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Shofar FTP Archive File: people/e/eichmann.adolf/transcripts/Sessions/Session-033-02

Archive/File: people/e/eichmann.adolf/transcripts/Sessions/Session-033-02
Last-Modified: 1999/06/01

State Attorney Bach:  This document, too, demonstrates that,
in spite of the coordination, as it were, the Head Office
for Reich Security does just what it wants in most cases.

The next document is No. 142, and the subject is the meeting
I mentioned before, which took place in the office of the
Accused on 28 August 1942.  The meeting of specialist
officers to which the representative in France was invited
and, as we shall prove later on, Wisliceny from Pressburg
was invited, Richter from Romania, and others.

Presiding Judge: We have already heard about this meeting.

State Attorney Bach:  I told the Court that actually such a
meeting also took place later, that Wisliceny mentions it,
and that certain matters were discussed.  But here is the
report on that meeting which has not yet been submitted.

Presiding Judge: This document is marked T/451.

State Attorney Bach:  By the way, this document was also
shown to the Accused and was numbered T/37(33).

     "On 28 August 1942, a conference on Jewish matters took
     place in the building of Section IVB4 of the Head
     Office for Reich Security, in which the undersigned
     took part as representative of Obersturmfuehrer

Presiding Judge: Mr. Bach...

State Attorney Bach:  Only one sentence here.

Presiding Judge: But we have already heard that this meeting
took place.  I am sorry I have to insist on such small
matters, but they add up to a big total.

State Attorney Bach:  I agree, Your Honour.  The subject of
the discussion was the situation of the Jewish Question,
especially the evacuation of Jews in the occupied foreign
countries by the staff of the branch offices in these
countries.  "SS Obersturmbannfuehrer Eichmann announced that
the present problem of evacuation (expulsion of the
stateless Jews) must be solved by the end of the current
calendar year."

Judge Halevi:  It says here: "year."  It said: "quarter"
before, but that is struck out.

State Attorney Bach:  That is only a question of language.
What is meant is September 1942, so in any case this is the
last quarter.  "As last date for the expulsion of the
remaining Jews the end of July 1943 was fixed.  SS
Obersturmbannfuehrer Eichmann pointed out that in the next
few months the expulsion must be stepped up, since it is
expected that the Reich Railways will be unable to provide
transportation in November, December and January."

There follow details I do not want to read at the moment
about increased deportations in October, about the supply of
blankets, boots, sheds, etc.

The next document is our No. 141, again a report by the same
Ahnert.  It is an interim summing up of the numbers of
deportees, which, at that stage, had reached 27,000.  I
shall read only one sentence: "Since, in accordance with
instructions from the Head Office for Reich Security, the
present evacuation programme (deportation of stateless Jews)
has to be completed by the end of this year and the Reich
Railways will presumably be unable to provide the necessary
rolling stock during the months of November and December
1942 and January 1943, an attempt is being made to step up
the transportation programme, starting on 15 September 1942,
so that, from that date on 1,000 Jews will be deported
Presiding Judge: This will be marked T/452.

Judge Halevi:  He says that the increase in pace depends on
the French Government supplying the necessary number of Jews
from the unoccupied zone.

State Attorney Bach:  Yes, thank you, Your Honour.  This was
in fact mentioned in one of the earlier documents, that a
law is in preparation that Jews who received French
citizenship after 1933 will lose it, so that it will be
possible to regard them as stateless.

The next document is our No. 1260: "On 8 September 1942, the
Secretary General for the French Police in the Occupied Zone
came to see me in order to describe the difficulties
concerning the deportation of Jews from the unoccupied

And at the end here, he again describes to his superior the
difficulties caused by the French, who have so far sent only
7,000 Jews from the unoccupied zone and he adds: "According
to the plan transmitted in secret by the Reichsfuehrer-SS,
the areas occupied by Germany are to be free of Jews already
by the middle of 1943.  The thirteen trains which the Reich
Transport Ministry has already prepared for the month of
September must therefore, in my opinion, be utilized by all
means, since, at the time, the train allocation was made far
in advance and caused the Ministry considerable
difficulties.  Furthermore, in November, December and
January no transports will be possible because of the
scarcity of rolling stock.

Presiding Judge: I see that what I say is of no avail.

State Attorney Bach:  I could not omit this sentence because
it comes between two important sentences, but this is the
last sentence from that document.  Again it is requested to
advise the French to hand over to the German Government all
the Jews who can possibly be delivered.

Presiding Judge: This will be marked T/453.

State Attorney Bach:  The next document is our No. 715,
again from Roethke.  A report about the arrest of rich and
influential Jews.  And here only one sentence: "In order to
prevent the persons designated to be arrested from receiving
advance information about the operation, as happened in the
case of previous sudden round-ups, it seems essential that
the French police - at any rate the officials involved -
should be informed at the last moment."

Presiding Judge: This will be marked T/454.

State Attorney Bach:  The next document is No. 37.  It was
shown to the Accused and was marked T/37(10), together with
his statement.  The significance of the document lies only
in its being again a report from Roethke to Eichmann, but
there is an addition at the end: "The brother of the former
French Prime Minister, Leon Blum, was deported with today's

Presiding Judge: This will be marked T/455.

State Attorney Bach:  The next document is No. 270.  Knochen
informs Eichmann about difficulties which Laval and Petain
are causing in connection with the arrest of Jews of French
nationality.  At this stage the change in Laval's attitude
is already noticeable.  As the Germans put it, he is
beginning to make difficulties where Jews of French
nationality are concerned.

Presiding Judge: This will be marked T/456.

State Attorney Bach:  The next document is No. 272.  Again
from Roethke to Eichmann, Oranienburg and Auschwitz.  This
time only 211 Jews were sent off and Roethke explains that
the transport was definitely necessary for political and
prestige reasons.  Roethke has learnt the lesson of the
"Blamage" (disgrace) which had so infuriated Eichmann.

Presiding Judge: This will be marked T/457.

State Attorney Bach:  The next document is our No. 254,
which actually contains three documents - a letter to
Eichmann, a telegram from Guenther, and again a letter from
Roethke.  We are submitting these three documents in order
to demonstrate the technique to the Court, this whole system
of dispatching the transports.  In the first letter there
is, as always, a request from Roethke to Eichmann asking
whether such and such transports - of 4 November, 6 November
and 9 November  - may be sent off.  After this a telegram
from Guenther - a positive reply: The deportation may be
carried out.  After that a report: The transport has left.

Presiding Judge: This will be marked T/458.

State Attorney Bach:  The next document is our No. 258.
Roethke informs Eichmann that 1,000 Jews of Greek
nationality have been arrested in Paris, and therefore it
will be necessary to send an additional, fourth, transport
to Auschwitz.  He asks that the Auschwitz camp be informed
of the arrival of the transport and that the detachment of
the Protective Police be provided.

Presiding Judge: This will be marked T/459.

State Attorney Bach:  The reply to this document is
contained in our document No. 259, which was also shown to
the Accused and was given the number T/37(67).  The answer
is, of course, positive.  Guenther cables that the proposed
additional transport of Jews to Auschwitz, of 1,000 Jews of
Greek nationality, can be carried out, and that all the
preparations for it have been made.

Presiding Judge: This will be marked T/460.

State Attorney Bach:  And here is the final report on this
matter, our document No. 255.  Roethke informs Eichmann,
Oranienburg and Auschwitz that the additional transport has
indeed been dispatched.

Presiding Judge: The document is marked T/461.

State Attorney Bach:  I now submit a document which will
explain why I asked the witness this morning a number of
questions about a man named Roger Masse, the former officer
whom Dannecker selected, as will be remembered, and who was
sent to Auschwitz and died there.  A petition was submitted
and this is our document No. 136.  The German Armistice
Commission transmitted the petition and said that the
Chairman of the French delegation had asked the Chairman of
the German Commission to recommend that a Jewish reserve
officer, who was arrested on 12 December 1941, and deported
to the East on 5 June, be released and returned to France.
It says that this is a French prisoner of war, a First
Lieutenant in the Reserves named Roger Masse, a Knight of
the Legion d'Honneur, decorated with the Croix de Guerre.
In addition, Mr. Masse belongs to one of the veteran
families in France which has great merits in the French
Republic.  It is also pointed out that in view of these
circumstances Marshal Petain takes a special interest in the
fate of this man, and therefore the Armistice Commission
asks for a reply as soon as possible.

This document was sent to the Accused for his opinion by the
Foreign Ministry.  At the end there is the reply of the
Accused: "...The above-mentioned Jew was deported from
Compiegne to the East (Auschwitz), on 5 June 1942.  As a
matter of principle I cannot agree to his being returned.
Please note.  By order - Eichmann."

Presiding Judge: The document is marked T/462.

State Attorney Bach:  We also have a sworn statement from
the son of the same Roger Masse who testifies to this and
gives some biographical details about his father and about
the fact that he indeed died in Auschwitz.

Presiding Judge: This is apparently his nephew.

State Attorney Bach:  Yes, Your Honour, I am sorry.

Presiding Judge: The document is marked T/463.

State Attorney Bach:  The next document is our No. 253,
which also received a number attached to the statement of
the Accused - T/37(65).  This document, too, contains
several letters, Your Honours.  It is an application from
the Union Generale des Israelites de France to the Commander
of the Security Police and the SD which states that, for the
purpose of paying out pensions and insurance, it is
sometimes necessary to obtain confirmation about what
happened to certain Jews.  Roethke transmits this letter to
IVB4 and asks for instructions whether information may be
given to those Jews.  He received the answer in the
following telegram:

     "For reasons of principle, the issue of confirmations
     by your Office or by the Camp Administrations about the
     evacuation of the Jews and their whereabouts is not
     permissible and must therefore always be avoided.
     Insofar as in individual cases the need [underlined]
     for information is admitted - settlement of estates,
     etc. - there is no objection to appropriate information
     being given by the French Police authorities.  But in
     order to obviate abuse of such information for the
     purpose of atrocity propaganda (Greuelhetze), there
     must be no mention of evacuation or deportation of the
     Jews in any information which may be given.  On the
     contrary, only the fact that the Jew concerned has
     moved and that his present place of residence is
     unknown may be mentioned."  Signed: Eichmann, SS

And indeed, in the end Roethke reports in accordance with
this reply by Eichmann.

I should like to draw your attention that when this letter
was shown to the Accused, on page 1214, the interrogator
asked him what was the danger of Greuelhetze, (atrocity
propaganda), what was the meaning of Greuelhetze." "Less
What is the intention here when you write:
Greuelhetze...abuse of such information for the purpose of
Greuelhetze...what does Greuelhetze mean here?  Eichmann
Yes, the transfers to concentration camps, because at that
time - May I here...

Q. Greuelhetze, whom were you referring to when you said
Greuelhetze?  That there will be talk about it abroad?

A. Yes, yes, in the newspapers, because, after all, it was
not only this, not for this reason, but opinions were also
constantly expressed after all against the measures taken by
the Reich Government and all these opinions - insofar as
they were negative - circulated in the Reich, it does not
matter if this was propaganda, it is probably even correct,
by the Propaganda Ministry and not by the Security Police,
under the concept of Greuelhetze.

Q. That is to say, it does not matter when that was, even
when those were facts, for instance...

A. Yes, yes - yes, yes, all this passed, it all passed as
"Die Greuelhetze."

He adds, by the way:

     "Auch wenn es stimmt - auch wenn es sich um andere
     Sachen handelte, nicht um Judenangelegenheiten, das
     Ganze segelte unter dem Wort "Greuelhetze"  (even when
     it is true, even when the talk was of other matters,
     not of Jewish affairs, it all "sailed" (segelte) under
     the word "atrocity propaganda").

Judge Halevi:  The last witness also thought that this was
atrocity propaganda, did he not?  He said that the broadcast
of the British radio about the gas chambers, he and the Jews
believed that that was atrocity propaganda.

State Attorney Bach:  The witness believed this, but the
situation of the Accused was different.

Judge Halevi:  Yes, but the one is connected with the other.

State Attorney Bach:  Of course, Your Honour.

Presiding Judge: The document is marked T/464.

State Attorney Bach:  The next document is our No. 122.
Eichmann informs the Commander of the Security Police in
Paris about a programme which is being finalized in order to
enable the Reich Railways to make arrangements in advance
for the rolling stock needed for the deportation of Jews in
1943, and he therefore requests to be informed immediately
to what extent transports of Jews from France may be resumed
during the first few months of the coming year.  He then
adds laconically: "Possibilities for reception are

Presiding Judge: This document is marked T/465.

State Attorney Bach:  The next document is No. 317,
Knochen's reply that resumption of the transports of Jews
from France is envisaged for the middle of February or the
beginning of March.  To what extent - this cannot yet be

Presiding Judge: The document is marked T/466.

State Attorney Bach:  Our next document is No. 1164.  It is
a letter from Heinrich Himmler to SS Gruppenfuehrer Mueller
and it says: "I herewith give instructions that all those
Jews still in France at this time, as well as those
Hungarian and Romanian Jews who have influential relatives
in America shall be assembled in a separate camp.  There
they will have to work, but under conditions which will keep
them healthy and assure their survival.  Jews of this kind
are valuable hostages for us.  In that respect I am thinking
of a number of about 10,000.  Signed - Heinrich Himmler."

Presiding Judge: This document will be marked T/467.

Judge Halevi:  What is the date of this?

State Attorney Bach:  December 1942.  This is important
because we shall see afterwards that this camp, which was
established later, was under the guidance and direct
influence of the Accused.

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