazi permission to take a
>thousand or so to Palestine. Again, Kastner was far from being 'fully
>rehabilitated'.
>
>The Majority Judgement
>-------------------------
>But now comes the really nasty bit. After unanimously acknowledging
>these FACTS, the Supreme Court of Israel, by a majority of three to two,
>found that Kastner's actions were MORALLY JUSTIFIABLE and convicted
>Greenwald of criminal libel for calling this 'collaboration'.
>
>In saying that 3CR broadcasts concealed the fact that Kastner had been
>fully rehabilitated by the Israeli Supreme Court, Dr. Foster is
>totally missing the point.
>
>Kastner's actions only proved that HE was a Nazi collaborator. It is
>the defense of these actions by the Government and Courts of Israel that
>prove conclusively that ZIONISM approves of Nazi collaboration.
>
>The majority of the Supreme Court of Israel did not REHABILITATE
>Kastner.
>They JOINED him.
>
>Let us read from the majority judgement of Supreme Court Judge Shlomo
>Chesin:
>
>"...What point was there in telling the people boarding the trains in
>Kluj, people struck by fate and persecuted, as to what awaits them at the
>end of their journey...Kastner spoke in detail of the situation, saying,
>'The Hungarian Jew was a branch which long ago dried up on the tree'. This
>vivid description coincides with the testimony of another witness about the
>Hungarian Jews, 'This was a big Jewish community in Hungary, without any
>ideological Jewish backbone' (Moshe Shweiger, a Kastner aide in Budapest,
>protocol 465).
>
>I fully agree with my friend, Judge Agranot, when he states that, 'The
>Jews of Hungary, including those in the countryside, were not capable,
>neither physically nor mentally, to carry out resistance operations with force
>against the deportation scheme'...From this point of view no rescue
>achievement could have resulted by disclosing the Auschwitz news to
>the Jewish leaders there, and this...is a consideration which on can
>properly conclude that Kastner had in front of his eyes.
>
>.And I take one more step. I am certain that the silence of Kastner
>when he arrived in Kluj was premeditated and calculated and did not result
>from his great dispair because of the helplessness of the Jewish community.
>Even then, I say, this is still not considered willful collaboration and
>assistance in the extermination, because all the signs indicate that
>Kastner's efforts were aimed at rescue and rescue on a big scale...And
>towards the end I take one last step. In doing so I go very far and
>say that even if Kastner ordered himself to keep silent knowingly, in
>submission to the strong will of the Nazis, in order to save a few
>Jews from Hell - this is still no proof that he stained his hands by
>collaborating with the enemies of his people and carrying out their
>plan to exterminate most of the Jewish community in Hungary.
>
>Even if, through these activities of his - or rather, his omission -
>the extermination became easier. And as to the moral issue, the question
>is not whether a man is allowed to kill many in order to save a few, or
>vice-versa. The question is altogether in another sphere and should be
>defined as follows: A man is aware that a whole community is awaiting
>its doom. He is allowed to make efforts to save a few, although part of
>his efforts involve concealment of truth from the many or should he
>disclose the truth to many though it is his best opinion that this way
>everybody will perish. I think that the answer is clear. What good will the
>blood of the few bring if everybody is to perish?...As I said, I am not arguing
>with the basic factual findings of the learned President of the Jewish
>District Court (Judge Halevi) but it seems to me, with all due respect, that
>his findings do not, as of necessity, demand the conclusion he has arrived
>at.
>That is to say, collaboration on the part of Kastner in the extermination
>of the Jews. And that they better coincide with bad leadership both
>from a moral and public point of view...
>
>In my opinion, one can say outright that if you find out that Kastner
>collaborated with the enemy because he did not disclose to the people
>who boarded the trains in Kluj that they were being led to extermination,
>one has to put on trial today Danzig, Herman, Hanzi, Brand, Revis and
>Marton, and many more leaders and half-leaders who gagged themselves in an
>hour of crisis and did not inform others of what was known to them and did not
>warn and did not cry out of the coming danger....
>
>Because of all this I cannot confirm the conclusion of the District Court
>with regard to the accusation that Greenwald has thrown on Kastner of
>collaboration with the Nazis in exterminating the Jewish people in
>Hungary during the last war." (Hecht, ibid, pp.270-2)
>
>In other words, the Court approved of Kastner's contempt for the
>Hungarian Jews and could not allow him to be condemned for doing exactly what
>many other Zionist leaders had half-leaders did - concealing their
>knowledge of the Nazi extermination plans so that Jews would board the trains to
>Auschwitz peacefully while their Zionist 'leaders' boarded a different
>train for Palestine.
>
>The Minority Judgement
>--------------------------
>It cannot be said that ALL top Zionists leaders actively approved of
>Nazi collaboration in this way. Indeed the most precise answer to this
>sickening judgement of Judge Chesin is provided in the minority judgement of
>Supreme Court Judge Moshe Silberg:
>
>"I do not say that he was the only man who possessed information among
>the leaders. It is quite possible that somebody else as well does not have
>a clear conscience with regards to this concealment. But we are dealing
>here with the guilt of Kastner and we do not have to make judgements on the
>guilt of others....
>
>The declaration of the learned Attorney General therefore shrinks into
>an opinion....'Kastner was convinced and believed that there was no ray
>of hope for the Jews of Hungary, almost for none of them, and as he, as a
>result of his personal dispair, did not disclose the secret of the
>extermination in order not to endanger or frustrate the rescue of the
>few - therefore he acted in good faith and should not be accused of
>collaborating with the Nazis in expediting the extermination of the Jews,
>even though, in fact, he brought about its result.'
>
>I am compelled to state that it is very difficult for me to conceive
>such an intention. Is this good faith? Can a single man, even in
>cooperation with some of his friends, yield to despair on behalf and
>without the knowledge of 800,000 other people? This is, in my opinion, the
>decisive consideration in the problem facing us. The charge emanating from
>the testimony of the witnesses against Kastner is that had they known of
>the Auschwitz secret, then thousands or tens of thousands would have been
>able to save their lives by local, partial, specific or indirect rescue
>operations like local revolts, resistance, escapes, hidings,
>concealment of children with Gentiles, forging of documents, ransom money,
>bribery, etc - and when this is the case and when one deals with many hundreds
>of thousands, how does a human being, a mortal, reject with complete
>certainty and with an extreme 'no' the efficiency of all the many and varied
>rescue ways? How can he examine the tens of thousands of possibilities? Does
>he decide instead of God? Indeed, he who can act with such a usurpation
>of the last hope of hundreds of thousands is not entitled to claim good faith
>as his defense. The penetrating question quo warrento is a good answer to
>a claim of such good faith...
>
>If the superintendent of a big hospital lets thousands of sick people
>die so that he may devote himself to the sure rescue of one soul, he will
>come out guilty, at least morally, even if it is proven that he as an
>individual erroneously thought that there was no hope of saving the other
>patients. He is a collaborator with the angel of death.
>
>Either a complete atrophy of the soul or a blind involvement with
>complete loss of senses and proportion in his small but personal rescue
>operation could bring a man to such a gigantic, hazardous play.
>
>And if all this is not enough to annul the claim of good faith which
>was put before us on behalf of Kastner by the Attorney General, then
>Kastner himself comes and annuls it altogether. Not only did he never make
>this claim, but his own words prove the contrary. He writes in his report
>to the Jewish Agency that the Committee sent emissaries to many ghettos in
>the countryside and pleaded with them to organize escapes and to refuse to
>board the trains. And though the story of these pleadings is untrue,
>and the silence of Kastner in Kluj is proven, the very uttering of these
>statements entirely contradicts the claim that Kastner had concealed
>the news about the fate of the ghetto inmates in good faith and only as a
>result of his complete despairing of the chances of escaping or
>resisting the Germans. You can not claim at the same time helplessness and
>activity.
>Anyway, such a claim is not convincing...
>
>We can sum up with three facts:
>A. That the Nazis didn't want to have a great revolt - 'Second Warsaw'
>- nor small revolts, and their passion was to have the extermination
>machine working smoothly without resistance. This fact was known to Kastner
>from the best source - from Eichmann himself - And he had additional proofs
>of that when he witnessed all the illusionary and misleading tactics
>which were being taken by the Nazis from the first moment of occupation.
>B. That the most efficient means to paralyze the resistance with - or
>the escape of a victim is to conceal from him the plot of the coming
>murder.
>This fact is known to every man and one does not need any proof of
>evidence for this.
>C. That he, Kastner, in order to carry out the rescue plan for the few
>prominents, fulfilled knowingly and without good faith the said desire
>of the Nazis, thus expediting the work of exterminating the masses.
>
>And also the rescue of Becher by Kastner...He who is capable of
>rescuing this Becher from hanging proves that the atrocities of this great
>war criminal were not so horryfying or despicable in his eyes...I couldn't
>base the main guilt of Kastner on this fact had it been alone, but when it
>is attached even from afar to the whole scene of events it throws
>retroactive light on the whole affair and serves as a dozen proofs of our
>conclusion." (Supreme Court Judge, Moshe Silberg, 1957)
>
>Conclusion
>-----------
>If that had been the majority judgement, one could say that whatever
>their attitudes to the Arabs, and whatever their past behaviour might have
>been under pressure, the Zionist leadership today did not advocate
>collaboration with the Nazis.
>
>One could then at least understand the complaints by Mr. Bloch,
>President of the Victorian Jewish Board of Deputies, about the 'dragging in
>of alleged episodes in the history of Jewish/Nazi relationships'.
>
>But Judge Silberg's judgement was that of a minority.
>
>The Kastner case is therefore not an alleged episode in past history,
>being 'dragged in' to discredit an opponent.
>
>It is a continuing controversy in which the top Zionist leadership of
>Israel stand indicted of continuing to publicly defend collaboration
>with the Nazis in the extermination of Jews.
>
>Despite the unanimous finding of the Supreme Court of Israel that Kurt
>Becher was a major war criminal, the Jewish Agency (World Zionist
>Organization) refused to withdraw the fraudulent certificate Kastner
>gave on their behalf, which saved Becher from hanging, and allowed him to
>remain a free man in West Germany, the head of several corporations and with
>an estimated personal worth of $30 million.
>
>Becher has even used his certification as a 'good' SS officer to give
>evidence in support of his associates at other war crimes trials in
>West Germany.
>
>Since the prosecution, representing the Israeli Government agreed with
>the Supreme Court that Becher was a major war criminal, one can only
>presure that the Israeli Government did not want him put on trial for
>fear of what might come out.
>
>Likewise, none of Kastner's associates on the Zionist Relief and
>Rescue Committee or his bosses in the Jewish Agency have ever been put on
>trial as demanded by Israeli public opinion. Let alone the hundreds of
>'prominents' who helped Kastner to reassure the Hungarian Jews that they
>were going to Kenyermeze and not Auschwitz, in exchange for tickets on
>the one train that took them eventually to Palestine.
>
>As for Kastner himself, he will cause no further embarassment to the
>Zionist leadership with his undisputed claims that everything he did
>was approved by the Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) leadership
>in Palestine. He is, as Dr. Foster so delicately puts it, 'now dead'. Or
>putting it less delicately, on 3 March 1957 he was shot by Zeer
>Eckstein - immediately after the appeal hearings were concluded, and
>before the judgement 'rehabilitating' him was delivered. Eckstein was
>not a Hungarian avenger. He was a paid undercover agent of the Israeli
>secret service.
>(Hecht, ibid., p.208. Another 'fantastic allegation' no doubt; but
>admitted in court during the murder trial).
>
>Clearly this issue has a major indirect relevance to the Arab-Israeli
>dispute. Apart from countering Israel's cynical use of the holocaust
>as a propaganda weapon, it answers a very real concern that many people
>have about the State of Israel and the Jews. This concern is whether,
>if Jews had a State of their own during the holocaust many more could
>have been saved, and whether this is not an essential future consideration,
>at least as an insurance policy.
>
>The facts of the Kastner case show that the very existence of the
>Jewish Agency (World Zionist Organization) was an actual help to the Nazis
>and that more could have been saved if the Zionist movement had not
>existed.
>Having a State that approves of actions like those of Kastner for an
>insurance policy, is like using petro for a fire extinguisher.
>
>Zionism is not the answer to anti-semitism, but a cowardly proposal to
>run away from it. The only answer to anti-semitism is to fight back.
>
>We shall go on to prove this in detail.
>-------------------------------------------------------------------
>Elias Davidsson - Oldugata 50 - 101 Reykjavik - Iceland
>Tel. (354)-552-6444     Fax: (354)-552-6579
>Email: edavid@itn.is     URL:  http://www.nyherji.is/~edavid


If you believe in the TRUTH and the RIGHT,
then visit  www.freedomsite.org

Lawyers, politicians, and judges need to be recycled - as fertiliser!!

"At a time of universal deceit - telling the truth
is a revolutionary act."
(George Orwell)

David Icke - '...and the truth shall set you free'

"All truth passes through three stages.
First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed,
and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
(Arthur Schopenhauer)

"The reason men are silenced is not because they speak falsely,
but because they speak the truth. This is because if men speak
falsehoods, their own words can be used against them; while if
they speak truly, there is nothing which can be used
against them -- except force." -- John Bryant

"To attempt to silence a man is to pay him homage, for it is an
acknowledgement that his arguments are both impossible to answer
and impossible to ignore."
--John Bryant


Posted by:
Patrick Lee Humphrey
7500 Bellerive #1807
Houston, Texas 77036-3040
1-713-266-7764

Steven Horn (KCOM)
1836 NW 11th St
Oklahoma City, OK 73106
(405) 524-0576

together with
Boris Dynin  = NAMBLA executive &
Henry
CALL late nights to discuss: (408) 773-0984
Email me: boris@movil.com , boris@sonic.net or even
VISIT me at:
55 Chumasero Drive, Daly City, San Francisco  94132

We all like late night discussions, even from Stormfront,
Christian Identity, Pamyat, Aryan Nations, etc.
We are together with McVay, regional managers for NAMBLA.
We like young children, so that we can train them our way.


Ken McVay invites callers,and visitors,to his homosexuals escorts
office: VISIT at:
#5 - 1601 - Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada, or my home at:
Apt. 3108 - 995 Bowen Road, Nanaimo, B.C., Canada
or call: 1-250-616-9431

As everyone can see McVay takes it as a compliment when he is
called a "confessed child-molester" and the additional material
should give an indication as to the why.

"I am weary of seeing the issue of "child porn" blown out of
proportion (I've been on and around the Net since 1988, and have
yet to come across anything I'd consider "child porn." I've
seen photos of naked children, but then I've got some of those in
my family photo album, and fail to see the harm, or any great
moral danger to our society)." - Nizkor Director Ken McVay
http://www.spectacle.org/695/mcvay.html [Many paedophiles
also have family albums with naked children photos in them.]

Look at Ken McVay's photo and ask yourselves; "Does he not look like
a disheveled unkempt pervert or someone who would molest your child
even if he or she were not naked"?
http://www.protocol.gov.bc.ca/protocol/prgs/obc/1995/1995_KMcVay.jpg

For detailed and documented evidence of McVay's questionable
background and details of convictions, please refer to Dr.David
Michael's
detailed expose on McVay. McVay is a distraught paranoid molseter, and
is
known for claiming that anyone who refutes his lies must be a
grosvenor!!
It is also suspected that McVay fabricates responses using aliases,
just
to justify his existence to his ZHID masters.

Since I am a female, I also like to receive many calls, to discuss
NAMBLA,lesbianism, JEW atrocities and similar.
Email  me, Shiksa Susan Cohen at: Flavia18@verizon.net, especially
late nights.

Also,be sure to include me on maillists:
Keith Spencer,5005 Whitemud Road,Edmonton,AB,Canada T6H5L2
I welcome phone calls, late nights:(780)437-1787  or
send lots of emails to: krs2@ualberta.ca, or phone to
work:(780)492-0473

And also: George Firestone: "George" ,
and davejoll@ihug.co.nz.

Here is Fag Rianin's own web page:  http://gaydar.co.uk/riain_il
Notice he is a self confessed ZionistFagJew!

For the real TRUTH about ZHIDS, visit the world top-rated website for
JEW-WATCH:
http://www.jewwatch.com

Now with more evidence coming out proving ZHID COLLABORATION WITH
NAZIS - another 51 cases besides the renowned Kastner case - no wonder
people around the world are really disliking the Christkiller ZHIDS!!

Or, other useful websites include:
ZUNDELSITE - www.zundelsite.org
IHR - www.ihr.org
OSTARA - www.ostara.org
PAMYAT - http://abbc.com/pamyat/index.html
Edgar J.Steele - www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
AL JAZEERA - http://english.aljazeera.net/HomePage
THE HOFFMAN WIRE - Dedicated to Freedom of the Press,
    Investigative Reporting and Revisionist History
    Subscribe: HoffmanWire-subscribe@topica.com

Or, visit the website for NATIONAL ALLIANCE : http://www.natall.com
They have lots of information, as well as books and records.

They also are involved in exposing Ken McVay for the crook he is,
and passing on information to the appropriate criminal prosecutors.

As a service to the public, this article is posted worldwide by a
victim of the molester pervert Ken McVay, with the assistance
of a group interested in detailing the depredations of the ZHIDS.
May Ken McVay and his like,rot in gehenna.

In memory of William Grosvenor who courageously posted the TRUTH
for many years around the world.



On Thu, 29 Jun 2006 07:21:14 GMT, "princeandy"  wrote:

>WHAT DOUBTS????
>
>>Here then are excerpts from the verdict of Judge Halevi, who later
>>became one of the panel of three judges that tried Eichmann:
>>
>>"The masses of Jews from Hungary's ghettos obediently boarded the
>>deportation trains without knowing their fate. They were full of
>>confidence in the false information that they were being transferred to
>>Kenyermeze.
>>
>>The Nazis could not have misled the masses of Jews so conclusively had
>>they not spread their false information through Jewish channels.
>>
>>The Jews of the ghettos would not have trusted the Nazi or Hungarian
>>rulers. But they had trust in their Jewish leaders. Eichmann and
>>others used this known fact as part of their calculated plan to mislead
>>the Jews.
>>They were able to deport the Jews to their extermination by the help
>>of Jewish leaders.
>>
>>The false information was spread by the Jewish leaders. The local
>>leaders of the Jews of Kluj and Nodvarod knew that other leaders were
>>spreading such false information and did not protest.
>>
>>Those of the Jews who tried to warn their friends of the truth were
>>persecuted by the Jewish leaders in charge of the local 'rescue work'.
>>
>>The trust of the Jews in the misleading information and their lack of
>>knowledge that their wives, children and themselves were about to be
>>deported to the gas chambers of Auschwitz led the victims to remain
>>quiescent in their ghettos. It seduced them into not resisting or
>>hampering the deportation orders.
>>
>>Dozens of thousands of Jews were guarded in their ghettos by a few
>>dozen police. Yet even vigorous young Jews made no attemptt to overpower
>>these few guards and escape to nearby Rumania. No resistance activities to
>>the deportations were organized in these ghettos.
>>
>>And the Jewish leaders did everything in their power to soothe the
>>Jews in the ghettos and to prevent such resistance activities.
>>
>>The same Jews who spread in Kluj and Nodvarod the false rumor of
>>Kenyermeze, or confirmed it, the same public leaders who did not warn
>>their own people against the misleading statements, the same Jewish leaders
>>who did not organize any resistance or any sabotage of
>>deportations...these same leaders did not join the people of their
>community
>>in their ride to Auschwitz, but were all included in the Rescue train.
>>
>>The Nazi organizers of extermination and the perpetrators of
>>extermination permitted Rudolf Kastner and the members of the Jewish
>Council
>>in Budapest to save themselves, their relatives, and friends. The Nazis did
>>this as a means of making the local Jewish leaders, whom they favoured,
>>dependent on the Nazi regime, dependent on its good will during the time of
>>its fatal deportation schedule. In short, the Nazis succeeded in bringing
>the
>>Jewish leaders into oollaboration with the Nazis at the time of the
>>catastrophe.
>>
>>The Nazi chiefs knew that the Zionists were a most vital element in
>>Jewry and the most trusted by the Jews.
>>
>>The Nazis drew a lesson from the Warsaw ghetto and other belligerent
>>ghettos. They learned that Jews were able to sell their lives very
>>expensively if honorably guided.
>>
>>Eichmann did not want a second Warsaw. For this reason, the Nazis
>>exerted themselves to mislead and bribe the Jewish leaders.
>>
>>The personality of Rudolph Kastner made him a convenient catspaw for
>>Eichmann and his clique, to draw into collaboration and make their
>>task easier.
>>
>>The question here is not, as stated by the Attorney General in his
>>summation, whether members of the Jewish Rescue Committee were or were
>>not capable of fulfilling their duty without the patronage of the S.S.
>>chiefs.
>>It is obvious that without such S.S. Nazi patronage the Jewish Rescue
>>Committee could not have existed, and could have acted only as an
>>underground.
>>
>>The question is, as put by the lawyer for the defense, why were the
>>Nazis interested in the existence of the Rescue Committee? Why did
>>the S.S. chiefs make every effort to encourage the existence of the
>>Jewish Rescue Committee? Did the exterminators turn into rescuers?
>>
>>The same question rises concerning the rescue of prominent Jews by
>>these German killers of Jews. Was the rescue of such Jews a part of
>>the extermination plan of the killers ?
>>
>>The support given by the extermination leaders to Kastner's Rescue
>>Committee proves that indeed there was a place for Kastner and his
>>friends in their Final Solution for the Jews of Hungary - their total
>>annihilation.
>>
>>The Nazi's patronage of Kastner, and their agreement to let him save
>>six hundred prominent Jews, were part of the plan to exterminate the Jews.
>>Kastner was given a chance to add a few more to that number. The bait
>>attracted him. The opportunity of rescuing prominent people appealed
>>to him greatly. He considered the rescue of the most important Jews as a
>>great personal success and a success for Zionism. It was a success that
>>would also justify his conduct - his political negotiation with Nazis and
>>the Nazi patronage of his committee.
>>
>>When Kastner received this present from the Nazis, Kastner sold his
>>soul to the German Satan. The sacrifice of the vital interests of the
>majority
>>of the Jews, in order to rescue the prominents, was the basic element in
>the
>>agreement between Kastner and the Nazis. This agreement fixed the division
>of
>>the nation into two unequal camps: a small fragment of prominents, whom the
>>Nazis promised Kastner to save, on the one hand, and the great majority of
>>Hungarian Jews whom the Nazis designated for death, on the other hand.
>>An imperative condition for the rescue of the first camp by the Nazis was
>that
>>Kastner will not interfere in the action of the Nazis against the other
>camp
>>and will not hamper them in its extermination. Kastner fulfilled this
>>condition. He concentrated his efforts in the rescue of the prominents
>>and treated the camp of the doomed as if they had already been wiped out
>>from the book of the living.
>>
>>One cannot estimate the damage caused by Kastner's collaboration and
>>put down the number of victims which it cost Hungarian Jews. These are not
>>only the thousands of Jews in Nodvarod or any other community in the border
>>area, Jews who could escape through the border, had the chief of their
>>rescue committee fulfilled his duty toward them.
>>
>>All of Kastner's answers in his final testimony were a constant effort
>>to evade this truth.
>>
>>Kastner has tried to escape through every crack he could find in the
>>wall of evidence. When one crack was sealed in his face, he drated quickly
>>to another."
>>
>>(Judgement of Judge Benjamin Halevi, Criminal Case 124/53; Attorney
>>General
>>v. Malchiel Greenwald, District Court, Jerusalem, June 22, 1955).
>>
>>Judge Halevi reverts to the meeting of Kastner with the S.S. officers
>>Becher and Rudolf Hoess, commandant of Auschwitz at the time when the
>>'new line' of rescuing Jews was revealed by Hoess. He says:
>>
>>"From this gathering in Budapest, it is obvious that the 'new line'
>>stretched from Himmler to Hoess, from Jutner to Becher and Krumey.
>>
>>According to Kastner, however, these Nazis were all active in rescuing
>>Jews.
>>
>>This meeting of these important German guests in Budapest exposes the
>>'rescue' work of Becher in its true light. It reveals also the extent
>>of Kastner's involvement in the inner circle of the chief German war
>>criminals.
>>
>>Just as the Nazi war criminals knew they needed an alibi and hoped to
>>achieve it by the rescue of a few Jews at the eleventh hour, so
>>Kastner also needed an alibi for himself.
>>
>>Collaboration between the Jewish Agency Rescue Committee and the
>>Exterminators of the Jews was solidifed in Budapest and Vienna.
>>Kastner's duties were part and parcel of the genral duties of the S.S.
>>
>>In addition to its Extermination Department and Looting Department,
>>the Nazi S.S. opened a Rescue Department headed by Kastner.
>>
>>All these extermination, robbery and rescue activities of the S.S.
>>were coordinated under the management of Heinrich Himmler". (ibid)
>>
>>Judge Halevi continues:
>>
>>"Kastner perjured himself knowingly in his testimony before this court
>>when he denied he had interceded in Becher's hehalf. Moreover, he concealed
>>the important fact that he interceded for Becher in the name of the Jewish
>>Agency and the Jewish World Congress.
>>
>>As to the contents of Kastner's affidavit, it was enough for the
>>defense to prove Becher was a war criminal. It was up to the prosecution to
>>remove Becher from this status, if they wished to negate the affidavit.
>>
>>The Attorney General admitted in his summation that Becher was a war
>>criminal.
>
>"Salah Jafar"  wrote in message
>news:9Zamg.4103$DI2.3584@trnddc05...
>Europe doubts Israel's claims
>
>THERE IS NO DOBT THE ONLY DOUBT IS WHO IS TO BLAME FOR THE WHOLE MESS? DID
>THE JEWS/ZIONISTS CAUSE THE WHOLE MESS AND THEN SUFFER THE FAITH OF BEINGING
>IMPRISONED WHEN THE WHOLE POPULATION WAS STARVING.
>AS THE ALLIED  WINNERS THEMSELVES WERE ON SEVERE RATIONING, WHICH WAS A GOOD
>THING FOR SOME COUNTRIES WHERE HEART AND OTHER PROBLEMS INDUCED BY SMOKING
>AND OVER EATING WERE DOWN DURING WAR YEARS.
>
>
>
>TIME ACADEMICS STOPPED  JEWS AND SUPPORTERS TO ENJOYING  A GOOD LIVING  ON
>LIES AND DISHONEST PRACTICES IN CORRUPTING OUR HISTORY WHILE SUPPORTING THE
>JAILING OF  HONEST ACADEMICS TRYING TO PRESENT AND INCORPORATE THE TRUTH IN
>WHAT IS MAINLY OUR HISTORY OF WWII AND NOT THE SOLE PROPERTY OF THE
>JEWQW/ZIONIST/ISRAELI CLIQUE TO USE TO SUPPORT FURTHER LIES AND
>MISREPRESENTATIONS ABOUT THE PRACTICES OF THE ZIONISTS AND SAME GROUP WHO
>ARE IN POWER IN ISRAEL.
>
>"Yisroel Markov"  wrote in message
>news:c58u72tfjrt2dafgrbko9qs33rutp5jh5h@4ax.com...
>> UK to Israeli Profs: Class Dismissed
>> ------------------------------------
>> The weird movement to boycott Israeli academics
>> By Ari Paul
>
>NOTHING WEIRD , THE WEIRD IS THE STANDING BACK AND ACTUALLY ALLOWING THE
>PAMPERED AND EGOTISTICAL JEWISH/ZIONIST/ISRAELI ACADEMICS BLUFF THEM INTO
>NOT CONTRADICTING ALL THE LIES THEY HAVE ACTUALLY MADE A PART OF WWII
>HISTORY AND ALLOWED AND SUPPORTED THE JAILING OF JEWISH AND NONJEWISH
>HISTORIANS DOING NO MORE THAN THEIR JOB BY MAKING AN HONEST EVALUATION OF
>THE HOLOCAUST CLAIMS AS NOT SUPPORTED BY HISTORICAL FACT.
>
>AND IN SO DOING SUPPORTING THE LIES AND PROPAGANDA SPREAD BY ISRAEL AND
>SUPPORTERS WHO ARE NOT EITHER LOYAL CITIZENS OR HONEST MEN/WOMEN.
>
>ALLOWING THESE FRAUDS TO ENJOY A GOOD LIVING WHILE ALLOWING HONEST ACADEMICS
>TO BE PERSECUTED.
>
>WALK OPENLY OVER OUR , I HOPE, STRONGLY HELD BELIEFS OF FREEDOM OF SPEECH
>AND ASSOCIATION. AND RIGHTS THAT THEY HAVE NEVER INCORPORATED OR PRACTISED
>IN ANY STATE IN WHICH THEY HAVE HAD A POSITION OF CONTROL.
>
>WARNING To People in Austria; Belgium; France; Germany;
>Israel; Spain and Switzerland. You can be fined,imprisoned or both for
>discussing the topics set forth in this article.
>
>Israeli stats
>http://www.ifamericansknew.org/
>
>
>Jews and Palestinians genetically similar.
>http://www.khazaria.com/genetics/abstracts.html
>
>War without end
>http://www.itszone.co.uk/zone0/viewtopic.php?t=39590
>
>
>Yes and you have no quarrel with the US?
>They dont have to, they use their army to shoot, run over and mistreat
>physically and sexually helpless children. What can a Palestinian do when
>the mighty money contributing yanks cannot protect their citizens.
>
>http://www.thenausea.com/elements/thenotforgotten/rachel/index.html
>http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/16/rafah.death/
>http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/79400p-72974c.html
>One guy gets 10 years, the other gets a raise and promotion??
>
>And the chimp smirks on
>_ HYPERLINK "http://www.smirkingchimp.com/print.php?sid=26276" __
>http://www.smirkingchimp.com/print.php?sid=26276
>
>
>
>http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/01AA7ECA-7018-447B-A10D-9E4139D4788A.
>htm
>
>_
>American and Australian shot by Israelis
>Chris McGreal talks to the relatives of three British and American victims
>http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,1066817,00.html
>http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/16/rafah.death/
>http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,1066817,00.html
>http://www.rachelcorrie.org/
>
>http://www.thenausea.com/elements/thenotforgotten/rachel/index.html
>
>http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,916299,00.html
>http://www.omjp.org/rachelphotos.html
>http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8853425952359751341&q=Palestinian+p
>eople
>
>
>http://www.nogw.com/israeliatrocities.html
>http://www.palestinefacts.org/index.php
>http://www.palestinechronicle.com/story-2003112917164320.htm
>http://thirdworldtraveler.com/Israel/IsraelsTortureBan.html
>
>http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0197/9701007.htm
>
>Christian homes being knocked down???
>http://sf.indymedia.org/news/2003/05/1607911.php
>
>
>(Wanderer, Oct. 12, 1989, p. 7; National Review, March 16, 1992, p. S-5).
>
>Israeli soldiers can beat up a priest on the West Bank, then shoot up his
>church during Mass, and only the Catholic press takes note...If Christians
>had done such a thing to a synagogue, anywhere, it would have been
>front-page news, everywhere. (Wanderer, Oct. 12, 1989, p. 7; National
>Review, March 16, 1992, p. S-5).
>
>Farmers harassed and shot in israel
>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3757004.stm
>http://www.itszone.co.uk/zone0/viewtopic.php?t=53042
>
>
>Zionist settler deliberately hits and kills Palestinian old man
>http://www.palestine-info.co.uk/am/publish/article_3293.shtml
>http://www.palestine-info.co.uk/am/publish/article_3396.shtml
>http://judicial-inc.biz/School_shooting.htm
>
>
>
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics.nationalism.white/msg/20deae4bed
>c378ab?q=&rnum=1
>In a letter to the conference host, UNESCO Director-General Koichiro
>Matsuura,
>the protesters said the Wiesenthal center, "under the deceitful cover of the
>struggle against anti-Semitism, is on the contrary encouraging intolerance
>and
>racism in our societies."
>
>Jon and David Kimche
>http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v13/v13n4p29_Weber.html
>The SS was particularly enthusiastic in its support for Zionism. An internal
>June 1934 SS position paper urged active and wide-ranging support for
>Zionism by the government and the Party as the best way to encourage
>emigration of Germany's Jews to Palestine.
>
>The Jewish Agency delegation headed by Golda Meir (Meirson) ignored a German
>offer to allow Jews to emigrate to other countries for $250 a head, and the
>other Jewish groups  made no effort to influence the United States and the
>32 other countries attending the conference to allow immigration of German
>and Austrian Jews.
>http://www.jews-for-allah.org/Jews-not-for-Judaism/Jews-who-helped-nazis-hit
>ler.htm
>
>
>Marlon Brando.
>http://www.theunjustmedia.com/ben%20stein%20on%20jewish%20media%20control.ht
>m
>
>If one wants to exterminate an entire race, one would start with the leaders
>first and
>
>Why did Rabbi Baeck never leave the Third Reich
>
>On March 24, 1933, the Jewish World Congress, then under the leadership of
>Chaim
>Holocaust Calendar
>Jewish dominance
>
>Rabbi to Publish Book on Jewish Supremacy
>... One is Rabbi Saadya Grama, author of an upcoming book "On the Exalted
>Nature of Israel and Understanding ... Written by Rabbi Saadya Grama - an
>alumnus of Beth Medrash Govoha, the ...
>more hits from:
>ttp://atheism.about.com/b/a/057831.htm?terms=published+book  -  25 KB
>
>The Jews declared war against Germany
>On March 24, 1933, the Jewish World Congress, then under the leadership of
>Chaim Weizman, declared war on Germany on behalf of the Jews of the world.
>http://www.corax.org/revisionism/misc/encampment.html
>
>
>http://www.rense.com/general45/zzo.htm
>The Zionist Jewish Role In  - Causing World War II
>"In 1941, a Jewish writer, Theodor N. Kaufman, wrote Germany Must Perish.
>Kaufman set out a plan for the total destruction of the German population by
>a very simple method: the mass sterilisation of all German men and women
>between the age of puberty and sixty years."
>
>From a pre-1993 edition of John Tyndall's Spearhead magazine
>12-9-3
>
>
>
>http://www.corax.org/revisionism/misc/encampment.html
>Immediately after Japan declared war on the United States of America, the
>order was issued to round up all Americans of Japanese ancestry and imprison
>them in large camps. A declaration of war entitles any nation to imprison
>its enemy and their sympathizers.
>On March 24, 1933, the Jewish World Congress, then under the leadership of
>Chaim Weizman, declared war on Germany on behalf of the Jews of the world.
>The basic question arises; what were the Germans supposed to do with their
>large Jewish population?
>
>http://www.heretical.com/mkilliam/wwii.html
>That second war was later made certain, not by the intentions of Hitler but
>by the determination of his eternal enemies to destroy the new Germany that
>he had created.
>By the Treaty of Versailles on 28 June 1919 and the Treaty of St. Germain on
>20 September of the same year, the German people were thoroughly humiliated.
>The British Prime Minister, Lloyd George, wrote:
>'The international bankers swept statesmen, politicians, journalists and
>jurists all to one side and issued their orders with the imperiousness of
>absolute monarchs.'
>
>
>
>
>http://www.msnbc.com/news/606092.asp?0si=-&cp1=1
>Who has said, America and Israel? I'll pick Israel every time. That is a guy
>who was educated, worked in intelligence in the air force in America
>ALIEN CONTROL
>Is US like Germany of the '30s? Published on Friday, June 11, 2004 by the
>Chicago Sun Times  by Andrew Greeley
>http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0611-10.htm
>
>The Daily Mail reported on 10 July 1933:
>'The German nation, moreover, was rapidly falling under the control of its
>alien elements. In the last days of the pre-Hitler regime there were twenty
>times as many Jewish government officials in Germany as had existed before
>the war. Israelites of international attachments were insinuating themselves
>into key positions in the German administrative machine.'
>Resentment and resistance began to build up against the alien horde and in
>the year before Adolf Hitler came to power Bernard Lecache, President of the
>World Jewish League, stated:
>'Germany is our public enemy number one. It is our object to declare war
>without mercy against her.'
>On that same day, 24 March 1933, on the front page of the London Daily
>Express appeared the main headlines: "Judaea declares war on Germany: Jews
>of all the world unite", and followed with:
>'The Israelite people of the entire world declare economic and financial war
>on Germany. The appearance of the Swastika as the symbol of the new Germany
>revives the old war symbol of the Jews. Fourteen million Jews stand as one
>body to declare war on Germany. The Jewish wholesale dealer leaves his
>business, the banker his bank, the shopkeeper his shop, the beggar his
>miserable hut in order to combine forces in the holy war against Hitler's
>people.'
>The German government was removing Jews from influential positions and
>transferring power back to the German people. This declaration of war by the
>Jews on Germany was repeated throughout the world. The first boycott of
>Jewish business concerns came after this Jewish declaration of war in April
>1933.
>
>
>http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/Holocaust/stlouis.html
>
>http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/opposition/cannonfodder.htm
>We implore and beseech our Jewish brethren to realize that the Zionists are
>not the saviours of the Jewish People and guarantors of their safety, but
>rather the instigators and original cause of Jewish suffering in the Holy
>Land and worldwide.
>
>
>http://www.aldeilis.net/zion/zionhol01.html
>
>The Zionist Federation of Germany (ZVfD), an organisation representing a
>tiny minority of German Jews, was selected by the Nazis as the body to
>represent the Jews of the Reich.
>The best example of this was the 'Transfer Agreement' of 1934. Immediately
>after the Nazi takeover in 1933, Jews all over the world supported or were
>organising a world wide boycott of German goods. This campaign hurt the Nazi
>regime and the German authorities searched frantically for a way disabling
>the boycott. It was clear that if Jews and Jewish organisations were to pull
>out, the campaign would collapse.
>This problem was solved by the ZVfD. A letter sent to the Nazi party as
>early as 21.6.33, outlined the degree of agreement that existed between the
>two organisations on the questions of race, nation, and the nature of the
>'Jewish problem', and it offered to collaborate with the new regime:
>
>In their eagerness to gain credence and the backing of the new regime, the
>Zionist organisation managed to undermine the boycott. The main public act
>was the signature of the 'Transfer Agreement' with the Nazi authorities
>during the Zionist Congress of 1934. In essence, the agreement was designed
>to get Germany's Jews out of the country and into Mandate Palestine. It
>provided a possibility for Jews to take a sizeable part of their property
>out of the country, through a transfer of German goods to Palestine. This
>right was denied to Jews leaving for any other destination (emphasis - ED).
>The Zionist Organisation was the acting agent, through its financial
>organisations. This agreement operated on a number of fronts 'helping' Jews
>to leave the country, breaking the ring of the boycott, exporting German
>goods in large quantities to Palestine, and last but not least, enabling the
>regime to be seen as humane and reasonable even towards its avowed enemies,
>the Jews. After all, they argued, the Jews do not belong in Europe and now
>the Jews come and agree with them.
>
>After news of the agreement broke, the boycott was doomed. If the Zionist
>Organisation found it possible and necessary to deal with the Nazis, and
>import their goods, who could argue for a boycott? This was not the first
>time that the interests of both movements were presented to the German
>public as complementary. Baron Von Mildenstein, the first head of the Jewish
>Department of the SS, later followed by Eichmann, was invited to travel to
>Palestine. This he did in early 1933, in the company of a Zionist leader,
>Kurt Tuchler. Having spent six months in Palestine, he wrote a series of
>favourable articles in Der Sturmer describing the 'new Jew' of Zionism, a
>Jew Nazis could accept and understand.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>The declared enemy was now right in the middle of their country. Bankers,
>industrialists, media moguls, movie producers, merchants, and others,
>overnight became enemies of Germany.
>No nation in the world would have allowed their declared enemies to freely
>roam around the country. The Germans, however, never implemented measures
>against the Jews as drastic as the United States did with their Japanese
>citizens.
>
>http://www.corax.org/revisionism/misc/encampment.html
>On March 24, 1933, the Jewish World Congress, then under the leadership of
>Chaim Weizman, declared war on Germany on behalf of the Jews of the world.
>
>thousands of Jews were not bothered by the Nazis or by the fate of their
>"convicted" co-religionists. They went on with their daily lives in Germany
>while the world was running amok about the "harsh treatment of Jews in
>Germany." To illustrate the true "fate of the Jews," one has to look at some
>of the prominent Jewish leaders living in Germany at the time.
>These are very important questions, because so many prominent Jews survived
>the alleged Holocaust. Simon Wiesenthal, Eli Wiesel, Leo Baeck, Max
>Nussbaum, and so many more like them. As a matter of fact, approximately 4.5
>million Jews "survived."
>
>Why did Rabbi Baeck never leave the Third Reich, the land of concentration
>camps and "gas chambers," with all the other 300,000 German Jews who were
>allowed to leave for more lucrative lands?
>
>
>By all accounts, Rabbi Dr. Leo Baeck must have had a very comfortable
>existence under the National Socialist Government in Germany. Born in 1873
>in Posen, he became a Rabbi in 1897 in Oppeln/Silesia. Interestingly, he was
>a Rabbi in Berlin from 1912 until 1943, when he himself was interned at the
>Theresienstadt camp, a camp where most of the prominent Jews and resistance
>activists were housed. After the war Leo Baeck immigrated to England.
>
>Why did Rabbi Baeck never leave the Third Reich, the land of concentration
>camps and "gas chambers," with all the other 300,000 German Jews who were
>allowed to leave for more lucrative lands?
>
>Another question should be put to all those false Holocaust "experts" by
>asking them how many Jews were gassed in Dachau? As a matter of fact, no one
>was ever "gassed" in Germany, or in territories under German control, as has
>been established in court
>
>In Schuld und Schicksal (Guilt and Fate) Burg dealt with the Warsaw and Lodz
>ghettos. When the German troops occupied Warsaw, they wanted to concentrate
>the Jewish population. Real ghettos had been there for centuries but the
>assimilated or emancipated Jews had lived far way from the ghettos. Now the
>Germans wanted to have the Jews all together. In a practical sense, the
>ghetto was also organized for the protection of the Jewish population.
>(26-6885, 6886)
>The Zionists were happy with this arrangement. An appointed Jewish Council
>was the governing body of the ghetto. They had their own police, jails and
>everything else. Naturally, there were some who were cruel. One of these was
>the vice president of the police, who was later executed. In Burg's eyes,
>this execution was evidence that Jews defended themselves against the
>minority of Zionists who were using the majority of Jews for their own
>purposes. (26-6886, 6887)
>
>Then, when hundreds of thousands of civilians died in massive Allied bombing
>raids against German civilians ... and only then ... Rabbi Baeck got out.
>And where did he go? To Theresienstadt, because the concentration camp was
>never bombed by the Allies, and was the safest place for a Jew to be.
>Why did Rabbi Baeck never leave the Third Reich, the land of concentration
>camps and "gas chambers," with all the other 300,000 German Jews who were
>allowed to leave for more lucrative lands?
>It must have been relatively easy to leave Germany. Max Nussbaum, Chief
>Rabbi of Berlin until 1940 (who later became Chief Rabbi of Beverly Hills,
>CA), immigrated to New York at the advice of Rabbi Stephen Wise. Did Rabbi
>Wise already know of the coming war between the United States and Germany in
>1940?
>One must assume that Rabbi Baeck knew about Rabbi Nussbaum's plan to move to
>New York, but again Baeck remained in Berlin. A riddle to be sure, unless
>the horrors of Nazism were not that horrible for the Jews after all.
>Ø > IS IT TRUE that in 1941 and again in 1942, the German Gestapo offered
>all
>> > European Jews transit to Spain, if they would relinquish all their
>property
>> > in Germany and Occupied France; on condition that:
>> > a) none of the deportees travel from Spain to Palestine;<
>
>YES THAT OFFER WAS MADE. THE JEWS CAN THANK THE ZIONISTS WHO DECLINED FOR
>THEIR VARIOUS REASONS.
>Under the guise of "love of Israel", the Zionist "statesmen" seduced many
>Jews to replace devotion to the Torah and its Sages with devotion to the
>scoundrel who founded Zionism
>http://www.jewsnotzionists.org/tenquestions.htm
>The Jewish Agency delegation headed by Golda Meir (Meirson) ignored a German
>offer to allow Jews to emigrate to other countries for $250 a head, and the
>other Jewish groups  made no effort to influence the United States and the
>32 other countries attending the conference to allow immigration of German
>and Austrian Jews.
>http://www.jews-for-allah.org/Jews-not-for-Judaism/Jews-who-helped-nazis-hit
>ler.htm
>Ø
>
>
>
>By Max Hastings
>
>LONDON: Whatever the outcome of the current Palestinian chaos, meaningful
>negotiations with Israel seem unlikely. The m